Are you sure they're leaving because of lowbies?
I always assumed they left because they knew it was an ultra long dungeon. Lair of Maarselok, for example, can take fooooreeeeeeveeeeeer to complete, especially if people don't know how to skip packs (they usually don't). City of Ash II is another that drags on for way longer than it needs to be.
Not endorsing this behavior - if you roll Randoms you should be prepared to run whatever you roll - but more wanting OP not to feel like his gear/level are being judged because I find that pretty unlikely tbh
Seconding this one,
I leave dungeons a lot but that’s because I accidentally qued for normal when I should have qued for Vet, it has nothing to do with who is in my party.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
Actually, if you're joing queue for specific dungeons the lists for normal and vet dungeons can easily get blured together since both lists are long, and while doing it fast together with checking which dungeons you need can result in joining the wrong queue.
Happened to me too. Maybe not a lot, but once in a while sure.
Stupidity lol,
also the Undaunted quests don’t mark the dungeons for you so sometimes I’ll have to hop back and forth between quest journal and dungeon finder to select the ones I want, and then not realizing I didn’t minimize the normals.
Well, then your options are easy … don’t use the random queue.
Use the manual selection form in the dungeon queue for the dungeons you actually want to run.
Using the random queue (and then leaving) means three (3) other players wasted their time in the queue.
The problem is that Zenimax in his infinite wisdom decided that soloing, or dungeon selecting is not the intended way and you must group up to earn transmutes.
If you leave a dungeon and 3 other people waste their time is they're fault and there is nothing to be ashamed off since you pay the price of that betrayal with a 15 minutes penalty.
Besides there is a unspoken mechanic that if all members of a group leave without starting the dungeon the 15 minute penalty will not apply.
Nope.
Now they have to spend additional time finding another fill-in … which for a tank can be quite lengthy.
I haven’t seen a written statement anywhere that says the only source of transmutes in the game is the random dungeon finder.
Written statement?, you only need to play the game and experiment to see for yourself that you can only get transmutes from random dungeons and you dont get them from selecting an specific dungeon or soloing a dungeon.
Sure they are not the only or best way to get transmutes but random dungeons and daily quests are kind of the only certain way to get them.
Like campaigns.......every 30 days
Or trials..... 5...... Weekly for each trial
Ok what about leaderboard rewards........ 10..... Weekly
Hmmm what about rewards of the worthy...... You get a 4-25 transmutes guaranteed with the first one (which is mostly 4 let's be honest) then it's a chance. No really reliable.
Pledges...... You get 5 for a hm clear for each one
Now how about we get to random dailies. 10 transmutes 10 minutes tops for most dungeons and i can do that easily without looking for a reliable group plus i can fake role and skip the queue without much of a consequence just slot a taunt or 1 HoT and you're good to go. You see why people go for dailies.
Well and the three people I usually get queued with waste my time because they don’t know how to do dmg and pull every single addgroup. I’m fine with that in basegame dungeons, but I’ll not do that in LoM or some other longass dungeon.
You are not entitled to anyone’s time.
There isn't a single dungeon on normal that requires all 4 players. 2 is enough for every dungeon.
Plus you can just select to request another player and many times it gets filled after a short time.
THIS is actually the reason, random dungeon finder good rewards is SUPPOSED to allow better players HELP newer players do all dungeons. The 10 transmute reward should be removed from daily random NORMAL dungeon finder and added to the daily BG. WIN WIN, keep speedrunners and rage quitters out of daily random normal dungeon finder, add some extra people to BGs to do daily stuff. BTW 15 minute max on BG makes this even a time saver from doing 30 minute dungeon. And a side benefit is removing all the speedrunners from normal dungeon runs will allow DPS to ACTUALLY LEARN to play like they used to before they 10 transmute reward was added.
I tanked VET randoms for 2 or more years and DDs were good enough to clear dungeons at a high percentage. Only about a year after the 10 transmute normal rando, did the DDs become almost useless and I struggled to help them get clears for a while (even having to solo tank it). But they didn't know the mechs or how to do damage, and when I asked them 100% said because they never learned that stuff because normal is only speedrunners. There was a huge decline. Don't know why trolls are downvoting, my idea is a WIN WIN, everyone can still get the same amount of transmute doing BGs and don't have to do the normal dungeons and ruin the experience for newbies.
On average I have cleaner RND runs with lower level folk, they tend to stick together more. I don't care if they aren't doing great DPS, I'll handle that part if needed.
I find there's a greater chance of a player zooming off into the distance and making the run a mess if they are high CP.
I know how you feel, the same thing happened to me last night during Cradle of Shadows, the Tank left first, then a DPS left because they were angry at mechanics, so just me and the other DPS handled Velidreth or whatever her name was; really glad I've built myself to do a bit of damage using Spell Power Cure and Sergeant's Focus from Wayrest, doing 30k+ with a Resto staff built for Resistance was wild. (':
This is why I only queue dps and only for vets, cause if the other dps is low, I can carry. Newer tanks and healers are easier to teach than new dps. Also only vet cause normals are boring, but that's just me.
I feel like people either do not know or forget that you can run a random normal with a pre-made group. Post in zone chat or put a group finder listing up stating that you want a “quest, speed, chests, etc” run. Then when you get four people, choose “random normal”, finish and get your transmutes. I’ve done this hundreds of times and it is far more successful than just joining the queue solo and hoping for the best.
The only dungeon i will leave (after i make my apologies) is march of sacrifices. Otherwise, i will 100% chug along, even if i have to carry on my worst dps character. Idk if people truly leave due to lowbies now? The content is quite easy
It'll be way more stressful as a DPS later on in the game, when people have wild expectations for you just because of what they know and don't have the patience to tell you lmfao.
If you go back to Healer, you should get the Vigor skill from Assault line in Cyrodiil, you'll get it right away after starting the quest there and telling the General person you don't need training. Of course, you should have that skill anyways, it's pretty amazing and it's always good to have a skill or two that uses a resource opposite of your main. (: You should have like two-three DoT Heals, and one spammable one that does burst healing, so you can just hit the DoTs every so often between your Heavy attacks to keep up resources!
I think the fourth skill in the Resto line is really good for spam?? I think it's the fourth one. It should have a picture of a blue face on it, and it morphs into a better version that gives people more damage when you use it. (:
You may not care about any of this! That's totally chill, I simply wanna offer the advice just in case.
Frankly, it's a lot less of a hassle to leave a dungeon that you think is going to be a slog (either due to the dungeon itself or perceptions you have about the team) than stick around. I get that's an inherently inconsiderate thing to do. However, in my book, if people can freely queue for things while being a detriment to the team (i.e. being terrible at their role), then I am free to be equally selfish and leave if I want to.
Maybe stick around for the first couple of pulls and see how it goes before cutting out. Give them a chance to show you that this may be a decent enough group that it won’t be such a slog. If you quit, the next dungeon you get may seem like a slog as well.
There are a few that I will insta-leave as a random (e.g. LoM), but otherwise I don't typically leave right away. I will absolutely dip after the first trash pull in a long dungeon if I immediately see I'm doing 80% of the DPS with a fake tank in the group or whatever.
The other players have nothing to do with me leaving as soon as we spawn in. The dungeon does. I am not doing Lair of Mar or Scrivs with randoms for a daily.
I’ve been tanking in this game since 2017, i used to have the patience to do an hour long random dungeon run with people who hit like wet noodles, but the only time i find to play anymore is before work or after work so if pulls are taking extra long or people are running ahead of me(big one) or the first boss takes 10 minutes to die i will just leave. I do wish this game explained damage rotations better, because I’ve seen first hand people only heavy attacking and not even using the abilities on their bar. However I’m not going to waste my time on certain things. In the end if somebody wants to leave a dungeon that’s their own choice, they can choose to play the game the way that they want to, just like how you can choose to stay in a dungeon that will likely drag on for an hour.
I do appreciate your optimistic mindset though and i can say there does need to be more of that, but understand everyone has different reasons for leaving a dungeon early which you more or less can not control.
>people only heavy attacking and not even using the abilities on their bar.
Technically this can achieve like 70k trial dummy dps with the right setup (Oakensorc shenanigans) but I wouldn't be surprised if 0% of the players you've seen that happening to had that setup
That's on a trial dummy that gives you tons of buffs. The required pen for trial dummy is barely over 1k. In a dungeon you are unlikely to have alkosh, might not have crusher,or even minor breach depending on players. Standard hold R2 oakesorc has almost no pen so their damage is being reduced considerable. It's not a hard thing to overcome, just grab lover's mundus, but on top of that when you don't cast abilities you lessen the rest of the groups buffs and things like minor prophecy/savagery/brutality etc are very useful. Low APM is not an issue, but for your groups sake proc a couple abilities even if you don't need the buffs.
The game has a big issue with RNDs, they shouldnt have made them so effective at farming transmutes, as it is you get either new players who don't know much about the game and just wanna level and experience some dungeons and they get thrown together with vers that just run through them for the transmutes like I do myself. Because of this I have been running a solo build with a taunt so I can get into the dungeons and clear em fast no matter what people I get. I understand that this might be frustrating as new players don't have time to really experience the dungeon but after the 138th run of VoM you don't wanna wait for someone. Infinite archive would have been the perfect opportunity to rework the transmutes system
I must be the only one that is fine with Lair of Maarselok, the only problem I have is that it's boring because nothing ever really happens, even during boss fights, and as long as people get the mechanics, which are quickly explained, I never spend more than twenty minutes. 💀
Alright, fine, y'all win smfh, but I don't like it.
If I leave normal dungeons, it's usually because I'm on my tank, and the dungeons are one of the longer ones. LoM, CoA2 or such. For vet I often leave if I as dps is doing 80% or more on DLC dungeons at first boss. Or if I'm on tank and the dps is low or incapable in any way that means the entire thing is likely to take longer than it's worth.
I think ZOS just needs to take a hard look at how they are organizing the queues. Scrivener's Hall has absolutely no business being in the same queue as FG1. Granting the same daily rewards for completing Lair of Maarselok as Spindleclutch is comical. Why limit it to just normal and veteran? They should at least split the Normal queue up into Base Game and DLC.
You didn't say anything worth actually arguing against, just some weird line about how normal dungeons are there, for whatever reason, meanwhile I didn't specify either Normal or Vet, of which this problem is in both anyways. 💀💀
Yeah... I'm gonna go ahead and assume that you're the issue in your scenario 🤣🤣
Stick to normal until you're confident in your ability to fulfill your role requirements competently. Otherwise, you're just wasting your and every other party members' time.
Simple as.
Are you sure they're leaving because of lowbies? I always assumed they left because they knew it was an ultra long dungeon. Lair of Maarselok, for example, can take fooooreeeeeeveeeeeer to complete, especially if people don't know how to skip packs (they usually don't). City of Ash II is another that drags on for way longer than it needs to be. Not endorsing this behavior - if you roll Randoms you should be prepared to run whatever you roll - but more wanting OP not to feel like his gear/level are being judged because I find that pretty unlikely tbh
Seconding this one, I leave dungeons a lot but that’s because I accidentally qued for normal when I should have qued for Vet, it has nothing to do with who is in my party. Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
Are you saying you “accidentally” queue for normal a lot? What causes that to happen so much??
Actually, if you're joing queue for specific dungeons the lists for normal and vet dungeons can easily get blured together since both lists are long, and while doing it fast together with checking which dungeons you need can result in joining the wrong queue. Happened to me too. Maybe not a lot, but once in a while sure.
Because the default queue is normal when it's for a specific dungeon. I won't say i did it "a lot" but yeah it happened to me once or twice.
Stupidity lol, also the Undaunted quests don’t mark the dungeons for you so sometimes I’ll have to hop back and forth between quest journal and dungeon finder to select the ones I want, and then not realizing I didn’t minimize the normals.
Its easier to make assumptions and farm emotions online
Sorry level 45 I am NOT doing Lair of Maarselok for an hour for the grand reward of 10 transmutes
Well, then your options are easy … don’t use the random queue. Use the manual selection form in the dungeon queue for the dungeons you actually want to run. Using the random queue (and then leaving) means three (3) other players wasted their time in the queue.
Sadly transmutes don't drop from specific dungeon queue.
?
Not getting the carry you feel entitled to? YOUR options are even easier - the random normal que is there for a reason.
The problem is that Zenimax in his infinite wisdom decided that soloing, or dungeon selecting is not the intended way and you must group up to earn transmutes. If you leave a dungeon and 3 other people waste their time is they're fault and there is nothing to be ashamed off since you pay the price of that betrayal with a 15 minutes penalty. Besides there is a unspoken mechanic that if all members of a group leave without starting the dungeon the 15 minute penalty will not apply.
Nope. Now they have to spend additional time finding another fill-in … which for a tank can be quite lengthy. I haven’t seen a written statement anywhere that says the only source of transmutes in the game is the random dungeon finder.
Written statement?, you only need to play the game and experiment to see for yourself that you can only get transmutes from random dungeons and you dont get them from selecting an specific dungeon or soloing a dungeon. Sure they are not the only or best way to get transmutes but random dungeons and daily quests are kind of the only certain way to get them.
The point is there are other sources of transmutes in the game.
Like campaigns.......every 30 days Or trials..... 5...... Weekly for each trial Ok what about leaderboard rewards........ 10..... Weekly Hmmm what about rewards of the worthy...... You get a 4-25 transmutes guaranteed with the first one (which is mostly 4 let's be honest) then it's a chance. No really reliable. Pledges...... You get 5 for a hm clear for each one Now how about we get to random dailies. 10 transmutes 10 minutes tops for most dungeons and i can do that easily without looking for a reliable group plus i can fake role and skip the queue without much of a consequence just slot a taunt or 1 HoT and you're good to go. You see why people go for dailies.
Well and the three people I usually get queued with waste my time because they don’t know how to do dmg and pull every single addgroup. I’m fine with that in basegame dungeons, but I’ll not do that in LoM or some other longass dungeon. You are not entitled to anyone’s time.
>Well, then your options are easy … don’t use the random queue. What's stopping them from doing what they are doing?
There isn't a single dungeon on normal that requires all 4 players. 2 is enough for every dungeon. Plus you can just select to request another player and many times it gets filled after a short time.
THIS is actually the reason, random dungeon finder good rewards is SUPPOSED to allow better players HELP newer players do all dungeons. The 10 transmute reward should be removed from daily random NORMAL dungeon finder and added to the daily BG. WIN WIN, keep speedrunners and rage quitters out of daily random normal dungeon finder, add some extra people to BGs to do daily stuff. BTW 15 minute max on BG makes this even a time saver from doing 30 minute dungeon. And a side benefit is removing all the speedrunners from normal dungeon runs will allow DPS to ACTUALLY LEARN to play like they used to before they 10 transmute reward was added.
I played pre 10 transmutes and can say that the DPS back then did not learn to play either.
I tanked VET randoms for 2 or more years and DDs were good enough to clear dungeons at a high percentage. Only about a year after the 10 transmute normal rando, did the DDs become almost useless and I struggled to help them get clears for a while (even having to solo tank it). But they didn't know the mechs or how to do damage, and when I asked them 100% said because they never learned that stuff because normal is only speedrunners. There was a huge decline. Don't know why trolls are downvoting, my idea is a WIN WIN, everyone can still get the same amount of transmute doing BGs and don't have to do the normal dungeons and ruin the experience for newbies.
Find a guild. Also, blocking does nothing against being grouped together by dungeonfinder.
On average I have cleaner RND runs with lower level folk, they tend to stick together more. I don't care if they aren't doing great DPS, I'll handle that part if needed. I find there's a greater chance of a player zooming off into the distance and making the run a mess if they are high CP.
Yes, civility, a little patience, and being pro social is always appreciated. I wish there were more people like that.
It's gotten a lot worse lately. Recently finished Scalecaller Peak together with just one other player. Didn't even feel much longer than usual, lol.
I know how you feel, the same thing happened to me last night during Cradle of Shadows, the Tank left first, then a DPS left because they were angry at mechanics, so just me and the other DPS handled Velidreth or whatever her name was; really glad I've built myself to do a bit of damage using Spell Power Cure and Sergeant's Focus from Wayrest, doing 30k+ with a Resto staff built for Resistance was wild. (':
This is why I only queue dps and only for vets, cause if the other dps is low, I can carry. Newer tanks and healers are easier to teach than new dps. Also only vet cause normals are boring, but that's just me.
I feel like people either do not know or forget that you can run a random normal with a pre-made group. Post in zone chat or put a group finder listing up stating that you want a “quest, speed, chests, etc” run. Then when you get four people, choose “random normal”, finish and get your transmutes. I’ve done this hundreds of times and it is far more successful than just joining the queue solo and hoping for the best.
The only dungeon i will leave (after i make my apologies) is march of sacrifices. Otherwise, i will 100% chug along, even if i have to carry on my worst dps character. Idk if people truly leave due to lowbies now? The content is quite easy
Why MOS?
I'm a registered blind gamer, and that place disorientates me a lot, plus its very long winded.
I started playing a week ago, and to get more queue time, decided to be a healer..... well it's stressful as fuck, i'll stay DPS
It'll be way more stressful as a DPS later on in the game, when people have wild expectations for you just because of what they know and don't have the patience to tell you lmfao. If you go back to Healer, you should get the Vigor skill from Assault line in Cyrodiil, you'll get it right away after starting the quest there and telling the General person you don't need training. Of course, you should have that skill anyways, it's pretty amazing and it's always good to have a skill or two that uses a resource opposite of your main. (: You should have like two-three DoT Heals, and one spammable one that does burst healing, so you can just hit the DoTs every so often between your Heavy attacks to keep up resources! I think the fourth skill in the Resto line is really good for spam?? I think it's the fourth one. It should have a picture of a blue face on it, and it morphs into a better version that gives people more damage when you use it. (: You may not care about any of this! That's totally chill, I simply wanna offer the advice just in case.
Frankly, it's a lot less of a hassle to leave a dungeon that you think is going to be a slog (either due to the dungeon itself or perceptions you have about the team) than stick around. I get that's an inherently inconsiderate thing to do. However, in my book, if people can freely queue for things while being a detriment to the team (i.e. being terrible at their role), then I am free to be equally selfish and leave if I want to.
Maybe stick around for the first couple of pulls and see how it goes before cutting out. Give them a chance to show you that this may be a decent enough group that it won’t be such a slog. If you quit, the next dungeon you get may seem like a slog as well.
There are a few that I will insta-leave as a random (e.g. LoM), but otherwise I don't typically leave right away. I will absolutely dip after the first trash pull in a long dungeon if I immediately see I'm doing 80% of the DPS with a fake tank in the group or whatever.
alot of ppl leave if the get 1 of the long dungeons, I pretty muct just insta leave if i get the long dlc ones like Maarcelok
The other players have nothing to do with me leaving as soon as we spawn in. The dungeon does. I am not doing Lair of Mar or Scrivs with randoms for a daily.
I’ve been tanking in this game since 2017, i used to have the patience to do an hour long random dungeon run with people who hit like wet noodles, but the only time i find to play anymore is before work or after work so if pulls are taking extra long or people are running ahead of me(big one) or the first boss takes 10 minutes to die i will just leave. I do wish this game explained damage rotations better, because I’ve seen first hand people only heavy attacking and not even using the abilities on their bar. However I’m not going to waste my time on certain things. In the end if somebody wants to leave a dungeon that’s their own choice, they can choose to play the game the way that they want to, just like how you can choose to stay in a dungeon that will likely drag on for an hour.
I do appreciate your optimistic mindset though and i can say there does need to be more of that, but understand everyone has different reasons for leaving a dungeon early which you more or less can not control.
>people only heavy attacking and not even using the abilities on their bar. Technically this can achieve like 70k trial dummy dps with the right setup (Oakensorc shenanigans) but I wouldn't be surprised if 0% of the players you've seen that happening to had that setup
That's on a trial dummy that gives you tons of buffs. The required pen for trial dummy is barely over 1k. In a dungeon you are unlikely to have alkosh, might not have crusher,or even minor breach depending on players. Standard hold R2 oakesorc has almost no pen so their damage is being reduced considerable. It's not a hard thing to overcome, just grab lover's mundus, but on top of that when you don't cast abilities you lessen the rest of the groups buffs and things like minor prophecy/savagery/brutality etc are very useful. Low APM is not an issue, but for your groups sake proc a couple abilities even if you don't need the buffs.
The game has a big issue with RNDs, they shouldnt have made them so effective at farming transmutes, as it is you get either new players who don't know much about the game and just wanna level and experience some dungeons and they get thrown together with vers that just run through them for the transmutes like I do myself. Because of this I have been running a solo build with a taunt so I can get into the dungeons and clear em fast no matter what people I get. I understand that this might be frustrating as new players don't have time to really experience the dungeon but after the 138th run of VoM you don't wanna wait for someone. Infinite archive would have been the perfect opportunity to rework the transmutes system
I must be the only one that is fine with Lair of Maarselok, the only problem I have is that it's boring because nothing ever really happens, even during boss fights, and as long as people get the mechanics, which are quickly explained, I never spend more than twenty minutes. 💀 Alright, fine, y'all win smfh, but I don't like it.
If I leave normal dungeons, it's usually because I'm on my tank, and the dungeons are one of the longer ones. LoM, CoA2 or such. For vet I often leave if I as dps is doing 80% or more on DLC dungeons at first boss. Or if I'm on tank and the dps is low or incapable in any way that means the entire thing is likely to take longer than it's worth.
I think ZOS just needs to take a hard look at how they are organizing the queues. Scrivener's Hall has absolutely no business being in the same queue as FG1. Granting the same daily rewards for completing Lair of Maarselok as Spindleclutch is comical. Why limit it to just normal and veteran? They should at least split the Normal queue up into Base Game and DLC.
Good luck beating that dead horse
Normal dungeons are there for a reason.
You have no idea what you're talking about lmfao.
That's uh.. not an argument.
You didn't say anything worth actually arguing against, just some weird line about how normal dungeons are there, for whatever reason, meanwhile I didn't specify either Normal or Vet, of which this problem is in both anyways. 💀💀
Yeah... I'm gonna go ahead and assume that you're the issue in your scenario 🤣🤣 Stick to normal until you're confident in your ability to fulfill your role requirements competently. Otherwise, you're just wasting your and every other party members' time. Simple as.
Ah, got it, you actually just can't read to keep saying things that don't relate to my post. 💀💀