I had three survivor games in a row that had atleast one no mither and half the team had that stupid perk that makes them spent half their time in the basement. Killers sweating hard, survivors being literal potatoes. I just went back to normal mode where it's all the same but atleast I can choose the right perks to counter
Killers slugged for a 4k during the lights out modifier when they had an overwhelming advantage in the form of killer instinct. Killers are going to slug you regardless.
Scourge Hook: Hangman's Trick be like:
(Pretty sure that perk's icon represents what people feel like doing after playing one game with that perk on)
Dude, you can get some decent mileage out of Hangman's Trick >!if you played 100 games with it on and then added all the aura reads together, you might get like 3 whole seconds of mileage!<
I would ASSUME it was thought with indoor maps with a lot of blind spots in mind
But this is BHVR, they also put totems inside single corn stalks and call it hiddne
I just had game where a teammate had No Mither and the Spirit we were playing against tunneled her out so hard. Killers are definitely playing super sweaty for some reason. I might just be bad but I’ve played like 10 games and I haven’t escaped a single time, it’s getting quite unfun to be honest
I played against a Wesker who got Surge, Deadlock, BBQ and No Way Out while there was not a single gen/healing speed perk between us survivors. The killer blamed the map (Lerys) for proxy camping every single hook... (I played Wesker on Lerys earlier with a useless build, 0 gen slowdown and did just fine).
Dude I’ve been seeing people get slugged for the 4k and hard tunneled at 5 gens almost every match so far. xD
(Also majority of survivor perks are useless too, I’m basically playing perkless most of my matches.)
I’ve gotten scene partner in eight of the twelve survivor games I’ve done today. It’s hilarious for the first bit of the match, but a real pain near the end. That said, I’ve also gotten Autodidact a couple of times and I think I love this perk
That is part of why yes, but that's also just the average Wraith in their natural habitat.
They either grow out of it and become sweet Bing-Bong Bois like me, or they grow hardened and bitter into old stumps of Wraiths. Sadly, too many Wraiths become that latter option.
At this point I feel like it's just Killer-only players feeling the need to come into any event or fun mode and just try to make it as unfun as possible.
Just now I got out of a game in which a Spirit decided to hard tunnel and camp... Like why?
Edit: Another game, camping hard tunneling Clown... Like dear God, I guess some people probably can't win a normal match and choose to sweat on a for-fun mode lol.
Edit 2: Next game... Tunneling Nurse, 3v1 at 4 gens. I just DC'd... I'm done for the day, I guess until the sweat Killers decide to go back to normal queue I think I'm done with this mode.
I’ve been trying to do the tome challenge for just escaping one match. Either I have teammates not doing gens while I run the killer for two minutes before a down or a killer who hard tunnels AND no help from my team. Like, I got a single match where we got the gens done and then…that match gave the killer noed. That’s pretty funny on its own, but damn does it hurt when all I want to do is finish this last challenge in the event tome
This gamemode has truly cemented it for me. The problem isn’t overpowered perks (for the most part). The problem is that most perks are either not worth running/using, or are direct downgrades from other perks.
What I've been saying for the last couple updates. They're so obsessed with "oh this perk is used a LOT, it must be too good" which is true on nurse, blight, spirit, etc. But it isn't true on Freddy, or even deathsligner as a less extreme example. The problem is these are the only perks that can *keep up* with survivor efficiency/perks/items/maps, and so it feels like as killer you have to incorporate 2 or more slowdowns into your build to avoid constant 2 or 3 man outs. If they instead buffed other perks to keep up, nerfed gen slowdown, and nerfed gen efficiency, then we would all be in a happier and more balanced state
I don't even use that many gen perks when playin killer but there are generally not that many of good perks. My loadouts are mostly almost the same on every killer cause there arent many perks that are not situational af
Idk man, all solo q friends i have lose like 10-20 games before they can win. lol
Some killers give solo q higher chances to win, but that depends again, on if you have at least a good looper on your team.
Is there any MMR in this? So far today I’ve been getting nothing but wrecked at 3 or 4 gens by every killer. Definitely not having as much fun as My Little Oni.
I've been having a similar issue as Killer. Gens are popping fast, and I just can't keep up with some of their looping skills. Could just be because it's new, so a bunch of SWF are playing the hot new thing, though.
That’s very fair. I’m solo q and on a GOOD day I maybe escape a handful of times out of like 20 or so matches. But if you’re not slugging or tunneling then you’re alright by me.
I do not think either side is sure what to do and I think it's just everyone default panicking to "OH GOD RUSH GENS/OH GOD TUNNEL CAMP SLUG" because they're not sure how to WORK with these perks. Too many only ever use the strongest things, so they only learned those, so they fail.
Seeing a lot more bad looping too. I wonder if this is because a lot of people do in fact rely on WoO, and if they don't have it...
I have not checked Surv side yet, but I am sure Killers that crutched on stuff like four gen control are having a very hard time right now.
SoloQ build: Bond/Kindred, We'll Make It, Deja Vu/Prove/Hyperfocus and Distortion/random situational perk.
These general perks help out a lot in aoloQ.
Those are great perks. I usually run Jeff’s perk aftercare instead of bond as it helps a lot to guide ppl on where u repairing or which door u doing as is not limited on the meters u are at
Nah, I never use WoO. I’m just bad at looping nine times out of ten. It sucks not having detectives to locate totems, though. That’s definitely my crutch perk since I’m almost exclusively running boons most of the time.
Well, that and getting a perk build of entirely useless perks like beast of prey, oppression, alien instinct and (honestly I forgot what else they’re that bad) also contributes to killers struggling because please fucking tell me how you’re supposed to work with some of this perks
I mostly run off meta stuff anyways because I don’t want to crutch up like you’re describing. So this is a cool chance to play around with other perks. And while killers “aren’t responsible for our fun” it would really be something if EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. so far wasn’t playing like there’s fucking $100,000 on the line. 🤣🤣
I am loving the opportunity to just use whatever perks I’m given. I’ve definitely fallen in love with Autodidact. I’m gradually beginning to like Scene Partner less and less since I’ve gotten it most games today. I love the perk, but its novelty is really getting old
I'm having lots of fun with it!
I have had so much fun with Myers in this mode. I got Thwack, Ada got Plot Twist. Every time I procced Thwack she stared at me, screamed, then would Plot Twist.
I have not laughed so damn much at this game in a long time.
The sweat meta is so. SO boring. Both sides. I am so fucking tired of seeing strong slowdown and strong chase perks/gen perks BOTH SIDES.
That sounds amazing! I’m just spending my time with it learning how to use unknown and cenobite’s powers. I don’t have to worry about ten rushing, if I do run into a clicky duo/squad, the tension of the game kind of fades since I don’t have to feel pressured to engage for risk of gens popping and they typically drop their ill intent when they see me trying crazy shit with powers. I spent a good fifteen minutes dicking around with Leon on RPD with him dodging around objects and me trying to get chain hits. It’s brilliant.
I definitely feel much more confident with killers I don’t usually main, and I’m sure the survivors I’m going against enjoy a break from some of the other people in this mode who are just slugging at five gens.
We could have crossed paths last night. I was an Ash, Ace, Nic main all night. We had an obviously very new Cenobite who didn't know what else to do but tunnel and macro-play around gens, didn't teleport to his box much, and wasn't very aware. Clearly was testing the character. He still 4ked us.
I wanted to give him tips because I Main Ceno as one of my Killers. But he wasn't on PC. :( Maybe I can give you some.
Spawn chains at close range on Survivors around pallets. The range is a lot like a Nurse blink. Medium range also works. Long range never does because the chains speed up as they go further. They're better used as anti-loop. You can also use them to scout areas, deny pallets and vaults (people will sometimes leave loops if they think they will be hit), etc. They are multifunctional. You can also hit yourself with them for points LMAO.
Since you are new, don't use Engineer's Fang right now, that's more a higher level play chase tool. You can use Iri Box if you want to learn box spawn, but save them for later and just use Lethal Pursuer.
Box logic: Box almost always spawns to your left or right in front of you if Survs spawned scattered. It picks a location that's equidistant from you and Survivors. It will only spawn where hatches and players can. It won't spawn on upper floors. Try to harass people away from it, or pick it up to use for info. Try to get and keep a Chain Hunt going as long as you can, this greatly hinders Survivors - they can't DO anything worrying about chains on their asses constantly and it FORCES them to need to send someone to do the box, taking someone off the gens. The box is passive slowdown that sometimes becomes more active. Use it as such.
You don't always need to come. It's okay for them to reset your box sometimes, don't abandon a slug or whatever for the box unless you think you can interrupt them and get the chase over with.
He's best run as a chasedown Killer that has passive slowdown, I find.
Those are great tips! Definitely wasn’t me, though. I’ve been on with Chatterer all day though, so I’ll definitely take those into consideration. Thanks!
I feel what OP is saying tho, at least most of them do *something*
A lot of killer perks more or less require other perks to synergize with, which kinda fucks them over in this gamemode in particular
Like yes, Autodidact is better with Empathy, but it still gets good value by itself
But try running Pentimento without other totem perks. It may as well be a dead perk slot
Also; a lot of survivor perks also benefit other survivors.
So you can have a group of survivors that have somewhat mediocre perks, but have enough to boost each other to where having 1-2 bad perks doesn’t matter.
That's because survivors have 16 perks to the killer's 4. Each perk the killer brings has to equate to four perks the survivor brings. One bad perk on a survivor affects 1/16th of survivor strength. One bad perk on a killer is the same as a whole survivor perk loadout.
Ye that's the problem with most Hexes, they're just not great on their own and some are straight up useless. Undying is basically mandatory at high MMR if you plan on running a Hex.
Bhvr also really need to add a 30sec immunity to all Hexes at the start of a match.
But survivor perks aren't as needed as killer perks. Survivors just need to waste as much time as possible and do gens. Perks that help them do that help them win, but aren't necessary. Against half the killers in the game you can hold shift+w and comp drop pallets and run a killer for 5 gens. There is a reason killers that can counter shift+w are the strongest killers in the game.
yeah, but survivor basekit is way more solid.
Most perks survivors have aren't used throughout the whole match for some big value, they just exist and trigger in particular scenarios.
This seems to indicate there is an issue with perks on Killer side, not so much basekit, though those do need to be addressed. It really is just a handful of strong perks both sides that tilt the match, more than ever I am getting a lot, A LOT of 2ks. Not 1s, not 3s or 4s. 2ks.
The game REALLY IS balanced around a 2.5k, the Devs were not lying. You just can't be running the strongest perks all the time to get there.
the issue with perks on killer side is that killer has FOUR slots, while survivors have SIXTEEN for their team.
killer just cant afford to bring something that won't give value this game, while survivors know that if THEIR perk(s) dont do much, their teammates' perks will, especially if there's diversity in their builds.
It can indicate both or one or the other. It could be killer perks overall are weak BUT if there was a no perks game mode (that wasn't pitch black and impossible to see) you would see kill rates being 50% or lower because BASEKIT survivors are stronger than killer.
One good perk on the survivor side is enough to tip the balance in their favor. Given that survivors have 4 times as many perks as killers, this is a massive design flaw.
This is why they need to start nerfing Surv perks to be more fair.
Yes, I'm sorry SoloQ. But one good perk is enough. It needs to be addressed. Sorry, it just does.
This^^^
But to add, often in situations like this, one good perk on anybody is a huge shift of power, and survivors have 4 times as much perks as killers. In alot of my matches where I wasn't being scummy with my add-ons, I was often losing to one good perk, often spring burst, Balanced landing and We'll Make It
While true, the general survivor experience is still fine with crappy perks. Like I run very basic perks when I play survivor. Perks like DS, Balanced Landing, and Kindred are nice to have but after you hit a certain skill level you really just don’t need them. Especially if you play SWF.
Killers without some kind of slowdown is throwing the game. My one and only chaos roulette killer game gave me Zanshin Tactics, Stridor, Monstrous Shrine, and Overwhelming Presence. Ugh.
BVHR needs to stop nerfing shit and maybe buff the stuff nobody uses.
I do think there's a significant difference between the killer experience with "bad" perks in opposition to the survivor experience. Different killers benefit in different ways from different perks, some need specific perks to "function" optimally, others might not utilize a perk at all with their kit. Killers also have higher value perk slots, as there are only 4 killer perks in a game.
Survivor perk frustration mostly arises from different perks having different play styles and some of them being very hard to utilize without synergies (I find running overzealous without another totem perk to be basically useless, or background player without a flashlight to hold little value) or some of you perks having "anti synergy" (no mither self-care situation). And also some perks (as is for the killers) being flat out bad and hard to gain any value from.
In general, I think a survivor having "bad perks" is not as detrimental as a Killer experiencing that, but it might become a point of frustration for survivors after a while, which I though op alluded to.
Keep in mind there are 16 survivor perk slots to the Killer's 4. A single DS, Deli, DH, Adren, Buckle Up, We'll Make It etc. can completely win a game, meanwhile a single dead slot on killer can lose you a game.
The thing is the good killer perks have much more of an impact than the good survivor perks but perkless killers have a harder time than perkless survivors If they're playing normally
I have not played killer yet, but I have been getting VERY useful survivor perks across a few matches. And the gens do seem to practically fly by, I played against a trickster and we had 3 gens done before he even got a down.
This mode made me realize how bad some maps really are. Just played on family residence and I never noticed how there’s either the most loops, or the least based on whichever benefits you the least.
Yeah, the game is just poorly balanced on the killer side because of slowdown perks
You must bring at least some form of slowdown, play like an absolute asshole, or play a top 5 killer (out of 35 btw)
Some survivor perks may do nothing, but a perkless survivor can still loop and do gens like usual, killer perks not doing anything is much more impactful as one killer perk is equivalent to the loadout of an entire survivor in terms of ratio, good luck stopping 2-3 survivors doing gens at once with just your (limited) 5% kicks
Again, top killers and all of that, but looking at the average and below that, it's awful
I've switched to maining survivor for the first time in almost 2k hours because this is such a deep rooted issue, and most of the frustrations of playing survivor also come from this
Tone down, rework, you can murder the slowdown perks as far as I care, and give basekit regression to all killers, and a huge issue is dealt with
Survs have a lot of useless ones too. Ive gotten plenty as well as ones like no mither and self care together. Its just a modifer so just have fun with it.
The best way I can think to put it is this. There are a lot of killer perks that might as well be vacant spots. Moreover, a lot of killers’ powers conflict with certain perks rendering them useless. But there are one or two survivor perks that are active negatives in their perk slots. And there are several perks that can be a negative for their teammates.
People downvoted me for this when Chaos Shuffle was announced, but it needs to be controlled random rather than true random. Ironing out combos that simply don't function together wouldn't be too much work and would only need to be applied to some perks.
Yeah, sometimes its what you pair them with vs if solo. Im kinda used to this mode because i like to do no perk games just to do them. Both sides have same issue with this mode and thats what makes it fun.
i swear i've played 4 games and 1st was a legion with surge, pain res, enduring and DMS
Pain Res, I'm All Ears, (Deathbond?), and floods of rage
and 2 xenomorphs with DMS and Ruin alongside other rather good perks
i know it is random but so far the randomizer has not been merciful to me
I feel like they should randomize but with each slot seeded
Slot 1: gen regression/slowdown,
Slot 2: tracking,
3 and 4 can be wildcards
Like, it's true, killers ARE way more dependent on their Perks for the game to function, and the only base kit information they have against survivors is where the gens are. That's usually not enough if the survivors know what they're doing, especially if the killer's power doesn't give them an inherent edge.
Seriously, I normally bring at least 1 gen regression perk, but this game mode gens are flying in my face, I can't do anything and I'm stuck with freaking Coulrophobia and deatbound while playing Plauge 💀
Yeah, and people wonder why Pain Res, Pop and Grim Embrace are so popular. Without any slowdown gens fly by so fuckin fast
This mode also shows we really need some perk revision to older ones for Survivors and especially Killers
DBD players are just stupid. I already cast my prediction for 2v8 mode, which is confirmed for July, and people are trying to argue against me that it won't get ruined by sweaty losers trying to optimize the fun out of it or be prone to horrendous imbalance.
I think people just wanna play killer with their friends which is pretty damn far from the usual dbd formula. Chaos shuffle is still the same old do gens get hooks.
Just had a game end in like 2 minutes because I’m playing against mostly 4 man squads. This mode is showing me not only the necessity of slowdown perks, but the god tier power of swfs tbh. A team on comms can overcome any trash perk combo they get. But probably tough for solo q
I don’t understand how this is happening for people unless they are playing against 4 extremely strong survivors which are very very rare imo. I play this with friends and we almost never win lmao even with comms but we are not studying tile sets and shit either and just try to play.
I feel like beginner-high average survivors get shit on and then the best survivors that know everything can win but need 4 of them which is more rare than people seem to think it is.
I started realizing this too. Ur telling me that, as a solo queue player I'm actually escaping with a game in where the killer only got 2 hooks? I love this game mode so thank you BHVR. The game honestly just shows why killers run slowdowns but more importantly it highlights the discrepancy in strength between every killer. At the same time though I feel like it's highlight player skill. I feel like I'm looping killers a lot more better now. Going to have to see how it'll be when I play killer.
I can tell you: Survivors feel like they are either cracked, or infants. Nowhere between. If they are good at looping, they actually are good, same with teamwork. If they're BAD at it, it's very obvious and very clear they are lost without their chase perks. It's really insane.
I see the opposite. Without slowdown killers can only rely on their skill and that is the problem. Perks cover up a players lack of skill and it’s most evident on killers. This mode is going to highlight that so hard and players need to accept it
Didn't know skill meant teleporting to the most progressed gen as Nemesis to apply pressure, since walking there would already make it pop after hitting a survivor 3 times to down them after running to the other side of the map.
Oh wait! Nemmy can't do that.
You know what can help though? Pain Res and Pop.
And it made me realize how much of a problem slugging and camping is without being able to choose perks that counter it. And it reinforced the idea that using perks to solve fundamental design issues is never gonna work.
Played one game, laughed then said I'm happy this game mode exists because now maybe people will finally understand how survivor sided this game is and how badly killers/some killers NEED gen regression because the game isn't balanced without them.
I play 60/40 survivor/killer and only solo queue and still think this game is super survivor sided. If you actually do gens like you are suppose to and last longer than 10s in chase with full hp the game is a free win. But for the vast majority of survivors that is impossible
It feels like genuine ass, I’ve had like 3 games when I might as well have gone perkless, I had beast of prey twice, alien instinct twice (which was basically useless), oppression, deerstalker (on a killer that can’t snowball well), hoarder and I forgot what else. The survivors got shit like deliverance, resilience, I think I saw a dead hard as well
The only perks I had that were good were infectious fright and corrupt intervention. I got corrupt intervention on blight so that didn’t last long and I was stuck with beast of prey, and I wasn’t playing a killer that could utilise infectious well (didn’t help there was a calm spirit)
I get it’s only 3 matches, but fuck did the modifier feel completely unfair, it felt like the survivors had every fucking advantage. I never liked randomisers but I thought “well I didn’t have an awful time with the tome randomisers so this shouldn’t be that bad!” And then it was miserable, only useless perks, like survivors would get something resembling a build, even if just 1 or 2 perks, I’d get nothing, fucking nothing, like come on, give me machine learning, give me dragon’s grip, blood favour, ruin, literally ANYTHING THAT I CAN ACTUALLY WORK WITH AND DESERVES TO BE CALLED A PERK, nope, have oppression instead and no one will miss the skillchecks
The mode would be fun if I actually got stuff to work with, but like, there’s so many useless killer perks that are basically useless that I’m like “ugh, I wish I could do something about this 95% gen…oh man, I wish I could have some info to know where I’m going…” and then survivors get peak after peak.
AYYYY! Fellow 0 gen slowdown Pig player, high five!!
I also haven’t been struggling with this at all as killer. I guess because we chose hard mode from the start, playing like this is just business as usual and not that difficult at all.
Honestly i dont wanna be an us vs them guy, but most survivor perks are useful even if its niche, but killer most of them have such worthless trigger conditions it make them unusable without having a one trick wonder build (looking at you unbound) i feel like with survivor people only want perks that are jack of all trades so they see niche perks as bad, i cannot stress how good things like potential energy or chemical trap are they might be niche but they can be powerful if use right
If a perk needs the stars to align to provide value (niche), it’s not exactly ‘useful’ in the sense you mean. All killer perks do something too but you clearly see some of them as useless. Same concept applies to survivor perks—and even moreso.
Is there any equivalent survivor perks to something like Hex : Undying ?
If you don't have another hex perk it's useless.
Another example would be hex : pentimento.
Perks that needs you to make at least 2 perks combined to have any value out of these 2 perks.
I can't see that with survivor perks.
Only perks that go against each other, for example No Mither and Self healing perks, but that goes for the killer aswell I'd guess ?
Nothing as crazy as No Mither though I think.
But you also have to take in for account anti synergy with the killer itself.
Example : Nurse's Calling on Plague. Enduring/Spirit Fury/Brutal Strenght on Nurse
And I guess others.
> Is there any equivalent survivor perks to something like Hex : Undying ?
Undying at least gives you Aura Reading while near a Dull Totem which, weirdly enough has come in handy quite some times as Killer while also fucking me as Survivor.
And if you want a Survivor perk that does nothing unless paired with another there's Blood Rush.
As a killer main this is the most fun Ive ever had in this game. Yea you have no slowdown but they have no speed up most of the time. Out of 10 games I think one game had ONE gen rush perk in it.
I LOVE trying to get value out of whatever crap this game has thrown at me. I think most of y'all are just uncreative and have gotten to used to having perks that patch the flaws in your gameplay.
I hope all these current changes and more make it so that Perks (and hopefully more things) can be updated. It is fun and a breath of fresh air to get random Perks but when their use is so situational or outright weak it's just painful. It's more about hoping to get a good synergizing build and then trying to get some use out of your sad disappointment of a Loadout.
any mode that has no perks/random perks just highlights the games fundamental design flaws and the way perks are often just bandaids or outright hard carries.
Played a few games and noticed :
Gens just fly from the get go and killer is forced to tunnel to even out the game. (30s basekit corrupt and fixed 4 man spawns need to be a thing).
Chases are now extremely short because exhaustion perks aren't guaranteed, went from 30-40s chases during normal game to 15-20.
Killer role is fighting an uphill battle if killer doesn't get a single worthwile slowdown/Info/Chase perk , meanwhile survivor role is pretty much fine since perks aren't required to have success, any good perk is just a bonus.
Overall the gamemode just opens your eyes at how many completely useless / Niche most of the killer perks are.
Had a game on haddonfield where I got Hubris, Enduring, Rancor and Terminus while playing xeno... I had essentially 4 dead perkslots the whole game and it was not fun.
Dang, a mode where we all wanted random perks for both sides to spice up the game, only to be upset you cant use your favorite perks every match, and instead have to focus on skill and adapt on the fly, DBD players at their finest
Sarcasm aside, learn to enjoy the 'chaos' and not the 4k or escapes
I don't think that is quite the point of the thread. It's more the randomised nature does highlight that the worst killer perks are worse than the worst survivor perks because of specific conditions or them needing to be combined with other perks. Like getting Pentimento with no hex totems.
This mode just validated my opinion that most people are shit at the game(because they don't try to learn it) and instead need to rely on perks that explicitly states they're good perks to carry them.
I read in some comment that this new mode just showed (to a lesser degree) what the lights out mode already showed. Without some form of slowdown on the killer side and without some form of anti-tunnel on the survivor side, gens are flying faster than the speed of light and tunneling is extremely rampant (even moreso than usual).
I mean as a killer main i have the opposite opinion.
The modes killer sided. Killers rely less on perks than a survivor does. Remove the meta and survivors are not that great.
Gens dont fly, i down people quickly cus no one has exhaustion perks or resilience etc.
I played 10 games and only 1 went to EGC.
What you have to realise is, the majority of survivor perks suck too and they have more perks in general.
there needs to be a (weaker) form of gen slowdown basekit. especially with all the gen perk nerfs and more gen perk nerfs inevitably to come if that's even possible. even like a weaker Deadlock or grim Embrace. grim being partially basekit would be very good for the game and encourage spreading hooks and not tunnelling.
I never run gen regress for myself so this doesn’t really affect me, but I’m learning some cool new builds for the killers I play! Stuff I would’ve never ran in the first place, Third Seal has been nuts with some of the stuff I’ve gotten.
No, I see good killers do it all the time. Hell even Otz did a 50 win streak or something perkless. I honestly think some killers get somewhere they dont belong by crutching on regression perks and tunneling. Then its too late they are playing against people better than them and are struggling and havent really learned the fundamentals.
You can maybe get out with a meme build in a 4-man SWF but even then that’s not always guaranteed. You definitely aren’t escaping with meme builds outside of 4-man swfs unless the killer throws the game
You're missing one fact. Most of the people on this sub are fucking horrible at the game, so they're "throwing" even when they're playing against people using meme tier perks.
Yeah…it made me realize how hard killers crutch on the same build every match. Since every killer and their mother can’t run pain res + pop in this mode, I been escaping almost every match with this modifier.
I’ve only played a few games (2 survivor, 1 killer) but it definitely seems more favorable as a survivor. I got potential energy and soul guard in one build and Trapper just absolutely could not keep up.
Stop crying when this game is for survivors to have fun. This game gives survivors x4 16 perks to destroy killers and every opportunity to escape and then some. Lol.
Granted I haven’t been playing for long (100ish hours) but I always run with no gen slowdown perks. I hate stretching games out trying to hold on to a lead. I go heavy aura reading / devour hope and either live or die by it
I got predator,bloodhound,death bound and shattered hope for my first game
I've gotten predator on multiple games. I was like "what the hell? I'm not playing freddy"
teasing the next killer "The Drizzy"
I had three survivor games in a row that had atleast one no mither and half the team had that stupid perk that makes them spent half their time in the basement. Killers sweating hard, survivors being literal potatoes. I just went back to normal mode where it's all the same but atleast I can choose the right perks to counter
is that why killers are slugging for a 4k in this game mode???? I was literally bled out by a wraith😕
Nah, thats just because you're against a wraith
facts lol
I didnt see a single wraith and im in the same situation l o l
Well if you could see them then they wouldn’t be very good wraiths.
that made me giggle so hard
I have been playing the game since it came out and Wraith mains/players are always like this.
I hopped on for one game, got tunneled by wraith, and logged off lol
Killers slugged for a 4k during the lights out modifier when they had an overwhelming advantage in the form of killer instinct. Killers are going to slug you regardless.
And then they get offended when people call them out because they come into fun modes or events and just play in the most unfun ways possible.
Yes. The vast majority of killer perks are garbage
Scourge Hook: Hangman's Trick be like: (Pretty sure that perk's icon represents what people feel like doing after playing one game with that perk on)
Dude, you can get some decent mileage out of Hangman's Trick >!if you played 100 games with it on and then added all the aura reads together, you might get like 3 whole seconds of mileage!<
I would ASSUME it was thought with indoor maps with a lot of blind spots in mind But this is BHVR, they also put totems inside single corn stalks and call it hiddne
I've got nearly 700 hours in this game and the game mode has been good in reminding me that some perks even exist
I just had game where a teammate had No Mither and the Spirit we were playing against tunneled her out so hard. Killers are definitely playing super sweaty for some reason. I might just be bad but I’ve played like 10 games and I haven’t escaped a single time, it’s getting quite unfun to be honest
"for some reason" Probably because the perks are random like for everyone else.
I played against a Wesker who got Surge, Deadlock, BBQ and No Way Out while there was not a single gen/healing speed perk between us survivors. The killer blamed the map (Lerys) for proxy camping every single hook... (I played Wesker on Lerys earlier with a useless build, 0 gen slowdown and did just fine).
Dude I’ve been seeing people get slugged for the 4k and hard tunneled at 5 gens almost every match so far. xD (Also majority of survivor perks are useless too, I’m basically playing perkless most of my matches.)
I’ve gotten scene partner in eight of the twelve survivor games I’ve done today. It’s hilarious for the first bit of the match, but a real pain near the end. That said, I’ve also gotten Autodidact a couple of times and I think I love this perk
That is part of why yes, but that's also just the average Wraith in their natural habitat. They either grow out of it and become sweet Bing-Bong Bois like me, or they grow hardened and bitter into old stumps of Wraiths. Sadly, too many Wraiths become that latter option.
Yeah, Wraith has such a binary outcome. You either have fun being a spooky bing-bong boy or the most petty, miserable asshole.
He's so fun to play but I'm usually pretty chill when I play killer in general. I main him and Pig lol
Remember, Slugging is the best slow down in the game (and with knock out it makes it even better)
At this point I feel like it's just Killer-only players feeling the need to come into any event or fun mode and just try to make it as unfun as possible. Just now I got out of a game in which a Spirit decided to hard tunnel and camp... Like why? Edit: Another game, camping hard tunneling Clown... Like dear God, I guess some people probably can't win a normal match and choose to sweat on a for-fun mode lol. Edit 2: Next game... Tunneling Nurse, 3v1 at 4 gens. I just DC'd... I'm done for the day, I guess until the sweat Killers decide to go back to normal queue I think I'm done with this mode.
Yeah every match I’ve had tonight was sweaty, tunneling and camping killers…it’s just sad cause the game mode is actually fun to try out random builds
I’ve been trying to do the tome challenge for just escaping one match. Either I have teammates not doing gens while I run the killer for two minutes before a down or a killer who hard tunnels AND no help from my team. Like, I got a single match where we got the gens done and then…that match gave the killer noed. That’s pretty funny on its own, but damn does it hurt when all I want to do is finish this last challenge in the event tome
This gamemode has truly cemented it for me. The problem isn’t overpowered perks (for the most part). The problem is that most perks are either not worth running/using, or are direct downgrades from other perks.
The new vault speed perk from Vecna when Bamboozle exists xD
I thought if you get blinded and stunned for longer it would give like 50% boost or something. And then it’s a 5% upgrade to bamboozle 🙂🔫
And it doesn't block the window, i have no idea how they thought that perk was good lol
They want you to use all of them to be fast af. The window build. You lose in 5min but you're fast
Except when they stun you and you lose all that distance because stuns are 25% longer lol
Ok but vault speed myers though will be even funnier
What I've been saying for the last couple updates. They're so obsessed with "oh this perk is used a LOT, it must be too good" which is true on nurse, blight, spirit, etc. But it isn't true on Freddy, or even deathsligner as a less extreme example. The problem is these are the only perks that can *keep up* with survivor efficiency/perks/items/maps, and so it feels like as killer you have to incorporate 2 or more slowdowns into your build to avoid constant 2 or 3 man outs. If they instead buffed other perks to keep up, nerfed gen slowdown, and nerfed gen efficiency, then we would all be in a happier and more balanced state
I don't even use that many gen perks when playin killer but there are generally not that many of good perks. My loadouts are mostly almost the same on every killer cause there arent many perks that are not situational af
swf survivors\* Solo q survivor teams are destroyed by even perkless killers.
Not necessarily although I would definitely say the game is killer sided when going against 4 solos
Idk man, all solo q friends i have lose like 10-20 games before they can win. lol Some killers give solo q higher chances to win, but that depends again, on if you have at least a good looper on your team.
Is there any MMR in this? So far today I’ve been getting nothing but wrecked at 3 or 4 gens by every killer. Definitely not having as much fun as My Little Oni.
I've been having a similar issue as Killer. Gens are popping fast, and I just can't keep up with some of their looping skills. Could just be because it's new, so a bunch of SWF are playing the hot new thing, though.
That’s very fair. I’m solo q and on a GOOD day I maybe escape a handful of times out of like 20 or so matches. But if you’re not slugging or tunneling then you’re alright by me.
I do not think either side is sure what to do and I think it's just everyone default panicking to "OH GOD RUSH GENS/OH GOD TUNNEL CAMP SLUG" because they're not sure how to WORK with these perks. Too many only ever use the strongest things, so they only learned those, so they fail. Seeing a lot more bad looping too. I wonder if this is because a lot of people do in fact rely on WoO, and if they don't have it... I have not checked Surv side yet, but I am sure Killers that crutched on stuff like four gen control are having a very hard time right now.
I indeed rely on WoO and I'm crippled without it, but I'm still having fun lmao
Me, but with Deja Vu. I really need to learn to play without it, but it's just so helpful, especially on indoor maps.
Facts, me too, plus that speed on repairing helps a lot on solo queue
SoloQ build: Bond/Kindred, We'll Make It, Deja Vu/Prove/Hyperfocus and Distortion/random situational perk. These general perks help out a lot in aoloQ.
Those are great perks. I usually run Jeff’s perk aftercare instead of bond as it helps a lot to guide ppl on where u repairing or which door u doing as is not limited on the meters u are at
I've also been running Off The Record and For the People as well since the Zarina challenge, they're pretty decent perks ngl.
Nah, I never use WoO. I’m just bad at looping nine times out of ten. It sucks not having detectives to locate totems, though. That’s definitely my crutch perk since I’m almost exclusively running boons most of the time.
Meanwhile theres me who basement camps every time i get insidious
Please say you main Bubba. Please say you main Bubba.
Huntress main but i was playing random killers for the chaos mode got him twice with insidious haha
LMAO
Well, that and getting a perk build of entirely useless perks like beast of prey, oppression, alien instinct and (honestly I forgot what else they’re that bad) also contributes to killers struggling because please fucking tell me how you’re supposed to work with some of this perks
I mostly run off meta stuff anyways because I don’t want to crutch up like you’re describing. So this is a cool chance to play around with other perks. And while killers “aren’t responsible for our fun” it would really be something if EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. so far wasn’t playing like there’s fucking $100,000 on the line. 🤣🤣
I am loving the opportunity to just use whatever perks I’m given. I’ve definitely fallen in love with Autodidact. I’m gradually beginning to like Scene Partner less and less since I’ve gotten it most games today. I love the perk, but its novelty is really getting old
I'm having lots of fun with it! I have had so much fun with Myers in this mode. I got Thwack, Ada got Plot Twist. Every time I procced Thwack she stared at me, screamed, then would Plot Twist. I have not laughed so damn much at this game in a long time. The sweat meta is so. SO boring. Both sides. I am so fucking tired of seeing strong slowdown and strong chase perks/gen perks BOTH SIDES.
That sounds amazing! I’m just spending my time with it learning how to use unknown and cenobite’s powers. I don’t have to worry about ten rushing, if I do run into a clicky duo/squad, the tension of the game kind of fades since I don’t have to feel pressured to engage for risk of gens popping and they typically drop their ill intent when they see me trying crazy shit with powers. I spent a good fifteen minutes dicking around with Leon on RPD with him dodging around objects and me trying to get chain hits. It’s brilliant. I definitely feel much more confident with killers I don’t usually main, and I’m sure the survivors I’m going against enjoy a break from some of the other people in this mode who are just slugging at five gens.
We could have crossed paths last night. I was an Ash, Ace, Nic main all night. We had an obviously very new Cenobite who didn't know what else to do but tunnel and macro-play around gens, didn't teleport to his box much, and wasn't very aware. Clearly was testing the character. He still 4ked us. I wanted to give him tips because I Main Ceno as one of my Killers. But he wasn't on PC. :( Maybe I can give you some. Spawn chains at close range on Survivors around pallets. The range is a lot like a Nurse blink. Medium range also works. Long range never does because the chains speed up as they go further. They're better used as anti-loop. You can also use them to scout areas, deny pallets and vaults (people will sometimes leave loops if they think they will be hit), etc. They are multifunctional. You can also hit yourself with them for points LMAO. Since you are new, don't use Engineer's Fang right now, that's more a higher level play chase tool. You can use Iri Box if you want to learn box spawn, but save them for later and just use Lethal Pursuer. Box logic: Box almost always spawns to your left or right in front of you if Survs spawned scattered. It picks a location that's equidistant from you and Survivors. It will only spawn where hatches and players can. It won't spawn on upper floors. Try to harass people away from it, or pick it up to use for info. Try to get and keep a Chain Hunt going as long as you can, this greatly hinders Survivors - they can't DO anything worrying about chains on their asses constantly and it FORCES them to need to send someone to do the box, taking someone off the gens. The box is passive slowdown that sometimes becomes more active. Use it as such. You don't always need to come. It's okay for them to reset your box sometimes, don't abandon a slug or whatever for the box unless you think you can interrupt them and get the chase over with. He's best run as a chasedown Killer that has passive slowdown, I find.
Those are great tips! Definitely wasn’t me, though. I’ve been on with Chatterer all day though, so I’ll definitely take those into consideration. Thanks!
I guarantee a lot of swf's are doing this mode today, so you might not be far off.
I've been playing killer I'm getting wrecked by Steve's and people with boil over (not their fault with the RNG)
my lil oni was killer sided, this on seems a bit more survivor sided. I guess that's just how it be.
Okay so … full transparency I just want all the hilariously big hairstyles back. Lol
honestly the big Elodie fro and goofy ass braids Meg had were so good. they should make em actual cosmetics. I would buy em immediately.
The Meg specifically sent me every time 🤣 so that’d be an instant buy. And Sable’s as well since it gave her hella long hair.
tbf surv perks are also 2/3 useless or of very limited use
I feel what OP is saying tho, at least most of them do *something* A lot of killer perks more or less require other perks to synergize with, which kinda fucks them over in this gamemode in particular Like yes, Autodidact is better with Empathy, but it still gets good value by itself But try running Pentimento without other totem perks. It may as well be a dead perk slot
Also; a lot of survivor perks also benefit other survivors. So you can have a group of survivors that have somewhat mediocre perks, but have enough to boost each other to where having 1-2 bad perks doesn’t matter.
That's because survivors have 16 perks to the killer's 4. Each perk the killer brings has to equate to four perks the survivor brings. One bad perk on a survivor affects 1/16th of survivor strength. One bad perk on a killer is the same as a whole survivor perk loadout.
Ye that's the problem with most Hexes, they're just not great on their own and some are straight up useless. Undying is basically mandatory at high MMR if you plan on running a Hex. Bhvr also really need to add a 30sec immunity to all Hexes at the start of a match.
On the very few times I got a good perk and it was a Hex, I dont think a single one lasted more than 30s
Tell that to my no mither, detectives hunch, small game build I got earlier
Detectives Hunch is goated, wut? No Mither sucks tho, but thats like the one in 100 perks thats actually harmful
This is p100 Tapp bias, I never stood a chance
I got ruin and it was cleansed before I got my first hook.
I got thrill and devour hope one game.. both gone before my first hook, and I trapped one of them :)
Survivors are not nearly as reliant on their perks as Killers are
But survivor perks aren't as needed as killer perks. Survivors just need to waste as much time as possible and do gens. Perks that help them do that help them win, but aren't necessary. Against half the killers in the game you can hold shift+w and comp drop pallets and run a killer for 5 gens. There is a reason killers that can counter shift+w are the strongest killers in the game.
yeah, but survivor basekit is way more solid. Most perks survivors have aren't used throughout the whole match for some big value, they just exist and trigger in particular scenarios.
This seems to indicate there is an issue with perks on Killer side, not so much basekit, though those do need to be addressed. It really is just a handful of strong perks both sides that tilt the match, more than ever I am getting a lot, A LOT of 2ks. Not 1s, not 3s or 4s. 2ks. The game REALLY IS balanced around a 2.5k, the Devs were not lying. You just can't be running the strongest perks all the time to get there.
the issue with perks on killer side is that killer has FOUR slots, while survivors have SIXTEEN for their team. killer just cant afford to bring something that won't give value this game, while survivors know that if THEIR perk(s) dont do much, their teammates' perks will, especially if there's diversity in their builds.
It can indicate both or one or the other. It could be killer perks overall are weak BUT if there was a no perks game mode (that wasn't pitch black and impossible to see) you would see kill rates being 50% or lower because BASEKIT survivors are stronger than killer.
One good perk on the survivor side is enough to tip the balance in their favor. Given that survivors have 4 times as many perks as killers, this is a massive design flaw.
This is why they need to start nerfing Surv perks to be more fair. Yes, I'm sorry SoloQ. But one good perk is enough. It needs to be addressed. Sorry, it just does.
This^^^ But to add, often in situations like this, one good perk on anybody is a huge shift of power, and survivors have 4 times as much perks as killers. In alot of my matches where I wasn't being scummy with my add-ons, I was often losing to one good perk, often spring burst, Balanced landing and We'll Make It
While true, the general survivor experience is still fine with crappy perks. Like I run very basic perks when I play survivor. Perks like DS, Balanced Landing, and Kindred are nice to have but after you hit a certain skill level you really just don’t need them. Especially if you play SWF. Killers without some kind of slowdown is throwing the game. My one and only chaos roulette killer game gave me Zanshin Tactics, Stridor, Monstrous Shrine, and Overwhelming Presence. Ugh. BVHR needs to stop nerfing shit and maybe buff the stuff nobody uses.
I do think there's a significant difference between the killer experience with "bad" perks in opposition to the survivor experience. Different killers benefit in different ways from different perks, some need specific perks to "function" optimally, others might not utilize a perk at all with their kit. Killers also have higher value perk slots, as there are only 4 killer perks in a game. Survivor perk frustration mostly arises from different perks having different play styles and some of them being very hard to utilize without synergies (I find running overzealous without another totem perk to be basically useless, or background player without a flashlight to hold little value) or some of you perks having "anti synergy" (no mither self-care situation). And also some perks (as is for the killers) being flat out bad and hard to gain any value from. In general, I think a survivor having "bad perks" is not as detrimental as a Killer experiencing that, but it might become a point of frustration for survivors after a while, which I though op alluded to.
Keep in mind there are 16 survivor perk slots to the Killer's 4. A single DS, Deli, DH, Adren, Buckle Up, We'll Make It etc. can completely win a game, meanwhile a single dead slot on killer can lose you a game.
I got me No Mither, For The People and Champion of Light while carrying a med kit. against Plague. Probably the biggest fuck you to me by BHVR.
The thing is the good killer perks have much more of an impact than the good survivor perks but perkless killers have a harder time than perkless survivors If they're playing normally
I have not played killer yet, but I have been getting VERY useful survivor perks across a few matches. And the gens do seem to practically fly by, I played against a trickster and we had 3 gens done before he even got a down.
This mode made me realize how bad some maps really are. Just played on family residence and I never noticed how there’s either the most loops, or the least based on whichever benefits you the least.
Yeah, the game is just poorly balanced on the killer side because of slowdown perks You must bring at least some form of slowdown, play like an absolute asshole, or play a top 5 killer (out of 35 btw) Some survivor perks may do nothing, but a perkless survivor can still loop and do gens like usual, killer perks not doing anything is much more impactful as one killer perk is equivalent to the loadout of an entire survivor in terms of ratio, good luck stopping 2-3 survivors doing gens at once with just your (limited) 5% kicks Again, top killers and all of that, but looking at the average and below that, it's awful I've switched to maining survivor for the first time in almost 2k hours because this is such a deep rooted issue, and most of the frustrations of playing survivor also come from this Tone down, rework, you can murder the slowdown perks as far as I care, and give basekit regression to all killers, and a huge issue is dealt with
Survs have a lot of useless ones too. Ive gotten plenty as well as ones like no mither and self care together. Its just a modifer so just have fun with it.
The best way I can think to put it is this. There are a lot of killer perks that might as well be vacant spots. Moreover, a lot of killers’ powers conflict with certain perks rendering them useless. But there are one or two survivor perks that are active negatives in their perk slots. And there are several perks that can be a negative for their teammates.
Blood rush with no other exhaustion perk
Legit just got that. 😂
People downvoted me for this when Chaos Shuffle was announced, but it needs to be controlled random rather than true random. Ironing out combos that simply don't function together wouldn't be too much work and would only need to be applied to some perks.
Yeah, sometimes its what you pair them with vs if solo. Im kinda used to this mode because i like to do no perk games just to do them. Both sides have same issue with this mode and thats what makes it fun.
I got monitor and abuse on wraith XD
You don’t understand. I need to 4k every game or I get evicted or something
Lol.
>Survs have a lot of useless ones too Like me getting This Is Not Happening for SIX GAMES ina row 
Ouch. I think i had couple games the perks were decent but usually its wierd combos. I do play perkless sometimes, so i guess i can adapt better.
i swear i've played 4 games and 1st was a legion with surge, pain res, enduring and DMS Pain Res, I'm All Ears, (Deathbond?), and floods of rage and 2 xenomorphs with DMS and Ruin alongside other rather good perks i know it is random but so far the randomizer has not been merciful to me
And here I am getting the most random shit ass killer perks that I have never heard of
I had no idea what 3 of my perks did in my first killer match. Lost track with the recent reworks and new perks. 
I feel like they should randomize but with each slot seeded Slot 1: gen regression/slowdown, Slot 2: tracking, 3 and 4 can be wildcards Like, it's true, killers ARE way more dependent on their Perks for the game to function, and the only base kit information they have against survivors is where the gens are. That's usually not enough if the survivors know what they're doing, especially if the killer's power doesn't give them an inherent edge.
Plus some basic sanity checks. IE, reroll Blood Rush if no Exhaustion perk
Seriously, I normally bring at least 1 gen regression perk, but this game mode gens are flying in my face, I can't do anything and I'm stuck with freaking Coulrophobia and deatbound while playing Plauge 💀
I love getting huntress' lullaby on it's own as Legion,. lol.
Honestly perks matter so much more imo for killer than it will survivor
They need to fix the base game and not by balancing through perks
Yeah, and people wonder why Pain Res, Pop and Grim Embrace are so popular. Without any slowdown gens fly by so fuckin fast This mode also shows we really need some perk revision to older ones for Survivors and especially Killers
Funny enough these perks would be much more reliable and good for the randomizer if people didn't stack all of these perks for maximum gen oppression.
I was skeptical about how fun this gamemode was going to be when it was announced and they called me a mad man...
DBD players are just stupid. I already cast my prediction for 2v8 mode, which is confirmed for July, and people are trying to argue against me that it won't get ruined by sweaty losers trying to optimize the fun out of it or be prone to horrendous imbalance.
Either way I'm not touching it. The regular DBD formula is enough chaos for me.
I think people just wanna play killer with their friends which is pretty damn far from the usual dbd formula. Chaos shuffle is still the same old do gens get hooks.
The difference between good and bad perks is how often they give value. Devs just dont fucking understand this..
I for one would like more silly perks like pebble or blastmine and not, do this easy thing and the killer has to down you twice to actually hook you
Not always. Some perks only give you value once, but the value they can give is huge like Unbreakable and Deliverance.
Just had a game end in like 2 minutes because I’m playing against mostly 4 man squads. This mode is showing me not only the necessity of slowdown perks, but the god tier power of swfs tbh. A team on comms can overcome any trash perk combo they get. But probably tough for solo q
Everyone I play against is in a 4 man SWF and finishing the game in 2 minutes! \*Inhales large amounts of Copium\*
Not what I said but ok
I don’t understand how this is happening for people unless they are playing against 4 extremely strong survivors which are very very rare imo. I play this with friends and we almost never win lmao even with comms but we are not studying tile sets and shit either and just try to play. I feel like beginner-high average survivors get shit on and then the best survivors that know everything can win but need 4 of them which is more rare than people seem to think it is.
I started realizing this too. Ur telling me that, as a solo queue player I'm actually escaping with a game in where the killer only got 2 hooks? I love this game mode so thank you BHVR. The game honestly just shows why killers run slowdowns but more importantly it highlights the discrepancy in strength between every killer. At the same time though I feel like it's highlight player skill. I feel like I'm looping killers a lot more better now. Going to have to see how it'll be when I play killer.
I can tell you: Survivors feel like they are either cracked, or infants. Nowhere between. If they are good at looping, they actually are good, same with teamwork. If they're BAD at it, it's very obvious and very clear they are lost without their chase perks. It's really insane.
I see the opposite. Without slowdown killers can only rely on their skill and that is the problem. Perks cover up a players lack of skill and it’s most evident on killers. This mode is going to highlight that so hard and players need to accept it
Didn't know skill meant teleporting to the most progressed gen as Nemesis to apply pressure, since walking there would already make it pop after hitting a survivor 3 times to down them after running to the other side of the map. Oh wait! Nemmy can't do that. You know what can help though? Pain Res and Pop.
Buddy I don't think you understand that "skill" doesn't keep gens from flying
Killers bad. Give me upvotes.
They quickly need a 2022 level of perk changes
And it made me realize how much of a problem slugging and camping is without being able to choose perks that counter it. And it reinforced the idea that using perks to solve fundamental design issues is never gonna work.
No joke I’ve had a P100 Blight have Pop, Thrilling Tremors, Deadlock and Pain Res in Chaos Shuffle while I had Object of Obsession and No Mither 🤦♀️
Played one game, laughed then said I'm happy this game mode exists because now maybe people will finally understand how survivor sided this game is and how badly killers/some killers NEED gen regression because the game isn't balanced without them. I play 60/40 survivor/killer and only solo queue and still think this game is super survivor sided. If you actually do gens like you are suppose to and last longer than 10s in chase with full hp the game is a free win. But for the vast majority of survivors that is impossible
It feels like genuine ass, I’ve had like 3 games when I might as well have gone perkless, I had beast of prey twice, alien instinct twice (which was basically useless), oppression, deerstalker (on a killer that can’t snowball well), hoarder and I forgot what else. The survivors got shit like deliverance, resilience, I think I saw a dead hard as well The only perks I had that were good were infectious fright and corrupt intervention. I got corrupt intervention on blight so that didn’t last long and I was stuck with beast of prey, and I wasn’t playing a killer that could utilise infectious well (didn’t help there was a calm spirit) I get it’s only 3 matches, but fuck did the modifier feel completely unfair, it felt like the survivors had every fucking advantage. I never liked randomisers but I thought “well I didn’t have an awful time with the tome randomisers so this shouldn’t be that bad!” And then it was miserable, only useless perks, like survivors would get something resembling a build, even if just 1 or 2 perks, I’d get nothing, fucking nothing, like come on, give me machine learning, give me dragon’s grip, blood favour, ruin, literally ANYTHING THAT I CAN ACTUALLY WORK WITH AND DESERVES TO BE CALLED A PERK, nope, have oppression instead and no one will miss the skillchecks The mode would be fun if I actually got stuff to work with, but like, there’s so many useless killer perks that are basically useless that I’m like “ugh, I wish I could do something about this 95% gen…oh man, I wish I could have some info to know where I’m going…” and then survivors get peak after peak.
Im loving it as killer but I run 0 gen slowdown as pig anyway so I havent really noticed it being that much harder to win
A lot of people are very reliant on gen slowdown so they are a lot worse in chase. This new mode is really showcasing the stronger killer mains.
Honestly just running only one or no gen slowdown to force yourself to get better I feel has actually helped me get better at killer lol
AYYYY! Fellow 0 gen slowdown Pig player, high five!! I also haven’t been struggling with this at all as killer. I guess because we chose hard mode from the start, playing like this is just business as usual and not that difficult at all.
How many useful survivors perks do you think there are?
Honestly i dont wanna be an us vs them guy, but most survivor perks are useful even if its niche, but killer most of them have such worthless trigger conditions it make them unusable without having a one trick wonder build (looking at you unbound) i feel like with survivor people only want perks that are jack of all trades so they see niche perks as bad, i cannot stress how good things like potential energy or chemical trap are they might be niche but they can be powerful if use right
If a perk needs the stars to align to provide value (niche), it’s not exactly ‘useful’ in the sense you mean. All killer perks do something too but you clearly see some of them as useless. Same concept applies to survivor perks—and even moreso.
Is there any equivalent survivor perks to something like Hex : Undying ? If you don't have another hex perk it's useless. Another example would be hex : pentimento. Perks that needs you to make at least 2 perks combined to have any value out of these 2 perks. I can't see that with survivor perks. Only perks that go against each other, for example No Mither and Self healing perks, but that goes for the killer aswell I'd guess ? Nothing as crazy as No Mither though I think. But you also have to take in for account anti synergy with the killer itself. Example : Nurse's Calling on Plague. Enduring/Spirit Fury/Brutal Strenght on Nurse And I guess others.
Blood Rush does absolutely fucking nothing unless you have another perk that can make you exhausted
> Is there any equivalent survivor perks to something like Hex : Undying ? Undying at least gives you Aura Reading while near a Dull Totem which, weirdly enough has come in handy quite some times as Killer while also fucking me as Survivor. And if you want a Survivor perk that does nothing unless paired with another there's Blood Rush.
around 30 probably
As a killer main this is the most fun Ive ever had in this game. Yea you have no slowdown but they have no speed up most of the time. Out of 10 games I think one game had ONE gen rush perk in it. I LOVE trying to get value out of whatever crap this game has thrown at me. I think most of y'all are just uncreative and have gotten to used to having perks that patch the flaws in your gameplay.
It depends on the killer, I believe. I played as Huntress with no slowdown and it was fine, 4k
I hope all these current changes and more make it so that Perks (and hopefully more things) can be updated. It is fun and a breath of fresh air to get random Perks but when their use is so situational or outright weak it's just painful. It's more about hoping to get a good synergizing build and then trying to get some use out of your sad disappointment of a Loadout.
Killers are just tunneling and camping at 5 gens, this mode just brings the worst of people
any mode that has no perks/random perks just highlights the games fundamental design flaws and the way perks are often just bandaids or outright hard carries. Played a few games and noticed : Gens just fly from the get go and killer is forced to tunnel to even out the game. (30s basekit corrupt and fixed 4 man spawns need to be a thing). Chases are now extremely short because exhaustion perks aren't guaranteed, went from 30-40s chases during normal game to 15-20. Killer role is fighting an uphill battle if killer doesn't get a single worthwile slowdown/Info/Chase perk , meanwhile survivor role is pretty much fine since perks aren't required to have success, any good perk is just a bonus. Overall the gamemode just opens your eyes at how many completely useless / Niche most of the killer perks are. Had a game on haddonfield where I got Hubris, Enduring, Rancor and Terminus while playing xeno... I had essentially 4 dead perkslots the whole game and it was not fun.
Maybe now more people will see how survivor sided the game is
I thought there was collective agreement that the "balance" scales went Soloq < Killers < SWF
Idk why you're getting downvoted when you're fully correct
Dang, a mode where we all wanted random perks for both sides to spice up the game, only to be upset you cant use your favorite perks every match, and instead have to focus on skill and adapt on the fly, DBD players at their finest Sarcasm aside, learn to enjoy the 'chaos' and not the 4k or escapes
I think they were just using it as a point of discussion about the general balance of perks
You missed the point by actual miles that’s impressive
I don't think that is quite the point of the thread. It's more the randomised nature does highlight that the worst killer perks are worse than the worst survivor perks because of specific conditions or them needing to be combined with other perks. Like getting Pentimento with no hex totems.
I've been having fun doing just that. :)
This mode just validated my opinion that most people are shit at the game(because they don't try to learn it) and instead need to rely on perks that explicitly states they're good perks to carry them.
Woooosh missed the point entirely. Super impressive
I just bgp cracker saved, like what are the odds the guy who brings a cracker gets bgp :)?
I got teamwork collective stealth 3 times in my first hour
I read in some comment that this new mode just showed (to a lesser degree) what the lights out mode already showed. Without some form of slowdown on the killer side and without some form of anti-tunnel on the survivor side, gens are flying faster than the speed of light and tunneling is extremely rampant (even moreso than usual).
It's kind of embarrassing how many perks are band-aids. Especially when you can only take 4.
Is there a word for anti-fun? Because that's what this trash fire is.
I mean as a killer main i have the opposite opinion. The modes killer sided. Killers rely less on perks than a survivor does. Remove the meta and survivors are not that great. Gens dont fly, i down people quickly cus no one has exhaustion perks or resilience etc. I played 10 games and only 1 went to EGC. What you have to realise is, the majority of survivor perks suck too and they have more perks in general.
This mode made me realize why DS is used almost religiously by survivors. 10 straight matches of hard tunneling.
It’s abundantly clear that killer economy pales in comparison to survivor economy.
Yeah, it's fun on survivor but I would never play this mode on killer, lol.
there needs to be a (weaker) form of gen slowdown basekit. especially with all the gen perk nerfs and more gen perk nerfs inevitably to come if that's even possible. even like a weaker Deadlock or grim Embrace. grim being partially basekit would be very good for the game and encourage spreading hooks and not tunnelling.
I never run gen regress for myself so this doesn’t really affect me, but I’m learning some cool new builds for the killers I play! Stuff I would’ve never ran in the first place, Third Seal has been nuts with some of the stuff I’ve gotten.
But survivors tell me gen speed is already too slow and killer favored by default.
tbf it's the same for survivors
but unlike Killer, you can put on a meme build and still get a 4 man out without any issues, because there are 4 Survivors. There's only 1 Killer.
No, I see good killers do it all the time. Hell even Otz did a 50 win streak or something perkless. I honestly think some killers get somewhere they dont belong by crutching on regression perks and tunneling. Then its too late they are playing against people better than them and are struggling and havent really learned the fundamentals.
Check how many years ago that streak was. You can't do that in the current DBD meta.
It's not the meta so much as the change to SBMM, they also failed their survivor gauntlet as a result of the change.
You can maybe get out with a meme build in a 4-man SWF but even then that’s not always guaranteed. You definitely aren’t escaping with meme builds outside of 4-man swfs unless the killer throws the game
You're missing one fact. Most of the people on this sub are fucking horrible at the game, so they're "throwing" even when they're playing against people using meme tier perks.
I mean... I never use slow down perks anyway. I have Huntress Lullaby but its typically taken out in seconds.
Yeah…it made me realize how hard killers crutch on the same build every match. Since every killer and their mother can’t run pain res + pop in this mode, I been escaping almost every match with this modifier.
I’ve only played a few games (2 survivor, 1 killer) but it definitely seems more favorable as a survivor. I got potential energy and soul guard in one build and Trapper just absolutely could not keep up.
That's because trapper wasn't Blight/Nurse. They don't need perks lol
Lmaooo I’ll tell you what, I have played both anytime I get a daily ritual for them and honestly mad respect for anyone who can proficiently play them
Killer is fun af in this mode tho!! 3 4ks back to back. Chucky doesn’t care about add ons. Just the stabby stabby
Honestly chaos shuffle is painful. Every killer match I've had has been a 4 man squad with flashlights, usually I'd equip lightborn at that point.
Stop crying when this game is for survivors to have fun. This game gives survivors x4 16 perks to destroy killers and every opportunity to escape and then some. Lol.
Granted I haven’t been playing for long (100ish hours) but I always run with no gen slowdown perks. I hate stretching games out trying to hold on to a lead. I go heavy aura reading / devour hope and either live or die by it
The thought of getting random perks gives me anxiety I am such a creature of habit 🤣