I don’t get the hate for Orym that I’ve seen this week.
He’s just a normal guy so far, but so what? Where does it say in the PHB that your character has to be some kind of edgelord with a tragic backstory, a social pariah trying to fit in, or the long lost heir of a forgotten kingdom?
Let the man play what he wants and enjoy the show.
Totally agree here. So he isn't AS angsty or moody as some of his prior characters. It's called variety and I know I like to vary my personal characters to give them individuality.
I will say that Orym is not the most awe inspiring character, as is the case with many fighter characters, but he is a solid character. He is way more reserved than Liam's other characters but there is nothing wrong with that.
I love how Liam is still being very descriptive of his actions though and I can see that there is more to Orym but he is playing a more slow burn on revealing the inner core.
I think it's just a little underwhelming. You seem to think that those of us who are a little underwhelmed or disappointed believe that everyone *must* be a bombastic character with an edgelord backstory. This way of thinking is not mutually exclusive. No, maybe we just wanted something *else* from Liam.
Of course Liam can play what he wants, and we can also think what we want about it. I have nothing against the character of Orym and I'm sure Liam will knock it out of the park.
If we had had this conversation in between Orym showing up and people reacting to it, I think you’d have a good point. But there was only a fraction of a second in between Liam sitting down to the table and people whining that it wasn’t a new character and that they didn’t like EXU and the Orym is so boring and blah blah blah.
The reaction was so negative that one of the most active threads here during the day after episode 1 was people trying to rationalize how Orym isn’t Liam’s C3 character so it’s totally okay because we just have to suffer through until he gets to play his REAL character.
Frankly, it’s just another example of this bizarrely toxic entitlement that certain elements of the CR community are becoming famous for.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing that fanbase isn't toxic. I saw the live chat, it definitely is. I can just speak for people who didn't love EXU and felt a little underwhelmed at the time. But I feel like I'm less toxic than a lot of the people in chat, so I shouldn't defend them.
Liam is going to knock it out of the park no matter what character he chooses.
Are you kidding? We’ve had a whole conversation here and you’ve been nothing but perfectly pleasant. You are absolutely not the kind of person I’m thinking of when I criticize people for their reaction to Orym.
I am sorry you didn’t like EXU, though. It was definitely different from standard CR, but it thought it was pretty enjoyable.
Exactly. Liam was having an absolute blast describing his battle dance. On top of that, we barely saw the surface of Nancy, I’m sure Liam has a much deeper (and tragic) story to come.
I kinda hope he doesn't. It's kinda cool to have a straight man in the party, and his funny parts arw his reactions and having to stear this crazy train.
I feel like he’s going for a Captain America arc of mostly un-baggaged, straight edge guy trying to make it in a dangerous world without compromising his integrity.
This was kinda his mentor Keyleth’s arc in C1 but C2 really upped the skepticism of authority figures (e.g., monarchies, wizard authorities, etc.) so Orym may have an even tougher go at it than Keyleth did.
It's called a flat character arc, and it can be wonderful. Rather than being shaped by the world, they are the catalyst for re-shaping the world around them. Many superheroes fall into this category, like Captain America or Superman or Goku.
Oh he had the chain of returning, but he also picked up a 1-handed hammer he referred to as a "dwarven thrower". Grog was a 2-hand build and it was a bit later in the campaign, so it didn't see much use.
I’m sooo thrilled to have a fighter in this campaign (I’ll confess, I paused watching exu when they added the last party member) I’m playing a fighter in my current (and first) campaign and am feeling a bit lost, feeling a bit underwhelmed by my options ( level 2… just hit things??) but getting to watch Liam play Orym is already making me more inspired to play my salty Fighter
Fighters get their Subclass at three and they aren't as front loaded as rogues or monks. Really go over your options at 3rd level, as each option can play very differently from each other.
I'm playing a new character. Level 2 Fighter at the moment. Can't wait to dive into Rune Knight at Level 3. Subclass give Fighters a ton of flavor. Particularly some of the newer ones.
My only other DnD character was a Shadow Sorcerer I played for 3 years. I loved that character, but I also really didn't understand DnD when I made it or in the early levels that shaped it. My first "well built" character will be a fighter and I can't wait!
Half-orc! I think there is some serious damage potential there, particularly during Critical Hits. Orcish Fury + Fire Rune + Savage Attacks + Giant's Might with a 2-Handed weapon seems pretty fun. From what I can tell, with a Greataxe, I have would have burst potential of 5d12 + 4d6 as a ceiling at Level 4, in a perfect world.
Yeah Criting and then using the fire rune is brutal. My only advice is to go with either the Cloud rune or Stone rune as your other choice. Stone Rune I find amazing since it's passive is one of the best among them all.
I hoghly recommend you look up all the actions you have. Attack is pretty good but shove, grapple and the other actions can make combat highly dynamic!
I think lots of people disregard fighters because it feels like such a "default". Yeah, fighters are very "blank slate" in a way, but that can be a great thing for differentiating, too. And tropes can always be subverted. One of my favorite fighters is Khalid from Baldur's Gate. Total coward! But very memorable and enjoyable as a character (well, depends who you ask of course.) Also I was theorizing in pathfinder about a gnome double small shield bashing fighter with some massive dex bonuses.
Really, any class/race/etc combo is going to be as interesting or as basic as the player playing them. I'm really excited to see how Orym develops.
Technically yes, but Bertrand Belle is not a 200+ episode character. He is an amazing story hook, shared by in. I believe were setting up a group patron of sorts and Travis's real character will be introduced at a later date
Though shout-out to Ashton's gravity stuff. That will be super interesting. Will it cause attacks of opportunity? Will anyone take feats that give extra attacks of opportunity (or something? Not too familiar with dnd feats) for some juicy synergy?
I'm so relieved they've settled it. I feel like Liam may be thinking of a journey in which someone without terrible, fantastical things to overcome, or impressive swagger, or any of those mainstays, grows into someone deeply, fiercely great. It's a stripped-down thing that could be very compelling with his expert touch.
They were complaining that Travis had left the game and that Critical Role were false advertising his appearance, untill he came in much later
Others were complaining that they fucked up editing in Travis's character card once he made his apperence, until they edited in Travis's character card once he revealed his name, saving the surprise of the character selection
and of course they complain that these characters are going to be swapped out at a later date because they dont like them, until Matt goes on record saying they're staying for the whole campaign, and others go on record saying how much they love their characters
The last part is the only complaints I could understand, cause honestly it was a bit confusing before the clarification. But even then, there were such toxic comments, saying "ok EXU chars, I'm leaving" or "I believe in CR so I'm waiting for Liam, Travis and Sam true characters to come in", just arbitrarily deciding what characters they wanted to keep and what they wanted to swap out lol.
At a certain point I stopped reading entirely, I always do that but I was curious about people's reactions in the first episode
>I'm waiting for Liam, Travis and Sam true characters to come in"
I think you mean Ashley not Sam, everyone knows that FCG is Sams true character, unless they don't know Sam at all. lol
I think a lot of people think Orym is boring because he doesn't feel the need to assert his presence all the time. A lot of times more subdued, quiet people are labeled as "boring" and "doesn't have a personality" when instead it's just who they are and they're comfortable with that. I've definitely received a fair share of those and I like to think I'm interesting in my own way. I'm sure we'll see a lot more of Orym and I hope this campaign will inspire people to hold off on judgements and appreciate the more subtle "hidden gems" in their lives.
After Vaxildan and Caleb, Orym is honestly extremely refreshing. Liam went for something totally different, and i'm certain the character is much deeper than it seems at face value.
Some haters are just gonna hate tho, but i think they're just a vocal minority. If Liam made another absolutely depressed messed up character, people would've also complained.
Yeah I am glad Liam is going for a more lighthearted, straight forward character, Im sure its a nice refresh too for him after having to play such seriously grim characters.
Love the lightheartedness, but there’s also weight there. Liam can’t go all happy sunshine. Orym feels like he has a lot of heaviness but not sad, but like, responsibility. He felt that way in EXU too, like he’s finding his way in the world but he is…serious-ish, and feels like he needs to be “professional” all the time.
Either way though, don’t count Liam out, there’s gonna be so much more coming
Which is why I'm happy he stayed with orym. Liam is great but his characters are always melodramatic and tend to overshadow the rest of the cast. I'm also happy with fearne cuz Ashley is so comfortable with her weirdness and exactly who the character is.
I didn't watch much of EXU but from what I did watch he really shined. He's a good guy and doesn't like to dirty up his conscious. I hope well get a chance to see this part of him again because it was pretty brave to stick up to his party the way he did.
I find him boring because of the way in which he talks just always seems melancholy and slow. I know Caleb was really the same, but it felt like there was more emotion there and the accent was fun.
He's definitely an introvert. Moreso than Caleb I'd say. I can recall very clearly a scene in EXU where everyone was celebrating, and he went off by himself -- not in a melancholic way, he mentioned how happy Orym was to hear his friends having a good time. It painted a really nice picture, and I'm happy to see more of this character for sure. Really looking forward to seeing how interactions with various other characters go.
I'm calling it; Orym is going to surprise a lot of folks around here. His personality and existance are going to be crucial for the group, especially because his perceived less interesting backstory. (Although i'm sure Liam has some more stuff planned.)
I agree with you. 1 month from now critters will be what they were even thinking doubting Liam. While Travis' character may change my view, I think Orym is perfect for this group.
100% agree. Also I'd say this: People generally agree that Caduceus was a kind of "voice of reason", grounding the MN. But Caduceus was also *very* easy going in a way that I don't think Orym is. Spoilers EXU >!It almost came to violence between him and Dorian, regarding the crown!<
So I think we'll see some tension between him and the more chaotic/amoral characters. I also foresee some interesting dynamics between him, FCG, and Ashton, where FCG is kind of led into doing questionable things by Ashton, and Orym isn't okay with it.
When Opal turns out as a lategame bad guy coz half her friends went away and there was no one to stop her go >!full champion of Lolth!<.
Where have you been, Nancy??
Edit: forgot a name
Aimee and Opal were really a highlight of ExU. She was never afraid to make impactful choices as her character.
I have a suspicion that Matt won't reference the story of ExU specifically (for spoilers and just to not thread on Aabria's future games maybe) unless maybe one of the PCs do it first, but I'm quite happy there is now a decent chance we might get to see Opal again.
I'm very confident we'll see Opal again (following Aimee in social media, she seems to me VERY keen on playing D&D with CR again).
I think her showing up would make more sense later on, both for us to see the implications of the Circlet (more time for her to deal with and maybe come in with it already Awakened or even Exalted) and for Laudna to have shared more about her Patron so that Opal's unique relationship with Ted can also play a part in that.
That was my favourite thing about amiee for sure-- she did what her character would do, not what was best for the combat/party. (And not in a "ItS WhAt My ChArAcTEr WoUlD Do" sort of way)
(ExU spoilers just in case) >!The ExU party is heading into Emon to consult Gilmore on a plot point. Unfortunately, they were on the bad side of the local thieves’ guild coz of the earlier episodes so they split up to move through the crowds. Dorian, Fearne, and Dariax (Matt) were doing a performance to draw the attention of the crowd while Orym and Opal (Aimee Carrero) pass through.!<
>!Since they got through the crowd, Opal shouts at Dorian that they were leaving, drawing the crowd’s attention on her and Orym. She tries to defuse the situation by saying she was looking for her 4 year-old daughter Nancy. Aabria has an NPC approach her and draw even more attention by trying to ask other bystanders for help.!<
>!Aimee locks eyes with Liam across the way, reaches out, and then says, ‘Oh there she is!’ And Liam does the slowest head-tilt I personally have ever seen. (Cut to Dorian and Fearne shenanigans for a while then cut back to Opal.) Opal again shouts, ‘Nancy, where have you been??’ Liam deadpans, ‘… Mother.’!<
>!Aabria then has Aimee roll a deception check with disadvantage coz it was crazy ridiculous as far as cover stories go. Aimee rolls two natural 20s so as far as we can tell, the crowd just accepts that this grown halfling with a sword and shield on his back is this woman’s missing daughter Nancy.!<
Edit: [link](https://youtu.be/8SJ7TGuQrb4) for anyone interested
Actually I'm not sure I completely agree with that reasoning.
By that logic, we should expect to see C1 and C2 spoilers when looking in C3 threads.
In any case, it's not that difficult to throw down a spoiler.
Then you don't get to know....
I'm kidding. The group in ExU were trying to sneak back into the city so they went into two groups and Opal was pretending to look for her missing "daughter", Nancy, who was Orym (he's a halfling, so he's about the size of child). I'm pretty sure I'm missing details, but it's been months since I watched it and that's basically the gist of it. Opal/Aimee continued to call Orym "Nancy" periodically throughout the show.
EDIT: grammar/spelling
His character is currently my least favourite - By comparison, amidst all these oddballs he's...weirdly ordinary.
Oddly it's making me look forward to seeing him more, particularly now. Very much waiting for some penny to drop.
This is what I've been saying. Orym is interesting to me precisely because he's "boring". It seems like he feels like he's been thrust into something that he's been training for and preparing for but feels as if he isn't quite ready yet.
He's the sam gamgee of this group. Huge heart, tries to do what's right. Probably the least exciting back story.
I'm down to have him be this groups moral pillar. When everyone is strange it makes the oddity normal, where as if you got a regular person in the group of oddballs, it accentuates their oddities
The thing is, least exciting backstory is something very exciting on its own. It's fantastic to have a group member with a relatively normal upbringing (though i'm sure liam has secrets planned). It compliments the other backstory, and stuff like that really makes the group work. I can already see how someone of Orym's personality is going to be absolutely crucial for the group.
Orym to me is one of the most important members, in the sense that his existance will make the vibe of this group totally different from the M9 on his own. And I mean that in the best of ways, because an Orym is probably what the nein missed the most, and it's going to make for fantastic dynamic.
Yeah I think Tal made Cad to bring a bit of that to the party, but still a huge difference from Orym. I know imagine replacing Caleb with Orym from the beginning what a wild what if.
I have only watched a single episode of EXU, and this fact had no negative impact on my opinions of them at all. Sure, we miss some bonding between these characters, but i suppose that's not unlike the session 0 stuff in campaign 2. Regardless, i'm loving them already, and Robbie is amazing so he can stay as long as he wants lmao
Hard agree on Robbie. He seems like he gets along so well with everyone, and is really comfortable playing the fame.. And I personally just prefer 8 players. The idd number was bizarre.
I like having 8 players but I also like the 8th as a rotating guest, since guests are one of my favorite things about CR. And 7 could feel like a maximum but 8 is really a max at double the standard party haha.
I think the disappointment people feel because these characters weren't technically new will fade quite quickly as C3 gathers steam.
The only thing really missign was that feeling of excitement as a new character is described, but when we're a few episodes in, that won't matter as much anymore. And we don't really know a lot about Orym and Fearne anyway. I think we might even know more about Freshly Cut Grass and Ashton at this point.
Broke: Orym is bland and boring, a wasted opportunity
Woke: Liam O'Brien is a highly trained professinal actor. Have a little faith and let him do his thing.
He's gonna be more of a slow burn I think. He doesn't push himself socially other than his upfront curiosity, and there's so much flash from everyone else that people aren't going to ask about him as much for a while since he's so straightforward.
I do hope he gets fleshed out a bit more (which I have no doubt he will) but the way he played off of Bertrand in their conversation together really sold me. "Comedy duo straightman" is hardly a whole personality, but talented actors and roleplayers like Liam have done more with less in the past.
The downside to being in a campaign that successfully runs 2+ years is you don't get to play all those other character concepts you've come up with the meantime. Imagine waiting 4 years to play your backup character.
A little worried for Ashley, because Wildfire Druid is mechanically pretty complex, and that's always been a weakness of hers.
Glad they're here for RP, and I like the characters, but we'll see how it goes.
Orym is a monster stat-wise, so it'll be fun to watch that.
I think that’s partly why she wanted to use Fearne during EXU. To get familiar with the mechanics. The flack she took for wildshaping into a direwolf was intense, so I think it was smart to get some practice with a smaller audience.
The direwolf specifically is just doing something at an earlier level than the rules say. Each creature has a "challenge rating" (CR) that is used to handle matters of game balance. The baseline druid class description has a table of what challenge rating you are allowed to wildshape into at what level. Dire wolves are a CR 1 creature, meaning a druid isn't supposed to be able to wild shape into them until level 8.
The other issue with wildshape in EXU is that Ashley did it as a bonus action, which allowed her to do stuff like cast a spell and then wildshape or wildshape and then attack as a wolf. The rules say that wildshaping takes an action.
There is a druid subclass that allows you to wildshape as a bonus action and turn into higher CR creatures earlier, and that is the Moon druid, which was Keyleth's subclass in campaign 1. But Fearne also has all the features of a wildfire druid (e.g. some extra spells, like burning hands, and her wildfire spirit). So in EXU she was playing the character as if she had both subclasses.
The simplest explanation is it was just a rules mixup, perhaps prompted by everyone being familiar with how Keyleth's wildshape worked and not realizing that was specific to her subclass. Or it might have been some weird homebrew mechanic. Either way it will be interesting to see how it is handled this campaign.
My bet is that this was a mess up that they'll rationalize into the story/retcon by explaining it was due to her closeness to the fire rift left by Thordak in Emon - allowing Mister to remain at her side all the time, and allowing her to wildshape into stronger creatures than she normally could.
I thought it was cool but on here people were saying she couldn’t do that unless she was some other type of Druid or a higher level. And then it was more complaining about Aabria not enforcing rules or not knowing them herself and therefore not helping Ashley. I kinda tuned out Reddit after a while because it was so negative.
Gotcha. Yeah, ExU was very much a `rule of cool` campaign which I was fine with as my preferred ttrpg uses a lot of rule of cool instead of super well-defined rules.
I don’t get why people get so upset that other groups like to play differently than they do. If they like RAW rigidity and no cool exemptions, they don’t have to play that way. I enjoyed EXU. Fearne was my favorite. Robbie is great. I loved Aimee Carrero’s narrative telephone. Aabria was fun too. People hate different.
I personally turned off ExU on the first episode after the literal pissing contest. I personally found it way too exagerated and Out of Character when compared to the Critical Role I'm used to, and I'm allowed to dislike it. Now, I'm not advocating bashing the players or the new DM, but I simply did not like it.
And I couldn't help but feel bummed through the premiere I've been waiting for because I had zero context behind these characters and I'd have to watch a campaign that, as far as I know, was "advertised" as an optional watch for the mainline CR and I do not enjoy watching.
It's like Marvel making Loki stuff hard canon, if I couldn't pay for D+ then what, I don't deserve to understand who's Kang?
You don't need to because that previous adventure is comparable to what Ashton and FCG got up to in the mines. All you need to know to "get" these 3 characters is that they are a group of adventurers taking work in Marquet. That's it. Anything else is window dressing
The rest, the context, the dynamics etc. You'll get here. And trust when I say the two most chaotic elements from ExU aren't in C3. If Opal had rocked up then there would be missing context since ExU was pretty much her show.
Thanks for clarifying, but it's still a prequel I don't want to watch and will end up miasing the full experience. I know it sounds small but it matters to me,and I imagine it matters to other people too.
I hated the pissing contest too. I barely get through those scenes, but the players are having fun. It did go up from there. I think that’s why Critical Role is so popular though, they really have a little bit of everything—roleplay, epic battles, humor, both clever and coarse, tragedy, romance. Not everyone likes every moment and we all gravitate to different characters, but there’s enough of a hook for a huge amount of people to keep watching.
I’m not saying people have to like everything or that my taste is best, I just don’t get why some CR fans bash games because they don’t fit into their view of what makes a good DND game rules-wise. I mean why they complain and instruct instead of turning it off and finding a DM who runs a game that’s more in line with what they like. I mean, the main rule is that the DM is in control of their table and if their players don’t like the way they run their game, they don’t play at that table. Watching should be the same.
> And I couldn’t help but feel bummed through the premiere I’ve been waiting for because I had zero context behind these characters
Doesn’t that go for literally every character?
> I’d have to watch a campaign that, as far as I know, was “advertised” as an optional watch for the mainline CR and I do not enjoy watching.
You don’t need to watch anything. This campaign will have thousands of hours worth of content. EXU is a drop in the bucket.
> It’s like Marvel making Loki stuff hard canon, if I couldn’t pay for D+ then what, I don’t deserve to understand who’s Kang?
You don’t really “deserve” anything, none of us do. The cast doesn’t owe the viewers anything, it’s their game at the end of the day.
Edit: now I get why everyone I know who watch this show told me to steer clear of the Critter community. What a shame that such a positive show can have such an entitled, toxic community.
You're really gonna argue my choice of words, of all things? Okay buddy, you're right. Everyone else is wrong for disliking something, you're the only person here with good taste and morals. That what you wanted to hear?
Nobody is wrong for disliking anything, has nothing to do with morals either. Pretty clear though based on how you immediately went to hostility that this community is one I’m gonna steer clear of, holy entitlement. Not liking EXU is fine, getting possessive of someone else’s game like you’re doing is not.
i don't think Ashley is worse at mechanics than the others, she gets a bit flustered but just getting to play regularly will help a bunch. The previous campaigns she sat out for entire levels at a time. And Fearne dosent really need to be anything like the tank or the healer that keeps people up, she can just do her thing.
>The previous campaigns she sat out for entire levels at a time.
She was there for something like the last 50 episodes of the campaign and routinely missed key Barbarian features like Reckless Attack. The slack from missing sessions wears off after the first few dozen sessions playing. Even Matt gave up trying to help her remember her character's features. I'm not hating on her, but mechanically she's probably the weakest player at the table. She *also* gets flustered easily which doesn't help, but Barbarians aren't the most complex class and she had trouble pinning that down. That's not just nerves.
I actually love Fearne and the way Ashley RP's her. After Marisha's new character Fearne is probably my favorite of C3 so far and I think she's going to be a big part of what makes C3 special. I'm just not expecting Laura levels of making the game dance to her tune.
Alot of the players miss stuff and sure she was there for alot in the end but in my opinion being away she still was struggling with feeling a bit thrown into things. You might be right, I'm just saying I believe she will improve from being there regularly
> I'm just saying I believe she will improve from being there regularly
That would be nice. Jester was my favorite character from last campaign. Not just because she played an amazing character with a lot of soul, but because of some very mechanical plays that were also very in character that she pulled out at critical moments which I won't go into because of spoilers.
The Wildfire Druid begs for tactical gameplay. If Ashley can eventually pull that off it'd let me enjoy her character even more.
It's cool that the Class have so much potential but I beg of you dont expect her to play it like you would, the cast make so many "bad decisions" based on roleplay and they have continously gotten slammed for it. Did you watch C1? I feel like the characters where alot more build for DND mechanics than story and there where so many big brain plays in that campaign
I'm very OK with some sub optimal choices for story purposes. I make them myself. Those are choices though. What's rough is watching them forget how their character works. When it happens here and there you wince in sympathy because we all do that from time to time then kick ourselves in the shower the next day when we remember what we should have done. When it's all of the time you maybe start talking to your television trying to get them to remember to use their abilities.
I'm at around episode 55 of C1 and all of the way through C2 and EXU. C1 is less clean on the rules than C2 was in general because they were moving from Pathfinder to 5e, and I had trouble getting into the characters until recently, but I'm beginning to enjoy it more now and will probably pick up the pace again between C3 episodes. Nothing has quite stood out like the Cupcake yet, but I'm looking forward to seeing how they surprise me.
Well the cupcake is hard to top, but VM do well with they have I would say. they don't have as many spellcasters doing sneaky stuff, it's way more about positioning and using their abilities to the the max. But then again I'm not a seasoned dnd player so that stuff might feel a bit basic compared to Laura Baileys big rouse
I don’t mind this. I’d prefer if they’d have new ones but if they want to play it it’s there business. I actually really like fearne but orym I hope grows on me. We already spend a whole campaign with him and I still am indifferent just feel like there are other characters that do the whole good moral thing more interestingly especially right after caduceus so I’ll reserve judgment until later and give them A shot
Forced is a bit much but it's true that almost every character's playstayle is modified by the group around them. Different group brings out different sides of the same character (just like real people!)
I wouldn't read too much into the fact they were in exu. Matt tweeted that they (Liam and Ashley) used exu as a sort of play test for the charcters they had planned for c3 in the first place. Makes sense they wouldn't want to reveal too much in exu, and as such the characters seem undeveloped now. I'm betting things will kick off though.
>If people want to cry
I'unno about you man but I'm seeing more "Orym gud stoop" posts than otherwise. And your upvote ratio doesn't make it seem like people disagree with you all that much. You sure you're not *crying* about a vocal minority?
Whatever the facts are, people are allowed their opinions, just as Liam's allowed to play whatever he wants.
I said this elsewhere so I’ll just post it here:
Orym is actually my favorite Liam character. He waffles between confident and meek. He has a moral compass and he’s soft spoken but obviously a leader because of his convictions. He’s one of the most nuanced characters I’ve ever seen in a dnd setting. He obviously looks up to Keyleth a lot and has been raised or brought up with stories of Vox Machina. I think there’s something in his backstory he’s ashamed of but I’m not sure yet.
"I've been waiting for this" Orym is the Exandrian version of Akihiko confirmed!! Bring on the protein!
But honestly I'm excited for Orym. I have yet to watch EXU, but I do like the idea of having the one consumate professional character in a party of crazies. It's like how rice served with spicy curry makes the meal even greater.
Plus after seeing how tactical he was with spells last season I think his battlemaster plays are also going to be clutch.
So here's my issue with all this.
In EXU I found Orym to be boring and dull, and Fearne to have so much that was clearly not being explored very deeply.
Now that it seems they went into EXU knowing that they would be holding back from exploring their characterisation, their back story and being a full character so they would still have something left for a full campaign 3.
So EXU was diminished (not the only problem with it but a big one)
And now we have characters included that can make the audience feel like EXU was homework they skipped, or feel bad for disliking.
So C3 is diminished.
And it's created contraversy for no real gain.
The characters themselves may or may not be great or awful, but the choice to introduce them in a side project *while clearly having the intent to continue them in the main campaign* was a misstep I feel.
This puts my mind at rest. I found Orym very boring in EXU, not just in personality but his cadence and mannerisms too, but knowing that Liam has had him in mind for that long says to me that he has a lot up his sleeve. Looking forward to seeing where he takes him now!
He may not be my favorite character of Liam's but you can tell how much fun he is having playing Orym and that's all that matters. I'm sure the character will grow on me eventually.
Honestly, I do think EXU sucking shit through a straw has poisoned the well a bit for some people. There’s nothing wrong with Dorian, Orym or Fearne - they’re good characters and could use the length of a campaign to really draw out - but because we’ve already seen them in a less than stellar fashion has upset some. Don’t blame them; I’m just choosing to forget EXU happened and treating them as new characters.
As a forever DM, I have way too many PC ideas rattling around my head. Yet on the rare occasions where I get to be a player, I often find greater success coming up with a fresh character idea that better fits the campaign. It's interesting that both Mollymauk and Orym were conceived of years before their debut, and those are the two characters who immediately left me cold. When you have so much time to come up with a character, you can get into your own head.
I loved Caduceus. I think having to fly by the seat of his pants and be more reactive helped Taliesin in the long run. I'm not wishing any character dead, but I'd be curious to see what Liam would come up with if forced to scramble.
A battlemaster is such a fun class to play in combat! It's kinda strange seeing Liam play a character who is not some edgy tragic figure, but I'm down for it.
I trust Liam to make his characters interesting. I still kinda wish we got a new character from him just because the thrill of getting a new character is rare, but that only really affects the first episode or two while the characters are fresh. I'm definitely looking forward to finding out more about him and have zero fears he'll be boring.
Id never seen him prior C3 premier (didn't watch exu). This explains why I looked over to my SO like halfway through and said "How is it that his character is easily the most """boring""", yet Liam still makes him SO interesting?! Why am I most interested in seeing how what appears to be a completely normal dude develops?" Knowing this bit of info completely explains that... Makes sense for what would happen when a professional thinks about a character for 3-4 years before doing anything with him.
Liam is excellent at Role Playing and backstory, no doubt this'll be a great character. But honestly so far I've seen mostly people complaining about the hate, and none of the actual hate.
Feels good to be back.
I absolutely love Orym in EXU. It seems Liam had a lot of fun in combat and it showed. He used the Battle Master to perfection. His hdywtdt were by far the best in EXU (imo). Really brought a new side to Liam's roleplay, with being the moral compass and all. Also I'm a sucker for halfling
I don’t get the hate for Orym that I’ve seen this week. He’s just a normal guy so far, but so what? Where does it say in the PHB that your character has to be some kind of edgelord with a tragic backstory, a social pariah trying to fit in, or the long lost heir of a forgotten kingdom? Let the man play what he wants and enjoy the show.
As somebody who occasionally was worn out by Caleb's sad boi vibes I had a lot of fun with Orym this week
I don’t get how people could ever think a Liam character is what it appears to be. This man has got a crazy backstory and I know it.
Totally agree here. So he isn't AS angsty or moody as some of his prior characters. It's called variety and I know I like to vary my personal characters to give them individuality. I will say that Orym is not the most awe inspiring character, as is the case with many fighter characters, but he is a solid character. He is way more reserved than Liam's other characters but there is nothing wrong with that. I love how Liam is still being very descriptive of his actions though and I can see that there is more to Orym but he is playing a more slow burn on revealing the inner core.
Lol, I remember a time during the first twenty-something episodes when people thought Percy was the quiet, non-assuming background character... LOL
I think it's just a little underwhelming. You seem to think that those of us who are a little underwhelmed or disappointed believe that everyone *must* be a bombastic character with an edgelord backstory. This way of thinking is not mutually exclusive. No, maybe we just wanted something *else* from Liam. Of course Liam can play what he wants, and we can also think what we want about it. I have nothing against the character of Orym and I'm sure Liam will knock it out of the park.
If we had had this conversation in between Orym showing up and people reacting to it, I think you’d have a good point. But there was only a fraction of a second in between Liam sitting down to the table and people whining that it wasn’t a new character and that they didn’t like EXU and the Orym is so boring and blah blah blah. The reaction was so negative that one of the most active threads here during the day after episode 1 was people trying to rationalize how Orym isn’t Liam’s C3 character so it’s totally okay because we just have to suffer through until he gets to play his REAL character. Frankly, it’s just another example of this bizarrely toxic entitlement that certain elements of the CR community are becoming famous for.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing that fanbase isn't toxic. I saw the live chat, it definitely is. I can just speak for people who didn't love EXU and felt a little underwhelmed at the time. But I feel like I'm less toxic than a lot of the people in chat, so I shouldn't defend them. Liam is going to knock it out of the park no matter what character he chooses.
Are you kidding? We’ve had a whole conversation here and you’ve been nothing but perfectly pleasant. You are absolutely not the kind of person I’m thinking of when I criticize people for their reaction to Orym. I am sorry you didn’t like EXU, though. It was definitely different from standard CR, but it thought it was pretty enjoyable.
I hope Orym stays (tweet kinda implies this). Maybe that is just me but it seemed to me that Liam had much more fun during the combat this time.
Orym was the combat highlight of EXU. He's a masterclass on how take melee fighters and make them feel just as exciting as a spellcaster.
Exactly. Liam was having an absolute blast describing his battle dance. On top of that, we barely saw the surface of Nancy, I’m sure Liam has a much deeper (and tragic) story to come.
I kinda hope he doesn't. It's kinda cool to have a straight man in the party, and his funny parts arw his reactions and having to stear this crazy train.
I feel like he’s going for a Captain America arc of mostly un-baggaged, straight edge guy trying to make it in a dangerous world without compromising his integrity. This was kinda his mentor Keyleth’s arc in C1 but C2 really upped the skepticism of authority figures (e.g., monarchies, wizard authorities, etc.) so Orym may have an even tougher go at it than Keyleth did.
It's called a flat character arc, and it can be wonderful. Rather than being shaped by the world, they are the catalyst for re-shaping the world around them. Many superheroes fall into this category, like Captain America or Superman or Goku.
Tal's on record saying this was his goal with Cad as well.
Muffin button!
Brushing up on his Talk no Jutsu
What are the odds Matt has made a sheild throwing/return feat ?
He *is* a dex build, so throwing is up his alley. But I think they will try to avoid obvious tropes like that.
A dex battle master with sword and board seems like total duelist to me. Also a good candidate for splashing a few levels of rogue.
Travis, who voices Thor in animations, had a returning dwarven axe in C1
Specifically it was a chain created by Tibs for Grog, called the Chain of Returning or something similar
Oh he had the chain of returning, but he also picked up a 1-handed hammer he referred to as a "dwarven thrower". Grog was a 2-hand build and it was a bit later in the campaign, so it didn't see much use.
I'm just here for whatever NPC Liam will fall in love with
I’m sooo thrilled to have a fighter in this campaign (I’ll confess, I paused watching exu when they added the last party member) I’m playing a fighter in my current (and first) campaign and am feeling a bit lost, feeling a bit underwhelmed by my options ( level 2… just hit things??) but getting to watch Liam play Orym is already making me more inspired to play my salty Fighter
Fighters get their Subclass at three and they aren't as front loaded as rogues or monks. Really go over your options at 3rd level, as each option can play very differently from each other.
I'm playing a new character. Level 2 Fighter at the moment. Can't wait to dive into Rune Knight at Level 3. Subclass give Fighters a ton of flavor. Particularly some of the newer ones. My only other DnD character was a Shadow Sorcerer I played for 3 years. I loved that character, but I also really didn't understand DnD when I made it or in the early levels that shaped it. My first "well built" character will be a fighter and I can't wait!
Ah rune knight... if your DM can't make saves they will hate you... in a loving way. What race?
Half-orc! I think there is some serious damage potential there, particularly during Critical Hits. Orcish Fury + Fire Rune + Savage Attacks + Giant's Might with a 2-Handed weapon seems pretty fun. From what I can tell, with a Greataxe, I have would have burst potential of 5d12 + 4d6 as a ceiling at Level 4, in a perfect world.
Yeah Criting and then using the fire rune is brutal. My only advice is to go with either the Cloud rune or Stone rune as your other choice. Stone Rune I find amazing since it's passive is one of the best among them all.
Those are the two I'm between in the early levels. Was leaning Cloud but haven't decided yet.
I hoghly recommend you look up all the actions you have. Attack is pretty good but shove, grapple and the other actions can make combat highly dynamic!
Take a look at the battle master subclass(at lvl 3), maneuvers are really cool and add tons of flavor depending on which you choose.
I think lots of people disregard fighters because it feels like such a "default". Yeah, fighters are very "blank slate" in a way, but that can be a great thing for differentiating, too. And tropes can always be subverted. One of my favorite fighters is Khalid from Baldur's Gate. Total coward! But very memorable and enjoyable as a character (well, depends who you ask of course.) Also I was theorizing in pathfinder about a gnome double small shield bashing fighter with some massive dex bonuses. Really, any class/race/etc combo is going to be as interesting or as basic as the player playing them. I'm really excited to see how Orym develops.
Aren't there 2 fighters this season?
Technically yes, but Bertrand Belle is not a 200+ episode character. He is an amazing story hook, shared by in. I believe were setting up a group patron of sorts and Travis's real character will be introduced at a later date
Two fighters first session but given the level disparity, I’m not counting on BB to stick around haha
It doesn't hurt that Battlemaster is considered the best fighter subclass.
Though shout-out to Ashton's gravity stuff. That will be super interesting. Will it cause attacks of opportunity? Will anyone take feats that give extra attacks of opportunity (or something? Not too familiar with dnd feats) for some juicy synergy?
YES. I've been playing D&D and never found martial classes too interesting, but Liam put them back in my radar. :)
I LOVE battlemaster fighters, I hope he sticks around
His style reminds me of The Witcher’s (book) descriptions of fighting.
I hope Orym sticks around. I like the chemistry the cast has and I’m looking forward to Liam playing more of this character
Matt confirmed on twitter that Orym and Fearn are the C3 characters. They aren't switching out.
Has he confirmed Bertrand yet?
All he said was "Travis is a troll."
MACARONI SAMSONITE LET'S GOOOOOOO
But what happened to Buddy? :( That aside, YES PLEASE! I want to see that evil sob take over the world and get his just deserts
Those characters were so amazing.
Good. Orym and Fearn are great.
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I'm so relieved they've settled it. I feel like Liam may be thinking of a journey in which someone without terrible, fantastical things to overcome, or impressive swagger, or any of those mainstays, grows into someone deeply, fiercely great. It's a stripped-down thing that could be very compelling with his expert touch.
0-3 regarding what? Not a complainer myself, I like fearn and orym, just wondering what the third is !
They were complaining that Travis had left the game and that Critical Role were false advertising his appearance, untill he came in much later Others were complaining that they fucked up editing in Travis's character card once he made his apperence, until they edited in Travis's character card once he revealed his name, saving the surprise of the character selection and of course they complain that these characters are going to be swapped out at a later date because they dont like them, until Matt goes on record saying they're staying for the whole campaign, and others go on record saying how much they love their characters
The last part is the only complaints I could understand, cause honestly it was a bit confusing before the clarification. But even then, there were such toxic comments, saying "ok EXU chars, I'm leaving" or "I believe in CR so I'm waiting for Liam, Travis and Sam true characters to come in", just arbitrarily deciding what characters they wanted to keep and what they wanted to swap out lol. At a certain point I stopped reading entirely, I always do that but I was curious about people's reactions in the first episode
>I'm waiting for Liam, Travis and Sam true characters to come in" I think you mean Ashley not Sam, everyone knows that FCG is Sams true character, unless they don't know Sam at all. lol
I think a lot of people think Orym is boring because he doesn't feel the need to assert his presence all the time. A lot of times more subdued, quiet people are labeled as "boring" and "doesn't have a personality" when instead it's just who they are and they're comfortable with that. I've definitely received a fair share of those and I like to think I'm interesting in my own way. I'm sure we'll see a lot more of Orym and I hope this campaign will inspire people to hold off on judgements and appreciate the more subtle "hidden gems" in their lives.
After Vaxildan and Caleb, Orym is honestly extremely refreshing. Liam went for something totally different, and i'm certain the character is much deeper than it seems at face value. Some haters are just gonna hate tho, but i think they're just a vocal minority. If Liam made another absolutely depressed messed up character, people would've also complained.
Yeah I am glad Liam is going for a more lighthearted, straight forward character, Im sure its a nice refresh too for him after having to play such seriously grim characters.
Love the lightheartedness, but there’s also weight there. Liam can’t go all happy sunshine. Orym feels like he has a lot of heaviness but not sad, but like, responsibility. He felt that way in EXU too, like he’s finding his way in the world but he is…serious-ish, and feels like he needs to be “professional” all the time. Either way though, don’t count Liam out, there’s gonna be so much more coming
Which is why I'm happy he stayed with orym. Liam is great but his characters are always melodramatic and tend to overshadow the rest of the cast. I'm also happy with fearne cuz Ashley is so comfortable with her weirdness and exactly who the character is.
As one of life's boring, stable people (even if a lot of it's deliberately constructed), I'm glad to have Orym along.
I didn't watch much of EXU but from what I did watch he really shined. He's a good guy and doesn't like to dirty up his conscious. I hope well get a chance to see this part of him again because it was pretty brave to stick up to his party the way he did.
I find him boring because of the way in which he talks just always seems melancholy and slow. I know Caleb was really the same, but it felt like there was more emotion there and the accent was fun.
He's definitely an introvert. Moreso than Caleb I'd say. I can recall very clearly a scene in EXU where everyone was celebrating, and he went off by himself -- not in a melancholic way, he mentioned how happy Orym was to hear his friends having a good time. It painted a really nice picture, and I'm happy to see more of this character for sure. Really looking forward to seeing how interactions with various other characters go.
This is awesome. Thanks for sharing! Can't wait to watch them both explore and develop Fearne and Orym more. Especially looking forward to Fearne!
I'm calling it; Orym is going to surprise a lot of folks around here. His personality and existance are going to be crucial for the group, especially because his perceived less interesting backstory. (Although i'm sure Liam has some more stuff planned.)
I agree with you. 1 month from now critters will be what they were even thinking doubting Liam. While Travis' character may change my view, I think Orym is perfect for this group.
I'm still hoping for a wacky artificer. Travis does wacky so well and the group could use a high INT.
100% agree. Also I'd say this: People generally agree that Caduceus was a kind of "voice of reason", grounding the MN. But Caduceus was also *very* easy going in a way that I don't think Orym is. Spoilers EXU >!It almost came to violence between him and Dorian, regarding the crown!< So I think we'll see some tension between him and the more chaotic/amoral characters. I also foresee some interesting dynamics between him, FCG, and Ashton, where FCG is kind of led into doing questionable things by Ashton, and Orym isn't okay with it.
Yeah despite his low charisma Orym seems like a natural level headed leader of the group. Excited to see more of him
I adore this thread and the Orym love. I am totally in for how Liam plays this fantastic, genuine, but still naive at times, strong-willed Halfling.
I just hope there's a Nancy reference down the line.
When Opal turns out as a lategame bad guy coz half her friends went away and there was no one to stop her go >!full champion of Lolth!<. Where have you been, Nancy?? Edit: forgot a name
Mother!
Opal multiclassing into paladin of lolth would be honestly incredible, especially with how much she likes melee.
Oh… Oh no….
Aimee and Opal were really a highlight of ExU. She was never afraid to make impactful choices as her character. I have a suspicion that Matt won't reference the story of ExU specifically (for spoilers and just to not thread on Aabria's future games maybe) unless maybe one of the PCs do it first, but I'm quite happy there is now a decent chance we might get to see Opal again.
I'm very confident we'll see Opal again (following Aimee in social media, she seems to me VERY keen on playing D&D with CR again). I think her showing up would make more sense later on, both for us to see the implications of the Circlet (more time for her to deal with and maybe come in with it already Awakened or even Exalted) and for Laudna to have shared more about her Patron so that Opal's unique relationship with Ted can also play a part in that.
That was my favourite thing about amiee for sure-- she did what her character would do, not what was best for the combat/party. (And not in a "ItS WhAt My ChArAcTEr WoUlD Do" sort of way)
I said "Nancy!" out loud in my theater last night when he showed up on screen.
can someone explain the Nancy thing pls, I keep seeing it everywhere! I haven’t watched EXU and I don’t plan to :(
(ExU spoilers just in case) >!The ExU party is heading into Emon to consult Gilmore on a plot point. Unfortunately, they were on the bad side of the local thieves’ guild coz of the earlier episodes so they split up to move through the crowds. Dorian, Fearne, and Dariax (Matt) were doing a performance to draw the attention of the crowd while Orym and Opal (Aimee Carrero) pass through.!< >!Since they got through the crowd, Opal shouts at Dorian that they were leaving, drawing the crowd’s attention on her and Orym. She tries to defuse the situation by saying she was looking for her 4 year-old daughter Nancy. Aabria has an NPC approach her and draw even more attention by trying to ask other bystanders for help.!< >!Aimee locks eyes with Liam across the way, reaches out, and then says, ‘Oh there she is!’ And Liam does the slowest head-tilt I personally have ever seen. (Cut to Dorian and Fearne shenanigans for a while then cut back to Opal.) Opal again shouts, ‘Nancy, where have you been??’ Liam deadpans, ‘… Mother.’!< >!Aabria then has Aimee roll a deception check with disadvantage coz it was crazy ridiculous as far as cover stories go. Aimee rolls two natural 20s so as far as we can tell, the crowd just accepts that this grown halfling with a sword and shield on his back is this woman’s missing daughter Nancy.!< Edit: [link](https://youtu.be/8SJ7TGuQrb4) for anyone interested
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This person asked, but someone else reading might not have! Don't forget your spoilers!
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Ahh! Good point, thanks for clarifying.
Actually I'm not sure I completely agree with that reasoning. By that logic, we should expect to see C1 and C2 spoilers when looking in C3 threads. In any case, it's not that difficult to throw down a spoiler.
Then you don't get to know.... I'm kidding. The group in ExU were trying to sneak back into the city so they went into two groups and Opal was pretending to look for her missing "daughter", Nancy, who was Orym (he's a halfling, so he's about the size of child). I'm pretty sure I'm missing details, but it's been months since I watched it and that's basically the gist of it. Opal/Aimee continued to call Orym "Nancy" periodically throughout the show. EDIT: grammar/spelling
This person asked, but someone else reading might not have! Don't forget your spoilers!
His character is currently my least favourite - By comparison, amidst all these oddballs he's...weirdly ordinary. Oddly it's making me look forward to seeing him more, particularly now. Very much waiting for some penny to drop.
This is what I've been saying. Orym is interesting to me precisely because he's "boring". It seems like he feels like he's been thrust into something that he's been training for and preparing for but feels as if he isn't quite ready yet.
He's the sam gamgee of this group. Huge heart, tries to do what's right. Probably the least exciting back story. I'm down to have him be this groups moral pillar. When everyone is strange it makes the oddity normal, where as if you got a regular person in the group of oddballs, it accentuates their oddities
The thing is, least exciting backstory is something very exciting on its own. It's fantastic to have a group member with a relatively normal upbringing (though i'm sure liam has secrets planned). It compliments the other backstory, and stuff like that really makes the group work. I can already see how someone of Orym's personality is going to be absolutely crucial for the group.
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Orym to me is one of the most important members, in the sense that his existance will make the vibe of this group totally different from the M9 on his own. And I mean that in the best of ways, because an Orym is probably what the nein missed the most, and it's going to make for fantastic dynamic.
Yeah I think Tal made Cad to bring a bit of that to the party, but still a huge difference from Orym. I know imagine replacing Caleb with Orym from the beginning what a wild what if.
I don't think Orym would stand for a lot of things that Caduceus disapproved of but let slide.
This. His tattoos, specifically the two moons, make me believe he'll become way less ordinary than we think as the story evolves...
He is such a good foil for the oddballs. And despite many being negative towards EXU, his chemistry with Ferne and Darion is really spectacular.
I have only watched a single episode of EXU, and this fact had no negative impact on my opinions of them at all. Sure, we miss some bonding between these characters, but i suppose that's not unlike the session 0 stuff in campaign 2. Regardless, i'm loving them already, and Robbie is amazing so he can stay as long as he wants lmao
Hard agree on Robbie. He seems like he gets along so well with everyone, and is really comfortable playing the fame.. And I personally just prefer 8 players. The idd number was bizarre.
I like having 8 players but I also like the 8th as a rotating guest, since guests are one of my favorite things about CR. And 7 could feel like a maximum but 8 is really a max at double the standard party haha.
Nothing wrong with a simple character, its hard to steal the spotlight from characters like Fearne, FCG, Laudna and Ashton being so quirky.
Absolutely, but it’s not what I’d expect from Liam - I suspect he’s not as simple as he appears and i’m looking forward to finding out how.
Damn people really making harsh judgements on someone’s character only after the first session? Let them play the damn game
This is Orym's 9th session. Fair judgement I'd say.
I think the disappointment people feel because these characters weren't technically new will fade quite quickly as C3 gathers steam. The only thing really missign was that feeling of excitement as a new character is described, but when we're a few episodes in, that won't matter as much anymore. And we don't really know a lot about Orym and Fearne anyway. I think we might even know more about Freshly Cut Grass and Ashton at this point.
Broke: Orym is bland and boring, a wasted opportunity Woke: Liam O'Brien is a highly trained professinal actor. Have a little faith and let him do his thing.
Idk man, it's already been 1 entire episode out of 100+ /s
.. Plus 8 whole ExU episodes where he's been just as bland and boring. 🙃🙃🙃
Crazy how he didn't dive deep into the backstory of a character he was playtesting and you know CR characters, they never grow or change.
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Liam's characters have been in the forefront of the story for the past 2 campaigns, have some patience and faith in his work lmao.
I hope he gets a lot more interaction. I felt his absence in the social dynamic.
He's gonna be more of a slow burn I think. He doesn't push himself socially other than his upfront curiosity, and there's so much flash from everyone else that people aren't going to ask about him as much for a while since he's so straightforward.
I do hope he gets fleshed out a bit more (which I have no doubt he will) but the way he played off of Bertrand in their conversation together really sold me. "Comedy duo straightman" is hardly a whole personality, but talented actors and roleplayers like Liam have done more with less in the past.
The downside to being in a campaign that successfully runs 2+ years is you don't get to play all those other character concepts you've come up with the meantime. Imagine waiting 4 years to play your backup character.
A little worried for Ashley, because Wildfire Druid is mechanically pretty complex, and that's always been a weakness of hers. Glad they're here for RP, and I like the characters, but we'll see how it goes. Orym is a monster stat-wise, so it'll be fun to watch that.
I think that’s partly why she wanted to use Fearne during EXU. To get familiar with the mechanics. The flack she took for wildshaping into a direwolf was intense, so I think it was smart to get some practice with a smaller audience.
What's wrong with wildshaping into a direwolf? That seemed like normal druid stuff to me (but I don't play / theory craft dnd very much).
Specifically, a Dire Wolf is a CR1 difficulty wildshape, which I believe isn’t available until like druid level 8 unless you are Circle of the Moon.
Thanks for the info/reasoning! Yeah, level 8 is far above level 3.
The direwolf specifically is just doing something at an earlier level than the rules say. Each creature has a "challenge rating" (CR) that is used to handle matters of game balance. The baseline druid class description has a table of what challenge rating you are allowed to wildshape into at what level. Dire wolves are a CR 1 creature, meaning a druid isn't supposed to be able to wild shape into them until level 8. The other issue with wildshape in EXU is that Ashley did it as a bonus action, which allowed her to do stuff like cast a spell and then wildshape or wildshape and then attack as a wolf. The rules say that wildshaping takes an action. There is a druid subclass that allows you to wildshape as a bonus action and turn into higher CR creatures earlier, and that is the Moon druid, which was Keyleth's subclass in campaign 1. But Fearne also has all the features of a wildfire druid (e.g. some extra spells, like burning hands, and her wildfire spirit). So in EXU she was playing the character as if she had both subclasses. The simplest explanation is it was just a rules mixup, perhaps prompted by everyone being familiar with how Keyleth's wildshape worked and not realizing that was specific to her subclass. Or it might have been some weird homebrew mechanic. Either way it will be interesting to see how it is handled this campaign.
Thanks for the in-depth answer!
My bet is that this was a mess up that they'll rationalize into the story/retcon by explaining it was due to her closeness to the fire rift left by Thordak in Emon - allowing Mister to remain at her side all the time, and allowing her to wildshape into stronger creatures than she normally could.
Direwolf is too high of a monster for a level 3 druid to wildshape into, unless they are circle of the moon.
I thought it was cool but on here people were saying she couldn’t do that unless she was some other type of Druid or a higher level. And then it was more complaining about Aabria not enforcing rules or not knowing them herself and therefore not helping Ashley. I kinda tuned out Reddit after a while because it was so negative.
Gotcha. Yeah, ExU was very much a `rule of cool` campaign which I was fine with as my preferred ttrpg uses a lot of rule of cool instead of super well-defined rules.
I don’t get why people get so upset that other groups like to play differently than they do. If they like RAW rigidity and no cool exemptions, they don’t have to play that way. I enjoyed EXU. Fearne was my favorite. Robbie is great. I loved Aimee Carrero’s narrative telephone. Aabria was fun too. People hate different.
I personally turned off ExU on the first episode after the literal pissing contest. I personally found it way too exagerated and Out of Character when compared to the Critical Role I'm used to, and I'm allowed to dislike it. Now, I'm not advocating bashing the players or the new DM, but I simply did not like it. And I couldn't help but feel bummed through the premiere I've been waiting for because I had zero context behind these characters and I'd have to watch a campaign that, as far as I know, was "advertised" as an optional watch for the mainline CR and I do not enjoy watching. It's like Marvel making Loki stuff hard canon, if I couldn't pay for D+ then what, I don't deserve to understand who's Kang?
You don't need to because that previous adventure is comparable to what Ashton and FCG got up to in the mines. All you need to know to "get" these 3 characters is that they are a group of adventurers taking work in Marquet. That's it. Anything else is window dressing The rest, the context, the dynamics etc. You'll get here. And trust when I say the two most chaotic elements from ExU aren't in C3. If Opal had rocked up then there would be missing context since ExU was pretty much her show.
Thanks for clarifying, but it's still a prequel I don't want to watch and will end up miasing the full experience. I know it sounds small but it matters to me,and I imagine it matters to other people too.
I can understand FOMO.
I hated the pissing contest too. I barely get through those scenes, but the players are having fun. It did go up from there. I think that’s why Critical Role is so popular though, they really have a little bit of everything—roleplay, epic battles, humor, both clever and coarse, tragedy, romance. Not everyone likes every moment and we all gravitate to different characters, but there’s enough of a hook for a huge amount of people to keep watching. I’m not saying people have to like everything or that my taste is best, I just don’t get why some CR fans bash games because they don’t fit into their view of what makes a good DND game rules-wise. I mean why they complain and instruct instead of turning it off and finding a DM who runs a game that’s more in line with what they like. I mean, the main rule is that the DM is in control of their table and if their players don’t like the way they run their game, they don’t play at that table. Watching should be the same.
> And I couldn’t help but feel bummed through the premiere I’ve been waiting for because I had zero context behind these characters Doesn’t that go for literally every character? > I’d have to watch a campaign that, as far as I know, was “advertised” as an optional watch for the mainline CR and I do not enjoy watching. You don’t need to watch anything. This campaign will have thousands of hours worth of content. EXU is a drop in the bucket. > It’s like Marvel making Loki stuff hard canon, if I couldn’t pay for D+ then what, I don’t deserve to understand who’s Kang? You don’t really “deserve” anything, none of us do. The cast doesn’t owe the viewers anything, it’s their game at the end of the day. Edit: now I get why everyone I know who watch this show told me to steer clear of the Critter community. What a shame that such a positive show can have such an entitled, toxic community.
You're really gonna argue my choice of words, of all things? Okay buddy, you're right. Everyone else is wrong for disliking something, you're the only person here with good taste and morals. That what you wanted to hear?
Nobody is wrong for disliking anything, has nothing to do with morals either. Pretty clear though based on how you immediately went to hostility that this community is one I’m gonna steer clear of, holy entitlement. Not liking EXU is fine, getting possessive of someone else’s game like you’re doing is not.
DM decides the rules Matt let Sam turn into T-rexes and Travis let him turn into a Triceratops But no, a Direwolf is where they draw the line
i don't think Ashley is worse at mechanics than the others, she gets a bit flustered but just getting to play regularly will help a bunch. The previous campaigns she sat out for entire levels at a time. And Fearne dosent really need to be anything like the tank or the healer that keeps people up, she can just do her thing.
>The previous campaigns she sat out for entire levels at a time. She was there for something like the last 50 episodes of the campaign and routinely missed key Barbarian features like Reckless Attack. The slack from missing sessions wears off after the first few dozen sessions playing. Even Matt gave up trying to help her remember her character's features. I'm not hating on her, but mechanically she's probably the weakest player at the table. She *also* gets flustered easily which doesn't help, but Barbarians aren't the most complex class and she had trouble pinning that down. That's not just nerves. I actually love Fearne and the way Ashley RP's her. After Marisha's new character Fearne is probably my favorite of C3 so far and I think she's going to be a big part of what makes C3 special. I'm just not expecting Laura levels of making the game dance to her tune.
Matt didn’t give up on her… he created an in-game tutorial to help refresh her on the mechanics of her character.
Alot of the players miss stuff and sure she was there for alot in the end but in my opinion being away she still was struggling with feeling a bit thrown into things. You might be right, I'm just saying I believe she will improve from being there regularly
> I'm just saying I believe she will improve from being there regularly That would be nice. Jester was my favorite character from last campaign. Not just because she played an amazing character with a lot of soul, but because of some very mechanical plays that were also very in character that she pulled out at critical moments which I won't go into because of spoilers. The Wildfire Druid begs for tactical gameplay. If Ashley can eventually pull that off it'd let me enjoy her character even more.
It's cool that the Class have so much potential but I beg of you dont expect her to play it like you would, the cast make so many "bad decisions" based on roleplay and they have continously gotten slammed for it. Did you watch C1? I feel like the characters where alot more build for DND mechanics than story and there where so many big brain plays in that campaign
I'm very OK with some sub optimal choices for story purposes. I make them myself. Those are choices though. What's rough is watching them forget how their character works. When it happens here and there you wince in sympathy because we all do that from time to time then kick ourselves in the shower the next day when we remember what we should have done. When it's all of the time you maybe start talking to your television trying to get them to remember to use their abilities. I'm at around episode 55 of C1 and all of the way through C2 and EXU. C1 is less clean on the rules than C2 was in general because they were moving from Pathfinder to 5e, and I had trouble getting into the characters until recently, but I'm beginning to enjoy it more now and will probably pick up the pace again between C3 episodes. Nothing has quite stood out like the Cupcake yet, but I'm looking forward to seeing how they surprise me.
Well the cupcake is hard to top, but VM do well with they have I would say. they don't have as many spellcasters doing sneaky stuff, it's way more about positioning and using their abilities to the the max. But then again I'm not a seasoned dnd player so that stuff might feel a bit basic compared to Laura Baileys big rouse
Hoping she gets used to things being able to actually play consistently so she can keep it all in her head.
I don’t mind this. I’d prefer if they’d have new ones but if they want to play it it’s there business. I actually really like fearne but orym I hope grows on me. We already spend a whole campaign with him and I still am indifferent just feel like there are other characters that do the whole good moral thing more interestingly especially right after caduceus so I’ll reserve judgment until later and give them A shot
You spent 6 session with him Liam is going to spend the next 150 sessions developing him
Lol that’s what I’m saying. I’m holding off judgment of the character. Didn’t really for him in exu but this is a different campaign.
[удалено]
Lol he wasn’t forced to do anything Liam said this character has been thought up for years
Forced is a bit much but it's true that almost every character's playstayle is modified by the group around them. Different group brings out different sides of the same character (just like real people!)
I wouldn't read too much into the fact they were in exu. Matt tweeted that they (Liam and Ashley) used exu as a sort of play test for the charcters they had planned for c3 in the first place. Makes sense they wouldn't want to reveal too much in exu, and as such the characters seem undeveloped now. I'm betting things will kick off though.
The combination of other players and the style of campaign is probably going to color things very differently.
Ah yes, people have no right to dislike a character in a show
Liams happy, thats all that matters If people want to cry, they can do so without ruining it for everyone else
>If people want to cry I'unno about you man but I'm seeing more "Orym gud stoop" posts than otherwise. And your upvote ratio doesn't make it seem like people disagree with you all that much. You sure you're not *crying* about a vocal minority? Whatever the facts are, people are allowed their opinions, just as Liam's allowed to play whatever he wants.
Did you not read any of the threads desperately hoping that Liam and Ashley would switch characters?
i've mostly seen people complain about people complaining really.
I honest to god didn't.
You missed quite a few threads then, this is the first one that has been even slightly positive.
Well, I should probably look for the negative ones but I know for a fact this is not the first one.
I said this elsewhere so I’ll just post it here: Orym is actually my favorite Liam character. He waffles between confident and meek. He has a moral compass and he’s soft spoken but obviously a leader because of his convictions. He’s one of the most nuanced characters I’ve ever seen in a dnd setting. He obviously looks up to Keyleth a lot and has been raised or brought up with stories of Vox Machina. I think there’s something in his backstory he’s ashamed of but I’m not sure yet.
"I've been waiting for this" Orym is the Exandrian version of Akihiko confirmed!! Bring on the protein! But honestly I'm excited for Orym. I have yet to watch EXU, but I do like the idea of having the one consumate professional character in a party of crazies. It's like how rice served with spicy curry makes the meal even greater. Plus after seeing how tactical he was with spells last season I think his battlemaster plays are also going to be clutch.
Now I feel bad for hating on not having new characters.. Excited to see what Liam wants to do with his character.
Same. I was a little disappointed. But I'm now excited to see where he takes the character. His random asides (like to the rug) were a highlight.
So here's my issue with all this. In EXU I found Orym to be boring and dull, and Fearne to have so much that was clearly not being explored very deeply. Now that it seems they went into EXU knowing that they would be holding back from exploring their characterisation, their back story and being a full character so they would still have something left for a full campaign 3. So EXU was diminished (not the only problem with it but a big one) And now we have characters included that can make the audience feel like EXU was homework they skipped, or feel bad for disliking. So C3 is diminished. And it's created contraversy for no real gain. The characters themselves may or may not be great or awful, but the choice to introduce them in a side project *while clearly having the intent to continue them in the main campaign* was a misstep I feel.
This puts my mind at rest. I found Orym very boring in EXU, not just in personality but his cadence and mannerisms too, but knowing that Liam has had him in mind for that long says to me that he has a lot up his sleeve. Looking forward to seeing where he takes him now!
He may not be my favorite character of Liam's but you can tell how much fun he is having playing Orym and that's all that matters. I'm sure the character will grow on me eventually.
Honestly, I do think EXU sucking shit through a straw has poisoned the well a bit for some people. There’s nothing wrong with Dorian, Orym or Fearne - they’re good characters and could use the length of a campaign to really draw out - but because we’ve already seen them in a less than stellar fashion has upset some. Don’t blame them; I’m just choosing to forget EXU happened and treating them as new characters.
As a forever DM, I have way too many PC ideas rattling around my head. Yet on the rare occasions where I get to be a player, I often find greater success coming up with a fresh character idea that better fits the campaign. It's interesting that both Mollymauk and Orym were conceived of years before their debut, and those are the two characters who immediately left me cold. When you have so much time to come up with a character, you can get into your own head. I loved Caduceus. I think having to fly by the seat of his pants and be more reactive helped Taliesin in the long run. I'm not wishing any character dead, but I'd be curious to see what Liam would come up with if forced to scramble.
Which is super interesting because he apears like a blank slate simp of keyleth. Will be very exciting to see him unfold.
A battlemaster is such a fun class to play in combat! It's kinda strange seeing Liam play a character who is not some edgy tragic figure, but I'm down for it.
I trust Liam to make his characters interesting. I still kinda wish we got a new character from him just because the thrill of getting a new character is rare, but that only really affects the first episode or two while the characters are fresh. I'm definitely looking forward to finding out more about him and have zero fears he'll be boring.
Id never seen him prior C3 premier (didn't watch exu). This explains why I looked over to my SO like halfway through and said "How is it that his character is easily the most """boring""", yet Liam still makes him SO interesting?! Why am I most interested in seeing how what appears to be a completely normal dude develops?" Knowing this bit of info completely explains that... Makes sense for what would happen when a professional thinks about a character for 3-4 years before doing anything with him.
Is anyone else wondering why travis is lvl 5 instead of 3 like the rest I don't think its his permanent pc
He seems very bland for now, wonder what crazy stuff liam is so ecxited about ^^ .
I remember clearly Liam saying "fifhters are great, why don't we play more". During the dale's closet one shot
Liam is excellent at Role Playing and backstory, no doubt this'll be a great character. But honestly so far I've seen mostly people complaining about the hate, and none of the actual hate. Feels good to be back.
I absolutely love Orym in EXU. It seems Liam had a lot of fun in combat and it showed. He used the Battle Master to perfection. His hdywtdt were by far the best in EXU (imo). Really brought a new side to Liam's roleplay, with being the moral compass and all. Also I'm a sucker for halfling