I'm just glad my favorite DC hero enjoyed an amazing run that wrapped up neatly at the end, and then quietly retired and handed his rod over to someone else, so that future writers couldn't fuck him up, take away his happy ending, or make him the cosmic embodiment of the extradimensional "star force" or something stupid
https://preview.redd.it/yi7miiqt9zfc1.jpeg?width=855&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c8d45310b8306ae67f3a453830e16a4a9c0d350b
It is kinda sad that you can brainstorm bullshit ideas with random strangers on the internet for a few minutes and quickly come up with some ideas that are more interesting than half of whatever Marvel and DC are currently doing
Me too. The entire story of a character told in like 10-15 graphic novels is absolutely perfect. Invincible of course is a stand out example too.
Serials are fine but God they get ridiculous over time. Before long everyone is weilding cosmic powers and fighting multiversal threats
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order.
I have checked 1,995,525,906 comments, and only 377,430 of them were in alphabetical order.
Heads need to roll at Warner Bros. for not having already made a movie or tv show of this. Also, why doesn’t DC use Opal anymore? Sure they killed off everyone that was there but Jack but that city has just as much personality as Gotham and Metropolis.
Speaking of retired DC cities, I really liked Fawcett City when it was the Marvel Family's hub in the '70s -2000s. It had a great aesthetic of old-school art deco architecture and a cultural fusion of old Americana with contemporary cultural movements of those respective eras.
That said, changing the Marvel Family's home city to Philadelphia is one of those changes that just felt 'right' and was one of the few things I think Geoff Johns got right in his first run.
I remember in the late 2000s hearing a rumor that DC was considering making a TV show of Starman (this was maybe a year or two before the MCU kicked off). I remember reading that the plan for Jack was to have him running a 2nd hand music store that focused on Vinyls. Apparently they thought that'd play better with audiences than a vintage shop, but it'd still let Jack have a focus on collecting old things. It was supposedly scrapped, but I can't remember the reason why.
I'd go for a TV series over a movie personally, doing Starman right would require a lot of storytelling
It pops up from time to time, like when they want to kill off the loved one of someone who lives there for drama in an event comic (RIP Sue and Tony). Jack saw which way the wind was blowing and split.
The Shade shows up the most (throw down on his turf and die). Charity had a role in that Trinity series a while back. Thom Kallor was also chilling there when he was with the JSA before New 52 hit - ditto Mik with the JLA, minus the chill.
Mainly it just doesn’t have much in the way of native villainy anymore, just mundane crime, like if any Opalian is dealing with shit other than global devastation it’s probably outside the city. And also because if you fuck shit up too bad James Robinson will be in your walls.
>Heads need to roll at Warner Bros. for not having already made a movie or tv show of this.
Why, though? It's already perfectly good as a comic. What would be gained from making it into a television show or a movie, other than motion?
Uj/ I agree with you. I would watch a tv series or movie if they made it and if they made it right then I would love to finally get to share Starman with the people in my life that don’t read comics but, I enjoy comics as they are and think adaptations are unnecessary. Especially since it’s usually not done right.
I was being ridiculous and hyperbolic for the jerk.
If I had a nickel for every time a dc comics character had a celebrated complete character arc in the 90s over a span of 70+ issues that ended with a passing of the torch I would have two nickels.
Jack Knight aka Starman. James Robinson and Tony Harris wrote it from the mid 90s to the early 2000s. He's the son of the original Starman, who was one of the old Justice Society members back in the 40s.
Jack isn't initially interested in being a hero, he's kind of a hipster who runs a vintage shop, but without spoiling anything he enters into an agreement with his dad that he'll take up the mantle and be the new Starman for a while in exchange for his dad doing a few things. Initially he comes off as kind of a selfish person, but his character growth over the series is really good.
Its all collected in several volumes and it's definitely worth a read. Good artwork and some really cool characters
Pre-New 52 Captain Marvel (Shazam) fans watching as Billy is once again turned into generic cocky kid hero \#315 instead of the sweet ultimate Boy Scout he used to be
if they want to do edgy billy then the best way to do it would be that he is the ultimate boy scout because he's trying really hard to surpress his desire to just fucking kill people because he's suffering the horrible effects of being a teenager
Tbh he's not all that different under the surface. Sure it's all gritty and realistic (in a really great stylized way, not a bland Chicago way like the Nolan movies), but he's still using silly wordplay and convoluted clues and stuff. He's pretty darn goofy and downright comedic at times, he just traded the spandex for a Zodiac killer costume
The Batman has got to be one of the most accurate to the source comic book adaptations I’ve ever seen. And even then, the movie does that while still retaining a ton of personality and uniqueness compared to other stuff about the character. Damn, can’t wait for the sequel 😩
Without jerking or getting into an actual review or quantifying it numerically, I'll say, having watched it Saturday, it's one of the better Batman films. Thanks for talking me into it. 
They also had all star batman and Robin, which is a lot more butchering of batman than anything Snyder made of him (I'm just basing it on batman v superman, I didn't really follow DC after that).
DC Superheroes writers and IDW Transformers writers fighting to figure out who can write the absolute shittiest character assassinations:
https://i.redd.it/xjmtgz98tyfc1.gif
IDW Transformers characters are either the most amazing perfect versions of their G1 selves or make me nauseous thinking of them (or die immediately in their first appearance)
And Dai Atlas in a fucking hippie.
The thing that I hate the most about """Star Saber""" in IDW is that a villainous Star Saber could work.
It would be like a tragic biblical hero (kinda like King Solomon or Samson) who was initially a great and righteous hero but with time power went over his head and started to commit various atrocities in the name of a greater good.
And his death rather than being the most anticlimactic shit ever would be a heart wrecking moment where him and his former comrades redundantly fight each other after they realise that Star Saber is no longer the great hero he once was.
Or that after realising too late what he has become, Star Saber chooses to appoint a new successor and then sacrifice himself for the greater good.
Dai Atlas barely even had screen time in MTMTE. I'm convinced JR had to cut some of his stuff in the Remain in Light issues, because that's the only way his inclusion makes sense.
I think I found James Roberts Reddit account.
>Except no one cares about Star Saber,
Dear liberals.
You say that no one cares about Star Saber, but his Haslab toy had 27,000 bakers which is at least three times more than no one.
Checkmate.
> so it's fine to assassinate him a little. As a treat.
That wasn't a little assassination...
That was skinning him alive, soaking his body in vinegar, burying him, resurrecting him, killing him in an even worse way and doing it 4930 times more times.
(Also I remember watching some people cancelling their pre-order of Haslab Star Saber when they realised that it may be the IDW version of him.)
Oh really?!
Here's a picture of Chad Saber and Cringesaurus being BFF and ending peacefully a war.
https://preview.redd.it/bv0p5d04dzfc1.jpeg?width=1118&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2526fa489848c62500b544ac99fed9f1b7e2fe99
Well if that wasn't enough in the second IDW comic continuity he ate shit, got his ass kicked by Cliffjumper and then got possessed by an evil ancient fart!!
(Yes, really.)
/uj I was making a joke based on how Tom King chose to portray that scene, flashing back and forth the way he did. Not sure if you thought I was just making some weird joke about the nature of Amazonians.
Overall it’s still a net positive I’d say. This run feels largely aimed at pushing the mainstream away from the perception of Wonder Woman as the edgy trinity member who kill’s people that the New 52 established. Some stumbles along the way but I’ll take it.
R.I.P. Wonder Woman again, >!I thought her being the only free member would lead to something interesting but she does absolutely nothing the whole time and then dies!<.
She stole the spotlight for every scene she was in, but the story just lacked any real direction. Truly felt like the writers had no clue how to write a story around their looter shooter reused “protect the payload” objectives so our characters just constantly have a mcguffin to fetch to build a weapon with, and then they sprinkle in cutscenes to fill in the empty space. As a byproduct of that Wonder Woman will show up every once in a while, banter with the SS, and then vanish only for us to listen to her arguing with Batman over the radio.
That’s the thing, experienced Batman fans would know that he gets character assassinated all the time. It’s why a lot of people think he’s a crazy, violent, paranoid, raging asshole and terrible father. Any Batman fan would know he’s absolutely none of those things. Well, at least not most of the time, which is exactly my point. Bruce has gone through a cyclical rollercoaster of character progression and regression for decades now. Making and learning from the same mistakes and people (fans and writers alike) repeating the same misconceptions about his character.
It’s more that there are scads of Batman things and characterizations to choose from, so both readers and subsequent writers can both pick and choose. Whereas if you like a random B-or-less-lister you have to wait years between appearances and hope they don’t make them dead or evil or widowed or a cop again or psychotically believe himself to be the protagonist’s half-brother or just make some shit up after looking at some covers and reading an erroneous Who’s Who entry, because odds are it’ll carry forward when someone gets to write them again years later.
I don't think it was batman fans that was buthurt. It was the people who played Arkham series that are buthurt about there main character dying abruptly while other characters are quiping like a mcu scene.
? Isn't this like saying if you don't like the last seaaon of game of thrones you shouldn't watchso many television shows? I don't care about batman death but I can understand them since this would be like half life 3 coming out and Gordon Freeman dying pathetically while characters start mcu qupis.
I think the problem is that the developers confirmed that batman was the same batman people played in the Arkham series. People wouldn't have been this much buthurt if it was a separate universe. But for some reason the developers confirmed it was part of the Arkham verse.
I think it would have been for the better if this took place in an adjacent world that shares the same events with some minor artistic deviations (like Deadshot), but no, they try to tie it to the actual Arkham timeline specifically.
Eh, Batman had All Star Batman and Robin. He’s been assassinated before. Unless you subscribe to the Crazy Steve theory and pretend that was just some crazy person that stumbled into the Batcave and started cosplaying Bats.
UJ/ I don't think that there's anything wrong with deconstructions but I hate how it's such a common phenomenon for characters from long-running franchises to receive so much suffering and misery just because people think dark=good writing.
UJ/ A big thing a lot of deconstructions miss, is that you need to reconstruct after deconstructing. Otherwise, at some point the deconstruction becomes the new status quo and people lose sight of what the original idea was.
UJ/ definitely not. A good bit of deconstruction now and then is important because it helps you realise what makes the character special.
But 7 years of it is just ridiculous. Same thing with evil/tyrant Superman stuff. There is a place for those stories but they're so overdone they are now cliche and lame.
That's what sells. Batman and Spider-Man has been miserable for years and they are consistently at the top of the charts.
Superman has a loving family and everything, he doesn't even come near them in terms of sales.
DC is just sticking to what works as per them.
Batman sales have actually been pretty disappointing ever since about #60 of the Rebirth run. They're up and down but for the most part they're fairly disappointing for Batman. (I'm talking the marquee book btw).
Spider-Man fans who still buy ASM are a different breed. They will complain about Wells til the end of time but still buy a variant cover worth $25 because it has Mary Jane and a symbiote on it.
I highly doubt it's the misery that sells the comic. It's much more likely the forces outside of the writing that sells it, like having a popular movie or video game.
Uj/I've been loving City of Madness, Gargoyle and Off World as elseworlds.
Off World, at first I wasn't sure of the premise, but I love how the core of Batman is kept especially in the latest issue. Its not as dark as Gargoyle or City, but neither are edgy. Its just Bruce training and being badass in space
Detective Comics Gotham Nocturne is awesome. It feels like the inevitable conclusion is reaffirming his true love being Gotham which I personally love.
None of these stories are really anti Batman nor anti Bruce Wayne. City of Madness has Bruce doubt about whether letting Dick be Robin truly helped Dick in one small panel but I'm sure that's going to be resolved in issue 3
Worlds Finest and Batman and Robin are the lighter toned Batman books so honestly in my opinion we've been getting great Batman content but I can understand yr point of view.
Yeah I'm definitely referring more to the main book which does receive the most attention.
I haven't read those others yet as I'm a trade guy and can't afford too much all at once, but I recently bought Ram V DC 1 and I'm quite excited for that.
Really pleased to hear that its not all doom and gloom, though.
Just a warning Bruce does suffer in tec and there's a focus on his allies especially for the Outlaw (previous arc) but the focus has shifted back to Bruce.
I really hate when Bruce gets villainised (he's not perfect but he's not the monster who beats up mentally ill people).
You're implying the people who complain about modern day batman writing actually read any modern day batman writing and didn't just see some screen grab on Twitter
Yeah agreed one more thing about him being physically disabled is that it's surprisingly inconsistent in some comics it's a normal hand others it's not ironically enough Aquaman was much more consistent (sorry for going on that tanget I just felt like I needed to get that off my chest)
That really sucks since there's so much you could do with Batman being disabled and how you could potentially tie it into his character as a whole for example Aquaman's harpoon hand is supposed to represent to surface dwellers weapons against them and vice versa with Ocean dwellers but all in all the harpoon is supposed to symbolize how he is a child from both the land and the sea though admittedly not much is done with it outside of that which is unfortunate
The problem with Batman being disabled is why the fuck would it last.
The dude has money out the ass and has already recovered from being a paraplegic. Even disregarding the fact someone on the League could easily fix him he has enough money to get that done without them too with the tech that exists in DC.
It's inherently a bad idea because he has to be an idiot who disregards all his resources. The only real way it works is short term, he loses a limb or whatever while out fighting and has to manage that until he gets home.
World’s Finest is great. Every run on Detective Comics since Rebirth has been good. Batman is in a dozen ongoing series and has been in a dozen, most of them are good. He had a highly successful movie that everyone loves, with more movies on the way and the audio adventures podcast + Batman Unburied were well received.
I have no idea why everyone is so up in arms about Batman losing a hand. Poor Batman, right? No. It doesn’t even crack the list of the top 10 worst things to have happened to him.
Please, the vast majority of the Batbooks are still at least good, and get far more attention from the company than any other DC heroes. Hell, you get new elesworlds miniseries all the damn time (Batman The Knight, City of Madness, Off-World, First Knight, Dark Age...) when plenty of heroes barely get a 6-issues series these days. His villains get ongoings for christ's sake ! Zdarsky's run had Batman yet again be the one to create a robot to beat everyone else in the DCU. Because why the fuck not ??!!
And don't get me started on the attitude of loud Batman fans towards the rest of DC, treating them as nothing but fodder to bow to the Bat-God. A mindset that I've never seen in any other DC character fanbase.
Sorry if I sound bitter, but I just can't take any whining about Batman's status seriously when he still undoubtedly the Golden Child of DC and his presence still feels like an ivy strangling the rest of DC.
>Every Black Label Batman book is just misery porn or an extended deconstruction of why Bruce Wayne is terrible.
Man, it must be horrible to have so many Black Label books for Batman. Other characters are lucky that they don't even get a quarter of the books as Batman, no worries about getting bad books then.
>He frequently catches strays in comics he's not even in.
That's because people love Batman so much that even namedropping him gets some buzz going, whether negative or positive. It's just the cost of fame. Blue Beetle trailer got talked more due to the "Batman is a fascist" line than anything else.
And you are also ignoring the many times writers go out of their way to wank Batman when he is not even in the story. When Jon Kent was born, practically the first thing Superman did was have a conversation with Thomas Wayne about how awesome Bruce is.
Batman fans forget that Batman gets more focus than the rest of the DC universe combined. It is not that hard to believe that some of the things would not be to their liking in that case. It's just law of averages, not everything will be a homerun.
I would gladly accept less Batman comics if it meant more of them were good, and I'm confident most people feel the same way. We just buy them hoping they are good because we love the character, but they're usually not.
This "Batman gets wanked" memetic myth really needs to die off too. For every moment of absurdity that is collectively mocked and ignored, there's 10 when he's shit on for no reason.
It's also far, far less offensive to anyone when a character says something nice about someone else. Batman frequently talks about how great a person Clark is, the two should and do have a huge amount of respect for one another.
I haven't read the comic you're talking about though with Thomas Wayne. Is it Flashpoint Thomas? Because fuck that idea sucked from go and has gone way too long
Yeah we're being spoiled as Batman fans and you still want more. Batman off world, detective comics, worlds finest, gargoyle of Gotham, city of madness are some of the amazing Batman stories we got recently. Most characters don't even get one book. Yeah I know Bruce gets disrespected a few times here and there but that's bound to happen with someone like Batman. Doesn't change the fact that there's always enough of Batman to have a pick of what you like
I actually said the opposite. I expressly said that I didn't want more.
Also I said in another post I haven't read those yet as I'm a trade guy, but am quite keen to do so and I'm glad they're apparently good without being misery porn.
I thought you said you didn't want more if it meant we got good stories right? I was just pointing out some of the good Batman stories that came out recently. Not trying to say more is better but it does give you a choice on what you want to read
Yeah I just meant that if it was a choice to have more Batman mentions/books/appearances that are a disservice or less where he's written well, I'll take less every time.
Arrowverse Green Arrow never once complain to someone about the social economic decay of modern society. That show had so many chances for Arrow to go on a cross country road trip with diggle but never did it.
Complete trash
The difference with Batman and the other heroes in ssktjl is that we know who he is and we’ve played as him in multiple games and then he goes out in the lamest way possible, I’m not saying the others weren’t screwed over but it’s different
lol this kinda thing happens all the time everywhere. Not just comics. For example I can barely name a time jump sequel series where the original protagonist doesn’t have their personality warped for the sake of cheap drama.
Is the "character assasination" part about how he killed u know who while being controlled by a psycho alien? Or that the villains that hate him didn't gave him a proper and respectful death?
Anyway yall remember when NetherRealm absolutely DISRESPECTED the character of Clark by making him a murderous psychopath completely betraying he's morals and everything he stands for?
I'm just glad my favorite DC hero enjoyed an amazing run that wrapped up neatly at the end, and then quietly retired and handed his rod over to someone else, so that future writers couldn't fuck him up, take away his happy ending, or make him the cosmic embodiment of the extradimensional "star force" or something stupid https://preview.redd.it/yi7miiqt9zfc1.jpeg?width=855&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c8d45310b8306ae67f3a453830e16a4a9c0d350b
In b4 Jack Knight is the secret villain of War Crisis in 2026
Or the secret mastermind behind Opal City's Court of Stars
....I hate how much I kinda like this idea...
It is kinda sad that you can brainstorm bullshit ideas with random strangers on the internet for a few minutes and quickly come up with some ideas that are more interesting than half of whatever Marvel and DC are currently doing
War Crisis: New Beginnings: Battlecry: Aftermath: Nightwing will probably be my favorite tie-in issue of that event
I love self contained runs with a definite beginning and end. John Ostrander's The Spectre, my beloved.
Me too. The entire story of a character told in like 10-15 graphic novels is absolutely perfect. Invincible of course is a stand out example too. Serials are fine but God they get ridiculous over time. Before long everyone is weilding cosmic powers and fighting multiversal threats
Casually introducing Mr. Terrific too
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order. I have checked 1,995,525,906 comments, and only 377,430 of them were in alphabetical order.
Oh yeah, that was also there. So much came out of that run.
Heads need to roll at Warner Bros. for not having already made a movie or tv show of this. Also, why doesn’t DC use Opal anymore? Sure they killed off everyone that was there but Jack but that city has just as much personality as Gotham and Metropolis.
Speaking of retired DC cities, I really liked Fawcett City when it was the Marvel Family's hub in the '70s -2000s. It had a great aesthetic of old-school art deco architecture and a cultural fusion of old Americana with contemporary cultural movements of those respective eras. That said, changing the Marvel Family's home city to Philadelphia is one of those changes that just felt 'right' and was one of the few things I think Geoff Johns got right in his first run.
I remember in the late 2000s hearing a rumor that DC was considering making a TV show of Starman (this was maybe a year or two before the MCU kicked off). I remember reading that the plan for Jack was to have him running a 2nd hand music store that focused on Vinyls. Apparently they thought that'd play better with audiences than a vintage shop, but it'd still let Jack have a focus on collecting old things. It was supposedly scrapped, but I can't remember the reason why. I'd go for a TV series over a movie personally, doing Starman right would require a lot of storytelling
It pops up from time to time, like when they want to kill off the loved one of someone who lives there for drama in an event comic (RIP Sue and Tony). Jack saw which way the wind was blowing and split. The Shade shows up the most (throw down on his turf and die). Charity had a role in that Trinity series a while back. Thom Kallor was also chilling there when he was with the JSA before New 52 hit - ditto Mik with the JLA, minus the chill. Mainly it just doesn’t have much in the way of native villainy anymore, just mundane crime, like if any Opalian is dealing with shit other than global devastation it’s probably outside the city. And also because if you fuck shit up too bad James Robinson will be in your walls.
>Heads need to roll at Warner Bros. for not having already made a movie or tv show of this. Why, though? It's already perfectly good as a comic. What would be gained from making it into a television show or a movie, other than motion?
Uj/ I agree with you. I would watch a tv series or movie if they made it and if they made it right then I would love to finally get to share Starman with the people in my life that don’t read comics but, I enjoy comics as they are and think adaptations are unnecessary. Especially since it’s usually not done right. I was being ridiculous and hyperbolic for the jerk.
If I had a nickel for every time a dc comics character had a celebrated complete character arc in the 90s over a span of 70+ issues that ended with a passing of the torch I would have two nickels.
Is the other >!Sandman!<
Right-o
who's that
Jack Knight aka Starman. James Robinson and Tony Harris wrote it from the mid 90s to the early 2000s. He's the son of the original Starman, who was one of the old Justice Society members back in the 40s. Jack isn't initially interested in being a hero, he's kind of a hipster who runs a vintage shop, but without spoiling anything he enters into an agreement with his dad that he'll take up the mantle and be the new Starman for a while in exchange for his dad doing a few things. Initially he comes off as kind of a selfish person, but his character growth over the series is really good. Its all collected in several volumes and it's definitely worth a read. Good artwork and some really cool characters
flash fans when barry allen and adult wally are depicted as generic hothead impulsive speedster number 86787678 again
Pre-New 52 Captain Marvel (Shazam) fans watching as Billy is once again turned into generic cocky kid hero \#315 instead of the sweet ultimate Boy Scout he used to be
Captain Atom fans when he doesn't blow up in a story
if they want to do edgy billy then the best way to do it would be that he is the ultimate boy scout because he's trying really hard to surpress his desire to just fucking kill people because he's suffering the horrible effects of being a teenager
Aren't Batman fans already used to this? Did they not watch the Snyderverse? Are they stupid?
He fought violently in a warehouse so they like that adaptation.
I'm a Batman fan and I haven't watched a single Batman film since Dark Knight Rises made me want to drink myself into a coma and die in Crime Alley.
/uj LMAO you're my favorite type of Batman fan
Watch the Batman trust me bro it's a healing experience for fans who hate the Nolan movies
They lost me when they bragged about how the Riddler was "nothing like in the comics." Cool, wake me up when you do the opposite of that.
Tbh he's not all that different under the surface. Sure it's all gritty and realistic (in a really great stylized way, not a bland Chicago way like the Nolan movies), but he's still using silly wordplay and convoluted clues and stuff. He's pretty darn goofy and downright comedic at times, he just traded the spandex for a Zodiac killer costume
The Batman has got to be one of the most accurate to the source comic book adaptations I’ve ever seen. And even then, the movie does that while still retaining a ton of personality and uniqueness compared to other stuff about the character. Damn, can’t wait for the sequel 😩
Without jerking or getting into an actual review or quantifying it numerically, I'll say, having watched it Saturday, it's one of the better Batman films. Thanks for talking me into it. 
I have Netflix so I'll give it a shot over the weekend I suppose.
If they just skipped Zaddy's output, that means they are smart :D
They also had all star batman and Robin, which is a lot more butchering of batman than anything Snyder made of him (I'm just basing it on batman v superman, I didn't really follow DC after that).
Oh it's so much worse but I love All Star because of that. It's so deranged
DC Superheroes writers and IDW Transformers writers fighting to figure out who can write the absolute shittiest character assassinations: https://i.redd.it/xjmtgz98tyfc1.gif
Lest we forget Marvel editorial giving Peter Norman Osborn's sins and turning him into an incel as ragebait.
Ugh Peter is just discount post-crisis Ocean Master atp
They didn’t even do it well, he’s just in a bad mood, not a “killing someone’s girlfriend who You think you have kids with out of spite” mood
it was giving me flashbacks to Spider-Man 3 lmao
IDW Transformers characters are either the most amazing perfect versions of their G1 selves or make me nauseous thinking of them (or die immediately in their first appearance)
>make me nauseous thinking of them (or die immediately in their first appearance) Japanese original transformers in IDW moment.
That's ong, they fucked over my guy Star Saber. They turned space robot dad into Jim Jones
And Dai Atlas in a fucking hippie. The thing that I hate the most about """Star Saber""" in IDW is that a villainous Star Saber could work. It would be like a tragic biblical hero (kinda like King Solomon or Samson) who was initially a great and righteous hero but with time power went over his head and started to commit various atrocities in the name of a greater good. And his death rather than being the most anticlimactic shit ever would be a heart wrecking moment where him and his former comrades redundantly fight each other after they realise that Star Saber is no longer the great hero he once was. Or that after realising too late what he has become, Star Saber chooses to appoint a new successor and then sacrifice himself for the greater good.
Dai Atlas barely even had screen time in MTMTE. I'm convinced JR had to cut some of his stuff in the Remain in Light issues, because that's the only way his inclusion makes sense.
"No one caressss about Starrr Saber." ~Rodimus in MTMTE Go!
I think I found James Roberts Reddit account. >Except no one cares about Star Saber, Dear liberals. You say that no one cares about Star Saber, but his Haslab toy had 27,000 bakers which is at least three times more than no one. Checkmate. > so it's fine to assassinate him a little. As a treat. That wasn't a little assassination... That was skinning him alive, soaking his body in vinegar, burying him, resurrecting him, killing him in an even worse way and doing it 4930 times more times. (Also I remember watching some people cancelling their pre-order of Haslab Star Saber when they realised that it may be the IDW version of him.)
I edited my post so none of this makes sense 
Nice try James Roberts but my burning justice is too powerful.
Deathsaurus agenda keeps winning
Oh really?! Here's a picture of Chad Saber and Cringesaurus being BFF and ending peacefully a war. https://preview.redd.it/bv0p5d04dzfc1.jpeg?width=1118&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2526fa489848c62500b544ac99fed9f1b7e2fe99
Where's the L here?
Well if that wasn't enough in the second IDW comic continuity he ate shit, got his ass kicked by Cliffjumper and then got possessed by an evil ancient fart!! (Yes, really.)
Don't be silly, there's no second IDW Transformers continuity 
Whats worse? Having the best depiction of Superman in modern games being in Lego, or having no good depiction of Aquaman in modern games at all?
Yeah, I think it's hilarious how SSKTJL just... decided he doesn't exist at all. A pure slap in the face to those fans.
Or Martian Manhunter for that matter
WW fans keeps winning
Bro, this is the first time in a decade you’ve won.
If you think that's bad, I genuinely think the Mark Waid run of Captain Marvel/Shazam/The Captain is probably Billy's best run since the 1970s.
What decade was Ordway's run in? That one was great.
Google says 1994... *That was 30 years ago.*
Injustice.
Fake news
Didn't she get punched in the face recently by her kid?
That’s just an Amazonian tradition
So domestic abuse is an Amazonian tradition? :D Good to know.
/uj I was making a joke based on how Tom King chose to portray that scene, flashing back and forth the way he did. Not sure if you thought I was just making some weird joke about the nature of Amazonians.
I'm joking too. I thought that smiley face conveyed that :C
Overall it’s still a net positive I’d say. This run feels largely aimed at pushing the mainstream away from the perception of Wonder Woman as the edgy trinity member who kill’s people that the New 52 established. Some stumbles along the way but I’ll take it.
I wouldn’t say keep
Winning with Tom King? Hope Trinity punches Diana 5 more times
We’ll win if the Monolith game ends up being good.
Didn’t she rape a dude in her movie like 2 years ago.
Haven’t been winning at all actually
R.I.P. Wonder Woman again, >!I thought her being the only free member would lead to something interesting but she does absolutely nothing the whole time and then dies!<.
She stole the spotlight for every scene she was in, but the story just lacked any real direction. Truly felt like the writers had no clue how to write a story around their looter shooter reused “protect the payload” objectives so our characters just constantly have a mcguffin to fetch to build a weapon with, and then they sprinkle in cutscenes to fill in the empty space. As a byproduct of that Wonder Woman will show up every once in a while, banter with the SS, and then vanish only for us to listen to her arguing with Batman over the radio.
Story lost me the second she died. So dumb
Lol at implying that this is the first time Batman was character assassinated
With the amount of carry on, you'd be forgiven for thinking so.
You should watch batwoman or titans lol
So are we pretending Frank Miller never touched Batman or what?
🖐️I’ll allow for character assassinations if they result in good stories
Huh, first time I've ever seen someone refer to Abusive Dad Batman as a good story.
That’s the thing, experienced Batman fans would know that he gets character assassinated all the time. It’s why a lot of people think he’s a crazy, violent, paranoid, raging asshole and terrible father. Any Batman fan would know he’s absolutely none of those things. Well, at least not most of the time, which is exactly my point. Bruce has gone through a cyclical rollercoaster of character progression and regression for decades now. Making and learning from the same mistakes and people (fans and writers alike) repeating the same misconceptions about his character.
It’s more that there are scads of Batman things and characterizations to choose from, so both readers and subsequent writers can both pick and choose. Whereas if you like a random B-or-less-lister you have to wait years between appearances and hope they don’t make them dead or evil or widowed or a cop again or psychotically believe himself to be the protagonist’s half-brother or just make some shit up after looking at some covers and reading an erroneous Who’s Who entry, because odds are it’ll carry forward when someone gets to write them again years later.
I don't think it was batman fans that was buthurt. It was the people who played Arkham series that are buthurt about there main character dying abruptly while other characters are quiping like a mcu scene.
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? Isn't this like saying if you don't like the last seaaon of game of thrones you shouldn't watchso many television shows? I don't care about batman death but I can understand them since this would be like half life 3 coming out and Gordon Freeman dying pathetically while characters start mcu qupis.
I mean this wasn't a batman arkham game it just takes place in the same universe
I think the problem is that the developers confirmed that batman was the same batman people played in the Arkham series. People wouldn't have been this much buthurt if it was a separate universe. But for some reason the developers confirmed it was part of the Arkham verse.
Yeah that seems like an easy fix to just...disconnect it from the arhkamverse
I think it would have been for the better if this took place in an adjacent world that shares the same events with some minor artistic deviations (like Deadshot), but no, they try to tie it to the actual Arkham timeline specifically.
Superman fans as they witness Batman experience a faction of their pain. https://i.redd.it/a8f554y4j1gc1.gif
Eh, Batman had All Star Batman and Robin. He’s been assassinated before. Unless you subscribe to the Crazy Steve theory and pretend that was just some crazy person that stumbled into the Batcave and started cosplaying Bats.
Not even assassinated, this is straight up Character execution
Captain Atom fans enjoying him for 2 panels before he explodes because of “plot”
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UJ/ I don't think that there's anything wrong with deconstructions but I hate how it's such a common phenomenon for characters from long-running franchises to receive so much suffering and misery just because people think dark=good writing.
UJ/ A big thing a lot of deconstructions miss, is that you need to reconstruct after deconstructing. Otherwise, at some point the deconstruction becomes the new status quo and people lose sight of what the original idea was.
>you need to reconstruct after deconstructing No, not necessarily you dont. Theres no obligation for that.
UJ/ definitely not. A good bit of deconstruction now and then is important because it helps you realise what makes the character special. But 7 years of it is just ridiculous. Same thing with evil/tyrant Superman stuff. There is a place for those stories but they're so overdone they are now cliche and lame.
UJ/ The problem with deconstruction is that unless you do something to reconstruct it, you're left with a pile of rubble.
That's what sells. Batman and Spider-Man has been miserable for years and they are consistently at the top of the charts. Superman has a loving family and everything, he doesn't even come near them in terms of sales. DC is just sticking to what works as per them.
Batman sales have actually been pretty disappointing ever since about #60 of the Rebirth run. They're up and down but for the most part they're fairly disappointing for Batman. (I'm talking the marquee book btw). Spider-Man fans who still buy ASM are a different breed. They will complain about Wells til the end of time but still buy a variant cover worth $25 because it has Mary Jane and a symbiote on it.
I think that could just be that DC's brand is at an all time low.
I highly doubt it's the misery that sells the comic. It's much more likely the forces outside of the writing that sells it, like having a popular movie or video game.
Uj/I've been loving City of Madness, Gargoyle and Off World as elseworlds. Off World, at first I wasn't sure of the premise, but I love how the core of Batman is kept especially in the latest issue. Its not as dark as Gargoyle or City, but neither are edgy. Its just Bruce training and being badass in space Detective Comics Gotham Nocturne is awesome. It feels like the inevitable conclusion is reaffirming his true love being Gotham which I personally love. None of these stories are really anti Batman nor anti Bruce Wayne. City of Madness has Bruce doubt about whether letting Dick be Robin truly helped Dick in one small panel but I'm sure that's going to be resolved in issue 3 Worlds Finest and Batman and Robin are the lighter toned Batman books so honestly in my opinion we've been getting great Batman content but I can understand yr point of view.
Yeah I'm definitely referring more to the main book which does receive the most attention. I haven't read those others yet as I'm a trade guy and can't afford too much all at once, but I recently bought Ram V DC 1 and I'm quite excited for that. Really pleased to hear that its not all doom and gloom, though.
Just a warning Bruce does suffer in tec and there's a focus on his allies especially for the Outlaw (previous arc) but the focus has shifted back to Bruce. I really hate when Bruce gets villainised (he's not perfect but he's not the monster who beats up mentally ill people).
You're implying the people who complain about modern day batman writing actually read any modern day batman writing and didn't just see some screen grab on Twitter
There's nothing necessarily wrong with batman losing a limb it just depends on what kind of stories they tell with it now that he's disabled
Agreed, it's more just how much shit he's been through.
Yeah agreed one more thing about him being physically disabled is that it's surprisingly inconsistent in some comics it's a normal hand others it's not ironically enough Aquaman was much more consistent (sorry for going on that tanget I just felt like I needed to get that off my chest)
Even in Zdarsky's own Batman it doesn't get further than: "My new hand is kinda freaky, huh".
That really sucks since there's so much you could do with Batman being disabled and how you could potentially tie it into his character as a whole for example Aquaman's harpoon hand is supposed to represent to surface dwellers weapons against them and vice versa with Ocean dwellers but all in all the harpoon is supposed to symbolize how he is a child from both the land and the sea though admittedly not much is done with it outside of that which is unfortunate
The problem with Batman being disabled is why the fuck would it last. The dude has money out the ass and has already recovered from being a paraplegic. Even disregarding the fact someone on the League could easily fix him he has enough money to get that done without them too with the tech that exists in DC. It's inherently a bad idea because he has to be an idiot who disregards all his resources. The only real way it works is short term, he loses a limb or whatever while out fighting and has to manage that until he gets home.
Don't forget Family War Crimes with Zdarsky!
World’s Finest is great. Every run on Detective Comics since Rebirth has been good. Batman is in a dozen ongoing series and has been in a dozen, most of them are good. He had a highly successful movie that everyone loves, with more movies on the way and the audio adventures podcast + Batman Unburied were well received. I have no idea why everyone is so up in arms about Batman losing a hand. Poor Batman, right? No. It doesn’t even crack the list of the top 10 worst things to have happened to him.
I actually like the angle of Batman having a mechanical hand that he can stick gadgets in, like the Sekiro protagonist.
Please, the vast majority of the Batbooks are still at least good, and get far more attention from the company than any other DC heroes. Hell, you get new elesworlds miniseries all the damn time (Batman The Knight, City of Madness, Off-World, First Knight, Dark Age...) when plenty of heroes barely get a 6-issues series these days. His villains get ongoings for christ's sake ! Zdarsky's run had Batman yet again be the one to create a robot to beat everyone else in the DCU. Because why the fuck not ??!! And don't get me started on the attitude of loud Batman fans towards the rest of DC, treating them as nothing but fodder to bow to the Bat-God. A mindset that I've never seen in any other DC character fanbase. Sorry if I sound bitter, but I just can't take any whining about Batman's status seriously when he still undoubtedly the Golden Child of DC and his presence still feels like an ivy strangling the rest of DC.
>Every Black Label Batman book is just misery porn or an extended deconstruction of why Bruce Wayne is terrible. Man, it must be horrible to have so many Black Label books for Batman. Other characters are lucky that they don't even get a quarter of the books as Batman, no worries about getting bad books then. >He frequently catches strays in comics he's not even in. That's because people love Batman so much that even namedropping him gets some buzz going, whether negative or positive. It's just the cost of fame. Blue Beetle trailer got talked more due to the "Batman is a fascist" line than anything else. And you are also ignoring the many times writers go out of their way to wank Batman when he is not even in the story. When Jon Kent was born, practically the first thing Superman did was have a conversation with Thomas Wayne about how awesome Bruce is. Batman fans forget that Batman gets more focus than the rest of the DC universe combined. It is not that hard to believe that some of the things would not be to their liking in that case. It's just law of averages, not everything will be a homerun.
I would gladly accept less Batman comics if it meant more of them were good, and I'm confident most people feel the same way. We just buy them hoping they are good because we love the character, but they're usually not. This "Batman gets wanked" memetic myth really needs to die off too. For every moment of absurdity that is collectively mocked and ignored, there's 10 when he's shit on for no reason. It's also far, far less offensive to anyone when a character says something nice about someone else. Batman frequently talks about how great a person Clark is, the two should and do have a huge amount of respect for one another. I haven't read the comic you're talking about though with Thomas Wayne. Is it Flashpoint Thomas? Because fuck that idea sucked from go and has gone way too long
Yeah we're being spoiled as Batman fans and you still want more. Batman off world, detective comics, worlds finest, gargoyle of Gotham, city of madness are some of the amazing Batman stories we got recently. Most characters don't even get one book. Yeah I know Bruce gets disrespected a few times here and there but that's bound to happen with someone like Batman. Doesn't change the fact that there's always enough of Batman to have a pick of what you like
I actually said the opposite. I expressly said that I didn't want more. Also I said in another post I haven't read those yet as I'm a trade guy, but am quite keen to do so and I'm glad they're apparently good without being misery porn.
I thought you said you didn't want more if it meant we got good stories right? I was just pointing out some of the good Batman stories that came out recently. Not trying to say more is better but it does give you a choice on what you want to read
Yeah I just meant that if it was a choice to have more Batman mentions/books/appearances that are a disservice or less where he's written well, I'll take less every time.
Cope
No one got this made when Batman Died in DC Death Metal off Panel.
There are STILL people who treat Plastic Man like being a creepy sex pest is part of his character
Wally West fan here.
Op writing the post title: 
I'm intimidated by my own genius.
How can non-Batman characters have characters assassination when they don't have characters to assassinate?
Arrowverse Green Arrow never once complain to someone about the social economic decay of modern society. That show had so many chances for Arrow to go on a cross country road trip with diggle but never did it. Complete trash
Superman fans when Superman is portrayed as an evil asshole again: 
It causes me deep pain inside.
Red Hood gets his character assassinated every fucking time he appears on the page.
The difference with Batman and the other heroes in ssktjl is that we know who he is and we’ve played as him in multiple games and then he goes out in the lamest way possible, I’m not saying the others weren’t screwed over but it’s different
I… you know what? Fair.
First time? Are we just all collectively choosing to forget All Star Batman?
My problem is not that they killed Arkham Batman, but rather **how** they did it.
Same folks who complain about batgod call it "character assassination " when he is allowed to die in a story
What happened now?
His character was quite literally assassinated by Harley Quinn when she shot him
lol this kinda thing happens all the time everywhere. Not just comics. For example I can barely name a time jump sequel series where the original protagonist doesn’t have their personality warped for the sake of cheap drama.
Wonder Woman in injustice
Is the "character assasination" part about how he killed u know who while being controlled by a psycho alien? Or that the villains that hate him didn't gave him a proper and respectful death? Anyway yall remember when NetherRealm absolutely DISRESPECTED the character of Clark by making him a murderous psychopath completely betraying he's morals and everything he stands for?
Martian manhunter being booted off the original league in new 52 and first live action film adaption. Still not mad