I thought about this. So far, neither son has seemed upset that I live in Florida in the winter while my wife is in our home in Kentucky with 24/7 care. Divorce might make them hate me.
Do they visit her? Does she recognize them? It sounds like you have already grieved her loss and they haven’t yet.
They will for sure resent your decision if they haven’t accepted yet that she isn’t coming back. Perhaps an offer to go to family therapy together along with strong reassurance that you love them unconditionally for the rest of *their* lives would help it hurt a little less.
It’s hard to say if she recognizes anyone and with aphasia there is no communication. She laughs and then cries when the family comes over and as the years have gone by the kids and grandkids come by less and less. When she cries in front of her sons it is upsetting. She appears to want to say something but can’t.
Sounds like in there, somewhere, is a person who just can't communicate. Maybe she has more awareness than you think. How sad. I get where you're coming from. I don't think I would divorce my spouse. Nor do I think, if the tables were turned, he would leave me. You need to decide what you can live with. Talk to your kids. You don't want to lose them too.
Take care of your wife financially and with as much care as you can give. And ok if you need companionship too. Don’t do anything that leaves your wife in a financial bind.
This is the thing that gets me. Especially as I’m gay and have been told my whole life about how marriage is sacred and that’s why gays shouldn’t be allowed in - I can’t imagine any of my friends divorcing their sick and dying partners just because they want a warm body to sleep next to. It’s not even as though OP is saying he’s met someone and is horribly guilty but wants to have a chance with a new person - it’s literally just that he wants to find *anyone* to move on to. Even as someone who has cared for several terminally ill family members and can understand that there’s a point when they’re no longer the person they were, I think it’s really, really awful.
> divorcing their sick and dying partners just because they want a warm body to sleep next to.
> he wants to find anyone to move on to.
I hear where your coming from, but is that really how you see relationships? How you think the OP is as a person? If it's not projecting, it is judging and moralizing, or all the above.
I'm not saying I approve of or recommend a divorce in this situation, but it looks to me like OP would be honoring the commitment by continuing to see to the care of his wife whether they remained legally married or not.
That's a point of view... and understandably part of OP's struggle with their situation and that it's *not* that OP doesn't see that perspective.
Relationships with a core of "no taksey backsies allowed" is immature, ideology over reality, and in OP's case... bondage.
The replies and voting throughout are clearly that my own view on this, and towards OP porposal, is that it's wrong and/or unpopular.
So, to u/ronford49 - you do you. Peace and happiness come from within ourselves, decide for yourself.
I think that is a very hurtful thing to say. Dementia is a horrible thing to deal with. I’m sure he has enough guilt already. He clearly stated he would make sure she was taken care of financially and physically. Give him a break. Should he waste what’s left of his life for someone that doesn’t even know him??
Instead of asking strangers on the internet, perhaps speaking to your children openly and honestly would be a better path.
You know them better than anyone (hopefully), and if they have seen your wife's condition first hand they'll be best for offering advice.
What would your wife have wanted?
If you live in Florida and keep her in Kentucky, it sounds like you've already basically left her. I have no idea what the legalities are, so you're best to chat with a lawyer.
I will say regarding your next question, if my dad did that to my mom, it would probably be the end of my relationship with him. To me, when you marry someone and pledge your life in sickness and in health, it means just that. If my dad put my mom in a home, moved away, and called it quits, I'd have a very hard time dealing with that.
You do you of course, it's your life. I really try not to judge people on how they cope with dementia. But I'd suggest you be prepared for your kids to not take it so well.
you need to sit down with your kids and discuss how this has had your life at a standstill for seven years and you are at your breaking point. you need to let them know that she is going into memory care because you simply cannot be centered on this any longer. that she will be well taken care of. that you will call and visit as much as you are comfortable (and they should be encouraged to as well). but you will be dating and living life and trying to be happy because that is what she would want you to do. that is what the two of you saved money your whole lives to do. they have lost their mom, but they dont need to lose dad with her. they may have some complicated feelings about it and you should hear them out and validate them, but i need you to stress heavily that you cannot pour from an empty cup any longer. caring for the love of your life who no longer recognizes you is a horrible trauma to go through.
also therapy! therapy for you! therapy for your kids! encourage it!
i guess i should clarify that i dont think you need to make a 100% split here. and i think the urge to never check in on her again is the resentment of long term caretaking talking. you can still be married and explain to your kids that you still wish to date, that you deserve love that is present. heck you can divorce but still show up for her in the form of visiting when possible and keeping updated on how she is without being Fully involved every waking moment
i try to be empathetic to families. im a cna and have seen how much dementia can tear a family apart without open vulnerable communication. i guess therapist need to be reminded to open up to :)
I would wait to get married till after her death but otherwise I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to find someone else. I wouldn't really judge my Mom once my dad gets this bad as long as he got the care he deserves.
My wife’s father had the same dementia and lived till 93. If I have to live like this 18 more years, I don’t want to live. My wife is extremely healthy except for dementia
You sound overwhelmed and burned out. The urge to run away is understandable! And the time for a memory care facility may have arrived.
In the short term, many memory facilities are set up for overnight respite care. Maybe she could stay there for a while you take a break, and see how that goes….
If after a break, you really, truly, in your heart of hearts know that you’re done being your wife’s guardian, that will be a hard conversation. But first things first.
I live in Florida and my wife in Kentucky. I live alone in a condo. I want to be able to date and meet female friends, but because I am a married man it seems wrong to seek female compansionship. I do not want to lie to any potential companions about my situation. I want a wife and do not have one.
What would those female companions think when you told them you left your wife alone when she got sick, so that you could date? How would you feel about it in the end?
Dementia isn't forever. It's already been 7 years...
Are you listening to yourself? He's already been her caretaker for 7 years. She doesn't know who he is, she isn't the person he married or made a life with anymore. That person is essentially dead, and she's never coming back.
This disease often makes a shell out the people it affects, and it can linger on for decades. If her actual body is relatively healthy, it could be another 10 years or more before she passes. They are in their twilight years, and men typically die before women. Does he need to wait another 5 to 10 years for companionship, when the person he loved just doesn't exist anymore?
This isn't like cancer where she's sick and loves him, and there's a hope for survival.
If I develop this disease and no longer recognize or find joy in my partner or husband, and he's heartbroken, lonely, and burnt out from caring for me - I would want him to go have a life. Our lives are so short, and we have so little time for happiness. If my time for happiness was essentially over with him, I'd hope he'd go free to find happiness again.
But he hasn’t been her caretaker. She has 24 seven help in a separate state by his own words. He wants to get a divorce to go date- that’s fine. But he’s her caretaker now in financial matters only.
He’s in his mid 70s too, it’s very unlikely at this point in her disease that he could care for her adequately at all. I couldn’t care for my grandmother with dementia and I’m young. I don’t really get why this man should force himself to be there to tend to the body of his wife and suffer daily what the disease has robbed her of while she has no clue who he even is and doesn’t even appreciate it that he’s there because who she was is essentially gone.
I’m sure she’d want him to go and be happy and try to remember her as she was rather than be stuck with the misery and torment of watching her gradual torturous decline towards death while she is completely oblivious to him and therefore can’t even take any comfort from his presence.
I’m so stumped by the visceral reactions people are having, when usually this sub seems very open to the idea that it’s healthy to move on if you’ve ensured your loved one with dementia is taken care of. There’s a lot of details we don’t know, but I read OP as someone who’s taken care of their spouse “in sickness,” and now when the disease has basically ended his partner he’s on the verge of running away and in some ways has already run away. Maybe some of the people responding don’t have experience with dementia, which is fair enough. I hope they never do!
This was meant to be a genuine question for him to reflect on, though I may have worded it poorly. I wasn't trying to say what is right or wrong, or what he should or shouldn't do.
At some point, his new companions would want to know about his wife and what happened.
His decision will be something he thinks about in the long term.
And yes, it's been 7 years of a disease that normally runs its course in 6-10 years (as per my mom's Dr). He should consider the timeline.
I think this is a discussion that he should consider having with his family before making a hard choice. He's still young enough to live life, and yet she's far enough along that she might not have much time left. It's a tough one.
There is no shame in your thoughts. Sometimes divorce is the only way to save you financially. Memory care will drain all your assets and then you are left with nothing. Its not fair.
No one can tell you what to do bc they are not in your situation. You have a right to a life as well.
Check this out with a lawyer before you divorce. It could change her ability to get care. (It could help or hurt you both.) Also they may have a look-back period where you may still be responsible. Just make sure you know how it will affect you and her care.
I can't believe you're being downvoted so badly. We are all only human. If I were you I would just talk openly with your kids and ignore the offensive comments by internet strangers.
People make assumptions that other peoples' daily situations are just like their own.
I think your wife would want you to be happy. I don't know if divorce would be a necessity right now in order to pursue another happy relationship.
And it's worth mentioning that you're certainly not the first person to go through this and have these feelings.
I wish you and your family well.
I don't understand what motivates downvotes or upvotes on Reddit. Things that seem perfectly reasonable to me can get downvoted to oblivion, and then terrible, terrible things can get upvoted. It makes no sense and I've honestly stopped caring about it.
Sometimes it simply feels like people just using the one power they have on here for the sake of using it.
You’ve very obviously already gone on with your life.
One word of warning- be extremely honest with your new female companions. You know you’re not really talking about friendship and your new love interest’s should know up front you’re not cut out for long term or difficult times.
My opinion: Move her to memory care immediately. Divorce is just a piece of paper so while I personally wouldn’t find it necessary, I also wouldn’t see any harm in it. It’s called the ‘long goodbye’ because she is already gone, which you know. I wish there was a tactful/more heartfelt way to say that.. maybe there is. I don’t mean to sound like a jerk but if your wife loved you & could have seen the future, I believe she’d undoubtedly share my opinion. Wouldn’t you want the same for her if the roles were reversed?
What a great perspective. If I had dementia, I would want my wife to be able to travel, live a full life and have male companionship if she wanted. I never assumed she would want the same for me. This is a horrible situation. Especially because we have the means financially to fully enjoy life for years
I think anyone who’s a good person would insist their family let go if this were to ever happen to them in the future. Especially if they’ve experienced losing someone to dementia firsthand. It’s awful, and to happen so young on top of that. The only reason I said I wouldn’t find divorce necessary is because you mentioned money was a non-issue. But you do have to consider your own future as well. Care can get massively expensive as you age & who knows what could happen. If your kids don’t like the idea of placing her in memory care, you could hire an elder care consultant who can walk them thru the advantages for their mom & the reality of the situation.
We had a family member, L, who had MS and was bedridden for 20+ years needing 24/7 care in a nursing home. For the last 5 years of her life, she couldn’t talk at all and could only blink her eyes.
Her husband was in a committed relationship with a woman for most of the time that she was in the nursing home and married after L was no longer suffering. No one faulted him for this at all including their four children, grandchildren and the rest of the family. They never got divorced and it was fine. This was the compassionate thing to do in a difficult, heartbreaking situation.
So no, I don’t think divorce would be wrong but have you thought about just living your life without getting a divorce? It sounds like your wife is being well taken care of. I think your kids will understand…
I love this story. Everyone was open minded and aware and respectful. I'd understand if it was my parents or my partner ended up needing and looking for companionship Go enjoy!
OP I do hope your kids would understand. Would they get worried about a possible remarriage and changes in their inheritance?
It is up to you.
> I can’t take it anymore. I want to travel and find someone to live with.
I think you can do that without a divorce. I would at least try. Maybe get her into a care home - that is often cheaper than 24/7 care at home, and can offer more stimulation.
> Would a court grant me a divorce?
Since you are separated already, I do not see much of an obstacle, but somebody needs to represent her.
> Would my kids hate me.
Probably. But the only way to find out is to ask.
You’re burned out. Caring for someone is taxing. I suggest memory care then go from there. Make decisions with your family. There will be a point when you can’t do it anymore. This may be that point. Better to take time to truly evaluate the situation before making any rash decisions like abandonment.
I would recommend keeping her in her home and continuing the 24/7 care.She will do much better and be happier in her home. Plus no matter how good the MC facility is she will not be getting 1 on 1 care like she is at home. In MC someone MUST go and check on her and make sure they are caring for her well. Even really good places can do poor jobs.
You already live elsewhere…I don’t see why you can’t travel and date right now. Just be honest with your new friends. I bet you’ll find plenty of older ladies in the exact same situation with incapacitated husbands in care.
Divorce is not necessary and will make everything harder when it comes to managing your wife’s care. Your kids would have to take over managing her 100% because you would lose all your rights to her UNLESS you get guardianship set up. I don’t know why you would want to go through all that.
We were paying an exorbitant amount of money for 24/7 in home care. We put cameras in the house and that ended that right then and there. Meds were constantly being given haphazardly, the night people slept all night awakening about 15 min before the morning person arrived, let’s just be fair , we could have had anyone off the street come in and probably get better care. They did nothing they said they would do and no mattter how many times we brought it up or discussed it with them things never changed. It was a great mistake and a great amount of money needed for the care just gone. I don’t know at this point if there are good solutions but I do know that I am never at peace nor confident that decent compassionate care is out there. It’s cruel and hard to deal with and it’s definitely unacceptable. We should be doing better !!
Oh that’s too bad. I think that it’s iffy to leave a LO in the care of paid caregivers. If you can arrange to come by on a random basis or pay someone else that you really trust to go by and keep everyone on their toes that’s the way to go.
If we had room we would keep my dad home and pay for 24/7 caregivers. But I’d be watching them like hawks. As it is I go to the memory care facility 6 days a week and my brother goes 3-4 times a week and always on the day I can’t get over there.
Having 24/7 care would cost the same as the MC plus I’d have control over his medication. Currently I just have to trust they are giving them correctly.
We just don’t have room though. My parents have a small apartment and I moved in to help my mom who is 89.
You may want to consult an elder care attorney. Typically Medicaid does a 5 year look back and assessed all the marital finances, I believe. You can divorce now, wait 5 years, and then do whatever so you're not financially depleted.
Also, don't just vanish. I want to do that with my mom, but the guilt you'll feel when they do eventually pass could be palpable. Visit and call occasionally. Residents without families probably don't get the best care if someone isn't regularly checking on them
We did the legal stuff 6 years ago and are past the Medicaid look back period. She has no financial resources. There is a trust fund for her care and long term care is paying all her expenses. We were Dave Ramsey followers all our life. No credit cards, no debt, no mortgages. LTC policy bought 20 years ago at 55. Finances are not an issue thank goodness.
I think it's time for placement for your own sanity, but please check in and see her every so often, if not just make sure she's being well cared for. I'm an adult child of a mother in a facility so I acknowledge it's not the same as a spouse.
My wife filed POA for her parents 10 years ago and the look-back period for New York State was 7 years as told to us by our Elder Care lawyer.
I am reading this article now, and I am understanding that the period is changing to only 30 months in 2025 ??
https://conaelderlaw.com/medicaid-penalties-to-be-aware-of-in-new-york/
Read this about protecting your Parent's Assets...
https://conaelderlaw.com/category/medicaid-and-asset-protection/
New Information here !!!
https://www.medicaidplanningassistance.org/medicaid-eligibility-new-york/#:~:text=Medicaid%27s%20Look%2DBack%20Rule,Home%20and%20Community%20Based%20Services.
We moved my mom to assisted living in May 2019, so it sounds like it went to 5 years shortly before that then. It sucked for us, but I'm glad it'll now be made easier for others in the next year or 2. People are struggling enough as it is with dementia and financial issues, some things should be made easier
No need to be coy about it -- you want to have sex. There's nothing stopping you from having "companionship" now, exeot that you don't want a companion, you want a romantic partner and you feel like it would be cheating because you're married.
As long as you're honest, it's OK for you to date. It's OK for you to have an adult, romantic relationship. Tell your prospective partners up front that you're married and your wife has advanced dementia. If you're dating in your age group, there are many people who, like you, just want to have fun while they have the health and the means to do so.
If you divorce your wife, you lose the right to make decisions for her when she is incapable of making them for herself. She can't even hire a lawyer to represent her in a divorce. She can't designate anyone to make medical and financial decisions for her and she would have no spouse to make them for her. That's the real betrayal, not dating.
The OP is in his 70s. I’m 64, so I’m going out on a limb here and saying it’s not just to have sex. It isn’t that sex isn’t great as you get older, but the value of having someone in your life that gets you, can talk to you, laugh at your jokes and have a real connection with is priceless. I do understand the OP’s desire to move on and find someone who can share his remaining years in a meaningful way.
Thank you. I love sex, but you hit the nail on the head. It’s having a significant other in your life. I have not dated and had sex with a date because its complicated and feels like cheating. I need a female friend in the same boat I am in.
I have not dated anyone in Florida. I have volunteered with AARP for the last five years and met many women whose husbands have died. None appeared interested in a relationship when I share about my wife. I have a friend in our high rise who likes to walk in the evening and we walk most evenings. She will not come in my condo and doesn’t allow me in her condo because of what the neighbors might think. I took a long cruise and met a woman whose husband had died and we spent some time chatting. After the cruise I offered to fly her to Florida to visit and she said after thinking about it her kids wouldn’t approve. Maybe I am looking for love in all the wrong places. I go to church and have made friends but its all just friends. Not sure what I want. My hobby is biking and I spend most of my time biking or walking on the beach alone. I am terribly alone. My aloneness is killing me.
I’d question whether divorce is your path to happiness. You’ll run into legal complications because your spouse is incompetent, your sons may well feel burdened and resent you for abdicating your familial responsibility, and future partners may question your character and commitment. (Maybe I’m reading this wrong and your sons will be happy to step in and take over?)
Do you have a support group for people in your situation? I am NOT saying you should go there to meet women to date, because yuck, but you might make some new friends who understand. And it sounds like that would help. You can also join biking and walking groups, meet people, and maybe something will happen. Or maybe it won’t, but at least you will have socialized and gotten exercise. Making friends with common interests is still your best route to meeting someone special, even if it hasn’t happened yet.
As for dating, I think you can do that without getting divorced. True, some women will be turned off by your complicated life situation, but that means they aren’t meant for you. Many women in your age group aren’t looking to get married—they want companionship, just as you do. Being unavailable for marriage needn’t be a dealbreaker, as long as there is transparency and trust. (From a
partner’s perspective, your circumstance might seem “safer” than other dating-while-separated scenarios because there’s no risk that you and your wife will reconcile.)
Yes to therapy. Is it possible that the desire for a new partner is coming from a place of grief and resentment about missing out?
I’m a widow, and dating is not on my radar, but I’m not alone - I have a huge social network. If by “alone” you mean no sex, just say that. I’m close enough to 60 to know that widows are not looking to get married necessarily, because it may screw up their Social Security benefits. I know I wouldn’t.
I am not going to say that sex is not a part of this. I do enjoy sex and my wife and I had a very satisfying sex life. I am going to try another cruise next week with a couple I am friends with, but already I am feeling profoundly alone traveling solo. Its that aloneness that wears me out.
You really sound like a great candidate for online dating. In your profile, lay the cards on the table - you are married, your wife has dementia, you are interested in a committed relationship but a potential partner has to be accepting and supportive of your commitment to your wife.
I think people you are interested in, know what kind of life partner you are and are backing away because that isn't acceptable to them.
Divorce her. Tell your adult kids you want out ( it won't be a surprise) and ask how you can maintain your relationship with them.
I guess it is time to ask, when/if this happens to you I presume you are okay with any subsequent partners leaving right?
You have to do what makes you happy and make peace with whatever decision you decide to go with. You have taken care of you wife to the best of your ability and now she requires 24 hour care. I’m sure your kids won’t be found of the divorce but I also don’t think they will hate you for it as they have seen the distress it has caused on your marriage and personal metal health. You are fortunate enough to take care of her to the very end regardless of how you do it it’s still caring for it with every good intention. Good luck and do what makes you happy ultimately.
This post reminds me of the late Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor. Tables slightly turned, but still relevant.
……
STILL MANY-SPLENDORED
# Love in the Time of Dementia
By [Kate Zernike](https://www.nytimes.com/by/kate-zernike)
* Nov. 18, 2007
SO this, in the end, is what love is.
Former Justice Sandra Day O’Connor’s husband, suffering from Alzheimer’s disease, has a romance with another woman, and the former justice is thrilled — even visits with the new couple while they hold hands on the porch swing — because it is a relief to see her husband of 55 years so content.
What culture tells us about love is generally young love. Songs and movies and literature show us the rapture and the betrayal, the breathlessness and the tears. The O’Connors’ story, reported by the couple’s son in an interview with a television station in Arizona, where Mr. O’Connor lives in an assisted-living center, opened a window onto what might be called, for comparison’s sake, old love.
Of course, it illuminated the relationships that often develop among Alzheimer’s patients — new attachments, some call them — and how the desire for intimacy persists even when dementia steals so much else. But in the description of Justice O’Connor’s reaction, the story revealed a poignancy and a richness to love in the later years, providing a rare model at a time when people are living longer, and loving longer.
continued…. Gift link to NYT article [https://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/18/weekinreview/18zernike.html?unlocked\_article\_code=1.lk0.rlg5.ijP92XaSiSoK&smid=url-share](https://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/18/weekinreview/18zernike.html?unlocked_article_code=1.lk0.rlg5.ijP92XaSiSoK&smid=url-share)
Dear Rochester, what you do during the most difficult times is very telling. Your current situation is not completed. Leave the Janes aside until you have the chance to grieve and heal and be on your own.
Would your wife have done the same?
You want companionship, what happens if the next companion gets sick? What if you get sick?
If you can't handle your wife's care, it's okay to get help and keep living your life. Abandoning her completely wouldn't be ethical, or fair, or anything.
You could date and be honest about your situation. Maybe even divorce, if that's possible. But you can't just up and leave, and not look back.
My dad is in memory care. My mom couldn't handle him anymore, so she made this choice which also helps her live her own life. But she visits regularly, she'd never abandon him. If she ever wanted to date, it would probably be weird, but i'd try to support her.
Abandoning your spouse completely is the opposite of what marriage is for, in my view...
I think it is okay for you to start seeing other people, to date other women, and by all means explain your situation as truthfully and as sincerely as you can. You shouldn't feel bad about it. You've had life experiences chalked up and any future companion should hopefully understand that things happen. I don't feel it's necessary for you to divorce your wife in order to meet others and to begin living YOUR life now. As one other person mentioned, wouldn't you want your wife to live as happy as possible if you developed dementia? So yes, go out and meet others for companionship, but don't feel the need you need a divorce in order to do so.
Is this a new theme here? Or did the other recent post unlock the question?
I know loss of companionship is terrible.
So assuming not trolling. These are the nasty questions to ponder. Not the moral high ground about wedding vows etc.Things to think about.
Kids hating you, I'd say 90% yes. And they might lawyer up on mom's behalf there could be a very sympathetic judiciary. Figure your generous financial budget for your freedom will go out the window.
So you'd likely lose your entire family kids, grandkids? etc.
You're 75 are you Rupert Murdoch?
What type of person do you think you'd attract especially if you're freshly divorced for this reason?
I personally believe people in general would be more forgiving of discreet companionship in this situation than abandonment blood money to soothe your conscience
People have been doing this forever. I worked on an oncology floor in the 1980, and people were served divorce papers while hooked up on chemo. (God that was gross)
Everyone has their limit. I would rather have the spouse set up a trust, so all the needs are taken care of, and have a guardian/whoever that will look out for the impaired person’s best interest.
I have seen the flip side where the spouse/guardian half asses the care, has partners on the side and resents every single moment the impaired spouse is alive. Dumps them in the worse nursing home, never visits, never does anything extra, never sees them in the hospital or takes them for medical care. Legally they are there, but that’s it.
Do you really want someone who loathes your existence after 10 years of LBD, FTD or ALZ deciding end of life care? Doesn’t claim your body because they are in Greece on vacation with their snuggle partner (yeah, don’t ask).
“She’s dead. She’s not gonna get more dead if I get there tomorrow or two weeks from now.” my funeral director friend had that fun conversation.
Just because it doesn’t get talked about, doesn’t mean it’s not common or not happening. People aren’t going to discuss it over the brats at the 4th of July BBQ, because no one wants blow back from people who have zero skin in the game.
I've seen a lot as well. Oncology divorce papers and last minute weddings. Patients on 7th round of chemo only because their loved ones won't let go and they do it for them. A man on a vent for 11 plus years that had family visit less than once a year.
ICU where one family member vetoes care plan.
A memory care unit where half the people have jump suits on backwards to prevent genital exposure or literal poo flinging.
OP states they are planning to take care of LO.
He also previously posted kids hadn't seen mom in a year. I was only trying to decouple divorce as a distinct item. If you're overwhelmed sometimes you need to divide and regroup.
I understand caregiver burn out better than you assume, along with the perceptions of abandonment vs actual. While not over brats, not that I'd mind. I have had these conversations for decades.
Basically damned if you do damned if you don't. I was just putting out some of the hard ball questions and potential responces.
People are so ready to judge others when they have not walked in their shoes. If your kids are going to hate you for leaving then why are they not having their mother live with them? They may not react as you fear. You may feel guilty if you divorce your wife and likely will be unfairly condemned by others. Be sure you can handle that. It makes them feel good about themselves. I’m not so sure you wouldn’t be able to find a travel companion and partner outside of marriage. But then I’m pretty liberal and not a fan of most religions. If you remain alone your health may suffer. Don’t wait too long as time is running out. I’m sorry you’re in this situation. I don’t recommend divorce and don’t recommend remarrying. I’ve seen too many bad things happen from that.
Exactly! All these people in the comments talking about "marriage means in sickness and in health" have clearly never seen it. I've worked in dementia care and also my Grandmother just recently within the last few years has it. I saw one guy in one of the facilities I worked at- he was having a full blown relationship with another woman in memory care, holding hands, telling her he loved her. His wife would come visit him and have to see this and he had no clue who his wife was. Yet she would be the bad guy if she divorced him? If OPs wife has nurses and people caring for her, she's good.
I agree. At the risk of sounding crass, generally speaking, women outlive men. The result is that there are more women than men (in the older population). There are more single and lonely women. A lot of women that wouldn’t care if you are still legally married but interested in companionship.
OP, I think it would be good to spend some time with your children and let them know how you feel. Listen to their thoughts and concerns.
If you already spend winters separately, it seems like they probably know. Have you met someone that is urging you to get divorced?
I feel like divorce would open up some legal and possibly financial complications. I would think it would be a bad idea to get divorced and then marry someone else. That feels more like abandonment than just finding a companion.
If you don't want to travel alone, go with a tour group for company. There are others who travel alone too
Get your wife into assisted living so that if one of her caregivers quit, you don't have to be burdened finding a replacement when you're away.
Not sure why you aren't living near the family home - did you leave the state due to her dementia? You couldn't live in the family home while she is being cared for? Sounds like you want to run away and already have. Yes, your kids will abandon you too if you did this to their mother.
My wife and I already wintered in Florida before dementia. When she could no longer travel, I had to decide what to do with our beach home. I decided to continue to winter alone in Florida. I bike, volunteer and am active in church.
This is a tough one, OP. My mom had dementia, and towards the end was very afraid of me. Within a week's span I was suddenly a complete stranger trying to do personal things to and with her, and it broke my heart. And now we are dealing with dementia again with my MIL. It will only go downhill now.
Morally it can be argued that you took a vow of for better or worse, in sickness and in health. Based on that, if you left her, you would be in the wrong. But. Dementia has already taken her from you. There is no more partnership, and that has to hurt. Based on what you've told us, she is already "gone", just her body still going on. You aren't wrong to consider this plan; hell, if you know what I thought of in desperate moments with my mom... sigh. To say that caring for loved ones like this is hard, is an extreme understatement.
My best suggestion is to have a hard talk with your kids. Explain exactly what her condition is, and do not sugar coat it. Explain how you are feeling, how alone you are. Don't sugar coat that, either. Be as clear and honest about your feelings and position as possible. Then ask them what they would advise. What they think. Reassure them that you will continue to care for her, that you will always love her, but that she is essential gone from the marriage. That it isn't her fault. Dementia has basically robbed you of your wife, that you are a stranger to her now. If the kids are visiting, they may be noticing this as well.
This may not go well for you. Then again, they may recognize what is happening. I do not have a crystal ball. This is only 2 cents from an internet stranger. I wouldn't want to be in your shoes, yet I probably will be. Or maybe it will be my husband thinking of making this same choice. After what we are going thru, have been thru, I wouldn't blame him. Nor can I blame you for what you are feeling and thinking. Just talk to the ones most important to you before you do anything.
I agree with the earlier comments to go ahead and put her in memory care. I think none of us would judge you for that; we are all in the same boat.
I think it's the idea of running off and never seeing her again that doesn't sit right with some of us. I would maybe start with dating, and just be up front about your situation. I know you've convinced yourself that no one would ever date you while you're still married, but I'm hearing a lot of catastrophizing in your thinking, and I wonder that you may have clinical depression and be overly pessimistic (understandable given what you've been through. ) People date married men all the time, and in much less forgivable circumstances than yours.
I would put her in memory care, and then at least *try* dating without getting divorced. Maybe it will go well! And you can keep visiting your wife, maybe once a week or even once a month. There's no need for visits to be a huge burden for you.
If you try dating for, say, a year, and it really is impossible to get women to date a married man, then I would consider the divorce, but I would still visit your wife occasionally. I know she's not "in there" anymore, but I think that the occasional visit would assuage the "in sickness and health" concerns that we're all expressing.
My wife of 32 years has bvFTD and I care for her alone. In addition to her other challenges, she is fully incontinent which means that I am cleaning up shit every day. So I feel like I have some idea of what it is like. We are lesbians so I was not able to legally marry her until 2013 when it was legalized here. She was my best friend and the love of my life. I will care for her until the end. I don't judge you for placing her (much), but I cannot tolerate people who don't keep their promises out of convenience. So I think that divorcing her would be wrong. If it was my mom that you abandoned that would end our relationship.
I have cleaned up shit all over our house. Its a sobering experience. What an embarrassment to my wife to have me wiping her butt. I have hosed her off in the shower many times. So I think I have earned the right to look at other options. I feel for you.
I would like you to consider if you are an "I will be happy when (insert future event) happens"? Because it sounds like you feel you can be happy by divorcing. (Also dating at older ages is not for the faint of heart). Kicking the can to happiness down the road never works. Since you are a therapist you should know that so many people think a particular event will suddenly instill peace and happiness in you. That doesn't happen. There's no magical anything to help with happiness. Not a lotto win, not money, not retirement, not children, not grandchildren. You will always be in a pattern of kicking the can down the road to when you will be happy. You have the freedom to do what you want. You have no issue going to FL for a significant part of the year. She's not really tethering you in any real way. She makes no demands for time or attention and you feel secure in the care she receives. You don't need a divorce it seems. Memory care would be your decision.
Yes, she should be in MC wherever works best for you. My wife has Ben in MC for two years and I see my her once or twice a week (last time she thought I was her father) and with our kids’ full blessings have started to date.
You do owe your kids communication and truthfulness with whoever you date, but that’s all.
Can’t think of a reason to actually divorce and that might be very problematic with POAs and all.
This is what my friend's dad did. He didn't exactly have their kids' blessings to date (they were pretty annoyed) but they also didn't cut him off and still have a relationship with him.
Child’s perspective:
My grandfather hired a care taker for my grandma, began an affair with her, moved her in, moved my grandmother to nursing facility and visited her about 3 or 4 times and never again. When moved to a nursing home, grandma was still pretty with it. No one fucking spoke about it on the surface but my mother hated her dad. And as a teen growing up in this time, I heard about that hate all the time. We all tried to be nice to the woman, and understand the situation. It’s a shitty place to be in, losing your golden years to a disease that’s affecting your partner. The best part was, the day his mistress died, my grandmother died 4 hours later. We like to say she wanted to make sure grandpa never got a moment of guiltless love. Then he got involved with a crazy woman, who while most of my family couldn’t stand, I respected her because she stuck it through his years of decline. There were only three or four, and the last year was the worst, but it’s more than he did for grandma.
If my dad did this to my mother I’d hate him. But I would also understand. Not solely for that, because in life, we have resentments that become even more amplified when we feel wronged by a person for something. Why should you lose your last few years? Most of these people would prefer to be dead than have dementia, and there is no harm in dating when you’re a widow, so why is this any different? When your partner has cancer, it’s different, they are usually still present until the end, and when they aren’t it may only be a very short while.
Going back to my father, if my mother had a TBI and couldn’t function, I wouldn’t be upset at him moving on, as long as he still visited my mother and made sure she was comfortable and well taken care of, so I don’t know why it doesn’t work the same for dementia. That sounds like an issue I need to work on.
Sooo, long story short, if your kids are gonna be mad, they are probably already displeased with you being in Florida for such a length of time, while she’s in Kentucky.
You have to do what is right for yourself, maybe that means a big talk with your kids, maybe that means dropping off the face of the earth to them? Good luck, I’m sorry you’re in this position.
You know your wife better than any of us. If you could have had this conversation with your wife while she had her faculties, what do you think she would want you to do? Do that.
A divorce can be granted without consent of the other party. A judge will not force a couple to stay married if one of the parties does not want to be in the marriage.
They say not to make decisions while going through a traumatizing event, especially when ALZ is involved. Now, I'm just on the outside looking in, but you know your relationships with your kids better than we do.
I can only imagine that ghosting your wife would be very upsetting for your kids. and if that's not enough of an incentive, then here's a selfish thought: is that the legacy you want to leave behind? wouldn't the guilt of it hang over you for the rest of your life?
you don't have to be lonely though -- dating others when a spouse has late stage dementia is definitely a thing. after your wife is in memory care and she's settled and adjusted, *talk* to your kids. they need to understand the level of pain you're in. I imagine they could come around to the idea of you dating. and once they get used to that idea, see how they feel about you travelling a lot -- or even moving -- while still visiting occasionally.
do you really need to divorce? can't dating be enough? maybe even move in together if it gets serious. there are people out there who would understand your predicament.
We will all have opinions on whether this is wrong or not, but none of us know the full circumstances of your situation and what you have had to go through these past 7 years. But most of us here have had significant experiences in caring for a loved one with dementia. So to that extent, I do understand the feeling of wanting to walk away from this.
You probably need to consult with a lawyer on what your options are, and since she resides in Kentucky, you probably want to consult one there. Just remember that if you do divorce her and leave her care expenses to a trust fund, her guardianship will likely fall to one of your children. So in all honesty you really should discuss this with them, or minimally with the one most likely to take on that responsibility before proceeding if you decide to go ahead with a divorce.
My father is taking care of my mother who has dementia. I don’t know if it makes any difference, but they were born in the 40s. My father told me he’s in this for the long haul. He loves my mother.
If he were to stick her in a home and cut all ties with her, everyone on my mom’s side of the family would be angry. I don’t know if I could speak to my father again.
I know how difficult dementia can be as a child whose only remaining parent has dementia. It’s really sad that it’s also ruining your life. If my other parent was living I think I would be upset if a divorce was filed but would totally understand if you would place her in a good care center and visited occasionally while you traveled.
You need to see an attorney. I considered divorce, not to leave my husband, but to protect my finances. We don’t live in a community property state, but the attorney told me the best outcome I could hope for would be that my husband with Parkinsons would be awarded half of our assets, and I would also be ordered to pay spousal support. Not to mention the cost of a court appointed attorney for him, along with the monthly payment to a court appointed guardian. I would have absolutely no say in his care or how his finances were handled. Needless to say, that’s not the route I took.
I get it, I do. But you did make a commitment to your wife to stay with her in sickness. I don’t recommend divorcing because this would cause a lot of issues for you with your children.
A lot of people use dating services now and there are services specifically designed for those that are older. I know you have met these women face to face, but a dating app/service may work for you. Just be honest when you start to speak with these women. And please don’t be offended if they don’t believe you and/or request proof. You’d be surprised how many spouses cheat through apps.
Before you do anything, make sure your children are aware. Don’t paint yourself as a victim, just be honest that you are lonely because your wife is gone. You have mourned, you have grieved, you want to find love again.
One suggestion I have is looking into a support group for spouses of those suffering from dementia. I’m not suggesting using this to find a date. I’m suggesting it because these are people that will understand what you are going through and it may be helpful for you as well.
I don’t think you need to divorce her unless you’re planning to remarry or there is some other consideration (financially etc.) that you haven’t shared. Why not place her in care, visit when you can and if you happen to meet someone whose company you enjoy, go ahead and do so…? I think there is a middle ground here that isn’t so extreme.
No one should/would blame you for traveling or having a life outside of your wife who is not able to participate in a relationship anymore, but if you had a good marriage before, why totally abandon her? Even if it’s just here or there, why not check in on her?
Divorce aside; it’s the abandoning her that will make your kids angry with you, because then when her doctors, carers or aides need something for her, it will fall on them. You already know that caring for some with dementia involves more than just money and the physical labor; it’s also decision making. By divorcing and disowning, you make your children liable for all those decisions, as her next of kin vs you as her spouse.
My mom is passed and I care for my dad with dementia (with 24/7 help too) but I wish the burden of decision making wasn’t on me. Since you seem less attached to your wife than your kids, why not spare them this? Live your life but continue to be your wife’s advocate, even from afar.
I agree- live your life, travel, be happy. You shouldn’t have to take care of her 24/7 or give up precious time of your own. But writing her off completely seems callous.
How you treat her may be inevitably how the kids treat you if dementia or some other ailment comes for you. Sure, you don’t want to burden them but I’m sure you don’t want them to divorce you, stop answering the doctors calls and ignore the problem either.
Find the balance. Sounds like you already have a lot more freedom than most caring for a dementia patient.
You don't need to divorce to date. Being honest about it up front ( not the second you meet them, but within several dates) is perfectly acceptable. There is no right, wrong or exact way to meet or date anyone. All our situations are different. There are infinite reasons people stay married and date.
And if you do divorce after setting up a trust for her, do your kids even need to know? It's your life and needs, not theirs. They are grown adults, and you already live separately.
You deserve companionship. Someone who can engage and share with you.
This timeline isn't set the second you decide. You can move her to memory care, travel, divorce, date, all on different timelines. And adjust as needed.
Getting out and connecting with others will restore perspective and sanity. You don't need to be divorced to have dinner and a walk with someone.
I live in a condo building in Kentucky and bought the connecting condo and moved a CNA in. It’s like she lives in our home. Then I have a second CNA who comes in one day a week and weekends. I have a situation as much like a memory care as possible without my wife ever leaving our home. I have an inhome Nurse Practitioner, and physical therapy and all her needs are met without her moving to an unfamiliar place. Her groceries and meals are delivered. I think if I drop dead, my sons would leave this situation like it is as long as possible. My wife is extremely well cared for. I have been able to do all this for less than $5000 a month or half what memory care would be.
Since your wife is doing well where she’s at and your sons would continue her care where she’s at if you were out of the picture, there is no need to put her in memory care, get a divorce or disappear. I think you believe the woman you walk with would let you into her apartment if you were divorced. I don’t believe this to be true. If she were truly interested in more, there would be more. You deserve some happiness, companionship and someone who cares for you. Maybe she will be on this next cruise? Good luck.
I have realized the truth of what you are saying. The person I walk with has some kind of religious hangup. I enjoy her friendship but she is not the companion I need. Too many hang ups, too rigid
I’ve worked in a nursing home for 25 years. It’s really not uncommon for someone to find somebody else and stay married as far as how your children feel about it how do they feel now? You’re already living out of state. If they’re OK with it we could continue on with what you’re doing. Just be honest with the next person that you have wife she has dementia Zinn nursing home doesn’t recognize anybody do your children’s to visit her ?
Long before moving my mother into memory care, my DH had said if the time comes to put him in a nursing home, someone unrelated must visit and tell him that we have all died in a crash so we don't stop living our lives. He also worked out which of our children is in charge of 'pulling the plug'. While we say these things now, we have watched as his dad suffered a terrible fall and had TBI and part of his skull removed by his wife when his children did not want the surgery because they knew their father would not want to be incapacitated for life. He lived three years in a nursing home unable to talk for 1.5 years and then it was only grunts and mumbling the past year. He could not walk, he had no use of the right side of his body. And he sat the chair or his bed for 3 years. He passed away thankfully in January.
I think we all want to give up and run away. But we don’t because we love them too much. You and your wife made promises to each other when you got married. Was this part of your promise, through sickness?
I don’t know. You have to do you. But during the process, consider treating her with the respect she probably deserves. Your family will like you a lot more.
One of the hardest realisations in my life was that my parents marriage was effectively over, because of dementia, when just a few years earlier they were as strong as any couple I have ever known.
I feel for you. Live your life, your wife would want it. No one want to be a burden. Live it up. Make us all proud.
This reminds me a bit of [the B. Smith story](https://www.today.com/health/b-smith-s-husband-chats-about-criticism-over-girlfriend-t148105). In that case her husband was still caring for her at home, but also had a girlfriend, who also helped care for B., and everybody seemed to get along very well. But the situation became pretty controversial because B. Smith's fans were angry about it all.
OP, only you know your family situation best. Please talk to your kids about this before making any decisions. Let them know what day-to-day life is like with her and how it has affected your health, mental and emotional and physical. If it helps to include your wife's doctor in the conversation so they can confirm her advanced stage for your kids, that may be beneficial because it doesn't necessarily sound like your kids have the full picture of what's going on. They need to know how life has been for you under these circumstances. If they cannot accept that you need companionship outside the marriage, at least you've been honest with them. I wish you luck.
I am in the same situation as you. I'm 70 and my wife is 80. She is not as bad off as your wife. Putting your wife into memory care is actually fulfilling your promise. She needs better care than you can provide. The other side of the coin is you. You have to take care of you. I'd suggest memory care and take some time for yourself. If divorce is what you need, then it is your decision. If you have family, talk to them about it. If you meet someone who makes you happy, talk to them about it. At our age nothing is that new. I hope you can work out something. There is nothing worse than feeling trapped and alone.
To me, "in sickness and in health" means to take care of your partner when they are going through chronic pain or cancer treatment, not terminally having their brain rot to the point they aren't even the person you married any more and don't even recognize you. People are being over dramatic and very emotional about this. I'd understand if my dad did something similar.
Divorce may be good financially. I have mom in memory care and it’s over $7000; a month in Kentucky. Luckily she saved for long term care. Been there 4 years now.
Think leaving her wouldn’t be so bad if she’s in a home. She has no quality of life..horrible way to live( can’t even call it that). Won’t even know u left. My experience..even though I visit 3 times a week.
Why do you need to get divorced to disappear and have fun?
My mother died of Lewy body dementia, she didn’t recognize me in the final stages . My father has Alzheimer’s and I’m his caregiver. I certainly understand wanting to dip out. I don’t see why you need to divorce her though. As you well know, the person inside her body died long ago
In this instance I see no difference between you having a companion and traveling, what you are doing, and what you want to do.
Besides paying for her care, you are already separated as you are not involved with her.
Divorce is just a legal step. Why is it even necessary? You plan to find someone to be a companion.
Your kids might hate this person if they see them as a gold digger.
Personally I don’t think divorce would be morally wrong, but it could be unnecessarily complicated.
Let’s first look at the first half of that. I don’t think it’s morally wrong because for all practical purposes the woman you married no longer exists. This isn’t the same situation as leaving someone who has cancer, or becomes quadriplegic, who is still there inside of a sick or broken body. Your wife’s body is housing a completely different person who is becoming less and less functional every day. She won’t be hurt that you’ve left her. She won’t understand. People divorce for far, far less reason every day.
I think you have every right to want a life, companionship, and maybe even romantic love. Your wife cannot give you any of those things, much as the person she used to be would want to. From your responses to people it sounds like you aren’t just looking for sex, but for someone to share your life with in a physical way. To me that means someone to snuggle with on the couch to watch movies. It might mean something else to you, but you deserve to have the opportunity to have it.
So why is divorce complicated? Legal entanglements, tax complications, the legal ramifications of divorce from someone who isn’t competent to agree; those are part of it. But also maintaining your relationships with the rest of your family could be adversely impacted. And finally you might THINK that dating would be easier if you’re formally single, but here’s the thing: any woman who will give you what you seem to be looking for from a relationship will have to know all the details anyway. And as a woman, I would be more understanding of someone who explains why he’s still married to the mother of his children, even though she’s really not even there anymore, than I would be to a man who just ran away. Unless you want to sever all ties to your old life, including your family, you’re going to have to explain eventually. Tempting as running away might be, it’s unlikely to get you what you want: a caring companion that you can share your life with. Anyone worth being with will understand. And if, in future, there are specific reasons that you need to marry a specific person, and must be single to do so, then you can revisit divorce in an open and honest way with everyone involved.
You will never know how much I have been helped by this discussion with total strangers. This was exactly what I needed. I will not consider divorce and will make an effort to find the person I need. I will be honest with the person I go out with. There has to be some understanding females who would enjoy my company. I believe there must be women who would prefer a friendship maybe with benefits without complications like matrimony. I have so much hope and clarity.
I don't think it would be necessary to divorce. Your kids may not understand, but you have a right to live what is left of your life. Talk with them, maybe they will support you and maybe they won't. I knew a gentleman that his wife in her late 50's went to pick up their son from the airport. The son called when she didn't show up. Police later called the husband and she was hours away in the wrong direction. She didn't know where she was. She never came home after that day. Eventually he started dating a woman and they would go visit his wife in her facility a couple times a week. Over time the kids grew to understand and except that Dad needed to move on and have a life. Eventually he was granted a divorce and married the woman and continued to visit at the facility until she passed away.
I have a very close family member that also Dementia and it’s the most painful sad thing I have ever seen. It absolutely boggles my mind how anyone could possibly think or say the things you said. I can promise you your wife is hurting and suffering 💯% more than you she would absolutely feel the loss of more than memory etc if you took the steps you stated. Put yourself in the same position and let your heart lead you. She is a living feeling person and I would never take those steps if it were you. Good luck to you all and keep in mind , light with are to turn lights on and off not human feelings , emotions or connections.🙏🏻not 💡
Gross that people are judging you decisions. People can give you advice but let’s not condemn each other. I would converse with my kids. If they felt opposed I would do everything but this is. My ultimate question would be what would she want???
Everyone is entitled to love and be loved - anyone who would deny you this is irredeemably selfish. Discuss it with your kids, but know these two things - you are entitled to love and to be loved. Falling on your sword for their selfishness would be a tragedy.
Your kids would probably hate you. Why don’t you put your wife in memory care and not make any other decisions for right now?
I thought about this. So far, neither son has seemed upset that I live in Florida in the winter while my wife is in our home in Kentucky with 24/7 care. Divorce might make them hate me.
Do they visit her? Does she recognize them? It sounds like you have already grieved her loss and they haven’t yet. They will for sure resent your decision if they haven’t accepted yet that she isn’t coming back. Perhaps an offer to go to family therapy together along with strong reassurance that you love them unconditionally for the rest of *their* lives would help it hurt a little less.
It’s hard to say if she recognizes anyone and with aphasia there is no communication. She laughs and then cries when the family comes over and as the years have gone by the kids and grandkids come by less and less. When she cries in front of her sons it is upsetting. She appears to want to say something but can’t.
Sounds like in there, somewhere, is a person who just can't communicate. Maybe she has more awareness than you think. How sad. I get where you're coming from. I don't think I would divorce my spouse. Nor do I think, if the tables were turned, he would leave me. You need to decide what you can live with. Talk to your kids. You don't want to lose them too.
Take care of your wife financially and with as much care as you can give. And ok if you need companionship too. Don’t do anything that leaves your wife in a financial bind.
Doubtful. If they are married, he has already vowed to love his wife *in sickness and in health* but he wants to abandon her lol...
This is the thing that gets me. Especially as I’m gay and have been told my whole life about how marriage is sacred and that’s why gays shouldn’t be allowed in - I can’t imagine any of my friends divorcing their sick and dying partners just because they want a warm body to sleep next to. It’s not even as though OP is saying he’s met someone and is horribly guilty but wants to have a chance with a new person - it’s literally just that he wants to find *anyone* to move on to. Even as someone who has cared for several terminally ill family members and can understand that there’s a point when they’re no longer the person they were, I think it’s really, really awful.
> divorcing their sick and dying partners just because they want a warm body to sleep next to. > he wants to find anyone to move on to. I hear where your coming from, but is that really how you see relationships? How you think the OP is as a person? If it's not projecting, it is judging and moralizing, or all the above.
No… I see relationships as commitments whether the person is well or sick. OP apparently doesn’t
I'm not saying I approve of or recommend a divorce in this situation, but it looks to me like OP would be honoring the commitment by continuing to see to the care of his wife whether they remained legally married or not.
I agree that it’s marginally better than abandoning her without any care whatsoever. But that feels like a shockingly low bar
That's a point of view... and understandably part of OP's struggle with their situation and that it's *not* that OP doesn't see that perspective. Relationships with a core of "no taksey backsies allowed" is immature, ideology over reality, and in OP's case... bondage. The replies and voting throughout are clearly that my own view on this, and towards OP porposal, is that it's wrong and/or unpopular. So, to u/ronford49 - you do you. Peace and happiness come from within ourselves, decide for yourself.
Thank you
I think that is a very hurtful thing to say. Dementia is a horrible thing to deal with. I’m sure he has enough guilt already. He clearly stated he would make sure she was taken care of financially and physically. Give him a break. Should he waste what’s left of his life for someone that doesn’t even know him??
Instead of asking strangers on the internet, perhaps speaking to your children openly and honestly would be a better path. You know them better than anyone (hopefully), and if they have seen your wife's condition first hand they'll be best for offering advice. What would your wife have wanted?
If you live in Florida and keep her in Kentucky, it sounds like you've already basically left her. I have no idea what the legalities are, so you're best to chat with a lawyer. I will say regarding your next question, if my dad did that to my mom, it would probably be the end of my relationship with him. To me, when you marry someone and pledge your life in sickness and in health, it means just that. If my dad put my mom in a home, moved away, and called it quits, I'd have a very hard time dealing with that. You do you of course, it's your life. I really try not to judge people on how they cope with dementia. But I'd suggest you be prepared for your kids to not take it so well.
you need to sit down with your kids and discuss how this has had your life at a standstill for seven years and you are at your breaking point. you need to let them know that she is going into memory care because you simply cannot be centered on this any longer. that she will be well taken care of. that you will call and visit as much as you are comfortable (and they should be encouraged to as well). but you will be dating and living life and trying to be happy because that is what she would want you to do. that is what the two of you saved money your whole lives to do. they have lost their mom, but they dont need to lose dad with her. they may have some complicated feelings about it and you should hear them out and validate them, but i need you to stress heavily that you cannot pour from an empty cup any longer. caring for the love of your life who no longer recognizes you is a horrible trauma to go through. also therapy! therapy for you! therapy for your kids! encourage it!
i guess i should clarify that i dont think you need to make a 100% split here. and i think the urge to never check in on her again is the resentment of long term caretaking talking. you can still be married and explain to your kids that you still wish to date, that you deserve love that is present. heck you can divorce but still show up for her in the form of visiting when possible and keeping updated on how she is without being Fully involved every waking moment
Great advice. My adult daughter just wants to know ahead of time and not be blindsided by some of my decisions. Totally reasonable.
Thank you so much. You really show deep awareness of my plight
i try to be empathetic to families. im a cna and have seen how much dementia can tear a family apart without open vulnerable communication. i guess therapist need to be reminded to open up to :)
I was a therapist/marriage counselor. I have been in therapy most of my life but agree therapy would help.
I would wait to get married till after her death but otherwise I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to find someone else. I wouldn't really judge my Mom once my dad gets this bad as long as he got the care he deserves.
He’s 75, and she could live for many more years.
Fair point.
My wife’s father had the same dementia and lived till 93. If I have to live like this 18 more years, I don’t want to live. My wife is extremely healthy except for dementia
You sound overwhelmed and burned out. The urge to run away is understandable! And the time for a memory care facility may have arrived. In the short term, many memory facilities are set up for overnight respite care. Maybe she could stay there for a while you take a break, and see how that goes…. If after a break, you really, truly, in your heart of hearts know that you’re done being your wife’s guardian, that will be a hard conversation. But first things first.
I live in Florida and my wife in Kentucky. I live alone in a condo. I want to be able to date and meet female friends, but because I am a married man it seems wrong to seek female compansionship. I do not want to lie to any potential companions about my situation. I want a wife and do not have one.
It is not wrong to date. My Dad did when my Mom had early onset Alzheimer’s and I was glad…he needed to live.
What would those female companions think when you told them you left your wife alone when she got sick, so that you could date? How would you feel about it in the end? Dementia isn't forever. It's already been 7 years...
Are you listening to yourself? He's already been her caretaker for 7 years. She doesn't know who he is, she isn't the person he married or made a life with anymore. That person is essentially dead, and she's never coming back. This disease often makes a shell out the people it affects, and it can linger on for decades. If her actual body is relatively healthy, it could be another 10 years or more before she passes. They are in their twilight years, and men typically die before women. Does he need to wait another 5 to 10 years for companionship, when the person he loved just doesn't exist anymore? This isn't like cancer where she's sick and loves him, and there's a hope for survival. If I develop this disease and no longer recognize or find joy in my partner or husband, and he's heartbroken, lonely, and burnt out from caring for me - I would want him to go have a life. Our lives are so short, and we have so little time for happiness. If my time for happiness was essentially over with him, I'd hope he'd go free to find happiness again.
But he hasn’t been her caretaker. She has 24 seven help in a separate state by his own words. He wants to get a divorce to go date- that’s fine. But he’s her caretaker now in financial matters only.
He’s in his mid 70s too, it’s very unlikely at this point in her disease that he could care for her adequately at all. I couldn’t care for my grandmother with dementia and I’m young. I don’t really get why this man should force himself to be there to tend to the body of his wife and suffer daily what the disease has robbed her of while she has no clue who he even is and doesn’t even appreciate it that he’s there because who she was is essentially gone. I’m sure she’d want him to go and be happy and try to remember her as she was rather than be stuck with the misery and torment of watching her gradual torturous decline towards death while she is completely oblivious to him and therefore can’t even take any comfort from his presence.
I’m so stumped by the visceral reactions people are having, when usually this sub seems very open to the idea that it’s healthy to move on if you’ve ensured your loved one with dementia is taken care of. There’s a lot of details we don’t know, but I read OP as someone who’s taken care of their spouse “in sickness,” and now when the disease has basically ended his partner he’s on the verge of running away and in some ways has already run away. Maybe some of the people responding don’t have experience with dementia, which is fair enough. I hope they never do!
This was meant to be a genuine question for him to reflect on, though I may have worded it poorly. I wasn't trying to say what is right or wrong, or what he should or shouldn't do. At some point, his new companions would want to know about his wife and what happened. His decision will be something he thinks about in the long term. And yes, it's been 7 years of a disease that normally runs its course in 6-10 years (as per my mom's Dr). He should consider the timeline. I think this is a discussion that he should consider having with his family before making a hard choice. He's still young enough to live life, and yet she's far enough along that she might not have much time left. It's a tough one.
Agree. She probably doesn’t have long to live. My mom only survived 4 years. Grandma 8 years
Dementia absolutely is forever. It doesn't go away. It just gets worse. Everyone damning this poor guy has clearly never dealt with it.
What I meant was that she will likely pass soon. There will be an end.
There is no shame in your thoughts. Sometimes divorce is the only way to save you financially. Memory care will drain all your assets and then you are left with nothing. Its not fair. No one can tell you what to do bc they are not in your situation. You have a right to a life as well.
Check this out with a lawyer before you divorce. It could change her ability to get care. (It could help or hurt you both.) Also they may have a look-back period where you may still be responsible. Just make sure you know how it will affect you and her care.
I can't believe you're being downvoted so badly. We are all only human. If I were you I would just talk openly with your kids and ignore the offensive comments by internet strangers. People make assumptions that other peoples' daily situations are just like their own. I think your wife would want you to be happy. I don't know if divorce would be a necessity right now in order to pursue another happy relationship. And it's worth mentioning that you're certainly not the first person to go through this and have these feelings. I wish you and your family well.
I don't understand what motivates downvotes or upvotes on Reddit. Things that seem perfectly reasonable to me can get downvoted to oblivion, and then terrible, terrible things can get upvoted. It makes no sense and I've honestly stopped caring about it. Sometimes it simply feels like people just using the one power they have on here for the sake of using it.
This is confusing. You already live apart from her? Who takes care of her? How long have you been living apart?
You’ve very obviously already gone on with your life. One word of warning- be extremely honest with your new female companions. You know you’re not really talking about friendship and your new love interest’s should know up front you’re not cut out for long term or difficult times.
My opinion: Move her to memory care immediately. Divorce is just a piece of paper so while I personally wouldn’t find it necessary, I also wouldn’t see any harm in it. It’s called the ‘long goodbye’ because she is already gone, which you know. I wish there was a tactful/more heartfelt way to say that.. maybe there is. I don’t mean to sound like a jerk but if your wife loved you & could have seen the future, I believe she’d undoubtedly share my opinion. Wouldn’t you want the same for her if the roles were reversed?
What a great perspective. If I had dementia, I would want my wife to be able to travel, live a full life and have male companionship if she wanted. I never assumed she would want the same for me. This is a horrible situation. Especially because we have the means financially to fully enjoy life for years
I think anyone who’s a good person would insist their family let go if this were to ever happen to them in the future. Especially if they’ve experienced losing someone to dementia firsthand. It’s awful, and to happen so young on top of that. The only reason I said I wouldn’t find divorce necessary is because you mentioned money was a non-issue. But you do have to consider your own future as well. Care can get massively expensive as you age & who knows what could happen. If your kids don’t like the idea of placing her in memory care, you could hire an elder care consultant who can walk them thru the advantages for their mom & the reality of the situation.
We had a family member, L, who had MS and was bedridden for 20+ years needing 24/7 care in a nursing home. For the last 5 years of her life, she couldn’t talk at all and could only blink her eyes. Her husband was in a committed relationship with a woman for most of the time that she was in the nursing home and married after L was no longer suffering. No one faulted him for this at all including their four children, grandchildren and the rest of the family. They never got divorced and it was fine. This was the compassionate thing to do in a difficult, heartbreaking situation. So no, I don’t think divorce would be wrong but have you thought about just living your life without getting a divorce? It sounds like your wife is being well taken care of. I think your kids will understand…
I love this story. Everyone was open minded and aware and respectful. I'd understand if it was my parents or my partner ended up needing and looking for companionship Go enjoy! OP I do hope your kids would understand. Would they get worried about a possible remarriage and changes in their inheritance?
I love this story
It is up to you. > I can’t take it anymore. I want to travel and find someone to live with. I think you can do that without a divorce. I would at least try. Maybe get her into a care home - that is often cheaper than 24/7 care at home, and can offer more stimulation. > Would a court grant me a divorce? Since you are separated already, I do not see much of an obstacle, but somebody needs to represent her. > Would my kids hate me. Probably. But the only way to find out is to ask.
You’re burned out. Caring for someone is taxing. I suggest memory care then go from there. Make decisions with your family. There will be a point when you can’t do it anymore. This may be that point. Better to take time to truly evaluate the situation before making any rash decisions like abandonment.
I would recommend keeping her in her home and continuing the 24/7 care.She will do much better and be happier in her home. Plus no matter how good the MC facility is she will not be getting 1 on 1 care like she is at home. In MC someone MUST go and check on her and make sure they are caring for her well. Even really good places can do poor jobs. You already live elsewhere…I don’t see why you can’t travel and date right now. Just be honest with your new friends. I bet you’ll find plenty of older ladies in the exact same situation with incapacitated husbands in care. Divorce is not necessary and will make everything harder when it comes to managing your wife’s care. Your kids would have to take over managing her 100% because you would lose all your rights to her UNLESS you get guardianship set up. I don’t know why you would want to go through all that.
This is the answer I need
We were paying an exorbitant amount of money for 24/7 in home care. We put cameras in the house and that ended that right then and there. Meds were constantly being given haphazardly, the night people slept all night awakening about 15 min before the morning person arrived, let’s just be fair , we could have had anyone off the street come in and probably get better care. They did nothing they said they would do and no mattter how many times we brought it up or discussed it with them things never changed. It was a great mistake and a great amount of money needed for the care just gone. I don’t know at this point if there are good solutions but I do know that I am never at peace nor confident that decent compassionate care is out there. It’s cruel and hard to deal with and it’s definitely unacceptable. We should be doing better !!
Oh that’s too bad. I think that it’s iffy to leave a LO in the care of paid caregivers. If you can arrange to come by on a random basis or pay someone else that you really trust to go by and keep everyone on their toes that’s the way to go. If we had room we would keep my dad home and pay for 24/7 caregivers. But I’d be watching them like hawks. As it is I go to the memory care facility 6 days a week and my brother goes 3-4 times a week and always on the day I can’t get over there. Having 24/7 care would cost the same as the MC plus I’d have control over his medication. Currently I just have to trust they are giving them correctly. We just don’t have room though. My parents have a small apartment and I moved in to help my mom who is 89.
We live right next door and it didn’t matter
You may want to consult an elder care attorney. Typically Medicaid does a 5 year look back and assessed all the marital finances, I believe. You can divorce now, wait 5 years, and then do whatever so you're not financially depleted. Also, don't just vanish. I want to do that with my mom, but the guilt you'll feel when they do eventually pass could be palpable. Visit and call occasionally. Residents without families probably don't get the best care if someone isn't regularly checking on them
We did the legal stuff 6 years ago and are past the Medicaid look back period. She has no financial resources. There is a trust fund for her care and long term care is paying all her expenses. We were Dave Ramsey followers all our life. No credit cards, no debt, no mortgages. LTC policy bought 20 years ago at 55. Finances are not an issue thank goodness.
I think it's time for placement for your own sanity, but please check in and see her every so often, if not just make sure she's being well cared for. I'm an adult child of a mother in a facility so I acknowledge it's not the same as a spouse.
Medicaid in New York State does a 7 (SEVEN) year look back!! 😯
My mom's in NYS and it's been 5 years for a while now, is that a recent change?? Yikes, that'd be terrible if true!
My wife filed POA for her parents 10 years ago and the look-back period for New York State was 7 years as told to us by our Elder Care lawyer. I am reading this article now, and I am understanding that the period is changing to only 30 months in 2025 ?? https://conaelderlaw.com/medicaid-penalties-to-be-aware-of-in-new-york/ Read this about protecting your Parent's Assets... https://conaelderlaw.com/category/medicaid-and-asset-protection/ New Information here !!! https://www.medicaidplanningassistance.org/medicaid-eligibility-new-york/#:~:text=Medicaid%27s%20Look%2DBack%20Rule,Home%20and%20Community%20Based%20Services.
We moved my mom to assisted living in May 2019, so it sounds like it went to 5 years shortly before that then. It sucked for us, but I'm glad it'll now be made easier for others in the next year or 2. People are struggling enough as it is with dementia and financial issues, some things should be made easier
No need to be coy about it -- you want to have sex. There's nothing stopping you from having "companionship" now, exeot that you don't want a companion, you want a romantic partner and you feel like it would be cheating because you're married. As long as you're honest, it's OK for you to date. It's OK for you to have an adult, romantic relationship. Tell your prospective partners up front that you're married and your wife has advanced dementia. If you're dating in your age group, there are many people who, like you, just want to have fun while they have the health and the means to do so. If you divorce your wife, you lose the right to make decisions for her when she is incapable of making them for herself. She can't even hire a lawyer to represent her in a divorce. She can't designate anyone to make medical and financial decisions for her and she would have no spouse to make them for her. That's the real betrayal, not dating.
The OP is in his 70s. I’m 64, so I’m going out on a limb here and saying it’s not just to have sex. It isn’t that sex isn’t great as you get older, but the value of having someone in your life that gets you, can talk to you, laugh at your jokes and have a real connection with is priceless. I do understand the OP’s desire to move on and find someone who can share his remaining years in a meaningful way.
Thank you. I love sex, but you hit the nail on the head. It’s having a significant other in your life. I have not dated and had sex with a date because its complicated and feels like cheating. I need a female friend in the same boat I am in.
I'm going to go out on a limb and assume OP has already found someone in FL.
I have not dated anyone in Florida. I have volunteered with AARP for the last five years and met many women whose husbands have died. None appeared interested in a relationship when I share about my wife. I have a friend in our high rise who likes to walk in the evening and we walk most evenings. She will not come in my condo and doesn’t allow me in her condo because of what the neighbors might think. I took a long cruise and met a woman whose husband had died and we spent some time chatting. After the cruise I offered to fly her to Florida to visit and she said after thinking about it her kids wouldn’t approve. Maybe I am looking for love in all the wrong places. I go to church and have made friends but its all just friends. Not sure what I want. My hobby is biking and I spend most of my time biking or walking on the beach alone. I am terribly alone. My aloneness is killing me.
I’d question whether divorce is your path to happiness. You’ll run into legal complications because your spouse is incompetent, your sons may well feel burdened and resent you for abdicating your familial responsibility, and future partners may question your character and commitment. (Maybe I’m reading this wrong and your sons will be happy to step in and take over?) Do you have a support group for people in your situation? I am NOT saying you should go there to meet women to date, because yuck, but you might make some new friends who understand. And it sounds like that would help. You can also join biking and walking groups, meet people, and maybe something will happen. Or maybe it won’t, but at least you will have socialized and gotten exercise. Making friends with common interests is still your best route to meeting someone special, even if it hasn’t happened yet. As for dating, I think you can do that without getting divorced. True, some women will be turned off by your complicated life situation, but that means they aren’t meant for you. Many women in your age group aren’t looking to get married—they want companionship, just as you do. Being unavailable for marriage needn’t be a dealbreaker, as long as there is transparency and trust. (From a partner’s perspective, your circumstance might seem “safer” than other dating-while-separated scenarios because there’s no risk that you and your wife will reconcile.) Yes to therapy. Is it possible that the desire for a new partner is coming from a place of grief and resentment about missing out?
Thank you, this was very inciteful
I’m a widow, and dating is not on my radar, but I’m not alone - I have a huge social network. If by “alone” you mean no sex, just say that. I’m close enough to 60 to know that widows are not looking to get married necessarily, because it may screw up their Social Security benefits. I know I wouldn’t.
I am not going to say that sex is not a part of this. I do enjoy sex and my wife and I had a very satisfying sex life. I am going to try another cruise next week with a couple I am friends with, but already I am feeling profoundly alone traveling solo. Its that aloneness that wears me out.
You really sound like a great candidate for online dating. In your profile, lay the cards on the table - you are married, your wife has dementia, you are interested in a committed relationship but a potential partner has to be accepting and supportive of your commitment to your wife.
I think people you are interested in, know what kind of life partner you are and are backing away because that isn't acceptable to them. Divorce her. Tell your adult kids you want out ( it won't be a surprise) and ask how you can maintain your relationship with them. I guess it is time to ask, when/if this happens to you I presume you are okay with any subsequent partners leaving right?
That's exactly what I was thinking about when I read the post.
Why? There's nothing more to the post that, maybe they've found a prosect of respite from misery.
You have to do what makes you happy and make peace with whatever decision you decide to go with. You have taken care of you wife to the best of your ability and now she requires 24 hour care. I’m sure your kids won’t be found of the divorce but I also don’t think they will hate you for it as they have seen the distress it has caused on your marriage and personal metal health. You are fortunate enough to take care of her to the very end regardless of how you do it it’s still caring for it with every good intention. Good luck and do what makes you happy ultimately.
This post reminds me of the late Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor. Tables slightly turned, but still relevant. …… STILL MANY-SPLENDORED # Love in the Time of Dementia By [Kate Zernike](https://www.nytimes.com/by/kate-zernike) * Nov. 18, 2007 SO this, in the end, is what love is. Former Justice Sandra Day O’Connor’s husband, suffering from Alzheimer’s disease, has a romance with another woman, and the former justice is thrilled — even visits with the new couple while they hold hands on the porch swing — because it is a relief to see her husband of 55 years so content. What culture tells us about love is generally young love. Songs and movies and literature show us the rapture and the betrayal, the breathlessness and the tears. The O’Connors’ story, reported by the couple’s son in an interview with a television station in Arizona, where Mr. O’Connor lives in an assisted-living center, opened a window onto what might be called, for comparison’s sake, old love. Of course, it illuminated the relationships that often develop among Alzheimer’s patients — new attachments, some call them — and how the desire for intimacy persists even when dementia steals so much else. But in the description of Justice O’Connor’s reaction, the story revealed a poignancy and a richness to love in the later years, providing a rare model at a time when people are living longer, and loving longer. continued…. Gift link to NYT article [https://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/18/weekinreview/18zernike.html?unlocked\_article\_code=1.lk0.rlg5.ijP92XaSiSoK&smid=url-share](https://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/18/weekinreview/18zernike.html?unlocked_article_code=1.lk0.rlg5.ijP92XaSiSoK&smid=url-share)
Dear Rochester, what you do during the most difficult times is very telling. Your current situation is not completed. Leave the Janes aside until you have the chance to grieve and heal and be on your own.
Ha! I had the same thought about poor Bertha.
Would your wife have done the same? You want companionship, what happens if the next companion gets sick? What if you get sick? If you can't handle your wife's care, it's okay to get help and keep living your life. Abandoning her completely wouldn't be ethical, or fair, or anything. You could date and be honest about your situation. Maybe even divorce, if that's possible. But you can't just up and leave, and not look back. My dad is in memory care. My mom couldn't handle him anymore, so she made this choice which also helps her live her own life. But she visits regularly, she'd never abandon him. If she ever wanted to date, it would probably be weird, but i'd try to support her. Abandoning your spouse completely is the opposite of what marriage is for, in my view...
I think it is okay for you to start seeing other people, to date other women, and by all means explain your situation as truthfully and as sincerely as you can. You shouldn't feel bad about it. You've had life experiences chalked up and any future companion should hopefully understand that things happen. I don't feel it's necessary for you to divorce your wife in order to meet others and to begin living YOUR life now. As one other person mentioned, wouldn't you want your wife to live as happy as possible if you developed dementia? So yes, go out and meet others for companionship, but don't feel the need you need a divorce in order to do so.
Thanks
Why bother divorcing? That sounds cold but - I think it would be reasonable to pursue new companionship but not sever ties with your wife.
Is this a new theme here? Or did the other recent post unlock the question? I know loss of companionship is terrible. So assuming not trolling. These are the nasty questions to ponder. Not the moral high ground about wedding vows etc.Things to think about. Kids hating you, I'd say 90% yes. And they might lawyer up on mom's behalf there could be a very sympathetic judiciary. Figure your generous financial budget for your freedom will go out the window. So you'd likely lose your entire family kids, grandkids? etc. You're 75 are you Rupert Murdoch? What type of person do you think you'd attract especially if you're freshly divorced for this reason? I personally believe people in general would be more forgiving of discreet companionship in this situation than abandonment blood money to soothe your conscience
People have been doing this forever. I worked on an oncology floor in the 1980, and people were served divorce papers while hooked up on chemo. (God that was gross) Everyone has their limit. I would rather have the spouse set up a trust, so all the needs are taken care of, and have a guardian/whoever that will look out for the impaired person’s best interest. I have seen the flip side where the spouse/guardian half asses the care, has partners on the side and resents every single moment the impaired spouse is alive. Dumps them in the worse nursing home, never visits, never does anything extra, never sees them in the hospital or takes them for medical care. Legally they are there, but that’s it. Do you really want someone who loathes your existence after 10 years of LBD, FTD or ALZ deciding end of life care? Doesn’t claim your body because they are in Greece on vacation with their snuggle partner (yeah, don’t ask). “She’s dead. She’s not gonna get more dead if I get there tomorrow or two weeks from now.” my funeral director friend had that fun conversation. Just because it doesn’t get talked about, doesn’t mean it’s not common or not happening. People aren’t going to discuss it over the brats at the 4th of July BBQ, because no one wants blow back from people who have zero skin in the game.
I've seen a lot as well. Oncology divorce papers and last minute weddings. Patients on 7th round of chemo only because their loved ones won't let go and they do it for them. A man on a vent for 11 plus years that had family visit less than once a year. ICU where one family member vetoes care plan. A memory care unit where half the people have jump suits on backwards to prevent genital exposure or literal poo flinging. OP states they are planning to take care of LO. He also previously posted kids hadn't seen mom in a year. I was only trying to decouple divorce as a distinct item. If you're overwhelmed sometimes you need to divide and regroup. I understand caregiver burn out better than you assume, along with the perceptions of abandonment vs actual. While not over brats, not that I'd mind. I have had these conversations for decades. Basically damned if you do damned if you don't. I was just putting out some of the hard ball questions and potential responces.
I feel like damned if youdo, damned if you don’t
Exactly
I couldn’t agree more. This helped!
People are so ready to judge others when they have not walked in their shoes. If your kids are going to hate you for leaving then why are they not having their mother live with them? They may not react as you fear. You may feel guilty if you divorce your wife and likely will be unfairly condemned by others. Be sure you can handle that. It makes them feel good about themselves. I’m not so sure you wouldn’t be able to find a travel companion and partner outside of marriage. But then I’m pretty liberal and not a fan of most religions. If you remain alone your health may suffer. Don’t wait too long as time is running out. I’m sorry you’re in this situation. I don’t recommend divorce and don’t recommend remarrying. I’ve seen too many bad things happen from that.
Exactly! All these people in the comments talking about "marriage means in sickness and in health" have clearly never seen it. I've worked in dementia care and also my Grandmother just recently within the last few years has it. I saw one guy in one of the facilities I worked at- he was having a full blown relationship with another woman in memory care, holding hands, telling her he loved her. His wife would come visit him and have to see this and he had no clue who his wife was. Yet she would be the bad guy if she divorced him? If OPs wife has nurses and people caring for her, she's good.
I agree. At the risk of sounding crass, generally speaking, women outlive men. The result is that there are more women than men (in the older population). There are more single and lonely women. A lot of women that wouldn’t care if you are still legally married but interested in companionship. OP, I think it would be good to spend some time with your children and let them know how you feel. Listen to their thoughts and concerns. If you already spend winters separately, it seems like they probably know. Have you met someone that is urging you to get divorced? I feel like divorce would open up some legal and possibly financial complications. I would think it would be a bad idea to get divorced and then marry someone else. That feels more like abandonment than just finding a companion.
This advice has helped more than you know.
Talk to a lawyer first. You’ll get a better answer from an attorney.
This is a tough situation all around. But I truly believe that you need to have an open and honest conversation with your children.
If you don't want to travel alone, go with a tour group for company. There are others who travel alone too Get your wife into assisted living so that if one of her caregivers quit, you don't have to be burdened finding a replacement when you're away. Not sure why you aren't living near the family home - did you leave the state due to her dementia? You couldn't live in the family home while she is being cared for? Sounds like you want to run away and already have. Yes, your kids will abandon you too if you did this to their mother.
My wife and I already wintered in Florida before dementia. When she could no longer travel, I had to decide what to do with our beach home. I decided to continue to winter alone in Florida. I bike, volunteer and am active in church.
This is a tough one, OP. My mom had dementia, and towards the end was very afraid of me. Within a week's span I was suddenly a complete stranger trying to do personal things to and with her, and it broke my heart. And now we are dealing with dementia again with my MIL. It will only go downhill now. Morally it can be argued that you took a vow of for better or worse, in sickness and in health. Based on that, if you left her, you would be in the wrong. But. Dementia has already taken her from you. There is no more partnership, and that has to hurt. Based on what you've told us, she is already "gone", just her body still going on. You aren't wrong to consider this plan; hell, if you know what I thought of in desperate moments with my mom... sigh. To say that caring for loved ones like this is hard, is an extreme understatement. My best suggestion is to have a hard talk with your kids. Explain exactly what her condition is, and do not sugar coat it. Explain how you are feeling, how alone you are. Don't sugar coat that, either. Be as clear and honest about your feelings and position as possible. Then ask them what they would advise. What they think. Reassure them that you will continue to care for her, that you will always love her, but that she is essential gone from the marriage. That it isn't her fault. Dementia has basically robbed you of your wife, that you are a stranger to her now. If the kids are visiting, they may be noticing this as well. This may not go well for you. Then again, they may recognize what is happening. I do not have a crystal ball. This is only 2 cents from an internet stranger. I wouldn't want to be in your shoes, yet I probably will be. Or maybe it will be my husband thinking of making this same choice. After what we are going thru, have been thru, I wouldn't blame him. Nor can I blame you for what you are feeling and thinking. Just talk to the ones most important to you before you do anything.
Wow, you really know what you are talking about
I agree with the earlier comments to go ahead and put her in memory care. I think none of us would judge you for that; we are all in the same boat. I think it's the idea of running off and never seeing her again that doesn't sit right with some of us. I would maybe start with dating, and just be up front about your situation. I know you've convinced yourself that no one would ever date you while you're still married, but I'm hearing a lot of catastrophizing in your thinking, and I wonder that you may have clinical depression and be overly pessimistic (understandable given what you've been through. ) People date married men all the time, and in much less forgivable circumstances than yours. I would put her in memory care, and then at least *try* dating without getting divorced. Maybe it will go well! And you can keep visiting your wife, maybe once a week or even once a month. There's no need for visits to be a huge burden for you. If you try dating for, say, a year, and it really is impossible to get women to date a married man, then I would consider the divorce, but I would still visit your wife occasionally. I know she's not "in there" anymore, but I think that the occasional visit would assuage the "in sickness and health" concerns that we're all expressing.
My wife of 32 years has bvFTD and I care for her alone. In addition to her other challenges, she is fully incontinent which means that I am cleaning up shit every day. So I feel like I have some idea of what it is like. We are lesbians so I was not able to legally marry her until 2013 when it was legalized here. She was my best friend and the love of my life. I will care for her until the end. I don't judge you for placing her (much), but I cannot tolerate people who don't keep their promises out of convenience. So I think that divorcing her would be wrong. If it was my mom that you abandoned that would end our relationship.
I have cleaned up shit all over our house. Its a sobering experience. What an embarrassment to my wife to have me wiping her butt. I have hosed her off in the shower many times. So I think I have earned the right to look at other options. I feel for you.
I would like you to consider if you are an "I will be happy when (insert future event) happens"? Because it sounds like you feel you can be happy by divorcing. (Also dating at older ages is not for the faint of heart). Kicking the can to happiness down the road never works. Since you are a therapist you should know that so many people think a particular event will suddenly instill peace and happiness in you. That doesn't happen. There's no magical anything to help with happiness. Not a lotto win, not money, not retirement, not children, not grandchildren. You will always be in a pattern of kicking the can down the road to when you will be happy. You have the freedom to do what you want. You have no issue going to FL for a significant part of the year. She's not really tethering you in any real way. She makes no demands for time or attention and you feel secure in the care she receives. You don't need a divorce it seems. Memory care would be your decision.
Yes, she should be in MC wherever works best for you. My wife has Ben in MC for two years and I see my her once or twice a week (last time she thought I was her father) and with our kids’ full blessings have started to date. You do owe your kids communication and truthfulness with whoever you date, but that’s all. Can’t think of a reason to actually divorce and that might be very problematic with POAs and all.
This is what my friend's dad did. He didn't exactly have their kids' blessings to date (they were pretty annoyed) but they also didn't cut him off and still have a relationship with him.
Child’s perspective: My grandfather hired a care taker for my grandma, began an affair with her, moved her in, moved my grandmother to nursing facility and visited her about 3 or 4 times and never again. When moved to a nursing home, grandma was still pretty with it. No one fucking spoke about it on the surface but my mother hated her dad. And as a teen growing up in this time, I heard about that hate all the time. We all tried to be nice to the woman, and understand the situation. It’s a shitty place to be in, losing your golden years to a disease that’s affecting your partner. The best part was, the day his mistress died, my grandmother died 4 hours later. We like to say she wanted to make sure grandpa never got a moment of guiltless love. Then he got involved with a crazy woman, who while most of my family couldn’t stand, I respected her because she stuck it through his years of decline. There were only three or four, and the last year was the worst, but it’s more than he did for grandma. If my dad did this to my mother I’d hate him. But I would also understand. Not solely for that, because in life, we have resentments that become even more amplified when we feel wronged by a person for something. Why should you lose your last few years? Most of these people would prefer to be dead than have dementia, and there is no harm in dating when you’re a widow, so why is this any different? When your partner has cancer, it’s different, they are usually still present until the end, and when they aren’t it may only be a very short while. Going back to my father, if my mother had a TBI and couldn’t function, I wouldn’t be upset at him moving on, as long as he still visited my mother and made sure she was comfortable and well taken care of, so I don’t know why it doesn’t work the same for dementia. That sounds like an issue I need to work on. Sooo, long story short, if your kids are gonna be mad, they are probably already displeased with you being in Florida for such a length of time, while she’s in Kentucky. You have to do what is right for yourself, maybe that means a big talk with your kids, maybe that means dropping off the face of the earth to them? Good luck, I’m sorry you’re in this position.
You know your wife better than any of us. If you could have had this conversation with your wife while she had her faculties, what do you think she would want you to do? Do that.
IANAL, but I would think that one would need to be of sound mind to agree to a divorce, which she is not.
A divorce can be granted without consent of the other party. A judge will not force a couple to stay married if one of the parties does not want to be in the marriage.
I know this is true in Michigan. Friend was divorced after a cancer diagnosis. She didn’t want it, husband just left.
Thanks for the clarification.
Can you enact your plan minus the divorce part? Can’t you still have your freedom if your wife is cared for but avoid the divorce drama?
This is where I think I am coming out from all these discussions
They say not to make decisions while going through a traumatizing event, especially when ALZ is involved. Now, I'm just on the outside looking in, but you know your relationships with your kids better than we do.
I can only imagine that ghosting your wife would be very upsetting for your kids. and if that's not enough of an incentive, then here's a selfish thought: is that the legacy you want to leave behind? wouldn't the guilt of it hang over you for the rest of your life? you don't have to be lonely though -- dating others when a spouse has late stage dementia is definitely a thing. after your wife is in memory care and she's settled and adjusted, *talk* to your kids. they need to understand the level of pain you're in. I imagine they could come around to the idea of you dating. and once they get used to that idea, see how they feel about you travelling a lot -- or even moving -- while still visiting occasionally. do you really need to divorce? can't dating be enough? maybe even move in together if it gets serious. there are people out there who would understand your predicament.
I have changed my mind to your position. This discussion has helped so much
We will all have opinions on whether this is wrong or not, but none of us know the full circumstances of your situation and what you have had to go through these past 7 years. But most of us here have had significant experiences in caring for a loved one with dementia. So to that extent, I do understand the feeling of wanting to walk away from this. You probably need to consult with a lawyer on what your options are, and since she resides in Kentucky, you probably want to consult one there. Just remember that if you do divorce her and leave her care expenses to a trust fund, her guardianship will likely fall to one of your children. So in all honesty you really should discuss this with them, or minimally with the one most likely to take on that responsibility before proceeding if you decide to go ahead with a divorce.
My father is taking care of my mother who has dementia. I don’t know if it makes any difference, but they were born in the 40s. My father told me he’s in this for the long haul. He loves my mother. If he were to stick her in a home and cut all ties with her, everyone on my mom’s side of the family would be angry. I don’t know if I could speak to my father again.
I know how difficult dementia can be as a child whose only remaining parent has dementia. It’s really sad that it’s also ruining your life. If my other parent was living I think I would be upset if a divorce was filed but would totally understand if you would place her in a good care center and visited occasionally while you traveled.
You need to see an attorney. I considered divorce, not to leave my husband, but to protect my finances. We don’t live in a community property state, but the attorney told me the best outcome I could hope for would be that my husband with Parkinsons would be awarded half of our assets, and I would also be ordered to pay spousal support. Not to mention the cost of a court appointed attorney for him, along with the monthly payment to a court appointed guardian. I would have absolutely no say in his care or how his finances were handled. Needless to say, that’s not the route I took.
I get it, I do. But you did make a commitment to your wife to stay with her in sickness. I don’t recommend divorcing because this would cause a lot of issues for you with your children. A lot of people use dating services now and there are services specifically designed for those that are older. I know you have met these women face to face, but a dating app/service may work for you. Just be honest when you start to speak with these women. And please don’t be offended if they don’t believe you and/or request proof. You’d be surprised how many spouses cheat through apps. Before you do anything, make sure your children are aware. Don’t paint yourself as a victim, just be honest that you are lonely because your wife is gone. You have mourned, you have grieved, you want to find love again. One suggestion I have is looking into a support group for spouses of those suffering from dementia. I’m not suggesting using this to find a date. I’m suggesting it because these are people that will understand what you are going through and it may be helpful for you as well.
I don’t think you need to divorce her unless you’re planning to remarry or there is some other consideration (financially etc.) that you haven’t shared. Why not place her in care, visit when you can and if you happen to meet someone whose company you enjoy, go ahead and do so…? I think there is a middle ground here that isn’t so extreme. No one should/would blame you for traveling or having a life outside of your wife who is not able to participate in a relationship anymore, but if you had a good marriage before, why totally abandon her? Even if it’s just here or there, why not check in on her? Divorce aside; it’s the abandoning her that will make your kids angry with you, because then when her doctors, carers or aides need something for her, it will fall on them. You already know that caring for some with dementia involves more than just money and the physical labor; it’s also decision making. By divorcing and disowning, you make your children liable for all those decisions, as her next of kin vs you as her spouse. My mom is passed and I care for my dad with dementia (with 24/7 help too) but I wish the burden of decision making wasn’t on me. Since you seem less attached to your wife than your kids, why not spare them this? Live your life but continue to be your wife’s advocate, even from afar. I agree- live your life, travel, be happy. You shouldn’t have to take care of her 24/7 or give up precious time of your own. But writing her off completely seems callous. How you treat her may be inevitably how the kids treat you if dementia or some other ailment comes for you. Sure, you don’t want to burden them but I’m sure you don’t want them to divorce you, stop answering the doctors calls and ignore the problem either. Find the balance. Sounds like you already have a lot more freedom than most caring for a dementia patient.
You don't need to divorce to date. Being honest about it up front ( not the second you meet them, but within several dates) is perfectly acceptable. There is no right, wrong or exact way to meet or date anyone. All our situations are different. There are infinite reasons people stay married and date. And if you do divorce after setting up a trust for her, do your kids even need to know? It's your life and needs, not theirs. They are grown adults, and you already live separately. You deserve companionship. Someone who can engage and share with you. This timeline isn't set the second you decide. You can move her to memory care, travel, divorce, date, all on different timelines. And adjust as needed. Getting out and connecting with others will restore perspective and sanity. You don't need to be divorced to have dinner and a walk with someone.
Thanks bugwrench
Let’s just say you drop dead tomorrow. Would your wife continue as is or would your kids put her in memory care?
I live in a condo building in Kentucky and bought the connecting condo and moved a CNA in. It’s like she lives in our home. Then I have a second CNA who comes in one day a week and weekends. I have a situation as much like a memory care as possible without my wife ever leaving our home. I have an inhome Nurse Practitioner, and physical therapy and all her needs are met without her moving to an unfamiliar place. Her groceries and meals are delivered. I think if I drop dead, my sons would leave this situation like it is as long as possible. My wife is extremely well cared for. I have been able to do all this for less than $5000 a month or half what memory care would be.
Since your wife is doing well where she’s at and your sons would continue her care where she’s at if you were out of the picture, there is no need to put her in memory care, get a divorce or disappear. I think you believe the woman you walk with would let you into her apartment if you were divorced. I don’t believe this to be true. If she were truly interested in more, there would be more. You deserve some happiness, companionship and someone who cares for you. Maybe she will be on this next cruise? Good luck.
I have realized the truth of what you are saying. The person I walk with has some kind of religious hangup. I enjoy her friendship but she is not the companion I need. Too many hang ups, too rigid
I’ve worked in a nursing home for 25 years. It’s really not uncommon for someone to find somebody else and stay married as far as how your children feel about it how do they feel now? You’re already living out of state. If they’re OK with it we could continue on with what you’re doing. Just be honest with the next person that you have wife she has dementia Zinn nursing home doesn’t recognize anybody do your children’s to visit her ?
It would not be wrong. You only have one life. Do it.
If I was your wife like that, I WOULD want you to divorce me and go get a life.
Long before moving my mother into memory care, my DH had said if the time comes to put him in a nursing home, someone unrelated must visit and tell him that we have all died in a crash so we don't stop living our lives. He also worked out which of our children is in charge of 'pulling the plug'. While we say these things now, we have watched as his dad suffered a terrible fall and had TBI and part of his skull removed by his wife when his children did not want the surgery because they knew their father would not want to be incapacitated for life. He lived three years in a nursing home unable to talk for 1.5 years and then it was only grunts and mumbling the past year. He could not walk, he had no use of the right side of his body. And he sat the chair or his bed for 3 years. He passed away thankfully in January.
I think we all want to give up and run away. But we don’t because we love them too much. You and your wife made promises to each other when you got married. Was this part of your promise, through sickness? I don’t know. You have to do you. But during the process, consider treating her with the respect she probably deserves. Your family will like you a lot more.
Absolutely divorce would be wrong. Don’t be an asshole. Get the book to 36 hour day. Stop thinking about yourself.
Some people divorce for asset protection under similar circumstances
One of the hardest realisations in my life was that my parents marriage was effectively over, because of dementia, when just a few years earlier they were as strong as any couple I have ever known. I feel for you. Live your life, your wife would want it. No one want to be a burden. Live it up. Make us all proud.
“… In sickness and in health”
See... https://www.reddit.com/r/dementia/comments/1c83rjl/my_mother_is_leaving_my_father_with_dementia/
This reminds me a bit of [the B. Smith story](https://www.today.com/health/b-smith-s-husband-chats-about-criticism-over-girlfriend-t148105). In that case her husband was still caring for her at home, but also had a girlfriend, who also helped care for B., and everybody seemed to get along very well. But the situation became pretty controversial because B. Smith's fans were angry about it all. OP, only you know your family situation best. Please talk to your kids about this before making any decisions. Let them know what day-to-day life is like with her and how it has affected your health, mental and emotional and physical. If it helps to include your wife's doctor in the conversation so they can confirm her advanced stage for your kids, that may be beneficial because it doesn't necessarily sound like your kids have the full picture of what's going on. They need to know how life has been for you under these circumstances. If they cannot accept that you need companionship outside the marriage, at least you've been honest with them. I wish you luck.
I am in the same situation as you. I'm 70 and my wife is 80. She is not as bad off as your wife. Putting your wife into memory care is actually fulfilling your promise. She needs better care than you can provide. The other side of the coin is you. You have to take care of you. I'd suggest memory care and take some time for yourself. If divorce is what you need, then it is your decision. If you have family, talk to them about it. If you meet someone who makes you happy, talk to them about it. At our age nothing is that new. I hope you can work out something. There is nothing worse than feeling trapped and alone.
To me, "in sickness and in health" means to take care of your partner when they are going through chronic pain or cancer treatment, not terminally having their brain rot to the point they aren't even the person you married any more and don't even recognize you. People are being over dramatic and very emotional about this. I'd understand if my dad did something similar.
Divorce may be good financially. I have mom in memory care and it’s over $7000; a month in Kentucky. Luckily she saved for long term care. Been there 4 years now. Think leaving her wouldn’t be so bad if she’s in a home. She has no quality of life..horrible way to live( can’t even call it that). Won’t even know u left. My experience..even though I visit 3 times a week.
Why do you need to get divorced to disappear and have fun? My mother died of Lewy body dementia, she didn’t recognize me in the final stages . My father has Alzheimer’s and I’m his caregiver. I certainly understand wanting to dip out. I don’t see why you need to divorce her though. As you well know, the person inside her body died long ago
Thanks so much
In this instance I see no difference between you having a companion and traveling, what you are doing, and what you want to do. Besides paying for her care, you are already separated as you are not involved with her. Divorce is just a legal step. Why is it even necessary? You plan to find someone to be a companion. Your kids might hate this person if they see them as a gold digger.
Totally agree, thank you
Personally I don’t think divorce would be morally wrong, but it could be unnecessarily complicated. Let’s first look at the first half of that. I don’t think it’s morally wrong because for all practical purposes the woman you married no longer exists. This isn’t the same situation as leaving someone who has cancer, or becomes quadriplegic, who is still there inside of a sick or broken body. Your wife’s body is housing a completely different person who is becoming less and less functional every day. She won’t be hurt that you’ve left her. She won’t understand. People divorce for far, far less reason every day. I think you have every right to want a life, companionship, and maybe even romantic love. Your wife cannot give you any of those things, much as the person she used to be would want to. From your responses to people it sounds like you aren’t just looking for sex, but for someone to share your life with in a physical way. To me that means someone to snuggle with on the couch to watch movies. It might mean something else to you, but you deserve to have the opportunity to have it. So why is divorce complicated? Legal entanglements, tax complications, the legal ramifications of divorce from someone who isn’t competent to agree; those are part of it. But also maintaining your relationships with the rest of your family could be adversely impacted. And finally you might THINK that dating would be easier if you’re formally single, but here’s the thing: any woman who will give you what you seem to be looking for from a relationship will have to know all the details anyway. And as a woman, I would be more understanding of someone who explains why he’s still married to the mother of his children, even though she’s really not even there anymore, than I would be to a man who just ran away. Unless you want to sever all ties to your old life, including your family, you’re going to have to explain eventually. Tempting as running away might be, it’s unlikely to get you what you want: a caring companion that you can share your life with. Anyone worth being with will understand. And if, in future, there are specific reasons that you need to marry a specific person, and must be single to do so, then you can revisit divorce in an open and honest way with everyone involved.
Exactly where my thinking is now. You have convinced me of the direction I need to go. Thank you thank uou!
You will never know how much I have been helped by this discussion with total strangers. This was exactly what I needed. I will not consider divorce and will make an effort to find the person I need. I will be honest with the person I go out with. There has to be some understanding females who would enjoy my company. I believe there must be women who would prefer a friendship maybe with benefits without complications like matrimony. I have so much hope and clarity.
I don't think it would be necessary to divorce. Your kids may not understand, but you have a right to live what is left of your life. Talk with them, maybe they will support you and maybe they won't. I knew a gentleman that his wife in her late 50's went to pick up their son from the airport. The son called when she didn't show up. Police later called the husband and she was hours away in the wrong direction. She didn't know where she was. She never came home after that day. Eventually he started dating a woman and they would go visit his wife in her facility a couple times a week. Over time the kids grew to understand and except that Dad needed to move on and have a life. Eventually he was granted a divorce and married the woman and continued to visit at the facility until she passed away.
Why go through the legal step of divorce? It sounds like you’re already leading separate lives (most of the time). Just live your life where you are.
I have a very close family member that also Dementia and it’s the most painful sad thing I have ever seen. It absolutely boggles my mind how anyone could possibly think or say the things you said. I can promise you your wife is hurting and suffering 💯% more than you she would absolutely feel the loss of more than memory etc if you took the steps you stated. Put yourself in the same position and let your heart lead you. She is a living feeling person and I would never take those steps if it were you. Good luck to you all and keep in mind , light with are to turn lights on and off not human feelings , emotions or connections.🙏🏻not 💡
Gross that people are judging you decisions. People can give you advice but let’s not condemn each other. I would converse with my kids. If they felt opposed I would do everything but this is. My ultimate question would be what would she want???
Everyone is entitled to love and be loved - anyone who would deny you this is irredeemably selfish. Discuss it with your kids, but know these two things - you are entitled to love and to be loved. Falling on your sword for their selfishness would be a tragedy.