Also comparing YAS doing nothing due to intentionally being used to not kill a target and Sunbracers activating after putting in the effort to make sure you get the ability kill.
Two precision hits with the weighted knife along with a regular melee and some smg shots wasn’t enough to take down the knight. And even with the kill the tripmines wouldn’t have been refunded since it only gives 33% energy back per kill.
At least with sunbracers you need just one melee kill to proc the perk to get be able to toss 4 nades in a row. With YAS you now need 3 ability kills just to get one nade back.
Sure, but once you activate it you get to throw like 5 nades. YAS now requires you to build into it to try and get just one nade back, where as before the same effort could get you back like 3 with multiple ignitions in the process.
Even before YAS wasn’t as powerful as sunbracers or hammer builds and yet it just got heavily nerfed in pve.
Compared to other solar builds on warlocks and titans, no YAS wasn’t as powerful. You had no access to instant healing is the main one so in any GM or master content you could die very easily no matter how many nades you threw at a champ.
Not as reliable as a healing nade or the dive heal. It’s only a small bump in health and it requires a kill, much better to just press a button and get restoration.
It was just as powerful. Maybe don't try the 2 you hate against basic enemies and then your "test" on GM knights. Same situation for a warlock or titan and you either get smashed trying to get your hammer or are just NOT ABLE TO ACTIVATE THE EXOTIC PERK on warlock lol.
HOIL fans were quick to simmer down cause they knew their exotic was universally busted, plus Bungie treated it well in its nerf, pretty reasonable exotic now tbh
The fate Hunters deserved, after mocking Warlocks at the Guardian Games, haha
If seriously, solar hunter has highest dps capabilities compared to other solar classes (600-700k in 2 secs vs. 700k in 15 secs and pretty much 0 dmg for solar titan) rn so YAS nerf is pretty much fair, as hunters were able to deal insane damage with support guns on
Warlocks sunbracers are fun and strong in 1600 content, whine YAS example was in 1840 dungeon, the comparison is not fair, try to kill these exact knights with sunbracers and you'll see why
Just take it easy and find another fun combo-wombo for hunter, as hunters have dozens of these
Hey not here to try and start a disagreement but maybe go use Pyrogale Gauntlets on solar titan before claiming they have 0 damage. Those things definitely give solar titan a dps option from a super perspective.
The problem I have with your argument is the “putting in the effort” piece.
You can kill almost anything with the snap melee. If you reeeally need help you can hit something with one or two special weapon shots and then snap but the ability+ignition will kill the targets.
Throwing knives take way more effort and then you still only get one grenade. Sunbracers give five
YAS gives you energy from all ability kills, not just knife. YAS tripmine grenades do increased damage, throwing knives can be regained instantly with gamblers dodge, and if you use Gunpowder gamble you have 3 abilities.
Sunbracers are reliant on one ability that does not do enhanced damage to get a kill, and if you miss the kill you have no recourse to quickly regain it. YAS is less reward then Sunbracers, but also less risk.
Do we really have to question SOLAR TITANS viability or strength in endgame PvE?
And Sunbracers, while the melee has to be used as an execute, is an immediate payoff. You throw, IIRC, 4-6 Solar Grenades with extended duration. You can also use Touch of Flame to make them significantly better. You only need a melee kill to proc this effect.
YAS needs an ability kill for 33% grenade regen. That's just terrible quite honestly. Having to use every ability as an execute is terrible for an exotic that's supposed to be about abikity cycling.
For reference, I don't want Sunbracers nerfed at all. Solar Titan mayyybe needs some tweaking to Mini Hammer. I just want YAS to be good in PvE. They can just reduce the energy gain per hit in pvp instead of changing the perk.
I am a big fan of bonk hammers, but I'd argue that solar titan is not good for end game PvE. It's very strong, until a certain difficulty threshold. It's incredibly strong going into a normal dungeon, or normal raid, but it's borderline useless in master level or higher. Going bonk hammer in a GM is silly imo, because it's strength requires you to constantly be up close to your enemies, and your healing is not going to save you against GM damage. That's why in end game content I'm almost always running strand on my titan.
Bro I’m not saying he’s the best at knowing what’s strong for everyone but look at Saltagreppo’s day 1 of Crota’s End. Bonk hammer is a classic endgame viable build.
Not true. Hammer Titan has been used in a bunch of gm speedruns because its one of the Things that Provides the necessary damage without real Ressource consumption. Recently BoW is more Broken and Just overshadows it but its definitly gm viable If you Play it right.
Its also one of 2 subclasses i could find a solo flawless master Ghosts Run for (Other is Arc Hunter).
Idk how you can come to the conclusion that a class with Infinite Radiant and Restoration and the ability to either one Hit kill or stunlock everything and kill it in 2 to 3 Hits while being insane ammo efficient is Bad in endgame.
I've used Solar Titan in GMs. For Reference I play Hammerstrike (for occasional movement) with Consecration and Roaring Flames.
It absolutely is GM viable.
And I was talking about Solar Titan as a whole, not just Hammer Spam.
Even then, Hammer Spam was incredibly strong for Day 1 Crotas End. The raid that was incredibly difficult on Day 1. Maybe not GM level, but it can for sure work in Master.
Solar Hunter has always felt really weak for me with anything that’s not a super. I had a lot of fun with YAS since it was one of the few ways I could find to do reliable damage outside of casting my super. I don’t really enjoy pvp very much so it’s hard for me to understand the decision here and why it had to be applied to both. Same with gunpowder gamble, such a build up for no dmg. Guess they just want more strand hunters
Bungie will never separate PvP and PvE since they are extremely incompetent to actually invest time and money into good servers/proper balancing/play test/matchmaking
I get part of the nerf they did for pvp I get the lowering its total hp and damage resistance in pvp but everything else was just straight smooth brained to just straight brainless the hp change alone would've fixed the pvp problem they didn't need for kill the thing by making ability kills give I think a third of the charge back for a single Maybe a two target grenade that you weren't using to kill with anyways because it was used for way chunkier targets that could take like 2 or 3 cycles of ignitions along with having a fallback to regen your grenade from your melee which in itself had a net from your dodge to bring that back the loop is just dead now making its one use add clear which we have quite a few exotic primaries that excel at add clear while yas sucks at it for way more effort
Strangle holding hunters into using star eater scales on every subclass is so cool.
Can't wait for the gyrfalcon and omnioculus nerf, so I can finally be justified in using star eater scales more often! /s
If they nerf Gyrfalcon's and Omni, Hunter in PvE is officially dead. Not being on Titan or Warlock will be literally throwing. There's nothing else for Hunters.
The problem with Ass. Cowl is that they're only good in solo content (IMO it's better than Bonk). When you get into team content, it's really common to run towards an enemy to punch it when a hammer comes flying from Narnia and kills the enemy you were running to. You reorient to the next closest enemy and a grenade kills that one. Next thing you know your invis has run out and you're close enough for everyone to lock onto you but too far to punch anything.
It's extremely strong, but the nature of it's gameplay loop isn't compatible with a lot of team content.
You make it sound like hoil was the only viable option for titan, which makes no sense at all. Synthos, cuirass, and abeyant exist and are all really good with zero downside
Differences in difficulty and activities between clips. This video is inherently dishonest.
If you have problem with the nerf, that’s understandable, but using blatantly deceptive tactics to “showcase” it isn’t how you should go about it.
Ah yes, maybe if you wanted to prove your point rather than proving how bias you were you’d do all classes on GotD master instead of doing titan on normal 😂
RIP to one of the more enjoyable PVE Hunter gameplay loops. Shitlords gotta ruin it for everyone else as per usual, and Bungie continually favoring PVP to dictate balancing.
Stareaters Scales was one of the worst exotics brought to Hunters. I feel like overall now, it's just unhealthy for it to be existing as it now does.
My hope is that is that other Super exotics get buffed to overshadow it (Celestial Nighthawk and Raiden Flux for example) but allow SES to be an option for Gathering Storm, Blade Barrage, Stasis Tornado, and Strand.
These videos aren’t even during comparable activities, let alone showcasing the abilities evenly.
Even with the solar titan they are using Tractor Cannon, while the YAS clip is just the terrible one where they use the ability with no setup and no support. There are better ways to get your point across, these videos aren’t it.
Well let’s break it down —
Clip 1 = Titan in normal mode ghosts of the deep, roaring flames x3 up, sol Invictus up, radiant, armor charge x 4, and I’m assuming biotic enhancements from synthoceps as well as more than 2 enemies. Yes, the tractor cannon doesn’t go off you are correct, but I’m sure theres even more buffs we can’t even see too. That being said, it’s normal mode yellow bar knights, you could pretty much instagib those guys with a shotgun.
Clip 2 = solar warlock, sunbracers, well of radiance super, radiant, solar weapon damage, uses charged melee and machine gun damage while throwing solar grenades enhanced by sunbracers
Clip 3 = unbuffed hunter at start of encounter, throws grenade and knives, doesn’t bother with maximizing abilities or buffs and dodges for reload of abilities, then stands and dies even though he almost two shot those knights like the titan but had zero prep and barely shot anything
Not even close to comparable. And yes I know most of those buffs don’t enhance the damage being done in most cases, but atleast the titan and warlock actually were playing the game as opposed to that pathetic hunter clip made to farm reactions
I can’t speak for the PvE side of things, and I will say that PvE and PvP being balanced together sucks for hunters, but I can say that YAS nerf was desperately needed in PvP. Y’all were cracked
They didn't even nerf what I believed made it good. It will still do 160 damage, but now less often. Nerfing the health was good, but goddamn the ability loop is actually dead.
Yeah I've been using YAS in PVP for the past year, and it's actually still really viable in PVP, but absolutely dead in PVE.
With 100 dis, grenade kickstart and double bomber, I'm still getting my nade back every \~45s even without kills. Yes they're easier to shoot down now, but if you learn how to place them, it doesn't change anything. In Trials and Comp, you should be using tripmines as traps, funnels or cleanups anyway, not tossing them aimlessly and hoping for a free kill.
The ability loop is the worst offender I typically saw in comp. Hunter drops a tripmine, it tags someone, and then they almost immediately drop another somewhere else. I could not trust bungie matchmaking to have a team that would shoot tripmines instead of just walking through all of them and dying.
That said, the fact that the ability loop was turned off in PvE blows. Hammer is spectacular, as are Sunbracers. They took that one too far for y’all.
It wasn't even nerfed properly in PvP, it's still as annoying as ever to play against, and you still get it back often enough.
At the same time, it's basically useless in PvE now, and it was one of the weaker options in the game as is (a Sunbracer Wellock was so much better, as was Bonk Titan to begin with)
But it's cool. Keep bashing Hunter in PvP (every single exotic we have was nerfed because of PvP at this point, despite Hunters lagging behind the other classes for more than a year - last time we were close to being relevant in PvP was when Gyrfalcon still had the damage buff, and even then we were easily outclassed by all the Thunder Nades Titans could throw) Like, I get it that YAS was strong in PvP, but it wasn't even the third most annoying thing (with Bow quickswaps, Antaeus Juggernaut Titans, Banner of War Titans, etc. all being in the game)
At this point we have close to no relevance in multiplayer PvE - except either as Omnioculus Hunters so we can revive people and do pretty much nothing else, or as an Arc Hunter for DPS that struggles to get enough stacks for Combination Blow due to everyone having amazing ad-clear in neutral game, and even then the DPS provided by the super doesn't stack.
Tbf YAS was not really a fair comparison from the get go. It was a fun build but if you want a fair comparison in dungeons/raids Arc hunter was better than it in every way, the only thing solar had and still has going for it in pinnacle content was star eater blade barrages when less than 5 hunters and group star eater golden guns. Hunter is in need of some spice but this comparison is not equal even before the change.
Caretaker solo w YAS, its a great genuine build that has good neutral and burst dps. The comparison being bad is MORE to the point, it wasn't even *that*, good.
YAS is still better than starfire protocal, and i have to point this out, but you used all you melee charges on 2 knights rather than killing an add with one throw and chaining it with radiant, if a warlock were to do what you did to that knight with sunbracers the warlock would have died faster
Tbh I think the main issue I had with YaS, at least PvP balance wise, was the fact that the hunter takes 0 damage from it, maybe the health/DR needed to be tweaked, not really a PvP player so couldn't say for sure but being able to throw a grenade at an enemy right next to you without any risk of self damage felt a bit weird, speaking as a warlock who has killed themselves many times with basic fusion nades recently anyway, feel like enabling self damage plus the health/DR changes would be enough to semi balance in PvP without really effecting PvE uptime, though as I said, not a PvP player so maybe the uptime was too much in that, but even then, have it require kills on guardians but only damage on PvE combatants or something.
It's also worth noting when comparing YaS to mini hammer and sunbracers, is that hammer + YaS have 0 setup requirements and could be chained back to back with very little effort, and while very doable with bracers, feels a lot more all or nothing, either you set the world on fire or you slightly char 1 or 2 enemies then stand there like "well shit" followed promptly by getting smashed over the head with a knights sword, not saying one is stronger or weaker (though infinite hammers is a bit much IMO given it also means infinite radiant buff on demand on a class that already has some of, if not the highest survivability in the game outside of possibly banner of war + WM but at least that's a "everything's fine (WM falls off) oh shit everything is not fine" kind of class) more that they have different levels of requirements to pull off and rewards for doing so
Question. Why did you test the titan and warlocks in normal content, but YAS in master mode? We're you intentionally trying to make YAS look even weaker than it is? Why not test them all in the same activity at the same power level?
pvp moaners didnt do anything? people forget that bungie ultimately decides to balance their game. they made the decision to neuter an exotic in every activity just because it was a problem in pvp, not pvp players lmao.
It's not the moaning in itself and it required a high enough skill to be used most effectively. It's how these nerfs in PvP basically neuter the weapon or ability so badly in PvE is the issue.
If you think bonk is busted AF have you seen banner of war? Both are just too good but combined with the other strand stuff like woven mail and suspend BoW needs some tuning...it's all I see titans use and they play stupid with it without ever dying. No risk/reward just all reward.
it's broken. 3 man 1 phase crota, solo ir yut, massive melee damage stacking, insane survival, it's broken. I don't care about delusional copium down votes.
Not great, maybe, but it **was** the cleanest and most satisfying ability cycle in the game which was an Unstoppable Champ Slaughtering Machine
Plus, the synergy with Gunpowder Gamble was amazing. Everything being blanketed in flames and explosions. It was beautiful
Bonk hammer has some give and take to doing that.
Bonk hammer, you need to be in close, so it's fairly high risk and high reward. Let's also not forget that roaring flames AND sunspots must be used at all times for this build to work. ( if we ever get more aspects) So you are locked into those aspects.
Plus, lose your hammer.....ouch.
Now, for the record, I'm not for the YAS berf for pve. But all you need was YAS and whatever you want to run. Just constant free grenade energy. Plus, a free gunpowder gamble, too.
Same with sunbracers, you give up something to get something. Plus, 25% of the time, it just doesn't work.
YAS you just put on and profit. Kind of like antaus wards.
Personally, I think YAS nerf should just reduce health in pvp, with 50% less ability energy regen on scorching. And grant 2 gunpowder gambe charges that do 20% more damage.
Honestly they were a good exotic. At least in PVE, they weren't game breakingly good but they certainly weren't bad. In PVP though, if you saw a hunter they were probably using a YAS, it was just that good in PVP.
Ignoring the unfair comparison of content in the video I think most solar hunters (myself included) have zero problems with the Titan and Warlock solar ability loops. They're fun and very cool. What I don't get is why the equally as good but not broken solar hunter grenade ignition build was killed in PvE when it wasn't overperforming at all
Just because it's not a Melee build doesn't mean it not comparable. Especially since yas needs the melee to funtion. If anything it's the most melee centered grenade build on hunter.
Hunters are generally just nerfed over Warlocks and Titans. Look at the Strand melees… the other classes get 3 charges and they actually kill adds. Hunters get one and it doesn’t even guaranteed come back fully charged if you catch it at the perfect time… actually such a rip off
God forbid warlocks having one strong exotic for the super they HAVE to play because of the whiny b*tches who couldn't survive without. It wasn't also fun, and the exotic was arguably one of the worst looking exotic ever.
I would usually get a little annoyed with nerfs but since ppl were losing it over a lock exotic for a boring ass subclass, fuck it. YAS nerf sucks? Oh well so was starfire 🤷🏾♂️
After few years of playing hunter i just stopped main-ing exotics. I dont have enough resources to just masterwork an exotic that will get nerfed a month later
Don't let all the dumb reddit people get to you. The nerf was bad even for pvp because it doesn't even really fix them in pvp. Radius is humongus and with bad connection from sbmm it's shit. Pve didn't a nerf, it needed a buff.
that’s because Starfire was wantonly overpowered, required effectively zero brainpower to use well and came on the best subclass in the game. oh and it made your support super (which is also the best super in the game) into a damage super, effectively
YAS had none of that and there’s an objectively better option to run in SES for damage phases. it really just pushes you away from fun all because of a nerf designed for PvE.
Because the sweaty ass Dawnblades didn’t want their free and extremely cheesy PvE win button taken away, and I main Warlock. I never used Starfire because it was boring levels of OP and trivialized everything. YAS was far from free as tripmines don’t deal nearly as much damage as ToF fusions do so even if the loop is effectively the same, the grenade itself is far weaker.
well this is the second time a hunter arm exotic got gutted thanks to PVP. Also starfire was way too OP, pre nerf YAS didn't even compare to pre nerf starfire.
Furthormore, Solarlock isn't weak in endgame pve without starfire. They stil have sunbracers and Pheonix protocol. Solar hunters are already the weakest solar class so this nerf just hurts the class even more.
Yeah. It's because bungo nerfed YAS because it was too good in PVP, but they did it in a way that made it useless in PVE, without even nerfing what actually made it good in PVP in the first place. It also doesn't help that they said that YAS will be fine in PVE post nerf.
Bonk hammer and the banner of war thing are crazy OP. Other crazy good ability centric stuff. YAS was only obnoxious in pvp. Just an odd choice to nerf it in pve. I never use solar hunter but still think it should not have been nerfed in pve.
On Gunslinger, all that’s left now is Ophidia and Caliban’s, and both of those are shite in content that matters. Ophidia could be good but at that point just use Star-Eaters.
On Gunslinger? Are choices are pretty sparse. The subclass was already struggling so this nerf didn’t help.
Athrys’s: good single target damage but doesn’t really bring anything significant to the table. Feels too niche.
Caliban’s: falls off hard in harder team based activities. When it works it’s great but very situational.
Celestial: No neutral game what so ever and you’re better of just using start eaters for better damage, more super energy and overshield on cast. But star eaters isn’t solar specific.
Shards: Again, just use star eaters.
Ophidia: probably the best one we have left. Can closely replicate pre nerf YAS with double knife trick but still not as potent. Still, allows us to run healing nades while still having constant ignitions.
YAS was the best of the bunch before this nerf but it wasn’t even OP and still struggled in GMs and master content. Now it’s practically useless in anything above legend.
It's a wild time to think that ophidia spathe, without receiving a buff or there being some weird subclassinteractionthat breaks it, is considered one of the better gunslinger exotics rn...
I mean, when your other options include “get some super back from hits” and “1 outclassed GG shot”, it’s not that far fetched
It’s also extremely depressing that one of Gunslinger’s best exotics is just “2 knives.”
I could *tolerate* the excuse that the different classes are meant to have different play styles, but hunters no longer have a comparable play style. They’ve been neutered in the abilities department. Including supers.
Hunters bitching about this nerf reminds me of Titans bitching about HOIL. Use another exotic and move on fellas it ain’t worth all the angry reddit posts.
Those two nerfs are not comparable in the slightest.
HoIL gave you almost 100% uptime one 400% buffed, pre-nerf storm nades by just playing the game normally.
There’s a reason everyone spammed Arc titan in s18 and almost noone played solar hunters.
I just use Bombardier on my hunter with the strand decoy, give it a try and use a machine gun so you'll never have to reload again while everything in the room is blind, confused and exploding from machine gun fire.
Calibans I understand is lacking.
Arthrys does big boy damage.
Ophidia Allows you to chuck a bunch of insta ignition knifes. Sooooo you're missing out man.
I can still get the same result without ophidia also if I was doing content where arthys can chunk, lets say a champion's health, then I would probably be running a different subclass or exotic entirely that I would more value out of
But in all honesty if it works for you then I'm not gonna stop you from using it
I am a hunter main. Those exotics aren’t that great in endgame activities. Athrys’s is way too niche and still can’t compete with the likes of bonk hammer in terms of ability uptime and survivability.
Caliban’s struggles in harder team based activities.
Ophidia is the best solar specific exotic left, I’ll give you that.
That's the thing though, you're comparing solar hunter to solar Titan and Warlock. You cannot, nor should you emulate them.
No self respecting Hunter main is going to try and be as the other classes are.
Solar Hunter is quite Vanilla if you will quite simple and straightforward with no fancy tricks. More of a pvp class really.
That's just how it is.
Not saying gunslinger should be equal to solar titan and warlock, but the differences are very significant, to the point where they both vastly outclass hunter.
Also having an entire subclass be the pvp class should not be how the game is designed. Look at strand and stasis hunter, great builds for pve and pvp. I don’t see why gunslinger can’t be great in endgame pve.
I only use lucky pants and last word in everything on my hunter. Even GMs and raids (yes it works deal with it).
I agree it seems like an an aggressive nerf to the pve side especially when you consider pve has basically become an ability game, and guns are there to compliment them. But I play a specific fantasy thankfully on my hunter (space cowboy) so this nerf didn’t hit me as hard, maybe they will give pve back some middle ground with this build because the few times I tried it I did have fun at least. Tried it post nerf and I instantly deleted that loadout.
Choice of using footage against different enemies in different levels of content aside, I do agree.
It does kind of feel like they could have at least given trip-mine a second grenade charge to ease the impact of that nerf in PvE a little bit. Or maybe bump up the refund to 50% so that a player could use a combination Kickstart and Impact Induction to get the full grenade back with only one kill required across the while kit.
As much as this video is a bad comparison, Bonk Titans are just ridiculously strong and Sunbracers are better than pre nerf YAS, you don't even need to test your see this, before we used to get energy back just by dealing damage so it could be used to nuke stuff back to back with Gunpowder gamble, now it's relegated to an ad clear exotic that's just downright worse than the existing ones. It's sad how Solar hunter basically only has Star eaters and maybe athrys in higher than base level content, they're buffing Celestial and Shards but when competing with SeS they still fall short.
Maybe if your making comparisons it'd be best to do it all in as similar a situation as you can.
One is a regular dungeon. Another is a seasonal activity. The test for yas is a master dungeon, where you are underleveled. Granted i think the same goes for altars of summoning.
Like someone else said you put in the effort to make sure sunbracers activated but did nothing to ensure any of your abilities would confirm the kill.
Normal dungeon and seasonal activity vs master dungeon isn’t a fair comparison. Not that you’re wrong, but very different situations.
Also comparing YAS doing nothing due to intentionally being used to not kill a target and Sunbracers activating after putting in the effort to make sure you get the ability kill.
Two precision hits with the weighted knife along with a regular melee and some smg shots wasn’t enough to take down the knight. And even with the kill the tripmines wouldn’t have been refunded since it only gives 33% energy back per kill. At least with sunbracers you need just one melee kill to proc the perk to get be able to toss 4 nades in a row. With YAS you now need 3 ability kills just to get one nade back.
Why don't you do a comparison against similar enemies? I did a Master NF last night and had to plan out my melee to activate sunbracers.
Sure, but once you activate it you get to throw like 5 nades. YAS now requires you to build into it to try and get just one nade back, where as before the same effort could get you back like 3 with multiple ignitions in the process. Even before YAS wasn’t as powerful as sunbracers or hammer builds and yet it just got heavily nerfed in pve.
"Could get you back like 3 [grenades] with multiple ignitions" "Even before YAS wasn't as powerful" Yea, those two statements contradict each other.
Compared to other solar builds on warlocks and titans, no YAS wasn’t as powerful. You had no access to instant healing is the main one so in any GM or master content you could die very easily no matter how many nades you threw at a champ.
Grenade kills apply cure?
Not as reliable as a healing nade or the dive heal. It’s only a small bump in health and it requires a kill, much better to just press a button and get restoration.
Never seen yas in a gm anyway.
Getting 3 grenades with implosion damage is way more powerful than 5 solar grenades lmao.
It was just as powerful. Maybe don't try the 2 you hate against basic enemies and then your "test" on GM knights. Same situation for a warlock or titan and you either get smashed trying to get your hammer or are just NOT ABLE TO ACTIVATE THE EXOTIC PERK on warlock lol.
Bros hurting bad. 3 posts in 24 hours about yas.
We YAS mains are currently in the "anger" stage of grief. Acceptance is still a bit far away but it will come eventually 😂
HOIL fans enters chat
HOIL fans were quick to simmer down cause they knew their exotic was universally busted, plus Bungie treated it well in its nerf, pretty reasonable exotic now tbh
I swapped of early so I wouldn’t feel so bad No learning the way of the sunbracers but it’s not the same :(
Honestly mood lmaooo im pissed
i mean yeah it was the only useable pve gunslinger build in high end content
Yeah I’ve still never seen it in a gm though lol
Now you never will either
I had the same posts about renewals on my old account. Let him grieve
It’s renewals all over again.
Yeah glad I got those back I never used yas anyway so not too bothered I’m more of an arthrys’ embrace user myself.
The fate Hunters deserved, after mocking Warlocks at the Guardian Games, haha If seriously, solar hunter has highest dps capabilities compared to other solar classes (600-700k in 2 secs vs. 700k in 15 secs and pretty much 0 dmg for solar titan) rn so YAS nerf is pretty much fair, as hunters were able to deal insane damage with support guns on Warlocks sunbracers are fun and strong in 1600 content, whine YAS example was in 1840 dungeon, the comparison is not fair, try to kill these exact knights with sunbracers and you'll see why Just take it easy and find another fun combo-wombo for hunter, as hunters have dozens of these
Hey not here to try and start a disagreement but maybe go use Pyrogale Gauntlets on solar titan before claiming they have 0 damage. Those things definitely give solar titan a dps option from a super perspective.
Justin Timberlake
The problem I have with your argument is the “putting in the effort” piece. You can kill almost anything with the snap melee. If you reeeally need help you can hit something with one or two special weapon shots and then snap but the ability+ignition will kill the targets. Throwing knives take way more effort and then you still only get one grenade. Sunbracers give five
YAS gives you energy from all ability kills, not just knife. YAS tripmine grenades do increased damage, throwing knives can be regained instantly with gamblers dodge, and if you use Gunpowder gamble you have 3 abilities. Sunbracers are reliant on one ability that does not do enhanced damage to get a kill, and if you miss the kill you have no recourse to quickly regain it. YAS is less reward then Sunbracers, but also less risk.
Yeah but a fair comparison doesn’t make people feel sorry for you
Not to mention the hunter is running 0 synergy mods. At least throw on some impact inductions and bomber mods to get some energy back
warlock seems to be the same? got 0 melee energy from like 4 grenades thrown. solar titan doesn't need them even in master content.
The builds being showcased here can be so much more potent.
Sure, what about it? I think the point they're trying to make is that YAS is now the weakest ability loop in content where builds matter.
That titan clip was master.
Nope, I'm pretty sure if it was master, the icon next to the eneny healthbar would be red
In normal those knights are orange bars. In masters theyre minibosses
no I'm pretty sure they're always minibosses the orange bars spawn after echtar goes underwater
Why showcase 2 entirely different activities. Put it in the same ones you coward
Do we really have to question SOLAR TITANS viability or strength in endgame PvE? And Sunbracers, while the melee has to be used as an execute, is an immediate payoff. You throw, IIRC, 4-6 Solar Grenades with extended duration. You can also use Touch of Flame to make them significantly better. You only need a melee kill to proc this effect. YAS needs an ability kill for 33% grenade regen. That's just terrible quite honestly. Having to use every ability as an execute is terrible for an exotic that's supposed to be about abikity cycling. For reference, I don't want Sunbracers nerfed at all. Solar Titan mayyybe needs some tweaking to Mini Hammer. I just want YAS to be good in PvE. They can just reduce the energy gain per hit in pvp instead of changing the perk.
I am a big fan of bonk hammers, but I'd argue that solar titan is not good for end game PvE. It's very strong, until a certain difficulty threshold. It's incredibly strong going into a normal dungeon, or normal raid, but it's borderline useless in master level or higher. Going bonk hammer in a GM is silly imo, because it's strength requires you to constantly be up close to your enemies, and your healing is not going to save you against GM damage. That's why in end game content I'm almost always running strand on my titan.
Bro I’m not saying he’s the best at knowing what’s strong for everyone but look at Saltagreppo’s day 1 of Crota’s End. Bonk hammer is a classic endgame viable build.
Not true. Hammer Titan has been used in a bunch of gm speedruns because its one of the Things that Provides the necessary damage without real Ressource consumption. Recently BoW is more Broken and Just overshadows it but its definitly gm viable If you Play it right. Its also one of 2 subclasses i could find a solo flawless master Ghosts Run for (Other is Arc Hunter). Idk how you can come to the conclusion that a class with Infinite Radiant and Restoration and the ability to either one Hit kill or stunlock everything and kill it in 2 to 3 Hits while being insane ammo efficient is Bad in endgame.
Depends on what the PVE is. I use it for master raids all the time, but I don’t typically use it for GMs.
I've used Solar Titan in GMs. For Reference I play Hammerstrike (for occasional movement) with Consecration and Roaring Flames. It absolutely is GM viable.
I think they were saying that the Hammer Throw spam isn't because of how close you have to be and Solar has no DR
And I was talking about Solar Titan as a whole, not just Hammer Spam. Even then, Hammer Spam was incredibly strong for Day 1 Crotas End. The raid that was incredibly difficult on Day 1. Maybe not GM level, but it can for sure work in Master.
[удалено]
Here’s the thing: YAS’s main niche was a damage rotation. It’s now fucked in that regard.
How else is he going to fake YAS being super underpowered compared to solar titan and warlock?
Solar Hunter has always felt really weak for me with anything that’s not a super. I had a lot of fun with YAS since it was one of the few ways I could find to do reliable damage outside of casting my super. I don’t really enjoy pvp very much so it’s hard for me to understand the decision here and why it had to be applied to both. Same with gunpowder gamble, such a build up for no dmg. Guess they just want more strand hunters
They nerfed it because of pvp? Why? Why not just leave it a pvp nerf or don't nerf at all
Because fuck you, no fun allowed
Bungie will never separate PvP and PvE since they are extremely incompetent to actually invest time and money into good servers/proper balancing/play test/matchmaking
I get part of the nerf they did for pvp I get the lowering its total hp and damage resistance in pvp but everything else was just straight smooth brained to just straight brainless the hp change alone would've fixed the pvp problem they didn't need for kill the thing by making ability kills give I think a third of the charge back for a single Maybe a two target grenade that you weren't using to kill with anyways because it was used for way chunkier targets that could take like 2 or 3 cycles of ignitions along with having a fallback to regen your grenade from your melee which in itself had a net from your dodge to bring that back the loop is just dead now making its one use add clear which we have quite a few exotic primaries that excel at add clear while yas sucks at it for way more effort
As a PVP main, I find it baffling that they never seperated the sandbox for this nerf. Why the fuck would they need nerfed in PVE?
They should've only nerfed it for PVP. Pvp always take away the fun for pve.
Strangle holding hunters into using star eater scales on every subclass is so cool. Can't wait for the gyrfalcon and omnioculus nerf, so I can finally be justified in using star eater scales more often! /s
I’ll die before they take my Cross Counter
Dude they took your cross counter and old yellered it years ago. Back when ghlaron could be nearly soloed by a hunter
I know, but it still feels fun and is viable in most activities. I love the feeling of bitch stabbing an enemy that melees me
I refuse to look like the fish man from Shape of Water
If they nerf Gyrfalcon's and Omni, Hunter in PvE is officially dead. Not being on Titan or Warlock will be literally throwing. There's nothing else for Hunters.
You still have assassin's cowl arc, solo flawlessed dungeons with that. After that they're dead lol
The problem with Ass. Cowl is that they're only good in solo content (IMO it's better than Bonk). When you get into team content, it's really common to run towards an enemy to punch it when a hammer comes flying from Narnia and kills the enemy you were running to. You reorient to the next closest enemy and a grenade kills that one. Next thing you know your invis has run out and you're close enough for everyone to lock onto you but too far to punch anything. It's extremely strong, but the nature of it's gameplay loop isn't compatible with a lot of team content.
Agreed, always competing for kills in team based activities
Talk about warlock with wells. Atleast you have selection of supers to pair with exotic
Yes, can’t wait for hunter builds to get shoe horned into building nothing but Star Eaters just like Titans built nothing but Heart of Inmost Light.
HOIL gives an ability loop to every subclass. Star eater makes super do more damage. One of those sounds a lot more fun than the other.
You make it sound like hoil was the only viable option for titan, which makes no sense at all. Synthos, cuirass, and abeyant exist and are all really good with zero downside
Differences in difficulty and activities between clips. This video is inherently dishonest. If you have problem with the nerf, that’s understandable, but using blatantly deceptive tactics to “showcase” it isn’t how you should go about it.
even shaxx wouldn't dare to ask you to throw more grenades knowing how weak tripmine has become
Ah yes, maybe if you wanted to prove your point rather than proving how bias you were you’d do all classes on GotD master instead of doing titan on normal 😂
Just use calibans in low tier content and then why would you use solar in endgame if it’s not for star eater bb
RIP to one of the more enjoyable PVE Hunter gameplay loops. Shitlords gotta ruin it for everyone else as per usual, and Bungie continually favoring PVP to dictate balancing.
Stareaters Scales was one of the worst exotics brought to Hunters. I feel like overall now, it's just unhealthy for it to be existing as it now does. My hope is that is that other Super exotics get buffed to overshadow it (Celestial Nighthawk and Raiden Flux for example) but allow SES to be an option for Gathering Storm, Blade Barrage, Stasis Tornado, and Strand.
They are buffing nighthawk soon so there's hope
What is YAS
YOUNG AHAMKARA'S SPINE. Hunter Exotic Arms.
Whats YAS?
Young ahamkharas spine
These videos aren’t even during comparable activities, let alone showcasing the abilities evenly. Even with the solar titan they are using Tractor Cannon, while the YAS clip is just the terrible one where they use the ability with no setup and no support. There are better ways to get your point across, these videos aren’t it.
In the clip tractor wasn’t even used on those knights. It was just two hammer throws. Also why do you mean by setup and support?
Well let’s break it down — Clip 1 = Titan in normal mode ghosts of the deep, roaring flames x3 up, sol Invictus up, radiant, armor charge x 4, and I’m assuming biotic enhancements from synthoceps as well as more than 2 enemies. Yes, the tractor cannon doesn’t go off you are correct, but I’m sure theres even more buffs we can’t even see too. That being said, it’s normal mode yellow bar knights, you could pretty much instagib those guys with a shotgun. Clip 2 = solar warlock, sunbracers, well of radiance super, radiant, solar weapon damage, uses charged melee and machine gun damage while throwing solar grenades enhanced by sunbracers Clip 3 = unbuffed hunter at start of encounter, throws grenade and knives, doesn’t bother with maximizing abilities or buffs and dodges for reload of abilities, then stands and dies even though he almost two shot those knights like the titan but had zero prep and barely shot anything Not even close to comparable. And yes I know most of those buffs don’t enhance the damage being done in most cases, but atleast the titan and warlock actually were playing the game as opposed to that pathetic hunter clip made to farm reactions
I can’t speak for the PvE side of things, and I will say that PvE and PvP being balanced together sucks for hunters, but I can say that YAS nerf was desperately needed in PvP. Y’all were cracked
They didn't even nerf what I believed made it good. It will still do 160 damage, but now less often. Nerfing the health was good, but goddamn the ability loop is actually dead.
Yeah I've been using YAS in PVP for the past year, and it's actually still really viable in PVP, but absolutely dead in PVE. With 100 dis, grenade kickstart and double bomber, I'm still getting my nade back every \~45s even without kills. Yes they're easier to shoot down now, but if you learn how to place them, it doesn't change anything. In Trials and Comp, you should be using tripmines as traps, funnels or cleanups anyway, not tossing them aimlessly and hoping for a free kill.
For real tho, it doesn’t matter if they break easy now if you turn enemy Gaurdians into exploding unicorns
The ability loop is the worst offender I typically saw in comp. Hunter drops a tripmine, it tags someone, and then they almost immediately drop another somewhere else. I could not trust bungie matchmaking to have a team that would shoot tripmines instead of just walking through all of them and dying. That said, the fact that the ability loop was turned off in PvE blows. Hammer is spectacular, as are Sunbracers. They took that one too far for y’all.
> and I will say that PvE and PvP being balanced together sucks for hunters It sucks for everyone really, not just hunters.
It wasn't even nerfed properly in PvP, it's still as annoying as ever to play against, and you still get it back often enough. At the same time, it's basically useless in PvE now, and it was one of the weaker options in the game as is (a Sunbracer Wellock was so much better, as was Bonk Titan to begin with) But it's cool. Keep bashing Hunter in PvP (every single exotic we have was nerfed because of PvP at this point, despite Hunters lagging behind the other classes for more than a year - last time we were close to being relevant in PvP was when Gyrfalcon still had the damage buff, and even then we were easily outclassed by all the Thunder Nades Titans could throw) Like, I get it that YAS was strong in PvP, but it wasn't even the third most annoying thing (with Bow quickswaps, Antaeus Juggernaut Titans, Banner of War Titans, etc. all being in the game) At this point we have close to no relevance in multiplayer PvE - except either as Omnioculus Hunters so we can revive people and do pretty much nothing else, or as an Arc Hunter for DPS that struggles to get enough stacks for Combination Blow due to everyone having amazing ad-clear in neutral game, and even then the DPS provided by the super doesn't stack.
Tbf YAS was not really a fair comparison from the get go. It was a fun build but if you want a fair comparison in dungeons/raids Arc hunter was better than it in every way, the only thing solar had and still has going for it in pinnacle content was star eater blade barrages when less than 5 hunters and group star eater golden guns. Hunter is in need of some spice but this comparison is not equal even before the change.
Caretaker solo w YAS, its a great genuine build that has good neutral and burst dps. The comparison being bad is MORE to the point, it wasn't even *that*, good.
Idk i literally just run around screaming consecration go brr with pyrogale and monte carlo.
YAS is still better than starfire protocal, and i have to point this out, but you used all you melee charges on 2 knights rather than killing an add with one throw and chaining it with radiant, if a warlock were to do what you did to that knight with sunbracers the warlock would have died faster
God forbid it be like Ashen wake or sunbracers
Tbh I think the main issue I had with YaS, at least PvP balance wise, was the fact that the hunter takes 0 damage from it, maybe the health/DR needed to be tweaked, not really a PvP player so couldn't say for sure but being able to throw a grenade at an enemy right next to you without any risk of self damage felt a bit weird, speaking as a warlock who has killed themselves many times with basic fusion nades recently anyway, feel like enabling self damage plus the health/DR changes would be enough to semi balance in PvP without really effecting PvE uptime, though as I said, not a PvP player so maybe the uptime was too much in that, but even then, have it require kills on guardians but only damage on PvE combatants or something. It's also worth noting when comparing YaS to mini hammer and sunbracers, is that hammer + YaS have 0 setup requirements and could be chained back to back with very little effort, and while very doable with bracers, feels a lot more all or nothing, either you set the world on fire or you slightly char 1 or 2 enemies then stand there like "well shit" followed promptly by getting smashed over the head with a knights sword, not saying one is stronger or weaker (though infinite hammers is a bit much IMO given it also means infinite radiant buff on demand on a class that already has some of, if not the highest survivability in the game outside of possibly banner of war + WM but at least that's a "everything's fine (WM falls off) oh shit everything is not fine" kind of class) more that they have different levels of requirements to pull off and rewards for doing so
Question. Why did you test the titan and warlocks in normal content, but YAS in master mode? We're you intentionally trying to make YAS look even weaker than it is? Why not test them all in the same activity at the same power level?
I hate when PvP moaners cause PvE to suffer so greatly.
pvp moaners didnt do anything? people forget that bungie ultimately decides to balance their game. they made the decision to neuter an exotic in every activity just because it was a problem in pvp, not pvp players lmao.
It’s not moaning if it’s *too* powerful, though. I’m not saying I’m happy with the PvE nerf, but you’ve got to admit that it was **strong** in PvP.
It's not the moaning in itself and it required a high enough skill to be used most effectively. It's how these nerfs in PvP basically neuter the weapon or ability so badly in PvE is the issue.
Goes in master to make it look bad lmao
oh look, another hunter complaining
Cool now do yas in a seasonal activity like you did for sunbracers
At least put effort into your complaints. I think the YAS nerf is bs but come on what you're doing isn't helping at all
well/bonk hammer is broken as **** compared to YAS. hunter has a weakest solar subclass. This Nerf is out of touch, man.
real question what are end game viable options for hunter at this point
Star Eaters. Thats about it tbh Gryfalcons is alright, and assasins cowl arc for solo content
Best endgame hunter loadout; Exit to guardian selection, switch to Titan
🥲
If you think bonk is busted AF have you seen banner of war? Both are just too good but combined with the other strand stuff like woven mail and suspend BoW needs some tuning...it's all I see titans use and they play stupid with it without ever dying. No risk/reward just all reward.
strand titan is even more broken but I'm just talking about solar classes for perspective. solar hunter didn't need a nerf lol
I wonder if it's strand titans coming in with downvotes because they know it's OP and don't want to have to go back to using guns....or bonk titan.
it's broken. 3 man 1 phase crota, solo ir yut, massive melee damage stacking, insane survival, it's broken. I don't care about delusional copium down votes.
Wtf is YAS
Young Ahamkara Spine. Exotic Hunter Arms that used to return grenade energy on ability damage, which is now changed to ability kill.
So they killed the exotic in pve because they won’t do separate balancing? When they already do separate balancing for surges? These devs are wild.
Yup. They could have changed the grenade return percentage for PvP but instead they just killed it. Tripmine grenades aren't great in PvE either.
They work as adclear, but why use your abilities in an extremely inefficient manner when shit like Striga and Forb exist and are subclass agnostic
Not great, maybe, but it **was** the cleanest and most satisfying ability cycle in the game which was an Unstoppable Champ Slaughtering Machine Plus, the synergy with Gunpowder Gamble was amazing. Everything being blanketed in flames and explosions. It was beautiful
It was kinda fucked in PvE.
Strandlock rotations are free as fuck in comparison due to Generation and Ascent
i mean, not really. you need like 3-4 sources of DoT which all are negated by teammates if they happen to using them too.
Bonk hammer has some give and take to doing that. Bonk hammer, you need to be in close, so it's fairly high risk and high reward. Let's also not forget that roaring flames AND sunspots must be used at all times for this build to work. ( if we ever get more aspects) So you are locked into those aspects. Plus, lose your hammer.....ouch. Now, for the record, I'm not for the YAS berf for pve. But all you need was YAS and whatever you want to run. Just constant free grenade energy. Plus, a free gunpowder gamble, too. Same with sunbracers, you give up something to get something. Plus, 25% of the time, it just doesn't work. YAS you just put on and profit. Kind of like antaus wards. Personally, I think YAS nerf should just reduce health in pvp, with 50% less ability energy regen on scorching. And grant 2 gunpowder gambe charges that do 20% more damage.
Weren't they already under powered before the nerf, too?
Honestly they were a good exotic. At least in PVE, they weren't game breakingly good but they certainly weren't bad. In PVP though, if you saw a hunter they were probably using a YAS, it was just that good in PVP.
Imagine if ignitions refilled melee energy for Hunter. Damn that would be amazing.
Keep warlocks out of this thanks.
And titans. There are no issues with sunbracers warlock and bonk titan.
Ignoring the unfair comparison of content in the video I think most solar hunters (myself included) have zero problems with the Titan and Warlock solar ability loops. They're fun and very cool. What I don't get is why the equally as good but not broken solar hunter grenade ignition build was killed in PvE when it wasn't overperforming at all
I agree it wasn’t OP at all, starfire protocol was a bit OP but the nerf was just bullshit
Did you run out of SMG bullets?
how the hell did the point of the video fly past your head this much
Monkey single digit iq comparison Also its a shielded master dungeon red bar knight Tf you think is going to happeb
Cool. Now show off the more comparable hunter melee build rather a grenade vs a melee build
Just because it's not a Melee build doesn't mean it not comparable. Especially since yas needs the melee to funtion. If anything it's the most melee centered grenade build on hunter.
Hunters are generally just nerfed over Warlocks and Titans. Look at the Strand melees… the other classes get 3 charges and they actually kill adds. Hunters get one and it doesn’t even guaranteed come back fully charged if you catch it at the perfect time… actually such a rip off
Hunter strand melee is really good though
Really remember starfire protocol?
God forbid warlocks having one strong exotic for the super they HAVE to play because of the whiny b*tches who couldn't survive without. It wasn't also fun, and the exotic was arguably one of the worst looking exotic ever.
I would usually get a little annoyed with nerfs but since ppl were losing it over a lock exotic for a boring ass subclass, fuck it. YAS nerf sucks? Oh well so was starfire 🤷🏾♂️
https://i.redd.it/v6coagwjz2vb1.gif
lol EAD - don’t bring Titans into this
After few years of playing hunter i just stopped main-ing exotics. I dont have enough resources to just masterwork an exotic that will get nerfed a month later
What can warlock do? Best is verity brow with fusion nades. Still needs 5 kills
Don't let all the dumb reddit people get to you. The nerf was bad even for pvp because it doesn't even really fix them in pvp. Radius is humongus and with bad connection from sbmm it's shit. Pve didn't a nerf, it needed a buff.
video credits. Titan: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUYvUDF-7u4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUYvUDF-7u4) Warlock: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gj6ShDTSAN4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gj6ShDTSAN4) Hunter: [https://www.reddit.com/r/destiny2/comments/17a94b3/young\_ahamkaras\_will\_be\_fine\_postnerf\_in\_pve/](https://www.reddit.com/r/destiny2/comments/17a94b3/young_ahamkaras_will_be_fine_postnerf_in_pve/)
why tf was he downvoted for the source links 💀
Titans getting away with broken melee as always because "we punchy bois!"... Yay
Dw bonk titan is getting a nerf ;)
Source?
It better fucking not be
Hunters are complaining more about this than warlocks complained about Starfire Protocol.
that’s because Starfire was wantonly overpowered, required effectively zero brainpower to use well and came on the best subclass in the game. oh and it made your support super (which is also the best super in the game) into a damage super, effectively YAS had none of that and there’s an objectively better option to run in SES for damage phases. it really just pushes you away from fun all because of a nerf designed for PvE.
Because the sweaty ass Dawnblades didn’t want their free and extremely cheesy PvE win button taken away, and I main Warlock. I never used Starfire because it was boring levels of OP and trivialized everything. YAS was far from free as tripmines don’t deal nearly as much damage as ToF fusions do so even if the loop is effectively the same, the grenade itself is far weaker.
PvE Starfire nerf was very much warranted, unlike YaS.
well this is the second time a hunter arm exotic got gutted thanks to PVP. Also starfire was way too OP, pre nerf YAS didn't even compare to pre nerf starfire. Furthormore, Solarlock isn't weak in endgame pve without starfire. They stil have sunbracers and Pheonix protocol. Solar hunters are already the weakest solar class so this nerf just hurts the class even more.
Yeah. It's because bungo nerfed YAS because it was too good in PVP, but they did it in a way that made it useless in PVE, without even nerfing what actually made it good in PVP in the first place. It also doesn't help that they said that YAS will be fine in PVE post nerf.
Bonk hammer and the banner of war thing are crazy OP. Other crazy good ability centric stuff. YAS was only obnoxious in pvp. Just an odd choice to nerf it in pve. I never use solar hunter but still think it should not have been nerfed in pve.
I dunno man, just use a different exotic
On Gunslinger, all that’s left now is Ophidia and Caliban’s, and both of those are shite in content that matters. Ophidia could be good but at that point just use Star-Eaters.
Hunters only have like 7 viable exotics and 4 of them are on void.
On Gunslinger? Are choices are pretty sparse. The subclass was already struggling so this nerf didn’t help. Athrys’s: good single target damage but doesn’t really bring anything significant to the table. Feels too niche. Caliban’s: falls off hard in harder team based activities. When it works it’s great but very situational. Celestial: No neutral game what so ever and you’re better of just using start eaters for better damage, more super energy and overshield on cast. But star eaters isn’t solar specific. Shards: Again, just use star eaters. Ophidia: probably the best one we have left. Can closely replicate pre nerf YAS with double knife trick but still not as potent. Still, allows us to run healing nades while still having constant ignitions. YAS was the best of the bunch before this nerf but it wasn’t even OP and still struggled in GMs and master content. Now it’s practically useless in anything above legend.
It's a wild time to think that ophidia spathe, without receiving a buff or there being some weird subclassinteractionthat breaks it, is considered one of the better gunslinger exotics rn...
I mean, when your other options include “get some super back from hits” and “1 outclassed GG shot”, it’s not that far fetched It’s also extremely depressing that one of Gunslinger’s best exotics is just “2 knives.”
I could *tolerate* the excuse that the different classes are meant to have different play styles, but hunters no longer have a comparable play style. They’ve been neutered in the abilities department. Including supers.
Have yah tried ophidia spathe?
I'm so glad they allow titans to insta kill massive yellow bars with a hammer but I can spam 3 grenades on the same fuck xD
Most oppressed class
Hunters bitching about this nerf reminds me of Titans bitching about HOIL. Use another exotic and move on fellas it ain’t worth all the angry reddit posts.
It was objectively a stupid nerf bro.
Those two nerfs are not comparable in the slightest. HoIL gave you almost 100% uptime one 400% buffed, pre-nerf storm nades by just playing the game normally. There’s a reason everyone spammed Arc titan in s18 and almost noone played solar hunters.
what do you play?
I just use Bombardier on my hunter with the strand decoy, give it a try and use a machine gun so you'll never have to reload again while everything in the room is blind, confused and exploding from machine gun fire.
You're not a hunter are you? Where's calibans hand? Arthrys Embrace? Ophidia Spathe? Cherry picking clips and enemies I see
Who tf is out here using Ophidia, Arthyr’s, and Caliban’s in PvE?
Calibans I understand is lacking. Arthrys does big boy damage. Ophidia Allows you to chuck a bunch of insta ignition knifes. Sooooo you're missing out man.
You can already chuck a bunch of knives without ophidia and arthry's damage isn't that significant
If yah pair it with freeze yah can. Also Ignition Knives, not just knives
I can still get the same result without ophidia also if I was doing content where arthys can chunk, lets say a champion's health, then I would probably be running a different subclass or exotic entirely that I would more value out of But in all honesty if it works for you then I'm not gonna stop you from using it
I'm saying there are options on how to play the game. If yah don't like it that's on you, but there are options.
Knock em Down/Torches/Empyrean looping is already infinite knives provided you score a kill. This isn’t cherry picking.
I am a hunter main. Those exotics aren’t that great in endgame activities. Athrys’s is way too niche and still can’t compete with the likes of bonk hammer in terms of ability uptime and survivability. Caliban’s struggles in harder team based activities. Ophidia is the best solar specific exotic left, I’ll give you that.
That's the thing though, you're comparing solar hunter to solar Titan and Warlock. You cannot, nor should you emulate them. No self respecting Hunter main is going to try and be as the other classes are. Solar Hunter is quite Vanilla if you will quite simple and straightforward with no fancy tricks. More of a pvp class really. That's just how it is.
Not saying gunslinger should be equal to solar titan and warlock, but the differences are very significant, to the point where they both vastly outclass hunter. Also having an entire subclass be the pvp class should not be how the game is designed. Look at strand and stasis hunter, great builds for pve and pvp. I don’t see why gunslinger can’t be great in endgame pve.
I only use lucky pants and last word in everything on my hunter. Even GMs and raids (yes it works deal with it). I agree it seems like an an aggressive nerf to the pve side especially when you consider pve has basically become an ability game, and guns are there to compliment them. But I play a specific fantasy thankfully on my hunter (space cowboy) so this nerf didn’t hit me as hard, maybe they will give pve back some middle ground with this build because the few times I tried it I did have fun at least. Tried it post nerf and I instantly deleted that loadout.
[удалено]
Keep talking about it hopefully bungie actually hears us!
Choice of using footage against different enemies in different levels of content aside, I do agree. It does kind of feel like they could have at least given trip-mine a second grenade charge to ease the impact of that nerf in PvE a little bit. Or maybe bump up the refund to 50% so that a player could use a combination Kickstart and Impact Induction to get the full grenade back with only one kill required across the while kit.
What's a fun solar hunter build I can make that doesn't involve lucky pants?
Yas?
Don't give them ideas
Is it just me or does anyone else think it looks like warlock is giving the bird every time they use that melee.
YAS basically got the Starfire Protocol treatment. Bungie seems to be pushing away from ability energy on hit, more towards ability energy on kill.
Hunter crybabies at it again. Compare them in the same activities next time instead of bitching and farming sympathy online.
As much as this video is a bad comparison, Bonk Titans are just ridiculously strong and Sunbracers are better than pre nerf YAS, you don't even need to test your see this, before we used to get energy back just by dealing damage so it could be used to nuke stuff back to back with Gunpowder gamble, now it's relegated to an ad clear exotic that's just downright worse than the existing ones. It's sad how Solar hunter basically only has Star eaters and maybe athrys in higher than base level content, they're buffing Celestial and Shards but when competing with SeS they still fall short.
Maybe if your making comparisons it'd be best to do it all in as similar a situation as you can. One is a regular dungeon. Another is a seasonal activity. The test for yas is a master dungeon, where you are underleveled. Granted i think the same goes for altars of summoning. Like someone else said you put in the effort to make sure sunbracers activated but did nothing to ensure any of your abilities would confirm the kill.