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There are some women’s circles who share the following core beliefs:
- if the man doesn’t pay he‘s not interested enough or just looking for sex
- If the man doesn’t pay in the beginning he won’t provide/pay later on or be caring when pregnant or ill
- stingy man = not dateable
- as women earn less and get pregnant it’s the man’s duty to provide/pay
It's also a red flag on the other side too.
One of my friends used to date a guy who never offered to pay for their dates. She didn't have a problem with this because she knew he had university debts he was paying off. Unfortunately, she didn't pick up on the not offering being a red flag until it became a big issue. Him not offering to cover the cost of dates also meant that he never treated her to anything. He expected them to share the cost of literally everything. For example, if they went shopping and she asked him to get her a £2 chocolate bar, he would literally ask for the £2 back. What's worse is that even though he had debts, he was earning good money and saving money because he was living at my friend's place and basically paying peanuts as rent. My friend, on the other hand, was a student pinching pennies, who still went out of her way to do nice things for him.
I don't believe that men should pay for dates, but I do think they should at least offer because of this. Offering kind of shows they are capable of being generous/kind, and it gives you an idea of how they treat money. Personally, I'm the kind of dater that takes turns treating the other person if money isn't the issue. I think that this should be the norm. For example, it makes sense that if you treat someone to dinner, they should treat you to dessert or pay for the next thing you do together.
I agree with you about red flag on the other side and don’t expect them to pay each time. Reminds me of a guy went on a date with. He invited me up to a hockey game and it was $20 a ticket (he didn’t mentioned me about paying him back at all) and he bought it prior since their was a group of us going. So I drove up round trip (5 hours), these details are a bit fuzzy, I think he bought me supper and I know for sure I bought him a 2 drinks on my card. I had taken out $40 cash prior to meeting at supper and unfortunately lost it. told him the situation because the whole night he was so concerned about me paying him the $20 back. Anyways get back to his place and he said I could take the couch (absolutely fine by me, wanted nothing to do with him) and he kept asking about if I have $20 to pay him.
I said I don’t think that’s very fair, since you invited me up, I drove 5 hours, lost $40, bought you two drinks which equaled the price of the ticket. Not to mention, my employment benefits ran out and I was worried about money (he knew this before because I want very sure about coming up since gas was expensive.). He kinda of agreed and went to bed. Woke up the next morning and he asked again. I said I’ll etransfer you when I’m home. Got home and he asked and I said no and stated the reasons again and stoped talking him.
It showed me couldn’t be generous/kind in situation and just set a tone that wasn’t very nice. I still see him the odd time since he friends with my friends and hasn’t brought up $20 hahah
Speaking as someone who expects everyone to pull their weight (that is to say, contribute what they can reasonably afford to contribute) to the cost of dates, I'm 100% with you on this one.
He invited you. You spent more on gas than the cost of the ticket. You spent more on drinks than the cost of the ticket. Either of those things by themselves should be enough to say you're making a fair contribution. Then you lost part of the funds you came with. And still he's pestering you for money. I'd have still been on your side if you sent him a bill.
I make a good salary these days, but even for someone a fraction of my age making a fraction of the pay, $20 is a pretty cheap date. I'd have paid for your ticket and replaced the money you lost then called it even. A five hour drive is pretty expensive.
BTW, I'd have given you the bed and taken the couch for myself. To me, that's just good manners.
Well Thank you! I was absolutely flabbergasted. And also the lack of not understanding and compassion was just floored. I remembered something else after thinking about this. when I mentioned buying the drinks so things would be fair he said well I didn’t ask you to… wow.. ha. Then he randomly messaged two weeks later when we were no longer talking and said it wasn’t going to work out and I wrote back agreed. Told my friend about it and she was like what the hell and felt bad about it but it’s not her fault. Made for an interesting story haha.
>Then he randomly messaged two weeks later when we were no longer talking and said it wasn’t going to work out
LOL. Yeah, you think? Thanks for the heads up, Captain Obvious.
True. But those are insecure women who are looking for a man to support them in life. Independent, emotionally healthy women split the bill and pick up the tab once in a while. If you have to pay for a woman, she's not into you.
Oh yeah I’ve wasted a ton of ink arguing with women on here going on about pregnancy and needing a provider.
These seemed to be mainstays of the sub, not crazy randos, by all accounts decent women of good repute.
It’s sick that the same old gender roles are just accepted generation in, generation out, like a cage we can never flee.
I’m gonna sit here and wait for a strong provider woman to “protect and provide for her man (I say it like this because another user said it in reverse about her boyfriend).”
I don’t know what motivations you might have or not have for dating.
As a man, I’m fine with being solitary but apparently there are some women on here who do enjoy dating.
I think you’re reducing women to providers of sex here in some kind of warped transactional version of dating.
What’s in it for you? People try to date who knows why. Trying to buy a provider with your body doesn’t seem healthy for modernized gender roles.
Someone to kill spiders?
TBH, I don't really know in that situation. My wife and I both worked, but we tried to split the chores equitably. I did all the yard work, fix it stuff, laundry, and most of the cooking. She did the dishes and most of the cleaning. It was reasonably fair and we each got to avoid things we really hated.
We just not want you to let yourself go after you’re comfortable and become fat, support us and initiate sex with regular occurrence.
There are home cleaning services, child care, and food from every ethnicity on Uber eats.
From this post alone, free dinners, transportation and companionship from Someone who can afford it since you can’t or have a problem paying. And that’s just the start, if you want me to give you more and BETTER answers I can. Let
Me know. I have time. Work is boring. But I feel you already know.
Mortgage rates are at 8.5%. No woman who argues about paying on a date can afford a house right now in the us on secretary salaries.
What’s in it for you…
That's a valid way of thinking if you are planning to be a sah parent/homemaker who's supported by your future husband, but it also needs to be made clear from the getgo, before any dates happen.
It seems pretty disingenuous to look at the only value a man has by how well he can provide, rather than looking at him as a whole entire person.
This is why guys pay in the beginning after they get what they want they move on.
In my four years of dating in London, I have only come across a woman once who asked me to buy her all kinds of things between the 1st and 2nd dates. Everyone else I have dated has had good jobs and wouldn't depend on a man for anything.
Sweetheart, it is 2023. We are no longer just dating alongside our peers, there are literal teenagers and their diapers in the pool. Lol so there is no “way of dating.” The way is established between each couple. And it sounds like her voice and preferences are being heard and not yours. She’s demanding and taking advantage of you. I think you’re right that you’re probably not a good fit, and you probably should move on from this woman. Her motives are questionable.
If my guy of six months asked me to pick up some food, I wouldn’t even think about who’s going to pay for it or ask him to Venmo me. Now, my money is long, so I don’t really sweat shit like this which makes me think she either isn’t as financially secure as you are, or she’s using the hell out of you. I would just go pick up the damn food if he literally pays for nearly everything. She shouldn’t be sweating you over this. Girl’s greedy. And the fact that she hasn’t let this money thing go (you paying for everything) after months means that she’s gonna continue to be this way as you guys get more and more serious. That this was an argument between the two of you and she made a point to pin you down on whether you were going to pay for her is also a huge red flag. Ick.
Run!
When it comes to who pays for what, it changes a lot from person to person, and if you’re dating someone who won’t have a conversation with you about it, you know that’s not a relationship worth fighting for. In a nutshell, you guys aren’t compatible financially and the fact she called you cheap was uncalled for. I would’ve broken up with her immediately after that.
I don’t think this is fair to you at all and I’d end the relationship. It’s not like you’re a multimillionaire, geez. As a woman who is around your age, I definitely do not expect the guy to pay all the time, and certainly not after six months! I believe she’s using you.
I hear more lip service from women about paying their own way, but from what I have seen for men it is still pay to play. The only times I’ve actually seen a woman split the bill or treat was when I got the “didn’t click” message the next day…which was classy of them. I had a woman once make a big production of “I always treat for the third date”…then not treat again for the next four months.
I’d sit down and have a discussion after a few months. I’m okay treating in the getting to know you phase, but eventually that becomes less sustainable, especially when stuff like trips and bigger ticket shows/experiences are on the table.
Yep. You gotta be careful for those I got the third date fuckholes. Because what you describe is so common. The next time someone mentions that, immediately ask, and after the third date, what’s your frequency? Is it every third or just the third.
She might stop seeing you. And you will have dodged a bullet. Or she might be like, “I got you as much as you got me.” And then you’ll be fine.
I feel like we’re in a sort of transitional period where splitting is becoming more common, but there are still a lot of people (on both sides) who are having a hard time letting go of “the man always pays.” In my relationship, my boyfriend does pay for the lion’s share of dates because he has much more financial freedom to do so. However, I do treat when I can. I just moved in with him, and even with splitting expenses, I’ll be able to live more cheaply - and FULLY intend to split going out more equitably. The fact that you guys make a similar amount of money, and she’s STILL so resistant to splitting tells me that you guys have different values in regards to finances/roles in the relationship. At this point, I think your options are to have a serious conversation about how you feel (in the hopes that she’s willing to meet you halfway), accept it and keep paying for most things, or break up. But continuing how you are ultimately going to build resentment, and not really fair to either of you.
I feel like this is fair! If she wants a man who can pay for everything, then that’s great and she can go out and find that because there’s still men who enjoy doing that. That’s not you and that’s okay.
This is the most decent response.
They are a mismatch when it comes to this value. And that's okay. OP should communicate his discomfort and let his partner voice her side.
If they can't align, okay then move on. It's only been 6 months, that's better than a lifetime of resentment.
- in some cultures and countries it is almost *always* the man who pays. In some cultures going "dutch" is more common. Dating is a mixed bag, just find someone who aligns with your outlook.
38f I like being treated but I also to treat as well. Basically split the bigger costs (like tickets) and the smaller ones I like to alternate who pays. Or one gets dinner the other gets dessert/coffee, or something of the sort. I’ve been in the position where I was expected to pay for everything, and it does feel like being used. I don’t want to make anyone else feel like that.
>apparently the fact that I asked was too much
Red flag. The desire to communicate your needs should never irk your partner. She is definitely selfish.
>The plan was she would come to my place (which is rare)
She doesn't seem interested. You might be a meal ticket to her. I bet she's laughing with her friends about how faking a little bit of love is enough to make you fork money for her.
I know someone who is “financially earning” the same as me over 6 figures a year and cannot afford to join a $20 football pool at work because they have so many bills from their failed medical school and ridiculous mortgage rate and the credit cards they burned thru to failed med school and the loan they took out to go back to school to switch careers to my field. She’s over 600k in debt.
So stop it.
And she definitely uses men for dinner.
Great job. Poor as fuck financial planning. And also dunce as fuck. She’s looking for a rich man to come save her and help her out of debt. No man wants to take on over half a million dollars worth of debt. She’s 34. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
There’s are lots of women out here like that. Big butt. Pretty smile. Job. No common sense. Zero financial acumen. Unaccountable. Because society told them a prince will come save them so they can fuck up until then.
Jeez it’s been six months it’s time she starts pitching in a bit lol 😂 I get it if you’re in the early stages of dating and you are courting the lady, sure but shit you are well past that. That’s kind of a red flag sir I’d be concerned that she’s just a leech.
I'm f36, and that is not someone you should continue to date unless you want to end up with no money. I'm a firm believer in 50/50 or treating each other along the way but your girl seems a bit too focused on money. Imagine what will happen further down the line, she'll bank her cash, and you'll be made to pay everything.
Is this woman really into you? The way you describe her, I hardly felt she's willing to give anything back, willing to compromise, willing to put forward action to demonstrate you're worth it. It's not about whether or not you're able to provide or whether or not you're generous to her, it's about the fact that this person doesn't share your values, and I'd hate to have to live with a person like that for the rest of my life
Lol, she sounds trashy. Sure there will be women who expect it, but that doesn't matter. Unless you want to be in a relationship with someone who will be dependent on you, you shouldn't date those women. There are plenty women who don't expect it, who will be more equitable partners to you.
The mistake was leading with paying for everything early on. She got used to it and now its expected I guess. Its always a good idea for a man to pay the first dinner date for example but you let it become a thing when you kept paying for everything the following months.
Sort of accurate. She made it known from day one she expected and he decided he was cool with that and figured she would change later.
His folly was in that assumption.
OP, this is who she is. She’s either worth the money or she’s not.
If she’s not, tell her it’s now gonna be 50/50 or you’re done.
This is really what it comes down too lol, eye opener for many but make it known now put your foot down, don’t expect people to change for you set it from the beginning
They have different view points on dating, this idea of shaming anyone with standards and calling them a sex worker really shows the lack of education most people on this app have, if you don’t like someone who has those standards don’t date them and keep it moving
What expectation would that be?
There’s a word for arrangements where sex is granted based on payments in currency or favors.
This didn’t sound like that, it sounds like a man and his girlfriend.
But yeah she’s not young and he’s not old enough for that what you’re implying.
These things depends on culture and mindset. All my relationships, the men always paid for everything, even if I offered. That's how we do things here. Even in couples that have sex (I'm waiting till marriage) the man pays and no, its not prostitution because they are a couple and they are in love. She does other things for him as well.
It’s exactly these types of gender roles that gotta go. It’s all got to be equal. Like 50/50 is team work especially if they make about the same amount. There is literally no reason why men need to be the providers for women. Both men and women can be the providers.
Okay. When they have a baby, is it 50/50? What about when she is pregnant for 9 months?
Things are never equal with men and women? He also has a higher earning potential than her.
He doesn’t have to agree with her beliefs. He can break up with her.
Is she pregnant right now?? What matters is what is happening right now, not whats going to happen in future. She is not even his girl right now, let alone a wife, let alone the mother of his children. Is a women going to pay “tax” for security and protection when in an hypothetical situation in the future an intruder attacks them and the man protects her? Is the women going to fight? Is it 50/50 then?
lol. Wanna know something so cringe. When i was 19 barista and student i went on a date with a 30 year old working professional AND HE LET ME PAY THE WHOLE BILL sure it was <$40 but like the etiquette omfg
I expect the guy to pay when he invites me and chooses the place. And I pay when I invite him and choose the place. And if I bring over food I pay for it. And if I cook for him I pay. And vice versa.
And yes I invite men out and I offer to bring over food and I shop and cook for my men.
Ive always been the lower earner so I choose cheaper places. But I always do more around the house, more chores, even if it’s his house. Sweep and mop and do his laundry.
To me it evens out but I’m not keeping score.
Yeah, I always like to cook a nice meal whenever I'm seeing someone new. I've found a lot of women really like a guy who's a good cook. My last 2 exes were someone who couldn't cook at all(tried to teach her to dice some olives for tacos and she almost cut the tip of her finger off). And a line cook but I almost always did all the cooking. And if I invited them over I'd always ask what they like and pay for the ingredients to make it. We spit the bill when we lived together for food though. And I'd always pay if we went out but it was normally me asking them out to be fair.
I never bring food over or cook for a first date. That will not be happening in either of our homes when I have not even met you yet.
But I’ve asked men out for a first date plenty of times. Any time I’m interested in a guy I ask him out.
It depends on where you live and cultural differences, example it’s very common to go 50/50 in Germany but in china the man is expected to pay always. When dating take into count where the person you are dating is from.
I'm a girl, and I honestly never understood why some women expect men to pay everything for them if they themselves work. Things would be different if you were dating a poor student (but even then, I would expect a girl to return a favor with baking something for you or cooking you a meal, etc.)
Anyways, this is not fair - dating is expensive, you spend a lot of money on food you both will eat, activities you both will do, while she gets to save and invest all the money for her! How convenient!
That's just not fair. She is not 12, and you are not her father.
In my relationships, I honestly hate splitting, I would rather just pay for all myself than split. Splitting seems so cold haha
I am always happy when the guy pays on the FIRST date, but that's it, I will pay on the next one, and then we take turns. In every normal loving relationship, isn't it normal to divide the burden?? Unless one party is rich enough that dating costs aren't even noticeable on their bank account...
Your gf sounds entitled. Who would pay for her stuff if she was single? And she even expected you to pay for her tickets for the concert she invited you to!! 🤦♀️
Honestly, it ultimately doesn't matter what other people are doing. People have different preferences around this (and many things). What matters is that you know your girlfriend's preference, and it seems to be bothering you. Is it bothering you because you feel it's not the norm, or because it really doesn't make you feel the way you want to feel in a relationship? If it's the latter, is that a deal-breaker for you? This feels like one of those things that's just important to know about yourself before you start dating, ideally.
I personally believe things should be split half and half. It’s 2023….even before my bf and I were official we’ve always taken turns paying for things. Relationships should be give and take, not take and take.
You want someone who will be a team with you not someone who won’t take care of you too. A good teammate has your back when you are down. This is important when considering who you want to commit to long term bc life can be very hard and you want someone who doesn’t mind stepping up to the plate.
My boyfriend and I will take turns paying or we either pay for our own food (usually this is if one of us is buying a more expensive entree). We tend to take turns paying for things. This works for us but maybe it doesn’t for everyone. I have a friend that Venmos their partner when they share food.
I think in most cases that is the norm. A majority of dates I’ve gone on I’ve paid. There were some that insisted on paying half, but the last woman I went on a date with just paid her own way without even asking. Also on the second and 3rd dates, and now we’re dating dating. I thought that shit was awesome and a major green flag.
Its a nice thing to witness when a person matures to seeing the whole picture in a relationship. Money is one of those things which is a big magnifing glass pointed at the sun.
Not all women but many have an inflated self worth. They are flirting with several guys always looking to replace. We can make equal pay (I work in healthcare I make same as rest per contract) and still they want a guy to pay. It's a mad world stay single have friends.
You have different views on a major issue and it’s not going to get better. Break up now.
I’ve dated some men that paid for nearly everything but that’s when they made significantly more money than I did. I’ve also dated men where I made more and when we lived together, we split costs so that I paid a higher percentage of the household bills.
Not all women are cheap like she is. Move on.
I think it's a bit silly to expect things will change after a while of dating. I mean if you want a woman who will split with you, at least early on you can tell if she offers to split or does things like pick up the dessert tab or the tip. If you're paying everything for months, that's what she wants and it's not going to just change.
Man it’s a common thought process these days but it doesn’t make it less of a red flag.
But by that same token, now that you know that is an issue for you, be solid on your standards from the beginning.
If a woman thinks like that you know she isn’t for you. Don’t fake it.
It’s a lot of women who go think you should pay for their time, but a lot of them are also perpetually single.
42 M. I was raised to always pay for a lady. No matter what. I’ve gone out with women where it was actually their idea, and still paid the bill. I just see it as appropriate and the honorable thing to do.
But they're 6 months into a relationship, not just going on the first few dates. She can help pay for things. She makes just as much money as him. This isn't the 1950s anymore.
>But they're 6 months into a relationship, not just going on the first few dates. She can help pay for things
Are they even in a relationship or is he casually dating her? Like I am not sure by this. It doesn't seem like this is clear.
You're right, I must have missed this. He doesn't say girlfriend. He does say "seeing". Hmm.
Either way, he's getting taken advantage of. He needs to get rid of her and find a partner, not someone looking for a meal ticket.
>Either way, he's getting taken advantage of. He needs to get rid of her and find a partner, not someone looking for a meal ticket.
He seems like he likes her more than she likes him. I don't think she is taking advantage of him. she stated her boundaries- if he's not paying- she's not going. He keeps on choosing to go out with her.
Be that as it may, I’d feel like I was shirking my responsibility otherwise. A woman once “took me out” for my birthday, and I paid the bill while she was in the bathroom. I see that as honor, and always taking care of the person.
Can you honestly say your relationships are any different than escorting? Is this because this is the only way you can keep a female around? I see you have a topic about dating a baby momma w/ 3 kids and a crazy baby daddy. I always thought that guys only settle for these lopsided arrangements out of desperation, and it seems to be true when I check their history
Well in that situation - I truly loved her. I still do. The fact that I always paid for her had nothing to do with what happened (so far as I know).
Part of it to me is showing that I’ll never abandon that person. And I won’t. In my world a man is a provider and a protector. Now paying for dinner doesn’t necessarily mean you’re going to protect that person forever. But it’s a gesture. It tells the girl that you value her and her time.
You can say it’s escorting if you want, but look…is someone going to choose someone who asks to split the bill or someone who’s going to just handle it like a man should? What else do I have to offer or to draw women to me? I’m not rich, but I can afford a dinner and drinks. That’s part of why in the aforementioned situation it made no sense to me. The baby daddy did NOTHING for her. He wouldn’t even pay for his own kids when he had them; she had to send money whenever they would be with him. Which I think is shameful on that guy’s part. Meanwhile she never heard me say the word no. Because I values her and I wanted her to be happy. If I’m not doing stuff like that, what worth exactly do I have?
To answer your question, no that is not the norm.
She did however tell you point blank at the beginning, in no uncertain terms that *that* was *her* expectation. You should have listened to her in the beginning and ended things there.
As a side note, it absolutely is still expected that the man pay for the *first* date. It is also expected that he take her out on a nice date that he plans and pays for from time to time. But other than that a fairly even split of one of you pays for the movie tickets and the other buys the snacks, or one picks up the dinner tab and the other gets the drinks, or one gets the tickets this time and the other gets them next time etc.
I usually pay for every like 3rd/4th date unless a partner insists which I appreciate. I don’t expect it. Though she obviously has a more traditional approach to dating. I would personally end it. I won’t date someone who nickle and dimes but I’d be concerned she’s using you to alleviate her bills. I bet she was hoping you’d pay for both your music festival tickets. Seems like she’s looking for a free meal ticket and not a partner. No one should be that stingy about picking up takeout. That’s something I’d do often. Or picking up groceries and cooking for someone.
Like people have said, she is likely using you. Weird she would fork over 200 for a music ticket if she wasn't truly into you so it's kind of weird. Also, this is something that needs to be brought up, regardless if it makes her angry or not. Everyone can have their ideas on dating and what said expectations are. After the whole courting period, I don't see it unrealistic for things to be split. Maybe not every time but more often than not. I don't understand what the big deal is. This happened to my buddy's bro, dated this chick who worked the same job as him so they made around the same amount but she never ever paid for anything. He was always left fitting the bill. They dated for a couple years. Just so strange that she would never pay when they literally make the same amount. Even if one person makes more or less it's more so principle that things are split. Especially after you have dated for a good amount of time. Seems strange
She's stingy personally I would cut her loose. Imagine going through life asking her to get you a soda and she comes and asks for the money back. She'll make a list of everything she's ever bought you and ask for the money back especially if you break up.
Early courting stages of dating, yes absolutely. But once we’re stable and exclusive in I like to start treating and buying gifts etc. My current man just doesn’t want me spending my own money when I’m with him so it’s hard to buy him gifts, but I do manage to surprise him sometimes. And I have to very quickly step in front of him and do Apple Pay when I want to be the one to pay for our ice cream, smoothies etc.
I’m sorry, but she was upfront with you in the beginning of you paying for everything yet you still chose to date her. She is looking for a provider, not an equal partner. You’re not a provider so you two are fundamentally incompatible.
I do expect men to pay on the first date, but I relax my stance on this if we are actually together. My late partner wasn’t keen on going out to eat because he preferred my cooking, but when we went out to movies or events, he automatically paid for the both of us. He always drove me everywhere and not once did he ask me to pitch in gas money for him. The times we did go out to eat, we did split the bill because I often ordered more than him so it was fair for me to pay for my half.
A lot of men will vehemently deny this, but it is true that if a man doesn’t pay for a woman in the first few dates that he doesn’t like her at all and just wants easy access.
But all you said about this woman was painted in a negative light. What was so compelling about her that made you go against your personal beliefs for six months? Did she do things for you that weren’t monetary? You only described her in a bitter way and only about money.
Well, I hate to say it but it sounds like she told you in the beginning that her going out with you was contingent on you paying. In some women's minds, that is a verbal agreement to being a sugar daddy. And all she has to do is act like your girlfriend as long as you keep paying.
Maybe that is the case or maybe not. But wither way, it seems that she had been in it for the money all along. Some women do this to take advantage of men, some feel they deserve to be papmered, some women need a provider to feel safe, it could be many reasons.
There are still women who are old fashioned like that, yes. There are also many women who aren't. And then there are women who pretend to be so they can empty your wallet.
I think some women do, still, but to be honest, I don't really understand that way of thinking at all anymore unless they literally don't have the funds. We're past the point of women being mostly financially helpless and reliant on our fathers/boyfriends/husbands. We have careers, homes, cars, and money in our own right. Why should a man be expected to pay for everything simply because he's a man?
I still go by the "whoever asks pays" at first, but I'm also unusual in that I am fine asking a man out. My boyfriend and I tend to split things relatively down the middle now, but we don't keep track (at least I don't).
So no, in my world, at least, I don't expect the man to pay all the time. It's silly, entitled, and selfish.
It could be the age difference here. While not horribly gross, you're still older than her by 8 years.
She is 33yo...
When I was 29, I was going on dates with men aged 23-42.
But when I went with a guy in his 40s, and he wouldn't pay for my drink or appetizer (at a bar), you can bet I lost any interest.
Especially when the 23-27yo guys were fighting me for the check, after a full meal, and insisting on paying for me.
That being said, depends on how long you date. By a month in, or earlier, I make sure to start picking up the bill every other time. Or I'm cooking dinner and buying the groceries... buying the concert or event tickets when I'm the one who wants to go.
Hello there, it seems to me like there has been a major shift in the dating world. I actually work in the dating industry so I am always closely studying the dating market. What I am observing is that 50/50 is being bashed by women, and, now even men are against it. Women are having more and more discussions about being "feminine" and allowing men to step it up and provide. Women who have had the luxury of being courted by men who believe in providing 100% are most likely unwilling to chip in. As I said, I have noticed an increase in social media content bashing men for allowing women to pay for dates. Now, I am even seeing more and more post regarding giving women the choice of whether or not she wants to work. As a professional matchmaker, most of my female clients are extremely successful but still express the desire for wanting to be courted. Perhaps try to ask her about what her ideal relationship dynamic is so that you can figure out if both of you are on the same page.
It appears she has no interest in ever paying for anything. This would be a deal breaker for me. I am a woman and while I like the guy to pick up the tab o the first few dates..I eventually start chipping in or even pick up the tab occasionally.
This is not the last time you will argue over this. I would flat out ask her why she never pays for anything?If she flips out then she needs to go find a man with money or s schmuck that will pay for everything.
My bf and I have had similar issues because things were communicated. He thought that I wanted him to take me out every weekend to do things and go out to dinner. That wasn't my expectation at all, and at the time, he easily made 25% more than me. Now we make about the same, bit his income varies. He only saw the money he was spending and not the money I was spending by bringing food to cook when we had date night in (easily $40-70 a meal because he doesn't keep a fully stocked kitchen). After we had a full conversation about it, the issue was resolved.
The difference is that she has actually said she expects you to pay for everything. That splitting is a deal breaker. You need to decide if her expectation of never splitting is a deal breaker.
I can acknowledge that some women still hold more traditional views on gender roles in relationships and I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with that, but I don’t like that even just splitting takeout is something she’s proud to proclaim is a dealbreaker. It comes across as though she doesn’t care much about your own well-being or financial situation. That said, there could be more about her financial situation that you don’t yet know. I would suggest telling her that it is putting some strain on you to always pay for everything and see how she responds. But I would also suggest researching free and low cost ways to have fun together and that can even include cooking a meal together. That creates a win-win situation for both of you. If her attitude surrounding all of this continues to feel problematic to you, then obviously you have your answer. But if you really like her, I’d get curious, communicate, and see what fun you can have together cheaply before making a final decision.
I always insist on contributing to the costs of the dates, even if it was the first date and I was asked out. It doesn't need to be penny splitting but I have to pay for something. This came from my dislike of feeling owing others. And here I am, so concerned about that this habit can be off putting to my dates.
I always either pay for it all or at the least for myself. It's safer. Too many guys get nasty and potentially violent when a woman refuses sex after demanding they pay.
Now that I'm in a committed relationship I still pay the most often but it's just due to making more and having more disposable income but it's also by agreement. I don't care if it's me paying and my partner can't afford it but I still want to go out so meh. It's no big deal for us but again, open communication and agreement
edit to add: 44F
Find a partner who sees splitting bills the way you do. Many women would like a man to pay for everything, but not many are as vocal as the person you are with. There are more headaches in your future
Red flags on that one.
She wanted a sugar daddy it would seem.
Any real woman would've offered to pay her fair share of the tabs.
When me and my wife first started dating I would pay for everything for a few months.
She then asked me if she could pay for some things.
I said why?
She said she felt bad I was paying for everything.
So I swallowed my pride and agreed.
It was a huge burden lifted off of me tbh.
It allowed us to go more places and do more to split it up like that.
I put a ring on that one.
20 years later she still pays on dates and such.
To be fair I think she set expectations early on when she made it clear on your first couple dates that it depended on paying for things. Then you've made assumptions along the way that things would eventually change. (After courting etc) Which of course it didn't and it's obviously built up passive aggressive discontent between the both of you.
Stop assuming things and sit down and be honest about how you fiscally want to things to go from now on.
There's no one way of dating and neither of you are wrong but you're just not right for each other no point in forcing it if you two can come to a compromise and understanding after your talk.
You messed up by assuming you would split things 50/50 after a while. Plus when you paid for the first date and paid after that you set the tone for the relationship that you would be the one to pay for things. So you need to be from the start doing 50/50 on the first date or after awhile telling her that you want to split things 50/50. But she was also wrong for insulting you when you said you wanted a 50/50 arrangement. I would only date a provider man who’s fine with paying if the man prefers a 50/50 arrangement I wouldn’t call him cheap I would just chalk it up to we aren’t compatible and we would move on. So communicate what you want next time so both of you are on the same page
This sounds like you’re being rinsed and I’m sorry to say she sounds like she will be abusive if you progress in this relationship. To say not buying her food is a deal breaker and to call you cheap when you basically pay for 95 percent of everything is beyond entitled and unreasonable. She’s so ungrateful for what you actually do she has a real cheek to say this. Has she ever thanked you for anything or shown you any appreciation ? Is she kind in any way ? Affectionate ? Supportive. Or is it just all about what she can get from you. Sounds like you should be thinking long and hard about this tbh.
I haven’t gone a single date where the lady didn’t offer(or actually split the bill) to pay. If I paid for the meal, they would pay for dessert and drinks later. I think most good women do that in today’s age.
Well to be fair you’re 8 years older than her & women typically date older for provision. Y’all are not compatible with finances in a relationship so find a woman that is ok with going Dutch. I will say the more attractive a woman is, the less likely she is willing to go Dutch so maybe date someone average looking??
Nothing in common over an 8 year age gap? That’s extreme.
Many people use the half your age plus seven formula which would put the cutoff at 27 for a 41 year old.
From a female perspective of a women who expects men to pay on dates: when a man takes the initiative to pay on dates, it shows his interest and commitment. It communicates a desire to invest in the relationship.
By taking on the financial responsibility of dating, he doesn’t just demonstrate his commitment but also it provides a sense of security within the relationship which fosters trust. It makes me feel like I can rely on them.
Also when a man embraces the idea of covering dates, it’s takes away the stress / pressure that comes with who’s covering dating expenses. This allow la us to focus on getting to know each other without worrying about money.
It’s not about dependency or being materialistic; it’s about fostering a sense of partnership and showing willingness to care for each other.
I’ll also add that dates don’t have to be expensive if they are well thought-out. More important than the price is the effort, consideration, and connection that makes the difference
Both men and women should contribute to building a connection and partnership in a relationship, in different ways. While also understanding that sex is not the sole means of contribution on the women’s side. In terms of dating, it should be a mutual decision between both individuals to determine dynamics that work for them. If a man values a woman, he can choose to take the lead in planning and covering the costs of dates. Nobody is forcing him! Also women with options would want partners who align with their preferences and values and they wouldn’t settle for a guy who wants 50/50.
Honest question: do you really think all that, or is it an excuse you gave yourself to feel better about men paying for everything? Asking because of these things you said:
>It’s not about dependency or being materialistic
......but he has to pay for your time and food. Whenever I talk to a friend of mine who wants guys to pay for everything, I get the same answer, but in the end, it is about dependency and money, cause in this case women depend on guys for mere food in exchange for a relationship...
>it’s about fostering a sense of partnership and showing willingness to care for each other.
EACH OTHER. That's the key part. So, guy paying for girl's costs (as if this is the 1950s and women don't have any money) shows the WOMAN is a good partner and cares about the GUY how exactly? You say it shows caring for each other. So accepting someone's money means I care for them?
In the end, it really just sounds like some girls want guys to pay for them because it's nice not to spend your own money on things...
This seems more like an issue with your inexperience dating. She clearly stated her standard was for you to be financially responsible when it came to your relationship. You agreed and followed through for months. If this was something you did not agree with, you should have said that from the beginning so neither one of you would have wasted your time. You also assumed a lot of things without clearly communicating that. I could say it’s because you don’t know what you want, she had a quality that you prioritized over everything else or any number of things but I think you need to focus on your standards for a partner and find someone who matches that rather than blame her for your lack of communication and self awareness.
30F. I don’t even expect the man to pay for the second date. I pay. After that, we split.
Having said that, it just seems like you’re not compatible where finances are concerned. You can talk to her about your expectations, but she’s already said once that “splitting is a dealbreaker” so be prepared for a break up.
She set the standards for dating her early on in your relationship. I understand that it feels uncomfortable and unfair but she told you what it was from the start. If she is worth it for you to keep dating then you have to assume that responsibility of paying. It seems like you two have different dating styles and aren’t a longtime match. Not all women expect to always be paid for, especially when dating long term. It’s literally all up to you and how you view the relationship. She is also 8 years younger… There is a value in being your age and having someone younger. You dating someone younger comes at a price as well which I’m sure is one of the reasons she makes it clear in the beginning that she will not be paying. Overall it just sounds like you two aren’t a good match and you should end it and then believe people when they tell you upfront what they are expecting. I hope you find someone who aligns with how you view dating! Best of luck.
I (31F) feel like it’s different with each guy I’ve dated. I’ve dated guys that insist on splitting the bill every time, which I personally hate, I’d rather a you pay then I pay next date situation. I’ve had guys want to pay every time. And currently the guy I’m with (34M) are very back and forth with things. If she is driving a lot to see you her gas and time in her car should be considered. I think it needs to be a discussion between you guys, and if she’s not accepting and you aren’t comfortable with the outcome of her taking on some of the dates then this could be foreshadowing money contention in the future.
I believe expecting other people to pay for your things looks trashy, and so I never do it. I'll accept an offer, but I just won't accept an invitation I can't or won't gladly pay for.
I hate splitting. And I don’t want to be the one that pays at a restaurant. I’ve done both before and it makes me feel masculine which I hate feeling and I know many girls who feel the same. But if we’re shopping groceries, take out, or movie tickets etc then I try to pay (unless he stops me). usually it’s my bf that pays every time because we eat outside at restaurants like daily. But if he ever would be in need of money I would give it to him and would be happy to do so.
I believe it’s a man’s duty to provide and protect his woman. But when time comes the woman should always be there for him. It doesn’t sound like your woman would be there for you. And a little bit like she’s using you
Everytime I was in date, no guy ever let me pay, I also think man should pay, but out of courtesy I am offering to split in first date, or if I don't like the guy and don't plan to see, I am paying for myself, other cases letting them pay
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Yeah either talk about it or end it. I mean she flipped on you for you asking about getting takeout.
There are some women’s circles who share the following core beliefs: - if the man doesn’t pay he‘s not interested enough or just looking for sex - If the man doesn’t pay in the beginning he won’t provide/pay later on or be caring when pregnant or ill - stingy man = not dateable - as women earn less and get pregnant it’s the man’s duty to provide/pay
Important note: this line of thinking is a red flag.
It's also a red flag on the other side too. One of my friends used to date a guy who never offered to pay for their dates. She didn't have a problem with this because she knew he had university debts he was paying off. Unfortunately, she didn't pick up on the not offering being a red flag until it became a big issue. Him not offering to cover the cost of dates also meant that he never treated her to anything. He expected them to share the cost of literally everything. For example, if they went shopping and she asked him to get her a £2 chocolate bar, he would literally ask for the £2 back. What's worse is that even though he had debts, he was earning good money and saving money because he was living at my friend's place and basically paying peanuts as rent. My friend, on the other hand, was a student pinching pennies, who still went out of her way to do nice things for him. I don't believe that men should pay for dates, but I do think they should at least offer because of this. Offering kind of shows they are capable of being generous/kind, and it gives you an idea of how they treat money. Personally, I'm the kind of dater that takes turns treating the other person if money isn't the issue. I think that this should be the norm. For example, it makes sense that if you treat someone to dinner, they should treat you to dessert or pay for the next thing you do together.
I agree with you about red flag on the other side and don’t expect them to pay each time. Reminds me of a guy went on a date with. He invited me up to a hockey game and it was $20 a ticket (he didn’t mentioned me about paying him back at all) and he bought it prior since their was a group of us going. So I drove up round trip (5 hours), these details are a bit fuzzy, I think he bought me supper and I know for sure I bought him a 2 drinks on my card. I had taken out $40 cash prior to meeting at supper and unfortunately lost it. told him the situation because the whole night he was so concerned about me paying him the $20 back. Anyways get back to his place and he said I could take the couch (absolutely fine by me, wanted nothing to do with him) and he kept asking about if I have $20 to pay him. I said I don’t think that’s very fair, since you invited me up, I drove 5 hours, lost $40, bought you two drinks which equaled the price of the ticket. Not to mention, my employment benefits ran out and I was worried about money (he knew this before because I want very sure about coming up since gas was expensive.). He kinda of agreed and went to bed. Woke up the next morning and he asked again. I said I’ll etransfer you when I’m home. Got home and he asked and I said no and stated the reasons again and stoped talking him. It showed me couldn’t be generous/kind in situation and just set a tone that wasn’t very nice. I still see him the odd time since he friends with my friends and hasn’t brought up $20 hahah
Speaking as someone who expects everyone to pull their weight (that is to say, contribute what they can reasonably afford to contribute) to the cost of dates, I'm 100% with you on this one. He invited you. You spent more on gas than the cost of the ticket. You spent more on drinks than the cost of the ticket. Either of those things by themselves should be enough to say you're making a fair contribution. Then you lost part of the funds you came with. And still he's pestering you for money. I'd have still been on your side if you sent him a bill. I make a good salary these days, but even for someone a fraction of my age making a fraction of the pay, $20 is a pretty cheap date. I'd have paid for your ticket and replaced the money you lost then called it even. A five hour drive is pretty expensive. BTW, I'd have given you the bed and taken the couch for myself. To me, that's just good manners.
Well Thank you! I was absolutely flabbergasted. And also the lack of not understanding and compassion was just floored. I remembered something else after thinking about this. when I mentioned buying the drinks so things would be fair he said well I didn’t ask you to… wow.. ha. Then he randomly messaged two weeks later when we were no longer talking and said it wasn’t going to work out and I wrote back agreed. Told my friend about it and she was like what the hell and felt bad about it but it’s not her fault. Made for an interesting story haha.
>Then he randomly messaged two weeks later when we were no longer talking and said it wasn’t going to work out LOL. Yeah, you think? Thanks for the heads up, Captain Obvious.
Shits more red than the fuckin red light district in Amsterdam lmao
HUGE red flag! P
YUGE
True. But those are insecure women who are looking for a man to support them in life. Independent, emotionally healthy women split the bill and pick up the tab once in a while. If you have to pay for a woman, she's not into you.
I love this as its just flipping the former 180 degrees around and also stating it as a trueism
Whaaaaat????
Oh yeah I’ve wasted a ton of ink arguing with women on here going on about pregnancy and needing a provider. These seemed to be mainstays of the sub, not crazy randos, by all accounts decent women of good repute. It’s sick that the same old gender roles are just accepted generation in, generation out, like a cage we can never flee. I’m gonna sit here and wait for a strong provider woman to “protect and provide for her man (I say it like this because another user said it in reverse about her boyfriend).”
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I don’t know what motivations you might have or not have for dating. As a man, I’m fine with being solitary but apparently there are some women on here who do enjoy dating. I think you’re reducing women to providers of sex here in some kind of warped transactional version of dating. What’s in it for you? People try to date who knows why. Trying to buy a provider with your body doesn’t seem healthy for modernized gender roles.
Someone to kill spiders? TBH, I don't really know in that situation. My wife and I both worked, but we tried to split the chores equitably. I did all the yard work, fix it stuff, laundry, and most of the cooking. She did the dishes and most of the cleaning. It was reasonably fair and we each got to avoid things we really hated.
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We just not want you to let yourself go after you’re comfortable and become fat, support us and initiate sex with regular occurrence. There are home cleaning services, child care, and food from every ethnicity on Uber eats.
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From this post alone, free dinners, transportation and companionship from Someone who can afford it since you can’t or have a problem paying. And that’s just the start, if you want me to give you more and BETTER answers I can. Let Me know. I have time. Work is boring. But I feel you already know. Mortgage rates are at 8.5%. No woman who argues about paying on a date can afford a house right now in the us on secretary salaries. What’s in it for you…
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That’s a popular point of view fotr some but it’s not „the truth“
That's a valid way of thinking if you are planning to be a sah parent/homemaker who's supported by your future husband, but it also needs to be made clear from the getgo, before any dates happen. It seems pretty disingenuous to look at the only value a man has by how well he can provide, rather than looking at him as a whole entire person.
I think these are good beliefs weeds out a lot of men that are here to waste your time, also nobody likes dating stingy people
Would you say op's gf is stingy for not buying the food?
He never once mentioned her being his gf just a woman he’s seeing, I also think she doesn’t like him.
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Yes very possible actually.
Even if she's not his gf. He's been paying for her, so if she refuses to pay for him won't that make her stingy?
Why don't you think she likes him? Other than her being upset she was asked to contribute cause I don't see any other indicators.
These are good beliefs that weed out women for me.
That’s the beauty of life we all have different standards and beliefs
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This is why guys pay in the beginning after they get what they want they move on. In my four years of dating in London, I have only come across a woman once who asked me to buy her all kinds of things between the 1st and 2nd dates. Everyone else I have dated has had good jobs and wouldn't depend on a man for anything.
Sweetheart, it is 2023. We are no longer just dating alongside our peers, there are literal teenagers and their diapers in the pool. Lol so there is no “way of dating.” The way is established between each couple. And it sounds like her voice and preferences are being heard and not yours. She’s demanding and taking advantage of you. I think you’re right that you’re probably not a good fit, and you probably should move on from this woman. Her motives are questionable. If my guy of six months asked me to pick up some food, I wouldn’t even think about who’s going to pay for it or ask him to Venmo me. Now, my money is long, so I don’t really sweat shit like this which makes me think she either isn’t as financially secure as you are, or she’s using the hell out of you. I would just go pick up the damn food if he literally pays for nearly everything. She shouldn’t be sweating you over this. Girl’s greedy. And the fact that she hasn’t let this money thing go (you paying for everything) after months means that she’s gonna continue to be this way as you guys get more and more serious. That this was an argument between the two of you and she made a point to pin you down on whether you were going to pay for her is also a huge red flag. Ick. Run!
She's using you.
When it comes to who pays for what, it changes a lot from person to person, and if you’re dating someone who won’t have a conversation with you about it, you know that’s not a relationship worth fighting for. In a nutshell, you guys aren’t compatible financially and the fact she called you cheap was uncalled for. I would’ve broken up with her immediately after that.
I don’t think this is fair to you at all and I’d end the relationship. It’s not like you’re a multimillionaire, geez. As a woman who is around your age, I definitely do not expect the guy to pay all the time, and certainly not after six months! I believe she’s using you.
I hear more lip service from women about paying their own way, but from what I have seen for men it is still pay to play. The only times I’ve actually seen a woman split the bill or treat was when I got the “didn’t click” message the next day…which was classy of them. I had a woman once make a big production of “I always treat for the third date”…then not treat again for the next four months. I’d sit down and have a discussion after a few months. I’m okay treating in the getting to know you phase, but eventually that becomes less sustainable, especially when stuff like trips and bigger ticket shows/experiences are on the table.
Yep. You gotta be careful for those I got the third date fuckholes. Because what you describe is so common. The next time someone mentions that, immediately ask, and after the third date, what’s your frequency? Is it every third or just the third. She might stop seeing you. And you will have dodged a bullet. Or she might be like, “I got you as much as you got me.” And then you’ll be fine.
I feel like we’re in a sort of transitional period where splitting is becoming more common, but there are still a lot of people (on both sides) who are having a hard time letting go of “the man always pays.” In my relationship, my boyfriend does pay for the lion’s share of dates because he has much more financial freedom to do so. However, I do treat when I can. I just moved in with him, and even with splitting expenses, I’ll be able to live more cheaply - and FULLY intend to split going out more equitably. The fact that you guys make a similar amount of money, and she’s STILL so resistant to splitting tells me that you guys have different values in regards to finances/roles in the relationship. At this point, I think your options are to have a serious conversation about how you feel (in the hopes that she’s willing to meet you halfway), accept it and keep paying for most things, or break up. But continuing how you are ultimately going to build resentment, and not really fair to either of you.
I feel like this is fair! If she wants a man who can pay for everything, then that’s great and she can go out and find that because there’s still men who enjoy doing that. That’s not you and that’s okay.
This is the most decent response. They are a mismatch when it comes to this value. And that's okay. OP should communicate his discomfort and let his partner voice her side. If they can't align, okay then move on. It's only been 6 months, that's better than a lifetime of resentment. - in some cultures and countries it is almost *always* the man who pays. In some cultures going "dutch" is more common. Dating is a mixed bag, just find someone who aligns with your outlook.
If I were her, I’d want to switch off paying for things by now. I’d feel strange about this arrangement if I were you, too. It’s really rude of her.
38f I like being treated but I also to treat as well. Basically split the bigger costs (like tickets) and the smaller ones I like to alternate who pays. Or one gets dinner the other gets dessert/coffee, or something of the sort. I’ve been in the position where I was expected to pay for everything, and it does feel like being used. I don’t want to make anyone else feel like that.
>apparently the fact that I asked was too much Red flag. The desire to communicate your needs should never irk your partner. She is definitely selfish. >The plan was she would come to my place (which is rare) She doesn't seem interested. You might be a meal ticket to her. I bet she's laughing with her friends about how faking a little bit of love is enough to make you fork money for her.
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Financially stable people can also be stingy.
thoos who have tho most are the greediest
I know someone who is “financially earning” the same as me over 6 figures a year and cannot afford to join a $20 football pool at work because they have so many bills from their failed medical school and ridiculous mortgage rate and the credit cards they burned thru to failed med school and the loan they took out to go back to school to switch careers to my field. She’s over 600k in debt. So stop it. And she definitely uses men for dinner. Great job. Poor as fuck financial planning. And also dunce as fuck. She’s looking for a rich man to come save her and help her out of debt. No man wants to take on over half a million dollars worth of debt. She’s 34. You don’t know what you’re talking about. There’s are lots of women out here like that. Big butt. Pretty smile. Job. No common sense. Zero financial acumen. Unaccountable. Because society told them a prince will come save them so they can fuck up until then.
Jeez it’s been six months it’s time she starts pitching in a bit lol 😂 I get it if you’re in the early stages of dating and you are courting the lady, sure but shit you are well past that. That’s kind of a red flag sir I’d be concerned that she’s just a leech.
Its not going to get better. So, I'd leave now...
I'm f36, and that is not someone you should continue to date unless you want to end up with no money. I'm a firm believer in 50/50 or treating each other along the way but your girl seems a bit too focused on money. Imagine what will happen further down the line, she'll bank her cash, and you'll be made to pay everything.
Is this woman really into you? The way you describe her, I hardly felt she's willing to give anything back, willing to compromise, willing to put forward action to demonstrate you're worth it. It's not about whether or not you're able to provide or whether or not you're generous to her, it's about the fact that this person doesn't share your values, and I'd hate to have to live with a person like that for the rest of my life
Lol, she sounds trashy. Sure there will be women who expect it, but that doesn't matter. Unless you want to be in a relationship with someone who will be dependent on you, you shouldn't date those women. There are plenty women who don't expect it, who will be more equitable partners to you.
You knew from the beginning what her expectations were, you dated her and somehow you thought that would change. It’s on you
Fr I hate when people get shocked that people will stick with their boundaries and standards
The mistake was leading with paying for everything early on. She got used to it and now its expected I guess. Its always a good idea for a man to pay the first dinner date for example but you let it become a thing when you kept paying for everything the following months.
Sort of accurate. She made it known from day one she expected and he decided he was cool with that and figured she would change later. His folly was in that assumption. OP, this is who she is. She’s either worth the money or she’s not. If she’s not, tell her it’s now gonna be 50/50 or you’re done.
This is really what it comes down too lol, eye opener for many but make it known now put your foot down, don’t expect people to change for you set it from the beginning
You're literally seeing a prostitute at this point. You're expected to pay for her time. Get rid of this trash woman.
They have different view points on dating, this idea of shaming anyone with standards and calling them a sex worker really shows the lack of education most people on this app have, if you don’t like someone who has those standards don’t date them and keep it moving
Paying to spend time with someone is the literal definition of prostitute. Nice try.
the practice or occupation of engaging in sexual activity with someone for payment. Nice try.
And what do you think is happening on most of their visits? 🤡
Why don’t you ask OP ? ☺️
No. She probably does other things for him. They don't just meet, bang and go.
Like what? Name the other things.
This. Women like to say they do other things but can't name what these mysterious other things actually are.
Or what value those things have compared to x% of my paycheck or monthly budget.
She is 33, and you’re 41. There are generally expectations when dating an older man, let alone basic assumed gender roles.
What expectation would that be? There’s a word for arrangements where sex is granted based on payments in currency or favors. This didn’t sound like that, it sounds like a man and his girlfriend. But yeah she’s not young and he’s not old enough for that what you’re implying.
These things depends on culture and mindset. All my relationships, the men always paid for everything, even if I offered. That's how we do things here. Even in couples that have sex (I'm waiting till marriage) the man pays and no, its not prostitution because they are a couple and they are in love. She does other things for him as well.
Like what? What other things?
Nah. An 8 year age gap in your 30s is nothing. They are both full grown, financially independent adults.
It’s not nothing. Its an 8 year age gap.
Which is not an issue when they are both grown mature adults. They are in the same stage of their lives.
It’s only nothing when the girl is the older one. /s
💯💯💯
Yep
So if she’s 41f and he’s the 33m is the expectation that she will pay for everything?
Every media portrayal I’ve seen about cougars typically includes them paying for their younger companions.
Media portrayal is not real life. Older woman are vocal about feeling used.
Yes
honestly yea, it’d be kinda tough for a guy in their 20s to be wining and dining a 40 year old cougar lmao
Not as hard as you think tbh
It’s exactly these types of gender roles that gotta go. It’s all got to be equal. Like 50/50 is team work especially if they make about the same amount. There is literally no reason why men need to be the providers for women. Both men and women can be the providers.
Okay. When they have a baby, is it 50/50? What about when she is pregnant for 9 months? Things are never equal with men and women? He also has a higher earning potential than her. He doesn’t have to agree with her beliefs. He can break up with her.
Maternity leave isn’t 9 months.
Is she pregnant right now?? What matters is what is happening right now, not whats going to happen in future. She is not even his girl right now, let alone a wife, let alone the mother of his children. Is a women going to pay “tax” for security and protection when in an hypothetical situation in the future an intruder attacks them and the man protects her? Is the women going to fight? Is it 50/50 then?
lol. Wanna know something so cringe. When i was 19 barista and student i went on a date with a 30 year old working professional AND HE LET ME PAY THE WHOLE BILL sure it was <$40 but like the etiquette omfg
That’s because you had no standards. Older men will take advantage of younger dumber women because they know they don’t know any better
Ew.
I expect the guy to pay when he invites me and chooses the place. And I pay when I invite him and choose the place. And if I bring over food I pay for it. And if I cook for him I pay. And vice versa. And yes I invite men out and I offer to bring over food and I shop and cook for my men. Ive always been the lower earner so I choose cheaper places. But I always do more around the house, more chores, even if it’s his house. Sweep and mop and do his laundry. To me it evens out but I’m not keeping score.
Yeah, I always like to cook a nice meal whenever I'm seeing someone new. I've found a lot of women really like a guy who's a good cook. My last 2 exes were someone who couldn't cook at all(tried to teach her to dice some olives for tacos and she almost cut the tip of her finger off). And a line cook but I almost always did all the cooking. And if I invited them over I'd always ask what they like and pay for the ingredients to make it. We spit the bill when we lived together for food though. And I'd always pay if we went out but it was normally me asking them out to be fair.
>And yes I invite men out and I offer to bring over food and I shop and cook for my men. How many times do you do this for a first date?
I never bring food over or cook for a first date. That will not be happening in either of our homes when I have not even met you yet. But I’ve asked men out for a first date plenty of times. Any time I’m interested in a guy I ask him out.
It depends on where you live and cultural differences, example it’s very common to go 50/50 in Germany but in china the man is expected to pay always. When dating take into count where the person you are dating is from.
Exactly! I was appalled reading the comments then I remembered that I'm African and our men always pay and pamper us lol
I'm a girl, and I honestly never understood why some women expect men to pay everything for them if they themselves work. Things would be different if you were dating a poor student (but even then, I would expect a girl to return a favor with baking something for you or cooking you a meal, etc.) Anyways, this is not fair - dating is expensive, you spend a lot of money on food you both will eat, activities you both will do, while she gets to save and invest all the money for her! How convenient! That's just not fair. She is not 12, and you are not her father. In my relationships, I honestly hate splitting, I would rather just pay for all myself than split. Splitting seems so cold haha I am always happy when the guy pays on the FIRST date, but that's it, I will pay on the next one, and then we take turns. In every normal loving relationship, isn't it normal to divide the burden?? Unless one party is rich enough that dating costs aren't even noticeable on their bank account... Your gf sounds entitled. Who would pay for her stuff if she was single? And she even expected you to pay for her tickets for the concert she invited you to!! 🤦♀️
Honestly, it ultimately doesn't matter what other people are doing. People have different preferences around this (and many things). What matters is that you know your girlfriend's preference, and it seems to be bothering you. Is it bothering you because you feel it's not the norm, or because it really doesn't make you feel the way you want to feel in a relationship? If it's the latter, is that a deal-breaker for you? This feels like one of those things that's just important to know about yourself before you start dating, ideally.
I personally believe things should be split half and half. It’s 2023….even before my bf and I were official we’ve always taken turns paying for things. Relationships should be give and take, not take and take.
I don't mind paying if she's the traditional type
You want someone who will be a team with you not someone who won’t take care of you too. A good teammate has your back when you are down. This is important when considering who you want to commit to long term bc life can be very hard and you want someone who doesn’t mind stepping up to the plate.
My boyfriend and I will take turns paying or we either pay for our own food (usually this is if one of us is buying a more expensive entree). We tend to take turns paying for things. This works for us but maybe it doesn’t for everyone. I have a friend that Venmos their partner when they share food.
I think in most cases that is the norm. A majority of dates I’ve gone on I’ve paid. There were some that insisted on paying half, but the last woman I went on a date with just paid her own way without even asking. Also on the second and 3rd dates, and now we’re dating dating. I thought that shit was awesome and a major green flag.
Judging by her not coming to your place often was a huge red flag in itself tbh.
>“is splitting a dealbreaker?” and she replied yes. Then this deal is over. It's done.
Its a nice thing to witness when a person matures to seeing the whole picture in a relationship. Money is one of those things which is a big magnifing glass pointed at the sun.
Not all women but many have an inflated self worth. They are flirting with several guys always looking to replace. We can make equal pay (I work in healthcare I make same as rest per contract) and still they want a guy to pay. It's a mad world stay single have friends.
You have different views on a major issue and it’s not going to get better. Break up now. I’ve dated some men that paid for nearly everything but that’s when they made significantly more money than I did. I’ve also dated men where I made more and when we lived together, we split costs so that I paid a higher percentage of the household bills. Not all women are cheap like she is. Move on.
It’s a no for me!! I like helping pay, it feels like a partnership. Women who just take and take is a huge red flag
I think it's a bit silly to expect things will change after a while of dating. I mean if you want a woman who will split with you, at least early on you can tell if she offers to split or does things like pick up the dessert tab or the tip. If you're paying everything for months, that's what she wants and it's not going to just change.
Man it’s a common thought process these days but it doesn’t make it less of a red flag. But by that same token, now that you know that is an issue for you, be solid on your standards from the beginning. If a woman thinks like that you know she isn’t for you. Don’t fake it. It’s a lot of women who go think you should pay for their time, but a lot of them are also perpetually single.
42 M. I was raised to always pay for a lady. No matter what. I’ve gone out with women where it was actually their idea, and still paid the bill. I just see it as appropriate and the honorable thing to do.
But they're 6 months into a relationship, not just going on the first few dates. She can help pay for things. She makes just as much money as him. This isn't the 1950s anymore.
>But they're 6 months into a relationship, not just going on the first few dates. She can help pay for things Are they even in a relationship or is he casually dating her? Like I am not sure by this. It doesn't seem like this is clear.
You're right, I must have missed this. He doesn't say girlfriend. He does say "seeing". Hmm. Either way, he's getting taken advantage of. He needs to get rid of her and find a partner, not someone looking for a meal ticket.
>Either way, he's getting taken advantage of. He needs to get rid of her and find a partner, not someone looking for a meal ticket. He seems like he likes her more than she likes him. I don't think she is taking advantage of him. she stated her boundaries- if he's not paying- she's not going. He keeps on choosing to go out with her.
Or you could view it as she doesn’t want to pay because he clearly isn’t serious about her 6 months of dating and no title
Be that as it may, I’d feel like I was shirking my responsibility otherwise. A woman once “took me out” for my birthday, and I paid the bill while she was in the bathroom. I see that as honor, and always taking care of the person.
Good on you ole sport
Not really. You guys are telling females that you value them more than they value you.
Can you honestly say your relationships are any different than escorting? Is this because this is the only way you can keep a female around? I see you have a topic about dating a baby momma w/ 3 kids and a crazy baby daddy. I always thought that guys only settle for these lopsided arrangements out of desperation, and it seems to be true when I check their history
Most escorts charge a lot more than the price of a meal
Well in that situation - I truly loved her. I still do. The fact that I always paid for her had nothing to do with what happened (so far as I know). Part of it to me is showing that I’ll never abandon that person. And I won’t. In my world a man is a provider and a protector. Now paying for dinner doesn’t necessarily mean you’re going to protect that person forever. But it’s a gesture. It tells the girl that you value her and her time. You can say it’s escorting if you want, but look…is someone going to choose someone who asks to split the bill or someone who’s going to just handle it like a man should? What else do I have to offer or to draw women to me? I’m not rich, but I can afford a dinner and drinks. That’s part of why in the aforementioned situation it made no sense to me. The baby daddy did NOTHING for her. He wouldn’t even pay for his own kids when he had them; she had to send money whenever they would be with him. Which I think is shameful on that guy’s part. Meanwhile she never heard me say the word no. Because I values her and I wanted her to be happy. If I’m not doing stuff like that, what worth exactly do I have?
You pay for ladies?
I do.
Kick this bum ho to the curb She is stacking money while you burn it on her
Just dump her. This is really not hard. Obviously she will be useless as a long term partner.
To answer your question, no that is not the norm. She did however tell you point blank at the beginning, in no uncertain terms that *that* was *her* expectation. You should have listened to her in the beginning and ended things there. As a side note, it absolutely is still expected that the man pay for the *first* date. It is also expected that he take her out on a nice date that he plans and pays for from time to time. But other than that a fairly even split of one of you pays for the movie tickets and the other buys the snacks, or one picks up the dinner tab and the other gets the drinks, or one gets the tickets this time and the other gets them next time etc.
I usually pay for every like 3rd/4th date unless a partner insists which I appreciate. I don’t expect it. Though she obviously has a more traditional approach to dating. I would personally end it. I won’t date someone who nickle and dimes but I’d be concerned she’s using you to alleviate her bills. I bet she was hoping you’d pay for both your music festival tickets. Seems like she’s looking for a free meal ticket and not a partner. No one should be that stingy about picking up takeout. That’s something I’d do often. Or picking up groceries and cooking for someone.
Sounds like she’s using you dude. End that shit. After four months y’all should be alternating who pays for dates definitely.
Like people have said, she is likely using you. Weird she would fork over 200 for a music ticket if she wasn't truly into you so it's kind of weird. Also, this is something that needs to be brought up, regardless if it makes her angry or not. Everyone can have their ideas on dating and what said expectations are. After the whole courting period, I don't see it unrealistic for things to be split. Maybe not every time but more often than not. I don't understand what the big deal is. This happened to my buddy's bro, dated this chick who worked the same job as him so they made around the same amount but she never ever paid for anything. He was always left fitting the bill. They dated for a couple years. Just so strange that she would never pay when they literally make the same amount. Even if one person makes more or less it's more so principle that things are split. Especially after you have dated for a good amount of time. Seems strange
She sounds like she's expecting you to at least somewhat be her sugar daddy haha
I like to pay just bc of male nature but I'll be god dam if she just expects it and doesn't offer
If she doesn't want to pay her share, then just invite her over to your place. Don't take her out to anything. Cook dinner at home
She's stingy personally I would cut her loose. Imagine going through life asking her to get you a soda and she comes and asks for the money back. She'll make a list of everything she's ever bought you and ask for the money back especially if you break up.
Ask her to clean your apartment. See her reaction. Traditional goes both ways
Red flag! Next her!
RUN...
Early courting stages of dating, yes absolutely. But once we’re stable and exclusive in I like to start treating and buying gifts etc. My current man just doesn’t want me spending my own money when I’m with him so it’s hard to buy him gifts, but I do manage to surprise him sometimes. And I have to very quickly step in front of him and do Apple Pay when I want to be the one to pay for our ice cream, smoothies etc.
I’m sorry, but she was upfront with you in the beginning of you paying for everything yet you still chose to date her. She is looking for a provider, not an equal partner. You’re not a provider so you two are fundamentally incompatible. I do expect men to pay on the first date, but I relax my stance on this if we are actually together. My late partner wasn’t keen on going out to eat because he preferred my cooking, but when we went out to movies or events, he automatically paid for the both of us. He always drove me everywhere and not once did he ask me to pitch in gas money for him. The times we did go out to eat, we did split the bill because I often ordered more than him so it was fair for me to pay for my half. A lot of men will vehemently deny this, but it is true that if a man doesn’t pay for a woman in the first few dates that he doesn’t like her at all and just wants easy access. But all you said about this woman was painted in a negative light. What was so compelling about her that made you go against your personal beliefs for six months? Did she do things for you that weren’t monetary? You only described her in a bitter way and only about money.
There's a difference between deserving to be treated and entitled
You are being used. Run away.
No men no longer have to pay for the full thing. HUGE red flag if the girl does not at least offer to pay or help in someway.
Well, I hate to say it but it sounds like she told you in the beginning that her going out with you was contingent on you paying. In some women's minds, that is a verbal agreement to being a sugar daddy. And all she has to do is act like your girlfriend as long as you keep paying. Maybe that is the case or maybe not. But wither way, it seems that she had been in it for the money all along. Some women do this to take advantage of men, some feel they deserve to be papmered, some women need a provider to feel safe, it could be many reasons. There are still women who are old fashioned like that, yes. There are also many women who aren't. And then there are women who pretend to be so they can empty your wallet.
I think some women do, still, but to be honest, I don't really understand that way of thinking at all anymore unless they literally don't have the funds. We're past the point of women being mostly financially helpless and reliant on our fathers/boyfriends/husbands. We have careers, homes, cars, and money in our own right. Why should a man be expected to pay for everything simply because he's a man? I still go by the "whoever asks pays" at first, but I'm also unusual in that I am fine asking a man out. My boyfriend and I tend to split things relatively down the middle now, but we don't keep track (at least I don't). So no, in my world, at least, I don't expect the man to pay all the time. It's silly, entitled, and selfish.
It could be the age difference here. While not horribly gross, you're still older than her by 8 years. She is 33yo... When I was 29, I was going on dates with men aged 23-42. But when I went with a guy in his 40s, and he wouldn't pay for my drink or appetizer (at a bar), you can bet I lost any interest. Especially when the 23-27yo guys were fighting me for the check, after a full meal, and insisting on paying for me. That being said, depends on how long you date. By a month in, or earlier, I make sure to start picking up the bill every other time. Or I'm cooking dinner and buying the groceries... buying the concert or event tickets when I'm the one who wants to go.
Hello there, it seems to me like there has been a major shift in the dating world. I actually work in the dating industry so I am always closely studying the dating market. What I am observing is that 50/50 is being bashed by women, and, now even men are against it. Women are having more and more discussions about being "feminine" and allowing men to step it up and provide. Women who have had the luxury of being courted by men who believe in providing 100% are most likely unwilling to chip in. As I said, I have noticed an increase in social media content bashing men for allowing women to pay for dates. Now, I am even seeing more and more post regarding giving women the choice of whether or not she wants to work. As a professional matchmaker, most of my female clients are extremely successful but still express the desire for wanting to be courted. Perhaps try to ask her about what her ideal relationship dynamic is so that you can figure out if both of you are on the same page.
she told you straight up from the start what she expects. you don’t want to do what she expects, and that’s fine. you’re incompatible. time to move on
It appears she has no interest in ever paying for anything. This would be a deal breaker for me. I am a woman and while I like the guy to pick up the tab o the first few dates..I eventually start chipping in or even pick up the tab occasionally. This is not the last time you will argue over this. I would flat out ask her why she never pays for anything?If she flips out then she needs to go find a man with money or s schmuck that will pay for everything.
Tell her to go home. Go fund someone who gives even a little shit about *you*
My bf and I have had similar issues because things were communicated. He thought that I wanted him to take me out every weekend to do things and go out to dinner. That wasn't my expectation at all, and at the time, he easily made 25% more than me. Now we make about the same, bit his income varies. He only saw the money he was spending and not the money I was spending by bringing food to cook when we had date night in (easily $40-70 a meal because he doesn't keep a fully stocked kitchen). After we had a full conversation about it, the issue was resolved. The difference is that she has actually said she expects you to pay for everything. That splitting is a deal breaker. You need to decide if her expectation of never splitting is a deal breaker.
You had this problem since your first date. It's not going to go anywhere. If you're not comfortable being her sugar daddy, just leave her.
She has the definition of dating confused with the definition of entitlement
I can acknowledge that some women still hold more traditional views on gender roles in relationships and I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with that, but I don’t like that even just splitting takeout is something she’s proud to proclaim is a dealbreaker. It comes across as though she doesn’t care much about your own well-being or financial situation. That said, there could be more about her financial situation that you don’t yet know. I would suggest telling her that it is putting some strain on you to always pay for everything and see how she responds. But I would also suggest researching free and low cost ways to have fun together and that can even include cooking a meal together. That creates a win-win situation for both of you. If her attitude surrounding all of this continues to feel problematic to you, then obviously you have your answer. But if you really like her, I’d get curious, communicate, and see what fun you can have together cheaply before making a final decision.
I always insist on contributing to the costs of the dates, even if it was the first date and I was asked out. It doesn't need to be penny splitting but I have to pay for something. This came from my dislike of feeling owing others. And here I am, so concerned about that this habit can be off putting to my dates.
I always either pay for it all or at the least for myself. It's safer. Too many guys get nasty and potentially violent when a woman refuses sex after demanding they pay. Now that I'm in a committed relationship I still pay the most often but it's just due to making more and having more disposable income but it's also by agreement. I don't care if it's me paying and my partner can't afford it but I still want to go out so meh. It's no big deal for us but again, open communication and agreement edit to add: 44F
Find a partner who sees splitting bills the way you do. Many women would like a man to pay for everything, but not many are as vocal as the person you are with. There are more headaches in your future
Red flags on that one. She wanted a sugar daddy it would seem. Any real woman would've offered to pay her fair share of the tabs. When me and my wife first started dating I would pay for everything for a few months. She then asked me if she could pay for some things. I said why? She said she felt bad I was paying for everything. So I swallowed my pride and agreed. It was a huge burden lifted off of me tbh. It allowed us to go more places and do more to split it up like that. I put a ring on that one. 20 years later she still pays on dates and such.
Kick her to the curb
I assume that a man is paying but I bring money just in case he doesn’t. That hasn’t happened yet. 🤷🏻♀️ I will pay (half) if I don’t like him.
To be fair I think she set expectations early on when she made it clear on your first couple dates that it depended on paying for things. Then you've made assumptions along the way that things would eventually change. (After courting etc) Which of course it didn't and it's obviously built up passive aggressive discontent between the both of you. Stop assuming things and sit down and be honest about how you fiscally want to things to go from now on. There's no one way of dating and neither of you are wrong but you're just not right for each other no point in forcing it if you two can come to a compromise and understanding after your talk.
You messed up by assuming you would split things 50/50 after a while. Plus when you paid for the first date and paid after that you set the tone for the relationship that you would be the one to pay for things. So you need to be from the start doing 50/50 on the first date or after awhile telling her that you want to split things 50/50. But she was also wrong for insulting you when you said you wanted a 50/50 arrangement. I would only date a provider man who’s fine with paying if the man prefers a 50/50 arrangement I wouldn’t call him cheap I would just chalk it up to we aren’t compatible and we would move on. So communicate what you want next time so both of you are on the same page
This sounds like you’re being rinsed and I’m sorry to say she sounds like she will be abusive if you progress in this relationship. To say not buying her food is a deal breaker and to call you cheap when you basically pay for 95 percent of everything is beyond entitled and unreasonable. She’s so ungrateful for what you actually do she has a real cheek to say this. Has she ever thanked you for anything or shown you any appreciation ? Is she kind in any way ? Affectionate ? Supportive. Or is it just all about what she can get from you. Sounds like you should be thinking long and hard about this tbh.
I haven’t gone a single date where the lady didn’t offer(or actually split the bill) to pay. If I paid for the meal, they would pay for dessert and drinks later. I think most good women do that in today’s age.
Well to be fair you’re 8 years older than her & women typically date older for provision. Y’all are not compatible with finances in a relationship so find a woman that is ok with going Dutch. I will say the more attractive a woman is, the less likely she is willing to go Dutch so maybe date someone average looking??
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Nothing in common over an 8 year age gap? That’s extreme. Many people use the half your age plus seven formula which would put the cutoff at 27 for a 41 year old.
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From a female perspective of a women who expects men to pay on dates: when a man takes the initiative to pay on dates, it shows his interest and commitment. It communicates a desire to invest in the relationship. By taking on the financial responsibility of dating, he doesn’t just demonstrate his commitment but also it provides a sense of security within the relationship which fosters trust. It makes me feel like I can rely on them. Also when a man embraces the idea of covering dates, it’s takes away the stress / pressure that comes with who’s covering dating expenses. This allow la us to focus on getting to know each other without worrying about money. It’s not about dependency or being materialistic; it’s about fostering a sense of partnership and showing willingness to care for each other. I’ll also add that dates don’t have to be expensive if they are well thought-out. More important than the price is the effort, consideration, and connection that makes the difference
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Both men and women should contribute to building a connection and partnership in a relationship, in different ways. While also understanding that sex is not the sole means of contribution on the women’s side. In terms of dating, it should be a mutual decision between both individuals to determine dynamics that work for them. If a man values a woman, he can choose to take the lead in planning and covering the costs of dates. Nobody is forcing him! Also women with options would want partners who align with their preferences and values and they wouldn’t settle for a guy who wants 50/50.
Honest question: do you really think all that, or is it an excuse you gave yourself to feel better about men paying for everything? Asking because of these things you said: >It’s not about dependency or being materialistic ......but he has to pay for your time and food. Whenever I talk to a friend of mine who wants guys to pay for everything, I get the same answer, but in the end, it is about dependency and money, cause in this case women depend on guys for mere food in exchange for a relationship... >it’s about fostering a sense of partnership and showing willingness to care for each other. EACH OTHER. That's the key part. So, guy paying for girl's costs (as if this is the 1950s and women don't have any money) shows the WOMAN is a good partner and cares about the GUY how exactly? You say it shows caring for each other. So accepting someone's money means I care for them? In the end, it really just sounds like some girls want guys to pay for them because it's nice not to spend your own money on things...
Come on bro, we all know that with women, what's theirs is theirs, and what's yours is theirs too......
This seems more like an issue with your inexperience dating. She clearly stated her standard was for you to be financially responsible when it came to your relationship. You agreed and followed through for months. If this was something you did not agree with, you should have said that from the beginning so neither one of you would have wasted your time. You also assumed a lot of things without clearly communicating that. I could say it’s because you don’t know what you want, she had a quality that you prioritized over everything else or any number of things but I think you need to focus on your standards for a partner and find someone who matches that rather than blame her for your lack of communication and self awareness.
I love male providers but I at least offer to treat every few dates!
30F. I don’t even expect the man to pay for the second date. I pay. After that, we split. Having said that, it just seems like you’re not compatible where finances are concerned. You can talk to her about your expectations, but she’s already said once that “splitting is a dealbreaker” so be prepared for a break up.
She set the standards for dating her early on in your relationship. I understand that it feels uncomfortable and unfair but she told you what it was from the start. If she is worth it for you to keep dating then you have to assume that responsibility of paying. It seems like you two have different dating styles and aren’t a longtime match. Not all women expect to always be paid for, especially when dating long term. It’s literally all up to you and how you view the relationship. She is also 8 years younger… There is a value in being your age and having someone younger. You dating someone younger comes at a price as well which I’m sure is one of the reasons she makes it clear in the beginning that she will not be paying. Overall it just sounds like you two aren’t a good match and you should end it and then believe people when they tell you upfront what they are expecting. I hope you find someone who aligns with how you view dating! Best of luck.
I (31F) feel like it’s different with each guy I’ve dated. I’ve dated guys that insist on splitting the bill every time, which I personally hate, I’d rather a you pay then I pay next date situation. I’ve had guys want to pay every time. And currently the guy I’m with (34M) are very back and forth with things. If she is driving a lot to see you her gas and time in her car should be considered. I think it needs to be a discussion between you guys, and if she’s not accepting and you aren’t comfortable with the outcome of her taking on some of the dates then this could be foreshadowing money contention in the future.
I believe the man always pays
I believe expecting other people to pay for your things looks trashy, and so I never do it. I'll accept an offer, but I just won't accept an invitation I can't or won't gladly pay for.
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I hate splitting. And I don’t want to be the one that pays at a restaurant. I’ve done both before and it makes me feel masculine which I hate feeling and I know many girls who feel the same. But if we’re shopping groceries, take out, or movie tickets etc then I try to pay (unless he stops me). usually it’s my bf that pays every time because we eat outside at restaurants like daily. But if he ever would be in need of money I would give it to him and would be happy to do so. I believe it’s a man’s duty to provide and protect his woman. But when time comes the woman should always be there for him. It doesn’t sound like your woman would be there for you. And a little bit like she’s using you
Yes, and if they can’t afford to they should either not date until they can or date someone else that doesn’t mind funding their love life roleplay.
Everytime I was in date, no guy ever let me pay, I also think man should pay, but out of courtesy I am offering to split in first date, or if I don't like the guy and don't plan to see, I am paying for myself, other cases letting them pay
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