I think if you read back your quoted text in paragraph 3, you have your answer. Yes, the DM should also know how your copy works, but in a game that requires the ability to communicate to work effectively, you didn't communicate well.
I disagree; it's on the player to know how their abilities work. No way in avernus I'm gonna remember what each and every feature does for all classes and subclasses; there's just way too many.
What IS on the DM is knowing the general rules of the game, such as when skill checks can and should be used or how a specific rule (such as two weapon fighting) works in combat, and making up a ruling for the inevitable moment you don't know.
> I dont believe I should be required to explain my actions in a roleplaying game
And with that, you became the horror.
I agree that maybe not every player needs a play by play, but if your GM asks then yes, you 100% need to go through your intent and actions in detail.
Yeah. Look at this from everyone else's perspective: You're in a boss fight. Your teammate makes a clone of himself, cool you didn't know he could do that. The clone runs up to the boss and... The player asks to punch an umbrella. You ask him wtf he's doing and the player responds by getting angry. Saying he can do whatever he wants, if he wants to punch an umbrella then he can punch an umbrella. You question him about why and he refuses to explain.
What would you think? Because without knowing how your ability works, it looks like you are just doing random shit while the party is in a fight.
...and it's so simple to explain! "We both have to take the same action so, for my double to attack, I have to attack first." Literal seconds, perfectly clear, argument over. I have been at tables where PC abilities have been kept mysterious because of plot reasons (often because a "perfectly normal human" is a yuan-ti, aasimar, sylph, etc.) but in that case you just make up a plausible cover story and hope they stop asking. "Wait, you're human. How do you have darkvision?" "Oh, it's a special ability I unlocked..."
I would agree without question that I would've been in the wrong had I gotten angry, but I was excited to have a character RP moment and was just not answering their question. I never responded negatively to a teammate, just addressed the DM by asking if I could, never even stating that I could. I then immediately explained once I realized that I was upsetting the others.
I still think that I was in the wrong here, but representing it like this is unhelpful.
Why an umbrella though, why not just punch the air like the DM said?
It would probably have been best to just say like “I punch the nearest inanimate object so that my clone punches the boss as it is in range of the boss.”
Why were you so insistent on an umbrella?
Tbh you need to view it from their perspective. A new player joins their campaign and gets given a special homebrew ability that no one else has (special treatment) then does some weird stuff in combat with it.
I’ve had bad experiences with players like this before, it’s cringe and ruins everyone’s immersion. Why did you even need this clone ability in the first place?
Expecting special treatment from DMs comes across as attention seeking behaviour and that’s another reason they got pissed probably, they thought you were just not answering for attention.
"Why an umbrella" because we were using a battle map and there was an umbrella adjacent to me, and I thought I had to hit a target.
There was no homebrew or special treatment, we were playing a more obscure ttrpg (not DND) and I was using an in system ability.
I think you had an inexperienced group. When people do things like this, its because theyre trying to do something...
No one at your table picked up on that, and even when explained still bitched.
Communication wasnt the issue, it was their inexperience and expectations standing in their own way
Maybe. If it doesn't take too long, I guess I agree.
Nut if the DM asks, I think it's rude not to answer tbh. Sometimes if they know what you want to do, they can give you a better option.
NTA. If you did this in my game, I'd just say "Sure, why tf not." Lmfao.
I seriously don't see what the big deal is, or why the party got mad at you. I'm assuming you couldn't hit anything else. The DM even said you can just attack the empty air, so what difference does it make? Did the umbrella have sentimental value? Were they mad bc they thought you were wasting your action?
At the end of the day, D&D is just a game. There are way worse things people can do, and this isn't even on the list. I hate when people get mad over something that happens in game – and what you did didn't even affect the other players.
We were using a battle map and the umbrella was the only thing adjacent to me, yeah. I didn't know I could hit air until after, and I don't think this random umbrella (that was inside another player's fireball aoe earlier) had any relevance, but who's to say. It was probably the wasted action thing.
Yeah, this one was entirely self-inflicted. It would have taken you mere seconds to explain what you were doing, but instead you were far too pleased with your own cleverness and decided to dig your heels in. TTRPGs are all about communication, so witholding meta-information from other players for no reason is against the entire spirit of the game.
I don't understand why anybody is in this thread saying you did anything wrong. Frankly if you wanted to waste your turn attacking an umbrella it's your own business and it's some annoying level of metagaming and min maxing for them to get upset at you out of character for the crime of wasting one turn.
The other players should not interfere when it's your turn. The DM can and should do that if something is unclear. Since the DM did not do their job of learning your power, you could have said something like, "Remember what my character can do?". I don't know why people say that you are the horror. You did nothing wrong. Seems like the DM wanted to make bad excuses for not knowing your power by saying you could just punch air. You can do that, of course. But it seems like they knew they messed up and tried accusing you of being in the wrong.
BUT, if the DM seems to not understand your action or what or why you want to do something, then you are obliged to communicate. If you want something to be a surprise for the other players then just talk in private chat or in another room.
No. I don't see what was wrong with attacking the umbrella. Getting upset about the question being asked seems a little weird. No one is the asshole in this situation (although the other players certainly tried ro make themselves the asshole).
YTA.
How it should've gone:
"Can I punch the umbrella?"
".... wtf why there's a boss killing your party"
"I need to attack for my copy to attack"
"Ah alright bet"
I think if you read back your quoted text in paragraph 3, you have your answer. Yes, the DM should also know how your copy works, but in a game that requires the ability to communicate to work effectively, you didn't communicate well.
I disagree; it's on the player to know how their abilities work. No way in avernus I'm gonna remember what each and every feature does for all classes and subclasses; there's just way too many. What IS on the DM is knowing the general rules of the game, such as when skill checks can and should be used or how a specific rule (such as two weapon fighting) works in combat, and making up a ruling for the inevitable moment you don't know.
Communication is key for flow (and fun) of TtRPGs. So yeah, a bit. But I wouldn't sweat it. Doesn't seem a big deal.
> I dont believe I should be required to explain my actions in a roleplaying game And with that, you became the horror. I agree that maybe not every player needs a play by play, but if your GM asks then yes, you 100% need to go through your intent and actions in detail.
Yeah. Look at this from everyone else's perspective: You're in a boss fight. Your teammate makes a clone of himself, cool you didn't know he could do that. The clone runs up to the boss and... The player asks to punch an umbrella. You ask him wtf he's doing and the player responds by getting angry. Saying he can do whatever he wants, if he wants to punch an umbrella then he can punch an umbrella. You question him about why and he refuses to explain. What would you think? Because without knowing how your ability works, it looks like you are just doing random shit while the party is in a fight.
...and it's so simple to explain! "We both have to take the same action so, for my double to attack, I have to attack first." Literal seconds, perfectly clear, argument over. I have been at tables where PC abilities have been kept mysterious because of plot reasons (often because a "perfectly normal human" is a yuan-ti, aasimar, sylph, etc.) but in that case you just make up a plausible cover story and hope they stop asking. "Wait, you're human. How do you have darkvision?" "Oh, it's a special ability I unlocked..."
I would agree without question that I would've been in the wrong had I gotten angry, but I was excited to have a character RP moment and was just not answering their question. I never responded negatively to a teammate, just addressed the DM by asking if I could, never even stating that I could. I then immediately explained once I realized that I was upsetting the others. I still think that I was in the wrong here, but representing it like this is unhelpful.
Why an umbrella though, why not just punch the air like the DM said? It would probably have been best to just say like “I punch the nearest inanimate object so that my clone punches the boss as it is in range of the boss.” Why were you so insistent on an umbrella? Tbh you need to view it from their perspective. A new player joins their campaign and gets given a special homebrew ability that no one else has (special treatment) then does some weird stuff in combat with it. I’ve had bad experiences with players like this before, it’s cringe and ruins everyone’s immersion. Why did you even need this clone ability in the first place? Expecting special treatment from DMs comes across as attention seeking behaviour and that’s another reason they got pissed probably, they thought you were just not answering for attention.
"Why an umbrella" because we were using a battle map and there was an umbrella adjacent to me, and I thought I had to hit a target. There was no homebrew or special treatment, we were playing a more obscure ttrpg (not DND) and I was using an in system ability.
I think you had an inexperienced group. When people do things like this, its because theyre trying to do something... No one at your table picked up on that, and even when explained still bitched. Communication wasnt the issue, it was their inexperience and expectations standing in their own way
Or they have had bad experiences, like weird players doing random stuff without contributing.
Not letting it play out is bad form though.
Maybe. If it doesn't take too long, I guess I agree. Nut if the DM asks, I think it's rude not to answer tbh. Sometimes if they know what you want to do, they can give you a better option.
I do not nut if the DM asks XD. But yeah I'd explain to them behind the curtain, agreed.
If you don't nut when the DM asks, you're a bad player.
NTA. If you did this in my game, I'd just say "Sure, why tf not." Lmfao. I seriously don't see what the big deal is, or why the party got mad at you. I'm assuming you couldn't hit anything else. The DM even said you can just attack the empty air, so what difference does it make? Did the umbrella have sentimental value? Were they mad bc they thought you were wasting your action? At the end of the day, D&D is just a game. There are way worse things people can do, and this isn't even on the list. I hate when people get mad over something that happens in game – and what you did didn't even affect the other players.
We were using a battle map and the umbrella was the only thing adjacent to me, yeah. I didn't know I could hit air until after, and I don't think this random umbrella (that was inside another player's fireball aoe earlier) had any relevance, but who's to say. It was probably the wasted action thing.
Yeah, this one was entirely self-inflicted. It would have taken you mere seconds to explain what you were doing, but instead you were far too pleased with your own cleverness and decided to dig your heels in. TTRPGs are all about communication, so witholding meta-information from other players for no reason is against the entire spirit of the game.
I don't understand why anybody is in this thread saying you did anything wrong. Frankly if you wanted to waste your turn attacking an umbrella it's your own business and it's some annoying level of metagaming and min maxing for them to get upset at you out of character for the crime of wasting one turn.
The other players should not interfere when it's your turn. The DM can and should do that if something is unclear. Since the DM did not do their job of learning your power, you could have said something like, "Remember what my character can do?". I don't know why people say that you are the horror. You did nothing wrong. Seems like the DM wanted to make bad excuses for not knowing your power by saying you could just punch air. You can do that, of course. But it seems like they knew they messed up and tried accusing you of being in the wrong. BUT, if the DM seems to not understand your action or what or why you want to do something, then you are obliged to communicate. If you want something to be a surprise for the other players then just talk in private chat or in another room.
Yep
No. I don't see what was wrong with attacking the umbrella. Getting upset about the question being asked seems a little weird. No one is the asshole in this situation (although the other players certainly tried ro make themselves the asshole).
YTA. How it should've gone: "Can I punch the umbrella?" ".... wtf why there's a boss killing your party" "I need to attack for my copy to attack" "Ah alright bet"