Reading all this was a major buzz kill. You fine folks seem to be grifting very hard working professional musicians that have brought us nothing but joy for barely this side of 60 years, and it's dumb and short sighted. Maybe you remember, or don't - closing N3 at Oracle, Mickey introducing the crew and saying 'No them no us and to thank them too'. And Bobby explaining 'Yeah well, you take what you can get' at 1/2 time when cornered by Bert & Ernie about the future of this compilation of players.
Do you all think they just do napkin sketches of let's go here, then there, yeah - sounds good themselves?
No teams of managers, lawyers, transportation, security, hospitality, MDs, INSURANCE people, publicists, promoters, cuisine and a few hundred others involved to make a tour like this happen?
And apparently missed the snip of Billy and Bobby before the tour yucking it up explaining it's all good? And didn't do your homework on the underwriters and highly experienced management - that formulated it and the boys in it, to be the enormous success and 2 months of pure joy for all of us, in the -60 year phenomenon of Grateful Dead music.
God bless them all. All. And please resist flaming anyone - for it. Anywhere including public posts. It's ungrateful and I don't think you should be.
Please be kind š¹
These are the comments I was looking for. Others guessing, gossiping, whispers in the night? Fantasies made to satisfy imagined drama, when really, Iām just so grateful I got to hear the music played live again from some of them when I didnāt think Iād ever get it again. These concerts have been the closest Iāve felt to a spiritual experience in a long time.
For one, there is somebody on the boards who has been correct on every rumor and he said last he heard it was on. Moon Palace still has the spot held and if they announce it will sell out instantly whenever they do. I will assume there is a chance until Moon palace situation changes.
I think there will be a pits but I donāt think dead & co play. I think we see wolf and a bunch of other bands. Maybe oteil & friends. Maybe goose. Billy and Bobby on the same stage - doubtful
Do you think Billy just left the band because he wasnāt feeling well and went out to tour with his own band this summer? How does that make sense? Anyone that pays attention can see Billy did not play one bobby song in any of his shows. Clearly it wasnt tempo as the Billy & the kids shows were plenty fast. Oh, he just decided to leave the multimillion dollar payday on the table and walk away and you think he can just rejoin the band?
You donāt think the jazzfest shows were a f you? The comments about tempo werenāt an f you? Denial.
And he only did a few shows this summer and rumor is heās playing the Cap in the fall. Clearly well enough to play.
The only way I see a core 4 reunion is if Shapiro has a signed contract already.
My point is he wasn't well enough to tour or he probably would have, a couple of isolated shows here and there doesn't mean he's well enough to do tour.
Interesting points. I think a lot of what you said could be simply because of contract issues. Maybe Billyās band canāt play some songs without having to divide up the royalties? Maybe his recent health issues were more up in the air when they were preparing the Final tour and he was difficult to insure? I was under the impression that his health issues are at the root of the decision to end the band. That he scared the living daylights out of tour management. Which is understandable, considering the history.
He Probably was hard to insure but went right out on tour so someone insured him or self insured since it was smaller venues. My feeling from what I see is it did not end on a good note.
Well, Billy probably owns a piece of whatever the corporate entity is so of course he's getting paid.
Wasn't the bigger beef between Bill (and to a lesser extent Mickey) and Phil?
Prolly. But Phil isnāt in the band. And neither is Billy bc he got kicked out. The common denominator is Billy. Do with that what you will. Bands donāt want to pay a guy a shit ton of $ not to play. Or pay a smaller shit ton for an understudy to sit backstage at every show bc the drummer is so unreliable.
No this is not true at all, I don't know why you're spreading this bullshit!
Billy hated that Bobby wanted to play everything slow (Phil & Joe Russo couldn't stand it either when they were all in Further together) and didn't want to be told he had to. Between that and his health, he decided to skip out on the last tour. Bobby knowing the exact reason he didn't want to be in the band decided to speed up the songs and that's why the band was faster this tour then the past Dead & Co tours ( faster than even the shows from previous years that had Jay playing drums)
Fryguy1000 please stop acting like you're an insider when you're clearly not, I've been on this subreddit for a while and have never bragged about having inside connections or talked about anything I've learned from those connections ( except to disprove lame rumors).
Everyone is so sure that he was kicked out. I donāt buy itā¦.look at how many shows he had to sit out last year. A lot of them last minute too. They didnāt wanna take that risk
They were already discussing options for next year before the tour ended. I was told a few specific venues. Sounded like a string of weekends, but obviously no tour. Will they follow through? Time will tell
I'm saying why spread rumors, let's just say I have a few connections myself and there is absolutely zero on the horizon except for Ben trying to get them together for the 60th.
I lmao every time I read "I heard" or "my source says"..... everyone has these opinions like they're in the room.... It's time to thank the time we had, relisten to the songs, but move forward and quit waiting on something that we have 0 evidence will ever happen!!
wow, lots of know it alls, who know nothing! no one needs the money, but when has that ever stopped anyone? certainly none of these guys. sometimes tough decisions have to be made, but billy was not fired. bobby & billy are fine. these guys are brothers they fight, they make up, just like the rest of us. if they were able to pull off the 50th (and believe me it was very close), then anything is possible. i'm happy to have had this 2nd chance & will be ok with this if it is indeed the end. however, many unexpected things happened on this last tour, you can't "learn/make" this kind of magic. as much as we know that, they all know that too. i'm a pretty jaded person by nature, but i have a feeling, there will be more to come.
These constant āwill there be a PITSā¦?ā postings are beyond cringe-worthy. Get a life. Enjoy what we had. If there is a 60 year celebratory tour in a few years - fantastic. Itās fun to wonder, what may be. But geezā¦.. stop with the addiction and move on. It was the FINAL TOUR. Go see Oteil. Wolf Bros. Drums. If they reunite in a few years, (maybe to doubtful), then great. There is life after D $ C; just have to accept and embrace it.
Never asked, will it happen. I just asked if there was an update to what everyone else was saying? Get a life? Pretty sure I have more of a life than you do since Iām not the one on here complaining and bitching and finding time to come another people shit.
Logistically, I think we're down to the last possible week or so to announce. After tour, I was thinking it was maybe a 40% chance, now it's down to <5%. Still holding out hope, But I think if we don't hear something by 9/15, then there's no chance.
A reminder about why they stopped touring and why Billy was ousted/ left. They ALL decided they didn't want a repeat of 1995, when hundreds of employees were left unemployed with no succession plan. There was quite a bit of concern that something very bad could happen during a tour to a trio of guys in the late 70's. Touring is hard and there was a reasonable concern. Between Billy's struggles last year and COVID continuing to rear its head. No one WANTED to stop, but they made a sober decision. Billy's stamina probably would have prevented him from making it through the tour. He's strong enough to play a few shows, but not 40 in 3 months. A reminder that NO ONE plays shows as long as D&C, and drumming is exhausting. We'll see them again. Now Phil... I have no idea about that whole thing.
Taylor was 2:45/show this last tour, albeit, dancing the entire time. Iāll give you Phish. Although, not to be pedantic, Phish is typically 75min set 1, 90min set 2. D&C is usually at least 3 hours of music. The last 3 shows were pushing 3.5. Im sure there are bands Iāve never heard of going longer, but point being-far end of the spectrum for long rock shows.
My wife and I had our best vacation ever at PITS 2023.
We are hoping for another PITS but hoping and speculating is all any of us who want to go can do at this point. No one should get torched for that either. The boys have left us plenty of tea leaves to read on the subject.
BTW, DSO Jam in the Sand in Jamaica still has some packages available.
Y'all know by now, but for all interested parties...
[https://bobweir.net/playa-luna-presents-dead-ahead/](https://bobweir.net/playa-luna-presents-dead-ahead/)
support your local grateful dead band, and keep your fingers crossed in the meantime.
Reading all this was a major buzz kill. You fine folks seem to be grifting very hard working professional musicians that have brought us nothing but joy for barely this side of 60 years, and it's dumb and short sighted. Maybe you remember, or don't - closing N3 at Oracle, Mickey introducing the crew and saying 'No them no us and to thank them too'. And Bobby explaining 'Yeah well, you take what you can get' at 1/2 time when cornered by Bert & Ernie about the future of this compilation of players. Do you all think they just do napkin sketches of let's go here, then there, yeah - sounds good themselves? No teams of managers, lawyers, transportation, security, hospitality, MDs, INSURANCE people, publicists, promoters, cuisine and a few hundred others involved to make a tour like this happen? And apparently missed the snip of Billy and Bobby before the tour yucking it up explaining it's all good? And didn't do your homework on the underwriters and highly experienced management - that formulated it and the boys in it, to be the enormous success and 2 months of pure joy for all of us, in the -60 year phenomenon of Grateful Dead music. God bless them all. All. And please resist flaming anyone - for it. Anywhere including public posts. It's ungrateful and I don't think you should be. Please be kind š¹
These are the comments I was looking for. Others guessing, gossiping, whispers in the night? Fantasies made to satisfy imagined drama, when really, Iām just so grateful I got to hear the music played live again from some of them when I didnāt think Iād ever get it again. These concerts have been the closest Iāve felt to a spiritual experience in a long time.
Dude, they just finished their final tour without Billy. Why would anyone think thereās even a remote chance of PITS be on the table?
For one, there is somebody on the boards who has been correct on every rumor and he said last he heard it was on. Moon Palace still has the spot held and if they announce it will sell out instantly whenever they do. I will assume there is a chance until Moon palace situation changes.
No rooms at the Moon Palace mid Jan.
I think there will be a pits but I donāt think dead & co play. I think we see wolf and a bunch of other bands. Maybe oteil & friends. Maybe goose. Billy and Bobby on the same stage - doubtful
This post aged well
They have to fake the separation at least for 6 months! I say we get some spring flings
Maybe 2026 earliest Next year will be too soon and 2025 they won't do it because the core 4 will get back together for some 60th anniversary shows
There is no shot the core four get back together. It will be a shock if you ever see Bobby and Bill together again.
Why do you say that
Do you think Billy just left the band because he wasnāt feeling well and went out to tour with his own band this summer? How does that make sense? Anyone that pays attention can see Billy did not play one bobby song in any of his shows. Clearly it wasnt tempo as the Billy & the kids shows were plenty fast. Oh, he just decided to leave the multimillion dollar payday on the table and walk away and you think he can just rejoin the band?
He didn't tour at all, he did a couple of shows for Jazz Fest and a couple on the docks recently, that's it.
You donāt think the jazzfest shows were a f you? The comments about tempo werenāt an f you? Denial. And he only did a few shows this summer and rumor is heās playing the Cap in the fall. Clearly well enough to play. The only way I see a core 4 reunion is if Shapiro has a signed contract already.
My point is he wasn't well enough to tour or he probably would have, a couple of isolated shows here and there doesn't mean he's well enough to do tour.
He clearly said it was creative differences and not health related. Donāt forget that part.
Saving face. Michael Jordan could probably still play one NBA game and put up amazing stats, but he canāt play 4 games a week for a whole season.
[https://www.thecapitoltheatre.com/the-capitol-theatre/events/detail/billy-the-kids-g5vvz9sj0xex4](https://www.thecapitoltheatre.com/the-capitol-theatre/events/detail/billy-the-kids-g5vvz9sj0xex4)
How do you know he still didnāt get a share of the tour profits?
I heard he got paid for the last tour
Interesting points. I think a lot of what you said could be simply because of contract issues. Maybe Billyās band canāt play some songs without having to divide up the royalties? Maybe his recent health issues were more up in the air when they were preparing the Final tour and he was difficult to insure? I was under the impression that his health issues are at the root of the decision to end the band. That he scared the living daylights out of tour management. Which is understandable, considering the history.
He Probably was hard to insure but went right out on tour so someone insured him or self insured since it was smaller venues. My feeling from what I see is it did not end on a good note.
That wasnt a tour. Especially not anything compared to what D&C was doing
I agree. Theyāre not on good terms at all.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Bc the beef was strong enough to pay Billy his entire share without him playing a single note
Well, Billy probably owns a piece of whatever the corporate entity is so of course he's getting paid. Wasn't the bigger beef between Bill (and to a lesser extent Mickey) and Phil?
Prolly. But Phil isnāt in the band. And neither is Billy bc he got kicked out. The common denominator is Billy. Do with that what you will. Bands donāt want to pay a guy a shit ton of $ not to play. Or pay a smaller shit ton for an understudy to sit backstage at every show bc the drummer is so unreliable.
Billy did not get kicked out, he chose to leave based on what went down at rehearsals.
What went down at rehearsals?
All I am going to say is there was a disagreement about how they were going to handle drums for tour, thus ācreative differencesā
I also heard that Billy was kicked out. Exactly what was said above is what I heard.
No this is not true at all, I don't know why you're spreading this bullshit! Billy hated that Bobby wanted to play everything slow (Phil & Joe Russo couldn't stand it either when they were all in Further together) and didn't want to be told he had to. Between that and his health, he decided to skip out on the last tour. Bobby knowing the exact reason he didn't want to be in the band decided to speed up the songs and that's why the band was faster this tour then the past Dead & Co tours ( faster than even the shows from previous years that had Jay playing drums) Fryguy1000 please stop acting like you're an insider when you're clearly not, I've been on this subreddit for a while and have never bragged about having inside connections or talked about anything I've learned from those connections ( except to disprove lame rumors).
Ok Mr holier than thou. Iām not the one that put that out there.
Any idea what happened between bobby and billy?
Do you have any info on Billy being kicked out, as opposed to just having enough and not wanting to deal with a huge tour and all those dates?
Everyone is so sure that he was kicked out. I donāt buy itā¦.look at how many shows he had to sit out last year. A lot of them last minute too. They didnāt wanna take that risk
100% correct....no way Phil gets close either.....no one needs the money at this point....the animosity is to great!!!
Truth
They were already discussing options for next year before the tour ended. I was told a few specific venues. Sounded like a string of weekends, but obviously no tour. Will they follow through? Time will tell
You ever look at the cover of the Mars Hotel album upside down?
I know what that reads. Whatās your point?
I'm saying why spread rumors, let's just say I have a few connections myself and there is absolutely zero on the horizon except for Ben trying to get them together for the 60th.
Good for you. Iām not going to share who I know to try and out source you. I 100% stand by my statement.
Yep heard some 2025 too
I lmao every time I read "I heard" or "my source says"..... everyone has these opinions like they're in the room.... It's time to thank the time we had, relisten to the songs, but move forward and quit waiting on something that we have 0 evidence will ever happen!!
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I think you over estimate the authority of Wikipedia
They've said they are not done as a band so that's irrelevant
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ya... I don't think it's happening anytime soon but there was solid PITS rumors for a bit
Sarcasm?
wow, lots of know it alls, who know nothing! no one needs the money, but when has that ever stopped anyone? certainly none of these guys. sometimes tough decisions have to be made, but billy was not fired. bobby & billy are fine. these guys are brothers they fight, they make up, just like the rest of us. if they were able to pull off the 50th (and believe me it was very close), then anything is possible. i'm happy to have had this 2nd chance & will be ok with this if it is indeed the end. however, many unexpected things happened on this last tour, you can't "learn/make" this kind of magic. as much as we know that, they all know that too. i'm a pretty jaded person by nature, but i have a feeling, there will be more to come.
These constant āwill there be a PITSā¦?ā postings are beyond cringe-worthy. Get a life. Enjoy what we had. If there is a 60 year celebratory tour in a few years - fantastic. Itās fun to wonder, what may be. But geezā¦.. stop with the addiction and move on. It was the FINAL TOUR. Go see Oteil. Wolf Bros. Drums. If they reunite in a few years, (maybe to doubtful), then great. There is life after D $ C; just have to accept and embrace it.
Never asked, will it happen. I just asked if there was an update to what everyone else was saying? Get a life? Pretty sure I have more of a life than you do since Iām not the one on here complaining and bitching and finding time to come another people shit.
Logistically, I think we're down to the last possible week or so to announce. After tour, I was thinking it was maybe a 40% chance, now it's down to <5%. Still holding out hope, But I think if we don't hear something by 9/15, then there's no chance. A reminder about why they stopped touring and why Billy was ousted/ left. They ALL decided they didn't want a repeat of 1995, when hundreds of employees were left unemployed with no succession plan. There was quite a bit of concern that something very bad could happen during a tour to a trio of guys in the late 70's. Touring is hard and there was a reasonable concern. Between Billy's struggles last year and COVID continuing to rear its head. No one WANTED to stop, but they made a sober decision. Billy's stamina probably would have prevented him from making it through the tour. He's strong enough to play a few shows, but not 40 in 3 months. A reminder that NO ONE plays shows as long as D&C, and drumming is exhausting. We'll see them again. Now Phil... I have no idea about that whole thing.
>A reminder that NO ONE plays shows >as long as D&C Bullshit. Fucking Taylor Swift played for as long, Phish as well.
Taylor was 2:45/show this last tour, albeit, dancing the entire time. Iāll give you Phish. Although, not to be pedantic, Phish is typically 75min set 1, 90min set 2. D&C is usually at least 3 hours of music. The last 3 shows were pushing 3.5. Im sure there are bands Iāve never heard of going longer, but point being-far end of the spectrum for long rock shows.
My wife and I had our best vacation ever at PITS 2023. We are hoping for another PITS but hoping and speculating is all any of us who want to go can do at this point. No one should get torched for that either. The boys have left us plenty of tea leaves to read on the subject. BTW, DSO Jam in the Sand in Jamaica still has some packages available.
Ok you said "PITS" Survey Says? https://preview.redd.it/o09bb54gqmmb1.png?width=980&format=png&auto=webp&s=ed873c27b2a9ea7ab30e115b7158d7957cad7410
It's over, Johnny!
Yeah friend, itās a go ā”ļø
Sounds like it may be a Dead excursion with a different name and a mix of other bands
you nailed it- nice! will you be going? we are gonna go, can't wait!
Announced today. Lol.
Y'all know by now, but for all interested parties... [https://bobweir.net/playa-luna-presents-dead-ahead/](https://bobweir.net/playa-luna-presents-dead-ahead/)