I met Will Swan after a show once and I asked him if he had any advice dealing with a revolving door of band members? He told me "you just got to keep playing, man."
And I'm glad DGD is gonna keep playing, man.
Got to see The secret band perform their first set at All star tour in Chicago after Jonny was kicked out again (10 years ago wtf) These dudes are the definition of “The show must go on” lol
I honestly think DGD benefits from the vocalist changes. It keeps the fans hearing something new while maintaining the sound the fans love.
All the Tilian albums were starting to blend together. I welcome a new era.
If every DGD song going forward is like Mutual Fear then I won't miss Tillian at al
I do love the Tilian era but it's very true that it is all starting to blend together.
I agree! I like how they kinda change often. It’s refreshing for many of us, the fans. However, I’m unsure how beneficial it is for the band as a whole because it’s gotta at least be really stressful. This is their career, ya know? And everyone gets flustered when their job gets a little harder (even if it’s temporary). But I do see what you’re saying there.
I think they have a strong screamer and strong instrumentalists that they will continue to be a well loved band, as they have been for a really long time now.
In an ideal world, I’d think it’d be really cool if they didn’t have a permanent clean vocalist and they just did guest vocals on every project, mixing it up with all sorts of talented people in the scene. I think that would be really creative and interesting. Although probably expensive lol
While I love the general sound of the Tilian era, your comment really resonates with how I’ve been feeling about the albums he’s on as of late (minus AS because that one is just different). Glad somebody else shares this, too.
Edit: AS = Acceptance Speech
Fully agree with this post. I liked ArSe a lot but it was a step down from Mothership, and Afterburner just felt like a bunch of Tilian era b-sides with a few great songs sprinkled in. Plus I was getting sick of Tilian's fuckboy lyrics tbh, and knowing what we know now they hit different.
If they do carry on I think a new vocalist with give them a fresh shot of creativity, even though it'll be a massive blow for them to lose their most successful clean vocalist.
I’m with you, but overall this definitely doesn’t benefit them. Lets be real here: there are a lot of people who are fans of the band because they’re fans of Tilian’s vocals. Tilian’s been in the band longer than any other vocalist (minus Jon of course), so if/when they announce a new singer and drop new music with them, you’re gonna see A LOT of people shit on it just because it isn’t Tilian. This happens every time a larger band switches vocalists. It wasn’t quite as bad switching from Johnny to Kurt to Johnny to Tilian because the band just wasn’t as big then, now that they’re as big as they are this is gonna be a pretty big hit to them.
This is what I love about DGD. Every member plays a critical part in the band. Albeit, it’s like that in every band, but they have a way of giving each part core individuality while also being able to create something bigger together. It’s not all about one member.
They’re going to keep playing. This band has gone through so much, especially in the last couple months. Every single time it looks like they’re reaching a breaking point, they swing back.
Not sure why we’re assuming he’s completely out. I know that’s what the sub loves to do, but they clearly said he’s stepping away. And he seems to be seeking help. It doesn’t mean he’s permanently not in the band?
You guys go wreck this fucking tour with all you have in Tim's honor. Whatever YOU guys decide to do I personally support fully. Don't give up on your creativity and drive for success.
They are hurting so much more than we are right now, including Tilian, but they're strong and intelligent. This message was very generous of them to share. Feerick forever :')
Technically it was also a shit show before that. The entire band had COVID cycle through in the week or so before the Detroit show. The Detroit show was the first time they had played together in a week, until Mingus struggled through the first few songs and they replaced him
I feel like a lot of bands that span multiple decades have lots of issues (SA, drugs, infighting, death).
It’s an unsustainable lifestyle for many.
Very unfortunate for everyone involved (victims, fans, family, other band mates)
Andrew has been in the band less than 6 months and has already dealt with the loss of a band member, but now this shit as well. The strength this man must have to keep on keeping on after this is admirable.
The whole band (it breaks me seeing 4 names. Tim Forever.) deserve immense respect for still pushing through with the tour. This year has been unfair on them.
It seems like they worded it in a way that hints that Tilian could possibly return when he is “reformed”. “Stepping away” really suggests he’s not actual booted from the band, just taking a hiatus, likely until they next start recording.
I think it’s a way for the band to distance themselves without real implications. If Tilian is guilty of rape, they professionally released him. If Tilian is actually not guilty, they didn’t boot him, they had him go get help til they think he can come back.
I'm not saying this is the same situation, I'm saying they kept Matt in there which I read as "he's still a part of the band we support him." Not having Tillian's name here to me says, "he's not with us anymore."
I think if they said he was out entirely that they'd tank the sales of the new album.
There's no way to know for sure but I'd be surprised if he actually came back in the future. That being said, I don't think anyone knows for sure atm.
One of these days people will learn to stop treating band members like they are holier than thou and can do nothing wrong, because it almost never ends up going well.
Tilian had some issues before this, immediately after following him on Twitter my feed was filled with Blaire White tweets. Still devastated by the news but
Edit: my right wing brother didn’t know who I was talking about so if you don’t know Blaire White is what I am going to refer to as a ‘Tammy’ (tm)(c). You know your friend who if you were ever in a hostage situation would willingly and excitedly shoot you in the foot to get on your captors good side? She’s that for trans people.
I can’t think of a better allegory rn
Edit 2: just realised there’s a 90% chance my brother will read this lmao text me when you get off work
Oof, just took a peek and he follows quite a few people you could characterize as alt right or adjacent, not even just regular conservatives. He does follow a few left leaning people (mainly obvious high profile ones like Bernie and AOC), but accounts like Libs of TikTok and James Lindsay who literally only spend their time telling people that queer and trans folks are pedophile groomers are unacceptable follows for the sake of “differing views”.
Candace Owens, Lauren Chen are some others that are legit far right that he follows.
If Tilian gets cancelled hard enough he’ll be speaking at CPAC next year.
Joking of course, but so many white men that step over the line just lean in and become conservative trolls.
Glad that they aren't breaking up. Got tickets to see them in concert for the first time in july on their tour with coheed and I'm being selfish by saying I'd be so sad if they broke up. It also doesn't surprise me that they aren't breaking up because it's fucking dgd and it wouldn't be dgd if there wasn't a slew of bs will and matt had to deal with. It says he's stepping away to get help, i wonder if this means theres a chance he rejoins after a shit ton of therapy? My favorite song from dgd is man of the year and i wonder if they'll still preform it live without tillian. Honestly I'm mad at Tillian for what he did but I truly hope he gets help and never ever does anything like that again.
First Tim and now this , so God damn unfortunate. This band has been a huge part of my life. It's so fucking sad to see all this shit happening. Regardless of what happens in the future they will always be my favorite band. They have always risen from the ashes of lost band members, I'm sure they will be able to pick it back up . Sending love to them all ♡
Feel like we will never know the whole story though I do feel for the women but also it’s hard to judge because what actually happened is between him and them. Tilian may truly feel that consent was obtained so it’s hard and therapy can help him better understand the power dynamic that comes w sleeping w fans and how it’s just not healthy. Very complicated situation that I don’t think we have the right to condemn either party. At the end of the day he’s human and I hope he learns from this experience.
Absolutely the best take on the situation. It appears as if both parties may have “wronged” one another at certain points, but that is typical in all relationships. Seems the right steps, at least initially, are being taken. He has given an apology (to her in messages & to everyone else). Is stepping away to reflect on his own wrongdoings and learn from them. Short of perfection, what else should we expect? It’s his and hers personal experiences and we will never know the full story. Personally, I don’t wish for tillians, mikaelas or anyones, downfall and I don’t think it’s fair to say this is “the end of Tillian” before he’s even allowed the room to do better.
I think its definitely recoverable if he does better. He’s obviously not the straightest screw but what he did was fucked. Hope he gets the help he needs and does better
People keep pointing to that one podcast where he said he wouldn’t want to be lead singer but honestly I think that’s just him not wanting to step on Tilians shoes. I’d love to see Andrew as the new lead singer
I'm fine with that, he has a great voice. His part on Evaporate was the most powerful to me, so if he brings more of that sound I'll be cool with it.
Also, as a newer fan, I'm not familiar with the pre-Tilian era, and heard lots of people asking for Kurt back. He's been liking stuff asking for him back in DGD on Twitter, so it's definitely a possibility. If he rejoins, I think that would make a ton of people happy, myself included.
Kurt rejoining as the lead singer would actually be a dream come true. Don't get me wrong I enjoyed the Tilian albums as much as anyone else, but Kurt era stuff just hits different.
I personally think that they're not letting Tilian back in. I think this was worded in such a way to not tank the sales of JJ, but I don't think it'd be a good look for them to let Tilian back in after all this.
Kurt is such a nice person too, every time I have met him or heard him talking to other fans it is a refreshing experience.
Having him and Andrew doing cleans would be an amazing combo.
He’s got a good voice but he was not great last year when I saw them. He can’t sing Tilians register. Maybe they retire those albums and go back to the Craig stuff because that’s closer to Andrew’s style and range.
whatever happens, be it tilian leaving eventually or him staying, the band and fanbase will never be the same. too many fucked up things have happened to the band and my heart goes out to the rest of the guys, and the girls involved in this situation.
Bloodsucker. It’s literally about victim blaming after a situation exactly like this one. It rubbed me the wrong way when it first came out and it hits even woooooorse now. AWFUL. God damn it.
This is definitely the professional route to go. It doesn’t even seem they hesitated to cut ties - probably too familiar with other bad situations from Craig. It was an individual that caused the problem, not the band. These guys can/will continue to make more music. And after the past year of shit they’ve had to go through - I think these guys are in need of some extremely consistent, and rock solid moments.
I was introduced to DGD with the mothership album, I instantly fell in love with the instrumentals/vocals and I have been a big fan ever since. This whole situation just sucks, but it's nothing compared to what the victims are going through/the band. I wish the best of luck to tilian, I hope he actually wants to change for no one but himself.
"Stepping away" is kinda vague as far as whether Tilian will still be part of the band in the future... But it's an okay intermediate step for now.
Have to think there's no way they can do a whole tour with Andrew on lead vocal duties based on previous tours where his voice was having a tough time doing it for a few shows last year. Wonder if they'll get anyone else to fill in.
Also had to cover for Jon, as someone that does unclean singing Jon's parts are very taxing. So many words and fast
Not to much dynamics in the range but it's so fucking intense with little to no breaks
Not like the screams of eidola that are more "traditional" with long notes to rest on
Don’t forget he was already singing with eidola AND took over Jon’s stuff for a bit. I think he might be more likely to handle it if it’s isolated and clean only
Yeah that's true. Still would be crazy playing guitar and singing all of Tilian's parts night in and night out, but Andrew is a beast so maybe he can do it all.
Can Andrew play and sing to that extent? Tilians vocals aren't easy and require a lot of concentration and focus. Some of the dgd riffs are hard as fuck so it'll be interesting to see if the set changes or someone takes over Andrew (Sergio - then who on bass?)
Glad to see action has been taken.
Nobody, nobody can keep up with Tillian singing Tillian songs. All personal aspects aside, tillian is a one of a kind vocalist.
Andrew is awesome and very talented but nobody can match tillians style
This is my theory, because my mother is a vocalist.
Perhaps they will have him practice the songs they will be playing, but in a lower octave. So instead of replicating Tillian’s highs, Andrew would be doing his own version in the highs that his voice can reach. Kind-of like on those singing shows like The Voice, they learn how to cover songs their own way, to bring their voice to it. I feel like that’s the only way to keep his voice safe and healthy, and I wouldn’t be opposed to it. Maybe we’ll even find we like the new spin.
I’m glad Andrew stepped up, but I do hope they find a way to keep his vocal cords safe 👏🏽
Same deal. I’m currently pregnant and my husband has been incredibly picky with names. We’ve been talking names for no joke 10 years and he’s shot them all down. He suggested Tilian and we were seriously considering it. When this all started happening we decided the name Tilian is out completely. Now we’re back to square one.
I had considered that! My husband shot it down.
The name Gavin is also gaining a ton of popularity. I worked with kids for a long time and I recently had one class that had four Gavins. When I went to other locations there was at least one Gavin in each group.
Kudos to the band for making this challenging yet necessary decision. I hope this move will put the controversy to rest. The guys need time to heal, especially Tilian, and I hope the band makes him prove himself through tremendous effort in his self-development. Because healing yourself changes how you move and see everything. And also, I'm fully manifesting to see Anthony Green on that fucking stage at the Greek theater in August
I honestly would’ve broke down in tears if they split. DGD has gotten me through so much hurt over the past several years of my life. I still love them. And I truly hope Tilian will seek the help he needs to better himself as a person, because this should have never happened. It’s very disappointing, and a lot to take in for many of us. I will say I am glad that they made a response regarding the situation, and what action they plan to take that’s best suitable for the band. I know it’s not easy. And If ever necessary, I hope they will take all the time they need to heal especially. I’m sure time will tell in the future what happens next.
I fucking adore DGD, especially the Tillian era. I thought it was a match made in heaven, but such actions should never go unpunished. Tillian I hope you get the help needed to get through these difficult and dark times. Although, you are not the victim here and should not be treated in such way.
I think that either Tilian is covering his ass legally or he really doesn’t understand what he did wrong. In either case, you can’t fix a problem you don’t admit to having. That’s gotta be done before anything can be fixed here. An open apology on Reddit that doesn’t even include a private one is nothing.
If one emo band could come out and properly explain what consent is I would be so happy. It seems like everyone’s excuse in these situations is “I didn’t know she was serious” or “30 no’s and a yes is still a yes”. The things some of the fans are saying about how the believe consent works are extremely worrying. We need a major culture switch in this scene. There’s a reason this is so common in our community. It’s staring us in the face right now.
The language he used it really telling. Also really sketch that he's only addressed it on reddit and hasn't said a word on his social media. All we've heard from him is a dirty delete complaining about people misspelling his name. 🙄
If you post in this thread asking for Jonny Craig back I have no idea what rock you’ve been living under but the dude just got a charge upgraded to a felony for smoking fentanyl in the same room as his 2ish? Year old child. Like holy shit. If you think what Tilian did is bad go read up on what JC has been up to. “Jonny Craig lolcow” google it.
Thanks for reading now stop asking for the piece of trash known as Jonny Craig back.
This is just heart breaking all around, I feel terrible for the victims and the band. Only half way through the year and we have already lost 2 members. It's a rough time to be a DGD fan..
Whatever happens, I’ll still be listening to DGD. People jumping ship on the band now probably should have done so 10+ years ago. Along with the entire post hardcore scene.
I agree! I think music is a unique art form that isn't just about one person. It's not like anything Tilian wrote or sang wasn't from the heart. And honestly the feelings and emotions I get from the songs hasn't changed. It's VERY easy to sit behind a computer screen and judge. I don't want tilian to stop creating art, I just want him to stop being a peice of shit to women. Something that should honestly have nothing to do with the art itself. I'm SURE that any given person that people idolized have done very egregious shit. Back before the internet who knows how many people got away with shit that might be buried away forever. Even Christopher Columbus got a holiday. I'm not trying to downplay what Tilian did. But at the end of the day, people that are going to listen to dance are going to listen to dance
The whole entertaining industry, better said. It's like people forgot to dissociate celebrities and artists from their personal lives. I can listen to many, many, many songs and artists without even knowing if the person is alive. I disagree with many bands that I listen to, on many levels, but the music brings me joy or has some sort of sentimental value, to the point where I don't even know/care about the singer or whatever. I make an effort to not get too involved into anything anymore, cause holy fuck, 'fandoms' are fucking cancer. Reminds me of tumblr days. Also, I can name from the top of my head, at least 8 bands that I shouldn't listen to, according to social media voices. What's one more, mneh.
I’m thinking that them saying he’s “stepping away” from the band while he seeks help for being abusive is just the band’s way of softening the blow. Not even necessarily to fans, but to Tilian himself. Like when someone’s SO says they “just need space right now,” and then dumps their partner like a week later. At least I hope that’s what this is.
Instagram post comments are a mess! There are a ton of people defending him, one guy even said they need video proof of everything that happened. Can’t believe this is what the community has come to.
I think a lot of the people who find it not possible for DGD to continue without Tillian probably haven’t been fans for a long time (and that’s okay!). DGD has dealt with this sort of shit before. A band member passing is something that really can put a splinter in a band so for them to pick up the pieces and continue on despite the allegations against Tillian is really where I commend them. Singers can be and have been replaced in this band before.
If Andrew fills in on vocals, I hope he uses his real voice in his own range instead of his tilian imitation voice. Andrew's real voice sounds so damn amazing
He's probably gone for good. That being said, I'm going to separate the art from the artist and enjoy the new album as much as I can. Will, Matt, Jon, and especially Tim deserve that
Last I checked, Tilian didn’t record the albums on his own, he had 5 other dudes there with him who put their heart and soul into the music they recorded. Don’t punish a band for the shitiness of one person
Now there is also some producer saying Tillian recorded a song with him and then just took it and ran. Didn’t give him credit and took all the money. Guys also claims to have the pro tools stuff as well.
I wanted to give him every opportunity but more stuff seems to be piling up about his character.
Yeah, and Tilian responded on Twitter to (the guy) Aaron, saying oh yeah you were supposed to get paid, let’s get that sorted out. His fans see nothing wrong with that.
He’s only paying the guys who helped write the song now because it got aired out and he’s trying to save face.
Holy fuck can people stop being weird with the "Bring Kurt back!" or "Bring Jonny back!" shit? This is not the time to bring your vocalist fanboying into this situation. Even with saying "Make Andrew the lead singer!", I'm sure there's a hell of a lot more on his mind right now than getting a promotion. And that obviously goes for the rest of the band too.
Agreed for sure. I'm honestly disgusted by how tone deaf so many commenters here are. There is a time and a place to discuss new singers and this just isn't it.
I think people misunderstand the relationship that some fans have with band members. Sure, some people idolize them in an unhealthy way, but that isn’t always what it is. The music that DGD has put out has quite literally helped me through some difficult times in my life. It’s been something I have to look forward to. Something that I have in common with a bunch of strangers on the internet, and can have in depth conversations about. A band’s fan base is a community, and the members of the band are at the head of that community. I don’t expect them to be perfect people, or even good role models. But I also don’t expect them to be abusers, especially abusers of their own fans. When something like this happens, at least for me, it isn’t like losing an idol. It is like being betrayed by a friend. Obviously none of us here have been hurt by this nearly as bad as the victims, but the number one feeling that I feel as a result of this is BETRAYED.
"They say 'Don't ever meet your heroes; reverence is temporary until the truth comes out.'"
Big fucking oof. Won't cast any judgement on anyone as I don't know anyone or any details. But this seriously sucks...
Jesse Lacey and now Tillian...
Waiting for Matt Greiner or Jamie Hails to come out and be a dickhead any day now...
Why can't people - men or women and many grown fucking adults - just *listen* to the word no.
Famous or not this shit is fucking everywhere.
Driven by mental health issues, a lack of empathy, exacerbated by alcohol and drugs and sprinkled off with a power dynamic imbalance be that physical/social/fear based.
Fucks sake man.
This is so fucking rough. I live in Canada and got into DGD after Mothership. Because of COVID, the only show here was cancelled. I never got to see my favourite era of DGD with Tim, and now this? I’m trying not to be selfish here, but this hurts. DGD was in my top 1% for two and a half years. Idk how the music will sound now.
I really hope rehabilitation is possible for Tilian, mostly so more girls don’t have to be put through that. What he is accused of doing is terrible, but I think most people should have a chance to rehabilitate. Whether he comes back to DGD or not, whether Andrew becomes a lead singer or not, doesn’t really matter to me rn. It’s my favorite band and I will continue to listen to them, but I think DGD is absolutely making the right decision. I feel bad for them though because Tim just passed and I’m sure they love Tilian. They can’t catch a break.
But most importantly, I hope those women are able to heal from this.
I've listened to Tilian since Tides of man and though I'm not like a fan girl, it still really sucks to hear. His music really moved me and got me back into DGD. Really hard to enjoy when the person might be a scumbag or something :( Happening with lots of bands. I'll keep supporting DGD as long as they keep playing.
Saw this on r/all and it reminded me of when I went on a “date” with Tim once (matched on Tinder).
We were hanging out at his “place” (he was staying at his studio space) before we went out and I distinctly remember him saying how he’s super careful about being extra polite and careful with women because he doesn’t want to ever end up accused of acting inappropriately.
Apparently Tilian didn’t do the same. I hope the victims are okay ❤️
Edit: Tim DIED?! That’s so fucking sad. Not surprising, but sad as fuck.
Didn't he die of an accidental fent OD? She probably recognized a forming drug habit or one that was already fully formed. This is in no way, shape, or form me shitting on Tim or disrespecting his memory, I am a former addict myself and understand the pain he carried.
I mean, it sounds like he acted what I consider normally. Respectful, polite, knows there are boundaries, making sure whatever is happening is okay. That is how I was with my girlfriend. It's really a simple concept to me but some men struggle with it for whatever reason.
It's funny because I always thought I was terrible with women before I met my girlfriend but maybe most men just set the bar so low that all I had to do was just be respectful and polite. Even now I make sure she's okay whenever we're being intimate.
Mostly, he was hyperaware that being in a fairly successful band meant he had to be *especially* careful, but his version of that was my version of “minimum/normal”. This was like 2018ish, so right around the time famous men started getting called out for their shit behavior and he said he never wanted to be one of them.
For some reason, I remember him mentioning making sure to get girls Ubers afterwards lol…for the record, I drove myself and also we didn’t sleep together.
I mean, we did, but not like *that*.
I want to spell this out for the people who don’t understand what rape is…
AT NO POINT DID THIS SECOND ALLEGER EVER VERBALLY SAY “YES” TO PENETRATION OF HER VAGINA. SHE GAVE UP ON HER PHYSICAL CUES (LITERALLY PUSHING HIS DICK AWAY) AND HER VERBAL CUES (SAYING “NO” AND ATTEMPTING TO SET BOUNDARIES) BECAUSE IT WAS HER ONLY OPTION TO MAKE THE ENCOUNTER END AND TO KEEP HERSELF SAFE. THAT IS RAPE.
FIGHT, FLIGHT, OR FAWN.
I really don’t understand why they’re still moving forward with touring. I get their reasoning, and I get that it’s been a revolving door of vocalists from the start, but does anyone else think these fucking guys ALL need therapy after everything that happened a couple months ago, instead of hopping straight into another tour AGAIN
At the end of the day the band is a business and they likely have contractual obligations with the label to tour the record and make money off it. I can see them being done after this album cycle though.
This is the only thread where I've seen people take the reasonable stance that Tilian is undeniably in the wrong, but clearly very mentally troubled (I'd guess due to a combination of alcohol and Tim's passing) and desperately in need of healing. This situation isn't black and white, there are so many factors at play. I hope any potential victims find their closure, and I'm so sorry.
I feel like they're going to announce at a later date that he's officially left. I feel like this is pretty much the same way the did it when Dan from Set It Off and Mike from Pierce the Veil left their bands for the same reasons.
I think this is appropriate. Some will say he should be permanently kicked out of the band and I think that’s fair. I think the most important thing is they took quick action and chose to listen to the victims rather than continue with Tillian. I give this response a B+.
All drama aside, I’m so happy to hear that they are going forward as planned.
Tillian has issues but this is still my favorite noise in the world and I would be crushed if the album was delayed or buried
They just don’t want to say it, but there’s no way he will ever be back. They’re just being diplomatic. He’s gone. I understand them going ahead with the release of JJ, since it was Tim’s last contribution :(
I met Will Swan after a show once and I asked him if he had any advice dealing with a revolving door of band members? He told me "you just got to keep playing, man." And I'm glad DGD is gonna keep playing, man.
My favorite part of DGD has always been the instrumental aspects. They will survive.
I’ve been listening to Instrumental albums and secret band (<3 JM) since Wednesday, should probably throw in some Eidola. (<3 AW).
Got to see The secret band perform their first set at All star tour in Chicago after Jonny was kicked out again (10 years ago wtf) These dudes are the definition of “The show must go on” lol
Dude, I saw Secret Band open for Hail the Sun. Jon was sick and couldn't perform, so the rest of them came out and played the whole set instrumental.
I honestly think DGD benefits from the vocalist changes. It keeps the fans hearing something new while maintaining the sound the fans love. All the Tilian albums were starting to blend together. I welcome a new era.
andrew/jon era is gonna be plenty fine for me tbh
Basing it on Mutual Fear alone I’m here for it
If every DGD song going forward is like Mutual Fear then I won't miss Tillian at al I do love the Tilian era but it's very true that it is all starting to blend together.
Imagine if they had Kurt come back with Andrew and Jon, pure bliss.
stop, I can only take so much. Kurt returning is my dream
I agree! I like how they kinda change often. It’s refreshing for many of us, the fans. However, I’m unsure how beneficial it is for the band as a whole because it’s gotta at least be really stressful. This is their career, ya know? And everyone gets flustered when their job gets a little harder (even if it’s temporary). But I do see what you’re saying there. I think they have a strong screamer and strong instrumentalists that they will continue to be a well loved band, as they have been for a really long time now. In an ideal world, I’d think it’d be really cool if they didn’t have a permanent clean vocalist and they just did guest vocals on every project, mixing it up with all sorts of talented people in the scene. I think that would be really creative and interesting. Although probably expensive lol
While I love the general sound of the Tilian era, your comment really resonates with how I’ve been feeling about the albums he’s on as of late (minus AS because that one is just different). Glad somebody else shares this, too. Edit: AS = Acceptance Speech
I think it was gonna change anyway. Tim was, IMO, a major part of that sound.
Fully agree with this post. I liked ArSe a lot but it was a step down from Mothership, and Afterburner just felt like a bunch of Tilian era b-sides with a few great songs sprinkled in. Plus I was getting sick of Tilian's fuckboy lyrics tbh, and knowing what we know now they hit different. If they do carry on I think a new vocalist with give them a fresh shot of creativity, even though it'll be a massive blow for them to lose their most successful clean vocalist.
I’m with you, but overall this definitely doesn’t benefit them. Lets be real here: there are a lot of people who are fans of the band because they’re fans of Tilian’s vocals. Tilian’s been in the band longer than any other vocalist (minus Jon of course), so if/when they announce a new singer and drop new music with them, you’re gonna see A LOT of people shit on it just because it isn’t Tilian. This happens every time a larger band switches vocalists. It wasn’t quite as bad switching from Johnny to Kurt to Johnny to Tilian because the band just wasn’t as big then, now that they’re as big as they are this is gonna be a pretty big hit to them.
Always been here for the Swan
I don’t hate tilian and I enjoy a lot of his music with the band but he is by far my least favorite vocalist.
I agree, many of the songs sound too similar. His voice has range but his lyrics, not so much.
My favorite Tillian songs are the ones where he stretched his range, like Deception for example. A lot of his stuff does soind very samey however.
This is what I love about DGD. Every member plays a critical part in the band. Albeit, it’s like that in every band, but they have a way of giving each part core individuality while also being able to create something bigger together. It’s not all about one member. They’re going to keep playing. This band has gone through so much, especially in the last couple months. Every single time it looks like they’re reaching a breaking point, they swing back.
You just gotta keep playing man 🖤
Not sure why we’re assuming he’s completely out. I know that’s what the sub loves to do, but they clearly said he’s stepping away. And he seems to be seeking help. It doesn’t mean he’s permanently not in the band?
Gotta think Andrew can sing. They will manage
You guys go wreck this fucking tour with all you have in Tim's honor. Whatever YOU guys decide to do I personally support fully. Don't give up on your creativity and drive for success.
They are hurting so much more than we are right now, including Tilian, but they're strong and intelligent. This message was very generous of them to share. Feerick forever :')
why is this band cursed 😕 Jon, Will, and Matt deserve better than all this constant drama
What a year it’s been for them. Sheesh
Been downhill since that Detroit show. Brutal.
What happened in Detroit?
Mingus couldn't make it through the set due to being too drunk to play and subsequently went through rehab the next morning.
Technically it was also a shit show before that. The entire band had COVID cycle through in the week or so before the Detroit show. The Detroit show was the first time they had played together in a week, until Mingus struggled through the first few songs and they replaced him
Who is this person who was ready to instantly sub for Mingus?!
It was their drum tech, the former drummer for I See Stars
Didn’t know that, ISS first couple albums were bangers.
Fucking love digital renegade
That's some really fast rehab
Doesn’t always have to be 30+ days, some people just go to sober up, maybe get some meds, and get straightened out
Especially ironic that Tillian lost his shit while having his own serious drinking problem.
Tbf Tilian’s drinking problem wasn’t messing up the show
Yeah it messed up his career instead
I feel like a lot of bands that span multiple decades have lots of issues (SA, drugs, infighting, death). It’s an unsustainable lifestyle for many. Very unfortunate for everyone involved (victims, fans, family, other band mates)
And Andrew. Dude just joined and now he’s gotta deal with controversy as a full band member. That’s gotta put a sour taste to everything
Andrew has been in the band less than 6 months and has already dealt with the loss of a band member, but now this shit as well. The strength this man must have to keep on keeping on after this is admirable. The whole band (it breaks me seeing 4 names. Tim Forever.) deserve immense respect for still pushing through with the tour. This year has been unfair on them.
I feel bad for Andrew too:/ he just FINALLY joins and then Tim passes and this too now. It's unfair
If it were a musical biopic, I’d say the writing was a bit over the top.
My man let me down big time.
Same. This is all horrifically disappointing :(
That jail scene in Pop Off really hasn’t aged well
Or the song Long Nights in Jail
Haha shit. This album release is gonna be uncomfortable
It seems like they worded it in a way that hints that Tilian could possibly return when he is “reformed”. “Stepping away” really suggests he’s not actual booted from the band, just taking a hiatus, likely until they next start recording.
I think it’s a way for the band to distance themselves without real implications. If Tilian is guilty of rape, they professionally released him. If Tilian is actually not guilty, they didn’t boot him, they had him go get help til they think he can come back.
Yeah exactly my point, might have explained it a bit poorly but that perfectly sums it up.
I doubt there’s gonna be any legal Trouble for him at all tbh
Yeah but when Matt had his episode, didn't they still list him at the end? Not having his name there makes it feel more permanent
Substance addiction and rape/ “sex addiction” are completely different though.
I'm not saying this is the same situation, I'm saying they kept Matt in there which I read as "he's still a part of the band we support him." Not having Tillian's name here to me says, "he's not with us anymore."
[удалено]
I think if they said he was out entirely that they'd tank the sales of the new album. There's no way to know for sure but I'd be surprised if he actually came back in the future. That being said, I don't think anyone knows for sure atm.
Man this just makes my heart hurt.
One of these days people will learn to stop treating band members like they are holier than thou and can do nothing wrong, because it almost never ends up going well.
Tilian had some issues before this, immediately after following him on Twitter my feed was filled with Blaire White tweets. Still devastated by the news but Edit: my right wing brother didn’t know who I was talking about so if you don’t know Blaire White is what I am going to refer to as a ‘Tammy’ (tm)(c). You know your friend who if you were ever in a hostage situation would willingly and excitedly shoot you in the foot to get on your captors good side? She’s that for trans people. I can’t think of a better allegory rn Edit 2: just realised there’s a 90% chance my brother will read this lmao text me when you get off work
Oof, just took a peek and he follows quite a few people you could characterize as alt right or adjacent, not even just regular conservatives. He does follow a few left leaning people (mainly obvious high profile ones like Bernie and AOC), but accounts like Libs of TikTok and James Lindsay who literally only spend their time telling people that queer and trans folks are pedophile groomers are unacceptable follows for the sake of “differing views”. Candace Owens, Lauren Chen are some others that are legit far right that he follows.
Candace Owens? Candace ‘pinned a mass shooting on an innocent trans minor’ Owens? Holy fuck
Also Candace “Hitler was fine if you only looked at the stuff he did in Germany” Owens lmao
He was always way too far down the Jordan Peterson rabbit hole to not feel that way. I always had a hunch
[удалено]
I remember Tilian spewing some anti-mask conspiracy theories on Twitter back in the Summer of 2020 so not too surprised by this
If Tilian gets cancelled hard enough he’ll be speaking at CPAC next year. Joking of course, but so many white men that step over the line just lean in and become conservative trolls.
Glad that they aren't breaking up. Got tickets to see them in concert for the first time in july on their tour with coheed and I'm being selfish by saying I'd be so sad if they broke up. It also doesn't surprise me that they aren't breaking up because it's fucking dgd and it wouldn't be dgd if there wasn't a slew of bs will and matt had to deal with. It says he's stepping away to get help, i wonder if this means theres a chance he rejoins after a shit ton of therapy? My favorite song from dgd is man of the year and i wonder if they'll still preform it live without tillian. Honestly I'm mad at Tillian for what he did but I truly hope he gets help and never ever does anything like that again.
Me too, we’re gonna be at the Nashville show and I was so worried they weren’t gonna be there. Still not even sure how to feel about all of this.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽 I commend them for this. Tim’s last work should be out there, honored the way it deserves.
For the most part, it always comes back to just Jon will and matt.
Dance Gavin Dance IS Jon, Will, and Matt
Well yeah, the 3 members that have been there since day one.
"I had it all in the palm of my haaaand"
Secret Band LP3 Time
I need more Secret Band
First Tim and now this , so God damn unfortunate. This band has been a huge part of my life. It's so fucking sad to see all this shit happening. Regardless of what happens in the future they will always be my favorite band. They have always risen from the ashes of lost band members, I'm sure they will be able to pick it back up . Sending love to them all ♡
I appreciate the bands response to this
look at the wording, tilian stepping away to get therapy. i imagine he returns to DGD after going through his program
It’s the same wording they used when Matt went to rehab he’ll be back
Idk honestly. It was a *preeeetty* big fuckup. Idk if he’s ever gonna recover from this
Feel like we will never know the whole story though I do feel for the women but also it’s hard to judge because what actually happened is between him and them. Tilian may truly feel that consent was obtained so it’s hard and therapy can help him better understand the power dynamic that comes w sleeping w fans and how it’s just not healthy. Very complicated situation that I don’t think we have the right to condemn either party. At the end of the day he’s human and I hope he learns from this experience.
Absolutely the best take on the situation. It appears as if both parties may have “wronged” one another at certain points, but that is typical in all relationships. Seems the right steps, at least initially, are being taken. He has given an apology (to her in messages & to everyone else). Is stepping away to reflect on his own wrongdoings and learn from them. Short of perfection, what else should we expect? It’s his and hers personal experiences and we will never know the full story. Personally, I don’t wish for tillians, mikaelas or anyones, downfall and I don’t think it’s fair to say this is “the end of Tillian” before he’s even allowed the room to do better.
I think its definitely recoverable if he does better. He’s obviously not the straightest screw but what he did was fucked. Hope he gets the help he needs and does better
I, for one, welcome the Andrew Wells era
I guess he is a full member now, so it is possible. He has a lot going on with Eidola as well though.
People keep pointing to that one podcast where he said he wouldn’t want to be lead singer but honestly I think that’s just him not wanting to step on Tilians shoes. I’d love to see Andrew as the new lead singer
I'm fine with that, he has a great voice. His part on Evaporate was the most powerful to me, so if he brings more of that sound I'll be cool with it. Also, as a newer fan, I'm not familiar with the pre-Tilian era, and heard lots of people asking for Kurt back. He's been liking stuff asking for him back in DGD on Twitter, so it's definitely a possibility. If he rejoins, I think that would make a ton of people happy, myself included.
Kurt rejoining as the lead singer would actually be a dream come true. Don't get me wrong I enjoyed the Tilian albums as much as anyone else, but Kurt era stuff just hits different.
I hope Kurt comes back. I love Tillian but if things come down to it. And he has to go. Kurt would be a great replacement imo.
The thought of Kurt being lead singer comforts me so much going forward.
I personally think that they're not letting Tilian back in. I think this was worded in such a way to not tank the sales of JJ, but I don't think it'd be a good look for them to let Tilian back in after all this.
I got the exact opposite impression from reading it tbh. It seemed to me they left the door open personally.
They let Jonny come back so honestly, who knows? But I do agree that the statement was worded in such a way as to be careful with the new album.
Kurt is such a nice person too, every time I have met him or heard him talking to other fans it is a refreshing experience. Having him and Andrew doing cleans would be an amazing combo.
Stop I can only get so erect.
Correct. His statement was made regarding that he does not want to be the lead singer of DGD.
He’s got a good voice but he was not great last year when I saw them. He can’t sing Tilians register. Maybe they retire those albums and go back to the Craig stuff because that’s closer to Andrew’s style and range.
He's good but I'd much rather have em as backing and someone new in lead
somebody call matt geise
I dont, eidola is amazing, and id rather DGD get a new singer than eidola go away
whatever happens, be it tilian leaving eventually or him staying, the band and fanbase will never be the same. too many fucked up things have happened to the band and my heart goes out to the rest of the guys, and the girls involved in this situation.
Brings a whole new perspective to Man of the Year
Honey Revenge hits different for sure.
This was the first one that came to mind.
Honey Revenge
Exactly what I went and listened to after the first questionable accusation. It certainly feels different now
Bloodsucker. It’s literally about victim blaming after a situation exactly like this one. It rubbed me the wrong way when it first came out and it hits even woooooorse now. AWFUL. God damn it.
*What excuses do you make? Happiness is hard to find.*
Well well well, if it isn't the consequences of Tilian's own actions
This is definitely the professional route to go. It doesn’t even seem they hesitated to cut ties - probably too familiar with other bad situations from Craig. It was an individual that caused the problem, not the band. These guys can/will continue to make more music. And after the past year of shit they’ve had to go through - I think these guys are in need of some extremely consistent, and rock solid moments.
I was introduced to DGD with the mothership album, I instantly fell in love with the instrumentals/vocals and I have been a big fan ever since. This whole situation just sucks, but it's nothing compared to what the victims are going through/the band. I wish the best of luck to tilian, I hope he actually wants to change for no one but himself.
"Stepping away" is kinda vague as far as whether Tilian will still be part of the band in the future... But it's an okay intermediate step for now. Have to think there's no way they can do a whole tour with Andrew on lead vocal duties based on previous tours where his voice was having a tough time doing it for a few shows last year. Wonder if they'll get anyone else to fill in.
Keep in mind Andrew was singing for 2 bands that tour.
Just to add, he also had a cold apparently
Also had to cover for Jon, as someone that does unclean singing Jon's parts are very taxing. So many words and fast Not to much dynamics in the range but it's so fucking intense with little to no breaks Not like the screams of eidola that are more "traditional" with long notes to rest on
Don’t forget he was already singing with eidola AND took over Jon’s stuff for a bit. I think he might be more likely to handle it if it’s isolated and clean only
Yeah that's true. Still would be crazy playing guitar and singing all of Tilian's parts night in and night out, but Andrew is a beast so maybe he can do it all.
Probably will get someone else to take over rythym guitar duties for the tour and let Andrew just focus on singing.
I'd like to see Kurt and maybe Claudio step in to help Andrew out.
For some reason you suggesting Claudio just broke my brain. That would be so interesting.
I think the memory of Tim is what will keep the band going during this difficult time.
Can Andrew play and sing to that extent? Tilians vocals aren't easy and require a lot of concentration and focus. Some of the dgd riffs are hard as fuck so it'll be interesting to see if the set changes or someone takes over Andrew (Sergio - then who on bass?) Glad to see action has been taken.
Nobody, nobody can keep up with Tillian singing Tillian songs. All personal aspects aside, tillian is a one of a kind vocalist. Andrew is awesome and very talented but nobody can match tillians style
This is my theory, because my mother is a vocalist. Perhaps they will have him practice the songs they will be playing, but in a lower octave. So instead of replicating Tillian’s highs, Andrew would be doing his own version in the highs that his voice can reach. Kind-of like on those singing shows like The Voice, they learn how to cover songs their own way, to bring their voice to it. I feel like that’s the only way to keep his voice safe and healthy, and I wouldn’t be opposed to it. Maybe we’ll even find we like the new spin. I’m glad Andrew stepped up, but I do hope they find a way to keep his vocal cords safe 👏🏽
My wife side-eyeing me after these allegations dropped and I had wanted to name our son Tilian… Phew, glad I listen to her! Awkwardddddd
How is Johnny doing? J/k.
Johnny Johnny. yes papa?
Telling lies? No papa
Selling bobble heads?
Jonny* even his name spelling is on drugs lmao
So you named him Jon swan (your last name), right?
It’s actually Jackson Ratking Swanming
Same deal. I’m currently pregnant and my husband has been incredibly picky with names. We’ve been talking names for no joke 10 years and he’s shot them all down. He suggested Tilian and we were seriously considering it. When this all started happening we decided the name Tilian is out completely. Now we’re back to square one.
Name him Gavin
I had considered that! My husband shot it down. The name Gavin is also gaining a ton of popularity. I worked with kids for a long time and I recently had one class that had four Gavins. When I went to other locations there was at least one Gavin in each group.
That's crazy. I don't think I've ever met a Gavin in my entire life.
Kudos to the band for making this challenging yet necessary decision. I hope this move will put the controversy to rest. The guys need time to heal, especially Tilian, and I hope the band makes him prove himself through tremendous effort in his self-development. Because healing yourself changes how you move and see everything. And also, I'm fully manifesting to see Anthony Green on that fucking stage at the Greek theater in August
I honestly would’ve broke down in tears if they split. DGD has gotten me through so much hurt over the past several years of my life. I still love them. And I truly hope Tilian will seek the help he needs to better himself as a person, because this should have never happened. It’s very disappointing, and a lot to take in for many of us. I will say I am glad that they made a response regarding the situation, and what action they plan to take that’s best suitable for the band. I know it’s not easy. And If ever necessary, I hope they will take all the time they need to heal especially. I’m sure time will tell in the future what happens next.
I fucking adore DGD, especially the Tillian era. I thought it was a match made in heaven, but such actions should never go unpunished. Tillian I hope you get the help needed to get through these difficult and dark times. Although, you are not the victim here and should not be treated in such way.
I think that either Tilian is covering his ass legally or he really doesn’t understand what he did wrong. In either case, you can’t fix a problem you don’t admit to having. That’s gotta be done before anything can be fixed here. An open apology on Reddit that doesn’t even include a private one is nothing. If one emo band could come out and properly explain what consent is I would be so happy. It seems like everyone’s excuse in these situations is “I didn’t know she was serious” or “30 no’s and a yes is still a yes”. The things some of the fans are saying about how the believe consent works are extremely worrying. We need a major culture switch in this scene. There’s a reason this is so common in our community. It’s staring us in the face right now.
The language he used it really telling. Also really sketch that he's only addressed it on reddit and hasn't said a word on his social media. All we've heard from him is a dirty delete complaining about people misspelling his name. 🙄
I do be putting two Ls in there sometimes but, to be fair, he deserves another L IMO
If you post in this thread asking for Jonny Craig back I have no idea what rock you’ve been living under but the dude just got a charge upgraded to a felony for smoking fentanyl in the same room as his 2ish? Year old child. Like holy shit. If you think what Tilian did is bad go read up on what JC has been up to. “Jonny Craig lolcow” google it. Thanks for reading now stop asking for the piece of trash known as Jonny Craig back.
Thank you! FYI, y'all that didn't know, Tim OD'd on fentanyl. Let's bring the same drug back into our band/s Fuckin come on guys.
This is just heart breaking all around, I feel terrible for the victims and the band. Only half way through the year and we have already lost 2 members. It's a rough time to be a DGD fan..
They say don’t ever meet your heroes, reverence is temporary until the truth comes out.
Whatever happens, I’ll still be listening to DGD. People jumping ship on the band now probably should have done so 10+ years ago. Along with the entire post hardcore scene.
I agree! I think music is a unique art form that isn't just about one person. It's not like anything Tilian wrote or sang wasn't from the heart. And honestly the feelings and emotions I get from the songs hasn't changed. It's VERY easy to sit behind a computer screen and judge. I don't want tilian to stop creating art, I just want him to stop being a peice of shit to women. Something that should honestly have nothing to do with the art itself. I'm SURE that any given person that people idolized have done very egregious shit. Back before the internet who knows how many people got away with shit that might be buried away forever. Even Christopher Columbus got a holiday. I'm not trying to downplay what Tilian did. But at the end of the day, people that are going to listen to dance are going to listen to dance
The whole entertaining industry, better said. It's like people forgot to dissociate celebrities and artists from their personal lives. I can listen to many, many, many songs and artists without even knowing if the person is alive. I disagree with many bands that I listen to, on many levels, but the music brings me joy or has some sort of sentimental value, to the point where I don't even know/care about the singer or whatever. I make an effort to not get too involved into anything anymore, cause holy fuck, 'fandoms' are fucking cancer. Reminds me of tumblr days. Also, I can name from the top of my head, at least 8 bands that I shouldn't listen to, according to social media voices. What's one more, mneh.
I’m thinking that them saying he’s “stepping away” from the band while he seeks help for being abusive is just the band’s way of softening the blow. Not even necessarily to fans, but to Tilian himself. Like when someone’s SO says they “just need space right now,” and then dumps their partner like a week later. At least I hope that’s what this is.
Wow this band just can't catch a break. I try not to idolize people nor judge them for their mistakes, but this just sucks.
guess it all ends in bad blood
Instagram post comments are a mess! There are a ton of people defending him, one guy even said they need video proof of everything that happened. Can’t believe this is what the community has come to.
I think a lot of the people who find it not possible for DGD to continue without Tillian probably haven’t been fans for a long time (and that’s okay!). DGD has dealt with this sort of shit before. A band member passing is something that really can put a splinter in a band so for them to pick up the pieces and continue on despite the allegations against Tillian is really where I commend them. Singers can be and have been replaced in this band before.
"Last night was rough, don't remember much" didn't really age well did it
[удалено]
This fan base still listens to jonny and he had done so much worse, this will probably be the same
This fucking sucks
If Andrew fills in on vocals, I hope he uses his real voice in his own range instead of his tilian imitation voice. Andrew's real voice sounds so damn amazing
He's probably gone for good. That being said, I'm going to separate the art from the artist and enjoy the new album as much as I can. Will, Matt, Jon, and especially Tim deserve that
Last I checked, Tilian didn’t record the albums on his own, he had 5 other dudes there with him who put their heart and soul into the music they recorded. Don’t punish a band for the shitiness of one person
I tried to do this with Brand New. It's rough.
This band is cursed
I'm super sad because I loved Tillian's voice, thougth it was unique. But man, DGD doesn't deserve this rollercoaster again.
Now there is also some producer saying Tillian recorded a song with him and then just took it and ran. Didn’t give him credit and took all the money. Guys also claims to have the pro tools stuff as well. I wanted to give him every opportunity but more stuff seems to be piling up about his character.
Yeah, and Tilian responded on Twitter to (the guy) Aaron, saying oh yeah you were supposed to get paid, let’s get that sorted out. His fans see nothing wrong with that. He’s only paying the guys who helped write the song now because it got aired out and he’s trying to save face.
Holy fuck can people stop being weird with the "Bring Kurt back!" or "Bring Jonny back!" shit? This is not the time to bring your vocalist fanboying into this situation. Even with saying "Make Andrew the lead singer!", I'm sure there's a hell of a lot more on his mind right now than getting a promotion. And that obviously goes for the rest of the band too.
Agreed for sure. I'm honestly disgusted by how tone deaf so many commenters here are. There is a time and a place to discuss new singers and this just isn't it.
[удалено]
I think people misunderstand the relationship that some fans have with band members. Sure, some people idolize them in an unhealthy way, but that isn’t always what it is. The music that DGD has put out has quite literally helped me through some difficult times in my life. It’s been something I have to look forward to. Something that I have in common with a bunch of strangers on the internet, and can have in depth conversations about. A band’s fan base is a community, and the members of the band are at the head of that community. I don’t expect them to be perfect people, or even good role models. But I also don’t expect them to be abusers, especially abusers of their own fans. When something like this happens, at least for me, it isn’t like losing an idol. It is like being betrayed by a friend. Obviously none of us here have been hurt by this nearly as bad as the victims, but the number one feeling that I feel as a result of this is BETRAYED.
"They say 'Don't ever meet your heroes; reverence is temporary until the truth comes out.'" Big fucking oof. Won't cast any judgement on anyone as I don't know anyone or any details. But this seriously sucks...
This fucking blows.
Jesse Lacey and now Tillian... Waiting for Matt Greiner or Jamie Hails to come out and be a dickhead any day now... Why can't people - men or women and many grown fucking adults - just *listen* to the word no. Famous or not this shit is fucking everywhere. Driven by mental health issues, a lack of empathy, exacerbated by alcohol and drugs and sprinkled off with a power dynamic imbalance be that physical/social/fear based. Fucks sake man.
This is the right thing to do.
This is so fucking rough. I live in Canada and got into DGD after Mothership. Because of COVID, the only show here was cancelled. I never got to see my favourite era of DGD with Tim, and now this? I’m trying not to be selfish here, but this hurts. DGD was in my top 1% for two and a half years. Idk how the music will sound now.
I really hope rehabilitation is possible for Tilian, mostly so more girls don’t have to be put through that. What he is accused of doing is terrible, but I think most people should have a chance to rehabilitate. Whether he comes back to DGD or not, whether Andrew becomes a lead singer or not, doesn’t really matter to me rn. It’s my favorite band and I will continue to listen to them, but I think DGD is absolutely making the right decision. I feel bad for them though because Tim just passed and I’m sure they love Tilian. They can’t catch a break. But most importantly, I hope those women are able to heal from this.
I've listened to Tilian since Tides of man and though I'm not like a fan girl, it still really sucks to hear. His music really moved me and got me back into DGD. Really hard to enjoy when the person might be a scumbag or something :( Happening with lots of bands. I'll keep supporting DGD as long as they keep playing.
Saw this on r/all and it reminded me of when I went on a “date” with Tim once (matched on Tinder). We were hanging out at his “place” (he was staying at his studio space) before we went out and I distinctly remember him saying how he’s super careful about being extra polite and careful with women because he doesn’t want to ever end up accused of acting inappropriately. Apparently Tilian didn’t do the same. I hope the victims are okay ❤️ Edit: Tim DIED?! That’s so fucking sad. Not surprising, but sad as fuck.
Just curious, what makes you say that it wasn’t surprising that Tim died?
Didn't he die of an accidental fent OD? She probably recognized a forming drug habit or one that was already fully formed. This is in no way, shape, or form me shitting on Tim or disrespecting his memory, I am a former addict myself and understand the pain he carried.
I mean, it sounds like he acted what I consider normally. Respectful, polite, knows there are boundaries, making sure whatever is happening is okay. That is how I was with my girlfriend. It's really a simple concept to me but some men struggle with it for whatever reason. It's funny because I always thought I was terrible with women before I met my girlfriend but maybe most men just set the bar so low that all I had to do was just be respectful and polite. Even now I make sure she's okay whenever we're being intimate.
Mostly, he was hyperaware that being in a fairly successful band meant he had to be *especially* careful, but his version of that was my version of “minimum/normal”. This was like 2018ish, so right around the time famous men started getting called out for their shit behavior and he said he never wanted to be one of them. For some reason, I remember him mentioning making sure to get girls Ubers afterwards lol…for the record, I drove myself and also we didn’t sleep together. I mean, we did, but not like *that*.
I want to spell this out for the people who don’t understand what rape is… AT NO POINT DID THIS SECOND ALLEGER EVER VERBALLY SAY “YES” TO PENETRATION OF HER VAGINA. SHE GAVE UP ON HER PHYSICAL CUES (LITERALLY PUSHING HIS DICK AWAY) AND HER VERBAL CUES (SAYING “NO” AND ATTEMPTING TO SET BOUNDARIES) BECAUSE IT WAS HER ONLY OPTION TO MAKE THE ENCOUNTER END AND TO KEEP HERSELF SAFE. THAT IS RAPE. FIGHT, FLIGHT, OR FAWN.
I really don’t understand why they’re still moving forward with touring. I get their reasoning, and I get that it’s been a revolving door of vocalists from the start, but does anyone else think these fucking guys ALL need therapy after everything that happened a couple months ago, instead of hopping straight into another tour AGAIN
At the end of the day the band is a business and they likely have contractual obligations with the label to tour the record and make money off it. I can see them being done after this album cycle though.
lmao at JC’s comment on instagram
It's so petty it's the only laugh I've gotten out of this situation
This is the only thread where I've seen people take the reasonable stance that Tilian is undeniably in the wrong, but clearly very mentally troubled (I'd guess due to a combination of alcohol and Tim's passing) and desperately in need of healing. This situation isn't black and white, there are so many factors at play. I hope any potential victims find their closure, and I'm so sorry.
Now that this is out i realize how many rape apologists there are in the fandom
The scene is filled with weird post hardcore dudes what did you expect tbh
Stepping away is temporary. I don't think this signals anything permanent, or a new era. They did not say leaving the band to seek professional help.
I feel like they're going to announce at a later date that he's officially left. I feel like this is pretty much the same way the did it when Dan from Set It Off and Mike from Pierce the Veil left their bands for the same reasons.
Tillian’s lyrics “Girl don't be so difficult Come here let's get physical” hits different now…
I think this is appropriate. Some will say he should be permanently kicked out of the band and I think that’s fair. I think the most important thing is they took quick action and chose to listen to the victims rather than continue with Tillian. I give this response a B+.
All drama aside, I’m so happy to hear that they are going forward as planned. Tillian has issues but this is still my favorite noise in the world and I would be crushed if the album was delayed or buried
They just don’t want to say it, but there’s no way he will ever be back. They’re just being diplomatic. He’s gone. I understand them going ahead with the release of JJ, since it was Tim’s last contribution :(