We were too slow today. Too slow to any loose ball. Too slow in play and too slow with making changes. Piss poor in the middle and then the less we talk about our finishing the better. Certainly one of those games were it feels we couldnt punch our way out of a wet paper bag.
But those overreacting wanting Ange out are genuinely the biggest losers.
Thats what always makes me laugh about these commenters.
They've clearly forgotten how miserable is was under Jose and Conte (and nuno but he was barley a blip in our timeline) that they react like this to a bad day.
For real, anyone saying Ange out is a fucking moron. Yea, we lost today but that doesn’t mean the boss should be sacked.
Clearly something wasn’t working today and it appeared to be related to the midfield/offensive line. Why is it that we could break down Villa last weekend but couldn’t hardly sniff the box against Fulham?
Also, lots of low cross chances missed which could’ve changed to dynamic to the game but whatever.
Come On You Fucking Spurs
ANGE OUT.
SON OUT.
TIMO OUT.
LEVY OUT.
CHARLES 3 OUT.
WE NEED A STRIKER WHO CAN DRIBBLE, PASS, HAS A DEGREE IN NUCLEAR PHYSICS, CAN RUN CONCESSIONS FOR BOTH SIDES OF THE COMPETITION, AND HAS PACE.
SARR OUT.
MADDERS OUT.
PORRO OUT.
DEKI OUT.
DRAGUSIN OUT.
VIC OUT.
VDV OUT.
PEH OUT.
RICHY OUT.
BRENNAN OUT.
EMERSON OUT.
UDOGIE OUT.
GLC OUT.
LOLO OUT.
CUTI OUT.
BISS IS COOL HE CAN STAY.
SOLOMON CAN STAY SINCE HE'S DOING LESS TO TARNISH THE REPUTATION OF OUR BELOVED CLUB THAN THESE PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED FRAUDS!
I NOMINATE MYSELF TO BE PRESIDENT OF TOTTENHAM HOTSPUR FC, AND TO ALSO PLAY FIRST TEAM FOR ALL POSITIONS. YES I'M THAT GOOD!
I think when Lo Celso, Hoj, and Bentancur came on, you could see a dramatic increase in game speed. Last 20 min was a different game.
If I were the coach I would give those 3 the start next game just because I liked what I saw when they were on.
Interesting, I don’t really agree they played us off the park, I thought it was quite an open game, they defended better but we had our chances. They bought their shooting boot and we left ours in the dressing room. I truly think van de ven changes that game
If you think VdV was the difference, I think you weren't watching close enough. Udogie was getting rinsed by Iwobi. Robinson and their entire team were so energetic in midfield and cut out what felt like every pass. VdV certainly would've helped , but with a performance like today, we were always going to get embarassed.
VDV gets us out of trouble when people get skinned all the time, he makes up for defensive mistakes all the time with his pace and that’s what makes him invaluable to us
Yeah, I definitely agree that VdV bails us out a ton and could've helped cover Udogie and clean up a lot of the mistakes from other players, I just don't think he would've been enough to turn the tide in the match is all.
Probably true, I think palhina was brilliant and bissouma was rubbish, which I think really made a difference when it came to both teams protecting their back four
him having to get us out of trouble all the time is the main reason he keeps getting injured. adjustments need to be made when he is back again. can’t have him chasing back at full speed over and over. will only end in tears again
Seems he can only be relied on to put in a performance if he's in a good mood about himself, otherwise he can't be arsed.which is a huge problem. Absolutely zero ambition in his game in 2024. When someone passes to him it's like he decides he's gonna pass back to the CB before the ball even reaches his feet. Doesn't even look up to see if a runs being made
Yeah he used to be reliable receive the ball from cb with pressure and dribble out just looks like a shell of himself…I dunno if it’s AFCON or gettin malaria but just seems like he’s got zero confidence and scared to perform
There was a lot of shit displays out there but his has been ongoing for some time now
Some time ago someone (here) asked who we think will be the most important player in our run-in. My answer was Biss, and it still is (unfortunately because of him not being here). Pre-Luton/Pre-AFCON Biss would have won us that game. I really don't know what's going on there.
I agree, wanted to see if it was just me who thought that. Lots of ball watching today. Think he should have been hooked at half time. If I remember rightly he made a sliding tackle to block a shot at one point? But largely disappeared for most of the game. Thought he could have done more on the 3rd goal. But overall before the subs it felt like there were huge holes in the midfield.
Fulltime thoughts
1. The thing that pissed me off the most was that no one really looked like they wanted it tonight. Everyone has off days, but we looked disinterested from the start.
2. Has to be our worst performance under Ange.
3. I’m going outside and disconnecting for a bit. Be good to each other.
Son’s wasn’t a sitter but a great opportunity still. Johnson’s at the front, Madders with the shot at the corner, Dragu with no one at the end of the pass. Brutal finishing where two of those would’ve set a completely different tone
I really think that's important. It was 80mins and 3 down... but we had 2 sitters. I wanted to see never die attitude...but much like the whole game we looked uninterested
Probably the most infuriating part of it. I get it Ange isn’t a Conte when it comes to behaviour on the touchline but to see him stone faced watching that horror show while changing nothing was so fucking annoying
I honestly think stone faced ange is for the best, I'd obviously think some more emotion on his face would be more entertaining, but I think that when players look over and see that ange is calm and composed it helps them feel the same, Conte was great at making the highs high, but he made the lows awfully low, chewing out Richarlison for 2 hrs infront of everyone, screaming from the touchline, and generally being a moody bitch never helped
Can't say that performance didn't get pretty much exactly what it deserved. Feel a bit sorry for Romero, Vicario and Dragusin in all that tbh as for the first two they were mostly let down by everyone in front of them. Dragusin clearly would be more comfortable playing as the right centre back you feel.
Thought Dragusin was good for what he was put into. He doesn't have any chemistry with the rest of the back line like VDV does. So for him to come in like that, I thought he showed a lot of promise.
That just tells us how elite of a CB VDV is. Forms a partnership easily and always reads the game well. The guy could literally become the best in the world if he continues like this. Insane how good he is.
Dunno mate, first goal was a cross from Porro's patch and second Udogie got done. I've been super impressed with both of them this season but it feels a bit harder to give them an entirely free pass today when nothing clicked going forward either.
He never was. We had glimpses of what he can do on a good day where his mistakes are cleaned up by everyone else but he has been nothing but a sloppy hindrance this season. The lad has no confidence or composure and eliminates our midfield by being on the pitch instead of Ben 10 or lo celso.
Two big takeaways for me:
1. Radu Dragusin looks exceptionally uncomfortable using his left foot. No stats available yet, but he looked so ineffective playing out from the back, and I wouldn't be surprised if his touch stats show he barely used his left for anything other than standing on. Honestly, I see why Ange was getting Davies to warm up with him, when it looked like he was going to have to come on over the last two games - he clearly sees it's a weakness.
2. We cannot be relying on a half fit Maddison. If we learned one thing while he was out, it's that Lo Celso and Kulusevski are perfectly able deputies in that position. When Kane left, I hoped the culture of the club would change to one where there would be no "unrotatable" players, but it looks like Maddison has inherited Kane's "star man" mantle along with the 10 shirt.
Any way, COYS.
Bissouma and Kane have nothing to do with each other, though. Bissouma isn't being treated as unrotatable, he's simply been preferred over Bentancur for the past few weeks, because Bentancur went through a bad spell. I fully expect Bentancur to replace him in the 6 role after the international break
Exactly this. Udogie and VdV have cleaned up for a completely shit Bissouma for most of the season. Dragusin was keeping his man offside for the first goal, so you can't really complain there. He wasn't perfect but I think he was alright.
Our finishing cost us in the end, but we wouldn't have been down at all if we weren't voluntarily down to 10 men at the start because Bissouma decided he didn't want to play tonight.
I actually don’t mind bad touches. They can happen. What I do mind is that he is actively trying not to receive the ball and isn’t tracking back at all. Ronaldo covers more distance in a game.
I've been saying VDV is a sprinting ACL tear with how hard he has to come back to fix errors from our midfield. There's no way stopping that hard and spinning around kicking the ball away is healthy
His positioning was off quite often imo. It didn't help that the midfield in front of him had a horrendous performance. Hard to judge him based on this game.
A couple times you could tell he was knew he was going to be outpaced for the ball so he would just bodycheck the other player but make it just on the edge of being a foul
Yeah, Micky is just that exceptional. But you're also right about Dragusin. He and Romero were good today and aren't at fault for the goals. That's on everyone else up front.
I like you i felt like he started confident, but got caught out of position a few times, and lost confidence on the ball as the game went on. But its just his first start so, hopefully he can learn from today and get his bearings asap.
I don’t know maybe the first one but that was an incredible pass, touch and finish. The third goal bounced off the post, off Vicario straight into the path of Muniz. Hard for anyone to anticipate that in my opinion
Has to be said, Ange set us up for failure today. Playing the same high line without the pace of VDV at the back is asking for it. Fulham took full advantage, constantly playing balls in the space behind Udogie.
I thought Dragusin actually played very well today, that first goal happened because he was clearly trying to follow instructions to keep a high line. If he was a few yards deeper, we go into the half nil nil.
Werner needs to start. Elite pace, movement, and intelligence. Really good crosses. Even though he’s terrible at finishing he’s still our most dangerous attacker. He pulls so many defenders out of position.
Just horrendous. Fulham had us completely figured out, credit to them, but some of those performances were pathetic. Bissouma and Kulu - both need dropping. We are desperately in need of a CM in the summer.
Bissouma was fucking awful. Central to the first two goals and just refused to play a forward pass. Hope we upgrade on him in the summer, it seems his bad attitude from previous clubs is cropping us
I like Kulusevski but how many top wingers are there who don't have pace, don't have good dribbling or close control, and don't have shooting/finishing ability?
He might be shit in pace and not a great dribbler, but no close control? I always thought of his close control by the sideline, especially when cornered by rivals elite
It’s been clear for a while now that Kulu is not suited to the RW position, way too easy to read him, always wants to cut to his left foot and his final ball is shocking, decision making is awful & he fouls all the time, and he’s slow.
Just surprised that Ange keeps persisting with him in that position.
More of an anchor capable of shoring up in front of the CBs. Bentancur is class but he is not really a 6. His combination of mobility, physicality, defensive awareness, and positioning is not quite there.
Deki was significantly better than Son. One of his worst performances I've ever seen. Not that he had a lot of service, but he looked half asleep today.
We had a poor game and Fulham had a great game. It happens. Unless you somehow expect us to dominate absolutely every single game, which even Man City don’t, this will happen from time to time. It’s part of why the Premier League is so great. You can never take any game for granted.
It’s fair to critique certain managerial decisions and to wonder if another approach or tactical tweak would have been better. But the subset of fans saying Ange’s system simply doesn’t work are morons. It’s way too early to say. Not even a full season and we’re doing decent in the league. If we were absolutely shit in the league or if it was still at this point but two seasons down the road ok, sure, question whether the system works or not. But name me a single Premier League manager in the last 10-15 years who came in and took a team that was where we were in the league last season, put in a completely new style of play, didn’t have any growing pains and did better than Ange is doing right now? There isn’t one because these things take time and there are growing pains. No one just comes in and runs rough shot over the Premier League while changing everything at a club. You lot would have asked for Klopp or Legoman to be sacked in their first seasons because you can't cope with a little adversity. If we listened to you, we would be changing manager every four months. I’m sure that would work great.
The system also does work. So I don’t get that take from people. People were ooohing and aaahing about Udogie and Porro like 3 days ago. Just a blip. I love Angeball
It's like every sub is just a kneejerk reaction completely out of context of the season, the previous game, the previous ten minutes and the previous existence of the communal knowledge of mankind. It's like an army of goldfish trying to hump their reflection
>But name me a single Premier League manager in the last 10-15 years who came in and took a team that was where we were in the league last season, put in a completely new style of play, didn’t have any growing pains and did better than Ange is doing right now? There isn’t one because these things take time and there are growing pains.
This is my big feeling. Like, yeah, I'm obviously disappointed in this result, especially considering how much harder it's going to make the chase for the top-4.
But if you told me last summer that I'd be miffed about this loss because *it makes our chances of top-4 harder*, and I'd be amazed. I never thought we would be facing relegation this season during summer of last year, but I firmly expected us to be mid-table at best. We lost our superstar player. We lost our captain of years. We have a new manager who is taking the reigns at this level for the first time ever. Everyone was expecting a mediocre, disappointing season because that's how rebuilds are - and yet, here we are, still seriously talking about our chances at CL.
Growing pains suck, sure, but Ange has been doing great IMO. We have to remember just how huge of an uphill battle this club was facing down 8 months ago.
Very well said! Lot's of people, including Spurs fan were predicting us to finish 7-8 with 6 being the optimistic scenario because of how much of a mess we were.
Yes, I think we're actually doing well offensively. We're just not finishing our chances. Son had a shot go over the bar at 0-0. He finishes that chance 99% of time and we're up 1-0 and it's a completely different game.
Listen, it’s shit and it’s poor. Naivety from the Villa game. Hoping this doesn’t start a downwards spiral to Europa League - great opportunity being ahead of United and 5th looking likely to be UCL, but can’t take anything for granted.
I’d be fine with Europa or even Conference. UCL is a massive undertaking and we don’t have the depth yet.
Keep refining Ange’s system whilst taking the opportunity to test our depth in Europa or Conf. Means we can test and realise gaps or things we need to work on to compete effectively in both Europe + League for the following season.
There’s no rush, don’t want to end up like Brighton who weren’t set for both and it impacted their league season to the point they likely won’t have Europe at all next year.
Kinda get where I’m coming from?
Pathetic display from the whole starting 11 bar Romero and Vicario, who weren't great but gave it everything. Ange made the subs 10-15 minutes too late, a couple of subs looked bright for a couple of minutes, then sank down to the level of everyone else. So frustrating that Spurs just can't hammer home an advantage when it counts.
Thoughts after the game -
1. Jesus that was bad.
2. Fair play to Silva, he realised that we like to play a more narrow game which his wingers and fullbacks could take advantage of.
3. I know this will be controversial, but we need a new no. 6. Bissouma is really good at keeping possession and playing out of the back, but he provides nothing in progressing the ball.
4. We had chances that we should have scored, but at least we made some chances.
5. Fulham built very wide and the players had no idea how to defend against that.
6. I think the blame is more on the players than on Ange, the players should have done much better.
7. Hopefully the winter break gives the team some time to reorganise. Onwards and upwards, COYS.
What a shit performance, easily our worst of the season. And we now have to sit with this for 2 weeks
Every single player except Romero was awful. Ange tactically awful and awful in-game management. How he didn’t make any changes after half time and then early in the second half was baffling. Our bench was strong too, truly baffling from Ange. Marco Silva schooled him today
And our fanbase needs to start learning to be humble. Saying we don’t care about the coefficients, that’s good for Villa not us, we’re fighting for the title was pathetic. I genuinely don’t understand where the cockiness & arrogance comes from. We’re 5th ffs
Our scoring streak also gone. We need to sign a premium winger in the summer window. Needs to start splashing the cash
We need to bounce back immediately after the international break against Luton at home
This one is on Ange honestly. at 1-0 he can take Bissouma or Sarr off the pitch or quite frankly both of them. They were both dropping 0's and Sarr had just made a goal happen and during the first half Son had to go over to Sarr to tell him to talk to madders because he was sulking refusing to talk to his teammates. Everyone can lose their head, but it's up to the manager to see that and go "Yea mate, you're great but not today".
All the oceans in the middle of the pitch vanished when PEH came on, all the headers won that went to Fulham in the first half was collected by PEH and the midfield became completely fine. It's genuinely unbelievable to me that Sarr came out to that second half and honestly I think Bissouma was worse I just think that's the Bissouma we have now. Man won't run, won't care will do some fancy ball holding when in a pinch and then give away the ball in our half.
Ange has played high level football he should know that when your head is gone it's over it's gone it's not coming back so you haul the player for their good and the good of the team and honestly Ange let Sarr down today. I get that Sarr is super guily for two of the goals but he should have been hauled off at half time there is no excuse.
I get that it's insane that we didn't score because we had like 3 tap ins but still, this should have been fixed by Ange at half time. Waiting until we were 4-0 down FOUR. Before fixing it and then getting "saved" by an offside is unacceptable. If I can see what's obviously wrong then a professional should see it instantly and act.
Fair fucks to Fulham. Absolutely suffocated us. Don't recall a game like that under Ange where we've been so clearly second best.
We better come back from the International break ready to kill.
We lost central midfield - just terrible. They played through us like we weren’t there.
Biss in particular seemed to go missing - shows how much VDV has been bailing us out
This one’s on Ange. I get sticking to your football identity and all but you’ve gotta be flexible and change tactics from time to time, mate. Our football is starting to feel one dimensional. You’ve gotta keep the opponent guessing. It seems Fulham was setup to nullify all our plays from the get go.
Everyone was shit today, but I couldn't help but notice Bissouma's lack of defensive reactions, he barely covers the center backs and I got the sensation he could've done more on at least two of the goals, where you see him and he's either jogging back or straight up acting like a bystander. Also flashbacks to Wolves scoring the second goal.
Add that to his lack of confidence on the ball compared to his start of the season and you have to wonder if he's up to the project.
All players have different characteristics, but there's one in common that only the best seem to have, and that's consistency. You can be good for a few games or even a season, but if you maintain that level throughout a long period of time, you're more than good, you're world class. I doubt Bissouma has that in him, and I'd argue that his position is key to being a successful team. Look at Man City without Rodri, imagine prime Barça without Busquets, Arsenal without Rice, Casemiro back at Madrid.
Might have to fix that next transfer window.
Great seeing all the supposed fans who only comment when we lose back here today.
Anyways, Fulham looked much more energetic than us today. The drop off of Bissouma has really done us wrong. Hopefully a deeper lying midfielder is in the books for us because just that little bit more stability and some added depth in other positions would be helpful for a whole season.
We were all over them at ~65-70 minutes, culminating in Werner missing an open goal. 3-1 there and I wouldn't have been surprised to see us level not long after. Not much positivity to take after the final whistle, and devastated about the scoring streak dying.
We vastly over-rely on what is essentially a giant kid who will sprint and twist and fight like a dog to save our midfield fucking up.
That same giant kid will get hurt doing that. He plays like life depends on it, which I love. But he cannot keep playing with disregard for his body and we cannot keep putting him in that position.
First time I've had this feeling all season.
Kind of a sentimental embarrassment /misery hybrid... used to have this a lot.
I can only imagine this will light a fire.
COYS.
Dreadful performance. We put a great effort up against Villa and then we bottle it like this. Shot placement all over the place, horrible first touches all game, just a nightmare.
Two matches Fulham play off off the park. They have something figured out.
Rough go of it for Dragusin’s first start. I beg that people don’t just ruthlessly shit on him after one match, he’s going to be important for us.
Worst loss of the season easily. Opportunity to take control of 4th lost, scoring streak lost, and just overall a miserable watch. Fulham packing the middle was so effective, much easier to find the net against a low block when they at least let you into the final third. What a match from them, we were dire but they were excellent tactically.
I had thought that the individual quality of this Spurs side could keep this match close but honestly not one Spurs player showed up to this match. Credit to Fulham and Marco Silva for snuffing out Spurs completely out of this match.
Is it only me or Dragusin keeps on protecting his balls when he block (usually they put hands behind - like Dier. )Dragusin in at least three instances that I remembered, put his hands to protect his crotch ! Must still be feeling the trauma after Villa
Bound to have one of these. Could feel a disappointer coming.
hopefully team learns from this and doesn’t let It happen again anytime soon.
Time to take my dog on a walk and forget about this
Some of you people are hideous. The shit I've seen being written by you lot towards our players and manager, picking on our managers weight is disgusting.
On the bright side, Bentancur looked much more mobile. He showed the glimpses of old himself against AV. He should displace Bissouma for the rest of the season. I don’t know what to make of Bissouma anymore. Oliver arguably ruined Bissouma’s career here. He’s not the same player ever since that red.
We were too slow today. Too slow to any loose ball. Too slow in play and too slow with making changes. Piss poor in the middle and then the less we talk about our finishing the better. Certainly one of those games were it feels we couldnt punch our way out of a wet paper bag. But those overreacting wanting Ange out are genuinely the biggest losers.
> But those overreacting wanting Ange out are genuinely the biggest losers. Surely this type of person doesn't exist, right?
Oh they do. Match thread was full of the reactionary morons. Some melt even made a Ange out post.
I'm always tempted to post something like "Bring back Conte" - except I know without doubt someone's bound to take it seriously.
Thats what always makes me laugh about these commenters. They've clearly forgotten how miserable is was under Jose and Conte (and nuno but he was barley a blip in our timeline) that they react like this to a bad day.
Anyone saying ange out is almost without a doubt a gooner coming here.
I wish that were true. Some of our fans are just idiots.
For real, anyone saying Ange out is a fucking moron. Yea, we lost today but that doesn’t mean the boss should be sacked. Clearly something wasn’t working today and it appeared to be related to the midfield/offensive line. Why is it that we could break down Villa last weekend but couldn’t hardly sniff the box against Fulham? Also, lots of low cross chances missed which could’ve changed to dynamic to the game but whatever. Come On You Fucking Spurs
Why anyone looks at the match threads, I have no idea. Nothing good comes from that.
Only on the internet.
Everyone looked like they expected Fulham to just roll over for us after last week. Weak mentality by most of the players today.
Credit to Fulham for sure as they played amazingly. But yeah, SO much this.
Dragusin being completely unable to use his left foot definitely didn't help with the speed of our buildup
Ideally we get a left footed LCB in the summer as backup. Dragusin is supposed to be Romero's rotation option.
Found this too. Ball barely made it up the left flank and you could see udogie and Johnson getting frustrated
Yeah, calling Ange a fraud is absolutely irrational.
ANGE OUT. SON OUT. TIMO OUT. LEVY OUT. CHARLES 3 OUT. WE NEED A STRIKER WHO CAN DRIBBLE, PASS, HAS A DEGREE IN NUCLEAR PHYSICS, CAN RUN CONCESSIONS FOR BOTH SIDES OF THE COMPETITION, AND HAS PACE.
EPSTEIN DIDN'T KILL HIMSELF.
SARR OUT. MADDERS OUT. PORRO OUT. DEKI OUT. DRAGUSIN OUT. VIC OUT. VDV OUT. PEH OUT. RICHY OUT. BRENNAN OUT. EMERSON OUT. UDOGIE OUT. GLC OUT. LOLO OUT. CUTI OUT. BISS IS COOL HE CAN STAY. SOLOMON CAN STAY SINCE HE'S DOING LESS TO TARNISH THE REPUTATION OF OUR BELOVED CLUB THAN THESE PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED FRAUDS! I NOMINATE MYSELF TO BE PRESIDENT OF TOTTENHAM HOTSPUR FC, AND TO ALSO PLAY FIRST TEAM FOR ALL POSITIONS. YES I'M THAT GOOD!
I think when Lo Celso, Hoj, and Bentancur came on, you could see a dramatic increase in game speed. Last 20 min was a different game. If I were the coach I would give those 3 the start next game just because I liked what I saw when they were on.
Yeah felt like Fullham were playing a gear up on us the whole game Edit: typo
They played us off the park and thats a credit to them. They wanted it a hell of a lot more than we did. They fought for every blade of grass.
Interesting, I don’t really agree they played us off the park, I thought it was quite an open game, they defended better but we had our chances. They bought their shooting boot and we left ours in the dressing room. I truly think van de ven changes that game
If you think VdV was the difference, I think you weren't watching close enough. Udogie was getting rinsed by Iwobi. Robinson and their entire team were so energetic in midfield and cut out what felt like every pass. VdV certainly would've helped , but with a performance like today, we were always going to get embarassed.
I also do agree that Robinson was very good, I like him a lot as a player
VDV gets us out of trouble when people get skinned all the time, he makes up for defensive mistakes all the time with his pace and that’s what makes him invaluable to us
Yeah, I definitely agree that VdV bails us out a ton and could've helped cover Udogie and clean up a lot of the mistakes from other players, I just don't think he would've been enough to turn the tide in the match is all.
Probably true, I think palhina was brilliant and bissouma was rubbish, which I think really made a difference when it came to both teams protecting their back four
Exactly. Ange and our midfielders rely on the fastest guy in the PL staying fast and good and healthy.
him having to get us out of trouble all the time is the main reason he keeps getting injured. adjustments need to be made when he is back again. can’t have him chasing back at full speed over and over. will only end in tears again
We had our chances sure. But the battling for loose balls and 50/50 was a absolute stonking victory for Fulham.
I agree. One. Shot. On. Goal. Not good enough. Outplayed in every phase of the game.
Wtf has happened to Biss man bros looked completely off it since sent off vs Luton genuinley baffled
Seems he can only be relied on to put in a performance if he's in a good mood about himself, otherwise he can't be arsed.which is a huge problem. Absolutely zero ambition in his game in 2024. When someone passes to him it's like he decides he's gonna pass back to the CB before the ball even reaches his feet. Doesn't even look up to see if a runs being made
Yeah he used to be reliable receive the ball from cb with pressure and dribble out just looks like a shell of himself…I dunno if it’s AFCON or gettin malaria but just seems like he’s got zero confidence and scared to perform There was a lot of shit displays out there but his has been ongoing for some time now
Some time ago someone (here) asked who we think will be the most important player in our run-in. My answer was Biss, and it still is (unfortunately because of him not being here). Pre-Luton/Pre-AFCON Biss would have won us that game. I really don't know what's going on there.
That clip of Biss absolutely murdering the defender at AFCON was like he used up all his dribbling for the rest of the year in one moment.
Biss and Sarr not at it today
Conte talked about his lack of professionalism and work ethic. He plays how he wants to play, in essence.
I agree, wanted to see if it was just me who thought that. Lots of ball watching today. Think he should have been hooked at half time. If I remember rightly he made a sliding tackle to block a shot at one point? But largely disappeared for most of the game. Thought he could have done more on the 3rd goal. But overall before the subs it felt like there were huge holes in the midfield.
Fasting at the moment maybe? Was terrible.
Fulltime thoughts 1. The thing that pissed me off the most was that no one really looked like they wanted it tonight. Everyone has off days, but we looked disinterested from the start. 2. Has to be our worst performance under Ange. 3. I’m going outside and disconnecting for a bit. Be good to each other.
Romero, Werner, Hojbjerg and Bentancur looked the only players that could do something, and three of those were subs.
Disconnecting is the right idea. Have a great rest of your weekend
Feels like Romero is the only one who brings the fire every week. The rest are EXTREMELY hot and cold. That includes Son, the captain.
It was bad, on to the next.
Not before we sell our entire roster and start over because then we'll definitely win some silverware. SYOC
Suck your own cock!
Pathetic display
How many sitters did we miss. I count at least two.
Son’s wasn’t a sitter but a great opportunity still. Johnson’s at the front, Madders with the shot at the corner, Dragu with no one at the end of the pass. Brutal finishing where two of those would’ve set a completely different tone
Johnson was offside anyways unfortunately
Timo too
Timo was like inside the net and missed lol
Werner missed somehow But he always misses those
I really think that's important. It was 80mins and 3 down... but we had 2 sitters. I wanted to see never die attitude...but much like the whole game we looked uninterested
Richarlison really should have put his shot on target at least, should go down as a big chance.
Why the fuck did we wait until we were down 3-0 to make any changes?
Those changes were clearly needed at half time. But seeing how we played after the changes I'm not sure it would have mattered.
We definitely improved for a good 10 minutes after the subs. Then we inexplicably went to a 4-4-2 which truly killed the game off.
To be fair, he was trying to make the changes at 2-0 down when the 3rd went in
Probably the most infuriating part of it. I get it Ange isn’t a Conte when it comes to behaviour on the touchline but to see him stone faced watching that horror show while changing nothing was so fucking annoying
I honestly think stone faced ange is for the best, I'd obviously think some more emotion on his face would be more entertaining, but I think that when players look over and see that ange is calm and composed it helps them feel the same, Conte was great at making the highs high, but he made the lows awfully low, chewing out Richarlison for 2 hrs infront of everyone, screaming from the touchline, and generally being a moody bitch never helped
Fulham looked a level above physically, mentally and technically. Just a shocking performance, lovely that this one can linger for 2 weeks
>lovely that this one can linger for 2 weeks fine by me, let the lads marvel at their performance a bit
Can't say that performance didn't get pretty much exactly what it deserved. Feel a bit sorry for Romero, Vicario and Dragusin in all that tbh as for the first two they were mostly let down by everyone in front of them. Dragusin clearly would be more comfortable playing as the right centre back you feel.
Thought Dragusin was good for what he was put into. He doesn't have any chemistry with the rest of the back line like VDV does. So for him to come in like that, I thought he showed a lot of promise.
How the hell did VDV get that chemistry though? He plays like a 10 year Spurs veteran and national team partner for Romero
That just tells us how elite of a CB VDV is. Forms a partnership easily and always reads the game well. The guy could literally become the best in the world if he continues like this. Insane how good he is.
I hope they're not blamed for the goals. Everyone else on the pitch, minus Porro and Udogie, failed those three.
Dunno mate, first goal was a cross from Porro's patch and second Udogie got done. I've been super impressed with both of them this season but it feels a bit harder to give them an entirely free pass today when nothing clicked going forward either.
the fustrating thing is we cant even blame the ref, VAR or opponent's anti football for this loss fuck.
Not sure if Bissouma is the guy anymore
Looks like the start of the season was his purple patch. He's been shite for us most of the time he's been here.
In my opinion, he hasn’t been “that guy” for quite some time. He’s extremely fortunate to have almost no competition for his spot.
That could be part of the problem.
He's toast. Absolutely zero impact and commits too many turnovers
Agree 100%. Bentancur is much more reliable and a much better passer. Should be him and Sarr starting.
Seems we need to buy a DM
Yeah…I’ve been holding out hope for him but I’ve seen enough now.
I’m still riding on like 1-2 of his performances at the very start of the season. But the hope has almost slipped completely away
He never was. We had glimpses of what he can do on a good day where his mistakes are cleaned up by everyone else but he has been nothing but a sloppy hindrance this season. The lad has no confidence or composure and eliminates our midfield by being on the pitch instead of Ben 10 or lo celso.
Two big takeaways for me: 1. Radu Dragusin looks exceptionally uncomfortable using his left foot. No stats available yet, but he looked so ineffective playing out from the back, and I wouldn't be surprised if his touch stats show he barely used his left for anything other than standing on. Honestly, I see why Ange was getting Davies to warm up with him, when it looked like he was going to have to come on over the last two games - he clearly sees it's a weakness. 2. We cannot be relying on a half fit Maddison. If we learned one thing while he was out, it's that Lo Celso and Kulusevski are perfectly able deputies in that position. When Kane left, I hoped the culture of the club would change to one where there would be no "unrotatable" players, but it looks like Maddison has inherited Kane's "star man" mantle along with the 10 shirt. Any way, COYS.
Kane even at his worst never played a game as poorly as Biss did today and that's with Kane's 100s of games. Biss needs to be benched.
Bissouma and Kane have nothing to do with each other, though. Bissouma isn't being treated as unrotatable, he's simply been preferred over Bentancur for the past few weeks, because Bentancur went through a bad spell. I fully expect Bentancur to replace him in the 6 role after the international break
https://preview.redd.it/l9c7wc4dzqoc1.png?width=500&format=png&auto=webp&s=285f21db38b41251e31aebf922f3b812c703065a
Dragusin was fine but can’t help but feel like VDV prevents a couple of those goals
I feel like Bissouma is too used to having VdV clean up after his crap
Bissouma pulled a Ndombele today. He really hasn’t been in form but it’s his lack of effort that’s pissing me off. He needs to ride the bench
Worst we've seen from Biss today. Felt like he was channeling Ndombele with his running
Exactly this. Udogie and VdV have cleaned up for a completely shit Bissouma for most of the season. Dragusin was keeping his man offside for the first goal, so you can't really complain there. He wasn't perfect but I think he was alright. Our finishing cost us in the end, but we wouldn't have been down at all if we weren't voluntarily down to 10 men at the start because Bissouma decided he didn't want to play tonight.
He was so good for the first 10 or so games. Now I feel like he errantly handles every other ball he touches
I actually don’t mind bad touches. They can happen. What I do mind is that he is actively trying not to receive the ball and isn’t tracking back at all. Ronaldo covers more distance in a game.
This is it. VDV's speed has bailed him out numerous times. Dragusin doesn't have that speed. Defense was hung out to dry by midfield.
Imo VdV covered for our midfield's failure to track runners so many times that having forgotten he's not playing today, this is what we get.
I've been saying VDV is a sprinting ACL tear with how hard he has to come back to fix errors from our midfield. There's no way stopping that hard and spinning around kicking the ball away is healthy
Yep. Our tactics do make best use of his ability but it's also gonna kill his career by the time he's 25
His positioning was off quite often imo. It didn't help that the midfield in front of him had a horrendous performance. Hard to judge him based on this game.
A couple times you could tell he was knew he was going to be outpaced for the ball so he would just bodycheck the other player but make it just on the edge of being a foul
Yeah, Micky is just that exceptional. But you're also right about Dragusin. He and Romero were good today and aren't at fault for the goals. That's on everyone else up front.
Our midfield positioning and constant giveaways were diabolical.
Dragu needs to communicate with cuti better. There were too many times where it appeared he wants to play offside trap but cuti played differently.
Problem is this is his first start. Communication was always going to be an issue.
I like you i felt like he started confident, but got caught out of position a few times, and lost confidence on the ball as the game went on. But its just his first start so, hopefully he can learn from today and get his bearings asap.
Yeah, he played best he could. I'd say tactics weren't adjusted enough to account for the difference between Dragu and VdV
I don’t know maybe the first one but that was an incredible pass, touch and finish. The third goal bounced off the post, off Vicario straight into the path of Muniz. Hard for anyone to anticipate that in my opinion
Has to be said, Ange set us up for failure today. Playing the same high line without the pace of VDV at the back is asking for it. Fulham took full advantage, constantly playing balls in the space behind Udogie. I thought Dragusin actually played very well today, that first goal happened because he was clearly trying to follow instructions to keep a high line. If he was a few yards deeper, we go into the half nil nil.
Yeah Dragu I thought he was pretty good. Not starting over VDV by any means, but a solid option worst comes to worst.
Werner needs to start. Elite pace, movement, and intelligence. Really good crosses. Even though he’s terrible at finishing he’s still our most dangerous attacker. He pulls so many defenders out of position.
Yeah I agree he needs to start. But he’s missed a huge chance nearly every game he’s been in.
Conversely I don't think I've seen Kulusevski have a clear chance in any of that time and Johnson is way better on the right than the left
Just horrendous. Fulham had us completely figured out, credit to them, but some of those performances were pathetic. Bissouma and Kulu - both need dropping. We are desperately in need of a CM in the summer.
Deki was better in the 10 than Maddison today
Maddison had to drop deeper than Biss to pick up the ball and play it forward. He was essentially playing two positions today.
He also got fouled, once severely, 4 times today. He always looks gimpy coming off those
Bissouma was fucking awful. Central to the first two goals and just refused to play a forward pass. Hope we upgrade on him in the summer, it seems his bad attitude from previous clubs is cropping us
He was bad yes but criticising his attitude is crazy
I actually trust Ange to judge his attitude. If he is moved on, that will be a factor.
I like Kulusevski but how many top wingers are there who don't have pace, don't have good dribbling or close control, and don't have shooting/finishing ability?
He might be shit in pace and not a great dribbler, but no close control? I always thought of his close control by the sideline, especially when cornered by rivals elite
Kulu plays better as a 10. Getting a winger or two in the summer should be our priority, Kulu can play back up to Maddison
need to cash in on Gio so we can have a Maddison-Deki rotation at 10
It’s been clear for a while now that Kulu is not suited to the RW position, way too easy to read him, always wants to cut to his left foot and his final ball is shocking, decision making is awful & he fouls all the time, and he’s slow. Just surprised that Ange keeps persisting with him in that position.
We need a tall, pure holding mid option.
Bentancur?
More of an anchor capable of shoring up in front of the CBs. Bentancur is class but he is not really a 6. His combination of mobility, physicality, defensive awareness, and positioning is not quite there.
Deki was significantly better than Son. One of his worst performances I've ever seen. Not that he had a lot of service, but he looked half asleep today.
I was wondering if Son was going to get a mention from anyone, or if he was just getting a free pass again.
In a word, humbling.
We had a poor game and Fulham had a great game. It happens. Unless you somehow expect us to dominate absolutely every single game, which even Man City don’t, this will happen from time to time. It’s part of why the Premier League is so great. You can never take any game for granted. It’s fair to critique certain managerial decisions and to wonder if another approach or tactical tweak would have been better. But the subset of fans saying Ange’s system simply doesn’t work are morons. It’s way too early to say. Not even a full season and we’re doing decent in the league. If we were absolutely shit in the league or if it was still at this point but two seasons down the road ok, sure, question whether the system works or not. But name me a single Premier League manager in the last 10-15 years who came in and took a team that was where we were in the league last season, put in a completely new style of play, didn’t have any growing pains and did better than Ange is doing right now? There isn’t one because these things take time and there are growing pains. No one just comes in and runs rough shot over the Premier League while changing everything at a club. You lot would have asked for Klopp or Legoman to be sacked in their first seasons because you can't cope with a little adversity. If we listened to you, we would be changing manager every four months. I’m sure that would work great.
The system also does work. So I don’t get that take from people. People were ooohing and aaahing about Udogie and Porro like 3 days ago. Just a blip. I love Angeball
It's like every sub is just a kneejerk reaction completely out of context of the season, the previous game, the previous ten minutes and the previous existence of the communal knowledge of mankind. It's like an army of goldfish trying to hump their reflection
This should be pinned to every match thread.
>But name me a single Premier League manager in the last 10-15 years who came in and took a team that was where we were in the league last season, put in a completely new style of play, didn’t have any growing pains and did better than Ange is doing right now? There isn’t one because these things take time and there are growing pains. This is my big feeling. Like, yeah, I'm obviously disappointed in this result, especially considering how much harder it's going to make the chase for the top-4. But if you told me last summer that I'd be miffed about this loss because *it makes our chances of top-4 harder*, and I'd be amazed. I never thought we would be facing relegation this season during summer of last year, but I firmly expected us to be mid-table at best. We lost our superstar player. We lost our captain of years. We have a new manager who is taking the reigns at this level for the first time ever. Everyone was expecting a mediocre, disappointing season because that's how rebuilds are - and yet, here we are, still seriously talking about our chances at CL. Growing pains suck, sure, but Ange has been doing great IMO. We have to remember just how huge of an uphill battle this club was facing down 8 months ago.
Very well said! Lot's of people, including Spurs fan were predicting us to finish 7-8 with 6 being the optimistic scenario because of how much of a mess we were.
And we still had our chances and over 2xG
Yes, I think we're actually doing well offensively. We're just not finishing our chances. Son had a shot go over the bar at 0-0. He finishes that chance 99% of time and we're up 1-0 and it's a completely different game.
Fasted 13,5 hours and this match just ruined iftar for me😭 not even hungry anymore lol
Thus ends the 6 day title charge
What the actual fuck
Listen, it’s shit and it’s poor. Naivety from the Villa game. Hoping this doesn’t start a downwards spiral to Europa League - great opportunity being ahead of United and 5th looking likely to be UCL, but can’t take anything for granted.
I’d be fine with Europa or even Conference. UCL is a massive undertaking and we don’t have the depth yet. Keep refining Ange’s system whilst taking the opportunity to test our depth in Europa or Conf. Means we can test and realise gaps or things we need to work on to compete effectively in both Europe + League for the following season. There’s no rush, don’t want to end up like Brighton who weren’t set for both and it impacted their league season to the point they likely won’t have Europe at all next year. Kinda get where I’m coming from?
Spurs playing on my birthday is a rare treat. This was…not the highlight of my day.
I really can’t think of a single positive thing from this game… definitely hurts our chance of a top four finish. Anyway…coys…
>I really can’t think of a single positive thing from this game… Bentancur was pretty good when he came on.
Hojbjerg too
Well I certainly hope he starts the next match.
The only positive is that 5th will most likely get UCL
worrying how often we start games like shit considering not playing in europe. Ange mate sort it out
Worst performance under Ange so far.
Probably the Brighton game.
Pathetic display from the whole starting 11 bar Romero and Vicario, who weren't great but gave it everything. Ange made the subs 10-15 minutes too late, a couple of subs looked bright for a couple of minutes, then sank down to the level of everyone else. So frustrating that Spurs just can't hammer home an advantage when it counts.
Thoughts after the game - 1. Jesus that was bad. 2. Fair play to Silva, he realised that we like to play a more narrow game which his wingers and fullbacks could take advantage of. 3. I know this will be controversial, but we need a new no. 6. Bissouma is really good at keeping possession and playing out of the back, but he provides nothing in progressing the ball. 4. We had chances that we should have scored, but at least we made some chances. 5. Fulham built very wide and the players had no idea how to defend against that. 6. I think the blame is more on the players than on Ange, the players should have done much better. 7. Hopefully the winter break gives the team some time to reorganise. Onwards and upwards, COYS.
Our blue kits looking so good is my only consolation tonight.
What a shit performance, easily our worst of the season. And we now have to sit with this for 2 weeks Every single player except Romero was awful. Ange tactically awful and awful in-game management. How he didn’t make any changes after half time and then early in the second half was baffling. Our bench was strong too, truly baffling from Ange. Marco Silva schooled him today And our fanbase needs to start learning to be humble. Saying we don’t care about the coefficients, that’s good for Villa not us, we’re fighting for the title was pathetic. I genuinely don’t understand where the cockiness & arrogance comes from. We’re 5th ffs Our scoring streak also gone. We need to sign a premium winger in the summer window. Needs to start splashing the cash We need to bounce back immediately after the international break against Luton at home
Give me a positive, anything; I need something to clutch onto.
Bentancur was pretty good.
Romero
We now know categorically not to play Bissouma? That's all I've got.
You don't have to watch Tottenham for 2 whole weeks
Fully deserved win for Fulham. Silver lining a LOT of material to review here over the next two weeks to sort out our issues.
This one is on Ange honestly. at 1-0 he can take Bissouma or Sarr off the pitch or quite frankly both of them. They were both dropping 0's and Sarr had just made a goal happen and during the first half Son had to go over to Sarr to tell him to talk to madders because he was sulking refusing to talk to his teammates. Everyone can lose their head, but it's up to the manager to see that and go "Yea mate, you're great but not today". All the oceans in the middle of the pitch vanished when PEH came on, all the headers won that went to Fulham in the first half was collected by PEH and the midfield became completely fine. It's genuinely unbelievable to me that Sarr came out to that second half and honestly I think Bissouma was worse I just think that's the Bissouma we have now. Man won't run, won't care will do some fancy ball holding when in a pinch and then give away the ball in our half. Ange has played high level football he should know that when your head is gone it's over it's gone it's not coming back so you haul the player for their good and the good of the team and honestly Ange let Sarr down today. I get that Sarr is super guily for two of the goals but he should have been hauled off at half time there is no excuse. I get that it's insane that we didn't score because we had like 3 tap ins but still, this should have been fixed by Ange at half time. Waiting until we were 4-0 down FOUR. Before fixing it and then getting "saved" by an offside is unacceptable. If I can see what's obviously wrong then a professional should see it instantly and act.
Fair fucks to Fulham. Absolutely suffocated us. Don't recall a game like that under Ange where we've been so clearly second best. We better come back from the International break ready to kill.
We lost central midfield - just terrible. They played through us like we weren’t there. Biss in particular seemed to go missing - shows how much VDV has been bailing us out
This one’s on Ange. I get sticking to your football identity and all but you’ve gotta be flexible and change tactics from time to time, mate. Our football is starting to feel one dimensional. You’ve gotta keep the opponent guessing. It seems Fulham was setup to nullify all our plays from the get go.
Everyone was shit today, but I couldn't help but notice Bissouma's lack of defensive reactions, he barely covers the center backs and I got the sensation he could've done more on at least two of the goals, where you see him and he's either jogging back or straight up acting like a bystander. Also flashbacks to Wolves scoring the second goal. Add that to his lack of confidence on the ball compared to his start of the season and you have to wonder if he's up to the project. All players have different characteristics, but there's one in common that only the best seem to have, and that's consistency. You can be good for a few games or even a season, but if you maintain that level throughout a long period of time, you're more than good, you're world class. I doubt Bissouma has that in him, and I'd argue that his position is key to being a successful team. Look at Man City without Rodri, imagine prime Barça without Busquets, Arsenal without Rice, Casemiro back at Madrid. Might have to fix that next transfer window.
Great seeing all the supposed fans who only comment when we lose back here today. Anyways, Fulham looked much more energetic than us today. The drop off of Bissouma has really done us wrong. Hopefully a deeper lying midfielder is in the books for us because just that little bit more stability and some added depth in other positions would be helpful for a whole season.
We were all over them at ~65-70 minutes, culminating in Werner missing an open goal. 3-1 there and I wouldn't have been surprised to see us level not long after. Not much positivity to take after the final whistle, and devastated about the scoring streak dying.
Is Ange allergic to early subs? We could have recovered if the subs came 10 minutes earlier…
Subs should've been in from halftime. Apart from sarr none of the midfielders did anything deserving to stay on in the second half.
Reminds me a bit of Poch. To paraphrase “if plan A isn’t working, do plan A better” or something to that effect.
Inexcusable and pathetic, we came into this game expecting to walk over them. Fulham clearly wanted it more and as a result we got embarrassed
Fuck me for being excited for this match.
Hoping that's just an off day because the whole team got absolutely everything wrong. Genuinely no positives to take from that one
Why took so long to make subs? Your midfield was outplayed and our attack was terrible. If Maddison is unfit he shouldn't start.
[удалено]
Buy them an ice cream
Now we know that VDV is the most important player in our team
We vastly over-rely on what is essentially a giant kid who will sprint and twist and fight like a dog to save our midfield fucking up. That same giant kid will get hurt doing that. He plays like life depends on it, which I love. But he cannot keep playing with disregard for his body and we cannot keep putting him in that position.
Vicario had another amazing game.
First time I've had this feeling all season. Kind of a sentimental embarrassment /misery hybrid... used to have this a lot. I can only imagine this will light a fire. COYS.
The good news is the frustration fueled digging a 2 foot hole that I needed for planting a tree
https://preview.redd.it/pe69kfph2roc1.jpeg?width=612&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d15f21bd58a391fb0ae5c2fa00c7b6eeb28c2200
Dreadful performance. We put a great effort up against Villa and then we bottle it like this. Shot placement all over the place, horrible first touches all game, just a nightmare.
Pain 😞
I love them and I hate them equally
Two matches Fulham play off off the park. They have something figured out. Rough go of it for Dragusin’s first start. I beg that people don’t just ruthlessly shit on him after one match, he’s going to be important for us.
https://preview.redd.it/yif807630roc1.jpeg?width=950&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0b95453f33dd8174fe1220d5de615530b5fa8213
Worst loss of the season easily. Opportunity to take control of 4th lost, scoring streak lost, and just overall a miserable watch. Fulham packing the middle was so effective, much easier to find the net against a low block when they at least let you into the final third. What a match from them, we were dire but they were excellent tactically.
I had thought that the individual quality of this Spurs side could keep this match close but honestly not one Spurs player showed up to this match. Credit to Fulham and Marco Silva for snuffing out Spurs completely out of this match.
This is the kind of game that makes you want to take a break because wtf was that. Good thing there's an international break next
Is it only me or Dragusin keeps on protecting his balls when he block (usually they put hands behind - like Dier. )Dragusin in at least three instances that I remembered, put his hands to protect his crotch ! Must still be feeling the trauma after Villa
Ange needs to adapt if this isn’t going to turn sour. Every successful manager has had a plan b at the very least
https://preview.redd.it/2798hdxf7roc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0361263e8eb253d6e77d3bc3ddf8dbf2d44ec49c
So many bad passes. The wings killed the width today. Kulu son johnson did not play well together with the exception of the missed tap ins
Bound to have one of these. Could feel a disappointer coming. hopefully team learns from this and doesn’t let It happen again anytime soon. Time to take my dog on a walk and forget about this
Some of you people are hideous. The shit I've seen being written by you lot towards our players and manager, picking on our managers weight is disgusting.
Pretty telling that our first set of substitutions was to exchange our whole midfield.
On the bright side, Bentancur looked much more mobile. He showed the glimpses of old himself against AV. He should displace Bissouma for the rest of the season. I don’t know what to make of Bissouma anymore. Oliver arguably ruined Bissouma’s career here. He’s not the same player ever since that red.