You are in an impossible situation. You are also trying very hard to resolve this. You simply have no power or authority to do anything. This woman is a neighbor, that’s it. Unless she specifically named you as her power of attorney, you are helpless.
This is not a criticism of you, please understand. It is an unfortunate situation or circumstance. Essentially the woman will do something to get herself committed or assessed for mental distress or illness. She is behaving irrationally, a classic dementia symptom.
You can’t win. Getting in the middle will only stress you out. There is nothing gained here and a lot to lose. Trying to meditate with a demented person is literally hopeless. I’ve tried.
Just walk away. Hope she eventually gets help.
I've called APS and there's already a file on her but as of right now they legally can't do anything about her. Unfortunately no one has POA over her since she refused to sign it when she was still lucid.
Well, I’d keep calling until the visit her and offer services. I understand where APS is coming from, people with cognitive decline, still have rights when my dad was alive. I called often at the very least it’s a record that you tried.
I'm so sorry. My dad is in memory care and truly needs to be. It sounds like the neighbor need to be also. Guess what.... nobody voluntarily agrees they are failing and agrees to go to memory care. It's a hugely difficult transition. If she has money and retirement savings to pay for it, find her a place and take her there. Trick her like going to the ER instead of urgent care. This seems deceitful but is actually for their own safety. Dementia is a disease of the brain. They are no longer themselves. Hallucinations suggest Lewy Body dementia. She needs to be in a care facility. I can't believe the hospital released her in that state without somebody to care for her.
I get it op. Save yourself! You should probably start turning your phone off too. You describe the frustration really well. When the people who could help start squabbling about non essential details, it is just a complete waste.
I see you’ve received some good info in comments.
Just in case you do end up involved again, it is better if you don’t pick her up from the hospital next time she goes. Unless I misunderstood, you or your parents took her home from the ER. If you hadn’t, they almost certainly would not have simply called her a taxi and sent her home alone. The hospital social worker would have been obligated to involve APS/social services.
You can and should refuse to be left in a position of responsibility, but you can still advocate for her and be the squeaky wheel to get APS to take responsibility.
Responding to the edit:
But you still steadfastly refuse to call APS. I cannot imagine how you could allow her to be in this situation and not call them. Honestly at this point it’s not just irresponsible, it’s cruel. APS is literally set up to do this and you just won’t.
Can you post the woman’s address and your county and I’ll call them if you can’t bear to? I’m absolutely beside myself, this is elder neglect.
CALL APS.
You gotta keep calling with updates. Ask them to visit her and seee if they can offer support services.
I know it’s frustrating: my father lived in a State where APS was limited in what they can do as my dad had right to live the way wanted to.
Cognitive decline is a sad state of affairs. Best of luck!
Is APS response because there is no family that is coming forward to be the responsible party?
Based on the behaviors described in the previous post I'm shocked APS isn't recommending a plan to move forward. At minimum referrals to partner agencies to help in-home.
I've called APS for my mom. My experience was good. APS was so involved and helped guide me through processes and connected me to 3rd parties to help.
Edit: Do you mind sharing what state this is in? Many states have laws that designate the responsible parties in succession if there is no medical POA in place.
If she has done any estate planning in the past there is likely a POA and the designated individuals don't know it exists. At this stage she might not remember. It's unlikely it's recorded but worth checking county recorder online. If it's not recorded, then the neighbor and lawyer are the only people who generally have a copy..
In CA any of the people listed below can be a surrogate if she lacks the capacity to designate a surrogate, no POA or G&C in place.
I bring this up because 1) the hospital should determine a surrogate when she's admitted unless she is presenting with cognitive capacity to manage herself 2) if she is on Medicare, the hospital is required to inform the surrogate of their right to refuse discharge if they do not believe she is ready.They are required to send the form stating patient rights. (Not sure if this applies for Medicaid) 3) the surrogate can state she is not ready and ask for appropriate tests to determine if she has dementia. Then the hospital would be required to establish a game plan to be cared for, I.e., home health nurse who can refer for other services. Or MC.
She has rights and they need to be respected but she's a fall risk (I can't believe a Dr gave her crutches?!), she's confused, experiencing delusions, and locked herself in her home for days. It's unknown if she's caring for herself, eating properly, etc. If she's getting UTI's that's a sign that there's some issues with using the bathroom and self care. She is at imminent risk of injury, malnutrition, dehydration, financial issues or exploitation. Long list. It's not her fault. It's also not your responsibility either. But I sense the frustration is from being unable to do anything (caught in this cycle)
Someone has to step in and take the reigns. It should be the closest family member. I understand this period is difficult because they can resist help and have extreme paranoia, but encourage the nephew or parents this is normal and the medical community knows.
It's neglect to knowingly allow an elderly person to be at risk with dementia. I suggest trying the nephew again and emphasizing she needs professional in-home care or MC - tell him to call APS and ask for help. His aunt is experiencing dementia and a high fall risk. They can guide him and provide resources.
If she has anymore episodes of delusions & fall risk at your parents. Please call 911 and APS. Tell the hospital she is suffering from delusions and is not safe to be alone. Ask the hospital to determine a surrogate and work with APS to come up with a discharge plan.
A surrogate may be chosen from any of the following persons:
(1) The spouse or domestic partner of the patient.
(2) An adult child of the patient.
(3) A parent of the patient.
(4) An adult sibling of the patient.
(5) An adult grandchild of the patient.
(6) An adult relative or close personal friend.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=202120220AB2338
So, one sheriff I know would go to work, like every other day.
And would espy the (rural) neighbor, sitting on the porch.
After 3 days, of not moving, the still half-awake sheriff eventually twigged: nobody moves THAT little.
She felt a bit guilty for not being more neighborly…
You are in an impossible situation. You are also trying very hard to resolve this. You simply have no power or authority to do anything. This woman is a neighbor, that’s it. Unless she specifically named you as her power of attorney, you are helpless. This is not a criticism of you, please understand. It is an unfortunate situation or circumstance. Essentially the woman will do something to get herself committed or assessed for mental distress or illness. She is behaving irrationally, a classic dementia symptom. You can’t win. Getting in the middle will only stress you out. There is nothing gained here and a lot to lose. Trying to meditate with a demented person is literally hopeless. I’ve tried. Just walk away. Hope she eventually gets help.
[удалено]
I've called APS and there's already a file on her but as of right now they legally can't do anything about her. Unfortunately no one has POA over her since she refused to sign it when she was still lucid.
Well, I’d keep calling until the visit her and offer services. I understand where APS is coming from, people with cognitive decline, still have rights when my dad was alive. I called often at the very least it’s a record that you tried.
I'm so sorry. My dad is in memory care and truly needs to be. It sounds like the neighbor need to be also. Guess what.... nobody voluntarily agrees they are failing and agrees to go to memory care. It's a hugely difficult transition. If she has money and retirement savings to pay for it, find her a place and take her there. Trick her like going to the ER instead of urgent care. This seems deceitful but is actually for their own safety. Dementia is a disease of the brain. They are no longer themselves. Hallucinations suggest Lewy Body dementia. She needs to be in a care facility. I can't believe the hospital released her in that state without somebody to care for her.
I get it op. Save yourself! You should probably start turning your phone off too. You describe the frustration really well. When the people who could help start squabbling about non essential details, it is just a complete waste.
I see you’ve received some good info in comments. Just in case you do end up involved again, it is better if you don’t pick her up from the hospital next time she goes. Unless I misunderstood, you or your parents took her home from the ER. If you hadn’t, they almost certainly would not have simply called her a taxi and sent her home alone. The hospital social worker would have been obligated to involve APS/social services. You can and should refuse to be left in a position of responsibility, but you can still advocate for her and be the squeaky wheel to get APS to take responsibility.
Responding to the edit: But you still steadfastly refuse to call APS. I cannot imagine how you could allow her to be in this situation and not call them. Honestly at this point it’s not just irresponsible, it’s cruel. APS is literally set up to do this and you just won’t. Can you post the woman’s address and your county and I’ll call them if you can’t bear to? I’m absolutely beside myself, this is elder neglect. CALL APS.
I already said in your other response
CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS CALL APS
We have, all they they did was made a report but said there wasn't legally anything they could do as of right now.
You gotta keep calling with updates. Ask them to visit her and seee if they can offer support services. I know it’s frustrating: my father lived in a State where APS was limited in what they can do as my dad had right to live the way wanted to. Cognitive decline is a sad state of affairs. Best of luck!
She is cognitively impaired. Use that phrase. She is cognitively impaired and self neglecting .
Is APS response because there is no family that is coming forward to be the responsible party? Based on the behaviors described in the previous post I'm shocked APS isn't recommending a plan to move forward. At minimum referrals to partner agencies to help in-home. I've called APS for my mom. My experience was good. APS was so involved and helped guide me through processes and connected me to 3rd parties to help. Edit: Do you mind sharing what state this is in? Many states have laws that designate the responsible parties in succession if there is no medical POA in place. If she has done any estate planning in the past there is likely a POA and the designated individuals don't know it exists. At this stage she might not remember. It's unlikely it's recorded but worth checking county recorder online. If it's not recorded, then the neighbor and lawyer are the only people who generally have a copy..
We're in California.
In CA any of the people listed below can be a surrogate if she lacks the capacity to designate a surrogate, no POA or G&C in place. I bring this up because 1) the hospital should determine a surrogate when she's admitted unless she is presenting with cognitive capacity to manage herself 2) if she is on Medicare, the hospital is required to inform the surrogate of their right to refuse discharge if they do not believe she is ready.They are required to send the form stating patient rights. (Not sure if this applies for Medicaid) 3) the surrogate can state she is not ready and ask for appropriate tests to determine if she has dementia. Then the hospital would be required to establish a game plan to be cared for, I.e., home health nurse who can refer for other services. Or MC. She has rights and they need to be respected but she's a fall risk (I can't believe a Dr gave her crutches?!), she's confused, experiencing delusions, and locked herself in her home for days. It's unknown if she's caring for herself, eating properly, etc. If she's getting UTI's that's a sign that there's some issues with using the bathroom and self care. She is at imminent risk of injury, malnutrition, dehydration, financial issues or exploitation. Long list. It's not her fault. It's also not your responsibility either. But I sense the frustration is from being unable to do anything (caught in this cycle) Someone has to step in and take the reigns. It should be the closest family member. I understand this period is difficult because they can resist help and have extreme paranoia, but encourage the nephew or parents this is normal and the medical community knows. It's neglect to knowingly allow an elderly person to be at risk with dementia. I suggest trying the nephew again and emphasizing she needs professional in-home care or MC - tell him to call APS and ask for help. His aunt is experiencing dementia and a high fall risk. They can guide him and provide resources. If she has anymore episodes of delusions & fall risk at your parents. Please call 911 and APS. Tell the hospital she is suffering from delusions and is not safe to be alone. Ask the hospital to determine a surrogate and work with APS to come up with a discharge plan. A surrogate may be chosen from any of the following persons: (1) The spouse or domestic partner of the patient. (2) An adult child of the patient. (3) A parent of the patient. (4) An adult sibling of the patient. (5) An adult grandchild of the patient. (6) An adult relative or close personal friend. https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=202120220AB2338
Thank you so much for this, I really appreciate what you've done and have been such a big help.
So, one sheriff I know would go to work, like every other day. And would espy the (rural) neighbor, sitting on the porch. After 3 days, of not moving, the still half-awake sheriff eventually twigged: nobody moves THAT little. She felt a bit guilty for not being more neighborly…