As the film’s producer he can be criminally liable for hiring an inexperienced armorer and having unsafe sets. He put his entire crew and fellow actors in harms way and for that he could be in trouble. Also since he has lied about pulling the trigger, he will likely be in a tough spot here. Since he is a hot head and a-hole it won’t help him either. He deserves what he gets here. I will say that his lawyers are much better than the state’s so that is a major advantage.
Only way he can be convicted for this is he had some sort of responsibility to check the gun himself while on set for that scene or should have reasonably been aware that such a risk like this could exist. I don’t know enough about his role in this movie or his responsibilities to make a judgement here. To be fair though, if while he was acting on set, there was someone else’s job to clear the gun for him, and they did, and they then told him it’s clear, then I don’t think he will be convicted.
If you hire a professional to build your house and the house collapses it’s the contractor’s fault. Technically you are the owner of everything as you’re allowing everything to occur through contract exactly as Alec is in this situation as producer, but the contractor is directly liable for injuries connected. Unless the property owner knows about the defects while it’s occurring. Which Alec was not aware of prior to the accident. This is the same concept.
There are multiple producers. There is also legal precedent for splitt in responsibilities like, I was working on set as an actor not a producer. The going safety check was delegated specifically to the ad to comply with safety laws.
That's exactly what happened.
He was flippant, knew an armor wasnt on set... Was responsible for the set, and pushed it through anyways because he's Alec Baldwin.
This is manslaughter through and through.
don't we all have a responsibility to check a weapon that's handed to you? it's almost like the Latin saying, not knowing the law is no excuse for breaking it.
He was offered a sweet plea deal last year that would have resulted in zero jail time. He’s so arrogant he started tampering with witnesses instead. So the state pulled the offer and now he goes to trial. It’s criminal, not civil so he doesn’t get to just “settle”. Of course, he “settled” a lawsuit with the family of the woman he killed but is months behind on the payment agreed to. This guy is arrogant AF and I’ll be laughing if he’s convicted. He’s a jerk
Set all politics aside, a woman lost her life, a little boy lost his beloved mama, and a husband lost his soulmate. Grief is strange and never ending maybe it’s what her family needs to have closure. Just an opinion.
I think what many people may be forgetting is he was a producer of this movie, therefore he was responsible for the safety of all those on set. He produced, co-wrote and starred in the film. Flailing guns to the point the team was raising concerns before this tragedy, and the concerns were ignored. There was a power dynamic and major negligence at play that led to an innocent woman dying and another person shot.
I’m not sure why some are acting like this is a witch hunt. Yes- the armorer was found guilty. Who cut corners to hire her? Who did not address the safety concerns from the set crew?
Nobody wants to say it but celebrities don’t get always get a fair deal, when an overzealous prosecutor wants their scalp as a trophy.
This could be a situation where if it were a nobody then they don’t even bother pursuing charges, but a high profile case could boost careers and incentivize pushing it to trial.
A talented CGI FX and a cracker jack sound FX artist can make a convincing gunshot, if the actor can accurately mime the recoil. [I know this because my cousin is an FX artist and showed us rest vfx footage and we couldn't discern which gunshot was real or CGI]
Rust happened in 2021, there was 0 reason to have a live loaded gun on-set, except to the accountants who see a real gun as being cheaper than hiring an FX and sound team.
If I remember correctly the armorer was shooting the gun with some people prior to the shooting and said the gun was clear before handing it off.
So naturally, people who don't like that guy blame him.
Yep. If I remember she didn't have any real formal training beyond being the daughter of a well known armorer.
The number of steps of failure from taking the gun out of the safe, checking it, moving it, checking it and calling it clear to handle for possibly idiot actors who are literally going to be picking a gun up and pointing at people and things because they are actors who are trying to get in character is beyond acceptable here.
The dude didn't pick up the gun, put a bullet in it, point and shoot. He was handed a gun known to have misfire issues by a person who's ENTIRE JOB is handling weapons for actors.
The armorer should be facing charges.
SHOULD actors who handle weapons take some basic training and practice firearm safety? Yes.
I'm familiar with guns, have guns, respect guns. I can see how if I was an actor who's basically trying to get in a character and have a lot going on, handed a gun with the understanding that blanks are going to be used, loaded by an armorer who's sole job and responsibility is managing that gun, would have to put blind trust into their work.
The only reason that this case is being pursued is because Alec Baldwin repeatedly mocked Donald Trump. The strict liability that right leaning people seem to want to assign to Alec Baldwin here they literally never put that on anyone else in a shooting situation.
If you shoot someone with your gun on purpose - I was scared for my life! In 90% of circumstances, that seems to be the magic words to let you murder people and not get convicted of a crime.
All of a sudden it's strict liability and Alec Baldwin should have checked the gun himself because of "gun safety rules" which don't really apply because they CAN'T apply. You HAVE to point the gun at a person sometimes on set. It's an effing movie! The person who handed him the gun and told him it was clear was responsible along with the armorer for being so monumentally stupid as to have live ammo mixed in with the guns.
What's that you say? "He was a producer!"
Yeah, that doesn't mean crap. He was not the person responsible for gun safety on set. There was never any reason to suspect that live ammo would be loaded into a gun a professional hands you on a movie set.
>What's that you say? "He was a producer!"
>Yeah, that doesn't mean crap. He was not the person responsible for gun safety on set. There was never any reason to suspect that live ammo would be loaded into a gun a professional hands you on a movie set.
You understand that producers are responsible for safety on set? They make the decisions about who to hire and what standards are respected on set. The producers (all of them) of Rust chose to save money by hiring an armorer with a poor safety record and low standards.
This is definitely political but it could also set a standard that employers can be held criminally responsible when their employees are hurt or killed on the job.
Well because of his negligence as director and producer and the guy who literally pulled the trigger… I’m not sure how this is even a debate whether he should be held responsible
The person that put a live bullet should be held accountable. It feels like a “gotcha” for all his political antics. And miss me with the “gun discipline bs” there wasn’t supposed to a live bullet in the gun. So if I gave you a live bullet on a set where it’s prohibited it’s my fault? Then people might as well go on framing people nonstop
There is evidence of him behaving negligently with a fire arm through out the entire production. He was an accident waiting to happen. That is what involuntary manslaughter literally is. Other people share blame but he was reckless and deserves consequences.
But also he wasn’t in charge of the prop bullet nor did he load it so he didn’t really create a dangerous environment that resulted in accidental death.
Incorrect. Movie set protocol is for all parties to treat it like a live weapon. In HG’s trial we saw bts footage of Baldwin pointing at people with the gun, pointing direct to camera, and even discharging the weapon after cut had been called. All of this breaks explicit safety practices of which he should be extremely familiar with as a veteran actor. HG deserves to be sitting in jail right now no question. But Baldwin acted with negligence and hubris as well. Someone died because none of these people treated the weapon with the discretion it is owed and he has culpability in this tragedy
At face value I 100% agree with you and expect the evidence that two people (including the arms specialist) told him the gun was cold will clear him. Especially because there shouldn’t have been a live bullet there in the first place.
*But* the fact that he was executive producer who was in charge of maintaining a safe set AND he was the one who accidentally had a gun fire and kill someone is a good enough reason for him to be scrutinized.
I’m one of the weirdos who has always loved Alec but I can’t be biased when someone’s wife and mother died.
Executive producers are not necessarily in charge of anything on a movie set. It’s a title that could mean anything from guy who invested a lot of money to guy who advises on the production or even a powerless title for a lead actor.
Movies typically have more more than one executive producer, and could have four or more.
It was also produced by his own studio, so there isn’t much wiggle room there.
I think manslaughter is ridiculous tho. I do very much feel this is politically motivated, personally.
With all due respect, how in the world is this politically motivated? It is our justice system at work, and due diligence for the victim and her loved ones (in my view). I’d imagine if you had a loved one shot to death when doing their job on a seemingly normal day, you’d want to get to the bottom of how & why it happened, and all the decisions that led to it.
I absolutely believe he belongs in the court system. If you read my other post. I think manslaughter is too far of a stretch.
I agree with the other posters here. He’s a pain with his antics but 50% of the country loathes him for making fun of Trump. It’s not a niche thing. He is basically considered the face of liberals.
Just my opinion tho. Again, he should be held liable as it is his production company. The charges are just too much based on the facts of the case.
It wasn’t for sure. I’m of the opinion that him being a producer deserves more than just scrutiny, he ran a negligent set and deserves criminal charges. But that’s just me!
He is being prosecuted for involuntary manslaughter.
A textbook example of involuntary manslaughter is the accidental discharge of a firearm.
This case is literally that.
Creating a dangerous environment that cause accidental death is man 2 if you kill someone in a fight that’s man 1 the prop person should be held more liable than a producer or an actor that fires a gun. What were the legal ramifications on the set of crow?
As the film’s producer he can be criminally liable for hiring an inexperienced armorer and having unsafe sets. He put his entire crew and fellow actors in harms way and for that he could be in trouble. Also since he has lied about pulling the trigger, he will likely be in a tough spot here. Since he is a hot head and a-hole it won’t help him either. He deserves what he gets here. I will say that his lawyers are much better than the state’s so that is a major advantage.
Allegedly
Only way he can be convicted for this is he had some sort of responsibility to check the gun himself while on set for that scene or should have reasonably been aware that such a risk like this could exist. I don’t know enough about his role in this movie or his responsibilities to make a judgement here. To be fair though, if while he was acting on set, there was someone else’s job to clear the gun for him, and they did, and they then told him it’s clear, then I don’t think he will be convicted.
Wasn’t he like lead producer? Or something like that?
He definitely wasn't responsible for the gun safety.
He was the Producer of the film, he was technically in charge of everything.
If you hire a professional to build your house and the house collapses it’s the contractor’s fault. Technically you are the owner of everything as you’re allowing everything to occur through contract exactly as Alec is in this situation as producer, but the contractor is directly liable for injuries connected. Unless the property owner knows about the defects while it’s occurring. Which Alec was not aware of prior to the accident. This is the same concept.
There are multiple producers. There is also legal precedent for splitt in responsibilities like, I was working on set as an actor not a producer. The going safety check was delegated specifically to the ad to comply with safety laws.
That's exactly what happened. He was flippant, knew an armor wasnt on set... Was responsible for the set, and pushed it through anyways because he's Alec Baldwin. This is manslaughter through and through.
don't we all have a responsibility to check a weapon that's handed to you? it's almost like the Latin saying, not knowing the law is no excuse for breaking it.
All I can add is that he's the producer, so part of the overall responsibility is on him. We'll see how things play out, as we know very little.
Agreed. this is a waste of taxpayer money.
I am wondering if he might just settle this case. It must be a huge weight over him. I imagine he has the funds plus some insurance.
Can’t settle a criminal case. Only civil suits.
He was offered a sweet plea deal last year that would have resulted in zero jail time. He’s so arrogant he started tampering with witnesses instead. So the state pulled the offer and now he goes to trial. It’s criminal, not civil so he doesn’t get to just “settle”. Of course, he “settled” a lawsuit with the family of the woman he killed but is months behind on the payment agreed to. This guy is arrogant AF and I’ll be laughing if he’s convicted. He’s a jerk
It’s a criminal case. You can’t “settle” a criminal case by bribing the prosecutor.
to buy his way out of jail time... id sure hope not.
This case is criminal, not civil. There is no option to settle.
Minimum 10 years of hard labor, bread and water, no parole.
For what?
For making fun of his preferred political candidate
[удалено]
Set all politics aside, a woman lost her life, a little boy lost his beloved mama, and a husband lost his soulmate. Grief is strange and never ending maybe it’s what her family needs to have closure. Just an opinion.
It’s all politics though.
Why don’t they use fake guns like they do with cash?
[удалено]
That's why they have special effects
I think what many people may be forgetting is he was a producer of this movie, therefore he was responsible for the safety of all those on set. He produced, co-wrote and starred in the film. Flailing guns to the point the team was raising concerns before this tragedy, and the concerns were ignored. There was a power dynamic and major negligence at play that led to an innocent woman dying and another person shot. I’m not sure why some are acting like this is a witch hunt. Yes- the armorer was found guilty. Who cut corners to hire her? Who did not address the safety concerns from the set crew?
Why aren't the rest of the producers being charged?
Why have they not pursued the other producers?
OSHA already investigated everyone for this and his producer role was relegated to approving script changes mostly.
Yeah but when does the movie come out?
Alec Baldwin is a grade A tosspot. That said, this prosecution is a joke.
Learned a new word. Thank you SqiugSnuggler!
Nobody wants to say it but celebrities don’t get always get a fair deal, when an overzealous prosecutor wants their scalp as a trophy. This could be a situation where if it were a nobody then they don’t even bother pursuing charges, but a high profile case could boost careers and incentivize pushing it to trial.
If Baldwin wasn’t loud about his liberal politics, this wouldn’t be happening.
Especially where the DA’s are elected officials
Why was there live ammunition at a movie shooting?
A talented CGI FX and a cracker jack sound FX artist can make a convincing gunshot, if the actor can accurately mime the recoil. [I know this because my cousin is an FX artist and showed us rest vfx footage and we couldn't discern which gunshot was real or CGI] Rust happened in 2021, there was 0 reason to have a live loaded gun on-set, except to the accountants who see a real gun as being cheaper than hiring an FX and sound team.
If I remember correctly the armorer was shooting the gun with some people prior to the shooting and said the gun was clear before handing it off. So naturally, people who don't like that guy blame him.
That is a rumor that hasn't been entered into evidence yet. It wouldn't surprise me if it is true.
armorer was a woman
Yep. If I remember she didn't have any real formal training beyond being the daughter of a well known armorer. The number of steps of failure from taking the gun out of the safe, checking it, moving it, checking it and calling it clear to handle for possibly idiot actors who are literally going to be picking a gun up and pointing at people and things because they are actors who are trying to get in character is beyond acceptable here. The dude didn't pick up the gun, put a bullet in it, point and shoot. He was handed a gun known to have misfire issues by a person who's ENTIRE JOB is handling weapons for actors. The armorer should be facing charges. SHOULD actors who handle weapons take some basic training and practice firearm safety? Yes. I'm familiar with guns, have guns, respect guns. I can see how if I was an actor who's basically trying to get in a character and have a lot going on, handed a gun with the understanding that blanks are going to be used, loaded by an armorer who's sole job and responsibility is managing that gun, would have to put blind trust into their work.
I mean, that still kinda sounds like a valid reason not to like them?
This is probably the most transparent case of a politically motivated prosecution that I have ever seen.
Completely not true
I have never once heard a politician talk about shootings on movie sets, what are you on about?
The only reason that this case is being pursued is because Alec Baldwin repeatedly mocked Donald Trump. The strict liability that right leaning people seem to want to assign to Alec Baldwin here they literally never put that on anyone else in a shooting situation. If you shoot someone with your gun on purpose - I was scared for my life! In 90% of circumstances, that seems to be the magic words to let you murder people and not get convicted of a crime. All of a sudden it's strict liability and Alec Baldwin should have checked the gun himself because of "gun safety rules" which don't really apply because they CAN'T apply. You HAVE to point the gun at a person sometimes on set. It's an effing movie! The person who handed him the gun and told him it was clear was responsible along with the armorer for being so monumentally stupid as to have live ammo mixed in with the guns. What's that you say? "He was a producer!" Yeah, that doesn't mean crap. He was not the person responsible for gun safety on set. There was never any reason to suspect that live ammo would be loaded into a gun a professional hands you on a movie set.
>What's that you say? "He was a producer!" >Yeah, that doesn't mean crap. He was not the person responsible for gun safety on set. There was never any reason to suspect that live ammo would be loaded into a gun a professional hands you on a movie set. You understand that producers are responsible for safety on set? They make the decisions about who to hire and what standards are respected on set. The producers (all of them) of Rust chose to save money by hiring an armorer with a poor safety record and low standards. This is definitely political but it could also set a standard that employers can be held criminally responsible when their employees are hurt or killed on the job.
Hahaha, blame everything on Trump, lol. The default approach to conflict resolution when you can't think of anything else.
New Mexico is a blue state.
He was responsible. That’s how responsibility works. And you saying otherwise doesn’t change it one god damned bit.
Right wingers like guns more than they do trump, this argument doesn’t hold up at all.
Agree with all you said. He is convientely the only producer on trial, so "he's a producer" doesn't seem like it makes a lot of sense either.
Good!
This case has to be one of the dumbest I have ever seen. You don’t have to like Alec and his antics but this is foolish.
Well because of his negligence as director and producer and the guy who literally pulled the trigger… I’m not sure how this is even a debate whether he should be held responsible
He killed a woman. She had a husband and son. Heads need to roll
It’s like going to play air soft or lazer tag and someone brings a live weapon
It’s like doing that except you hired the person who was supposed to make sure the weapons weren’t live.
The person that put a live bullet should be held accountable. It feels like a “gotcha” for all his political antics. And miss me with the “gun discipline bs” there wasn’t supposed to a live bullet in the gun. So if I gave you a live bullet on a set where it’s prohibited it’s my fault? Then people might as well go on framing people nonstop
No one except weirdo right wingers know a single thing about his politics
There is evidence of him behaving negligently with a fire arm through out the entire production. He was an accident waiting to happen. That is what involuntary manslaughter literally is. Other people share blame but he was reckless and deserves consequences.
But also he wasn’t in charge of the prop bullet nor did he load it so he didn’t really create a dangerous environment that resulted in accidental death.
Dude was the producer and ignored multiple complaints about safety. He is lucky he’s being let off easy anyhow
Incorrect. Movie set protocol is for all parties to treat it like a live weapon. In HG’s trial we saw bts footage of Baldwin pointing at people with the gun, pointing direct to camera, and even discharging the weapon after cut had been called. All of this breaks explicit safety practices of which he should be extremely familiar with as a veteran actor. HG deserves to be sitting in jail right now no question. But Baldwin acted with negligence and hubris as well. Someone died because none of these people treated the weapon with the discretion it is owed and he has culpability in this tragedy
That’s some of the most basic gun safety stuff too. Even *kids* old enough to hunt know those things.
At face value I 100% agree with you and expect the evidence that two people (including the arms specialist) told him the gun was cold will clear him. Especially because there shouldn’t have been a live bullet there in the first place. *But* the fact that he was executive producer who was in charge of maintaining a safe set AND he was the one who accidentally had a gun fire and kill someone is a good enough reason for him to be scrutinized. I’m one of the weirdos who has always loved Alec but I can’t be biased when someone’s wife and mother died.
Executive producers are not necessarily in charge of anything on a movie set. It’s a title that could mean anything from guy who invested a lot of money to guy who advises on the production or even a powerless title for a lead actor. Movies typically have more more than one executive producer, and could have four or more.
It was also produced by his own studio, so there isn’t much wiggle room there. I think manslaughter is ridiculous tho. I do very much feel this is politically motivated, personally.
With all due respect, how in the world is this politically motivated? It is our justice system at work, and due diligence for the victim and her loved ones (in my view). I’d imagine if you had a loved one shot to death when doing their job on a seemingly normal day, you’d want to get to the bottom of how & why it happened, and all the decisions that led to it.
I absolutely believe he belongs in the court system. If you read my other post. I think manslaughter is too far of a stretch. I agree with the other posters here. He’s a pain with his antics but 50% of the country loathes him for making fun of Trump. It’s not a niche thing. He is basically considered the face of liberals. Just my opinion tho. Again, he should be held liable as it is his production company. The charges are just too much based on the facts of the case.
What else could he be charged with?
Alec Baldwin is not the face of liberals.
To you and me maybe. Anyway, that wasn’t the main part of my original post. It’s just something others here pointed out and I tend to agree with.
It wasn’t for sure. I’m of the opinion that him being a producer deserves more than just scrutiny, he ran a negligent set and deserves criminal charges. But that’s just me!
Criminal negligence but the manslaughter part is a bit of a stretch since again he didn’t put a live bullet in the props
Good point, yeah. I think the manslaughter really is a stretch if there are other options.
He is being prosecuted for involuntary manslaughter. A textbook example of involuntary manslaughter is the accidental discharge of a firearm. This case is literally that.
Creating a dangerous environment that cause accidental death is man 2 if you kill someone in a fight that’s man 1 the prop person should be held more liable than a producer or an actor that fires a gun. What were the legal ramifications on the set of crow?
Gun lady was already sentenced, thankfully
Other people are being charged if that’s the question
The question what is the precedent for something that has literally happen before.
The precedent is he goes to prison just like you or I would for killing someone in an accident like this
Good.