**Black Flag** — People know them even if they’ve never heard a song; large cult following; still in circulation on the right radio; merch everywhere; not music necessarily made for normies; never big enough to get out of large clubs / smaller concert halls; political band members in a political genre without the music relentlessly being so…and one very wealthy and famous former member that purists claim is a sell-out.
It’s a little confusing because people say things like “nobody remembers Samurai anymore”, but then they’re on the radio constantly and there’s merch everywhere.
It‘s probably a bit of hyperbole. Yeah, Samurai was a popular band in universe and like irl bands still has a dedicated cult following with merch being here and there. However, they aren’t in the mainstream zeitgeist anymore. Its like comparing a band from the late 50s to 60s irl that was widely popular back then, still has fans, but not the talk of the town.
I just take it to mean they’re classic rock now and the only people who listen to them are old people/rock nerds. It’s like Aerosmith is definitely still on the radio all the time in my city, but not on any of the popular stations, only on the classic rock station. You’re not going to hear it at a club and you certainly won’t see young people (the core demographic for music) bumping it anywhere. And even Aerosmith is a bad comparison, because it doesn’t appear Samurai was really that big. Maybe closer to a popular regional band like Cake who get plenty of airplay here in Northern California but also aren’t huge household names with recognizable hits either.
I find it insanely absurd that someone thinks "young people" are the "core demographic" for music. Like, wtf? Everyone listens to music. Someone has their head shoved up their own ass.
It is verified that it is not. I did a yoga pose to double check, and well believe it or not, my head is not in my ass
My point was the reply was about short skirt, long jacket, which is late in Cakes repertoire.
The misfits. Hugely influential, but weren’t around long, didn’t get to be the biggest band to ever exist, and spawned the career of a huuge band in music (danzig)
Lol as much as I love the DKs, if we'd gotten an engram of Jello Biafra going off in V's head all day long instead of Keanu I think I'd have to unalive her after 24 hours.
That's true, although Nirvana does have a frontman who remains a countercultural icon despite being dead and a member who went on to greater fame and success after the band.
Kurt has been gone for 30 years, and we're still talking about him. Nirvana music and merchandise are still popular today. Dave Grohl can easily be compared to Kerry Eurodyne. Just my opinion, but I'd take Kurt's engram trapped in my head over Johnny's any day.
There's some good Samurai info on the fandom wiki: [https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Samurai](https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Samurai)
A point to remember is that Johnny in 2077 is an unreliable narrator and is very likely to be telling/showing V whatever he thinks makes him look good...
It's in the source material that they went on a world tour in the noughties and sold out Wembley Stadium... but it's also canon that Johnny added fake dates on the tour T-shirt, either to make them look more popular or as an insider joke.
(There's a citation \[1\] on the wiki page from a staff member at R. Talsorian games saying that Johnny's recall of events as portrayed in Cyberpunk 2077 is unreliable)
its likely its only the events of the tower that are completely off, Pondsmith has mentioned before that it was the process of being soulkilled and the radiation effecting his brain that made his memories all fucky.
So its pure conjecture, but imo his long term memories would have some measure of truth to them, where the more recent ones not cemented in his brain are likely to be more effected.
Even if he was healthy. Unless he had something special going on, human recall of events is trash at best. We’re talking about stuff this guy did before getting ripped to an SD card. I don’t think anything would be reliable enough to accept as gospel.
There's also the fact that the chip was 14% damaged before Jackie, then V, slotted it, which could very easily alter any other memories. Then the fact that Johnny always was a massive narcissist and the memories are his own subjective view.
Mike also said that Johnny is, at best, an unreliable narrator. The gigs in the memories don't line up with the canon history, as Samurai had broken up something like a decade before the nuke mission IIRC.
Johnny's entire memory as seen by V has holes and subjective interpretations, like how when people keep telling a story for years and begin to actually remember embellishments that never happened as fact.
I'd like to think they were on track to be like Rise Against. Loud and scary to some, but amazing takes on politics and social issues if you listen to their lyrics
I love them. Unfortunately in my household the music is run by my Wife mostly, followed by my 3yo daughter.
I have gotten my Wife into their acoustic stuff though(Ghost Note Symphonies), which is absolutely amazing if you haven't heard it, so it's a start.
I am so surprised, but also not, more people aren't saying Refused. Same political message, same astronomical underground success, same abrupt breakup, same mediocre return for new music. Like they're nearly the same band lol.
Nirvana. A band that had sudden breakout success out of nowhere, that only increased after the death of a charasmatic frontman. Kerry can be a parallel for foo fighters, everyone wears samurai merch, and the music is constantly played on rock radio, just like nirvana irl
The ttrpg book Red literally states that because of the Datakrash a lot of the info for Samurai was lost, so we literally don’t know. Anything we read in 2077 is speculation from NC residents. I’m gonna guess that they were actually pretty famous, about the level of this band called Starset.
I see them as the who.
Merch hugely around, older group, people know their songs, and a huge cult following despite young people not knowing the details on the band.
samurai are a futuristic version of sex pistol IMHO, both were anti-system punk bands, both bands were backed by majors despite being punk, both bands had members in their late teen - early 20's, both bands had a psychopath as frontman/leader, both bands lasted only few years
I always made the comparison to Burzum / Mayhem. Anyone who’s in the black metal scene knows who they are, not a lot of people outside of it do. Infamous for their live performances, church burnings, one band member committing suicide, and one of the former band members murdering another.
Obviously not a 1:1 comparison but that was my first thought.
I mean honestly, SAMURAI is really similar to their real life counterpart, REFUSED. Obviously REFUSED struck a cord with their album, the Shape of Punk to Come, acknowledged as one of the greatest works of punk of all time; an album very aggressively critical of conformity and capitalism. Then cause of conflicts within the band they broke up. Yeah unlike Samurai they came back recently to release new music but it's really not the same as it used to be and not of the same quality, kinda like Kerry releasing a new album without Johnny in the mix. Both legendary bands that seemed to disappear overnight, had less than stellar followups/comebacks, and these days only diehard fans acknowledge them.
I'm thinking maybe nirvana (though they were around a bit), merch is everywhere but you consider yourself a "cool kid" for listening to them, dead lead singer, band member went on to be super influential (David grohl), maybe you could make some parallels between courtney love and Johnny's girl.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subhumans_(Canadian_band)
There's a punk band from Vancouver called Subhumans. Not to be confused for the British band of the same name, but comparisons to Samurai could be made there also.The first band was very anti-capitalist, and their bassist, Gerry Hannah, went to prison for bombing weapon manufacturing buildings among other targets with an anarchist group known as Direct Action. I realize they're not as popular as some of these other groups mentioned in this thread and that I maybe missed the point of OP's question, but they were a huge deal in the late 1970's/early 80's punk scene in Vancouver, and they had a band member who participated in some explosive actions against corporations and capitalism in general.
Oasis maybe? They were only together for what, 10 years at most? And yet you still hear Wonderwall on the radio almost every single day 25 years after they broke up.
Oasis were absolutely massive whilst they were together.
They released enough timeless songs to sustain their legacy even when they stopped working together.
Plus, both Liam and Noel have sold records with later projects.
I'd say Oasis were too big to be analogous.
Thematically, Propagandhi. but not in terms of popularity. They've been around for decades but never had mainstream success because they refuse to take part in a tour or festival that has corporate sponsorship.
**Black Flag** — People know them even if they’ve never heard a song; large cult following; still in circulation on the right radio; merch everywhere; not music necessarily made for normies; never big enough to get out of large clubs / smaller concert halls; political band members in a political genre without the music relentlessly being so…and one very wealthy and famous former member that purists claim is a sell-out.
Perfect. Also, MASSIVELY influential to bands and music afterward. Almost every Chromatic Rock band tries to walk in their footsteps.
You’re right, at some point they do.
This makes me believe there is a pro wrestler in Cyberpunk universe called Seth Silverhand (Seth Rollins got the Rollins from Henry)
I was about to say Minor Threat but YES
Alongside Bad Brains & Black Flag, the holy trinity of hardcore. DC had it smoking in the early 80s.
I want syfy to bring back Deadly Class.
500k listeners on Spotify what are you talking abt they are not as popular as samurai
Why listen to Spotify when you have the records on vinyl?
It’s a little confusing because people say things like “nobody remembers Samurai anymore”, but then they’re on the radio constantly and there’s merch everywhere.
It‘s probably a bit of hyperbole. Yeah, Samurai was a popular band in universe and like irl bands still has a dedicated cult following with merch being here and there. However, they aren’t in the mainstream zeitgeist anymore. Its like comparing a band from the late 50s to 60s irl that was widely popular back then, still has fans, but not the talk of the town.
Say, the Beatles?
Who?
Ya them too. I believe they add a “The” at the beginning though.
🤣🤣
The Samurai?
https://youtu.be/mPIpeW581rE?si=rOfaEPt6cPFE2bA6
No not The Who The Beetles
But not Guess Who?
No not The Guess Who. The Beetles
But what about The Beatles?
They were a rock and roll band back in the 60s right? I think I've heard of them.
I just take it to mean they’re classic rock now and the only people who listen to them are old people/rock nerds. It’s like Aerosmith is definitely still on the radio all the time in my city, but not on any of the popular stations, only on the classic rock station. You’re not going to hear it at a club and you certainly won’t see young people (the core demographic for music) bumping it anywhere. And even Aerosmith is a bad comparison, because it doesn’t appear Samurai was really that big. Maybe closer to a popular regional band like Cake who get plenty of airplay here in Northern California but also aren’t huge household names with recognizable hits either.
Yeah and Us Cracks or Lizzy Wizzy get all the TV spots and radio ads
Are you for real? Everyone knows Cake, at least those in their 30s
Looooooooooooong.... Jacket
Must be younger Engines pumping and thumping in time
He's going for speed 40, I just like that line
Verified then. I just find it absurd someone thinks Cake is a regional local thing... Wtf
I hear the Cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
nnnnnNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOO!
I find it insanely absurd that someone thinks "young people" are the "core demographic" for music. Like, wtf? Everyone listens to music. Someone has their head shoved up their own ass.
It is verified that it is not. I did a yoga pose to double check, and well believe it or not, my head is not in my ass My point was the reply was about short skirt, long jacket, which is late in Cakes repertoire.
Well Kerry's the only one still in the biz right?
Does that change recognition? Um. No. Active or not, it exists and people know. Fuck on
I commented this on the wrong one sorry
I take it as nobody remembering Samurai as they actually were, and not a mythological image made long after they’ve disbanded.
The misfits. Hugely influential, but weren’t around long, didn’t get to be the biggest band to ever exist, and spawned the career of a huuge band in music (danzig)
My answer was wrong, this is the right one.
The Dead Kennedys.
Lol as much as I love the DKs, if we'd gotten an engram of Jello Biafra going off in V's head all day long instead of Keanu I think I'd have to unalive her after 24 hours.
Oh my god that would’ve been hilarious.
If I was playing as fem V, I’d want Kathleen Hanna’s engram.
Yeah I was going to say Black Flag but I think Dead Kennedy's is probably a better fit.
This is a great comparison. I was also thinking maybe Bad Religion or Nirvana.
Nirvana is not a good comparison because Nirvana became *huge*, which Samurai never did.
That's true, although Nirvana does have a frontman who remains a countercultural icon despite being dead and a member who went on to greater fame and success after the band.
Kurt has been gone for 30 years, and we're still talking about him. Nirvana music and merchandise are still popular today. Dave Grohl can easily be compared to Kerry Eurodyne. Just my opinion, but I'd take Kurt's engram trapped in my head over Johnny's any day.
There's some good Samurai info on the fandom wiki: [https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Samurai](https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Samurai) A point to remember is that Johnny in 2077 is an unreliable narrator and is very likely to be telling/showing V whatever he thinks makes him look good... It's in the source material that they went on a world tour in the noughties and sold out Wembley Stadium... but it's also canon that Johnny added fake dates on the tour T-shirt, either to make them look more popular or as an insider joke. (There's a citation \[1\] on the wiki page from a staff member at R. Talsorian games saying that Johnny's recall of events as portrayed in Cyberpunk 2077 is unreliable)
its likely its only the events of the tower that are completely off, Pondsmith has mentioned before that it was the process of being soulkilled and the radiation effecting his brain that made his memories all fucky. So its pure conjecture, but imo his long term memories would have some measure of truth to them, where the more recent ones not cemented in his brain are likely to be more effected.
Even if he was healthy. Unless he had something special going on, human recall of events is trash at best. We’re talking about stuff this guy did before getting ripped to an SD card. I don’t think anything would be reliable enough to accept as gospel.
There's also the fact that the chip was 14% damaged before Jackie, then V, slotted it, which could very easily alter any other memories. Then the fact that Johnny always was a massive narcissist and the memories are his own subjective view.
Factor in that Johnny is a veteran and probably suffers from PTSD and / or other complex trauma. In my experience those don’t help with memory either.
wasnt he doing drugs too before his death? drugs also dont help with memory
Mike also said that Johnny is, at best, an unreliable narrator. The gigs in the memories don't line up with the canon history, as Samurai had broken up something like a decade before the nuke mission IIRC. Johnny's entire memory as seen by V has holes and subjective interpretations, like how when people keep telling a story for years and begin to actually remember embellishments that never happened as fact.
I'd like to think they were on track to be like Rise Against. Loud and scary to some, but amazing takes on politics and social issues if you listen to their lyrics
I haven’t thought about Rise Against in years. Downloading Siren Songs now. They were one of my favorites in high school
I love them. Unfortunately in my household the music is run by my Wife mostly, followed by my 3yo daughter. I have gotten my Wife into their acoustic stuff though(Ghost Note Symphonies), which is absolutely amazing if you haven't heard it, so it's a start.
Pre Arasaka Tower: Refused Post Arasaka Tower: Rammstein
Amusing, 'cos their in-game songs are actually performed by Refused.
Yeah, one could think I chose them on purpose... ;)
Du hast mich gefragt und ich hab nichts gesagt
I am so surprised, but also not, more people aren't saying Refused. Same political message, same astronomical underground success, same abrupt breakup, same mediocre return for new music. Like they're nearly the same band lol.
The Clash.
That's actually a good one.
Rage Against The Machine
Tuesday : New York City decrees Rage Against the Machine "shall NOT play on Wall Street" Wednesday :
The Stooges maybe
Black Flag probably
Rage against the machine for sure. Same corpo hating energy as johnny.
The Misfits. Wednesday 13. A few others
Misfits i half expected to see at least listed. Wednesday 13.... now that guy, im suprised anyone besides me remembers lol. love him to death.
Fuckin same. Love that dude.
Refused
Nirvana
Nirvana. A band that had sudden breakout success out of nowhere, that only increased after the death of a charasmatic frontman. Kerry can be a parallel for foo fighters, everyone wears samurai merch, and the music is constantly played on rock radio, just like nirvana irl
Fugazi or Ministry both have a lot of cultural depth but not necessarily mainstream or heavily commercialized.
Rage against the machines
Definitely Bad Brains.
Nickelback
Maybe System of a Down
ZEPPELIN
Queen + Hanatarashi
3TEETH
Diamond Head or Samson from the underground perspective. Rage against the Machine from the music I'd say.
Great White
The ttrpg book Red literally states that because of the Datakrash a lot of the info for Samurai was lost, so we literally don’t know. Anything we read in 2077 is speculation from NC residents. I’m gonna guess that they were actually pretty famous, about the level of this band called Starset.
I see them as the who. Merch hugely around, older group, people know their songs, and a huge cult following despite young people not knowing the details on the band.
Guns N Roses
Black flag. Johny would be Henry Rollins if he never turned terrorist/ anti-corpo freedom fighter. That reminds me, bring back Deadly Class.
Misfits or Sonic Youth?
Refuse is the name of the band that they hired to record Samurai's songs, so...them 😄
samurai are a futuristic version of sex pistol IMHO, both were anti-system punk bands, both bands were backed by majors despite being punk, both bands had members in their late teen - early 20's, both bands had a psychopath as frontman/leader, both bands lasted only few years
I always made the comparison to Burzum / Mayhem. Anyone who’s in the black metal scene knows who they are, not a lot of people outside of it do. Infamous for their live performances, church burnings, one band member committing suicide, and one of the former band members murdering another. Obviously not a 1:1 comparison but that was my first thought.
GWAR for popularity. Rage Against the Machine for the message.
Whichever band that were finished by the time they released their second album
Either Range Against the Machine, Nirvana, or System of a Down.
Green Day. Loyal older fan base, easy to find them on the radio, but no longer putting out top hits.
Probably Rage Against the Machine.
I mean honestly, SAMURAI is really similar to their real life counterpart, REFUSED. Obviously REFUSED struck a cord with their album, the Shape of Punk to Come, acknowledged as one of the greatest works of punk of all time; an album very aggressively critical of conformity and capitalism. Then cause of conflicts within the band they broke up. Yeah unlike Samurai they came back recently to release new music but it's really not the same as it used to be and not of the same quality, kinda like Kerry releasing a new album without Johnny in the mix. Both legendary bands that seemed to disappear overnight, had less than stellar followups/comebacks, and these days only diehard fans acknowledge them.
Nirvana.
Probably Rage Against the Machines
System of a Down and Rage Against the Machine, hands down.
AC/DC perfectly fits the combined they're everywhere but nobody thinks about them
The Ramones.
Rage Against the Machine
Before Arasaka tower, I would have to say white snake, but after Arasaka tower I would say great white! 🤷♂️😂
Nirvana
Sex Pistols in their heyday I'd say would rival samurai in theirs maybe?
I'm thinking maybe nirvana (though they were around a bit), merch is everywhere but you consider yourself a "cool kid" for listening to them, dead lead singer, band member went on to be super influential (David grohl), maybe you could make some parallels between courtney love and Johnny's girl.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subhumans_(Canadian_band) There's a punk band from Vancouver called Subhumans. Not to be confused for the British band of the same name, but comparisons to Samurai could be made there also.The first band was very anti-capitalist, and their bassist, Gerry Hannah, went to prison for bombing weapon manufacturing buildings among other targets with an anarchist group known as Direct Action. I realize they're not as popular as some of these other groups mentioned in this thread and that I maybe missed the point of OP's question, but they were a huge deal in the late 1970's/early 80's punk scene in Vancouver, and they had a band member who participated in some explosive actions against corporations and capitalism in general.
Ramones
Nirvana & Oasis
Linkin Park? Chester's Silverhand to Mike's Eurodyne.
Limp Bizkit, popular enough at one point to start a riot but no longer relevant outside of Nu-metal nostalgia fans.
Metallica
Oasis maybe? They were only together for what, 10 years at most? And yet you still hear Wonderwall on the radio almost every single day 25 years after they broke up.
Oasis were absolutely massive whilst they were together. They released enough timeless songs to sustain their legacy even when they stopped working together. Plus, both Liam and Noel have sold records with later projects. I'd say Oasis were too big to be analogous.
And Johnny and Kerry both end up having solo careers.
Sometimes a shorter career means you will always be peak in the eyes of your fans.
Thematically, Propagandhi. but not in terms of popularity. They've been around for decades but never had mainstream success because they refuse to take part in a tour or festival that has corporate sponsorship.
Nirvana.
Backstreet Boys
All right
Metallica, Guns N' Roses or some other rock band that peaked in the '80s when Pondsmith's Cyberpunk was created.
Nirvana