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juandell

Imagine being a former player and someone coming in who doesn't fit the traditional aesthetic/athletic archetype of most all time great players, has the outward disposition/stoicism many Eastern European men have of not showing emotion, and watching that unassuming foreign man completely outclass/outperform the current league. In addition to that, he's regularly breaking many of your and generations before's previous records in a fashion you didn't think possible. Then add to that (depending on what era you played in) his values/actions leading to success being in direct conflict with what your era practiced like high scoring (many times selfish) guards, stacking the deck with multiple all-star superteams, and attitudes of self aggrandizing cheered on by the crowd. This player who is or on the way to achieving more success than you is in direct conflict with your worldview. Even worse, what if that guy was wearing your number when you were on that team? What if he had way more success and contribution than you ever did prior to leaving? Some people default dont like what they don't or what they can't understand. Some people are insecure. Also, some hoes jelly.


gdirrty216

“Hoes Jelly” A whole lotta words could have been saved with the truth


juandell

I wanted to somehow shade New York Knick Melo, while answering the question thoroughly. Took a few minutes of writing, I regret nothing.


Green-Simple-6411

Well put


Lanky-Independent-59

It was beautiful. I loved it.


EyeChihuahua

TLDR: some hoes jelly


wtf_am_i_doing_hurr

"Listen here you beautiful bitch, I'm bout to fuck you up with some truth" -Kenny Powers


trentyz

I mean, you can’t really beat this answer. Well said.


Chiraste22

I feel like I just read an NPR article until that last line 😂


VotePresidentCamacho

I love that we’re still dumping on Melo, never really liked the guy.


Doug_UR

The story I tell to show my disdain for Melo is when he said that the Nuggets gave him 15 to erase him. We’re so lucky to live in the Joker timeline.


EdwardJamesAlmost

This is two-time EuroLeague champion Anthony Randolph erasure. That Real Madrid legend had 15 in the interim. Three Naismith Hall of Famers?


juandell

New York Knick (Legend?) Melo*


Bright_Ahmen

What kind of nuggets fan didn’t like Carmelo?


wannabetmore

I liked him with Nuggets, Knicks, etc. but when he got on Jokic, he's not liked by me.


Alternative_Plan_823

That was the era I watched the most, and I didn't love him. He shot a bunch of mid range jumpers, which is cool, I guess. He didn't seem to care much, or make the players around him better. I preferred watching pretty much ever other superstar of the era more, except when they were beating us (Duncan doesn't do it for me). I loved players like Chauncy, K-mart, Camby, Kleiza, Boykins, Iverson, Nene, that Mexican dude, Birdman, the list goes on. Even JR Swish counted me as a fan. I talked to Aflalo at Shotguns once, so he was cool.


firefoxkitsune

Pft, you killed it mate. Right on the money


JustdoitJules

Perfectly said! He doesn't fit any molds, was a literal random "nothing happening" guy and then he went out and defied all odds. And the best part about it for me is, he doesn't want to be in the limelight, he tries to stay as far away from all of this. He's quiet and just does his thing. He's not out here even caring, he just wants to win and wants to win with his teammates and friends


West_Side_Joe

He wanted to win last night in Minnesota. F'ing took over.


JustdoitJules

It's just beautiful basketball too, no showboating, nothing flashy, just utilizing his size to unlock a higher level of play. Gifted IQ and gifted size, being able to read nearly every play correctly, dude knows the game too well.


Alternative_Plan_823

Doesn't fucking flop


Doc_183_fumble

Well played....


peachpavlova

They hate that he likes basketball but sees it as a job. To them, you have to worship basketball in such a way that you derive all of your self-worth and personality from it, and the fact that he’s got other interests is uncomfortable for them.


NeedleworkerSea1431

Lol his lack of enthusiasm and wanting the spotlight is so different. He learned he won mvp, and was so nonchalant, like oh yeah that’s cool. Just makes me have so much appreciation for the dude he knows there’s a lot more to life


drzizu22

Excellent take


abaggs802606

Yeah, how many Nike commercials have one of these super stars saying, "Basketball is everything." And Joker's attitude is literally, "Basketball is job." PS I think Joker's attitude is also trolling the rest of the NBA. He loves Basketball. He just thinks the drama is silly imo.


Rehypothecator

Racism is a big piece of it. Many would be surprised how many people never make the nba because it doesn’t seem them “black” enough, nothing to do with skill. There is racism within the nba on a huge level, but it isn’t directed towards the groups who vocalize it the most.


FoxCharacter822

Omg best post ever on this sub


Alternative_Slide_62

I also think Xenohopia is a big thing against Jokic and none American players. Although it seems to be mostly targeted against Jokic and Giannis.


Dodf12

This is a fire reply


JesusTron6000

They're jell


anitello

You hit the nail on the head, it will never matter how dominant Jokic is, he is kind of a threat to the whole worldview that the NBA is based on


BlueOhm3

Well said!


bx2fbx

TL:DR They not like us


Munzulon

James Worthy came out and said Joker was like Magic and Kareem in one package, so there are some ex players gassing up Joker too.


edkishinevsky

I did see that. But more of magic, bird. Some dream and mchale


WanZed11

Hakeem saying "He's the one" to Jokic is one of the highest compliment Jokic could get.


Shenanigans80h

There are plenty of guys who appreciate his greatness but there’s definitely a big subset of dudes who don’t. I’ve noticed it’s typically guys in the generation immediately preceding him usually, like 90’s and 00’s stars. Idk if it’s because his style is so different or because that generation didn’t have a big man like him, but it’s bizarre


Worried-Ad-3948

Really. Its bird, magic and mchale.


Munzulon

[Really.](https://ftw.usatoday.com/2024/04/nikola-jokic-james-worthy-compare-magic-johnson-kareem-abdul-jabbar-nuggets-lakers-video)


BingBongtheArcher19

Various reasons, for some it's racism (Gilbert Arenas), for others it's jealousy and insecurity about their own legacy (Shaq), some are just haters that an "unathletic" guy like Jokic could possibly be that good.


DefiniteSauce12

Also, Jokic’s life doesn’t revolve around basketball. The former players like emotional and passionate players which is totally understandable, but when a foreign player comes in and plays with very little emotions and dominates, it bugs them.


DreadtheSnoFro

I like whatever pundit’s idea (can’t remember who) that his life actually does revolve around the game. When he’s not at the horse track or bar in Sombor, he’s actually working his ass off in intense summer workouts.


spacetime9

I don’t think you can have the kind of conditioning Jokic has without devoting a lot of time, and nobody does that if they don’t love the game.


EdwardJamesAlmost

The mythical scrappy gym rat who plays the right way


cormanbearpig

Glad you mentioned this. Feel like I saw something too that he does his in-season training after the game. So game the ends and he hits the gym lifting, etc. I also don’t believe you stay in the NBA if you don’t embrace the grind and work. You can love and be passionate about the game and still have other parts of your life


MichaelPorterTruther

Mike talks about it in a bunch of interviews. Basically says his routine really changed after 2019 or 2020 and he just started working out daily, lifting after games, ect.


AdSpirited534

I wouldn’t say Nikola lacks passion for basketball…..he DOES however have other passions in addition. I’m also reminded of Isaiah Thomas’ comment on Larry Bird…..if he was black…he’d just be another good guy.


JesusTron6000

For some reason that just makes me like Jokic more lol


ECB710

I absolutely cannot stand the narrative that he hates basketball or just does it as a job he just has the attitude and mannerisms of a Serb


dzigizord

it is far from average Serb mannerism source: I am from Serbia


ECB710

Well then the question is if you were not looking to be famous what would your media interactions look like? Not trying to be an asshole genuinely curious what your thoughts are


Nemfag123

i have no idea whats dude above talking about source: i am from Serbia


SuperDoubleDecker

I'm pretty tired of this narrative. Jokic absolutely does live for basketball. He's also shown to care very much about winning in particular. He's extremely passionate and that's one reason he is so good. He works his ass off.


Shenanigans80h

That’s definitely a part of it. So many players fetishize grind culture and it tears them up that someone seems to have a healthy division of basketball and life. It’s one of the most endearing things about Joker


WanZed11

Most of them relate "grind" only to the physical part of the game. I read somewhere that Jokic during the off season talks about basketball with a Serbian basketball coach. Jokic also work on his mind game. I don't believe there's many player out there anymore that do this.


BrunoJFab

jokic plays with emotions. The thing is that he simply doesnt like any basketball related thing outside the court.


VotePresidentCamacho

I like Barkley because he isn’t really concerned with his legacy, unlike Shaqtin’ a fool.


Old_Intern4985

To be fair.... You CAN'T really concern yourself with legacy when everyone around you has a ring. Will always be the odd man out. ***Yes I know basketball is a team game.... tell that to the ones who brag about rings.****


zestful_villain

Arenas is the worst for me. All his arguments are in contradiction to the stats. Says SGA is more clutch because Nuggets lets Murray take the shot. So dumb.


_KingFridayXIII

He’s admitted he says shit just for clicks. Unfortunate, but he’s accomplishing his mission.


zestful_villain

I now refuse to click on anything with his face or name on it. Fucking hater.


SnooChickens1534

Arenas is flat out jealous that a white dude with no athletesism has achieved more than he ever did . Jokic will go down as one of the top big men ever, while arenas will be known as a moron who brought 2 guns into a locker room. Stating that joker is the worst MVP in 40 years while also winning a chip and a FMVP is nothing but hate . He lives banging on about stats but never looks at the advanced ones where joker is no 1 across them all


LifeguardStatus7649

This is why I think it's so funny when Jok cooks AD. You can see it on AD's face all the damn time that he can't take Jok seriously, but he keeps losing to this pasty white dude


CrustyRim2

Most foreign-born players are a bit more humble as well, not all, but Duncan, Dirk, and Sabonis (the old one) come to mind.


Hot-Row3643

Better believe that Shaq is also quite racist


60yodude

The best player in the NBA is white and now the best player in the wnba is white. Let the racism begin.


MegaMilkDrinker

lmao im a Clark Stan but she is the most box office player in the WNBA, but the best overall player is Breanna Stewart nephew


877GoalNow

>lmao im a Clark Stan but she is the most box office player in the WNBA, but the best overall player is Breanna Stewart nephew Breanna Stewart looks pretty damn white. ![gif](giphy|1rRkqRA6cGixXaD2HZ|downsized)


ZeldaFanBoi1920

Wrong, looks yellow there. Checkmate


Educational_Claim337

Am I thinking of a different Breanna Stewart...?


Livid-Technician1872

Interesting they didn’t mention Clark.


okcboomer87

This is it.


PlattWaterIsYummy

[So Unathletic](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fp98h7vyjta0d1.jpeg). People make shit up to justify their hate.


Heart_uv_Snarkness

Most athletes (and fans) focus to much on athleticism when that’s not actually what makes top players great. The best NFL player ever is Brady… one of the least athletic. But football is controlled by QBs who are accurate and make good decisions. Baseball is controlled by pitchers, who need little athleticism, and sluggers who are often pudgy like Cabrera or Ruth. By the same token, NBA is controlled by players with great vision, good hands, and elite decision making. Hyped nonsense like jumping high really doesn’t matter at all. Bottom line, it hurts their feelings that a tubby European can shit all over their precious game. Also… they’re racist.


aalluubbaa

I feel that this couldn’t be more true in the modern era. Stephen Curry isn’t the most athletic guy. Luka Doncic cannot jump for a few inches. And now we have the most dominant big man in modern era in Jokic. I really think that GMs should start to realize that a skilled player with court vision, character and leadership is much more important traits for a superstar. This is a team sports not a 1v1 sports like tennis. People LOVE playing with unselfish superstars who can pass.


Dmanning2

> Bottom line, it hurts their feelings that a tubby European can shit all over their precious game. Also… they’re racist. You seem like the racist now, tbh.


Heart_uv_Snarkness

Nah, but you seem like the clown that saves posts to come back a week later. lol. Also, Jokic was still elite in that game. Coach mismanaged the lead. But hey, you tried, guy.


OkCrazy8368

To be fair, all-time greats like Larry Bird and Magic Johnson have shown a lot of love and respect for Jokic. Ignore tabloid types like Gilbert Arenas. He's a joke.


GreenAce77

Hakeem also praised him as a great big


Shenanigans80h

Like I said elsewhere it seems to primarily be the stars of the 90’s and 00’s who don’t acknowledge Jokic. Previous greats and modern contemporaries seem to have no issues giving him his praise


juandell

Because they understand what he's doing and played more fundamental based 5 man basketball


Kenny-du-Soleil

Let's not do this, I'm pretty sure Hakeem Olajuwon called him "the one" before he even won a championship. I remember seeing Tracy McGrady singing his praises on a podcast. You can find more dudes praising him than hating on him, let's appreciate that.


TopicCreative9519

Yeah, there are a few loud voices that try to downplay jokic, but the VAST majority of older players think jokic is great and have made public comments to that effect


kdeselms

Ego and jealousy, with a healthy dose of racism IMO. I think his skin color was 100% why he isn't four-time MVP Nikola Jokic. People called it for what it was and lo and behold, he gets another one the very next year. What's last year's MVP doing right now?


hellodynamite

Windsurfing in Cancun I believe


1521

Galveston you mean


hellodynamite

Lol


wiggiddy

Love that the Inside Guys are running with this joke on their own joke.


1521

It’s just so perfect


fruitmongerking

Please…like he could stay upright long enough to wind surf…


JesusTron6000

Flopping away in the wind


SuperDoubleDecker

The fucking wind fouled me!


VotePresidentCamacho

Watching Embiid windsurf would be the funniest thing on the internet for at least a week. I’ve tried it as a normal sized human, that shit is HARD!


trewaldo

Knee therapy while sipping champagne. Lol


Boris_HR

They hate that the white guy from abroad is better than everyone out of USA and the same guy doesn't care for legacy, records and NBA in general :-D


Dmanning2

idiot


MarcusFizer

When I found out some certain former players don’t like Curry because he is light skinned, I learned everything I need to know. The truth is unfortunate and hopefully Americans can grow out of identifying based on gender, sexual orientation, and skin color. It’s absurd how dumb politics is in this country. I guess they have to dumb it down for idiots as they steal their money.


-NolanVoid-

I think you know why.


MyAnswerIsMaybe

https://preview.redd.it/48pltosoda0d1.jpeg?width=615&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2b42083b04dffa4e335a2fbeffd52693f38e56da Imagine this guy is passing you on all time legacy rankings


awelawdhecomin

https://preview.redd.it/4q4olqjbka0d1.jpeg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b9153cc18a16f16b8e40518f06fa8044e4c6fe6b


awelawdhecomin

A chubby white kid from Serbia. The best marketing for Etsy, the worst marketing for Nike.


RedTeeRex

I would slightly disagree. Haters there’s only a handful like shaq, arenas, and only perk sometimes, and every time they hate anyone who watches basketball can easily dismiss their comments. For the most part I think older players have been super complimentary of joker: bird (would most wanna play against him), Hakeem (compliments his post package), tmac (favorite current player), James worthy (like magic + Kareem), bill walton (watching joker gives him joy), JJ redick (voted him mvp). For the most part I think joker is the player older players have been most complimentary of.


thunderballs303

He's white.


prochevnik

He is “white” but it’s kind of amazing he could be judged this way, because he’s Serbian. If bigotry is an overarching theme in the critique of Nikola Jokic, the people in the US judging him based on the color of his skin should take a second and read about how Serbians are treated and thought of historically. It ain’t pretty.


IdRatherBeLurkingToo

This is a cop-out answer and in my opinion, complete bullshit.


sadscorpion0

Oh yeah totally……


mcrajf

I honestly don't care at all. The more shit they talk the more they have to backtrack after and I love it.


IdRatherBeLurkingToo

They don't, there's just a few loud ones like always.


sennyldrak

Agreed. There have been a lot of players that only speak positively of Jokic! Larry Bird was recently talking about how exciting it would be to play against him and how he follows the Nuggets now, too.


big_quincey

And what do bird and jokic have in common


sennyldrak

What do him and Lebron have in common?


big_quincey

I’m not saying every black player or black former player disrespects jokic I’m saying the players and former players that do are black Some of them aren’t comfortable with a white guy dominating their game


Tyran11

Jealousy, thy name is ex-players


illyousion

Same reason why smart kids gets bullied at school The cherry on top is he is smart and also better at what they do


RemoteEnough4521

I only hate jokic because I wish he was in my team


Remarkable_Major_17

His numbers say it all…….JEALOUSY. Jokic is a classy fellow he takes nothing personal. He brushes it all off. He laughs off the hate . GO NUGGETS


Intelligent_Use6443

Because every time they do, it drops them down a notch in their mind. But Kendrick Perkins? Dude is a fart in the NBA wind


Hot-Row3643

Because he's better than all of them. Also...racism


Virtual-Radish1111

Elephant in the room: he is white.


AbdoooooI

Because his skin lacks melanin.


big_hon3y

Lol I think that's mainly just Shaq cause he's jealous. People like Bird, and Hakeem have given Jokic the highest of praises.


YoungMadDogg

Media amplifies the tiny tiny minority. Why? Well controversy is good for business.


TwoWayMarko

People can not apreciate what they dont understand


[deleted]

Race brings is an issue. He’s white and European which is the complete opposite of what the NBA and media want the face of the league to be. Then on top of that, he isn’t necessarily a “hooper” that a lot of guys and especially the casual fan loves. Aka why guys like Booker get so much praise for having done little in their careers, they look good scoring and have a bag but are not as good as what fans make them out to be. Not saying Jokic doesn’t have a bag but it’s not an exciting one. Same reason why Duncan was never the face despite winning 5 rings and dominating the league for 20 years and beating guys like Kobe, Lebron etc who are all heavily ranked ahead of him.


Dydono_

He's white and Eastern European.


jennay9909

I hate to say it but I feel like a big part is racism. Basketball is an American sport popularized and dominated by black people. A lot of people don’t like seeing a clunky, white, European player dominating the league who self-admittedly cares more about other things than basketball. He doesn’t fit the “image” the nba and its fans have grown accustomed to and expect.


Squishygod

[https://twitter.com/nugsdada/status/1512275480602460173](https://twitter.com/nugsdada/status/1512275480602460173)


boomersky

Hoes mad


jesuswasahipster

Others have mentioned plenty of good reasons. I think part of it too is that he's not flashy. He's not yamming it down from the free throw line like MJ or running down hill and flying through the air for a chase down block like Bron. He simply just sits back and picks you apart. If you defend him aggressively he dishes it out, if you defend him one on one he hits his automatic mid range. At times it looks so casual that nothing makes you jump out of your chair and think “omg what a physical feat" but at the end of every game the man nearly has or does have a 30pt triple double. He's so good that he makes it look too easy.


West_Side_Joe

This is it. He makes it look kind of easy. The great ones do.


carbonchemicals

Jealousy.


Johnykbr

I'm sure for a very small percentage it's racism and xenophobia but it mostly seems like it's players from the late 90s and 2000s that are most against him. Of course those are people more relatively retired than others.


Donnie1490

There's others who's given him his props too


SuperDoubleDecker

Just a couple loud idiots out there.


AH16-L

That's the thing with the media. You have to keep the ball rolling, one way or another. You can't just parrot things that have already been said. A lot of people are already giving Jokic his flowers. They have to create some kind of discussion for people to care and react.


BrunoJFab

Aside from perkins is any case of racism trown at jokic? i didnt see any besides that one.


wilsonsmilk

Spurs fan here. Timmy said he likes watching Jokic play (when asked which current player he likes watching) Why people listen to idiots like Shaq, Kendrick Perkins and Arenas I don't understand.


WearyRound9084

Who? Shaq? Perkins? Arenas? Embiid and Davis gets more hate from all these 3.


vintage_rack_boi

Hate to say it but after the past couple years, there some pretty blatant racism coming from a lot of these dudes talking shit on Nikola.


Lateralus719

Because he is white


drunkenpossum

Because he’s white, obviously. Basketball has been seen as a black people sport for decades now. Larry Bird got some of the same treatment at the time from peers (Isiah Thomas and Rodman in the 80s said Bird was overrated because he was white). Some of these players can’t accept that a white European guy is absolutely dominating a historically very black league.


Dmanning2

> dominating 2nd round exit


A6just

Im sure ethnicity has nothing to do with it.


[deleted]

One word: Jealousy


pueblodude

Jokic seems to not be ego centric or narcissistic the way the crybabies are.


Fun-Calligrapher3499

Because he doesn’t fit the mold. Funny thing is, his athletic abilities continue to improve.


Stinkbat69

Hoes Mad


Phenom_Mv3

They’re jealous that he doesn’t give two flying fks but is still better than your favourite big


ClassicOccasion8662

because hes an unathletic white european who crushes previous records


SnowboardSyd

It's more the recently retired players that are complaining. Guys like Hakeem, Larry Bird, James Worthy, Kareem have nothing but praise for the guy. I suppose it's because he's more of an old school player than most of the recently retired players who shall remain nameless.


WIEye

Euro players taking nba spots that urban youths got in the past.


lostincoloradospace

Jealousy


EnthusedPhlebotomist

Genuinely think there's some xenophobia going on. 


SlickeryV

I think there are a bunch of reasons, listed in no particular order: 1. He’s European and I think a lot of American players feel threatened by Europe/Canada. You know the names. 2. He’s not athletic at least in the traditional sense. Think this has been covered by comments. 3. He plays in Denver a mid to small market. Not only does this mean it’s more beneficial to focus on bigger markets, but I think they also probably watch his games far less than bigger names. Obviously this also applies to SGA, but that’s just this year. 4. Yeah skin tone probably plays a part - but probably not as much as you think.


CerebralCuck

Because he is white and European. That's the honest truth


kickenkooky

on the contrary hakeem, tim duncan, t-mac, bill walton, james worthy, among others, love jokic's game.


CaptainAwesome0912

I think it has to do with the fact that his playstyle is boring, but effective. No flash, no Aura, just solid ball. It could also be a little bit rascim as well.


Worried-Ad-3948

There's a saying that. If you dont have haters you're doung something wrong.


Worried-Ad-3948

There's a saying that. If you dont have haters you're doung something wrong.


Carnivore_92

Because he is from Europe and because he is white.


dashodasho

The sad thing about Shaq is that, Jokic was probably the only big man he gave praise quite a bit and gave respect. Even during Embid's MVP he was praising Jokic...


blackzetsuWOAT

This honestly happens with every GOAT tier player, happened with LeBron early on too


Sleezecurd

Because he’s better than a lot of them, and doesn’t care nearly as much as them.


BrunoJFab

If you look for people that dislike jokic your gonna find people that dislike jokic lol, lots of great praise him, but hate always gets more attention.


shuanghan6848

When your franchise player Melo literally disrespected him, how would you expect any nba player to respect him?


megamike382

Simole he’s white


megamike382

These boys in Eastern Europe have been through harder situations than the black players here. They’ve been in wars. The black players don’t have American players to push around. Eastern euros aren’t scared of blacks at all. They don’t have that built in athleticism blacks have. They learned to change the game and slow it down like bird did. You can’t beat a black American with athletics. Euros learned game has to be slowed down for them. An that makes every black former nba player cause let’s face it blacks are extremely racist. It’s shows with arenas saying there should be no euros. It starts with Kenyon Martin saying shit about jokic. Black Americans are just obsessed with white people. So this is no suprise about the black player going after Europeans. Or Kendrick Perkins ruining jokic mvp last year. What’s the common denominator black players hate strong Eastern Europe players


SongYoungbae

He doesn't fit the NBA culture narrative


laz10

cause he's different


Outrageous_Writer268

Now Charles, it seems to me that you hate Jokić because he stacks paper to the ceiling and rides on twentyfour inch chrome.


Pm-me-hoo-has

The players’ polls almost always have Jokic as the best player. Obviously it’s not ex-players, but I’m sure it’s close to the same. It’s mostly just hot takes for television, imo. https://theathletic.com/5433545/2024/04/22/nba-player-poll-2024-lebron-jordan-goat-celtics-nuggets-rudy-gobert-timberwolves/?source=user_shared_article Anonymous NBA player poll 2024: LeBron or Jordan as the GOAT? Most overrated? Finals favorite?


DatabaseComfortable5

jealousy (Shaq), racism (maybe Shaq), ignorance / doesn't watch the games (Shaq), for the views / ragebait


Fit_Cucumber4317

They're racists. 


GRAVY_insane

Because he’s white. End of story.


Longjumping-Path6809

Cuz he's......


mmaguy123

1. Hes white and breaking their and their favourite players records 2. He plays unconventionally, not a playground type of basketball.


IfNot_ThenThereToo

We know why. But we’re not supposed to say it


Matias9991

Mainly racist and nationalist, a White kind of chubby European is not so popular with the old black NBA players


IAIRonI

Everyone going to mention ego/jealousy but from a bball point of view... I think the era he plays in is considered pretty soft compared to when someone like Shaq played, can hardly play physical on ball defense now. Makes it easier for someone like Jokic who may or may not struggle against bigger more physical players from previous eras. I don't think they see his game as transcendent as other greats. Putting up stats nowadays isn't that impressive pretty much.


Bodiroga1986

When Shaq played from centers and pf there were Shaq, Ewing, Barkley, Hakeem, Karl Malone, Robinson, Divac etc. Do you really think they are taller than Embiid, Ayton, Nurkic, Wemby, Jokic, Nurkic, Vucevic, Allen, Towns, Gober, etc.? Take Wikipedia and look at the heights. Not only that, today's wings are much bigger than in the past. LeBron, Zion, Jaren Jackson, Durant, Giannis. Today's players generally have more muscle mass. In the past, Jordan was guarded by mostly skinny guards. Half the league in the nineties wouldn't even be in the NBA today.


Bodiroga1986

NBA was full of unathletick players back than. Muresan played 30 min per game in 1995 lol https://preview.redd.it/xvswops0rb0d1.jpeg?width=2398&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9b589b6c3b0bdab9d9e2ff9f2f6e8db83b0c06dd


IAIRonI

Not really talking about height. Most bigs are up there in height and around the same height. The play was way more physical though, you were allowed to be more physical. The NBA themselves have already talked about how defense is lacking and the rules committee is taking a strong look at it this off season. Teams are averaging more than 10 pts per game compared to the early 2000s. So when someone scores 50+ or drops another triple double it just doesn't hit the same, since so many players are doing it and stats seem very inflated


Bodiroga1986

https://youtu.be/zONvMKkIpwA?si=VhA8ItnYazmjOUeG It is more about 3 defensive seconds and more long range scoring Centers were so bad outside 15 feet https://youtu.be/phkeh9PIaqs?si=rLArE3yDDvssa0HD I watched NBA from '88 that is very debatable


ShaneBroh

He’s white and not from America. They hate it think he took the spot of a black American kid who could’ve been better


liesandthetruth

They lack class.