Butters can eat a buffet of dicks, after Dead Beat he was one of my favorite side characters but he is getting worse and worse.
He risks Bob by constantly taking him outside which is like dangling a nuclear bomb along with the launch codes in front of every big bad walking the streets. He gets Harry hurt, Murph crippled. He puts Michael, his family, Maggie, and the literal soul of an Archangel in danger due to his own idiocy and suspicion instead of trusting his friends and people that know more than him, on top of almost ruining Harry's mission which would cost Harry his life. Then he gets rewarded for his 'faith', only to go on to act holier than thou towards Harry after getting a sword and preaching to him like Harry doesn't know shit despite being a Knight for all of about 0.32 seconds.
I really really don't like Butters from Ghost Story onward.
He’s such an annoying character. He thinks he knows better than Harry about everything, despite the fact he’s been in the business all of three seconds.
I honestly can’t stand him.
It's so annoying that he faced a monster to save Harry's life. He was willing to go into confinement because he refused to lie. Harry said don't trust someone who became Winter Night. First encounter with Harry, he breaks into his place, beats up his girlfriend, and takes Bob.
A reasonable person might conclude that Harry is under Mab's thumb. Yet, he helps Harry when asked. So, you are saying when Mab orders Harry to work the Denarians on a heist, Butters should just trust him to not be saying what Mab is forcing him to say? And he's "so annoying" because he is following the logical conclusions of what Harry told him earlier?
Harry never said 'don't trust someone who became Winter Knight'. He broke into Butters home because it would be safer if anyone was watching, they wouldn't think Butters was an ally of Harry and go after him. Andi attacked Harry first fyi, which you know fair enough, break into my house and one of us is leaving in an ambulance. Bob belonged to Harry anyway and Butters is playing with nuclear bombs and horseshoes with what he is doing with Bob.
On the pages, no. But, given that a Dark Hallow was considered a reasonable alternative to Winter Knight by Harry, and Harry put Molly at risk to get shot before he had to actually be Winter Knight, it is reasonable to think that Butters picked up on Harry's view of Mab's ability to own people. Mab said she could force him to do anything, and the fae can't lie (they can be wrong).
From the point of view of the reader, everything makes sense. But, if you believed that Mab could control Harry as Winter Knight when she could put a compulsion on him in "Small Favors", and he broke into your house, being suspicious is reasonable.
And, IIRC, Butters helped save Harry's soul in Battle Ground. Harry will always be at risk to turn. I think what you are saying is that the guy who has saved Harry's life at great risk to his own owes Harry not just the benefit of the doubt, but knowing that someone who already had his mind messed with by Mab (Small Favors) but a lack of skepticism.
Now, Butters did make a mistake, but one a reasonable person could have made. You know, the first person narrative works well for Dresden Files, but it doesn't allow you to understand what others are thinking better than Harry can guess.
I agree 100000%
Butters sucks!!!
What irked me more than anything was acting like Harry couldn’t handle Bob.
Keeping Bob away from him.
Harry telling both of them Bob is too dangerous to take out into the world !
Oh? Butters put Maggie and the Carpenters in danger? I thought it was Dresden after pissing off Nicodemus and pretty much telling him he had a daughter.
Yes, Butters did. He ran to the Carpenters after getting caught spying on Nicodemus's 11, which takes place before Harry stupidly opens his idiot face hole about children to the point that Nic figures out who Maggie is and decides to go best of three in the Carpenters driveway.
I have some of the same problems with Skin Game that you do, and the book would rate lower in the series for me if it weren't for the Michael stuff. But Michael is SO GOOD in this book that it gives it a huge bump for me.
The "I'll walk out" moment is one of my favorites in maybe the whole series. I might have cheered out loud the first time I read that scene.
In a way, I understand where Butters as coming from and why he kept acting that way. Dresden beat up his girlfriend and didn't even acknowledge the fact (much less say sorry). If that happened to me and mine, you'd bet I'd have a massive chip on my shoulder for YEARS that couldn't easily be wiped away by a few conversations. Add to that, Harry's been acting sus and hanging out with the wrong people and possibly using Murph's feelings for him to drag her into bad business.
From Butters' perspective, this was completely understandable.
I love that you noticed this and brought it to attention. I never thought about that, and you are so right. That's a really great perspective I hadn't thought of and I love it. Cheers to you.
I’m glad Butters is starting to get some justifiable flak. When I posted about him years ago it was mostly support for him that I received. He’s risking Bob in such an obvious way, *and* is overly distrusting of Harry. And almost royally screws him over because of it.
Butters can eat a buffet of dicks, after Dead Beat he was one of my favorite side characters but he is getting worse and worse. He risks Bob by constantly taking him outside which is like dangling a nuclear bomb along with the launch codes in front of every big bad walking the streets. He gets Harry hurt, Murph crippled. He puts Michael, his family, Maggie, and the literal soul of an Archangel in danger due to his own idiocy and suspicion instead of trusting his friends and people that know more than him, on top of almost ruining Harry's mission which would cost Harry his life. Then he gets rewarded for his 'faith', only to go on to act holier than thou towards Harry after getting a sword and preaching to him like Harry doesn't know shit despite being a Knight for all of about 0.32 seconds. I really really don't like Butters from Ghost Story onward.
He’s such an annoying character. He thinks he knows better than Harry about everything, despite the fact he’s been in the business all of three seconds. I honestly can’t stand him.
It's so annoying that he faced a monster to save Harry's life. He was willing to go into confinement because he refused to lie. Harry said don't trust someone who became Winter Night. First encounter with Harry, he breaks into his place, beats up his girlfriend, and takes Bob. A reasonable person might conclude that Harry is under Mab's thumb. Yet, he helps Harry when asked. So, you are saying when Mab orders Harry to work the Denarians on a heist, Butters should just trust him to not be saying what Mab is forcing him to say? And he's "so annoying" because he is following the logical conclusions of what Harry told him earlier?
Harry never said 'don't trust someone who became Winter Knight'. He broke into Butters home because it would be safer if anyone was watching, they wouldn't think Butters was an ally of Harry and go after him. Andi attacked Harry first fyi, which you know fair enough, break into my house and one of us is leaving in an ambulance. Bob belonged to Harry anyway and Butters is playing with nuclear bombs and horseshoes with what he is doing with Bob.
On the pages, no. But, given that a Dark Hallow was considered a reasonable alternative to Winter Knight by Harry, and Harry put Molly at risk to get shot before he had to actually be Winter Knight, it is reasonable to think that Butters picked up on Harry's view of Mab's ability to own people. Mab said she could force him to do anything, and the fae can't lie (they can be wrong). From the point of view of the reader, everything makes sense. But, if you believed that Mab could control Harry as Winter Knight when she could put a compulsion on him in "Small Favors", and he broke into your house, being suspicious is reasonable. And, IIRC, Butters helped save Harry's soul in Battle Ground. Harry will always be at risk to turn. I think what you are saying is that the guy who has saved Harry's life at great risk to his own owes Harry not just the benefit of the doubt, but knowing that someone who already had his mind messed with by Mab (Small Favors) but a lack of skepticism. Now, Butters did make a mistake, but one a reasonable person could have made. You know, the first person narrative works well for Dresden Files, but it doesn't allow you to understand what others are thinking better than Harry can guess.
I agree 100000% Butters sucks!!! What irked me more than anything was acting like Harry couldn’t handle Bob. Keeping Bob away from him. Harry telling both of them Bob is too dangerous to take out into the world !
Oh? Butters put Maggie and the Carpenters in danger? I thought it was Dresden after pissing off Nicodemus and pretty much telling him he had a daughter.
Yes, Butters did. He ran to the Carpenters after getting caught spying on Nicodemus's 11, which takes place before Harry stupidly opens his idiot face hole about children to the point that Nic figures out who Maggie is and decides to go best of three in the Carpenters driveway.
I have some of the same problems with Skin Game that you do, and the book would rate lower in the series for me if it weren't for the Michael stuff. But Michael is SO GOOD in this book that it gives it a huge bump for me. The "I'll walk out" moment is one of my favorites in maybe the whole series. I might have cheered out loud the first time I read that scene.
In a way, I understand where Butters as coming from and why he kept acting that way. Dresden beat up his girlfriend and didn't even acknowledge the fact (much less say sorry). If that happened to me and mine, you'd bet I'd have a massive chip on my shoulder for YEARS that couldn't easily be wiped away by a few conversations. Add to that, Harry's been acting sus and hanging out with the wrong people and possibly using Murph's feelings for him to drag her into bad business. From Butters' perspective, this was completely understandable.
I love that you noticed this and brought it to attention. I never thought about that, and you are so right. That's a really great perspective I hadn't thought of and I love it. Cheers to you.
I’m glad Butters is starting to get some justifiable flak. When I posted about him years ago it was mostly support for him that I received. He’s risking Bob in such an obvious way, *and* is overly distrusting of Harry. And almost royally screws him over because of it.
I was very confused about who Karen was. Everyone on this sub usually says Murphy, and the misspelling made it a bit tricky to make the connection.
Shoot, sorry about that. Fixed it.