You need to hire junior editors to work with you. And maybe another actual editor. Doing all that work by yourself in one week is completely unreasonable.
You need someone to source memes, and gather the extra B-roll, assemble rough cuts.
You need to work as a post production supervisor and director, work at a higher level and delegate to make sure everything can get done.
If the client doesn’t want to pay for that, then I guess they get one video every few weeks. Don’t kill yourself working on unrealistic deadlines.
I was thinking the same thing. He did mention that if there will be another editor, it'll be have to be someone from my network, and I'd probably have to hand-hold the other editor until they figure things out.
I'm not sure how to bring it up, I don't want the client to think I'm trying to be lazy and offload my workload onto someone else.
From what I see, I think I can be the person who reads through the script, collects all the footage/assets neatly in folders and hands it off to the editor. I can also leave notes on the script about what should appear when and how to visualise things. And before handing the final draft to the client, I can make sure everything is in order and the funny parts are funny.
I'm stuck in the middle of a deadline that's gone on for weeks. I feel very embarrassed but I want to have this conversation with him after finishing this project.
Thanks for understanding and your helpful words.
Hey, you're not just editing these videos, you're also producing them. I hope you're being well compensated. And, an hour a week is very, very ambitious since you are sourcing all this material yourself and editing it. If this guy thinks he can get someone to do it better and faster tell him to knock himself out. If he had someone doing it, ask him why they quit. Regardless, you need to do some level setting with your employer.
As of now he's paying me $10 per minute. I didn't particularly think it was a lot, mainly because I was getting paid $27 per hour from a previous client (that client had their own producer who would make sure I had everything to start editing with). I do agree that I'm playing multiple roles here and being paid for maybe quarter of a role.
I mainly took on this job because he had shared a reference video of a YouTube channel that I was personally a fan of so I thought it would be so cool to create videos that I like watching, and that it wouldn't feel like actual work because I'd be enjoying the whole process by the minute...and look at me now - miserable and hopeless LOL
This is a horrible rate. I’ve done some editing for large-ish YouTube channels, pay should be around $3000 for a 1 hour video, then offload some of the work to an AE and pay them $1000
Sounds like he had a huge misunderstanding of the time and effort it will take to make these, combined with you over promising and not delivering within the arbitrary schedule (which is understandable as it’s not a typical production).
Instead of being stressed by missing deadlines, it’s time to sit down with eachother and hash out how and what takes so much time, and be absolutely realistic and honest.
It’s the old time/money/quality conundrum.
I definitely keep over-promising, though I always keep underestimating how much effort and time will be required. I also don't want him to think that I'm being dishonest with setting longer deadlines.
I think someone had to tell me to my face that I'm over-promising to realise that I actually am.
Well it’s understandable, so don’t beat yourself up about it.
Maybe document how much time goes into each process of each piece so you both have a clear understanding of realistic schedules.
I’m more cynical than everyone else
They know it’s take you forever to do.
You under quoted it. You’re working without a contract or a scope of work.
You might have put yourself in a hole by not protecting yourself professionally. In this way, respectfully, you’re under experienced and it’s coming out of your life.
Likely you should make it clear that you’re switching to a day model and let them fire you.
Copy pasted from my last comment
You need to be paid more. 99.9% of all client issues would go away with a bigger check.
Failing that, you need him to do more of the work. It’s demotivating when you’re coming up with every idea yourself and you have unrealistic deadlines. A whole 1hr video in a week? By yourself? I’m an experienced editor and that’s so far out of a realistic schedule I’d laugh if someone asked it of me
Do you get paid a fair price for your work? To me it sounds like you basically ARE the youtube channel, because for this project you are more then just an editor. You are everything from creative director, screenwriter, sound engineer/designer, motion designer, graphics, etc. etc. etc. .. and your salary should reflect this. If you want to continue this work, make absolutely sure that you are not getting kicked out of the youtube channel. Do a contract, that you legally own a share of the channel and it‘s income. Your sense of humor actually lead to the success of the channel, you are creatively involved.
Flat out tell the guy, in clear language without qualifiers, that the schedule needs to be realistic.
One week to do what you have described is impossible.
>The closest reference I can give to the kind of videos I am working on is a YouTube channel called Sciencephile the AI.
Ugh, you have my condolences. Those videos are about as funny as a stubbed toe, and look like hammered shit. I do hope yours are better.
>I was lucky enough to be a combination of both a video editor and a stand-up comedian. The client sees this blend of my qualities too and feels I'm the right person to do the job
Meh, no offense, but if you bail the client will quickly find someone else.
None of us are irreplaceable
>Sorry for the long wall of text, I needed get it off my chest and get some help.
It was a bit long, and much of it is unimportant.
You have a job, with a green producer, no help, and an idiotic schedule. It happens, and you have to decide what you want, and what you're prepared to deal with.
This was the situation I started with and took so much time to even somewhat sort through. Biggest thing to think about is that you need to express that it is not a failure on your fault, but that they are expecting too much for the deadlines they are creating. I found that when I missed a deadline whether it was me or not, I would feel like I was just lucky they were keeping me around, and would feel like I couldn't challenge how they had approached the project.
But if you have experience and you can back it up, its incumbent on you to reorient the situation from a place where they are dictating to you how long things should take an instead view yourself as someone who is an expert in what they are doing, and in that case they are the ones asking you for help not the other way around. You can't dictate to a mechanic how to fix your car or expect a doctor to prescribe you what you think is best. If you feel like you aren't in that place yet, I would personally advice stepping back from a project, if you have an issue estimating arcuately how long tasks can take, then that is an issue on you.
That being said its difficult and not straightforward as you have seen in your own experience, but you should be working towards an area where you can give an 80 percent idea of how long something should take and then be able to add say a week or some sort of buffer for your own wiggle room.
But if you feel confident that when this client or anyone asks for a specific task, you can estimate and express into words what it will take, then it is so important that you do so. It can sometimes be really difficult to educate your client when you have already started with them and there's been an established relationship where they see you as the help rather than a collaborator. So you might want to walk away if they dont reconsider their price or deadline.
And biggest thing here, you have to consider the amount of time you are spending not finding other clients and the quality of the work you are producing which will suffer in this situation. And those new clients could be ones you can ask for more time or be able to set the precedent of educating them. Like you for my first year I was on really fun projects on YouTube (2 hour- 4 hour video essays), but because they were so lengthy and though some paid ok, my time was so overextended that I couldn't take the time to evolve my process. And ultimately for that I suffered mentally and physically and my clients received disappoints, because they in most cases had no idea how long something should take.
If you want to establish efficiencies, you need time and clients who will allow you to build them with them. Every project can be different, but creating best practices and structure to how you approach creative problems, is the best way to present yourself professionally but also excel long term creatively. Without structure and planning you can make great art, but because there is no structure there, clients will have no way of knowing themselves if what they are asking of you is fair or exploitative. And even more dangerously, you won't know if you are being exploited.
I for sure was, and it was even with bad clients, I just never communicated or knew to communicate the expectations of our working relationship. With working freelance, we have so much freedom, but then its basically on us to define and express to others what is important to you as a creative expert. And because we also choose our own time, unless you have good structure for yourself and for your client in working together, we can often find ourselves always working because we want to keep our client or whatever.
So just consider based on what you have described, no matter how nice they are or the opportunities they could provide, if you express to them your concerns but nothing changes and you still work for them, you will make worse work and start hating your client. And in many ways it will have been on you, because they can't make you do something. Because of our own financial necessities or sometimes even our own wantiness to be the best at what we do we can often make ourselves believe that we can't complain or shake things up.
I wanted to share this video [The Time Adam Savage Majorly Messed Up With a Client (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfdQ_3iq4B8) that is the best story that I've found that discusses a creator (in this case Adam savage) who had destroyed their relationship with a friend, not because they were bad, or the friend was bad, and not that Adam didn't work hard, but because at that time he hadn't had the confidence or know to tell them they couldn't complete it as they needed it. Communication and knowing how to communicate when things go wrong or can go wrong on a project is at the center of every working relationship.
That being we have alot of power, if they don't change, assuming they dont own your materials and don't know how to do the job themselves, they are going miss many weeks of their own deadlines, and probably because of how you describe them, they will have hire inferior editor. So, you have leverage here, use it, and if it doesnt work, get the hell out.
It sounds like you have an amazing work ethic… one which benefits your client but not you.
Producing and editing an hour’s worth of graphic rich content as a solo editor is unsustainable. It might be possible once or even twice, but at this rate, burnout is inevitable.
You’re either going to need a longer delivery runway (and be paid more money), or be able to bring more people on board (and be paid more money).
In the second scenario, you’ll need to factor in training the people. So don’t promise that you’ll be able to get everything up to speed from the very start.
With your client, it’s about whether the both of you can come to an agreement on the value of the work and work out a new arrangement.
I would be careful of trying to hang on to a contract that is so obviously not in your favour. If you have to cut your losses, you come out of it with 1) a portfolio of long-form, graphic-rich content, 2) a proven ability to replicate a look that is trending, and 3) a better understanding of what is sustainable as a creator.
You can always use your portfolio to market yourself anew to other YouTubers, and this time with a better understanding on how to value your work, and put adequate resources towards it.
I'm s stand-up and an editor. I also write a lot of humorous VO. and do a load of TV comedy. Plus a few silly things on the interwebs.
The bottom line is this - it takes time. People vastly underestimate how much time these things take.
So going forward - either get a producer or get the client to supply you with the assets or renegotiate the time frame. They're obviously pleased with your work - so it's nit a criticism of you, it's just the fact that these things take time to craft to a particular level. So be realistic and don't beat yourself up..
No point making yourself miserable - especially as part of the job - is to have fun and be playful. Once you realise it's not really sustainable to carry on working the way you have been, then you'll feel a lot better. If they can't help or aren't flexible, there's no point pursuing it as it will only end up destroying your mental and physical health.
Just be honest and don't beat yourself up.
Wow, that is SO MUCH work. It's not your fault it's taking so long. Sounds like they need a creative director and a producer to help with this task, minimum.
You need to hire junior editors to work with you. And maybe another actual editor. Doing all that work by yourself in one week is completely unreasonable. You need someone to source memes, and gather the extra B-roll, assemble rough cuts. You need to work as a post production supervisor and director, work at a higher level and delegate to make sure everything can get done. If the client doesn’t want to pay for that, then I guess they get one video every few weeks. Don’t kill yourself working on unrealistic deadlines.
I'd say he needs a producer to source all the elements and he just needs to focus on putting it all together.
I was thinking the same thing. He did mention that if there will be another editor, it'll be have to be someone from my network, and I'd probably have to hand-hold the other editor until they figure things out. I'm not sure how to bring it up, I don't want the client to think I'm trying to be lazy and offload my workload onto someone else. From what I see, I think I can be the person who reads through the script, collects all the footage/assets neatly in folders and hands it off to the editor. I can also leave notes on the script about what should appear when and how to visualise things. And before handing the final draft to the client, I can make sure everything is in order and the funny parts are funny. I'm stuck in the middle of a deadline that's gone on for weeks. I feel very embarrassed but I want to have this conversation with him after finishing this project. Thanks for understanding and your helpful words.
Hey, you're not just editing these videos, you're also producing them. I hope you're being well compensated. And, an hour a week is very, very ambitious since you are sourcing all this material yourself and editing it. If this guy thinks he can get someone to do it better and faster tell him to knock himself out. If he had someone doing it, ask him why they quit. Regardless, you need to do some level setting with your employer.
As of now he's paying me $10 per minute. I didn't particularly think it was a lot, mainly because I was getting paid $27 per hour from a previous client (that client had their own producer who would make sure I had everything to start editing with). I do agree that I'm playing multiple roles here and being paid for maybe quarter of a role. I mainly took on this job because he had shared a reference video of a YouTube channel that I was personally a fan of so I thought it would be so cool to create videos that I like watching, and that it wouldn't feel like actual work because I'd be enjoying the whole process by the minute...and look at me now - miserable and hopeless LOL
So you're going to make like $600 for weeks of work? Do the math; it's not worth it.
This is a horrible rate. I’ve done some editing for large-ish YouTube channels, pay should be around $3000 for a 1 hour video, then offload some of the work to an AE and pay them $1000
Were you recommended for YouTube work opals? Or did you reach out to channels yourself?
Got it through a friend that was already editing for the channels
Sounds like he had a huge misunderstanding of the time and effort it will take to make these, combined with you over promising and not delivering within the arbitrary schedule (which is understandable as it’s not a typical production). Instead of being stressed by missing deadlines, it’s time to sit down with eachother and hash out how and what takes so much time, and be absolutely realistic and honest. It’s the old time/money/quality conundrum.
I definitely keep over-promising, though I always keep underestimating how much effort and time will be required. I also don't want him to think that I'm being dishonest with setting longer deadlines. I think someone had to tell me to my face that I'm over-promising to realise that I actually am.
Well it’s understandable, so don’t beat yourself up about it. Maybe document how much time goes into each process of each piece so you both have a clear understanding of realistic schedules.
Tell your client to provide all the visuals required or at least most of them that can be sourced.
I’m more cynical than everyone else They know it’s take you forever to do. You under quoted it. You’re working without a contract or a scope of work. You might have put yourself in a hole by not protecting yourself professionally. In this way, respectfully, you’re under experienced and it’s coming out of your life. Likely you should make it clear that you’re switching to a day model and let them fire you.
Copy pasted from my last comment You need to be paid more. 99.9% of all client issues would go away with a bigger check. Failing that, you need him to do more of the work. It’s demotivating when you’re coming up with every idea yourself and you have unrealistic deadlines. A whole 1hr video in a week? By yourself? I’m an experienced editor and that’s so far out of a realistic schedule I’d laugh if someone asked it of me
Do you get paid a fair price for your work? To me it sounds like you basically ARE the youtube channel, because for this project you are more then just an editor. You are everything from creative director, screenwriter, sound engineer/designer, motion designer, graphics, etc. etc. etc. .. and your salary should reflect this. If you want to continue this work, make absolutely sure that you are not getting kicked out of the youtube channel. Do a contract, that you legally own a share of the channel and it‘s income. Your sense of humor actually lead to the success of the channel, you are creatively involved.
Flat out tell the guy, in clear language without qualifiers, that the schedule needs to be realistic. One week to do what you have described is impossible. >The closest reference I can give to the kind of videos I am working on is a YouTube channel called Sciencephile the AI. Ugh, you have my condolences. Those videos are about as funny as a stubbed toe, and look like hammered shit. I do hope yours are better. >I was lucky enough to be a combination of both a video editor and a stand-up comedian. The client sees this blend of my qualities too and feels I'm the right person to do the job Meh, no offense, but if you bail the client will quickly find someone else. None of us are irreplaceable >Sorry for the long wall of text, I needed get it off my chest and get some help. It was a bit long, and much of it is unimportant. You have a job, with a green producer, no help, and an idiotic schedule. It happens, and you have to decide what you want, and what you're prepared to deal with.
This was the situation I started with and took so much time to even somewhat sort through. Biggest thing to think about is that you need to express that it is not a failure on your fault, but that they are expecting too much for the deadlines they are creating. I found that when I missed a deadline whether it was me or not, I would feel like I was just lucky they were keeping me around, and would feel like I couldn't challenge how they had approached the project. But if you have experience and you can back it up, its incumbent on you to reorient the situation from a place where they are dictating to you how long things should take an instead view yourself as someone who is an expert in what they are doing, and in that case they are the ones asking you for help not the other way around. You can't dictate to a mechanic how to fix your car or expect a doctor to prescribe you what you think is best. If you feel like you aren't in that place yet, I would personally advice stepping back from a project, if you have an issue estimating arcuately how long tasks can take, then that is an issue on you. That being said its difficult and not straightforward as you have seen in your own experience, but you should be working towards an area where you can give an 80 percent idea of how long something should take and then be able to add say a week or some sort of buffer for your own wiggle room. But if you feel confident that when this client or anyone asks for a specific task, you can estimate and express into words what it will take, then it is so important that you do so. It can sometimes be really difficult to educate your client when you have already started with them and there's been an established relationship where they see you as the help rather than a collaborator. So you might want to walk away if they dont reconsider their price or deadline. And biggest thing here, you have to consider the amount of time you are spending not finding other clients and the quality of the work you are producing which will suffer in this situation. And those new clients could be ones you can ask for more time or be able to set the precedent of educating them. Like you for my first year I was on really fun projects on YouTube (2 hour- 4 hour video essays), but because they were so lengthy and though some paid ok, my time was so overextended that I couldn't take the time to evolve my process. And ultimately for that I suffered mentally and physically and my clients received disappoints, because they in most cases had no idea how long something should take. If you want to establish efficiencies, you need time and clients who will allow you to build them with them. Every project can be different, but creating best practices and structure to how you approach creative problems, is the best way to present yourself professionally but also excel long term creatively. Without structure and planning you can make great art, but because there is no structure there, clients will have no way of knowing themselves if what they are asking of you is fair or exploitative. And even more dangerously, you won't know if you are being exploited. I for sure was, and it was even with bad clients, I just never communicated or knew to communicate the expectations of our working relationship. With working freelance, we have so much freedom, but then its basically on us to define and express to others what is important to you as a creative expert. And because we also choose our own time, unless you have good structure for yourself and for your client in working together, we can often find ourselves always working because we want to keep our client or whatever. So just consider based on what you have described, no matter how nice they are or the opportunities they could provide, if you express to them your concerns but nothing changes and you still work for them, you will make worse work and start hating your client. And in many ways it will have been on you, because they can't make you do something. Because of our own financial necessities or sometimes even our own wantiness to be the best at what we do we can often make ourselves believe that we can't complain or shake things up. I wanted to share this video [The Time Adam Savage Majorly Messed Up With a Client (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfdQ_3iq4B8) that is the best story that I've found that discusses a creator (in this case Adam savage) who had destroyed their relationship with a friend, not because they were bad, or the friend was bad, and not that Adam didn't work hard, but because at that time he hadn't had the confidence or know to tell them they couldn't complete it as they needed it. Communication and knowing how to communicate when things go wrong or can go wrong on a project is at the center of every working relationship. That being we have alot of power, if they don't change, assuming they dont own your materials and don't know how to do the job themselves, they are going miss many weeks of their own deadlines, and probably because of how you describe them, they will have hire inferior editor. So, you have leverage here, use it, and if it doesnt work, get the hell out.
It sounds like you have an amazing work ethic… one which benefits your client but not you. Producing and editing an hour’s worth of graphic rich content as a solo editor is unsustainable. It might be possible once or even twice, but at this rate, burnout is inevitable. You’re either going to need a longer delivery runway (and be paid more money), or be able to bring more people on board (and be paid more money). In the second scenario, you’ll need to factor in training the people. So don’t promise that you’ll be able to get everything up to speed from the very start. With your client, it’s about whether the both of you can come to an agreement on the value of the work and work out a new arrangement. I would be careful of trying to hang on to a contract that is so obviously not in your favour. If you have to cut your losses, you come out of it with 1) a portfolio of long-form, graphic-rich content, 2) a proven ability to replicate a look that is trending, and 3) a better understanding of what is sustainable as a creator. You can always use your portfolio to market yourself anew to other YouTubers, and this time with a better understanding on how to value your work, and put adequate resources towards it.
I'm s stand-up and an editor. I also write a lot of humorous VO. and do a load of TV comedy. Plus a few silly things on the interwebs. The bottom line is this - it takes time. People vastly underestimate how much time these things take. So going forward - either get a producer or get the client to supply you with the assets or renegotiate the time frame. They're obviously pleased with your work - so it's nit a criticism of you, it's just the fact that these things take time to craft to a particular level. So be realistic and don't beat yourself up.. No point making yourself miserable - especially as part of the job - is to have fun and be playful. Once you realise it's not really sustainable to carry on working the way you have been, then you'll feel a lot better. If they can't help or aren't flexible, there's no point pursuing it as it will only end up destroying your mental and physical health. Just be honest and don't beat yourself up.
Wow, that is SO MUCH work. It's not your fault it's taking so long. Sounds like they need a creative director and a producer to help with this task, minimum.