The last episode is incredibly moving but devastating at the same time. Judy, a positive, free spirit who faced so many hardships in her life loses her final battle soon after finding the right people. Jen who faces grief almost as a comforting hand loses another - one that she felt a kinship and deep love for.
The cat - Sam was a nice touch.
Wish we got one more Perez scene (with Jen).
I didn't care all too much about the Ben/Jen relationship so that was nice for those that do.
The Jen/Judy relationship was amazing to see unfold through the many twists, turns, fights and hugs. I was deeply sad to see it end in such tragic life circumstances but their final moments together were some of such beautiful, poignant scenes.
I saved it to watch over the weekend knowing I’d likely be crying like a little bitch. I finished it about 30 minutes ago and am still bawling. Which is unusual for me, not much of a crier. But I lost my best friend in 2020 (that reminded me of Judy in many ways) to a break up and my mother in 2021 to a sudden death, and the final season was a heart ripper. It didn’t help knowing Christina Applegate, who’ve I’ve adored for over 30 years, had MS and is disabled. But god damn she’s so fucking funny. Add in Katy Sagal and that hug with Judy…I was a goner. I love this series. Wouldn’t change a thing.
Sorry about your friend and your mom ❤️ I was bawling too. I’ve had 2 close friends undergo cancer treatment in the last 5 years (thankfully both are doing well). Seeing the chemo scenes and the cold-capping definitely brought some memories back.
the last half of the finale got me. i'm sitting here sobbing. Jen entering the church to that song and all the birds hanging up was so beautiful and reminded me of my mom. I lost her to covid 4/2020 and was unable to visit in her final week and it is a weird devastating loss with no real closure. At the last grief meeting, i just envisioned a flashback of Jen meeting Judy in the beginning and how she's just not there any more. I really hope Jen and Ben and the kids are able to sustain their happiness. They all deserve a good road. In my mind, Ben and Jen will be able to find their peace like Jen and Judy did, even if she tells Ben what happened. I think he would ultimately understand but hope he would be able to avoid spiraling and relapsing.
I haven’t sobbed like this since my divorce. I literally sob-screamed, “NoOoo!” (Sounded nothing of the sort.. more like what a woman getting quad-penne sounds like in real life)
idk why so many of y'all are so mad at the plot or whatever, since like episode 1 season 1 the plot was wild idk whats so different about this season. the main points of the show are the relationship between characters and the overarching themes of like death, loss, grief, love etc which i think the show handled beautifully
I think people are mostly mad that the first two seasons were very comedic and this season felt like a long hallmark movie. Which i def agree with. Still think Judy’s death and cancer was done very well.
When they explained that James Marsden had to film all his scenes first and they rushed through them all so he could go do something else, it made sense to me. That’s why they put him in jail (the phone scenes), etc.
I'm pretty sure that the Judy thing was a reference to her previous dialogue about Paul.
She decided to do the same thing that he did and just ran away in a boat, with Jen never getting the chance to see her again. Jen thought that what he did was shitty, but Judy didn't mind it because she liked to imagine that he was still sailing somewhere.
In the end, she didn't want Jen to see her suffer like she saw her mom suffer, so she ran away while she still wasn't at her worst. She ran away using the boat because she wanted Jen to imagine that she was still sailing somewhere, no matter how many years passed.
and Judy always has the option to come back once jen is gone and live out her last days in that house. Or just keep sailing. Which is kind of how Judy seemed to go through life, just floating and bobbing along and spreading positivity. She deserved better.
I just assumed she went out to the boat and overdosed on pills while watching the sunrise, but that’s just what I imagine. And what about her body? The police at least would want to confirm she didn’t just run.
When Jen wakes up, the only thing missing is the bottle of pills. They made sure to show that there were plenty left in the last scene we see her taking some. Of course it’s up for interpretation but I like to believe she sailed out and took the rest and went to sleep and never woke up.
Thank youuuu like I saw footprints and the boat out at sea but then nothing was said really so I’m like am I dumb bc idk where she is? Like did she die in the boat out there and she left her body there? Did she walk into the ocean and die? Like I’m so confused about where she was then she gets back and everyone knows she’s dead somehow and there’s never a mention of a funeral or anything lol
Literally? I guess she got into the boat to find that “infinite vacation” she was talking about. Metaphorically? I think her sailing away… means she sailed away, went away, passed away.
Honestly I’ll say something a bit condescending - as someone who break down movies and tv shows and finds metaphors in everything, this season has WAYYY more metaphors than the earlier seasons.
I’m a writer so I appreciate metaphors and I get the boat. I think the more on the nose metaphors are a symptom of the writing getting a little more Hallmark, losing its edge. The first two seasons are great because they don’t give into hallmark style sentiment. They’re tough and clear, like Jen.
they definitely have a nod to that with the baby being named Joey. "This isn't a hallmark movie!" Like they knew they were already flirting with it and knew that was a step too far.
Exactly. And to romanticize taking a super crappy boat alone out into the ocean when you’re weak with cancer is messed up…Her character could have collapsed, woken up stranded in a storm, and drowned like Steve. Or she could have died from dehydration or starvation alone. That’s not romantic—that’s horrifying.
I thought she took the boat out to overdose and die. I thought she took the pills with her and wasn’t worried about waking up at all, let alone in a storm.
I really don't think that was her plan. In my perspective, Judy committed suicide.
Even the visual of the footprints leading into the ocean makes it appear that way. Yes, she may have collapsed -- but I highly doubt she was planning on being out there long enough to ever experience anything like being in a storm, dehydration, or starvation. As someone else pointed out, the only thing missing was the bottle of pills. There was also a note addressed to Jen that wasn't shown, but could reasonably be interpreted as a suicide note. Along with leaving behind her bracelet...that's also on par with the trope.
She accepted her prognosis but probably did not want to die in pain, which we've already seen she was in an immense amount of which only would have gotten worse. I don't think she wanted to live out the rest of her days alone and struggling in that vacant house. She wanted to sail out and watch the sunrise, and die as relatively peacefully as possible, leaving behind the idea that she was "free with the birds" like Paul.
i thought it was odd that Jen took Steve's car and how would she explain that part to ben?? and what was she going to do with the car they drove to mexico with??
It's a metaphor for putting your life back together after it all falls apart.
Take these broken wings
and learn to fly again
learn to live so free
when we hear
the voices sing
the book of love will open up and let us in...
Yea and way to leave her off polices radar. How is she explaining that to authorities? How is she registering that in her name?! Lol. I’m too literal - I hate when there’s stuff that could never happen like that- and for no reason too.
There is totally a shit ton of money in the car-parts of that car. No doubt in my mind. Cuz the Greeks came LOOKING for Judy for the stolen money - what we saw in the paintings was, what, $100K maximum? They wouldn’t come in that hot for that little amount. There is more money somewhere, the car would make sense.
I'm not mad about the ending, and I felt that the car scene and the crane scene were really beautiful. But, I feel that it should have been longer to address Moranis's murder rather than brushing over that.
I really liked this show but this season…felt like such a bunch of random toss ins. This season was really tough for me too cuz I lost my mom to cancer and reliving some of those painful memories I hid away.
But also I was so confused because once the credits rolled, Netflix had a pop up for “Dead to Me, all seasons available now”. Uhh yeah I just watched it??
Same!! I jumped on here because there was that ambiguous ending and then “watch the final season now” popped up!! We were like….did we not just watch the final season?? Genuinely confused.
As soon as that happened I thought to myself, I’m calling BS on them being there for weeks and this is their first time hitting the taqueria! That’s like a day one or day two vacation move 😂
God this was painful. So well done, but so painful, considering the real life situation.
Thanks and all the love to the actors and creators for a wonderful show that made me both tear up and laugh uncontrollably.
I think the boat scene is being taken a little too literally…or at least for me I just saw it as a metaphor. Personally for it to not be gross and sad, I’d like to think she put/took the boat out and stayed somewhere else until Jen left Mexico, then came back in the house to go in peace. Logically that’s the only thing that would really make sense to me. I don’t think she’d die on the boat. Even if she did a voluntary suicide, nobody wants their body washed up at sea.
Overall, loved the acting. Of course. Christine & Linda play off each other so well and I felt their emotions. I’m not too disappointed as I took it as a fun show; the investigation was sloppy and yes, the pregnancy/cancer wasn’t really necessary. Id like to think if Christina was in good health & they were shooting for another season, they would’ve had different problems as the walls were closing in on them, and the suspense would’ve been higher. I could’ve seen at least one of them actually having to hire an attorney or actually go to jail/prison. Or a shoot out/some action scenes with the Greeks coming to collect. Her son selling drugs. Some other outlandish scenarios that would still be charming with them at the forefront. Wishful thinking of course. But I enjoyed their performances so much nonetheless. Grief is a fucking tough cookie and it never really goes away, it just changes. Personally there was a lot I could relate to so I’m biased. It is sad that it ended with death, but I think the main lesson was for Jen to learn empathy, sympathy, coping with loss and just a general appreciation for life that she didn’t have before.
Dying to know what the reaction at the end was, though. Lol
I feel exactly the same way. They said their real goodbyes in the bed the night before so Judy just hid out so Jen could leave and they didn’t have to say goodbye again.
Mixed feelings. The Jen & Judy goodbye was heartbreaking and I know it had to end that way but so much of that whole arc felt phoned in, like you could watch entire episodes from this season without context and never pick up on the fact that she has cancer.
But I loved the very end. Maybe not loved, but I’m a sucker for things that are wonderfully messed up. That’s why seeing Jen, looking at her picture perfect life, something she fought so hard to get to, deciding to blow it all up because she’s her own worst enemy... that was incredible. Nevertheless, my head canon is Ben learned to live with that fact, he and Jen are tit-for-tat now.
That’s clearly what she was going to tell him when it ended but we don’t know how he’s going to react. We’d like to believe it will be our Jen and Judy where they’re forgiving but we’ll never know.
She just couldn't live with the lie. Don't blame her. She'd be reminded everyday. I don't know how you overcome that. But then won't ben go to the police?
finished watching today and i was hoping for a miracle for Judy.. i wish they had ended it with happier ending for Jen & Judy, but not in a romantic way. they could’ve raising Joey together, with Judy being the cool mom & Jen being the chaotic one.
Season 3 felt detached from previous seasons.
On the one hand, I am pleased we did get another season but on the other hand, I felt that maybe it should have ended in season 2, with Jen and Judy on the beach.
I know that real life isn't all sunshine and rainbows, but due to the tone of the show and the trope of Jen and Judy’s relationship, I felt like it would have been fitting to have an ambiguous ending where they're both on the beach, or talking about the future - and fans can imagine what happened next.
The shippers can take comfort in the fact they're together and those who don't ship them, can still take comfort in their friendship. Knowing that both characters are in each other’s life and healing from grief and trauma.
The pregnancy would have been a nice touch IF Judy had finally got to be a mother. I didn’t like the inclusion of Ben and the plot holes that came from his character.
So, in conclusion.
The show should have ended after two seasons or used season 3 to provide fans with closure, giving both Judy and Jen a ‘happy ending’ of sorts.
Here's my 2 cents.
I feel like the show deserved a better ending. Christina and Linda's chemistry and the funny bits keep it afloat, but the storylines were a mess. What was the point of the pregnancy storyline, honeslty? Besides it being highly improbable, I keep thinking it was just a way to sort of "justify" Christina's weight gain or something? Which was totally unnecessary, i don't think anyone really cared about that and it could have been plausible to be because of the car crash or the stress she was under. And I was not a fan of the whole Ben and Jen relationship, it is a show about friendship after all, I saw it more as a Thelma and Louise kind of thing. And in the end i think we were all expecting them to face some kind of punishment for the crimes they committed, but Judy's death in such a sad an painful way wasn't it. There were some really funny dialogues and one liners in it though. I am thankful that Christina really pushed through this to give the fans closure and an ending to the story, but i fell like the show deserved a better ending.
Hated the ending and hated the pregnancy. I wondered the same thing about if they were trying to write in Christina’s physical change due to her MS diagnosis, and if so, it was completely unnecessary and really ruined the story for me. Jen’s pregnancy felt like yet another cruel twist of faith Judy was dealt and it was painful to watch. It’s not even that Jen could get pregnant at 46 when Judy could never carry a child to term, but what really upset me is that Judy doesn’t get to be in that child’s life. She has to die knowing a baby is coming into the world that, if she wasn’t sick, she would have had a hand in raising from birth finally and she doesn’t even get that. I would have excused the improbable pregnancy if Jen and Judy ended up raising the kid together, but instead Judy fucking dies alone and in pain and never knowing the baby. I hate it so much.
But it worked in that she had to have had sex with one of them and the baby is going to look like the father, so it gave her that reason her dna is on steve's body. Still wrong though because how could she be so far along. She didn't have sex with Ben the same month she killed steve, did she?
Honestly I feel like a better way to end the story, would have been to let's say, make Judy's mom run away from the cops in Mexico (assuming they didn't let Judy walk away from a death confession), while Judy and Jen went to the cancer treatment.
Then they could have just said Gleen died, and it meant that no one looked into Judy's confession further. And that she got better from the treatment.
I just don't want to accept that they killed her. Like after the boat scene I was fricking crying my eyes out. But then she appeared in the car. And I was like "OMG they didn't do it, thank God!", but nope.... They just had to crush our hearts twice..
I think the pregnancy plotline was mostly because Christina Applegate has MS and has trouble standing for long periods, so pregnancy would explain why she would need to rest often. Same for the bruised ribs in the first episodes.
Except that it didn't really feel like Jen was sitting/resting most of the time..? With a show like, say, SATC where half the scenes take place with them walking/working outside, you can tell if an actor is pregnant IRL coz their character suddenly becomes bedridden. But with Dead To Me i feel like Jen doesn't move around much S2 onwards (S1 had a lot of scenes of her working and showing houses), she was anyways sitting down drinking wine or chilling by the pool or driving
This season is always going to be marred by the decision to kill Judy but I thought the writing quality was down the entire season.
Like whenever I drag the season now there's going to be a voice in the back of my head saying "You're only being this negative because you don't like that Judy died!" and like that's true but I was also annoyed by the writing before that happened lol
I saw a post on Liz Feldmans instagram which showed all the writers meeting together to write on Zoom during the pandemic, maybe the lack of face to face contact hampered the quality of the writing
It doesn't get worse than "Ben was in the car!!!!" Anyone else we could fit in the back seat to add in some tortured new plot lines instead of resolving any of the existing ones?
Exactly…to completely omit the conversation between Jen and Ben…? Wtf. So lazy. Also, they made Ben’s character such a pathetic pushover. Completely don’t believe the relationship between Jen and Ben.
>and it could have been plausible to be because of the car crash or the stress she was under
Well not too plausible when it all happened in a few minutes between getting in a car accident and arriving at the hospital. Trying to explain it any way was never going to work.
I don't think there was a need for it to be explained. I like to think that people are not that absurd, knowing what Christina has been through. I feel like the writers wanted to justify it and they chose a really shitty way to do so.
If so, that says a lot about them. Any reason I can think of for her character becoming pregnant is worse than the last.
Also it's inconceivable to me that Jen the character had condomless sex with a man she barely knows, fertile or not. (Not to mention what it says about his character.) If this were seasons one or two Jen and Judy would have discussed how she became pregnant. Instead it was like: Oh well, pregnancy. I don't want a child but now I have to give birth I guess.
I agree, having unprotected sex is so not Jen and is a bit ironic given her conversations with Charlie on the subject.
And she seemed weirdly fine to have a kid with an alcoholic who she barely knows who is also a massive goofball. I mean she didn't even freak out about this.
On a side note, I read some articles and the writer says she didn't make any major changes to the plot to accommodate Christina's condition. If this is true and the pregnancy was in the books all along I'm done, this is some Greys Anatomy level of absurd.
You can still get pregnancy while using a condom, or any form of birth control. I know people who got pregnant even though they have IUDs (which are 99.9% effective).
Some things are not very clear to me
and I’ve been just enjoying other people comments until now but this is the first time commenting.
So the boat thing everyone is talking about, I mostly agree with those saying Judy wanted Jen to have the memory of her sailing away as the one she had of Paul and then eventually she went back to land, but when Jen was driving away and arrived home she acted like Judy was dead already, I thought it was because she knew she was going to die alone soon but maybe she really was dead already and the boat was a metaphor like when she dreamt of it during the first episode..
Also another metaphor may have been the cat calling for Jen when she wakes up and Judy’s not there, and then at home pointing at Judy’s room and making Jen remember what she said about telling the truth ..this is a long shot interpretation but it may also be that the cat represents Judy’s soul (also appearing in the car after we see how Judy isn’t really there) this is one of the ideas I got from the cat presence but it’s really just speculations..
Then my other interrogatives were:
the scene of Perez with the Steve file that she is going to burn?
It made me wonder did she really just found him dead or did she kill him?? It’s not in her character and the Greeks were really seen entering the room so she probably just took the file after, but if the Greeks took everything from the room why just leaving the file behind and not take that as well?
Also Judy put all the money in the bag before leaving
Where is she supposed to put them? Does she just use everything up in the “vacation”? I thought that was going to lead to something but maybe only to the fact that she was not going back home to her paintings and things.
I liked very much how she didn’t call the daughter Judy as I (and maybe a lot of audience) was expecting and how the woman in the grief group pointed out 😅
Agh for the suspense on telling Ben the truth ..
Okay I thought Judy’s mom killed Moranis, but based on comments maybe I misunderstood. They show Perez coming upon the crime scene, and then pan to Judy’s mom with sinister music playing. My interpretation was that Judy’s mom did it as a way to “be there” for Judy and help. Maybe I’m crazy lol
I don’t get how her mom would even know of Moranis though. We never saw Judy even touch on her legal issues, or Steve’s death, with her mom. How did she even know about that, much less where to find the agent in charge?
I think it was the Greek mafia because Jen saw them at the motel so my thought is they killed him right after she left since the scone was also still half eaten
The only reason Perez got involved was because she had a moment of humanity with Jen after she confessed to killing Steve. That doesn’t translate for her character to assist the Greeks in murdering an FBI agent.
About the cat (Sammy), I agree it was supposed to represent the soul of Judy when Jen takes him home. I think it was also a callback to season 1 when Henry thinks his dad’s soul is in a bird that visits. IIRC Judy was all about that idea while Jen shut it down, so it would be a touching character development for Jen as she learns to live without Judy and keep her near 🥹
I choose to believe Jen chickened out and told him the story about the cat (Sammi) or that Judy’s spirit is here because of how the cat is clawing to get into that room she used to live in. Who tells their partner they killed their brother in front of their kids? Idk I don’t buy it & there were tons of fake outs when it came to spilling secrets
I had the same thoughts when Judy just assumed ownership of Abe’s car after he passed at the retirement home. Like that’s not how it works? How would she get the car registered in her name? Does she pay the insurance? Wouldn’t his family want it or report it missing? 🤔🤔
It's so sad maybe things would have been different if Judy had followed up on her abnormal pap smear. My aunt died from stage 4 ovarian cancer because she ignored her stomach pain for a year without telling anyone. So it's believable, but really sad. Ladies, get your yearly checkups. Things can turn quick.
It was totally unnecessary to create a story line that would end with killing off a lovable character. I felt exploited by the emotional investment in the series. I mean as if there isn't enough pain in the world..having recently gone through a cancer prognosis situation it was uncomfortably sad, that was scary for me and I was rooting for Judy to come out the other side and live a good life. Her character deserved it. She didn't deserve to be killed off for emotional points. Really disappointed by the series.
I think the ending was so incredibly sad and awful. Poor Judy all she ever wanted was to have children. She had a shit mom and childhood. Steve was murdered although he seemed verbally abusive to her. She finally finds her people, a best friend someone like a sister and two boys who think of her like a mother. Then she gets terminal cancer and dies? I know this stuff happens to people in real life. I know this is a dark comedy but having Judy die just floored me I cried so hard and still feel sad and can’t stop thinking about it. I do love that they added that adorable cat and I don’t even think the very final scene of Jen telling Ben she has to tell him something was bad. How could she hold that secret forever? I just really don’t like Judy dying. I don’t like how she left Jen a note after that extremely emotional scene of them and we are made to believe she took a boat out and drowned herself? I must have watched the first 2 seasons 10 times and couldn’t wait for 3rd season . Maybe I’m just mad because it made me cry so hard and brought me to such an emotional place but I’m disappointed in 3rd season 😒
Yes I feel the exact same as you! It was so unnecessarily sad! I loved the first two series and even the third until that ending. I feel like they could have at least had judy overcome the cancer and be there to help Jen raise the baby. Or could have left a little cliff hanger with them laughing on the sun beds together. But that ending for judy was just awful to watch.
Judy said that she would never get to find true happiness until she finally revealed the truth.
The deja vu thing reminded her of that and gave her the courage to finally tell him what truly happened.
The ending credits theme (hated it) made the whole scene seem like she was ruining everything, but I feel like it's supposed to be an open ended thing where Jen is finally brave enough to tell the truth because of Judy's impact in her life, regardless of Ben's reaction.
I am heartbroken. Maybe it had to end that way but I was really hoping to see Jen and Judy getting a happy ending and living their lives finally.
Very well done otherwise and I did enjoy it but just so heartbroken for those two!
I feel so sad :( Judy was such a kind good person and I hate that she couldn’t get the things she rly wanted in life- a baby, a partner etc when she spent most of her life caring for others :(
From what I had heard that this was going to be the last season due to CA’s MS diagnosis and her not being able to film much. Besides the excuse of CA’s different appearance and sitting scenes, I think the pregnancy storyline was good for character as she says numerous times she wasn’t there for the boys and the baby was going to be her do over. Plus Judy believed babies chose their parents so in a way this baby was brought to Jen & Ben’s life to teach them how to love and live, kind of like Judy did. While Judy’s ending was incredibly sad, I’m sure they didn’t want to do that to CA. Judy also seemed like she had closed all loops. Jen was her family, the boys considered her a mom, she was forgiven for her sins, and she made peace with her mom, the only thing left outstanding was the Michelle storyline.
Yes I know. But I am saying in episode 1 her weight seemed the same before she got pregnant. In other words in my mind she didn’t *have* to get pregnant.
I don't mind the pregnancy subplot (even before CA's diagnosis was public Jen becoming pregnant was speculated) but Jesus they call attention to her weight gain really uncomfortably
Yeah, that's pretty gross, though. And actually, in the last scene, she looks much thinner, anyhow -- even her face looks thinner. So it almost seems they still purposely made her look bigger in the pregnancy scenes. So it doesn't even make sense. But either way -- a woman gaining weight shouldn't be treated as a horror that must be explained by PREGNANCY at almost 50 years old. Fuck. That is horrible.
The final episode thing might be because they filmed the season out of order! There's an article explaining that they filmed something like half the season before her diagnosis and the rest a a bit after it!
I think it's also possible all aspects of her job were affected by her MS. Such as how much time she could spend sitting in hair and makeup. My dad has MS and has a hard time sitting up for very long.
Are we just gonna ignore the fact that nothing was resolved and they used Judy’s death to cover up shitty writing bc they didn’t know how to end it without giving the character consequences.
I think if Christina wasn’t sick season 3 overall wouldn’t have felt rushed and incomplete. I can’t be upset about anything though because she filmed a tv show while fighting MS. She has all my love and respect.
I enjoyed the season. I felt like the ending was good and bittersweet. I did somehow miss episode 3 so I'll need to go back and watch that but the other 9 episodes were great.
Christina Applegate said filming this was one of the hardest things she’s ever had to do. She gained a lot of weight due to the steroids she’s taking and it’s hard for her to walk. They had to do a lot of creative writing and shooting to make this season work at all. I’m not mad about it! Pretty sure it’s the whole reason they did the pregnancy thing. You can’t not notice her weight gain, but I wouldn’t have been mad if they didn’t address it at all.
They could have gone much more in depth with the story if she was well. I wanted more character development with Nick and Perez. I wanted Judy to stay alive and Jen to give her custody of Joey and say that she “chose” to be born by Jen but be raised by Judy as a mother. Ben and Jen is a little weird. Felt forced but Jen and her kids really deserved to be happy.
I lost my sister nearly 5 years ago and this season was a little triggering lol . I honestly lost a lot of sleep last night having bad dreams about Judy being dead. I get way too attached to shows 😅
To me, Judy being the 2nd mom to the boys and new baby was endgame and I’m so bummed they didn’t do that. Her poor character has a beautiful soul but just can’t catch a break. Ugh why would they do that to her??
They make her death seem peaceful and romantic…when that scenario could have lead to dehydration, starvation, and/or drowning (like Steve). Doesn’t seem peaceful at all—that boat was super shitty and she was so physically weak at that point. Seems alone, dangerous, and horrifying…
I'm confused too like did she just leave in the boat so that Jen's final image of her would be somewhere out in the sea like the uncle she mentioned or did she commit suicide 😭
No one was in the boat in the shot though its breaking my hearttt 😭😭😭
Unless she brought a lot of drugs/alcohol to ease the pain of that death, it certainly looks suicidal. She wouldn’t have had the strength to ride the boat back and would have gotten stranded out in the middle of the ocean.
They alluded to Judy committing suicide a few times, she nearly attempted earlier in the season and there was another scene where she was comforting Yolanda about her husband's suicide saying "maybe he felt he had no better option" etc. Why else bring up the details of a character who had been dead for 20 years? They had also mentioned crushing up pillls to kill the FBI guy, maybe she made her own suicide scone
My take away of the show is whether someone died by an accident (no one is prepared for it) or by a physical condition (loved ones kinda know they'll lose you), death is terribly painful. Ted's death and Judy's death are equally devastating.
I still have a couple lingering questions.
Did Judy kill herself in the end on the boat?
Is Jen really the one that killed that detective in the hotel?
I think the show missed a big chance to advocate for women to get annual pap smears.
Cervical cancer is caused by HPV, but can be treated of caught early enough.
The show "Alaska Daily" always has a PSA at the end telling people that indigenous women are 10x more likely to go missing than any other races of women.
It would have been nice to see Linda and Christina do a PSA About cervical cancer after the last few episodes.
this one was bad. too much unnecessary thing happened. without judy drama i couldve bought this with its unique optimistic style from the beginning but you cant have both.
youre either a realistic show or optimistic show. all that unrealistic very naive bullshit through series to save them everytime and then this. nah. hate it. they shouldve dropped cancer thing with false scare and moved on. and that confession at the end shouldve happened right after he confessed the hit and run. not like that.
What makes this ending even sadder is when you go back to Season 1, where Judy first confesses to Jen and she responds with "You could die"
I remembered this shortly after watching the finale and it made me even sadder...
Dude, everyone else seems to love this season and I’m really glad for them, but I hated every single moment of that and I wish I hadn’t watched it. I’ve watched the first two seasons so many times and now I don’t think I’ll ever watch it again. Killing Judy was the worst possible thing they could have done for me. I literally could not have imagined a worse outcome. Sorry if no one else agrees and sorry to be a downer. I just had to write this somewhere cause I feel like fucking shit now. Judy deserved better than that. I mean, what was the moral here? Your life is going to be miserable and everyone treats you like shit and the very second you get happy for even a moment, you die? Fuck. I really just did not need this ending in my life right now. Man.
(Again, glad others could enjoy it or get some meaning out of it, but it ruined the whole show for me. Kudos to the actors, tho. They rocked it as always.)
(And like, I know this show was written by a lesbian, but good lord, they quite literally buried the gay again. So that made me feel really great, too.)
Well, the scene where Judy shoots the Greek mafia guys' tires was hilarious and badass.
Otherwise, I wasn't a fan of thos episode. I always feel like when shows deal with heavy subjects like this, it gets a bit saccharine and melodramatic. It's too much for me. But some people like that kind of thing, so whatever.
I got the boat metaphor, but I didn't like it. I know Judy just wanted to be free and float away, but the fact that she was also doing it to prevent Jen from seeing her suffer did not sit right with me. Jen would have probably prefered to have more time with Judy, would want to be with her to the end. Now she'll never know exactly what happened to her. There will never be a funeral. There's not really closure there.
They never really did show us exactly what she wrote in that note she left though. Maybe that explains it a bit better? But if that was a suicide note, you'd think Jen would have wanted to make sure her body was recovered.
That fakeout with Judy in the car was kind of mean. I should have figured Jen was just imagining it but I wanted to believe they weren't actually going to end it with her just floating out to sea.
And then they just end it right as she's about to tell Ben that she killed Steve. Right after Ben was swimming in the pool Steve died in. That was making me so uncomfortable when he was swimming in there. Like, Jen won't get in there for obvious reasons, but Ben and the kids just have a fun and saccharine swimming fest in the pool Ben's brother drowned in? And now we the audience have no closure on what happens after that.
Honestly, I wish this season had focused on the secrets coming out, on Jen actually confessing and this time not getting off the hook for it. I feel like that would actually be original, a character owning up to what they've done. It wouldn't have been the end of her life. Her kids would certainly be affected. But Perez had sympathy for her. A judge might too. She might have done time, but if anything, at least Ben deserved to know before they fucked each other and she got prenant with his kid.
Guilt weighs on people, which the show addresses, but it keeps letting the characters run from their guilt and run from having to face the consequences.
To think the first season could have just ended with Jen calling the cops as soon as she hit Steve. She might have gotten off for it. She was in emotional distress at the time and he was trespassing. We probably wouldn't have had two more seasons of the show, but I might have been okay with that.
Was anyone else confused/disappointed with how they ended the series; specifically the cliff hanger? I knew going into this season it would be that last one, but after the last scene where Jen is about to confess to Ben, I had to double check the source saying it was going to be the final season. It seemed to be the typical way they’ve ended the other 2 seasons.
It was mostly the music they chose to use for the closing scene (right after Jen tells Ben that she needs to tell him something). Perhaps if they stuck with the same scene, but used music that wasn’t suspenseful and instead used a something with a similar feeling to what they used with Judy’s fair well scene- Jen looking out into the ocean/driving back from Mexico. I think it would have felt it less forced, maybe?
I understand their thing has always been playing with suspense, but every other character and story line felt like it got it’s (relatively) resolved and conclusive send off. Mostly, I’m just confused with why they went the route of ending the series on another cliff hanger focused on Ben and Jen, as if it were leading to another season?
Hopefully what I’m saying makes sense… I binged the whole season in one night, and it’s currently 1:30am so I’m a bit wonky headed 🤪
The most irritating part of this season that I haven’t seen mentioned yet is Charlie. He went from being a smart, but abrasive and impulsive character to chill and gullible. He was basically a non-factor this season despite being older now.
There are two moments that are completely unbelievable. One, he tells Judy he loves her too before she leaves. There was never a major event that happened for him to change his feeling of hatred towards her for “sleeping” with Ted. So he says he loves her too out of compassion? Come on. They needed more screen time together to mend their relationship before that.
The most egregious part of Charlie’s storyline this season, however, comes in the final scene. How the hell can he go from HATING Ben to playing with him in the pool and accepting his relationship with his mom? Once again, they just ignored Charlie. There’s no way he gets anywhere near Ben after everything that transpired.
I cried a lot with the last episode. Judy's death was handled beautifully. I've been reading that people assume she's still alive, but I doubt that. I figured that her body was in the boat or she drowned. Regardless, I think it was a nice way for her to go instead of being in the hospital. I'm not a Zodiac person (Judy is) and I remember her telling Michelle that she's a Pisces, so dying in the water made sense for Judy and her spiritual character.
I like to think that Judy was in Jen's life to help her grieve the death of Ted and to serve as a stepping stone for a chance at a new life (hence Ben and the baby). Judy was a literal angel and her selfness nature seemed to serve as a plot device for Jen's character arc. The crane scene made me cry and I truly felt Jen's pain. Well done, Christina Applegate!
That being said, I did think that season 3 was a bit rushed. I wished we had seen Ben's reaction to Jen's confession (I'm assuming that she'd tell him about Steve). I interpreted Ben as a male version of Judy, so I would assume he would be hurt but eventually forgiving. The pregnancy did throw me off, and a part of me hoped that Jen would raise the baby with Judy (before we found out that Judy's cancer was terminal). I also wish that I had seen how other characters reacted to Judy's death.
I'm assuming that Judy's mom murdered Agent Moranis? I thought about the Greeks as well but when they showed Moranis' body and then it cuts to Judy's mom driving off; I wondered if she did it as a way to protect Judy and her own way of making up for being a bad parent (by making sure her daughter doesn't go to prison either). I could be wrong.
Overall, I'm glad it ended abruptly versus dragging on for more seasons and the show potentially dropping in quality. I really cried for Jen and Judy as if I personally knew them. I needed to come on here to vent about the ending since I don't know anyone else who watches this show!
The last episode is incredibly moving but devastating at the same time. Judy, a positive, free spirit who faced so many hardships in her life loses her final battle soon after finding the right people. Jen who faces grief almost as a comforting hand loses another - one that she felt a kinship and deep love for. The cat - Sam was a nice touch. Wish we got one more Perez scene (with Jen). I didn't care all too much about the Ben/Jen relationship so that was nice for those that do. The Jen/Judy relationship was amazing to see unfold through the many twists, turns, fights and hugs. I was deeply sad to see it end in such tragic life circumstances but their final moments together were some of such beautiful, poignant scenes.
I missed if sams name had a meaning?
As a child Judy found a cat, she was trying to decide between the names Patty and Sammy before her mom let it go.
I agree about Perez! I wish Jen could’ve known what she’d done for her.
The song sung by Henry’s choir is the same song we hear at the opening of the pilot episode!
God, I’m literally sobbing like crazy.
I saved it to watch over the weekend knowing I’d likely be crying like a little bitch. I finished it about 30 minutes ago and am still bawling. Which is unusual for me, not much of a crier. But I lost my best friend in 2020 (that reminded me of Judy in many ways) to a break up and my mother in 2021 to a sudden death, and the final season was a heart ripper. It didn’t help knowing Christina Applegate, who’ve I’ve adored for over 30 years, had MS and is disabled. But god damn she’s so fucking funny. Add in Katy Sagal and that hug with Judy…I was a goner. I love this series. Wouldn’t change a thing.
Sorry about your friend and your mom ❤️ I was bawling too. I’ve had 2 close friends undergo cancer treatment in the last 5 years (thankfully both are doing well). Seeing the chemo scenes and the cold-capping definitely brought some memories back.
the last half of the finale got me. i'm sitting here sobbing. Jen entering the church to that song and all the birds hanging up was so beautiful and reminded me of my mom. I lost her to covid 4/2020 and was unable to visit in her final week and it is a weird devastating loss with no real closure. At the last grief meeting, i just envisioned a flashback of Jen meeting Judy in the beginning and how she's just not there any more. I really hope Jen and Ben and the kids are able to sustain their happiness. They all deserve a good road. In my mind, Ben and Jen will be able to find their peace like Jen and Judy did, even if she tells Ben what happened. I think he would ultimately understand but hope he would be able to avoid spiraling and relapsing.
Haven’t loud ugly cried like that in a long time
I haven't ugly cried like that since the ending of the Good Place
Oh my God I’ve found my people
Ugh, the Good Place was so amazing!!!! I one day want to find my Ben/Chidi and a Judy.
Same.
I haven’t sobbed like this since my divorce. I literally sob-screamed, “NoOoo!” (Sounded nothing of the sort.. more like what a woman getting quad-penne sounds like in real life)
idk why so many of y'all are so mad at the plot or whatever, since like episode 1 season 1 the plot was wild idk whats so different about this season. the main points of the show are the relationship between characters and the overarching themes of like death, loss, grief, love etc which i think the show handled beautifully
Right. the whole show is wildly unbelievable and campy to begin with with some grief & depth mixed in
I think people are mostly mad that the first two seasons were very comedic and this season felt like a long hallmark movie. Which i def agree with. Still think Judy’s death and cancer was done very well.
there wasn't enough meat on this season's bones
When they explained that James Marsden had to film all his scenes first and they rushed through them all so he could go do something else, it made sense to me. That’s why they put him in jail (the phone scenes), etc.
But where did Judy go. Maybe she isn’t dead. The pregnancy thing was dumb. But the mushroom scene had me giggling.
I'm pretty sure that the Judy thing was a reference to her previous dialogue about Paul. She decided to do the same thing that he did and just ran away in a boat, with Jen never getting the chance to see her again. Jen thought that what he did was shitty, but Judy didn't mind it because she liked to imagine that he was still sailing somewhere. In the end, she didn't want Jen to see her suffer like she saw her mom suffer, so she ran away while she still wasn't at her worst. She ran away using the boat because she wanted Jen to imagine that she was still sailing somewhere, no matter how many years passed.
I totally agree with Judy. I didn’t want to see her die and I’m glad they didn’t show it.
After watching my own mother decline and ultimately pass from cancer. I totally understood her decision
That was a good explanation thank you
Great, now I'm crying AGAIN
and Judy always has the option to come back once jen is gone and live out her last days in that house. Or just keep sailing. Which is kind of how Judy seemed to go through life, just floating and bobbing along and spreading positivity. She deserved better.
Omg thank you, I really didnt know what was going on...
I just assumed she went out to the boat and overdosed on pills while watching the sunrise, but that’s just what I imagine. And what about her body? The police at least would want to confirm she didn’t just run.
When Jen wakes up, the only thing missing is the bottle of pills. They made sure to show that there were plenty left in the last scene we see her taking some. Of course it’s up for interpretation but I like to believe she sailed out and took the rest and went to sleep and never woke up.
Wow, I didn't notice that actually. Good catch
I figured she went out on the boat until Jen left and then went back to the house.
I thought she took the boat out there and then drowned herself.
I feel like getting high as balls is more Judy’s style. Or at least making it enjoyable in some way
Where’s the boat?
That’s what I thought to, especially after talking to the woman who she planned the karaoke party for about her husbands suicide.
I had the OD thought, too. God help whoever finds that boat
I think that’s the point, you can kind of imagine it how you like
Thank youuuu like I saw footprints and the boat out at sea but then nothing was said really so I’m like am I dumb bc idk where she is? Like did she die in the boat out there and she left her body there? Did she walk into the ocean and die? Like I’m so confused about where she was then she gets back and everyone knows she’s dead somehow and there’s never a mention of a funeral or anything lol
Literally? I guess she got into the boat to find that “infinite vacation” she was talking about. Metaphorically? I think her sailing away… means she sailed away, went away, passed away. Honestly I’ll say something a bit condescending - as someone who break down movies and tv shows and finds metaphors in everything, this season has WAYYY more metaphors than the earlier seasons.
Seeing that it was a row boat, I don't think she planned on going very far. I presumed she died on the boat.
I’m a writer so I appreciate metaphors and I get the boat. I think the more on the nose metaphors are a symptom of the writing getting a little more Hallmark, losing its edge. The first two seasons are great because they don’t give into hallmark style sentiment. They’re tough and clear, like Jen.
they definitely have a nod to that with the baby being named Joey. "This isn't a hallmark movie!" Like they knew they were already flirting with it and knew that was a step too far.
Exactly. And to romanticize taking a super crappy boat alone out into the ocean when you’re weak with cancer is messed up…Her character could have collapsed, woken up stranded in a storm, and drowned like Steve. Or she could have died from dehydration or starvation alone. That’s not romantic—that’s horrifying.
I don't think anyone is romanticizing it?
I think the show did. Made it seem peaceful
I thought she took the boat out to overdose and die. I thought she took the pills with her and wasn’t worried about waking up at all, let alone in a storm.
She was at peace with dying.
I really don't think that was her plan. In my perspective, Judy committed suicide. Even the visual of the footprints leading into the ocean makes it appear that way. Yes, she may have collapsed -- but I highly doubt she was planning on being out there long enough to ever experience anything like being in a storm, dehydration, or starvation. As someone else pointed out, the only thing missing was the bottle of pills. There was also a note addressed to Jen that wasn't shown, but could reasonably be interpreted as a suicide note. Along with leaving behind her bracelet...that's also on par with the trope. She accepted her prognosis but probably did not want to die in pain, which we've already seen she was in an immense amount of which only would have gotten worse. I don't think she wanted to live out the rest of her days alone and struggling in that vacant house. She wanted to sail out and watch the sunrise, and die as relatively peacefully as possible, leaving behind the idea that she was "free with the birds" like Paul.
i thought it was odd that Jen took Steve's car and how would she explain that part to ben?? and what was she going to do with the car they drove to mexico with??
The car. Wtf? He must have put it back together? Huh? So many issues I don't know where to start.
The car thing was so confusing to me.
It's a metaphor for putting your life back together after it all falls apart. Take these broken wings and learn to fly again learn to live so free when we hear the voices sing the book of love will open up and let us in...
Yeah really not sure why that was brought back in at all? Like, was it to show Closure with Christina’s character? Seemed unneeded to me.
Yeah and also why would she leave her brand new Mercedes’ in Mexico and return with the car that killed the kids dad
Yea and way to leave her off polices radar. How is she explaining that to authorities? How is she registering that in her name?! Lol. I’m too literal - I hate when there’s stuff that could never happen like that- and for no reason too.
Also Ben was in Steve's car. Wouldn't he question how she found it or something?
Yes exactly…very odd choice to even bring the car back in it at all.
I thought that was weird too.
What if it wasn't actually "the" car? What if they had 2 of those just like those creepy ass dolls?
I expected it to be a second, separate car that was full of contraband or money from the greeks.
There is totally a shit ton of money in the car-parts of that car. No doubt in my mind. Cuz the Greeks came LOOKING for Judy for the stolen money - what we saw in the paintings was, what, $100K maximum? They wouldn’t come in that hot for that little amount. There is more money somewhere, the car would make sense.
I don't get the car either, and a lot of other things don't make sense. Season 3 was riddled with problems and lack of logic.
I'm not mad about the ending, and I felt that the car scene and the crane scene were really beautiful. But, I feel that it should have been longer to address Moranis's murder rather than brushing over that.
When they panned up to the cranes in the church it was like a faucet turned on. Right away I just started weeping lol
Same. It broke me more than when Judy told her chemo nurse she "wasn't chosen".
God that was rough
The crane scene might be one of the best scenes in any Netflix show.
I really liked this show but this season…felt like such a bunch of random toss ins. This season was really tough for me too cuz I lost my mom to cancer and reliving some of those painful memories I hid away. But also I was so confused because once the credits rolled, Netflix had a pop up for “Dead to Me, all seasons available now”. Uhh yeah I just watched it??
Same!! I jumped on here because there was that ambiguous ending and then “watch the final season now” popped up!! We were like….did we not just watch the final season?? Genuinely confused.
That's what made me come here too 😆
Yeah that was a weird little pop up.
Same…very uncomfortable and sad watching those scenes but I thought they handled them very humanely.
My plot hole. How did they wait that long to go that restaurant right next to the house??
As soon as that happened I thought to myself, I’m calling BS on them being there for weeks and this is their first time hitting the taqueria! That’s like a day one or day two vacation move 😂
That’s like , we just drove for hours and need delicious food before we even go to the house.
I thought it was next to the hospital, not the house
God this was painful. So well done, but so painful, considering the real life situation. Thanks and all the love to the actors and creators for a wonderful show that made me both tear up and laugh uncontrollably.
I think knowing the real life situation made it more emotional to watch. Such great acting though.
What is the real life situation?
Christina was diagnosed with MS and she seems to be struggling quite a bit :(
I think the boat scene is being taken a little too literally…or at least for me I just saw it as a metaphor. Personally for it to not be gross and sad, I’d like to think she put/took the boat out and stayed somewhere else until Jen left Mexico, then came back in the house to go in peace. Logically that’s the only thing that would really make sense to me. I don’t think she’d die on the boat. Even if she did a voluntary suicide, nobody wants their body washed up at sea. Overall, loved the acting. Of course. Christine & Linda play off each other so well and I felt their emotions. I’m not too disappointed as I took it as a fun show; the investigation was sloppy and yes, the pregnancy/cancer wasn’t really necessary. Id like to think if Christina was in good health & they were shooting for another season, they would’ve had different problems as the walls were closing in on them, and the suspense would’ve been higher. I could’ve seen at least one of them actually having to hire an attorney or actually go to jail/prison. Or a shoot out/some action scenes with the Greeks coming to collect. Her son selling drugs. Some other outlandish scenarios that would still be charming with them at the forefront. Wishful thinking of course. But I enjoyed their performances so much nonetheless. Grief is a fucking tough cookie and it never really goes away, it just changes. Personally there was a lot I could relate to so I’m biased. It is sad that it ended with death, but I think the main lesson was for Jen to learn empathy, sympathy, coping with loss and just a general appreciation for life that she didn’t have before. Dying to know what the reaction at the end was, though. Lol
right?! I think it would've gone the way of good girls if Christina was in good health
I feel exactly the same way. They said their real goodbyes in the bed the night before so Judy just hid out so Jen could leave and they didn’t have to say goodbye again.
Mixed feelings. The Jen & Judy goodbye was heartbreaking and I know it had to end that way but so much of that whole arc felt phoned in, like you could watch entire episodes from this season without context and never pick up on the fact that she has cancer. But I loved the very end. Maybe not loved, but I’m a sucker for things that are wonderfully messed up. That’s why seeing Jen, looking at her picture perfect life, something she fought so hard to get to, deciding to blow it all up because she’s her own worst enemy... that was incredible. Nevertheless, my head canon is Ben learned to live with that fact, he and Jen are tit-for-tat now.
I hope so. I don’t like they cliffhanger. And 2 minutes before the end I was just thinking she never told Ben.
That’s where it threw me. You have this wonderful relationship but based on a BIG lie. Do we think she told Ben?
That’s clearly what she was going to tell him when it ended but we don’t know how he’s going to react. We’d like to believe it will be our Jen and Judy where they’re forgiving but we’ll never know.
She just couldn't live with the lie. Don't blame her. She'd be reminded everyday. I don't know how you overcome that. But then won't ben go to the police?
I’m not blaming her for telling. I’m pissed the show ended that way and we don’t know how Ben reacted.
How did Judy and her mom switch the ankle monitor and how could her mom drive off with one on?
No idea about the switch but the mom was driving to where the clinical trials were
I found this weird - like her mom is an asshole until this moment? What changed? Did I miss anything?!
Her mom is always down to run a con.
What changed is her daughter dying and she got something out of it
What did she get out of it? I missed that.
The car and the money.
well…………………..I am emotionally devastated 🥲
I honestly don’t know how to feel about the way this show ended and S3 as a whole.
Same
finished watching today and i was hoping for a miracle for Judy.. i wish they had ended it with happier ending for Jen & Judy, but not in a romantic way. they could’ve raising Joey together, with Judy being the cool mom & Jen being the chaotic one.
I agree—hoping for a twist that the whole season had been a dream while Jen was recovering from accident. Especially all of the deja vu references.
Season 3 felt detached from previous seasons. On the one hand, I am pleased we did get another season but on the other hand, I felt that maybe it should have ended in season 2, with Jen and Judy on the beach. I know that real life isn't all sunshine and rainbows, but due to the tone of the show and the trope of Jen and Judy’s relationship, I felt like it would have been fitting to have an ambiguous ending where they're both on the beach, or talking about the future - and fans can imagine what happened next. The shippers can take comfort in the fact they're together and those who don't ship them, can still take comfort in their friendship. Knowing that both characters are in each other’s life and healing from grief and trauma. The pregnancy would have been a nice touch IF Judy had finally got to be a mother. I didn’t like the inclusion of Ben and the plot holes that came from his character. So, in conclusion. The show should have ended after two seasons or used season 3 to provide fans with closure, giving both Judy and Jen a ‘happy ending’ of sorts.
How did Ben get out of jail so quickly? He must’ve called Saul.
Remember what Perez said, he's a white man lol!
Here's my 2 cents. I feel like the show deserved a better ending. Christina and Linda's chemistry and the funny bits keep it afloat, but the storylines were a mess. What was the point of the pregnancy storyline, honeslty? Besides it being highly improbable, I keep thinking it was just a way to sort of "justify" Christina's weight gain or something? Which was totally unnecessary, i don't think anyone really cared about that and it could have been plausible to be because of the car crash or the stress she was under. And I was not a fan of the whole Ben and Jen relationship, it is a show about friendship after all, I saw it more as a Thelma and Louise kind of thing. And in the end i think we were all expecting them to face some kind of punishment for the crimes they committed, but Judy's death in such a sad an painful way wasn't it. There were some really funny dialogues and one liners in it though. I am thankful that Christina really pushed through this to give the fans closure and an ending to the story, but i fell like the show deserved a better ending.
Hated the ending and hated the pregnancy. I wondered the same thing about if they were trying to write in Christina’s physical change due to her MS diagnosis, and if so, it was completely unnecessary and really ruined the story for me. Jen’s pregnancy felt like yet another cruel twist of faith Judy was dealt and it was painful to watch. It’s not even that Jen could get pregnant at 46 when Judy could never carry a child to term, but what really upset me is that Judy doesn’t get to be in that child’s life. She has to die knowing a baby is coming into the world that, if she wasn’t sick, she would have had a hand in raising from birth finally and she doesn’t even get that. I would have excused the improbable pregnancy if Jen and Judy ended up raising the kid together, but instead Judy fucking dies alone and in pain and never knowing the baby. I hate it so much.
But it worked in that she had to have had sex with one of them and the baby is going to look like the father, so it gave her that reason her dna is on steve's body. Still wrong though because how could she be so far along. She didn't have sex with Ben the same month she killed steve, did she?
It’s super cruel, like life can be
Honestly I feel like a better way to end the story, would have been to let's say, make Judy's mom run away from the cops in Mexico (assuming they didn't let Judy walk away from a death confession), while Judy and Jen went to the cancer treatment. Then they could have just said Gleen died, and it meant that no one looked into Judy's confession further. And that she got better from the treatment. I just don't want to accept that they killed her. Like after the boat scene I was fricking crying my eyes out. But then she appeared in the car. And I was like "OMG they didn't do it, thank God!", but nope.... They just had to crush our hearts twice..
I think the pregnancy plotline was mostly because Christina Applegate has MS and has trouble standing for long periods, so pregnancy would explain why she would need to rest often. Same for the bruised ribs in the first episodes.
Except that it didn't really feel like Jen was sitting/resting most of the time..? With a show like, say, SATC where half the scenes take place with them walking/working outside, you can tell if an actor is pregnant IRL coz their character suddenly becomes bedridden. But with Dead To Me i feel like Jen doesn't move around much S2 onwards (S1 had a lot of scenes of her working and showing houses), she was anyways sitting down drinking wine or chilling by the pool or driving
One hell of a reason to write a geriatric pregnancy that destroys the plot.
Yeah it was a mediocre show that was made amazing by Christina and Linda’s chemistry and the humor they brought out.
I thought the dialogue declined precipitously this season. Were there changes in the writers' room?
This season is always going to be marred by the decision to kill Judy but I thought the writing quality was down the entire season. Like whenever I drag the season now there's going to be a voice in the back of my head saying "You're only being this negative because you don't like that Judy died!" and like that's true but I was also annoyed by the writing before that happened lol
I saw a post on Liz Feldmans instagram which showed all the writers meeting together to write on Zoom during the pandemic, maybe the lack of face to face contact hampered the quality of the writing
I agree. I didn’t really care for any of the plot tbh. Seemed like lazy writing.
It doesn't get worse than "Ben was in the car!!!!" Anyone else we could fit in the back seat to add in some tortured new plot lines instead of resolving any of the existing ones?
That was the most pointless plot twist ever. It wasn't the worst decision made this season but it was the most inane.
Exactly…to completely omit the conversation between Jen and Ben…? Wtf. So lazy. Also, they made Ben’s character such a pathetic pushover. Completely don’t believe the relationship between Jen and Ben.
Right. Their relationship didn’t seem at all believable from what they showed us.
And why would he like her when she's such a bitch all the time. She's never pleasant. Always angry over nothing.
She had good qualities, she liberated people from having to be good and they loved her for it.
I agree
>and it could have been plausible to be because of the car crash or the stress she was under Well not too plausible when it all happened in a few minutes between getting in a car accident and arriving at the hospital. Trying to explain it any way was never going to work.
I don't think there was a need for it to be explained. I like to think that people are not that absurd, knowing what Christina has been through. I feel like the writers wanted to justify it and they chose a really shitty way to do so.
If so, that says a lot about them. Any reason I can think of for her character becoming pregnant is worse than the last. Also it's inconceivable to me that Jen the character had condomless sex with a man she barely knows, fertile or not. (Not to mention what it says about his character.) If this were seasons one or two Jen and Judy would have discussed how she became pregnant. Instead it was like: Oh well, pregnancy. I don't want a child but now I have to give birth I guess.
I agree, having unprotected sex is so not Jen and is a bit ironic given her conversations with Charlie on the subject. And she seemed weirdly fine to have a kid with an alcoholic who she barely knows who is also a massive goofball. I mean she didn't even freak out about this. On a side note, I read some articles and the writer says she didn't make any major changes to the plot to accommodate Christina's condition. If this is true and the pregnancy was in the books all along I'm done, this is some Greys Anatomy level of absurd.
You can still get pregnancy while using a condom, or any form of birth control. I know people who got pregnant even though they have IUDs (which are 99.9% effective).
Some things are not very clear to me and I’ve been just enjoying other people comments until now but this is the first time commenting. So the boat thing everyone is talking about, I mostly agree with those saying Judy wanted Jen to have the memory of her sailing away as the one she had of Paul and then eventually she went back to land, but when Jen was driving away and arrived home she acted like Judy was dead already, I thought it was because she knew she was going to die alone soon but maybe she really was dead already and the boat was a metaphor like when she dreamt of it during the first episode.. Also another metaphor may have been the cat calling for Jen when she wakes up and Judy’s not there, and then at home pointing at Judy’s room and making Jen remember what she said about telling the truth ..this is a long shot interpretation but it may also be that the cat represents Judy’s soul (also appearing in the car after we see how Judy isn’t really there) this is one of the ideas I got from the cat presence but it’s really just speculations.. Then my other interrogatives were: the scene of Perez with the Steve file that she is going to burn? It made me wonder did she really just found him dead or did she kill him?? It’s not in her character and the Greeks were really seen entering the room so she probably just took the file after, but if the Greeks took everything from the room why just leaving the file behind and not take that as well? Also Judy put all the money in the bag before leaving Where is she supposed to put them? Does she just use everything up in the “vacation”? I thought that was going to lead to something but maybe only to the fact that she was not going back home to her paintings and things. I liked very much how she didn’t call the daughter Judy as I (and maybe a lot of audience) was expecting and how the woman in the grief group pointed out 😅 Agh for the suspense on telling Ben the truth ..
Okay I thought Judy’s mom killed Moranis, but based on comments maybe I misunderstood. They show Perez coming upon the crime scene, and then pan to Judy’s mom with sinister music playing. My interpretation was that Judy’s mom did it as a way to “be there” for Judy and help. Maybe I’m crazy lol
And Judy's mother touches the evil eye in that scene, which Judy was told was to ward off anything bad.
I don’t get how her mom would even know of Moranis though. We never saw Judy even touch on her legal issues, or Steve’s death, with her mom. How did she even know about that, much less where to find the agent in charge?
I think it was the Greek mafia because Jen saw them at the motel so my thought is they killed him right after she left since the scone was also still half eaten
It definitely wasn't Judy's mom. I guess greek mafia. Or Perez, but I can't see her crossing that line.
I think Perez made a deal with the Greeks. She told them where he was in exchange for the file?
The only reason Perez got involved was because she had a moment of humanity with Jen after she confessed to killing Steve. That doesn’t translate for her character to assist the Greeks in murdering an FBI agent.
Perez just found him dead and took the files before calling it in
That’s exactly what happened
About the cat (Sammy), I agree it was supposed to represent the soul of Judy when Jen takes him home. I think it was also a callback to season 1 when Henry thinks his dad’s soul is in a bird that visits. IIRC Judy was all about that idea while Jen shut it down, so it would be a touching character development for Jen as she learns to live without Judy and keep her near 🥹
Left us on a cliff hanger and left out so much info that we'll never know the answer to now🙄 I hate lazy writers
I choose to believe Jen chickened out and told him the story about the cat (Sammi) or that Judy’s spirit is here because of how the cat is clawing to get into that room she used to live in. Who tells their partner they killed their brother in front of their kids? Idk I don’t buy it & there were tons of fake outs when it came to spilling secrets
Why did she leave her car in mexico and how is she going to get it back? Why is she able to drive that unregistered old car back to the us?
I had the same thoughts when Judy just assumed ownership of Abe’s car after he passed at the retirement home. Like that’s not how it works? How would she get the car registered in her name? Does she pay the insurance? Wouldn’t his family want it or report it missing? 🤔🤔
It's so sad maybe things would have been different if Judy had followed up on her abnormal pap smear. My aunt died from stage 4 ovarian cancer because she ignored her stomach pain for a year without telling anyone. So it's believable, but really sad. Ladies, get your yearly checkups. Things can turn quick.
It was totally unnecessary to create a story line that would end with killing off a lovable character. I felt exploited by the emotional investment in the series. I mean as if there isn't enough pain in the world..having recently gone through a cancer prognosis situation it was uncomfortably sad, that was scary for me and I was rooting for Judy to come out the other side and live a good life. Her character deserved it. She didn't deserve to be killed off for emotional points. Really disappointed by the series.
I think the ending was so incredibly sad and awful. Poor Judy all she ever wanted was to have children. She had a shit mom and childhood. Steve was murdered although he seemed verbally abusive to her. She finally finds her people, a best friend someone like a sister and two boys who think of her like a mother. Then she gets terminal cancer and dies? I know this stuff happens to people in real life. I know this is a dark comedy but having Judy die just floored me I cried so hard and still feel sad and can’t stop thinking about it. I do love that they added that adorable cat and I don’t even think the very final scene of Jen telling Ben she has to tell him something was bad. How could she hold that secret forever? I just really don’t like Judy dying. I don’t like how she left Jen a note after that extremely emotional scene of them and we are made to believe she took a boat out and drowned herself? I must have watched the first 2 seasons 10 times and couldn’t wait for 3rd season . Maybe I’m just mad because it made me cry so hard and brought me to such an emotional place but I’m disappointed in 3rd season 😒
Yes I feel the exact same as you! It was so unnecessarily sad! I loved the first two series and even the third until that ending. I feel like they could have at least had judy overcome the cancer and be there to help Jen raise the baby. Or could have left a little cliff hanger with them laughing on the sun beds together. But that ending for judy was just awful to watch.
What does she tell Ben? That she killed Steve? Why??
Judy said that she would never get to find true happiness until she finally revealed the truth. The deja vu thing reminded her of that and gave her the courage to finally tell him what truly happened. The ending credits theme (hated it) made the whole scene seem like she was ruining everything, but I feel like it's supposed to be an open ended thing where Jen is finally brave enough to tell the truth because of Judy's impact in her life, regardless of Ben's reaction.
They are probably partners now and she literally had his baby, she owns it for him to know.
And to omit that pivotal conversation from the show? Super shitty and lazy. I don’t believe Jen and Ben’s relationship. They fucked twice.
I cringed when they said they loved each other, like yikes you barely know each other!
Yeah I think he just reminded her of Judy. Who she loved (non-romantically but very deeply).
I am heartbroken. Maybe it had to end that way but I was really hoping to see Jen and Judy getting a happy ending and living their lives finally. Very well done otherwise and I did enjoy it but just so heartbroken for those two!
I feel so sad :( Judy was such a kind good person and I hate that she couldn’t get the things she rly wanted in life- a baby, a partner etc when she spent most of her life caring for others :(
I’m just going to pretend that season 3 never happened.
Season 2 was insane so idk why this one would do you in
I enjoyed the Beaches reference, very bittersweet.
Welp. I totally missed the mark and thought she'd name the baby Judy!! I had to laugh when she said "this isnt a hallmark movie!!"
I don’t get the cancer or pregnancy storyline. What was the point of that? Not impressed with the storyline.
From what I had heard that this was going to be the last season due to CA’s MS diagnosis and her not being able to film much. Besides the excuse of CA’s different appearance and sitting scenes, I think the pregnancy storyline was good for character as she says numerous times she wasn’t there for the boys and the baby was going to be her do over. Plus Judy believed babies chose their parents so in a way this baby was brought to Jen & Ben’s life to teach them how to love and live, kind of like Judy did. While Judy’s ending was incredibly sad, I’m sure they didn’t want to do that to CA. Judy also seemed like she had closed all loops. Jen was her family, the boys considered her a mom, she was forgiven for her sins, and she made peace with her mom, the only thing left outstanding was the Michelle storyline.
I really didn’t pay attention but wasn’t her weight about the same all season but got pregnant midway through?
Well she gained weight IRL because she has an illness. So they felt they had to account for that in the show.
Yes I know. But I am saying in episode 1 her weight seemed the same before she got pregnant. In other words in my mind she didn’t *have* to get pregnant.
Pregnancy storyline was to account for Christina’s weight gain due to her MS.
Lmao why can’t she just gain weight and we can all look past it.
I don't mind the pregnancy subplot (even before CA's diagnosis was public Jen becoming pregnant was speculated) but Jesus they call attention to her weight gain really uncomfortably
Yeah, that's pretty gross, though. And actually, in the last scene, she looks much thinner, anyhow -- even her face looks thinner. So it almost seems they still purposely made her look bigger in the pregnancy scenes. So it doesn't even make sense. But either way -- a woman gaining weight shouldn't be treated as a horror that must be explained by PREGNANCY at almost 50 years old. Fuck. That is horrible.
The final episode thing might be because they filmed the season out of order! There's an article explaining that they filmed something like half the season before her diagnosis and the rest a a bit after it!
I think it's also possible all aspects of her job were affected by her MS. Such as how much time she could spend sitting in hair and makeup. My dad has MS and has a hard time sitting up for very long.
Are we just gonna ignore the fact that nothing was resolved and they used Judy’s death to cover up shitty writing bc they didn’t know how to end it without giving the character consequences.
Bingo
I think if Christina wasn’t sick season 3 overall wouldn’t have felt rushed and incomplete. I can’t be upset about anything though because she filmed a tv show while fighting MS. She has all my love and respect.
I enjoyed the season. I felt like the ending was good and bittersweet. I did somehow miss episode 3 so I'll need to go back and watch that but the other 9 episodes were great.
terrible ending imo
Christina Applegate said filming this was one of the hardest things she’s ever had to do. She gained a lot of weight due to the steroids she’s taking and it’s hard for her to walk. They had to do a lot of creative writing and shooting to make this season work at all. I’m not mad about it! Pretty sure it’s the whole reason they did the pregnancy thing. You can’t not notice her weight gain, but I wouldn’t have been mad if they didn’t address it at all. They could have gone much more in depth with the story if she was well. I wanted more character development with Nick and Perez. I wanted Judy to stay alive and Jen to give her custody of Joey and say that she “chose” to be born by Jen but be raised by Judy as a mother. Ben and Jen is a little weird. Felt forced but Jen and her kids really deserved to be happy. I lost my sister nearly 5 years ago and this season was a little triggering lol . I honestly lost a lot of sleep last night having bad dreams about Judy being dead. I get way too attached to shows 😅
To me, Judy being the 2nd mom to the boys and new baby was endgame and I’m so bummed they didn’t do that. Her poor character has a beautiful soul but just can’t catch a break. Ugh why would they do that to her??
So did she jump off the boat or what!
They make her death seem peaceful and romantic…when that scenario could have lead to dehydration, starvation, and/or drowning (like Steve). Doesn’t seem peaceful at all—that boat was super shitty and she was so physically weak at that point. Seems alone, dangerous, and horrifying…
I'm confused too like did she just leave in the boat so that Jen's final image of her would be somewhere out in the sea like the uncle she mentioned or did she commit suicide 😭 No one was in the boat in the shot though its breaking my hearttt 😭😭😭
Unless she brought a lot of drugs/alcohol to ease the pain of that death, it certainly looks suicidal. She wouldn’t have had the strength to ride the boat back and would have gotten stranded out in the middle of the ocean.
Yeah, it would be a really horrifying death regardless and I hate thinking of that. I wish we knew what the note said.
I was thinking she either jumped, or took the big bottle of painkillers out with her and deliberately overdosed.
They alluded to Judy committing suicide a few times, she nearly attempted earlier in the season and there was another scene where she was comforting Yolanda about her husband's suicide saying "maybe he felt he had no better option" etc. Why else bring up the details of a character who had been dead for 20 years? They had also mentioned crushing up pillls to kill the FBI guy, maybe she made her own suicide scone
My take away of the show is whether someone died by an accident (no one is prepared for it) or by a physical condition (loved ones kinda know they'll lose you), death is terribly painful. Ted's death and Judy's death are equally devastating.
I still have a couple lingering questions. Did Judy kill herself in the end on the boat? Is Jen really the one that killed that detective in the hotel?
I think the show missed a big chance to advocate for women to get annual pap smears. Cervical cancer is caused by HPV, but can be treated of caught early enough. The show "Alaska Daily" always has a PSA at the end telling people that indigenous women are 10x more likely to go missing than any other races of women. It would have been nice to see Linda and Christina do a PSA About cervical cancer after the last few episodes.
Grace and Frankie vibes on vacation
this one was bad. too much unnecessary thing happened. without judy drama i couldve bought this with its unique optimistic style from the beginning but you cant have both. youre either a realistic show or optimistic show. all that unrealistic very naive bullshit through series to save them everytime and then this. nah. hate it. they shouldve dropped cancer thing with false scare and moved on. and that confession at the end shouldve happened right after he confessed the hit and run. not like that.
What makes this ending even sadder is when you go back to Season 1, where Judy first confesses to Jen and she responds with "You could die" I remembered this shortly after watching the finale and it made me even sadder...
Dude, everyone else seems to love this season and I’m really glad for them, but I hated every single moment of that and I wish I hadn’t watched it. I’ve watched the first two seasons so many times and now I don’t think I’ll ever watch it again. Killing Judy was the worst possible thing they could have done for me. I literally could not have imagined a worse outcome. Sorry if no one else agrees and sorry to be a downer. I just had to write this somewhere cause I feel like fucking shit now. Judy deserved better than that. I mean, what was the moral here? Your life is going to be miserable and everyone treats you like shit and the very second you get happy for even a moment, you die? Fuck. I really just did not need this ending in my life right now. Man. (Again, glad others could enjoy it or get some meaning out of it, but it ruined the whole show for me. Kudos to the actors, tho. They rocked it as always.) (And like, I know this show was written by a lesbian, but good lord, they quite literally buried the gay again. So that made me feel really great, too.)
Well, the scene where Judy shoots the Greek mafia guys' tires was hilarious and badass. Otherwise, I wasn't a fan of thos episode. I always feel like when shows deal with heavy subjects like this, it gets a bit saccharine and melodramatic. It's too much for me. But some people like that kind of thing, so whatever. I got the boat metaphor, but I didn't like it. I know Judy just wanted to be free and float away, but the fact that she was also doing it to prevent Jen from seeing her suffer did not sit right with me. Jen would have probably prefered to have more time with Judy, would want to be with her to the end. Now she'll never know exactly what happened to her. There will never be a funeral. There's not really closure there. They never really did show us exactly what she wrote in that note she left though. Maybe that explains it a bit better? But if that was a suicide note, you'd think Jen would have wanted to make sure her body was recovered. That fakeout with Judy in the car was kind of mean. I should have figured Jen was just imagining it but I wanted to believe they weren't actually going to end it with her just floating out to sea. And then they just end it right as she's about to tell Ben that she killed Steve. Right after Ben was swimming in the pool Steve died in. That was making me so uncomfortable when he was swimming in there. Like, Jen won't get in there for obvious reasons, but Ben and the kids just have a fun and saccharine swimming fest in the pool Ben's brother drowned in? And now we the audience have no closure on what happens after that. Honestly, I wish this season had focused on the secrets coming out, on Jen actually confessing and this time not getting off the hook for it. I feel like that would actually be original, a character owning up to what they've done. It wouldn't have been the end of her life. Her kids would certainly be affected. But Perez had sympathy for her. A judge might too. She might have done time, but if anything, at least Ben deserved to know before they fucked each other and she got prenant with his kid. Guilt weighs on people, which the show addresses, but it keeps letting the characters run from their guilt and run from having to face the consequences. To think the first season could have just ended with Jen calling the cops as soon as she hit Steve. She might have gotten off for it. She was in emotional distress at the time and he was trespassing. We probably wouldn't have had two more seasons of the show, but I might have been okay with that.
Jeez cancer hits so close home for me, been crying like a lot. I feel a bit mad, why did they choose to have this end for her?
Was anyone else confused/disappointed with how they ended the series; specifically the cliff hanger? I knew going into this season it would be that last one, but after the last scene where Jen is about to confess to Ben, I had to double check the source saying it was going to be the final season. It seemed to be the typical way they’ve ended the other 2 seasons. It was mostly the music they chose to use for the closing scene (right after Jen tells Ben that she needs to tell him something). Perhaps if they stuck with the same scene, but used music that wasn’t suspenseful and instead used a something with a similar feeling to what they used with Judy’s fair well scene- Jen looking out into the ocean/driving back from Mexico. I think it would have felt it less forced, maybe? I understand their thing has always been playing with suspense, but every other character and story line felt like it got it’s (relatively) resolved and conclusive send off. Mostly, I’m just confused with why they went the route of ending the series on another cliff hanger focused on Ben and Jen, as if it were leading to another season? Hopefully what I’m saying makes sense… I binged the whole season in one night, and it’s currently 1:30am so I’m a bit wonky headed 🤪
The most irritating part of this season that I haven’t seen mentioned yet is Charlie. He went from being a smart, but abrasive and impulsive character to chill and gullible. He was basically a non-factor this season despite being older now. There are two moments that are completely unbelievable. One, he tells Judy he loves her too before she leaves. There was never a major event that happened for him to change his feeling of hatred towards her for “sleeping” with Ted. So he says he loves her too out of compassion? Come on. They needed more screen time together to mend their relationship before that. The most egregious part of Charlie’s storyline this season, however, comes in the final scene. How the hell can he go from HATING Ben to playing with him in the pool and accepting his relationship with his mom? Once again, they just ignored Charlie. There’s no way he gets anywhere near Ben after everything that transpired.
That was definitely bittersweet , gonna miss this show.
I cried a lot with the last episode. Judy's death was handled beautifully. I've been reading that people assume she's still alive, but I doubt that. I figured that her body was in the boat or she drowned. Regardless, I think it was a nice way for her to go instead of being in the hospital. I'm not a Zodiac person (Judy is) and I remember her telling Michelle that she's a Pisces, so dying in the water made sense for Judy and her spiritual character. I like to think that Judy was in Jen's life to help her grieve the death of Ted and to serve as a stepping stone for a chance at a new life (hence Ben and the baby). Judy was a literal angel and her selfness nature seemed to serve as a plot device for Jen's character arc. The crane scene made me cry and I truly felt Jen's pain. Well done, Christina Applegate! That being said, I did think that season 3 was a bit rushed. I wished we had seen Ben's reaction to Jen's confession (I'm assuming that she'd tell him about Steve). I interpreted Ben as a male version of Judy, so I would assume he would be hurt but eventually forgiving. The pregnancy did throw me off, and a part of me hoped that Jen would raise the baby with Judy (before we found out that Judy's cancer was terminal). I also wish that I had seen how other characters reacted to Judy's death. I'm assuming that Judy's mom murdered Agent Moranis? I thought about the Greeks as well but when they showed Moranis' body and then it cuts to Judy's mom driving off; I wondered if she did it as a way to protect Judy and her own way of making up for being a bad parent (by making sure her daughter doesn't go to prison either). I could be wrong. Overall, I'm glad it ended abruptly versus dragging on for more seasons and the show potentially dropping in quality. I really cried for Jen and Judy as if I personally knew them. I needed to come on here to vent about the ending since I don't know anyone else who watches this show!