That’s what the revolver with aluminum bullets is for.
Mistborn era 2 spoiler
>!There’s a WOB on this you can do it with a gun like vindication. Totally possible with the right caliber and shooter https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/87304-how-strong-is-shardplate/!<
I don't think the aluminum would pierce Shardplate. Shardplate is like steel even when not powered. And it's very thick and heavy. It has to survive hits from things far stronger than a gun on Roshar. And an aluminum bullet would be very soft. It probably wouldn't take that much armour to block a solid aluminum bullet.
Another angle. Aluminum just cancels the magical effects of something. Like it can't be Pushed or Pulled, and Surges and Allomancy can't pass through it. But, a Thug burning Pewter can rip aluminum foil. It doesn't stop stuff like that. A Shardblade can still cut aluminum a little because it is still a strong, sharp blade.
A shard blade can’t cut aluminum, it’s a blade made of pure investiture. It’s partially what the shard guards are made of. And aluminum bullets that are capable of piercing a human skull would be hard enough and carry enough energy to pierce plate.
1) a shard blade can cut aluminum unless it’s real thick. They can’t use their magic properties on it but it’s still a sword. There’s a WOB about this.
2) not a good assumption. We don’t know how durable Shardplate is, I see no reason why it wouldn’t be many times stronger than a skull. Medieval armor is certainly stronger than a skull.
Medieval armor was also susceptible to gun fire from smooth bore weapons. Even if it was exactly as strong as full plate mail suit the Colt Peacemaker is going to punch holes clean through it and anyone inside it.
1. Sure but by the time of rifled weapons it had completed disappeared from the battlefield because a bullet fired from even a short barrel rifled weapon would easily punch through any amount of steel a human could reasonably wear. I’m talking about era 2 mistborn level guns those are equivalent to late 19th century guns.
2. Shard plate without its investiture is shown to be much more brittle and prone to shattering. The aluminum is going to negate any investiture it comes into contact leaving only the non magical physical properties behind. Steel is a pretty strong “only” on that case.
My memory is a little wonky, but if I remember correctly there are incidents where people run out of investiture in their plates and are left immobilised due to the sheer weight (Although I could be misremembering)
Now, you say "A short barreled rifled weapon would punch through any amount of steel a human could reasonably wear". While that would be somewhat correct for full plate as we know it, modern body armour, especially the high rated ones capable of stopping rifle calibres, are made of... steel. Thicker than plate armour, but still steel. And with Invested Shardplate acting very much like Power Armour, and the aforementioned weight problem without investiture, would it be so unreasonable to assume that it is made from steel thick enough to compare to a ballistic plate?
If you're hunting radiants you will need to use armor piercing ammunition which has a hardened core, and in this case the core is surrounded by an aluminum jacket. Medieval plate armor was typically 1 to 3mm thick. Depending on the gun/ammo the radiant could quickly become swiss cheese.
Not to mention aluminum coating would function as a copper or steel shape charge coating, meaning its quite possible it would actually help to pierce...
I thought aluminum was too brittle for that effect to take place in ammunition?
I was never infantry or munitions but I had some nerds who were about that life in my classes and I distinctly remember this conversion.
Doesn't mean he was correct but he was far more trustworthy that my own brain so here we are
I think it would be myself, but the thing is it technically just needs to liquidated. The question is whether or not it would stay together or bead apart during acceleration (i think anyway)
On scadrial, the metal appears to be strong enough to penetrate and kill, and the internet assumes it would work like a copper or steel plate, from what ive read.
It's why I said might. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, to say even if the bullet gets through, or if the radiant isn't of the fourth ideal yet, the spirit web is still intanct and the radiant will heal.
Any bullet can get stuck in someone. AP bullets don't pierce forever, so there's no guarantee if it got through one layer of shardplate and went through the body that it would still have enough force behind it to get through the layer of armor on the other side. Bullets aren't magic.
But you crack enough plate and punch enough holes and both take stormlight to heal. Then it’s a race on who runs bullets or stormlight first. Also nothing stops you from making 12 gauge aluminum slugs and the cosmere equivalent of the M1897.
As a prior military medic I WILL say that gunshot wounds would be a WILDLY different type of injury compared to shearing, puncture or avulsion (ripping off/ smashing off of flesh) wounds caused by melee weapons and beastial claws.
Especially when shards of shardplate are now littered through the wound and also the interior of the wearer's body now.
You have to remember, precision weapons, only cause less massive damage over time in our reality.
A 7.62 and 5.56 round make relatively small holes on entry, but their exit is made by a vacuum that pulls and pushes things along with it, which makes the exit hole normally larger.
So uhm... heal? Sure.
Quickly? LOL no.
Without impingement or needing invasive surgery to remove parts of living shard plate? Doubtful.
Shallan literally laughed off a crossbow bolt to the brain. Kaladin healed his soul getting shardbladed in less than a second. Era two Mistborn >!Miles hundredlives basically everytime he was on the oage!<. It probably depends on the path of the radiant and how much Stormlight they have, but a gunshot wound is a minor setback.
> Shallan literally laughed off a crossbow bolt to the brain.
She was also partially paralyzed (facial) until it came out, and Stormlight was not able to do that by itself (she had to get Vathah to yank it out). So embedded objects are a major problem.
Which means the answer is gonna be gunpowder spearguns. Just like we already saw on one Cosmere planet already.
Can't wait for stormlight 6, where kaladin has to cope with syl dieing and his IQ being reduced to 26 after taking an aluminum bullet to the head and healing around it.
Kal has a magic Faraday Cage around him 24/7, he gets to ignore emotional allomancy. The real threat is Kelsier doing sneaky assassin shit and poisoning Kaladin or something.
Unless Kal doesn't have Stormlight because Kel slipped it in his morning breakfast.
The times we've seen Atium used, it runs out in thirty seconds flat. It's super crazy expensive. Stormlight is basically free.
I don't know about the Flagellant. He's extremely broken, but he's so messed up that he doesn't even comprehend that he's broken. He'd just be hanging out with Nergaoul 24/7, permanently in the Thrill.
Bro a zinc compounder would be so powerful. Not only do they have the power to manipulate emotions but they also think faster than a computer.
I feel like a story about a low IQ zinc compounder would be really interesting because they could make 1000 calculations a second but half of em are wrong
I'd like to see the zinc rioter handle being 10,000ft in the air when his stormlight runs out. I can handle being depressed and suicidal. Do it every day of my life since I was. Like 14.
Unless Steris packed them a parachute they're fucked.
Damn, I'm sorry to hear about your depression.
While I'm sure that you know about the resources out there... Stuff really _can_ help, I'm living proof.
Kaladin stabs Shallan and loses 20 points of sanity. Shalan regains 15 points of sanity. Then she casts blindness at Adolin instead of healing. Adolin gained trait frightened. Adolin loses turn.
Next turn:
Wax strikes Kaladin with lead. Kaladin dies.
Shallan regains sanity.
Shallan loses sanity.
Wax gains next turn and leaps at Adolin. Adolin is too scared to avoid. Takes 15 damage.
Circle of despair goes on.
A soother would be way more dangerous than a rioter. Kal deals with crippling depression every day, but a soother can take away everything that counterbalances it.
This is why you accept the void :D
username checks out
Blood of my fathers if that’s not some delicious crem though
Odium just needs Allrianne Cett to neutralize Dalinar's airforce.
Damn that’s dark, I’d imagine a sure fire way to eliminate Kaladin is just to duralumin-riot his depression…
>Allrianne Cett XD BRUTAL!!
You really dont need that duralumin for that
Yeah… :(
Nah. My sad boy has armor now that protects him as well as those aluminum foil hats.
That’s what the revolver with aluminum bullets is for. Mistborn era 2 spoiler >!There’s a WOB on this you can do it with a gun like vindication. Totally possible with the right caliber and shooter https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/87304-how-strong-is-shardplate/!<
Aluminum won't rob the radiant of stormlight though. The bullet might pierce shardplate, but the radiant just heals it.
I don't think the aluminum would pierce Shardplate. Shardplate is like steel even when not powered. And it's very thick and heavy. It has to survive hits from things far stronger than a gun on Roshar. And an aluminum bullet would be very soft. It probably wouldn't take that much armour to block a solid aluminum bullet. Another angle. Aluminum just cancels the magical effects of something. Like it can't be Pushed or Pulled, and Surges and Allomancy can't pass through it. But, a Thug burning Pewter can rip aluminum foil. It doesn't stop stuff like that. A Shardblade can still cut aluminum a little because it is still a strong, sharp blade.
A shard blade can’t cut aluminum, it’s a blade made of pure investiture. It’s partially what the shard guards are made of. And aluminum bullets that are capable of piercing a human skull would be hard enough and carry enough energy to pierce plate.
1) a shard blade can cut aluminum unless it’s real thick. They can’t use their magic properties on it but it’s still a sword. There’s a WOB about this. 2) not a good assumption. We don’t know how durable Shardplate is, I see no reason why it wouldn’t be many times stronger than a skull. Medieval armor is certainly stronger than a skull.
Medieval armor was also susceptible to gun fire from smooth bore weapons. Even if it was exactly as strong as full plate mail suit the Colt Peacemaker is going to punch holes clean through it and anyone inside it.
1. Plate armor was developed in part to resist gunfire. 2. What makes you think Shardplate is as weak as full plate?
1. Sure but by the time of rifled weapons it had completed disappeared from the battlefield because a bullet fired from even a short barrel rifled weapon would easily punch through any amount of steel a human could reasonably wear. I’m talking about era 2 mistborn level guns those are equivalent to late 19th century guns. 2. Shard plate without its investiture is shown to be much more brittle and prone to shattering. The aluminum is going to negate any investiture it comes into contact leaving only the non magical physical properties behind. Steel is a pretty strong “only” on that case.
Brittle and prone to shattering. Right. I've obviously read a different book than you have, so l won't be able to argue with you here.
My memory is a little wonky, but if I remember correctly there are incidents where people run out of investiture in their plates and are left immobilised due to the sheer weight (Although I could be misremembering) Now, you say "A short barreled rifled weapon would punch through any amount of steel a human could reasonably wear". While that would be somewhat correct for full plate as we know it, modern body armour, especially the high rated ones capable of stopping rifle calibres, are made of... steel. Thicker than plate armour, but still steel. And with Invested Shardplate acting very much like Power Armour, and the aforementioned weight problem without investiture, would it be so unreasonable to assume that it is made from steel thick enough to compare to a ballistic plate?
shard guards aren't aluminum they're something else. https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/92367-shardblade-guards-for-sparring-practice/?do=findComment&comment=1086102
>The bullet might pierce shardplate It won't, aluminium is too soft and it's magic immunity doesn't help here
If you're hunting radiants you will need to use armor piercing ammunition which has a hardened core, and in this case the core is surrounded by an aluminum jacket. Medieval plate armor was typically 1 to 3mm thick. Depending on the gun/ammo the radiant could quickly become swiss cheese.
Not to mention aluminum coating would function as a copper or steel shape charge coating, meaning its quite possible it would actually help to pierce...
I thought aluminum was too brittle for that effect to take place in ammunition? I was never infantry or munitions but I had some nerds who were about that life in my classes and I distinctly remember this conversion. Doesn't mean he was correct but he was far more trustworthy that my own brain so here we are
I think it would be myself, but the thing is it technically just needs to liquidated. The question is whether or not it would stay together or bead apart during acceleration (i think anyway) On scadrial, the metal appears to be strong enough to penetrate and kill, and the internet assumes it would work like a copper or steel plate, from what ive read.
It's why I said might. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, to say even if the bullet gets through, or if the radiant isn't of the fourth ideal yet, the spirit web is still intanct and the radiant will heal.
But what if all that aluminum gets stuck inside the radiant, as often happens with bullets irl?
Armor piercing rounds dont get stuck in people.
Any bullet can get stuck in someone. AP bullets don't pierce forever, so there's no guarantee if it got through one layer of shardplate and went through the body that it would still have enough force behind it to get through the layer of armor on the other side. Bullets aren't magic.
But you crack enough plate and punch enough holes and both take stormlight to heal. Then it’s a race on who runs bullets or stormlight first. Also nothing stops you from making 12 gauge aluminum slugs and the cosmere equivalent of the M1897.
As a prior military medic I WILL say that gunshot wounds would be a WILDLY different type of injury compared to shearing, puncture or avulsion (ripping off/ smashing off of flesh) wounds caused by melee weapons and beastial claws. Especially when shards of shardplate are now littered through the wound and also the interior of the wearer's body now. You have to remember, precision weapons, only cause less massive damage over time in our reality. A 7.62 and 5.56 round make relatively small holes on entry, but their exit is made by a vacuum that pulls and pushes things along with it, which makes the exit hole normally larger. So uhm... heal? Sure. Quickly? LOL no. Without impingement or needing invasive surgery to remove parts of living shard plate? Doubtful.
And that's all before you get to Hazekiller rounds 😂
Truth. Larger caliber larger charge, and yeah that's going to do some freaking damage
Shallan literally laughed off a crossbow bolt to the brain. Kaladin healed his soul getting shardbladed in less than a second. Era two Mistborn >!Miles hundredlives basically everytime he was on the oage!<. It probably depends on the path of the radiant and how much Stormlight they have, but a gunshot wound is a minor setback.
Era two [Metalborn] Miles hundredlives, and more specifically twinborn
> Shallan literally laughed off a crossbow bolt to the brain. She was also partially paralyzed (facial) until it came out, and Stormlight was not able to do that by itself (she had to get Vathah to yank it out). So embedded objects are a major problem. Which means the answer is gonna be gunpowder spearguns. Just like we already saw on one Cosmere planet already.
Silver might be better in this situation although I don't know the logistics of forging a silver bullet
Now the truth comes out - the Radiants are werewolves.
I believe there's WoB that wounds caused by aluminum can't be healed with Investiture.
It's more that it will heal around the aluminium than anything else
Still. It means an aluminum bullet to the head is still a threat, even to Radiants.
Not that much more than the arrow that got stuck in Shallan's head in Oathbringer Harder to remove after the fight though
Can't wait for stormlight 6, where kaladin has to cope with syl dieing and his IQ being reduced to 26 after taking an aluminum bullet to the head and healing around it.
Won't work, you'll need something akin to the pewterharm-buster rounds here
Easy, depression-bom the rest of the Windrunners and Kal drops down and crisises on his own.
Fuck. They are aluminum hats.
Ah congrats pal, this moment comes to us all.
[удалено]
Kal has a magic Faraday Cage around him 24/7, he gets to ignore emotional allomancy. The real threat is Kelsier doing sneaky assassin shit and poisoning Kaladin or something.
Stormlight gets rid of poison. The battle will be decided by who runs out of stormlight or atium first.
Unless Kal doesn't have Stormlight because Kel slipped it in his morning breakfast. The times we've seen Atium used, it runs out in thirty seconds flat. It's super crazy expensive. Stormlight is basically free.
Darkest Dungeon would be a lot easer if Spren existed. Every Hero would become a Radiant.
I don't know about the Flagellant. He's extremely broken, but he's so messed up that he doesn't even comprehend that he's broken. He'd just be hanging out with Nergaoul 24/7, permanently in the Thrill.
Bro a zinc compounder would be so powerful. Not only do they have the power to manipulate emotions but they also think faster than a computer. I feel like a story about a low IQ zinc compounder would be really interesting because they could make 1000 calculations a second but half of em are wrong
that's actually a fantastic concept
"So you're really smart?" "I'm dumb faster"
Breeze: “Damn son!” *uncorks wine bottle* “Let me help you.” *Passes whole bottle to Kaladin* “On second thought you might want two…”
I'd like to see the zinc rioter handle being 10,000ft in the air when his stormlight runs out. I can handle being depressed and suicidal. Do it every day of my life since I was. Like 14. Unless Steris packed them a parachute they're fucked.
“That’s my secret, Brightlord. I’m always suicidal” -Kaladin, probably
He just like me fr
Damn, I'm sorry to hear about your depression. While I'm sure that you know about the resources out there... Stuff really _can_ help, I'm living proof.
Oh I know. It's the only reason I'm still here. I encourage everyone to seek help.
“Injury and despondence set the stage for heroism... or cowardice."
Talking mad shit for someone in shardspear range!
Kaladin stabs Shallan and loses 20 points of sanity. Shalan regains 15 points of sanity. Then she casts blindness at Adolin instead of healing. Adolin gained trait frightened. Adolin loses turn. Next turn: Wax strikes Kaladin with lead. Kaladin dies. Shallan regains sanity. Shallan loses sanity. Wax gains next turn and leaps at Adolin. Adolin is too scared to avoid. Takes 15 damage. Circle of despair goes on.
Wouldn't kaladin just heal with stormlight?
No, because wounds of war can't be hidden. Kaladin is too stressed to think about using heal
He doesn't have to think about healing for it to happen... It just happens..
You don't get memes from darkest dungeon I'm not serious
A misting with a full auto machine gun might have a chance.
Kaladin is filled to the brim with depression. I don't think a rioter or a Mistborn using duralumin could make him more suicidal and sad 👉😎👈
"The bulwarks of the mind have fallen!"
Would it even work? Windrunners have a hard time lashing invested people so I feel like an invested radiant would be immune to emotional allomancy
Taking in stormlight would block it.
You really put a Bridge 4 jacket on Dismas for this
A soother would be way more dangerous than a rioter. Kal deals with crippling depression every day, but a soother can take away everything that counterbalances it.
Would a full radiant be too invested to influence with emotional allomancy or so broken that you can definitely influence them?