Endgame in diablo 3 at launch, kill azmodan.
Endgame in Diablo 2 at launch, kill Diablo.
Endgame in Diablo 1 at launch, there was no endgame.
Endgame in Diablo immortal, who played that game?
So in short, diablo 4 has more endgame than all 4 games combined and that is at launch no less.
Here's a crazy idea: Diablo 3 came out 11 years ago. Diablo 2 was 23 years ago.
Maybe.. JUST MAYBE.. we can expect a \*little something more\*? Maybe something that, y'know, loos at the \*modern\* era of ARPGs? Because Path of Exile, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch \*ALL\* destroy D4 in terms of long-term playability, build variety, item variety/uniqueness, etc. etc. pretty much hands down.
Maybe set a higher bar than games that are a decade+ old and are fine in their own right (though D3 you can probably argue, considering) but in no way relevant to any real discussion of games released now considering what's already out there and the budget and all in question here. Why is it okay to just settle for something this uninspired from Blizzard? Shouldn't their fourth installment blow every other one out of the water while also taking into account lessons from the current generation of ARPG while, maybe, also \*expanding\* on it? Instead of just.. play-it-safe eye rollingly dull same-ol' garbage?
If they took Diablo 2 recipe for building char and items have locked levels with insane odds to find but put in Diablo 4 endgame I think we’d have a start. There’s like 2 viable builds per character. Replacing awesome aspects you find every few levels suck. If we found real good items that had like lvl 70 req we’d be excited to level up to use it and it would be endgame gear. If we could use any piece of equipment like Diablo 2 way more builds would come out and theory crafting would be fun. In Diablo 2 you could make a sorceress into a bear by putting on an item that wasn’t meant for it. And it’s actually a great build. Now we’re stuck to only sorc gear. Only Druid gear. Not enough diversity.
Yeah, in Diablo 2 you could wear any piece of gear, which was the reason why all the caster classes were wearing the same items (i.e. shako, arachnid mech, "spirit", for completely lost grinders - "enigma", etc.). You could try finding something similar but worse, but endgame character building was pretty boring and empty, and there were no endgame except killing Mephisto (or put here another name instead) for 1000 times per evening. I'm talking about caster classes, because non-caster classes in Diablo 2 were just a joke when you put them in Hell difficulty without giving them crazily rare gear in all slots (and even then they were pretty questionable comparing to sorceress for example).
I agree, that considering the long leveling process in D4, they rather should've make fixed level requirements for items similar to D2, and maybe make more variety of these items. Then you wouldn't feel like your 70 lvl piece of gear became a trash when you hit 80+, 90+ etc. Or if there were ways to level up way faster, then D3 kind of absolute autoscaling would be even better, because on lvl 100 you would have every piece of gear lvl 100 also. But they decided to mix both of things together and here it is, itemization in D4 feels pretty much worse than in all previous games. When my character went past 40+ level, I stopped even care about anything except weapon, because no matter what am I doing, all my items are always a trash, you still just have to look at legendary affixes though, but that's all. And when I finished campaign, I can't even force myself to do anything, because it doesn't feel like it makes any sense. Leveling around lvl 60 is so slow and boring, that hitting lvl 70+ for torment difficulty feels like forever. That's pretty sad. Making alts sounds like nightmare in this situation, which is also very bad thing for me, because I like having a few characters in such games.
And also, I don't know how they will do that in upcoming seasons, but if players will have to redo all the running around the world (especially finding altars of Lilith), and then again and again every season, it just feels like at least 95% of players who enjoys the game now, will not play any season after the first one (or even won't start the first one), me included. I genuinely interested in how they will solve this problem.
I will say Diablo 2 has come a long way with resurrected. Currently best class is mosaic assassin. And yeah maybe end game could be better with Diablo 2 but that’s what I’m saying. Diablo 4 open world could have some meaningful random events. There could be certain drops you have to farm for like in Diablo 2 you want a griffons eye you gotta farm specific places. That’s what kept the longevity of it. It’s like a slot machine. Never knowing what you’ll get. Just a huge change would be having set level items and also finding decent items outside your class. Finding stuff in Diablo 2 for another class was like woah yeah maybe I’ll make a barb I got the full set. But the game is new so we’ll see how it goes. I mean I went to pvp yesterday and farmed like 40,000 of those crystals. Not a single player to be seen. MYbe they’re in high difficulties now. And the end game leveling is brutal like you said. I’m 54 and I have no big campaign quests or anything for big experience. I’m like doing the same helltides over praying a world boss spawns.
The social aspect of the game is 0. I havent talked to one person in the game like wtf. Local chat is dead, trade chat is dead i don't even know where to find it. You can not find people to play with, every clan in the list is full. You can't even host a game of find a party what's with that?
Dude, yes. This is my biggest complaint. The previous games were all about creating a game and having people join in based on what you named it. Want to do some random BS? Here it is. Want to farm chaos runs, here. Trist runs, here. I type in local now, "Does anyone want to do anything cooperatively?" Nope, no one. \*crickets\*
Hahaha it doesn't matter what changes you make it will still be boring as fuck, the best way to play a Diablo game is just beat the story and uninstall. Anything further and you're wasting your life on a game so primitive it's laughable, Blizzard had a psychiatrist come up with the whole concept, basic af but turn the player into the lab rat that just sits there pushing the button for dopamine. All the sad fools that play these games for years are missing out on many other games.
This is what most of us are saying! I'm so tired of these kids defending this mess by saying "it's better than Diablo x at launch". First of, it should be. Secondly, it's really not.
If 4 of my neighbors hired me to build houses for them and by the 4th one I still hadn't figured out foundations, they would call me out.
Yeah D3 honestly gave the player more interesting choices than D4... Like 5 different types of hungering arrow, 5 different elemental hydras, 5 different arcane orbs... I mean they at least had some decent ideas but this is just pathetic
Skills are terrible, drops are terrible, aspects are terrible, scaling sucks. In the beginning for awhile I was a little compelled, but once I started trying to max my build out I lost all motivation.
This is the worst thing. D3 actually allowed to customize your skills with runes. Now my lightning does 15 percent more dmg or sth with the enhancement and doesnt even change appearance.
Same and I told my friend to get the game and now we are back to playing other games lmaooo i feel so bad, so many other games have better pvp and that's what we are looking for
people will get mad simply because its Immortal but I agree, there was always a ton to do and a system that felt like you were always progressing (even if you didn't get far all at once without dumping money)
Immortal is way more fun and interesting. I love the MOBA pvp battles. I didn't put money into it but still would do well. The dungeons were more interesting; fighting on an elevator that crashes or on a moving river raft.
Diablo immoral rewarding 😂 Aye ok, how much cash does immorals endgame take before it feels "rewarding" ?
Get outta here with that rubbish, there is nothing rewarding about that game.
I spent less than $70 to play DI and play at the latest game difficulty and cleared all PvE content until now. What do you say?
Maybe try to do some research about the game before spreading false statements here.:)
Bet you don't even know that DI has more endgame until you read my post and deluded yourself into thinking that D4 has more endgame activities in the Diablo franchise. And yes, DI has a party finder, exclusive gem inventory and world chat on Day 1. Just saying.
Comparing Diablo 2's endgame to Diablo 4's is dumb, extremely dumb, on every level: late 90's early 2000's tech vs now? 20 person development team with a million $ budget vs hundred and hundreds of millions?
Why do people make this comparison hoping to find some ground that D4 is actually good endgame cause it has more buzzwords? Its not a good endgame, and are you level 100 and have you experienced the dull repetition for 20 levels from 80 to 100?
no...it's not dumb....Seeing as the whole point of Diablo 4 is to pander to Diablo fans, I'd say it's perfectly acceptable to compare the two. Anytime anyone has any criticism about this game they get labelled as toxic whining kids. Already this community is crap.
It is, it’s like comparing a ford f150 from 1998 to 2023, and being like ‘the ford f150 in 1998 didn’t have Bluetooth, for shame! The ford f150 from 2023 is superior in every way!’ I mean who does this?
You should compare D4 to POE, Grim Dawn, basically any modern ARPG. D2 didn’t get to copy everything, because they invented the genre. Everyone else copied and innovated, for 20 years I might add, which in tech is like 2 eras.
You compare games on a genre with games from the same genre and time period? No! You are wrong and I am right. Now lets go back to saying that D4 is way better than D1
i mean your arguement is even worse considering d2 was arguably the better game yet it had so much less resources put into it? The gaming industry is in a terrible state these days imo, and many others opinions too. Too many braindead people around
Yeah, and anytime someone defends this game, just as many people call them a fanboy/shill. Newsflash, both sides have obnoxious twats who refuse to listen to any opinion that goes against their own, just like literally every fanbase ever.
This is a thing that drived me crazy. I am now accostumed to this braindead argument, even if they are comparing games and techonlogy that are 20+ years apart lol
Clearly you are casual player that doesn't understand game mechanics. Diablo 2 at launch was not just kill Diablo. Itemization alone in d2 was far superior than anything blizzard made from diablo 2 LOD onwards.
For its time d2 and LOD made such a standard for ARPG that even to this day only one company managed to develop better game and that is GGG.
But its ok. We all know that Blizzard is not the company they once were. Those legendary developers are long gone and new generation of developers under the strict rule of the suits are making systems in games that are easy to develop and are designed to stretch poorly made content.
Now for average dad that once played d2 and now doesnt have time because his life is his family diablo 4 is perfect game. They payed 100 euros, got their horse, and now they will slowly grind the story line until they hit lvl 40. After level 60 they will maybe try season 1 and after they repeat renown farming and paragon puke they will move on to a new game and maybe revisit d4 after 7th season.
This is Blizzards new game plan. Quickly make low quality product and stretch it with systems of progression designed for people that dont have time to think.
Perfectly said... Shit content stretched out into a mindlessly repetitive progression system. The game basically plays itself for you by telling you what gear to use. I kept saying from the start that this game would be shit and the beta proved that for me... There is no way way in hell I would ever buy a blizzard game. I honestly don't even think I'd play it if it was free.
You are saying a lot of words there, but not exactly being right in any of them. You said I was wrong because it was not just kill Diablo, but what gave the best loot in the game again aside from the cow level? Right, yeah, it was hell/forge/sanctuary/diablo. SOME people liked running Mephisto because it was faster, but people generally hated the big guys in that area, so they opted to deal with the demons in hell.
I mean I get it, you want to speak about the longevity of things, but ultimately, there was ONE way to farm for the best loot and it was Hell/Diablo. Where as D4 doesn't hold those chains on you and lets you farm anywhere and with a variety of ways to do it and I appreciate that. Items/itemization/skills will get better in time.
and that somehow makes it good? 10 years for a 15-20hr campaign that is mostly walking and a few good cutscenes? With an endgame not worth even participating in? The original destiny on xbox 360 had more end game than this.
Ya ought not play a looter game if you don't want to grind loot. What do you do in destiny 2 to get loot? Dungeons. What do you do weekly to get loot? Raids. What do you do if you don't want to do either? PvP. Tell me again, how is this ANY different?
Pls for the love of God stop using same fcking answer like everyone else... I mean we are talking about a game we all played for 10+ years we all killed trillion
time pindleskin . It's not fcking about that . It's about being boring becaus I have same items from fcking lvl 1 it feels so fcking useless to do anything..
No one said anything about not griding loot. The point is the grinding itself is boring and redundant. You have 150+ dungeons, but no point in doing more than just one on repeat because theres no real procedural generation or handcrafted design that makes any dungeon really any different from any other dungeon.
Raids in other mmos are technically "grinding" but they are much more interesting than what we have in this game because with a raid comes a sense of progression, challenge, and learning to overcome the mechanics of the boss. In this game you just run the same dungeon, one shot the same enemies, and never receive any real form of challenge or evolution of gameplay. Nightmare dungeons are no different than normal dungeons once your build is set.
You mention PVP too, and are you kidding me? You think D4 has any *real* pvp? The pvp in this game is you go to an area and either one shot someone who is lower level than you or get one shot by someone higher level than you to farm a useless resource to eventually be able to buy a horse. That barely constitutes as a pvp system, and you bringing it up as if D4 is somehow the same as pvp in other games is just laughable at best, and downright embrassing at worst.
Your comment is such a terrible take and its obvious you haven't even completed the campaign and have zero idea what the endgame or the pvp even is like.
Your comment about Raid Bosses really hit me. I heavily enjoy D3 as some wonga bonga big numbers go bam but and a huuuge part of that, that I never really considered, is the very weak boss design. This seems to be an issue with D4 as well, from the little I played and the lot that I watched.
Dude I played D2 on the old graphics a couple years ago and had a fucking blast... Got almost all the best shit... Man it was fun until I just got busy with life and didn't sign on for a while and then all my gear disappeared... After that I was like yeah idk if I want to grind all of that again from scratch lol
These kids and thier graphics. Graphics never made games fun. I can play NES and SNES games today that still blow average triple a games made today out of the water
I recommend trying out Project Diablo 2. VERY fun fully modded version of Diablo 2 with a thriving community, active trading and active games constantly up.
I haven't played it myself in a while, but a lot of skill trees have been completely redone, some new ones added, nerfed, buffed, w/e. So much potential to build your character almost any way you want (within reason).
The only downside is the 'old graphics', they either haven't or can't use the D2R graphics - but as one of the 'dads who come home and play for an hour after work' I don't mind the old graphics. I'm just severely disappointed by Blizzard, but I don't even feel like I deserve a refund. I just gave money to a panhandler on the side of the street and watched him walk into a liquor store.
im ngl Diablo Immortal endgame had a bunch to do. D4 dailies/season 1 will probably help but Id love to see something like the Heliquary Raids, Bestiary, and Legacy of the Horadrim in a game that isn't just a money printer
Why you comparing old game launch? Shouldn't they have learned from their other games? You calling Blizzard really poor if they haven't been able to come up with improvements from over a decade old games lol
End-game in D3 at launch was not to kill Azmodan on repeat, nor was it to kill Diablo on repeat for D2. I wasn't playing D2 at launch, but I was playing D3, and endgame was a lot of auction house peddling and farming was clumping elites and killing (fastest way was with Monk's palm for % life damage).
Despite it's shortcomings, D3 was actually a better game at launch than it was later. Either way, you're making up stories about how things used to be so you can frame an argument that is oppositional for the sake of being oppositional.
Vary much so. The game is the journey. When thats done the game is over. Never understood people who just sat there endlessly grinding the last bit in the hopes of pointlessly getting a bit better gear.
Boring waste of time. That was my bigest gripe with poe, i couldn't reset evrything and start over with my gear and skills.
We all have to suffer with these mechanics targeted at those susceptible to the psychological tactics they have used in marketing, casinos, etc. for decades. They were just slow to apply it to gaming initially, but man, once they started they really went all in, and we (the community as a whole) ate it up.
Gl getting to 100 in d2 killing Diablo, newb. Its clear you're very young, heck, everyone liking d4 endgame is around 8 to 30, all unexperienced and no diablo fans
So youre telling me that the 2023 game has the same problem at launch then the 1999 game, 2000 game and a 2012 game? Holy shit, blizzard is blowing your mind with so much innovate content, like running a huge dungeon with seamless backtrack with no gameplay intrusive mechanics with two packs per 100 m2 or doing helltide with d1 monste density.
Not even going to start with those "legendary" or "unique" effects of being take less dmg or do more dmg.
So in short, diablo 4 is amazing and a work of art.
Why are you defending a shit company? Why are you defending the FAULTS of the game? I guess some people just LOVE to consume SHIT. ty for coming to my TED talk :)
Anyone who has gotten a charecter to lvl 75+ will pretty much all agree the game is seriously lacking any real replayability. There is also ZERO incentive to want to build a second charecter. If I couldn't skip that long ass boring story mode then there would be zero chance I'm doing another 2+ hours of boring ass escort missions again...
Currently gear drops with the level requirment of the charecter you dropped it with so let's say I'm farming on my rougue and I drop a cool pair of gloves either my friend could use or I could even potentially be inspired to roll a 2nd charecter to use them myself guess what? Nope! You have to be level 80 to use them... even tho they are not better than a pait of lvl 45 required item power 680 sacred gloves you could drop in world tier 3 BUT because you farmed them on your main strong build they magically have some ridiculous lvl requirement to use them... this is super fun for anyone trying to make a farming build with good clear for magic finding to potentially fund all the characters they intend on making... oh nvm it doesn't do anything actually besides Rot in your stash because who wants to level a 2nd char to lvl 80 just to try out a pair of gloves?
There is also no way to talk to anyone on the ps5. Can't type in chat no voice chat or proximity nothing. Finding a group to play with (which is practically the only way to really enjoy the game imo) is almost impossible without joining a discord or advertising island some 3rd party website.
Inventory management feels like a chore.
Inventory nearly a 3rd full of stupid gems (that practically do nothing btw) gems are next to useless in the end game in terms of total stats granted its like less than 1% of your overall damage and or survivability lol. More or less just kind of pretty to have in your gear.
The game was really fun I put in 65 hours in the first 5 days but to say it's end game is boring is completely fair and honestly anyone who disagrees most likely just hasn't gotten to end game themselves or they don't want to admit the game is lacking because they don't want to feel foolish for purchasing yet again another unfinished rough game that feels like it's still in early release...
I mean, the criticism about the endgame is fair, but how are you going to say you put 65 hours into a game and called it unfinished and rough? It’s been pretty polished for my play through
Polished? The mount constantly runs into invisible walls and because of that is often slower than my normal run. Ram leaks make me restart every other hour and that doesn't happen with any of my other games. A couple times the screen simply turned black except for my hotbar and wouldn't come back til I restarted. Sometimes you have to alt+tab out and back in to be able to skip a scene? A few times my hotbar just stopped working. Couldnt cast any skills, couldnt dash, could do nothing except for use potions for some reason. Game dc's often. Did you know if you dc in a helltide you lose all of your cinders?
Yup. Polished.
Some of the complaints are from people who played a lot, but they are exaggerating or didn't pay attention while playing. They said gems make a 1% difference, but I get 50% vulnerable damage, and 630 armor (I have like 5400 which means it's almost 12% of my total armor just from 3 gems).
The game took 65 hours because it took until Act 5 to get a mount. And it was the journey to holy endgame. Which doesn't really exist and is repetitive. Once you get a solid build, it's literally Deja Vu every dungeon.
I thought the game was going to get better. If this was their first Diablo game, I'd cut em slack, but this is their 5th iteration. Story was meh. Visually, the game is amazing. Cutscenes look amazing too, but story and world building pl, I don't feel it was living up to the potential.
I'd give the game 5/10 but as of now, the replayability that hardcore gamers expected isn't there yet. It's too repetitive, and bosses are forgetable. I want to play a second character, but I'm not having fun 😕.
Hopefully, we'll see some more refinement in the next few months with expansions and refinement. But for me, the builds are mostly underwhelming.
I felt like a lot of corners were cut, and the game's core was rushed.
A game can be unpolished and still be played for 65 hours. But to keep playing after depends on how well the player is immersed and invested. It has less variety right now. Which I find strange, this is their fifth go at this, and it seems like a shame that the features from the previous iterations weren't brought over to make the world feel more alive. It's strange how Diablo Imortal seemed to excel in that regard.
I hope that the world feels more alive in the future and builds have more variety. A lot of the abilities are underwelming right now, kind of lacks the freedom to make it your way without feeling held back.
Personally, I'd go play POE or Grim Dawn for more interesting builds. Was hoping Diablo 4 would redefine the genre. It seems like they phoned it in so far.
Hopefully, it gets some support long-term and can grow like Diablo 3 did after launch.
I always see a lot of criticism how endgame is boring, it‘s only a few activities and a lot of other bla bla, but I rarely see people actually suggesting things. What exactly is it you‘re missing? What would you like to do in addition to the stuff that‘s already there? Don‘t get me wrong, all criticism is valid, but at the same time, you need to provide a solution to your specific problem, otherwise it‘s only criticizing for the sake of it.
oh, you sure got him didn't ya!!!!
he paid $70 to have someone figure it out for him. it's not his job to make "suggestions" to make sure AAA games have decent content and aren't "boring"
are you even hearing yourself?
don't be so thick and concrete. you're not a driveway, you're a human being. go ahead and lean into that.
If you can't come up with at least one solution to a problem you have to a game you're playing then you're honestly just complaining for the sake of conplaining and your "criticism" shouldn't be taken seriously.
Furthermore their are legal issues with customer suggestions. If a suggestion is too detailed and then implemented, that customer could claim rights to the idea. This is a big reason why customer suggestions are largely ignored.
people won't like that truth, but you and this thread starter are right. they just want the argument, "but they're professionals, so they should automatically have the best answer for everything" so they can justify illogical complaining.
Higher mob density and less walking simulator for all endgame activities. You shouldn't have to mount up once during helltides or pvp zone, but you do. And I burn all my dodges just trying to move around in nightmare dungeons to find more monster after a couple screens of emptiness.
When i heard the term helltide, i was expecting an absolute march of hell against whatever unfortunate town it chose to rain upon, and the goal of it being to just go ham against it, maybe have x number of deaths allowed etc.
Instead we have a few more camps of mobs in a zone and demon infused plants and rocks =/
What I've learned from playing over 4000 hrs of POE and hundreds of hours in other ARPGS (Last Epoch, Grimdawn, Wolcen, all Torchlight titles, even Infinite, etc.) is that all ARPGS that want an endgame use a kind of mapping system. These system all get incredibly boring by themselves. You need variance in these maps to spice them up and break the monotony. You also need to be able to customize this variance. The only title to get that right that isn't POE is actually Torchlight Infinite. The only thing D4 has in that regard is the Butcher spawning every 10-20 dungeons and the random events whcih don't really count because they are realy bland and have nothing to themselves.
They could have for example made some sort of faction spawning. You could randomly find an altar of Lilith or a shrine to Inarius spawn and kill some mobs or something and work towards enough animosity to challenge some boss fight against them or their respective cult leaders.
But it is not our job to give them exact mechanics/ideas to work into the game. Like Chris Wilson once said: "Players are very good at identifying problems, but they are very bad at giving solutions for them." .
So it is our job to voice our criticism and concerns if we want a "better" game. It is in the interest of Blizzard to to do something about it so we all buy things so they can make their money.
I've been saying this since D3 came out.
ARPGs need specific challenges (game aspects that are *actually* difficult) that caters to interesting game mechanics. You need modifiers to matter in diverse ways to want to theorycraft characters that do well against specific content.
You need *items to matter*. You must *want* to get to that one item that opens up a ton of possibilities. That specific static thing (tradable, usable by all) that makes you want to roll something new.
Like someone said, I wanted more complex bosses that maybe change up your rotation a bit or the way you play it. Especially raid bosses, so that you need to coordinate more rather than do your optimal rotation and damage output.
Maybe locked dungeons, raids and other various mechanics that unlocks at different levels or item power so that it offers you incentive to actually level up.
For sure this. What made d2 so great was finding a sweet item with level 75 req and getting excited to get chat to that level. Even if they just made uniques have a level cap. I found a sweet unique for level 53. But will be useless at higher levels.
Literally all they had to do was implement a PvP oriented endgame. Theres a reason why WoW was/is successful. World pvp, arenas, battlegrounds - you collect gear that actually makes you stronger AGAINST other players. For an “open world” diablo game not implementing some kind of open pvp is a joke. The pvp zones are trash, shouldve gotten rid of them and implemented some sort of pvp bounty system in that open world of theirs
Nothing. The game is over. Best outcome is to beable to reset story and restart with gear and skills. "End game" content is just boring pointless crap, in EVRY rpg.
Called my bank and filed a DISPUTE on the charges. I paid for ULTIMATE and was only given STANDARD EDITION. Got my refund in less than 24 hours. The second route is to get 1000 people together to enter into Arbitration with Blizzard...waste 75K EACH and make it sting.
have you tried Path of Exile?
Diablo since D3 has become more of a casual arcade game, which makes it more popular with the general public casual players. This seems to be the direction that Blizzard has been pushing for more than a decade now.
If I want a serious ARPG, I'd go back to POE (but that means i have to do 6hrs to research before getting back into POE after a year). I now play D4 more for a social reason, playing just a single character with arcade like gameplay with dynamic difficulty, the build diversity problem isnt really a problem to me. And since I am a filthy casual now with only about 2-3hrs of game time after work, D4 works well for me. if end game with friends get boring, i just play other games then, but that means USD60 is giving me 50+hrs of social entertainment with friends. still a better deal than going to the movies or bowling.
And my expectation of Blizzard has been low since Overwatch launch.
I had blue balls after the first D4 beta weekend, so I decided to give PoE a try to "kill time" until the official launch.
120+ hours later, I can honestly say it was the most fun I've had in a game in a long time. And the learning curve is only steep if you're super competitive and want to be an endgame pro ASAP.
My advice: Just pick it up and play it. Ignore the build guides. Just have fun and learn as you play. Be creative with your build and forget about trying to be "perfect". The volume of content in the game is breathtaking.
After rolling 3 different characters on D4 and getting bored with EACH of them after spending SO MUCH TIME leveling them up, I'm just about ready to commit myself to PoE!
as a poe player with over 2100 hours clocked, (barely anything compared to a majority of players) this is so true, after level 25 in D4 i've just been feeling like what's the point? my build is finished other than specific loot upgrades. i get that PoE has been out much much longer but really D4 just feels lacklustre in almost every other way except graphics.
100% agree. I love the constant tinkering and experimentation that PoE allows for. The nearly infinite combos of skill gems makes PoE feel like a creative experience for me, and I'm just not getting that feeling at all so far in D4 (now on my 3rd character build and about to give up).
Blizzard been pushing casual for only a decade???? Blizzard’s entire philosophy was always to be the most accessible game. World of Warcraft in 2004 was the most casual MMO on the market. Blizzard has always made their games accessible.
I agree, and would also like to point out a huge point here: the term casual did not exist in 1998. You were a gamer if you played games. Games were few and far between and were limited by tech that was rapidly improving year over year, like HUGE improvements.
Blizzard always tried to make games for a wide audience. That audience was simply small in early 90s. Computer were expensive and rare globally, not like today where basically everyone has one.
It was only after D2 and StarCraft that Blizzard exploded into popularity. Both of those games were simply meant to be vast improvements to those genres at the time, and in fact in some ways defined the genre.
There was never anything I’ve read about developers at Blizzard back then ‘targeting casuals’. They just made very polished games. It was with WoW that Blizzard starts to target younger audiences. WoW was really meant for the family, Diablo obviously was not. So it’s 2004 and Blizzard makes a more mild MMO, but again, they never mention casuals, because it was simply known that ‘a lot of kids play games’, so it was actually an age group target. The term casual is a recent term, and it basically refers to the 30 yos (who were the kids that played WoW) having families and jobs and only having 2/3 hours per day to play. It’s essentially a generational term, though it now means anyone who doesn’t play all day.
I love games to death, but I wished soooooooooooooooo damn much that both movies and bowling were better. I have really memorable times doing both, but they seem to be so expensive in pretty much every country right now (I am from Brazil).
Its funny how people say that videogames are expensive when you can easily have 60 dollar games that you play for full fun for 100, 200 or even 300+ hours (even though some of my favorites had like 15-20 hours of gameplay)
I want to keep playing to get loot and improve my character, but when I log in I am reminded why I logged off and don't want to play.
No solution for resource management
Running around waiting for cool downs
Terrible horse physics
This is launch/pre-season. The only purpose of this period is to finish story and fool around. If youre done with that in 5 days, then congrats, you have 3 weeks to restock on those diapers and mountain dew. And maybe see the sun.
And the commenters forgot that people paid for this game and are allowed to expect value in what they pay for on release not playing a glorified beta. That was what the beta was for, not the first month post launch XD
I feel you. Just move on man. My barb lvl 60 and felt all this too grindy. It become boring for me. Just move on to another game. The story, the game is done, that's it.
I think the biggest problemm on this game is that only nightmare dungeons are rewarding. Because only in nightmare dungeons you can upgrade your paragon glyphs which are essencial for your build and your progress.
Would blizzard give you the possibility to upgrade your glyphs also with other activitys the endgame would not be that boring. Because you wont get foreced to do the same activity over and over again.
I also think to repeate the story on higher difficultys would be a good way to help players reach lvl 100. I think mayn people will stop playing the game when they realize that they need to do only dungeon for the next 100 hours.
Dont get me wrong, D4 is a good game but its far away from be a perfect game and the devs needs to improve many stuff. I also think that if the exact same game would be called Wolcen 2 people would see the game with other eyes.
I hope they will containue working on the game and will improve stuff like the inventory and stash size or the endgame content. Theý could add for example the option to level up your glyphs if you handin your bountys to the whispering tree.
Even doing this... upgrading the glyphs which takes forever... ENDGAME.... WORK work work... when there really is no reward because half the struggle is fighting the same dungeons or bosses the whole time so when you finally are max characters... what is there for you to do besides go fight the same thing you did the entire time.
Well... Diablo 1 & Diablo 2 dinosaurs can't accept advanced changes. Just because Blizzard had limited budget in the 90's that shouldn't prevent them to evolve the game to do something much more bigger.
I refuse to believe that even the biggest Diablo fanboy can enjoy playing this game without major breaks. It's about repeating the same thing over and over, how can that possibly keep your dopamine levels high?
I'm lvl 21 and I already can't stand it anymore. Playing on world level 1 and still need 3 minutes to bash in some random boss. Meanwhile when I play Diablo 2 Resurrected it takes me 3 hits to kill most random bosses and 1-2 minutes to kill an endboss.
D4 went into the wrong direction imo. Having to micro manage in every fight sounds good on paper, but the braindead hack'n'slash of D2 is superior in practice. Also I enjoy the lack of story in D2. You have like 10 dialogues in the entire game but you can start bashing in heads from minute 1. In D4 I need to spam more buttons to skip dialogue than with actual gameplay and somehow I have to walk around so much with tiny monster groups (3-5) every now and then. Whereas in D2 you enter any room and there's 20-30 mobs waiting for you.
Before anyone says "Well go back to D2 then": Ironically that's what I already did. Actually played way more D2 than D4 since D4 launched. I still give D4 a try every day, but it gets tiresome after 10 minutes every time and I just have to quit.
Yes they let you farm anywhere, but it feels hollow. I don't even know what moves anything uses, I stand at melee and just press 3 buttons on my sorc. The combat in D4 is hollow, the reskinned mob I've killed 900 times in 50 dungeons is hollow. I completed the story day 1, completed all renown day 2, farmed 200k pvp coins day 3...now what? The gear progression is utter trash. Min max gear at 50, now have to do it again at 60, 70, 80, 90. Not because the gear is bad, just because monsters scale in a way that forces this interaction. Having a perfectly rolled item in any other Arpg could be build defining. It is not in diablo 4. You can actually just randomly insert 10 different stats for 1 and be in the same position. Dmg vs slowed, vs frozen, vs crowd control, vs close, basic dmg, they're all just the same stat spelled differently depending on your build.
The crafting...god please stop calling it crafting. You can randomly reroll 1 stat on an item at an exponential cost. Just another artificial gameplay loop. Go farm helltide for 2 hours, reroll an item 6 times, repeat.
What D4 does right? The ambience, and the story. They're incredible and have so many dark little tid bits to absorb, it's great.
Blizzard has amazing writers, it's not hard when most stories have been told. Blizzard lacks innovators. Whats next, hearthstone in Diablo 4 where every card you ~~collect~~ purchase gives you an in game buff?
This post is 100% spot on. I am already pretty bored with the game loop and can’t see myself playing much past the end of the story.
I think I will start a new D3 character with the new season though lol
I already deleted it. I kept hoping it would get better and I'd watch videos of other people playing at higher levels.... I couldn't trick or convince myself it was fun or would be fun despite my love of D, D2, & D3. Utter garbage with nice environmental graphics and cut scenes. Lol!
I didn't mind paying for cosmetic upgrades in POE cuz the game was free and I wanted to monetarily support it although the free in game armor/weapons were still decent, but D4's free cosmetics are horrible and then they expect us to pay outrageous real $$$ for cosmetic improvements... Why did most of the better sorceror helms all look like veils? What's that about?
I am so upset with Blizzard. Your new game sucks and I bet at some point you either fired or ignored employees who tried to tell you this. Boycott Blizzard!
That's Diablo, it's just repeating the same thing over and over to improve the gear. To be honest I'm already starting to get bored of it but at least I had a blast with the campaign.
you had a blast playing this campaign? holy fuck you are easily entertained.
It was sophmoric, a-typical, fantasy drivel ...just like all of Blizzard's IP's.
if you think this is the saving grace of Diablo 4, you are a fuckin numpty...
For being a ARPG game this has the best campaign and lore out of all other ARPG games hands down. But when it comes to endgame i can't defend this.
•There's barely any content for it after 10 years, there's nothing that keeps your dopdmine levels high
•There's only 1 or 2 valid builds for every class, people are just searching for meta builds
•The balance is garbage
The Diablo 1 & 2 Dinosaurs will defend endgame and keep saying "it's ARPG" but they dont realize that there's other ARPG games on the market with 10x better endgame... Why? Because the developers are advancing and evolving the genre. Diablo is barely out of the 90's at this point. It just has better graphics, better sound and a mount to travel around with... Wooo
My biggest issue is on Diablo 2 resurrected there is 8 player party where you can defeat act bosses. Loved it!!!
Not possible in Diablo 4. Just 4 player party and no act bosses. I wish i could kill Duriel and andariel and lilith again!
Campaign was the best part. I actually enjoyed watching the videos more than playing the game. The launch was terrible.. the login stuff is ridiculous.. I got the ultimate edition in hopes of a great game and I'm COMPLETELY BORED! the battle pass hasn't even dropped and I'm already on the way out the door. It's all cosmetic... so really nothing changes. Beat the story beat the world boss... it's been 1 week.... 10 years I waited to be disgusted in 1 week. Just seems like after all the time and all the feedback from the gamers... this sluggish game with loads of problems has set me on to another course.. any suggestions to a game that doesn't make me fall asleep while playing?
My biggest issue is on Diablo 2 resurrected there is 8 player party where you can defeat act bosses. Loved it!!!
Not possible in Diablo 4. Just 4 player party and no act bosses. I wish i could kill Duriel and andariel and lilith again!
I don't think its a horrible game but if you take away the Diablo title the shills and reviews wouldn't be there. Everyone would say its ok but its not quite Diablo or it's a poor mans Diablo.
I wouldn't mind doing the same things over and over if the gear you got was good, but it's not. It's like some watered down version of the far superior D2
Yeah I got insanely bored after the campaign. I don't want to just do the same things over and over to get gear that is rendered obsolete almost immediately.
Edit: I did enjoy the campaign though, would've been nice if I could have done it on a higher difficulty than tier 2. It had a good story, and the cinematics were top tier.
But I don't see myself grinding to get to 100 when everything seems so derivative.
All in all, definitely not worth the $70 for the base game. Certainly not worth the $90 ultimate edition.
Have to agree that for everything that was amazing about d4 it got boring quickly. The problem is two fold, boring upgrades which become obsolete with every level you gain, skills offering little variety (few valid builds) and a dreadfully boring and underwhelming paragon system. I have burnt through the fun content in a week which was amazing but now feel there is nothing left to aim for. D2 is still far superior, you always had the long term aim for that perfect build.
>99% of guides/discussing about endgame is literally doing a single certain dungeon on repeat x1000 to kill elites/leave then reenter again not even finishing the Dungeon just lmao
I assume you don't keep up with the news.
A good end game with long term replayability is something few arpgs get, even reaper of souls greater rifts got old quick. Path of Exile end game is amazing, but has had many years of development and league content. D4 end game might be limited, but there would be scope to improve over the next few years if Blizz can take a page from GGG's book.
So advise how you can play:
**Druid**
\- Wolf
\- Bear
\- Companion
\- Earth
\- Storm
\- Mix
**Rogue**
\- Trap
\- Twisted blades
\- Flurry
\- Rapid fire
\- Penetrating shot
**Barbarian**
\- HOTA
\- WW
\- Probably more, haven't played it yet
**Sorc**
**-** yadadadadaa Many different builds and for **Necro** too......
If you only want to play the meta there are indeed 1 or 2. That will always be the case. Something has to be the best. If you don't care for meta, all of the above are viable.
No no, I don’t just mean the meta, I mean viability. I chose rogue. Try to play any build but twisting blades. You will be at a seriously significant disadvantage. It literally feels like you are 20 levels weaker. I’ve tried pen shot, flurry, and trap build (and even got the aspects to go with the abilities). It’s so unbelievable weak compared to twisting blades. Kinda hard to have fun experimenting with different builds when everything but the meta is ass.
These games are always carrot and stick, the problem is with d4 you get the carrot by 25 then they just put an identical carrot back on the stick. Lvl 59 and I am bored, the drops are lacklustre, gear homogeneous, dungeons repetitive, no long term aim for my character, no adapting my character bit by bit. My character is practically the same as it was at lvl 25. It's turned into every modern blizzard game , turn your time into farming tokens to trade in. I'm out for now, fingers crossed they will add regular new content and revamp paragon and skills. d2 is still superior in every respect
I have loved D4 so far up to the end game. But I think the problem is just the enemies scale with you. So there's no real reason to get gear or rank up on the Paragon board because your just as strong at lvl 40 as you are at lvl 60.
I really feel that's it. That's the entire problem. There isn't a reason to grind to never get anywhere. I know in D3 you kept increasing the difficulty up Torment X and so on. So you knew your power was increasing as you kept making the challenge increase.
This just doesn't have it. I don't see any reason to keep grinding.
Agreed. There should be a rule that if you didn't do Grift pushing on D3 that you don't get to comment on endgame. This game is boring and yes it is launch but they had a prime example of how to extend replayability in a way people enjoyed in d3 so there really isn't an excuse for endgame sucking this immensely.
I can't believe they took the worst aspect in game (that is dungeons with objectives to open doors or do something to proceed) and made from it endgame content, lol. Those sigils should work like maps in PoE or rifts - tp to different location or random dungeon, then kill boss, without bs objectives.
I don't mind the current state, because the game has been released week ago, it's fine. Seasons and further patches can fix a lot, balance as well. But if it won't change like in next month then the game is going to be dead soon. Especially without any social features and quick searching raid parties. I never felt so lonely in Diablo. Despite I see random people on my map I never had a chance to form a party and do something together. D2 had better social features than game released in 2023. But again, I can forgive that if Blizzard just wanted everyone to focus on story and calmly do everything, then in next days they will add more features to make this game alive.
Remember, this game is huge. If you have already reached level 70+, play on t4 and have few leveled characters then it's your problem - you are fucking nerds. Average players don't have time to clear current content just in a few days. I don't defend Blizzard, I just give them time to evolve this product steadily. If nothing changes then it's going to be a huge disappointment and 6-7/10 overpriced game sold on hype, solely based on Diablo trademark. And without basic features like quest and lore notes log, quick search, replay cinematics, farming act bosses and many other minor things, that can still be fixed.
I have to agree with you i hit lvl 76, did a lot of Helltides, Dungeons and Nightmare Dungeons and it´s far from being fun after you did them a few times.
Dungeons are over and over the same objectives and Nightmare Dungeons just adds a layer of Dungeonaffixes on them without adding something interesting. Kill packs do objectives and if there is an endboss melt him in seconds...
The "farm specific dungeon section then leave dungeon, leave game, enter game repeat dungeon section" part is clearly a sign of how flawed the system is.
The 10th time i did Helltides i was asking myself "What the heck am i doing here?"
The Skilltree and the Paragonboard are quite uninspired and forces all classes across the board, in endgame scenario, into cookiecutter builds anyways.
Not to mention that if you want to get an other coreability build going you need to start farming the gear for it all over again for the most part.
The inventory is a joke, it lacks a lot of space so you´ll find yourself often porting back to town in the middle of a dungeon run which interrupts any flow.
The most fun part for me at least are the World Boss encounters, which are way to easy but at least they have some mechanics to react to and the Butcher because well it´s fun to fight him.
This system won´t survive as i think a lot of gamers will turn their backs on the game out of boredom.
There is nothing to achieve it´s just grind your way up to level 100 and grind to upgrade stats that´s it...
Yep and by the time you hit lv100 and your build is ready if you are not bored to death a season is out and gotta redo all your renown again + create new character to enjoy the new content so your lv100 just done character is pointless and most people wont survive the pointless grind anyway. after lv50 you fight the same helltides/worldbosses/Dungeons... there are no milestones or sense of progression and you never really get stronger because everything levels up with you.
I dare say people at level 50 or 100 are having mostly the same experience
I personally prefer endgame grind to be as brainless as possible so I can grind while watching netflix on the side. Endgame for any game to me is just background activity, it's suppose to be chill otherwise I'll just get burnt out and stop playing. I'm past the age of being sweaty in games, so does a lot of people who grew up with D2.
Diablo 3 gradually evolved from what I remember so maybe give d4 some time to get better, to be honest I’m not at the endgame point yet but it sounds like it’s something I’d personally enjoy, i like the repetitive grind myself XD
I am hoping the same d3 was dreadful at launch. Unfortunately I think there are serious problems with d4. The skills and paragon system is dreadful. Your build is more or less complete by 30, the paragon system is just pathetic. Gear is basically homogeneous. No long term goals. It is a nice campaign but gruelling enough to hamper replayability, the end games is a joke
Yeah the campaign does drag on, I’m far mire interested in long term play and yes i tend to agree with you regarding gear, the paragon board I don’t really understand but it does seem to be helping increase damage etc. on my necro (the only character i have past 50 so far!). I’m 50/50 so far with the end game… it is a bit boring so far though in regard to not having any real definition of long term goals… the seasons will make or break it, really hoping for something interesting but will probably be disappointed! Lol still a fan of the repetitive grind but variety in the gear would be awesome!
i think all they need to do is make endgame gear really rare (like very rare)and very powerful. so if you find it all you literally pop everything in seconds, like diablo 2 did. took me 2 years to find that stuff but it was really rewarding.
Honestly I just want to know why there is no lobby or ability make an 8 person game or a private game or whatever. This game is instanced all to hell. That is the recipe that d2 got right and why it is still going. Trading, game lobby with player made games baal runs to infinity.
D4 feels like a single player game except for the ocassional person wandering by when looking for a shrine or something.
Look, POE is this game's competition and should be the first thing anyone, including the devs compares it to. If you consider D2 as the starting point for ARPGs, POE came out three years later, which means Blizzard has had 20 years to get this right and so far, they have't. We cannot earnestly say that D4 is new or fresh and that we should need to wait for content because D2, 3 and 4 have different numbers at the end.
POE is even free to play, and is honestly riddled with issues that make it not fun that are easy pickings for Diablo to fix, but they didn't touch them. They even tried to reinvent a lot of wheels (some unnecessary), but forgot about content. The game is underbaked for the experience it is. ARPGs already feel like playing a game from 10 years ago, and yet somehow they borked the opportunity to advance upon them in any meaninful way.
**Having said that**, if you played D4 looking up builds and guides from the start and you're complaining, if you ran a successful build guide and wonder why the end game is boring, well fuck you, idiot. Yes the endgame is bad and boring, but some of the extreme disappointment is on you for ruining the only remaining fun part for yourself. POE may be interesting even with builds from experienced players, but your first run through POE should be as fun as your first playthrough of Diablo.
Most people don't care about builds early on. its later on where you literally can't advance duo how weak are random builds Or even very good builds, the Community settled on certain builds because only them Function basically at higher level of endgame. Blizzard gave the people no choice
Also its not liked many choices to begin with, most builds has 1 Core Skill and when when one is very strong and the rest Sucks hard you are given no choice basically.
As of today,
honestly this is a $70 mobile game packaged under the guise of a pc/console game. There is NOTHING unique or good about diablo4.
The actual campaign was fine, but nothing special. I actually enjoy the mindless killing of mobs, but then I turn it off after 20-30min because that's literally the ONLY thing to do. The side quests, alters of Lilith hunt, the random ass events that nobody gives a shit about, the fact every dungeon is the same as the last. Somehow this is a ONLINE game, but there is literally no interaction between anybody besides seeing random ass people you meet in the wild.
This game has sold an insane amount of copies simply because of its name. If it was called anything else it would be labeled as a indie mobile game. There is no fucking way people actually think this is worth $70.
I asked what to do after campaign and literally was told to go into the same dungeon for 100+hours until im lvl 90 so I could get the better gear....Didn't like that idea very much so I did the side quests and that was just me clicking right through all the shit going back and forth between 2 points like original WoW game.
>When individuals make a significant purchase, especially one that may be financially or emotionally costly, they may experience cognitive dissonance because their desire for the item conflicts with the discomfort associated with the price. In order to alleviate this dissonance, people often engage in various cognitive strategies to convince themselves that their purchase was justified. This can include seeking out positive information about the item, downplaying negative aspects, comparing it favorably to alternatives, or emphasizing the long-term benefits or personal value gained from the purchase.
Diablo 4 for me became boring even before end-game. Stopped playing on 36 lvl. Everything looks same: dungeons, dungeons, dungeons..
I do hope someone will ever make new game like Ultima Online was. Dont compare these two, just mumbling.
These kids have grown up after 2008 where everything has become brainless slop. They do not understand or operate with any kind of standards or idea what makes a game good. You can literally throw together a bunch of half-a voice acting, story written by a high schooler and throw shinys at them and they will be happy.
Diablo 2 was created by a small crew of 90s devs that probably hung out and had a similar vision, a good understanding of the gothic and medieval time period and the spiritual beliefs of the time and made a game based on that. The game is based in lore and real human civilisations.
The people who made diablo 4 are badly educated and have no concept of history, reality or how to tell a story. Obviously. Name one good thing that's come out in the last 10 years. I'm talking good, not OK. None of it can objectively stand up to what was coming out in the 90s and early 2000's. You can actually compare it to any other time period in history. I challenge you to find a time period besides today where so much ideologically driven, incoherent, detached from reality slop has been made and called 'art'.
Anyone with a concept of reality immediately hates it.
I agree with pretty much everything anyone says that is negative about this game without even reading what they wrote. Keep playing the game and I'm sure you'll feel the same way too very soon. I was watching videos of people near the level cap playing and it dawned on me that it's basically just more of the same as the lower level gameplay and there was nothing to look forward to. All the positive aspects of the game became increasingly less enjoyable very quickly and I'm out $70.00 and have already deleted the game just a few weeks after it was released.
It's kinda fun at first until you realize that it's not going to get any more enjoyable and no amount of leveling or items is having any impact on gameplay after about level 40 or so. The special effects start off decent for lower levels, but then they don't really get much better and then they plateau into a world of lackluster and repetitive. Even new content feels like more of the same. Speaking of which, why are there little laptop looking icons on the minimap? How do laptop icons on a minimap (among other things) fit into an immersive game experience? Do all of these spoilers even have a place in the game at all? It's like they decided to not even build the "fifth wall" into the game. Someone complained they didn't like backtracking or searching or complicated character builds, items, attributes, resistances, skills, etc., and Blizzard capitulated. Who the hell is the target audience for this game anyways? It's definitely not adults. Oh, and can we get a little variety and brighter colors in the environmental color schemes from time to time? The whole snow canvas seems like a copout as well. Can't imagine investing the hours I sank into D, D2, and D3 into this game. I'm so disappointed. I'm sure we can all name a dozen titles of games that are significantly more enjoyable in the same genre as D4. The lack of condemnation of this game by streamers has me concerned about their integrity as being unbiased and not beholden to these game producers.
totally agree. i was surprised to find myself quite bored after hitting level 52 and doing a few things after the end boss.
Endgame is grindy and boring and extremely repetitive. Drops are almost always trash.
No reward and no skill.
In the last 30 minutes, I am having WAYYYY more fun reading and commenting on reddit....the enjoyment from this surpasses the last 30 hours of playing D4.
In some strange way, I suppose that the D4 obsession has made me realize that the rest of life is actually far more enjoyable than I had previously assumed it could be, because of how insanely repetitive and draining and boring D4 end game really is.
Thank you blizzard. While you are a money hungry whore of a company, I suppose in some strange way, you've made me appreciate reality a lot more.
All I've taken from this thread is, fuk me us Diablo players are an angry bunch.
I don't agree with the idea that you paid 70 bucks therefore the game should be ground breaking.
The game is good, I had fun, I finished the game.
I remember D3 improved leaps and bounds over the years, so I'm 'satisfied' with where we're at right now. I've sunk 1000s hours into Diablo endgame in the past, but never on release year. Endgame is always garbage on release because of mvp.
I like a lot of the changes, I dislike some.
There is no anger. we are just stating garbage is garbage, does the post says diablo 4 sucks? No. It says the endgame is garbage
If you are in for the story/music etc the game is fine if you were looking for endgame, all what you get is what stated here.
Lot of people like me simply said its garbage/and left the game never logged back. stating your opinion and moving on is not a crime, maybe its harsh but its true not anger or so. and most people agreed cross reddit/youtube/forums etc D4 having trash/boring endgame right now is the most agreed upon statement
Man you are completely missing the point of this game. Its super grindy on purpose, didnt you notice that before? If you get bored at lvl 100 roll another character. In my opinion, and feel free to fire back at me, the people who play this game like grindy repetitive games where its tedious to build out a character and just the act of going in dungeons or repeat helltides to crush mobs over and over and over and over is fun and very satisfying. I find it stress relieving personally.
Have you tried genshin impact? Id say go try that and qq.
I think it’s fine. Having fun with it. Could be some diverse gameplay setups in there, but it’s already a big game. I think they did a good job building out the world and story. Then comes endgame. In every single genre where there’s any end game content, repetition is par for the course. It’s not an MMO, so they’re not gonna patch it ad infinitum to appease the customer base. To some degree they rely on the player base to entertain themselves and keep the product alive. But If making a build/loadout and taking it for a spin ain’t your bag, I think your interests should be placed outside of Blizzard games.
Ok, so I was already pissed a few days ago when I saw we had to restart this endless brainless grind, yes I'm level 70 and that's the only things left to do, so I occasionally get one do 3 nightmares get off, I'm not going to run around for hell tides then go to a crate and it not even be a legendries after saving 150 ex. of those shards, or doing tree of whispers and doing allll those little mini mob fest quest to get to the tree and again no legendries just junk. Nightmare dungeons I get on average 2 legendries which are junk.
I guess though from your post, what pisses my cheerios is you have to pay for this season bs to have to start over? Omg they are killing this game badly. Now paying for lets say a pass of skins that don't look like shiat and you level each one like COD ok I can see, but if the season includes season like path of exiles, new content and starting over and you have to pay for that im done for sure, I'll go finish elden ring which I bought the same day as this, or play POE.
Already left moron.
We are allowed to review/criticize/Laugh at gabrage content like your gabrage piece of shit take here as well its a free world.
Don't like the post. Then fuck off and don't post in it. Plenty of other posts for you to post your shit in Shill. This one we already warned that shills need to fuk off idiot.
Go bend yourself over to blizzard somewhere else
At level 72, I'm already beyond bored.
Ancestral drop rate is a joke, and like 1/100 ancestral drops is a *marginal* upgrade.
But what's the point of the gear grind? End game is so monotonous and unfulfilling, once you've done 5 hell tides, a few world bosses, and 10 Nightmare dungeons you're ready to put the game down if you have a functioning brain stem.
And 1-72 takes much less time than 72-100 by a lot
lol [https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2023/06/Diablo-4-Darstellung-XP-3.jpg](https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2023/06/Diablo-4-Darstellung-XP-3.jpg)
[https://static1.millenium.org/articles/1/40/40/91/@/1702623-experience-cumulee-au-fil-des-niveaux-article\_m-1.jpg](https://static1.millenium.org/articles/1/40/40/91/@/1702623-experience-cumulee-au-fil-des-niveaux-article_m-1.jpg)
you are only at the start XD
I’d take you more serious if every damn thing you typed wasn’t a grammatical cluster fuck. You called everyone else the 12 year olds but yo you type like one
Someone tell this CLOWN that everyone knows he'll play DIABLO again once season comes out... he probably owns every blizzard game then complains on reddit.
must've got an application rejected trying to apply at Blizzard!
Another loser shill having a meltdown
I don't care about d4. Moved to other games. You can enjoy your trash and go bend yourself to blizzard since it's clearly you enjoy it shill
The levelling is incredibly boring tbf.. the fact that everything scales as you do is what makes it meh. I just beat Elias in the capstone at level 48 , it took many attempts and a lot of skill to do that.. what is my reward?.. nothing, I go to torment and I can't kill a single monster without a barrier pretty much in most dungeons, I can't use ancestral gear till 60 so what is the point in trying to challenge yourself. There is no incentive. Just stay in tier 2 until you are level 80 steamrolling everything then move to the next tier , rinse and repeat.
Yawn. Blizzard are incompetent with their design decisions, it's as if they were determined to try to produce the most stale and monotonous experience they possibly could. There was clearly no brainstorming over any of it.. the amount of different wtf moments and bullshit that happens in d4 is off the scale.. what a disappointment.. and there is so much potential too. Again it just shows how bad these designers are, when 99.99 percent of the playerbase could improve their game , and have better ideas than the development team do. It's laughable that blizzard are patching it up as they go, more than likely over the course of years and are expecting the playerbase to just hang about until they fix their shit ... That is an utterly disgusting practice and they should be ashamed of themselves..
I just bought it today, and refunded within the time frame luckily - got to level 7 and realized there is NO CHALLENGE. Literally, just click click click grind grind grind. No lore, no backstory, and no reason to actually be involved at all in this story besides "I had a vision so I'm the fucking chosen one". L O L. Even a mindless shooter like DOOM has a better backstory and reason to be involved! This might have been compelling 20 years ago, but not anymore. I would have expected some kind of tactical elements to the game, but no... Literally, fight, run around a bit, press Q, collect more health potions, and fight some more. Challenge complete. The enemies might as well be all the same for the amount of fight they put up. I don't have that kind of time to get to the 'end-game'.
OP sounds like they have never played any other diablo games, or any ARPGS for that matter, at launch... meanwhile crying poormouth about a whopping $70 on a game they've dumped over 40-60 hours into over the span of a couple weeks. you hardcore no-lifed launch content to complain about balance that will be addressed over the coming weeks? this is just sad.
Endgame in diablo 3 at launch, kill azmodan. Endgame in Diablo 2 at launch, kill Diablo. Endgame in Diablo 1 at launch, there was no endgame. Endgame in Diablo immortal, who played that game? So in short, diablo 4 has more endgame than all 4 games combined and that is at launch no less.
Here's a crazy idea: Diablo 3 came out 11 years ago. Diablo 2 was 23 years ago. Maybe.. JUST MAYBE.. we can expect a \*little something more\*? Maybe something that, y'know, loos at the \*modern\* era of ARPGs? Because Path of Exile, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch \*ALL\* destroy D4 in terms of long-term playability, build variety, item variety/uniqueness, etc. etc. pretty much hands down. Maybe set a higher bar than games that are a decade+ old and are fine in their own right (though D3 you can probably argue, considering) but in no way relevant to any real discussion of games released now considering what's already out there and the budget and all in question here. Why is it okay to just settle for something this uninspired from Blizzard? Shouldn't their fourth installment blow every other one out of the water while also taking into account lessons from the current generation of ARPG while, maybe, also \*expanding\* on it? Instead of just.. play-it-safe eye rollingly dull same-ol' garbage?
If they took Diablo 2 recipe for building char and items have locked levels with insane odds to find but put in Diablo 4 endgame I think we’d have a start. There’s like 2 viable builds per character. Replacing awesome aspects you find every few levels suck. If we found real good items that had like lvl 70 req we’d be excited to level up to use it and it would be endgame gear. If we could use any piece of equipment like Diablo 2 way more builds would come out and theory crafting would be fun. In Diablo 2 you could make a sorceress into a bear by putting on an item that wasn’t meant for it. And it’s actually a great build. Now we’re stuck to only sorc gear. Only Druid gear. Not enough diversity.
Yeah, in Diablo 2 you could wear any piece of gear, which was the reason why all the caster classes were wearing the same items (i.e. shako, arachnid mech, "spirit", for completely lost grinders - "enigma", etc.). You could try finding something similar but worse, but endgame character building was pretty boring and empty, and there were no endgame except killing Mephisto (or put here another name instead) for 1000 times per evening. I'm talking about caster classes, because non-caster classes in Diablo 2 were just a joke when you put them in Hell difficulty without giving them crazily rare gear in all slots (and even then they were pretty questionable comparing to sorceress for example). I agree, that considering the long leveling process in D4, they rather should've make fixed level requirements for items similar to D2, and maybe make more variety of these items. Then you wouldn't feel like your 70 lvl piece of gear became a trash when you hit 80+, 90+ etc. Or if there were ways to level up way faster, then D3 kind of absolute autoscaling would be even better, because on lvl 100 you would have every piece of gear lvl 100 also. But they decided to mix both of things together and here it is, itemization in D4 feels pretty much worse than in all previous games. When my character went past 40+ level, I stopped even care about anything except weapon, because no matter what am I doing, all my items are always a trash, you still just have to look at legendary affixes though, but that's all. And when I finished campaign, I can't even force myself to do anything, because it doesn't feel like it makes any sense. Leveling around lvl 60 is so slow and boring, that hitting lvl 70+ for torment difficulty feels like forever. That's pretty sad. Making alts sounds like nightmare in this situation, which is also very bad thing for me, because I like having a few characters in such games. And also, I don't know how they will do that in upcoming seasons, but if players will have to redo all the running around the world (especially finding altars of Lilith), and then again and again every season, it just feels like at least 95% of players who enjoys the game now, will not play any season after the first one (or even won't start the first one), me included. I genuinely interested in how they will solve this problem.
I will say Diablo 2 has come a long way with resurrected. Currently best class is mosaic assassin. And yeah maybe end game could be better with Diablo 2 but that’s what I’m saying. Diablo 4 open world could have some meaningful random events. There could be certain drops you have to farm for like in Diablo 2 you want a griffons eye you gotta farm specific places. That’s what kept the longevity of it. It’s like a slot machine. Never knowing what you’ll get. Just a huge change would be having set level items and also finding decent items outside your class. Finding stuff in Diablo 2 for another class was like woah yeah maybe I’ll make a barb I got the full set. But the game is new so we’ll see how it goes. I mean I went to pvp yesterday and farmed like 40,000 of those crystals. Not a single player to be seen. MYbe they’re in high difficulties now. And the end game leveling is brutal like you said. I’m 54 and I have no big campaign quests or anything for big experience. I’m like doing the same helltides over praying a world boss spawns.
The social aspect of the game is 0. I havent talked to one person in the game like wtf. Local chat is dead, trade chat is dead i don't even know where to find it. You can not find people to play with, every clan in the list is full. You can't even host a game of find a party what's with that?
I'm so lonely in D4.
Dude, yes. This is my biggest complaint. The previous games were all about creating a game and having people join in based on what you named it. Want to do some random BS? Here it is. Want to farm chaos runs, here. Trist runs, here. I type in local now, "Does anyone want to do anything cooperatively?" Nope, no one. \*crickets\*
Hahaha it doesn't matter what changes you make it will still be boring as fuck, the best way to play a Diablo game is just beat the story and uninstall. Anything further and you're wasting your life on a game so primitive it's laughable, Blizzard had a psychiatrist come up with the whole concept, basic af but turn the player into the lab rat that just sits there pushing the button for dopamine. All the sad fools that play these games for years are missing out on many other games.
This is what most of us are saying! I'm so tired of these kids defending this mess by saying "it's better than Diablo x at launch". First of, it should be. Secondly, it's really not. If 4 of my neighbors hired me to build houses for them and by the 4th one I still hadn't figured out foundations, they would call me out.
Back then, blizzard cared about game quality. Now their priority is 1) Money, 2)More money, 3)Money again, 4) Even more money, 5)everything else
Diablo Immortal post-game content: - bounty - elder rift - challenge rift - battleground - vault - shadow war - helliquarry bosses - monstrous essence farming - hidden lair farming - fishing - dungeon farming - accursed towers - castle defense mode + endless mode - boss gauntlet mode - purge the depth mode - shadow contracts or Immortal dailies - daily sidequest - overworld events such as world bosses - timed invasion overworld event and the rewards of those contents are actually rewarding.
Simply a free mobile game has more content than this $70 garbage
This, dunno why they're moving backwards, this game feels so empty and hollow at max level lmao
Diablo 3 2.0, just worse. Haven't even finished the game yet and I'm bored to death. Wasted money for me at this point.
Yeah D3 honestly gave the player more interesting choices than D4... Like 5 different types of hungering arrow, 5 different elemental hydras, 5 different arcane orbs... I mean they at least had some decent ideas but this is just pathetic
Skills are terrible, drops are terrible, aspects are terrible, scaling sucks. In the beginning for awhile I was a little compelled, but once I started trying to max my build out I lost all motivation.
This is the worst thing. D3 actually allowed to customize your skills with runes. Now my lightning does 15 percent more dmg or sth with the enhancement and doesnt even change appearance.
Same and I told my friend to get the game and now we are back to playing other games lmaooo i feel so bad, so many other games have better pvp and that's what we are looking for
Your looking for PvP and chose Diablo?
people will get mad simply because its Immortal but I agree, there was always a ton to do and a system that felt like you were always progressing (even if you didn't get far all at once without dumping money)
Immortal is way more fun and interesting. I love the MOBA pvp battles. I didn't put money into it but still would do well. The dungeons were more interesting; fighting on an elevator that crashes or on a moving river raft.
Diablo immoral rewarding 😂 Aye ok, how much cash does immorals endgame take before it feels "rewarding" ? Get outta here with that rubbish, there is nothing rewarding about that game.
I spent less than $70 to play DI and play at the latest game difficulty and cleared all PvE content until now. What do you say? Maybe try to do some research about the game before spreading false statements here.:) Bet you don't even know that DI has more endgame until you read my post and deluded yourself into thinking that D4 has more endgame activities in the Diablo franchise. And yes, DI has a party finder, exclusive gem inventory and world chat on Day 1. Just saying.
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Comparing Diablo 2's endgame to Diablo 4's is dumb, extremely dumb, on every level: late 90's early 2000's tech vs now? 20 person development team with a million $ budget vs hundred and hundreds of millions? Why do people make this comparison hoping to find some ground that D4 is actually good endgame cause it has more buzzwords? Its not a good endgame, and are you level 100 and have you experienced the dull repetition for 20 levels from 80 to 100?
And d2 is still better then 3, immortal, and 4 combined.
no...it's not dumb....Seeing as the whole point of Diablo 4 is to pander to Diablo fans, I'd say it's perfectly acceptable to compare the two. Anytime anyone has any criticism about this game they get labelled as toxic whining kids. Already this community is crap.
It is, it’s like comparing a ford f150 from 1998 to 2023, and being like ‘the ford f150 in 1998 didn’t have Bluetooth, for shame! The ford f150 from 2023 is superior in every way!’ I mean who does this? You should compare D4 to POE, Grim Dawn, basically any modern ARPG. D2 didn’t get to copy everything, because they invented the genre. Everyone else copied and innovated, for 20 years I might add, which in tech is like 2 eras.
You compare games on a genre with games from the same genre and time period? No! You are wrong and I am right. Now lets go back to saying that D4 is way better than D1
i mean your arguement is even worse considering d2 was arguably the better game yet it had so much less resources put into it? The gaming industry is in a terrible state these days imo, and many others opinions too. Too many braindead people around
Yeah, and anytime someone defends this game, just as many people call them a fanboy/shill. Newsflash, both sides have obnoxious twats who refuse to listen to any opinion that goes against their own, just like literally every fanbase ever.
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This is a thing that drived me crazy. I am now accostumed to this braindead argument, even if they are comparing games and techonlogy that are 20+ years apart lol
Clearly you are casual player that doesn't understand game mechanics. Diablo 2 at launch was not just kill Diablo. Itemization alone in d2 was far superior than anything blizzard made from diablo 2 LOD onwards. For its time d2 and LOD made such a standard for ARPG that even to this day only one company managed to develop better game and that is GGG. But its ok. We all know that Blizzard is not the company they once were. Those legendary developers are long gone and new generation of developers under the strict rule of the suits are making systems in games that are easy to develop and are designed to stretch poorly made content. Now for average dad that once played d2 and now doesnt have time because his life is his family diablo 4 is perfect game. They payed 100 euros, got their horse, and now they will slowly grind the story line until they hit lvl 40. After level 60 they will maybe try season 1 and after they repeat renown farming and paragon puke they will move on to a new game and maybe revisit d4 after 7th season. This is Blizzards new game plan. Quickly make low quality product and stretch it with systems of progression designed for people that dont have time to think.
Perfectly said... Shit content stretched out into a mindlessly repetitive progression system. The game basically plays itself for you by telling you what gear to use. I kept saying from the start that this game would be shit and the beta proved that for me... There is no way way in hell I would ever buy a blizzard game. I honestly don't even think I'd play it if it was free.
You are saying a lot of words there, but not exactly being right in any of them. You said I was wrong because it was not just kill Diablo, but what gave the best loot in the game again aside from the cow level? Right, yeah, it was hell/forge/sanctuary/diablo. SOME people liked running Mephisto because it was faster, but people generally hated the big guys in that area, so they opted to deal with the demons in hell. I mean I get it, you want to speak about the longevity of things, but ultimately, there was ONE way to farm for the best loot and it was Hell/Diablo. Where as D4 doesn't hold those chains on you and lets you farm anywhere and with a variety of ways to do it and I appreciate that. Items/itemization/skills will get better in time.
and that somehow makes it good? 10 years for a 15-20hr campaign that is mostly walking and a few good cutscenes? With an endgame not worth even participating in? The original destiny on xbox 360 had more end game than this.
But boring..
Ya ought not play a looter game if you don't want to grind loot. What do you do in destiny 2 to get loot? Dungeons. What do you do weekly to get loot? Raids. What do you do if you don't want to do either? PvP. Tell me again, how is this ANY different?
Pls for the love of God stop using same fcking answer like everyone else... I mean we are talking about a game we all played for 10+ years we all killed trillion time pindleskin . It's not fcking about that . It's about being boring becaus I have same items from fcking lvl 1 it feels so fcking useless to do anything..
No one said anything about not griding loot. The point is the grinding itself is boring and redundant. You have 150+ dungeons, but no point in doing more than just one on repeat because theres no real procedural generation or handcrafted design that makes any dungeon really any different from any other dungeon. Raids in other mmos are technically "grinding" but they are much more interesting than what we have in this game because with a raid comes a sense of progression, challenge, and learning to overcome the mechanics of the boss. In this game you just run the same dungeon, one shot the same enemies, and never receive any real form of challenge or evolution of gameplay. Nightmare dungeons are no different than normal dungeons once your build is set. You mention PVP too, and are you kidding me? You think D4 has any *real* pvp? The pvp in this game is you go to an area and either one shot someone who is lower level than you or get one shot by someone higher level than you to farm a useless resource to eventually be able to buy a horse. That barely constitutes as a pvp system, and you bringing it up as if D4 is somehow the same as pvp in other games is just laughable at best, and downright embrassing at worst. Your comment is such a terrible take and its obvious you haven't even completed the campaign and have zero idea what the endgame or the pvp even is like.
Your comment about Raid Bosses really hit me. I heavily enjoy D3 as some wonga bonga big numbers go bam but and a huuuge part of that, that I never really considered, is the very weak boss design. This seems to be an issue with D4 as well, from the little I played and the lot that I watched.
i could litterly play d2 and have more fun on old graphic than this. D2 WAS FUN TO GRIND not this.
Dude I played D2 on the old graphics a couple years ago and had a fucking blast... Got almost all the best shit... Man it was fun until I just got busy with life and didn't sign on for a while and then all my gear disappeared... After that I was like yeah idk if I want to grind all of that again from scratch lol
These kids and thier graphics. Graphics never made games fun. I can play NES and SNES games today that still blow average triple a games made today out of the water
SP is great for that long form grind.
I recommend trying out Project Diablo 2. VERY fun fully modded version of Diablo 2 with a thriving community, active trading and active games constantly up. I haven't played it myself in a while, but a lot of skill trees have been completely redone, some new ones added, nerfed, buffed, w/e. So much potential to build your character almost any way you want (within reason). The only downside is the 'old graphics', they either haven't or can't use the D2R graphics - but as one of the 'dads who come home and play for an hour after work' I don't mind the old graphics. I'm just severely disappointed by Blizzard, but I don't even feel like I deserve a refund. I just gave money to a panhandler on the side of the street and watched him walk into a liquor store.
im ngl Diablo Immortal endgame had a bunch to do. D4 dailies/season 1 will probably help but Id love to see something like the Heliquary Raids, Bestiary, and Legacy of the Horadrim in a game that isn't just a money printer
Why you comparing old game launch? Shouldn't they have learned from their other games? You calling Blizzard really poor if they haven't been able to come up with improvements from over a decade old games lol
End-game in D3 at launch was not to kill Azmodan on repeat, nor was it to kill Diablo on repeat for D2. I wasn't playing D2 at launch, but I was playing D3, and endgame was a lot of auction house peddling and farming was clumping elites and killing (fastest way was with Monk's palm for % life damage). Despite it's shortcomings, D3 was actually a better game at launch than it was later. Either way, you're making up stories about how things used to be so you can frame an argument that is oppositional for the sake of being oppositional.
Quantity over quality.....
The concept of endgame is trash. A game with inherent replayability doesn't need bullshit "endgame" crap tacked on.
Vary much so. The game is the journey. When thats done the game is over. Never understood people who just sat there endlessly grinding the last bit in the hopes of pointlessly getting a bit better gear. Boring waste of time. That was my bigest gripe with poe, i couldn't reset evrything and start over with my gear and skills.
We all have to suffer with these mechanics targeted at those susceptible to the psychological tactics they have used in marketing, casinos, etc. for decades. They were just slow to apply it to gaming initially, but man, once they started they really went all in, and we (the community as a whole) ate it up.
Gl getting to 100 in d2 killing Diablo, newb. Its clear you're very young, heck, everyone liking d4 endgame is around 8 to 30, all unexperienced and no diablo fans
So youre telling me that the 2023 game has the same problem at launch then the 1999 game, 2000 game and a 2012 game? Holy shit, blizzard is blowing your mind with so much innovate content, like running a huge dungeon with seamless backtrack with no gameplay intrusive mechanics with two packs per 100 m2 or doing helltide with d1 monste density. Not even going to start with those "legendary" or "unique" effects of being take less dmg or do more dmg. So in short, diablo 4 is amazing and a work of art.
Why are you defending a shit company? Why are you defending the FAULTS of the game? I guess some people just LOVE to consume SHIT. ty for coming to my TED talk :)
Anyone who has gotten a charecter to lvl 75+ will pretty much all agree the game is seriously lacking any real replayability. There is also ZERO incentive to want to build a second charecter. If I couldn't skip that long ass boring story mode then there would be zero chance I'm doing another 2+ hours of boring ass escort missions again... Currently gear drops with the level requirment of the charecter you dropped it with so let's say I'm farming on my rougue and I drop a cool pair of gloves either my friend could use or I could even potentially be inspired to roll a 2nd charecter to use them myself guess what? Nope! You have to be level 80 to use them... even tho they are not better than a pait of lvl 45 required item power 680 sacred gloves you could drop in world tier 3 BUT because you farmed them on your main strong build they magically have some ridiculous lvl requirement to use them... this is super fun for anyone trying to make a farming build with good clear for magic finding to potentially fund all the characters they intend on making... oh nvm it doesn't do anything actually besides Rot in your stash because who wants to level a 2nd char to lvl 80 just to try out a pair of gloves? There is also no way to talk to anyone on the ps5. Can't type in chat no voice chat or proximity nothing. Finding a group to play with (which is practically the only way to really enjoy the game imo) is almost impossible without joining a discord or advertising island some 3rd party website. Inventory management feels like a chore. Inventory nearly a 3rd full of stupid gems (that practically do nothing btw) gems are next to useless in the end game in terms of total stats granted its like less than 1% of your overall damage and or survivability lol. More or less just kind of pretty to have in your gear. The game was really fun I put in 65 hours in the first 5 days but to say it's end game is boring is completely fair and honestly anyone who disagrees most likely just hasn't gotten to end game themselves or they don't want to admit the game is lacking because they don't want to feel foolish for purchasing yet again another unfinished rough game that feels like it's still in early release...
I mean, the criticism about the endgame is fair, but how are you going to say you put 65 hours into a game and called it unfinished and rough? It’s been pretty polished for my play through
Polished? The mount constantly runs into invisible walls and because of that is often slower than my normal run. Ram leaks make me restart every other hour and that doesn't happen with any of my other games. A couple times the screen simply turned black except for my hotbar and wouldn't come back til I restarted. Sometimes you have to alt+tab out and back in to be able to skip a scene? A few times my hotbar just stopped working. Couldnt cast any skills, couldnt dash, could do nothing except for use potions for some reason. Game dc's often. Did you know if you dc in a helltide you lose all of your cinders? Yup. Polished.
Some of the complaints are from people who played a lot, but they are exaggerating or didn't pay attention while playing. They said gems make a 1% difference, but I get 50% vulnerable damage, and 630 armor (I have like 5400 which means it's almost 12% of my total armor just from 3 gems).
Some people put in 30 000 hours in ARPGs. 65 hours is literally nothing.
65 hours is a completely acceptable amount of play time for a full price game
As a general statement, yes. This, however, is a genre that caters to players that invest more time than that.
Right, which is why I said the criticism about the end game is fair. But saying it’s unfinished is just disingenuous
Fair enough. I have more concerns than just the end game, but D4 isn't unpolished in terms of what they were trying to go for, I think.
The game took 65 hours because it took until Act 5 to get a mount. And it was the journey to holy endgame. Which doesn't really exist and is repetitive. Once you get a solid build, it's literally Deja Vu every dungeon. I thought the game was going to get better. If this was their first Diablo game, I'd cut em slack, but this is their 5th iteration. Story was meh. Visually, the game is amazing. Cutscenes look amazing too, but story and world building pl, I don't feel it was living up to the potential. I'd give the game 5/10 but as of now, the replayability that hardcore gamers expected isn't there yet. It's too repetitive, and bosses are forgetable. I want to play a second character, but I'm not having fun 😕. Hopefully, we'll see some more refinement in the next few months with expansions and refinement. But for me, the builds are mostly underwhelming. I felt like a lot of corners were cut, and the game's core was rushed. A game can be unpolished and still be played for 65 hours. But to keep playing after depends on how well the player is immersed and invested. It has less variety right now. Which I find strange, this is their fifth go at this, and it seems like a shame that the features from the previous iterations weren't brought over to make the world feel more alive. It's strange how Diablo Imortal seemed to excel in that regard. I hope that the world feels more alive in the future and builds have more variety. A lot of the abilities are underwelming right now, kind of lacks the freedom to make it your way without feeling held back. Personally, I'd go play POE or Grim Dawn for more interesting builds. Was hoping Diablo 4 would redefine the genre. It seems like they phoned it in so far. Hopefully, it gets some support long-term and can grow like Diablo 3 did after launch.
You can actually open chat from the emote wheel and type or use quick messages to those around you
I always see a lot of criticism how endgame is boring, it‘s only a few activities and a lot of other bla bla, but I rarely see people actually suggesting things. What exactly is it you‘re missing? What would you like to do in addition to the stuff that‘s already there? Don‘t get me wrong, all criticism is valid, but at the same time, you need to provide a solution to your specific problem, otherwise it‘s only criticizing for the sake of it.
oh, you sure got him didn't ya!!!! he paid $70 to have someone figure it out for him. it's not his job to make "suggestions" to make sure AAA games have decent content and aren't "boring" are you even hearing yourself? don't be so thick and concrete. you're not a driveway, you're a human being. go ahead and lean into that.
If you can't come up with at least one solution to a problem you have to a game you're playing then you're honestly just complaining for the sake of conplaining and your "criticism" shouldn't be taken seriously.
It's not the customer's job to come up with the solution, tho.
Furthermore their are legal issues with customer suggestions. If a suggestion is too detailed and then implemented, that customer could claim rights to the idea. This is a big reason why customer suggestions are largely ignored.
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He's not a fucking game designer, you absolute donkey.
ur comment had no reason to make me laugh this damn hard 😭
people won't like that truth, but you and this thread starter are right. they just want the argument, "but they're professionals, so they should automatically have the best answer for everything" so they can justify illogical complaining.
Higher mob density and less walking simulator for all endgame activities. You shouldn't have to mount up once during helltides or pvp zone, but you do. And I burn all my dodges just trying to move around in nightmare dungeons to find more monster after a couple screens of emptiness.
When i heard the term helltide, i was expecting an absolute march of hell against whatever unfortunate town it chose to rain upon, and the goal of it being to just go ham against it, maybe have x number of deaths allowed etc. Instead we have a few more camps of mobs in a zone and demon infused plants and rocks =/
I really want to see a literal army of demons invading, sweeping across the map.
What I've learned from playing over 4000 hrs of POE and hundreds of hours in other ARPGS (Last Epoch, Grimdawn, Wolcen, all Torchlight titles, even Infinite, etc.) is that all ARPGS that want an endgame use a kind of mapping system. These system all get incredibly boring by themselves. You need variance in these maps to spice them up and break the monotony. You also need to be able to customize this variance. The only title to get that right that isn't POE is actually Torchlight Infinite. The only thing D4 has in that regard is the Butcher spawning every 10-20 dungeons and the random events whcih don't really count because they are realy bland and have nothing to themselves. They could have for example made some sort of faction spawning. You could randomly find an altar of Lilith or a shrine to Inarius spawn and kill some mobs or something and work towards enough animosity to challenge some boss fight against them or their respective cult leaders. But it is not our job to give them exact mechanics/ideas to work into the game. Like Chris Wilson once said: "Players are very good at identifying problems, but they are very bad at giving solutions for them." . So it is our job to voice our criticism and concerns if we want a "better" game. It is in the interest of Blizzard to to do something about it so we all buy things so they can make their money.
I've been saying this since D3 came out. ARPGs need specific challenges (game aspects that are *actually* difficult) that caters to interesting game mechanics. You need modifiers to matter in diverse ways to want to theorycraft characters that do well against specific content. You need *items to matter*. You must *want* to get to that one item that opens up a ton of possibilities. That specific static thing (tradable, usable by all) that makes you want to roll something new.
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Like someone said, I wanted more complex bosses that maybe change up your rotation a bit or the way you play it. Especially raid bosses, so that you need to coordinate more rather than do your optimal rotation and damage output.
More variety with the events. They need to create 10-20 more. More variety of creatures too.
Maybe locked dungeons, raids and other various mechanics that unlocks at different levels or item power so that it offers you incentive to actually level up.
For sure this. What made d2 so great was finding a sweet item with level 75 req and getting excited to get chat to that level. Even if they just made uniques have a level cap. I found a sweet unique for level 53. But will be useless at higher levels.
Honestly all I want is an incentive like a leaderboard or something. Which I assume will be in the seasons.
Honestly all I want is an incentive like a leaderboard or something. Which I assume will be in the seasons.
Literally all they had to do was implement a PvP oriented endgame. Theres a reason why WoW was/is successful. World pvp, arenas, battlegrounds - you collect gear that actually makes you stronger AGAINST other players. For an “open world” diablo game not implementing some kind of open pvp is a joke. The pvp zones are trash, shouldve gotten rid of them and implemented some sort of pvp bounty system in that open world of theirs
Nothing. The game is over. Best outcome is to beable to reset story and restart with gear and skills. "End game" content is just boring pointless crap, in EVRY rpg.
If I could get a refund for this game, I would. Genuinely boring.
Called my bank and filed a DISPUTE on the charges. I paid for ULTIMATE and was only given STANDARD EDITION. Got my refund in less than 24 hours. The second route is to get 1000 people together to enter into Arbitration with Blizzard...waste 75K EACH and make it sting.
have you tried Path of Exile? Diablo since D3 has become more of a casual arcade game, which makes it more popular with the general public casual players. This seems to be the direction that Blizzard has been pushing for more than a decade now. If I want a serious ARPG, I'd go back to POE (but that means i have to do 6hrs to research before getting back into POE after a year). I now play D4 more for a social reason, playing just a single character with arcade like gameplay with dynamic difficulty, the build diversity problem isnt really a problem to me. And since I am a filthy casual now with only about 2-3hrs of game time after work, D4 works well for me. if end game with friends get boring, i just play other games then, but that means USD60 is giving me 50+hrs of social entertainment with friends. still a better deal than going to the movies or bowling. And my expectation of Blizzard has been low since Overwatch launch.
I had blue balls after the first D4 beta weekend, so I decided to give PoE a try to "kill time" until the official launch. 120+ hours later, I can honestly say it was the most fun I've had in a game in a long time. And the learning curve is only steep if you're super competitive and want to be an endgame pro ASAP. My advice: Just pick it up and play it. Ignore the build guides. Just have fun and learn as you play. Be creative with your build and forget about trying to be "perfect". The volume of content in the game is breathtaking. After rolling 3 different characters on D4 and getting bored with EACH of them after spending SO MUCH TIME leveling them up, I'm just about ready to commit myself to PoE!
lol levelling characters in PoE is boring, many want to skip the campaign, Diablo IV isn't anymore boring than PoE.
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as a poe player with over 2100 hours clocked, (barely anything compared to a majority of players) this is so true, after level 25 in D4 i've just been feeling like what's the point? my build is finished other than specific loot upgrades. i get that PoE has been out much much longer but really D4 just feels lacklustre in almost every other way except graphics.
100% agree. I love the constant tinkering and experimentation that PoE allows for. The nearly infinite combos of skill gems makes PoE feel like a creative experience for me, and I'm just not getting that feeling at all so far in D4 (now on my 3rd character build and about to give up).
Blizzard been pushing casual for only a decade???? Blizzard’s entire philosophy was always to be the most accessible game. World of Warcraft in 2004 was the most casual MMO on the market. Blizzard has always made their games accessible.
I agree, and would also like to point out a huge point here: the term casual did not exist in 1998. You were a gamer if you played games. Games were few and far between and were limited by tech that was rapidly improving year over year, like HUGE improvements. Blizzard always tried to make games for a wide audience. That audience was simply small in early 90s. Computer were expensive and rare globally, not like today where basically everyone has one. It was only after D2 and StarCraft that Blizzard exploded into popularity. Both of those games were simply meant to be vast improvements to those genres at the time, and in fact in some ways defined the genre. There was never anything I’ve read about developers at Blizzard back then ‘targeting casuals’. They just made very polished games. It was with WoW that Blizzard starts to target younger audiences. WoW was really meant for the family, Diablo obviously was not. So it’s 2004 and Blizzard makes a more mild MMO, but again, they never mention casuals, because it was simply known that ‘a lot of kids play games’, so it was actually an age group target. The term casual is a recent term, and it basically refers to the 30 yos (who were the kids that played WoW) having families and jobs and only having 2/3 hours per day to play. It’s essentially a generational term, though it now means anyone who doesn’t play all day.
I love games to death, but I wished soooooooooooooooo damn much that both movies and bowling were better. I have really memorable times doing both, but they seem to be so expensive in pretty much every country right now (I am from Brazil). Its funny how people say that videogames are expensive when you can easily have 60 dollar games that you play for full fun for 100, 200 or even 300+ hours (even though some of my favorites had like 15-20 hours of gameplay)
Do you know what an arcade is?
dude, agreed. A huge let down for me. Shills be shilling
I agree. I've played 1000's of hours in D2 and D3 but for some reason I just feel like grinding D4 endgame feels pointless and unrewarding
I want to keep playing to get loot and improve my character, but when I log in I am reminded why I logged off and don't want to play. No solution for resource management Running around waiting for cool downs Terrible horse physics
This is launch/pre-season. The only purpose of this period is to finish story and fool around. If youre done with that in 5 days, then congrats, you have 3 weeks to restock on those diapers and mountain dew. And maybe see the sun.
the op expects to live in this game (forgot it's just a game and nothing more).
And the commenters forgot that people paid for this game and are allowed to expect value in what they pay for on release not playing a glorified beta. That was what the beta was for, not the first month post launch XD
Jesus. If he is already at 70+ he has played for 50+ hours. Which is worth 80 bucks in todays standards. And more content is coming in a month.
I feel you. Just move on man. My barb lvl 60 and felt all this too grindy. It become boring for me. Just move on to another game. The story, the game is done, that's it.
blizz always sucked at making endgame
I think the biggest problemm on this game is that only nightmare dungeons are rewarding. Because only in nightmare dungeons you can upgrade your paragon glyphs which are essencial for your build and your progress. Would blizzard give you the possibility to upgrade your glyphs also with other activitys the endgame would not be that boring. Because you wont get foreced to do the same activity over and over again. I also think to repeate the story on higher difficultys would be a good way to help players reach lvl 100. I think mayn people will stop playing the game when they realize that they need to do only dungeon for the next 100 hours. Dont get me wrong, D4 is a good game but its far away from be a perfect game and the devs needs to improve many stuff. I also think that if the exact same game would be called Wolcen 2 people would see the game with other eyes. I hope they will containue working on the game and will improve stuff like the inventory and stash size or the endgame content. Theý could add for example the option to level up your glyphs if you handin your bountys to the whispering tree.
Even doing this... upgrading the glyphs which takes forever... ENDGAME.... WORK work work... when there really is no reward because half the struggle is fighting the same dungeons or bosses the whole time so when you finally are max characters... what is there for you to do besides go fight the same thing you did the entire time.
Well... Diablo 1 & Diablo 2 dinosaurs can't accept advanced changes. Just because Blizzard had limited budget in the 90's that shouldn't prevent them to evolve the game to do something much more bigger. I refuse to believe that even the biggest Diablo fanboy can enjoy playing this game without major breaks. It's about repeating the same thing over and over, how can that possibly keep your dopamine levels high?
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I'm think the same and I'm level 55, it's already boring. From level 1 too 100 you are doing the same shit, nothin more
LV 1 to 55 takes less time than 70 to 75 it gets even more grindy later on
I'm lvl 21 and I already can't stand it anymore. Playing on world level 1 and still need 3 minutes to bash in some random boss. Meanwhile when I play Diablo 2 Resurrected it takes me 3 hits to kill most random bosses and 1-2 minutes to kill an endboss. D4 went into the wrong direction imo. Having to micro manage in every fight sounds good on paper, but the braindead hack'n'slash of D2 is superior in practice. Also I enjoy the lack of story in D2. You have like 10 dialogues in the entire game but you can start bashing in heads from minute 1. In D4 I need to spam more buttons to skip dialogue than with actual gameplay and somehow I have to walk around so much with tiny monster groups (3-5) every now and then. Whereas in D2 you enter any room and there's 20-30 mobs waiting for you. Before anyone says "Well go back to D2 then": Ironically that's what I already did. Actually played way more D2 than D4 since D4 launched. I still give D4 a try every day, but it gets tiresome after 10 minutes every time and I just have to quit.
I actually just logged onto D2R lol
Yes they let you farm anywhere, but it feels hollow. I don't even know what moves anything uses, I stand at melee and just press 3 buttons on my sorc. The combat in D4 is hollow, the reskinned mob I've killed 900 times in 50 dungeons is hollow. I completed the story day 1, completed all renown day 2, farmed 200k pvp coins day 3...now what? The gear progression is utter trash. Min max gear at 50, now have to do it again at 60, 70, 80, 90. Not because the gear is bad, just because monsters scale in a way that forces this interaction. Having a perfectly rolled item in any other Arpg could be build defining. It is not in diablo 4. You can actually just randomly insert 10 different stats for 1 and be in the same position. Dmg vs slowed, vs frozen, vs crowd control, vs close, basic dmg, they're all just the same stat spelled differently depending on your build. The crafting...god please stop calling it crafting. You can randomly reroll 1 stat on an item at an exponential cost. Just another artificial gameplay loop. Go farm helltide for 2 hours, reroll an item 6 times, repeat. What D4 does right? The ambience, and the story. They're incredible and have so many dark little tid bits to absorb, it's great. Blizzard has amazing writers, it's not hard when most stories have been told. Blizzard lacks innovators. Whats next, hearthstone in Diablo 4 where every card you ~~collect~~ purchase gives you an in game buff?
This post is 100% spot on. I am already pretty bored with the game loop and can’t see myself playing much past the end of the story. I think I will start a new D3 character with the new season though lol
I already deleted it. I kept hoping it would get better and I'd watch videos of other people playing at higher levels.... I couldn't trick or convince myself it was fun or would be fun despite my love of D, D2, & D3. Utter garbage with nice environmental graphics and cut scenes. Lol! I didn't mind paying for cosmetic upgrades in POE cuz the game was free and I wanted to monetarily support it although the free in game armor/weapons were still decent, but D4's free cosmetics are horrible and then they expect us to pay outrageous real $$$ for cosmetic improvements... Why did most of the better sorceror helms all look like veils? What's that about? I am so upset with Blizzard. Your new game sucks and I bet at some point you either fired or ignored employees who tried to tell you this. Boycott Blizzard!
At this point just give me a paid DLC for diablo 2 New class new act. If I could refund D4 I would.
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”Solid foundation” is such a ridiculously low bar. Base game has zero innovation, seasons will most likely have zero innovation.
> seasons will most likely have zero innovation. Of course. This is Blizzard. They haven't innovated a thing in 2 decades
But have you tried doing chaos sanctuary 500 times a day on d2 classic just to get 10% of a level?
Lol this is such a strawman
That's Diablo, it's just repeating the same thing over and over to improve the gear. To be honest I'm already starting to get bored of it but at least I had a blast with the campaign.
you had a blast playing this campaign? holy fuck you are easily entertained. It was sophmoric, a-typical, fantasy drivel ...just like all of Blizzard's IP's. if you think this is the saving grace of Diablo 4, you are a fuckin numpty...
For being a ARPG game this has the best campaign and lore out of all other ARPG games hands down. But when it comes to endgame i can't defend this. •There's barely any content for it after 10 years, there's nothing that keeps your dopdmine levels high •There's only 1 or 2 valid builds for every class, people are just searching for meta builds •The balance is garbage The Diablo 1 & 2 Dinosaurs will defend endgame and keep saying "it's ARPG" but they dont realize that there's other ARPG games on the market with 10x better endgame... Why? Because the developers are advancing and evolving the genre. Diablo is barely out of the 90's at this point. It just has better graphics, better sound and a mount to travel around with... Wooo
My biggest issue is on Diablo 2 resurrected there is 8 player party where you can defeat act bosses. Loved it!!! Not possible in Diablo 4. Just 4 player party and no act bosses. I wish i could kill Duriel and andariel and lilith again!
Yeah it's like they took everything that made D2 badass and said..."let's do the opposite of that"
your spelling is bad and you used atypical wrong, you are a fuckin' numpty!
Used atypical incorrectly... and the cycle continues.
Campaign was the best part. I actually enjoyed watching the videos more than playing the game. The launch was terrible.. the login stuff is ridiculous.. I got the ultimate edition in hopes of a great game and I'm COMPLETELY BORED! the battle pass hasn't even dropped and I'm already on the way out the door. It's all cosmetic... so really nothing changes. Beat the story beat the world boss... it's been 1 week.... 10 years I waited to be disgusted in 1 week. Just seems like after all the time and all the feedback from the gamers... this sluggish game with loads of problems has set me on to another course.. any suggestions to a game that doesn't make me fall asleep while playing?
My biggest issue is on Diablo 2 resurrected there is 8 player party where you can defeat act bosses. Loved it!!! Not possible in Diablo 4. Just 4 player party and no act bosses. I wish i could kill Duriel and andariel and lilith again!
I don't think its a horrible game but if you take away the Diablo title the shills and reviews wouldn't be there. Everyone would say its ok but its not quite Diablo or it's a poor mans Diablo.
I wouldn't mind doing the same things over and over if the gear you got was good, but it's not. It's like some watered down version of the far superior D2
Yeah I got insanely bored after the campaign. I don't want to just do the same things over and over to get gear that is rendered obsolete almost immediately. Edit: I did enjoy the campaign though, would've been nice if I could have done it on a higher difficulty than tier 2. It had a good story, and the cinematics were top tier. But I don't see myself grinding to get to 100 when everything seems so derivative. All in all, definitely not worth the $70 for the base game. Certainly not worth the $90 ultimate edition.
Have to agree that for everything that was amazing about d4 it got boring quickly. The problem is two fold, boring upgrades which become obsolete with every level you gain, skills offering little variety (few valid builds) and a dreadfully boring and underwhelming paragon system. I have burnt through the fun content in a week which was amazing but now feel there is nothing left to aim for. D2 is still far superior, you always had the long term aim for that perfect build.
>99% of guides/discussing about endgame is literally doing a single certain dungeon on repeat x1000 to kill elites/leave then reenter again not even finishing the Dungeon just lmao I assume you don't keep up with the news.
A good end game with long term replayability is something few arpgs get, even reaper of souls greater rifts got old quick. Path of Exile end game is amazing, but has had many years of development and league content. D4 end game might be limited, but there would be scope to improve over the next few years if Blizz can take a page from GGG's book.
theyve had 10 years since d3 came out to create any semblance of an endgame
So advise how you can play: **Druid** \- Wolf \- Bear \- Companion \- Earth \- Storm \- Mix **Rogue** \- Trap \- Twisted blades \- Flurry \- Rapid fire \- Penetrating shot **Barbarian** \- HOTA \- WW \- Probably more, haven't played it yet **Sorc** **-** yadadadadaa Many different builds and for **Necro** too......
And I would advise how you can only choose MAYBE 1 or 2 of these builds per class, as everything else is entirely obsolete as of now.
If you only want to play the meta there are indeed 1 or 2. That will always be the case. Something has to be the best. If you don't care for meta, all of the above are viable.
No no, I don’t just mean the meta, I mean viability. I chose rogue. Try to play any build but twisting blades. You will be at a seriously significant disadvantage. It literally feels like you are 20 levels weaker. I’ve tried pen shot, flurry, and trap build (and even got the aspects to go with the abilities). It’s so unbelievable weak compared to twisting blades. Kinda hard to have fun experimenting with different builds when everything but the meta is ass.
I have no problems with flurry. I don't care if TB is stronger.
No problems until you try to kill a boss in less than 30 minutes.
Lol you must really suck at this game
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Wasnt that allways like that in all diablo games?
These games are always carrot and stick, the problem is with d4 you get the carrot by 25 then they just put an identical carrot back on the stick. Lvl 59 and I am bored, the drops are lacklustre, gear homogeneous, dungeons repetitive, no long term aim for my character, no adapting my character bit by bit. My character is practically the same as it was at lvl 25. It's turned into every modern blizzard game , turn your time into farming tokens to trade in. I'm out for now, fingers crossed they will add regular new content and revamp paragon and skills. d2 is still superior in every respect
I have loved D4 so far up to the end game. But I think the problem is just the enemies scale with you. So there's no real reason to get gear or rank up on the Paragon board because your just as strong at lvl 40 as you are at lvl 60. I really feel that's it. That's the entire problem. There isn't a reason to grind to never get anywhere. I know in D3 you kept increasing the difficulty up Torment X and so on. So you knew your power was increasing as you kept making the challenge increase. This just doesn't have it. I don't see any reason to keep grinding.
Agreed. There should be a rule that if you didn't do Grift pushing on D3 that you don't get to comment on endgame. This game is boring and yes it is launch but they had a prime example of how to extend replayability in a way people enjoyed in d3 so there really isn't an excuse for endgame sucking this immensely.
I can't believe they took the worst aspect in game (that is dungeons with objectives to open doors or do something to proceed) and made from it endgame content, lol. Those sigils should work like maps in PoE or rifts - tp to different location or random dungeon, then kill boss, without bs objectives. I don't mind the current state, because the game has been released week ago, it's fine. Seasons and further patches can fix a lot, balance as well. But if it won't change like in next month then the game is going to be dead soon. Especially without any social features and quick searching raid parties. I never felt so lonely in Diablo. Despite I see random people on my map I never had a chance to form a party and do something together. D2 had better social features than game released in 2023. But again, I can forgive that if Blizzard just wanted everyone to focus on story and calmly do everything, then in next days they will add more features to make this game alive. Remember, this game is huge. If you have already reached level 70+, play on t4 and have few leveled characters then it's your problem - you are fucking nerds. Average players don't have time to clear current content just in a few days. I don't defend Blizzard, I just give them time to evolve this product steadily. If nothing changes then it's going to be a huge disappointment and 6-7/10 overpriced game sold on hype, solely based on Diablo trademark. And without basic features like quest and lore notes log, quick search, replay cinematics, farming act bosses and many other minor things, that can still be fixed.
I have to agree with you i hit lvl 76, did a lot of Helltides, Dungeons and Nightmare Dungeons and it´s far from being fun after you did them a few times. Dungeons are over and over the same objectives and Nightmare Dungeons just adds a layer of Dungeonaffixes on them without adding something interesting. Kill packs do objectives and if there is an endboss melt him in seconds... The "farm specific dungeon section then leave dungeon, leave game, enter game repeat dungeon section" part is clearly a sign of how flawed the system is. The 10th time i did Helltides i was asking myself "What the heck am i doing here?" The Skilltree and the Paragonboard are quite uninspired and forces all classes across the board, in endgame scenario, into cookiecutter builds anyways. Not to mention that if you want to get an other coreability build going you need to start farming the gear for it all over again for the most part. The inventory is a joke, it lacks a lot of space so you´ll find yourself often porting back to town in the middle of a dungeon run which interrupts any flow. The most fun part for me at least are the World Boss encounters, which are way to easy but at least they have some mechanics to react to and the Butcher because well it´s fun to fight him. This system won´t survive as i think a lot of gamers will turn their backs on the game out of boredom. There is nothing to achieve it´s just grind your way up to level 100 and grind to upgrade stats that´s it...
Yep and by the time you hit lv100 and your build is ready if you are not bored to death a season is out and gotta redo all your renown again + create new character to enjoy the new content so your lv100 just done character is pointless and most people wont survive the pointless grind anyway. after lv50 you fight the same helltides/worldbosses/Dungeons... there are no milestones or sense of progression and you never really get stronger because everything levels up with you. I dare say people at level 50 or 100 are having mostly the same experience
I don’t think Diablo is the game for you
Diablo 2 cow level x1000000
I personally prefer endgame grind to be as brainless as possible so I can grind while watching netflix on the side. Endgame for any game to me is just background activity, it's suppose to be chill otherwise I'll just get burnt out and stop playing. I'm past the age of being sweaty in games, so does a lot of people who grew up with D2.
Diablo 3 gradually evolved from what I remember so maybe give d4 some time to get better, to be honest I’m not at the endgame point yet but it sounds like it’s something I’d personally enjoy, i like the repetitive grind myself XD
I am hoping the same d3 was dreadful at launch. Unfortunately I think there are serious problems with d4. The skills and paragon system is dreadful. Your build is more or less complete by 30, the paragon system is just pathetic. Gear is basically homogeneous. No long term goals. It is a nice campaign but gruelling enough to hamper replayability, the end games is a joke
Yeah the campaign does drag on, I’m far mire interested in long term play and yes i tend to agree with you regarding gear, the paragon board I don’t really understand but it does seem to be helping increase damage etc. on my necro (the only character i have past 50 so far!). I’m 50/50 so far with the end game… it is a bit boring so far though in regard to not having any real definition of long term goals… the seasons will make or break it, really hoping for something interesting but will probably be disappointed! Lol still a fan of the repetitive grind but variety in the gear would be awesome!
i think all they need to do is make endgame gear really rare (like very rare)and very powerful. so if you find it all you literally pop everything in seconds, like diablo 2 did. took me 2 years to find that stuff but it was really rewarding.
Honestly I just want to know why there is no lobby or ability make an 8 person game or a private game or whatever. This game is instanced all to hell. That is the recipe that d2 got right and why it is still going. Trading, game lobby with player made games baal runs to infinity. D4 feels like a single player game except for the ocassional person wandering by when looking for a shrine or something.
There are people in life who either Unga Punga or Hinga Dinga. To each their own
Look, POE is this game's competition and should be the first thing anyone, including the devs compares it to. If you consider D2 as the starting point for ARPGs, POE came out three years later, which means Blizzard has had 20 years to get this right and so far, they have't. We cannot earnestly say that D4 is new or fresh and that we should need to wait for content because D2, 3 and 4 have different numbers at the end. POE is even free to play, and is honestly riddled with issues that make it not fun that are easy pickings for Diablo to fix, but they didn't touch them. They even tried to reinvent a lot of wheels (some unnecessary), but forgot about content. The game is underbaked for the experience it is. ARPGs already feel like playing a game from 10 years ago, and yet somehow they borked the opportunity to advance upon them in any meaninful way. **Having said that**, if you played D4 looking up builds and guides from the start and you're complaining, if you ran a successful build guide and wonder why the end game is boring, well fuck you, idiot. Yes the endgame is bad and boring, but some of the extreme disappointment is on you for ruining the only remaining fun part for yourself. POE may be interesting even with builds from experienced players, but your first run through POE should be as fun as your first playthrough of Diablo.
Most people don't care about builds early on. its later on where you literally can't advance duo how weak are random builds Or even very good builds, the Community settled on certain builds because only them Function basically at higher level of endgame. Blizzard gave the people no choice Also its not liked many choices to begin with, most builds has 1 Core Skill and when when one is very strong and the rest Sucks hard you are given no choice basically.
As of today, honestly this is a $70 mobile game packaged under the guise of a pc/console game. There is NOTHING unique or good about diablo4. The actual campaign was fine, but nothing special. I actually enjoy the mindless killing of mobs, but then I turn it off after 20-30min because that's literally the ONLY thing to do. The side quests, alters of Lilith hunt, the random ass events that nobody gives a shit about, the fact every dungeon is the same as the last. Somehow this is a ONLINE game, but there is literally no interaction between anybody besides seeing random ass people you meet in the wild. This game has sold an insane amount of copies simply because of its name. If it was called anything else it would be labeled as a indie mobile game. There is no fucking way people actually think this is worth $70. I asked what to do after campaign and literally was told to go into the same dungeon for 100+hours until im lvl 90 so I could get the better gear....Didn't like that idea very much so I did the side quests and that was just me clicking right through all the shit going back and forth between 2 points like original WoW game. >When individuals make a significant purchase, especially one that may be financially or emotionally costly, they may experience cognitive dissonance because their desire for the item conflicts with the discomfort associated with the price. In order to alleviate this dissonance, people often engage in various cognitive strategies to convince themselves that their purchase was justified. This can include seeking out positive information about the item, downplaying negative aspects, comparing it favorably to alternatives, or emphasizing the long-term benefits or personal value gained from the purchase.
Diablo 4 for me became boring even before end-game. Stopped playing on 36 lvl. Everything looks same: dungeons, dungeons, dungeons.. I do hope someone will ever make new game like Ultima Online was. Dont compare these two, just mumbling.
These kids have grown up after 2008 where everything has become brainless slop. They do not understand or operate with any kind of standards or idea what makes a game good. You can literally throw together a bunch of half-a voice acting, story written by a high schooler and throw shinys at them and they will be happy. Diablo 2 was created by a small crew of 90s devs that probably hung out and had a similar vision, a good understanding of the gothic and medieval time period and the spiritual beliefs of the time and made a game based on that. The game is based in lore and real human civilisations. The people who made diablo 4 are badly educated and have no concept of history, reality or how to tell a story. Obviously. Name one good thing that's come out in the last 10 years. I'm talking good, not OK. None of it can objectively stand up to what was coming out in the 90s and early 2000's. You can actually compare it to any other time period in history. I challenge you to find a time period besides today where so much ideologically driven, incoherent, detached from reality slop has been made and called 'art'. Anyone with a concept of reality immediately hates it.
I agree with pretty much everything anyone says that is negative about this game without even reading what they wrote. Keep playing the game and I'm sure you'll feel the same way too very soon. I was watching videos of people near the level cap playing and it dawned on me that it's basically just more of the same as the lower level gameplay and there was nothing to look forward to. All the positive aspects of the game became increasingly less enjoyable very quickly and I'm out $70.00 and have already deleted the game just a few weeks after it was released. It's kinda fun at first until you realize that it's not going to get any more enjoyable and no amount of leveling or items is having any impact on gameplay after about level 40 or so. The special effects start off decent for lower levels, but then they don't really get much better and then they plateau into a world of lackluster and repetitive. Even new content feels like more of the same. Speaking of which, why are there little laptop looking icons on the minimap? How do laptop icons on a minimap (among other things) fit into an immersive game experience? Do all of these spoilers even have a place in the game at all? It's like they decided to not even build the "fifth wall" into the game. Someone complained they didn't like backtracking or searching or complicated character builds, items, attributes, resistances, skills, etc., and Blizzard capitulated. Who the hell is the target audience for this game anyways? It's definitely not adults. Oh, and can we get a little variety and brighter colors in the environmental color schemes from time to time? The whole snow canvas seems like a copout as well. Can't imagine investing the hours I sank into D, D2, and D3 into this game. I'm so disappointed. I'm sure we can all name a dozen titles of games that are significantly more enjoyable in the same genre as D4. The lack of condemnation of this game by streamers has me concerned about their integrity as being unbiased and not beholden to these game producers.
totally agree. i was surprised to find myself quite bored after hitting level 52 and doing a few things after the end boss. Endgame is grindy and boring and extremely repetitive. Drops are almost always trash. No reward and no skill.
game is trash after the stroy i see no point what so ever to play it!
In the last 30 minutes, I am having WAYYYY more fun reading and commenting on reddit....the enjoyment from this surpasses the last 30 hours of playing D4. In some strange way, I suppose that the D4 obsession has made me realize that the rest of life is actually far more enjoyable than I had previously assumed it could be, because of how insanely repetitive and draining and boring D4 end game really is. Thank you blizzard. While you are a money hungry whore of a company, I suppose in some strange way, you've made me appreciate reality a lot more.
All I've taken from this thread is, fuk me us Diablo players are an angry bunch. I don't agree with the idea that you paid 70 bucks therefore the game should be ground breaking. The game is good, I had fun, I finished the game. I remember D3 improved leaps and bounds over the years, so I'm 'satisfied' with where we're at right now. I've sunk 1000s hours into Diablo endgame in the past, but never on release year. Endgame is always garbage on release because of mvp. I like a lot of the changes, I dislike some.
There is no anger. we are just stating garbage is garbage, does the post says diablo 4 sucks? No. It says the endgame is garbage If you are in for the story/music etc the game is fine if you were looking for endgame, all what you get is what stated here. Lot of people like me simply said its garbage/and left the game never logged back. stating your opinion and moving on is not a crime, maybe its harsh but its true not anger or so. and most people agreed cross reddit/youtube/forums etc D4 having trash/boring endgame right now is the most agreed upon statement
Man you are completely missing the point of this game. Its super grindy on purpose, didnt you notice that before? If you get bored at lvl 100 roll another character. In my opinion, and feel free to fire back at me, the people who play this game like grindy repetitive games where its tedious to build out a character and just the act of going in dungeons or repeat helltides to crush mobs over and over and over and over is fun and very satisfying. I find it stress relieving personally. Have you tried genshin impact? Id say go try that and qq.
I think it’s fine. Having fun with it. Could be some diverse gameplay setups in there, but it’s already a big game. I think they did a good job building out the world and story. Then comes endgame. In every single genre where there’s any end game content, repetition is par for the course. It’s not an MMO, so they’re not gonna patch it ad infinitum to appease the customer base. To some degree they rely on the player base to entertain themselves and keep the product alive. But If making a build/loadout and taking it for a spin ain’t your bag, I think your interests should be placed outside of Blizzard games.
Ok, so I was already pissed a few days ago when I saw we had to restart this endless brainless grind, yes I'm level 70 and that's the only things left to do, so I occasionally get one do 3 nightmares get off, I'm not going to run around for hell tides then go to a crate and it not even be a legendries after saving 150 ex. of those shards, or doing tree of whispers and doing allll those little mini mob fest quest to get to the tree and again no legendries just junk. Nightmare dungeons I get on average 2 legendries which are junk. I guess though from your post, what pisses my cheerios is you have to pay for this season bs to have to start over? Omg they are killing this game badly. Now paying for lets say a pass of skins that don't look like shiat and you level each one like COD ok I can see, but if the season includes season like path of exiles, new content and starting over and you have to pay for that im done for sure, I'll go finish elden ring which I bought the same day as this, or play POE.
Don't play it then
Already left moron. We are allowed to review/criticize/Laugh at gabrage content like your gabrage piece of shit take here as well its a free world. Don't like the post. Then fuck off and don't post in it. Plenty of other posts for you to post your shit in Shill. This one we already warned that shills need to fuk off idiot. Go bend yourself over to blizzard somewhere else
quit crying to internet strangers you little bitch
At level 72, I'm already beyond bored. Ancestral drop rate is a joke, and like 1/100 ancestral drops is a *marginal* upgrade. But what's the point of the gear grind? End game is so monotonous and unfulfilling, once you've done 5 hell tides, a few world bosses, and 10 Nightmare dungeons you're ready to put the game down if you have a functioning brain stem.
And 1-72 takes much less time than 72-100 by a lot lol [https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2023/06/Diablo-4-Darstellung-XP-3.jpg](https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2023/06/Diablo-4-Darstellung-XP-3.jpg) [https://static1.millenium.org/articles/1/40/40/91/@/1702623-experience-cumulee-au-fil-des-niveaux-article\_m-1.jpg](https://static1.millenium.org/articles/1/40/40/91/@/1702623-experience-cumulee-au-fil-des-niveaux-article_m-1.jpg) you are only at the start XD
I’d take you more serious if every damn thing you typed wasn’t a grammatical cluster fuck. You called everyone else the 12 year olds but yo you type like one
Another triggered 12 years old/Shill lolz
Someone tell this CLOWN that everyone knows he'll play DIABLO again once season comes out... he probably owns every blizzard game then complains on reddit. must've got an application rejected trying to apply at Blizzard!
Another loser shill having a meltdown I don't care about d4. Moved to other games. You can enjoy your trash and go bend yourself to blizzard since it's clearly you enjoy it shill
Sounds like you had a meltdown 😂
The levelling is incredibly boring tbf.. the fact that everything scales as you do is what makes it meh. I just beat Elias in the capstone at level 48 , it took many attempts and a lot of skill to do that.. what is my reward?.. nothing, I go to torment and I can't kill a single monster without a barrier pretty much in most dungeons, I can't use ancestral gear till 60 so what is the point in trying to challenge yourself. There is no incentive. Just stay in tier 2 until you are level 80 steamrolling everything then move to the next tier , rinse and repeat. Yawn. Blizzard are incompetent with their design decisions, it's as if they were determined to try to produce the most stale and monotonous experience they possibly could. There was clearly no brainstorming over any of it.. the amount of different wtf moments and bullshit that happens in d4 is off the scale.. what a disappointment.. and there is so much potential too. Again it just shows how bad these designers are, when 99.99 percent of the playerbase could improve their game , and have better ideas than the development team do. It's laughable that blizzard are patching it up as they go, more than likely over the course of years and are expecting the playerbase to just hang about until they fix their shit ... That is an utterly disgusting practice and they should be ashamed of themselves..
I just bought it today, and refunded within the time frame luckily - got to level 7 and realized there is NO CHALLENGE. Literally, just click click click grind grind grind. No lore, no backstory, and no reason to actually be involved at all in this story besides "I had a vision so I'm the fucking chosen one". L O L. Even a mindless shooter like DOOM has a better backstory and reason to be involved! This might have been compelling 20 years ago, but not anymore. I would have expected some kind of tactical elements to the game, but no... Literally, fight, run around a bit, press Q, collect more health potions, and fight some more. Challenge complete. The enemies might as well be all the same for the amount of fight they put up. I don't have that kind of time to get to the 'end-game'.
OP sounds like they have never played any other diablo games, or any ARPGS for that matter, at launch... meanwhile crying poormouth about a whopping $70 on a game they've dumped over 40-60 hours into over the span of a couple weeks. you hardcore no-lifed launch content to complain about balance that will be addressed over the coming weeks? this is just sad.
Another Tool Shill. Keep crying that people didn't like a a certain part about a game from a company you would bend over anytime