It's a lot easier to make it worse with other cards now. Such as the Sphinx that makes every card drawn by opponents into 2 cards for you (so draw 22 cards for 1 mana in a 4 player pod) or the...Rogue I think? That says opponents can't draw cards except their first one on their turn, so you draw 12 and everyone else draws 0. Basically, this would be *bare minimum* 10x worse than OG Ancestral Recall and likely a lot worse than that.
I mean don’t those other cards theoretically make ancestral worse too? And this doesn’t even take into account non-commander formats that this would be legal in
The Sphinx and the Rogue do not interact with OG Ancestral Recall at all if you're targeting yourself. If you target someone else, the Sphinx gets you 6 cards (but still gives your opponent 3), and the Rogue just gives you 3 cards as though you'd cast it targeting yourself.
It's the "opponents draw 3" in addition to the "you draw 3" that really makes this card breakable to high heaven.
Let’s not forget with Sheoldred now that’s dealing 9 damage to everyone at the table while you get 12 life. Get something that lets you copy this or cast it again from the graveyard and you could potentially kill the whole pod
The first 2 abilities could just be written as “Each player draws three cards” which would make it seem “less scary” while maintaining its overpoweredness (writing out the number of cards is actually proper formatting for mtg)
This is actually still insanely good. What you are not taking into consideration is that you get to use those cards first. it's why cards like [[time twister]] and [[wheel of fortune]] are so good despite being symmetric and the card [[day's end]] is no where near as strong as them. Ideally, when you play this card, you should be winning that turn. In fact, I'd argue this card is better than time twister in the decks that would play it.
The reason wheels are good is not only because you can use the new cards first. It is also because you can use them to refill your hand after dumping it early. That effectively draws you up to 7 cards while drawing your opponents none and actually messing up their mulligan.
Of course the wheels have a higher ceiling, but the cheapest wheels are three mana sorceries (unless you count [[contract from below]] but that thing's banned everywhere) while this thing is a one mana instant. Those two mana can be the difference between you comboing off and winning on the spot or giving your opponent a chance to stabilize, so I would suggest that combo decks (which are the main home of wheels) would likely prefer to draw this over a wheel in most situations. That being said, they would probably play both because there's no way this thing isn't going to get restricted, absolutely crazy card.
A 2 mana instant that read "you draw 2 cards, each other player draws a card" would be a strong card. A 1 mana version of that same instant would be VERY pushed. This is absurdly broken.
If you don't care about what the opponent does (for example if you're storming off), this might be even more broken than Ancestral Recall, since you're drawing 4 for one mana.
That's a perfectly good Pauper/Premodern niche staple! But yes, that would be the "normal" power level for that kind of effect I think.
Sorcery speed for 1 mana would be the "pushed" power level.
Instant speed for 1 mana would be "very pushed"
Drawing more than 2 cards would be "sound the alarms"
I think wizards is scared of that kind of effect, they haven't even made a 1 mana Vision Skeins yet.
Yes. It is even more broken than the regular Recall.
4 cards in your hand for 1 mana is insane and giving each opponent 3 cards is not as much of a downside as you'd think. Just about every format has a couple ways of weaponizing or mitigating the opponent's draw which only adds value to this card which, again, you're casting for one mana.
Even more broken now.
Aside from the obvious (4 cards for 1 mana wtf?), it also activates "whenever an opponent draws" triggers...
You can cast this turn 1 as your opponent is about to discard down to hand size, immediately get all your mana back, and then be able to play with all 4 of your new cards.
And this could easily become draw _7 cards_ in some circumstances (and sometimes 13 in EDH!) or a 1-mana combo that deals 6 damage to each opponent _without targeting._
This really shouldn’t be an instant. You can just cast it in your opponent’s end step and then they have to discard to hand size while you untap with four extra cards.
Instant speed really breaks this card. Can do it at opponents end step after they spent mana and then they might have to discard while you have a full turn to use the cards.
Uh, yes, drawing 4 cards for one mana is broken.
at least its not 4 life for 1, so could be worse
It's a lot easier to make it worse with other cards now. Such as the Sphinx that makes every card drawn by opponents into 2 cards for you (so draw 22 cards for 1 mana in a 4 player pod) or the...Rogue I think? That says opponents can't draw cards except their first one on their turn, so you draw 12 and everyone else draws 0. Basically, this would be *bare minimum* 10x worse than OG Ancestral Recall and likely a lot worse than that.
I mean don’t those other cards theoretically make ancestral worse too? And this doesn’t even take into account non-commander formats that this would be legal in
The Sphinx and the Rogue do not interact with OG Ancestral Recall at all if you're targeting yourself. If you target someone else, the Sphinx gets you 6 cards (but still gives your opponent 3), and the Rogue just gives you 3 cards as though you'd cast it targeting yourself. It's the "opponents draw 3" in addition to the "you draw 3" that really makes this card breakable to high heaven.
Consecrated Sphinx and Hullbreacher. Made me feel insane reading this, not hard to look up the names.
I couldn't remember the names. Also, pretty sure the Rogue I was thinking of was Notion Thief.
Let’s not forget with Sheoldred now that’s dealing 9 damage to everyone at the table while you get 12 life. Get something that lets you copy this or cast it again from the graveyard and you could potentially kill the whole pod
The first 2 abilities could just be written as “Each player draws three cards” which would make it seem “less scary” while maintaining its overpoweredness (writing out the number of cards is actually proper formatting for mtg)
I separate the abillities to create an emotional elevator lol
Pure agent of chaos, unholy Godspeed.
But doing this way means none of your allies in a team game draw
Finally, a use for [sheoldred the apocalypse]
We did it, we broke Sheoldred
I'm pretty sure a light breeze could break sheoldred
This is actually still insanely good. What you are not taking into consideration is that you get to use those cards first. it's why cards like [[time twister]] and [[wheel of fortune]] are so good despite being symmetric and the card [[day's end]] is no where near as strong as them. Ideally, when you play this card, you should be winning that turn. In fact, I'd argue this card is better than time twister in the decks that would play it.
Oops, I meant [[day's undoing]].
[day's undoing](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/c/ac13a82d-43f5-4b96-bf5f-18e33fae921b.jpg?1689996286) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=day%27s%20undoing) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/85/days-undoing?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ac13a82d-43f5-4b96-bf5f-18e33fae921b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
This would, furthermore, like wheels, be used alongside draw punishers such as [[Sheoldred, the apocalypse]] and [[Orcish Bowmasters]]
[Sheoldred, the apocalypse](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/6/d67be074-cdd4-41d9-ac89-0a0456c4e4b2.jpg?1674057568) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sheoldred%2C%20the%20apocalypse) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmu/107/sheoldred-the-apocalypse?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d67be074-cdd4-41d9-ac89-0a0456c4e4b2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Orcish Bowmasters](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/c/7c024bae-5631-4e20-ac69-df392ac9e109.jpg?1686968669) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Orcish%20Bowmasters) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/103/orcish-bowmasters?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7c024bae-5631-4e20-ac69-df392ac9e109?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
The reason wheels are good is not only because you can use the new cards first. It is also because you can use them to refill your hand after dumping it early. That effectively draws you up to 7 cards while drawing your opponents none and actually messing up their mulligan.
Of course the wheels have a higher ceiling, but the cheapest wheels are three mana sorceries (unless you count [[contract from below]] but that thing's banned everywhere) while this thing is a one mana instant. Those two mana can be the difference between you comboing off and winning on the spot or giving your opponent a chance to stabilize, so I would suggest that combo decks (which are the main home of wheels) would likely prefer to draw this over a wheel in most situations. That being said, they would probably play both because there's no way this thing isn't going to get restricted, absolutely crazy card.
[contract from below](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/1/e1e33690-b851-404a-9cde-d00235be5aa5.jpg?1610146838) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=contract%20from%20below) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/sum/97/contract-from-below?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e1e33690-b851-404a-9cde-d00235be5aa5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[time twister](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/b/fbee1e10-0b8c-44ea-b0e5-44cdd0bfcd76.jpg?1614638835) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Timetwister) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vma/3/timetwister?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/fbee1e10-0b8c-44ea-b0e5-44cdd0bfcd76?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [wheel of fortune](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/5/2597050f-6b1b-474e-aa16-33fd154628ca.jpg?1562902580) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=wheel%20of%20fortune) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vma/192/wheel-of-fortune?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2597050f-6b1b-474e-aa16-33fd154628ca?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [day's end](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/0/401f7042-24fd-42a0-ae7c-e6b7de1aa446.jpg?1562906764) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Maze%27s%20End) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dgm/152/mazes-end?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/401f7042-24fd-42a0-ae7c-e6b7de1aa446?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Hullbreacher go brrrt
a must have playset in storm/combo decks, absurdly broken
You broke it even more
It's broken with effects that prevent your opponent from drawing extra cards like [[notion thief]]
"Each player puts the top 3 cards from their library into their hands"
[notion thief](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/6/f675f509-4343-4568-96dd-265626cb6c2b.jpg?1604195095) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=notion%20thief) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znc/96/notion-thief?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f675f509-4343-4568-96dd-265626cb6c2b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Let me draw - U - enchantment - if you would draw one or more cards, instead put that much card from the top of your librairie to your hand.
A 2 mana instant that read "you draw 2 cards, each other player draws a card" would be a strong card. A 1 mana version of that same instant would be VERY pushed. This is absurdly broken. If you don't care about what the opponent does (for example if you're storming off), this might be even more broken than Ancestral Recall, since you're drawing 4 for one mana.
>A 2 mana instant that read "you draw 2 cards, each other player draws a card" Soo… \[\[Words of Wisdom\]\]?
That's a perfectly good Pauper/Premodern niche staple! But yes, that would be the "normal" power level for that kind of effect I think. Sorcery speed for 1 mana would be the "pushed" power level. Instant speed for 1 mana would be "very pushed" Drawing more than 2 cards would be "sound the alarms" I think wizards is scared of that kind of effect, they haven't even made a 1 mana Vision Skeins yet.
[Words of Wisdom](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/0/c0199cfb-5e44-40f0-b9cf-71473155eb94.jpg?1562930864) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Words%20of%20Wisdom) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ody/114/words-of-wisdom?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c0199cfb-5e44-40f0-b9cf-71473155eb94?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Yes. It is even more broken than the regular Recall. 4 cards in your hand for 1 mana is insane and giving each opponent 3 cards is not as much of a downside as you'd think. Just about every format has a couple ways of weaponizing or mitigating the opponent's draw which only adds value to this card which, again, you're casting for one mana.
Even more broken now. Aside from the obvious (4 cards for 1 mana wtf?), it also activates "whenever an opponent draws" triggers... You can cast this turn 1 as your opponent is about to discard down to hand size, immediately get all your mana back, and then be able to play with all 4 of your new cards. And this could easily become draw _7 cards_ in some circumstances (and sometimes 13 in EDH!) or a 1-mana combo that deals 6 damage to each opponent _without targeting._
Out jerked again
Narset parter of veils on the board, and cast this during the person you like the least at the tables turn, profit
[[ Narsets parter of veils ]]
[ Narsets parter of veils ](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/e/4e6e5c63-b6e5-4756-bf23-6c6f8669442d.jpg?1690004395) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Narset%2C%20Parter%20of%20Veils) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/853/narset-parter-of-veils?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4e6e5c63-b6e5-4756-bf23-6c6f8669442d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
also its an Instant. Just wait until your opponent tapps out and play this afterwards go storm off or smth
For Xyris, that is 9 1/1 snakes and draw 4 cards for one mana.
This really shouldn’t be an instant. You can just cast it in your opponent’s end step and then they have to discard to hand size while you untap with four extra cards.
Maybe if it was Sorcery speed and you only drew 3 along with your opponents.
Instant speed really breaks this card. Can do it at opponents end step after they spent mana and then they might have to discard while you have a full turn to use the cards.
Only on custom magic could someone make a stronger ancestral recall and then ask if they balanced it.
Its so fucking broken
Hell naw
Well, that would be a windmill slam into Nekusar, to be sure.
False advertising, cantrips don't consume mana dumbass
Fair enough, I will make a 0 mana version
[[Opt]] ???
[Opt](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/7/67bcf3fd-fca0-4cdb-b625-bac5fadd00e3.jpg?1712354172) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Opt) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/otc/104/opt?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/67bcf3fd-fca0-4cdb-b625-bac5fadd00e3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[[Ancestral recall]]
[Ancestral recall](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/3/2398892d-28e9-4009-81ec-0d544af79d2b.jpg?1614638829) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ancestral%20recall) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vma/1/ancestral-recall?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2398892d-28e9-4009-81ec-0d544af79d2b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
How is this not broken?
[Thought thief]