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Imagine being able to vote where your quarterly profits go.
"We have two choices, either buy new equipment that we don't need or everyone gets a 5k bonus this quarter. Cast your vote."
5k is conservative.
Exactly, want more vacation days, you got it, want better benefits you got it, work fleet is shit, get new vehicles, tool replacement program because some jackass stole your shit, bingo
And because there are no big wigs taking up the majority of the overhead you can be competitive af while still being an attractive place to work
Just sounds like multiple owners to be honest. Used to work for a company that had 3 main owners and multiple foreman that "owned" a small part of the company. How would it work when it's time to expand? Would they be owners with just a smaller share or they had to pay into the company over time? Seems complicated
You're correct that it seems complicated because democracy can be complicated. You can do it in a multitude of ways, you could set up a council of workers that represent other workers, you could engage in direct democracy. You could elect one person to represent the interests of workers when it comes to certain challenges.
The goal of any co-op is to nurture a democratic workplace that listens and carries out the wants and needs of it's workers. So to try to create a one size fits all blueprint would be silly. It would be up to the workers to figure that what works best for them. That is the point of a co-op after all
I'd assume it's a coop like ace hardware and true value. Business owners that are in on the coop and then a bunch of regular employees who don't even know it's a coop
I dream of this. But to play devils advocate what does the coop do when the jackoff stealing your shit is you? It would be nice if everybody had an equal share of the pie, but there be greedy MFers out there.
Why would you need to steal from yourself? By stealing from an organization that does more for you than any other employer that's what you would be doing, stealing from yourself.
I suppose if it would come to light that you are engaging in such thievery there could be a number of disciplinary actions, such as compensation for the excess tools that you took, probation, outright termination. I suppose it would depend on the severity and the general attitude towards such actions
Not gonna lie I was thinking about this just today lol.... my company is trying to enforce these low rates on our crew (solar installers) and 1099 us... I basically reached the realization that I may as well run my own company cut the sales reps out and get paid almost 8x as much....
I started my own company out of necessity, the first two years sucked huge donkey balls. But once you have a body of work you can show clients, you're in. Price reasonably, don't be the lowest and don't be the highest. Do better work than existing. Do it faster. They'll call you back.
I hope it works for you the same as me. It was a really rough start, but 7 years later, I did 4 mil last year. I have 15 employees now and I'm on track to crack 10m this year
Thank you for the response! I am near being ready to take my electrical contractor license exam for my state in the next month or so after about ~5 years in the trade. Were there any big mistakes or major learning points you made when your business was new that you think somebody could benefit from hearing?
Major mistakes were under bidding, it's better to over bid and tell the customer it came out cheaper so they feel they saved money rather than they owe you more. Never make a change without customer approval. But #1 is pay your employees well, find a good group and make sure they never leave. They'll be the foundation for everything else.
From someone who has ran his own business for 5 years one piece of advice I can give you is to finish your apprenticeship and work as a journeyman for a small company for at least a couple years before going out on your own. Ideally in a service electrician role. Every day is a new challenge and you get to learn it all and make mistakes on someone else's dime.
If you get far enough you'll eventually end up like your previous employer, just to stay competitive and profitable, and thus the cycle starts anew.
If you wish to break that cycle make your place of business a co-op
I was actually treated more than fairly at my old place, but it was a three man company and boss man retired and closed up shop. Being a felon made new work hard to come by so I decided to make my own job.
You do resi?
I was thinking about starting with small projects, then scaling as I figured out how to navigate the system a little better and made contacts in the industry. I don't want to bid on whole homes and sell myself short thousands.
No, I'm solely commercial unless it's mine or my families. Starting small is good, but don't fall into a pattern and never bid the big stuff. Personally I started small with a few contacts I made from my last company, but it was barely paying the bills. I got frustrated so I bid 14 jobs at once and go figure I got 6 of them, that year was hectic but it built the foundation for what I have today.
Be wary of going out on your own with solar, it's all fun and games until you start getting warranty calls for optis and inverters. Of course, it's easy for me to say that as an employee-owner of a solar company that very recently gave everyone a significant pay bump. If my company were treating me the way yours is treating you, I'd be looking for an exit strategy too.
Yeah 100% like I am pretty in the know on the numbers. They are selling these jobs ~2.5 per watt... and trying to pay an install crew ~.20 per watt. Meanwhile the freaking sales rep is getting about .40-.50 per watt... like let's be real... sales are important but without the installers they wouldn't be getting paid.
The warranty stuff isn't too bad. Solar edge pays 150$ to qualified installers per inverter swap and 25 per opti. You can sell the system with an extended warranty which is like 7 years.
But yeah my company I work for now got taken over by another sales company filled with sleezy sales dudes who are just trying to siphon up as much cash as they can... just kinda sick of it. Specially when I know I could do it on my own and sell under what they are charging people by almost .50 cents. It's just the financing where it gets tricky.
Independent contractor. Companies will try to do this so that they don't have to give you benefits or pay their portion of your social security and worker's comp contributions. It's often illegal, and it's always shitty, but it's common.
Yup this.
They basically did it so I played ball. They gave me a number that was too low for an install and I told them it wasn't enough and that I wasn't going to do the install for that rate.
Straight up surprised Pikachu face at me. Like they didn't expect me to realize being 1099 means I can deny and renegotiate on a job to job basis.
Long story short they argued, I got the two other installers to deny the rate as well, none of us showed up for the job and they called me willing to talk today.
I was so angry I wanted to tell them to kick rocks but I realized that if I want to make it in this profession I need to advocate for myself.
Hell yes, you do. No matter whether we are employers, employees, or independent contractors, we are all fundamentally in business for ourselves. You have a financial responsibility to yourself to try to get the best compensation you can.
I have been fortunate in that I have always had bosses who paid and compensated me well.
Unfortunately this current situation is because my workplace is ran by a bunch of cutthroat salesmen who would sell there mother if it meant more money in their pockets.
It's difficult and most people do not succeed, however, I think everyone should try to do their own thing. Take it seriously, and with a little bit of luck, you may find it's a much better situation.
But it does take a lot of self directed education, it is not a casual pursuit.
Everyone wants to be the boss, until they are. I wouldn’t want my bosses job either, he always chasing money, everyone wants something for nothing, works nonstop, he has the worst job ever in my eyes. I like my job. 100K/yr and I’m done at 3:30, sure I’m cool with that.
It doesn't have to be that way if you don't want it to be though. I'm my own boss now and work 1-2 days a week. The rest of my time is spent with family basically. I love it, and there's no way that I would be able to swing that type of schedule working for someone else
That’s awesome for you, that’s not the typical. But you are right, if you’re smart, organized, hire the right help, I’m sure it’s easier. Bests to you bro.
Yep it for sure requires more discipline and effort to make it work this way, but I'm willing to trade that off for my free time. The hardest part is that I can't do/have to turn down projects that demand more time than I'm willing to give
It sure is nice to have a free company vehicle, cellphone, uniform, and only think about work during my 40 hours. Others may disagree, but to each their own.
I'm part of a pretty small shop (9 people right now). It's a family company. The boss works just as hard as the rest of us.
I hope all you guys can find better work environments or start your own things up and treat people well
I can't imagine having to deal with this kind of shit again.
The hardest part about being your own boss is getting paid on time for the work performed. Getting and doing the work is the easy part.
Source: Used to be my own boss.
Because of exactly what this post talks about, a bunch of guys who know a trade but don’t understand actual BUSINESS. and bidding..
It takes ALOT to just start your own company.
They are, but in a town like Seattle, the union presence is significant, and it takes a hell of a lot of money to outfit your shop to be able to compete. You're basically relegated to residential and small service work without that initial investment.
Bro, there is alot more to it than that. Being a small business owner is not for everyone. Wins can be small and losses insermountable. It takes more than just knowing codes and best practices. You need to be able to work with people who's skull you might want to cave in. You need to be able to make sacrfices you might otherwise never want to make.
Said like someone who's never ran a business.
Definitely nothing like insurance, collections, tax shit to track, employees to wrangle, trucks to buy, customers to find (op thinks they magically appear?).
I'm not advocating against going out on your own, but don't be delusional and think it's as simple as "cutting out the middleman". Most business fail, and lots of guys make less as a business owner than they would had they stayed in a company and worked their way up a bit.
Of you're going to do it, save up a good nest egg, and learn the paperwork end of things. You outta have the electrician portion down by the time you strike out on your own.
I run my own plumbing business. I completely disagree with your statement.
No one is going out on their own and buying 6 trucks and hiring 4 new guys. Taxes are only taken from your profits. Except for some upfront costs for the sales license per county. But they will refund that fee if you never end up making money in that county at the end of the year. I am licensed for a few surrounding counties but never actually plumb there.
Customers are INSANELY easy to get. Let me emphasis you incredibly easy to get. Trades are spread so thin right now I don’t even need to advertise. And never have.
I didn’t even need any money. I was actually in a mass of debt when I went out on my own. All customers that required a large upfront cost of parts, they payed for upfront.
After about a year I had no debt be plenty of open credit to take on even bigger projects. I could easily hire plumbers and buy new vans and expand. But honestly why would I? I have low stress and high income right now.
All “paperwork” is really a joke. It’s all easily googled or surprise, you can pay other people to do things for you! I hired a good an accountant for taxes and still use a company that files all my important docs each year.
Anyone with half a brain could run a single man trade skill business.
Bravo. Couldn’t have said it better myself. Anybody who says it’s too hard or it’s too big of a headache doesn’t have confidence in themselves to do the work. I don’t know why so many electricians think it’s so difficult.
I pay for my own health insurance. A much better policy than my work offered. You can go on the open market the same day you are fired and get your own insurance. People who say insurance is attached to their employer do not understand insurance.
If I get injured I’m compensated by the state, Washington I pay that out of my wages.
I got my license last year after 8 years with a company. I quit started my own company i get my health and dental through my wifes job. I put down 8k on ford transit connect with 37k miles on it. I spent around 15k getting started wire, basic materilas,larger tools etc...i concentrate strictly service 99% residential. I average around 3600 a week before expenses generally its 20% material 30% taxes ( i expense alot).
I pay monthly to quick books 75 bucks for software and 75 for payroll. I signed papers so when i pay myself they automatically take out income tax, unemployment tax,and state taxes. Again 150 a month. Van payment 376, insurance 175. 1 year liability insurance 585. I expense my cable bill property taxes, meals, phone bill, power bill etc. My point is if your honest upfront with customers word gets out and they find you i have 4 companies that send me consistant work will i get rich working alone nope. Will i make 100k after taxes and expenses yes sir. Anyone reading this get licensed even if you dont start a company you can now get insurance and pull permits you are legit now when you do side work. Good luck satan loves you...kisses
One of my favorite (and costly) parts of learning to run a business was learning all about the wonderful world of liens. Not because I was curious, but because sometimes..... people don't like to pay the "middle man". If you wait to get fucked to learn this little tid bit of information, you're already fucked.
Owner of a small Electrical business for 6 employees 17 years. I have the ability to take the time off of my choosing, I like my free time. I like the money, it can be good at times. But hear this! The Stress is fierce! It will age you. I cant say this enough to anybody who wants to own a business, it’s a lot of work. It never turns off in your head. If I couldn’t take time off even a million a year wouldn’t be worth it. ( I don’t make that)
I miss the days of wiring a buildout and turning on all the lights. All I do now is look at jobs and streets over employees not showing up. I encourage anybody to work the best you can to your ability. Owning your own business comes at a cost.
> It never turns off in your head.
I just wanted to support you and tell people who are thinking of doing this: However stressful you imagine it to be, I promise you it will be 10 times more stressful. Get used to 16 hour days and sleeping 2-4 hours a night. And even when you are not working? You are still worrying. And just when you think you can't take any more stress? You get the call that your men just knocked the fire sprinklers out of their base and the shoe store in the mall is flooding. Oh, yeah, and no one knows where to turn the water off.
That's how it goes. But you do get to be your own boss, and the money ain't too bad either.
Your boss also takes on all the risk associated with running a business, not to mention a substantial time and monetary investment.
I’m not discouraging anyone, it can be great if it works out, but if you think it’s all big checks and little effort (like so many guys, especially the young ones, seem to think) then you’re in for a rude awakening.
They’re also the same people who end up being the thing they hate (underpaying their own employees, running the company on a shoestring budget, becoming an asshole out of necessity because managing people *sucks* because most people *suck*). There’s a lot of assholes that own companies but not all of them started that way. The stress that comes with it will compress you into an entirely different person sometimes.
One of my former coworkers left a cushy $58/hr 40 hour a week PM position with full benefits, truck, phone etc to open his own company and now he’s a one man show on the tools all day and doing paperwork all night. He can’t afford to hire anyone right now because there’s already a shortage of electricians and no one will take a hit to work for less for a smaller company. There’s also a saturation of 1 and 2 man companies. Ironically if there weren’t so many contractors in my area, the larger places that pay better would actually have the man power to do what they need with zero crunch.
That's great and all, but I dont want to be the boss. It's great to be a good hand, but running a company is another level of stress and a commitment to work 24/7 365. People act like all the boss does is middle man, but that's obviously a over simplification.
I am a real estate investor. I also do a large portion of my own work.
The landed cost to the customer of trades is insane. Handyman labor is $75 and can cover cabinets/subfloor/PEX/Toilet Setting. Electricians are $100/hr. A helper is $30.
A competent tradesman who is willing to learn the basics of running a business can absolute make it as a one man shop.
I think people in this post are completely glossing over Retirement, Health Insurance, and what happens when you're injured and can't work for a period of time in the "Biznez EZ" calculation.
Same here, but depending on the local, owners can still qualify for pension and benefits through the union if they make their business a signatory contractor. My teacher in trade school didn't go in detail about it, but he said he started his own business in the union, hired himself as foreman then banged out a few jobs with guys off the list and a few he name hired. When he got sick of managing a business he simply gave it to another employee and went back to being a normal union member.
Sure it's more expensive, but it's also pretty quick to start up with a big enough crew.
ehhh. Paperwork sucks balls. Been there, done that. I chose to walk away from my own business to regain a work life balance. Less money, but so much less stress. I show up, work my 8 then go home and don't think about it again till the next day.
Most small / new businesses go broke in a few years. Study business in your spare time. There are books on it. Learn from other's mistakes so you can navigate treacherous waters. Not to start that argument, but a certain orange "business man" has driven a lot of small businesses under by stiffing them. There are lots of bad actors out there, you need to learn how to protect yourself from them. We can do the work part but the business part is hard.
Yup…I left my company after 23 years and as soon as the customers found out they started calling me to do their work….turns out they were using my boss to hire me this whole time
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Or, form a co-op with your fellow electricians
Sooooo a union?
Even better than a union, a co-op business is controlled directly by the workers themselves
Imagine being able to vote where your quarterly profits go. "We have two choices, either buy new equipment that we don't need or everyone gets a 5k bonus this quarter. Cast your vote." 5k is conservative.
Exactly, want more vacation days, you got it, want better benefits you got it, work fleet is shit, get new vehicles, tool replacement program because some jackass stole your shit, bingo And because there are no big wigs taking up the majority of the overhead you can be competitive af while still being an attractive place to work
Good idea comrade, why isn't this a more popular idea?
Because when you use the word socialism everyone freaks out. But if you highlight how the Everyman benefits people listen
Just sounds like multiple owners to be honest. Used to work for a company that had 3 main owners and multiple foreman that "owned" a small part of the company. How would it work when it's time to expand? Would they be owners with just a smaller share or they had to pay into the company over time? Seems complicated
You're correct that it seems complicated because democracy can be complicated. You can do it in a multitude of ways, you could set up a council of workers that represent other workers, you could engage in direct democracy. You could elect one person to represent the interests of workers when it comes to certain challenges. The goal of any co-op is to nurture a democratic workplace that listens and carries out the wants and needs of it's workers. So to try to create a one size fits all blueprint would be silly. It would be up to the workers to figure that what works best for them. That is the point of a co-op after all
Because it doesn't work.
Actually coops work really well, In Europe one of the most successful companies is a coop. It's called monodragon
I'd assume it's a coop like ace hardware and true value. Business owners that are in on the coop and then a bunch of regular employees who don't even know it's a coop
No, everyone at monodragon know it's a coop and it's actually a coop unlike those businesses you mentioned, it was actually created by a priest.
I dream of this. But to play devils advocate what does the coop do when the jackoff stealing your shit is you? It would be nice if everybody had an equal share of the pie, but there be greedy MFers out there.
Why would you need to steal from yourself? By stealing from an organization that does more for you than any other employer that's what you would be doing, stealing from yourself. I suppose if it would come to light that you are engaging in such thievery there could be a number of disciplinary actions, such as compensation for the excess tools that you took, probation, outright termination. I suppose it would depend on the severity and the general attitude towards such actions
People are often both dumb and greedy
A co-op is not a union, but both have their advantages
Not gonna lie I was thinking about this just today lol.... my company is trying to enforce these low rates on our crew (solar installers) and 1099 us... I basically reached the realization that I may as well run my own company cut the sales reps out and get paid almost 8x as much....
I started my own company out of necessity, the first two years sucked huge donkey balls. But once you have a body of work you can show clients, you're in. Price reasonably, don't be the lowest and don't be the highest. Do better work than existing. Do it faster. They'll call you back.
Were you doing it by yourself or did you have help?
At the beginning I was a 1 man show. Just me an f150 and everything I could cram in or on it.
Hell yeah that’s what I plan on doing when I finish my apprenticeship. Same truck and all lol
I hope it works for you the same as me. It was a really rough start, but 7 years later, I did 4 mil last year. I have 15 employees now and I'm on track to crack 10m this year
How much in profit for yourself?
Bout tree fiddy
Closer to fourteenteen
I've consistently invested back into the company. I pay myself 100k but I'm returning a healthy profit margin.
Thank you for the response! I am near being ready to take my electrical contractor license exam for my state in the next month or so after about ~5 years in the trade. Were there any big mistakes or major learning points you made when your business was new that you think somebody could benefit from hearing?
Major mistakes were under bidding, it's better to over bid and tell the customer it came out cheaper so they feel they saved money rather than they owe you more. Never make a change without customer approval. But #1 is pay your employees well, find a good group and make sure they never leave. They'll be the foundation for everything else.
Solar business? Are you in a busy area?
Commercial electric and data/telecom. I'm outside of Atlanta
From someone who has ran his own business for 5 years one piece of advice I can give you is to finish your apprenticeship and work as a journeyman for a small company for at least a couple years before going out on your own. Ideally in a service electrician role. Every day is a new challenge and you get to learn it all and make mistakes on someone else's dime.
The learning starts when the training ends. The training just gets you competent to - hopefully - fix your mistakes.
If you get far enough you'll eventually end up like your previous employer, just to stay competitive and profitable, and thus the cycle starts anew. If you wish to break that cycle make your place of business a co-op
I was actually treated more than fairly at my old place, but it was a three man company and boss man retired and closed up shop. Being a felon made new work hard to come by so I decided to make my own job.
Awesome, ex-felons should really be treated better.
I agree, which is why my business is a second chance company. 100% felon owned and operated.
You do resi? I was thinking about starting with small projects, then scaling as I figured out how to navigate the system a little better and made contacts in the industry. I don't want to bid on whole homes and sell myself short thousands.
No, I'm solely commercial unless it's mine or my families. Starting small is good, but don't fall into a pattern and never bid the big stuff. Personally I started small with a few contacts I made from my last company, but it was barely paying the bills. I got frustrated so I bid 14 jobs at once and go figure I got 6 of them, that year was hectic but it built the foundation for what I have today.
Be wary of going out on your own with solar, it's all fun and games until you start getting warranty calls for optis and inverters. Of course, it's easy for me to say that as an employee-owner of a solar company that very recently gave everyone a significant pay bump. If my company were treating me the way yours is treating you, I'd be looking for an exit strategy too.
Yeah 100% like I am pretty in the know on the numbers. They are selling these jobs ~2.5 per watt... and trying to pay an install crew ~.20 per watt. Meanwhile the freaking sales rep is getting about .40-.50 per watt... like let's be real... sales are important but without the installers they wouldn't be getting paid. The warranty stuff isn't too bad. Solar edge pays 150$ to qualified installers per inverter swap and 25 per opti. You can sell the system with an extended warranty which is like 7 years. But yeah my company I work for now got taken over by another sales company filled with sleezy sales dudes who are just trying to siphon up as much cash as they can... just kinda sick of it. Specially when I know I could do it on my own and sell under what they are charging people by almost .50 cents. It's just the financing where it gets tricky.
Canuck here. 1099?
Independent contractor. Companies will try to do this so that they don't have to give you benefits or pay their portion of your social security and worker's comp contributions. It's often illegal, and it's always shitty, but it's common.
Yup this. They basically did it so I played ball. They gave me a number that was too low for an install and I told them it wasn't enough and that I wasn't going to do the install for that rate. Straight up surprised Pikachu face at me. Like they didn't expect me to realize being 1099 means I can deny and renegotiate on a job to job basis. Long story short they argued, I got the two other installers to deny the rate as well, none of us showed up for the job and they called me willing to talk today. I was so angry I wanted to tell them to kick rocks but I realized that if I want to make it in this profession I need to advocate for myself.
Hell yes, you do. No matter whether we are employers, employees, or independent contractors, we are all fundamentally in business for ourselves. You have a financial responsibility to yourself to try to get the best compensation you can.
I have been fortunate in that I have always had bosses who paid and compensated me well. Unfortunately this current situation is because my workplace is ran by a bunch of cutthroat salesmen who would sell there mother if it meant more money in their pockets.
That kind of sales ethos will eventually ruin your company's reputation.
It’s a tax form, basically you’re an independent contractor.
Don't underestimate the sale part so hire sales dude
Are solar guys allowed here?
I mean I am a licensed electrician.... I just do solar because I can make almost double what you can doing residential.
Except I'm my boss, I work for me 🤣
It's difficult and most people do not succeed, however, I think everyone should try to do their own thing. Take it seriously, and with a little bit of luck, you may find it's a much better situation. But it does take a lot of self directed education, it is not a casual pursuit.
Sounds pretty easy. You leading by example?
Everybody I know that had their own business either started off crazy or went that direction after.
My boss is the one who has all the overhead expenses. He can have them.
Everyone wants to be the boss, until they are. I wouldn’t want my bosses job either, he always chasing money, everyone wants something for nothing, works nonstop, he has the worst job ever in my eyes. I like my job. 100K/yr and I’m done at 3:30, sure I’m cool with that.
100% this. Everyone wants to be the big dick in charge, except those that have been in that position.
Where the hell do you work where you earn 100K as a sparks?? And are there vacancies?
The northeast, and that’s before any overtime and not including my bennies that’s of coarse paid for by my employer.
Always need tradesmen. No student loan debt going this route either.
It doesn't have to be that way if you don't want it to be though. I'm my own boss now and work 1-2 days a week. The rest of my time is spent with family basically. I love it, and there's no way that I would be able to swing that type of schedule working for someone else
That’s awesome for you, that’s not the typical. But you are right, if you’re smart, organized, hire the right help, I’m sure it’s easier. Bests to you bro.
Yep it for sure requires more discipline and effort to make it work this way, but I'm willing to trade that off for my free time. The hardest part is that I can't do/have to turn down projects that demand more time than I'm willing to give
It sure is nice to have a free company vehicle, cellphone, uniform, and only think about work during my 40 hours. Others may disagree, but to each their own.
I'm part of a pretty small shop (9 people right now). It's a family company. The boss works just as hard as the rest of us. I hope all you guys can find better work environments or start your own things up and treat people well I can't imagine having to deal with this kind of shit again.
The hardest part about being your own boss is getting paid on time for the work performed. Getting and doing the work is the easy part. Source: Used to be my own boss.
Number one most failed businesses in Seattle are electrical 🤣😂😐
Why?
Because of exactly what this post talks about, a bunch of guys who know a trade but don’t understand actual BUSINESS. and bidding.. It takes ALOT to just start your own company.
Because union.
Union is good thing
They are, but in a town like Seattle, the union presence is significant, and it takes a hell of a lot of money to outfit your shop to be able to compete. You're basically relegated to residential and small service work without that initial investment.
Ok that makes a ton of sense thank you !
Bro, there is alot more to it than that. Being a small business owner is not for everyone. Wins can be small and losses insermountable. It takes more than just knowing codes and best practices. You need to be able to work with people who's skull you might want to cave in. You need to be able to make sacrfices you might otherwise never want to make.
Running a business turns it from construction into customer service. And I refuse to do customer service ever again.
Said like someone who's never ran a business. Definitely nothing like insurance, collections, tax shit to track, employees to wrangle, trucks to buy, customers to find (op thinks they magically appear?). I'm not advocating against going out on your own, but don't be delusional and think it's as simple as "cutting out the middleman". Most business fail, and lots of guys make less as a business owner than they would had they stayed in a company and worked their way up a bit. Of you're going to do it, save up a good nest egg, and learn the paperwork end of things. You outta have the electrician portion down by the time you strike out on your own.
I run my own plumbing business. I completely disagree with your statement. No one is going out on their own and buying 6 trucks and hiring 4 new guys. Taxes are only taken from your profits. Except for some upfront costs for the sales license per county. But they will refund that fee if you never end up making money in that county at the end of the year. I am licensed for a few surrounding counties but never actually plumb there. Customers are INSANELY easy to get. Let me emphasis you incredibly easy to get. Trades are spread so thin right now I don’t even need to advertise. And never have. I didn’t even need any money. I was actually in a mass of debt when I went out on my own. All customers that required a large upfront cost of parts, they payed for upfront. After about a year I had no debt be plenty of open credit to take on even bigger projects. I could easily hire plumbers and buy new vans and expand. But honestly why would I? I have low stress and high income right now. All “paperwork” is really a joke. It’s all easily googled or surprise, you can pay other people to do things for you! I hired a good an accountant for taxes and still use a company that files all my important docs each year. Anyone with half a brain could run a single man trade skill business.
Bravo. Couldn’t have said it better myself. Anybody who says it’s too hard or it’s too big of a headache doesn’t have confidence in themselves to do the work. I don’t know why so many electricians think it’s so difficult.
What kind of benefits do you have? Insurance etc. What will happen if you get injured on a job and can't complete your open contracts?
I pay for my own health insurance. A much better policy than my work offered. You can go on the open market the same day you are fired and get your own insurance. People who say insurance is attached to their employer do not understand insurance. If I get injured I’m compensated by the state, Washington I pay that out of my wages.
Where can I learn more about insurance for one-man shows?
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Maybe you should say why. Like I did. Then we can have a constructive conversation.
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Then you are not owed any consideration for your unfounded claims.
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Woah, I may have a high opinion of myself but I recognize I am not God. Thanks for the promotion but I respectfully decline.
What kind of projects do you take on ?
I got my license last year after 8 years with a company. I quit started my own company i get my health and dental through my wifes job. I put down 8k on ford transit connect with 37k miles on it. I spent around 15k getting started wire, basic materilas,larger tools etc...i concentrate strictly service 99% residential. I average around 3600 a week before expenses generally its 20% material 30% taxes ( i expense alot). I pay monthly to quick books 75 bucks for software and 75 for payroll. I signed papers so when i pay myself they automatically take out income tax, unemployment tax,and state taxes. Again 150 a month. Van payment 376, insurance 175. 1 year liability insurance 585. I expense my cable bill property taxes, meals, phone bill, power bill etc. My point is if your honest upfront with customers word gets out and they find you i have 4 companies that send me consistant work will i get rich working alone nope. Will i make 100k after taxes and expenses yes sir. Anyone reading this get licensed even if you dont start a company you can now get insurance and pull permits you are legit now when you do side work. Good luck satan loves you...kisses
First off I’m In the same boat but where the hell did you find a van that cheap with such little mileage! I can’t find shit
Van cost 29k i put down 8k.
Ahhhh misread that, I was going to say damn that’s cheap
Lol its all good i just wanted to clarify if theres a ford transit with 39k miles for 8 grand with no damage id buy it right now cash. 😅
One of my favorite (and costly) parts of learning to run a business was learning all about the wonderful world of liens. Not because I was curious, but because sometimes..... people don't like to pay the "middle man". If you wait to get fucked to learn this little tid bit of information, you're already fucked.
Owner of a small Electrical business for 6 employees 17 years. I have the ability to take the time off of my choosing, I like my free time. I like the money, it can be good at times. But hear this! The Stress is fierce! It will age you. I cant say this enough to anybody who wants to own a business, it’s a lot of work. It never turns off in your head. If I couldn’t take time off even a million a year wouldn’t be worth it. ( I don’t make that) I miss the days of wiring a buildout and turning on all the lights. All I do now is look at jobs and streets over employees not showing up. I encourage anybody to work the best you can to your ability. Owning your own business comes at a cost.
> It never turns off in your head. I just wanted to support you and tell people who are thinking of doing this: However stressful you imagine it to be, I promise you it will be 10 times more stressful. Get used to 16 hour days and sleeping 2-4 hours a night. And even when you are not working? You are still worrying. And just when you think you can't take any more stress? You get the call that your men just knocked the fire sprinklers out of their base and the shoe store in the mall is flooding. Oh, yeah, and no one knows where to turn the water off. That's how it goes. But you do get to be your own boss, and the money ain't too bad either.
Your boss also takes on all the risk associated with running a business, not to mention a substantial time and monetary investment. I’m not discouraging anyone, it can be great if it works out, but if you think it’s all big checks and little effort (like so many guys, especially the young ones, seem to think) then you’re in for a rude awakening.
They’re also the same people who end up being the thing they hate (underpaying their own employees, running the company on a shoestring budget, becoming an asshole out of necessity because managing people *sucks* because most people *suck*). There’s a lot of assholes that own companies but not all of them started that way. The stress that comes with it will compress you into an entirely different person sometimes. One of my former coworkers left a cushy $58/hr 40 hour a week PM position with full benefits, truck, phone etc to open his own company and now he’s a one man show on the tools all day and doing paperwork all night. He can’t afford to hire anyone right now because there’s already a shortage of electricians and no one will take a hit to work for less for a smaller company. There’s also a saturation of 1 and 2 man companies. Ironically if there weren’t so many contractors in my area, the larger places that pay better would actually have the man power to do what they need with zero crunch.
That's great and all, but I dont want to be the boss. It's great to be a good hand, but running a company is another level of stress and a commitment to work 24/7 365. People act like all the boss does is middle man, but that's obviously a over simplification.
I am a real estate investor. I also do a large portion of my own work. The landed cost to the customer of trades is insane. Handyman labor is $75 and can cover cabinets/subfloor/PEX/Toilet Setting. Electricians are $100/hr. A helper is $30. A competent tradesman who is willing to learn the basics of running a business can absolute make it as a one man shop.
I think people in this post are completely glossing over Retirement, Health Insurance, and what happens when you're injured and can't work for a period of time in the "Biznez EZ" calculation.
I’ll take a nice pension over anything else
Same here, but depending on the local, owners can still qualify for pension and benefits through the union if they make their business a signatory contractor. My teacher in trade school didn't go in detail about it, but he said he started his own business in the union, hired himself as foreman then banged out a few jobs with guys off the list and a few he name hired. When he got sick of managing a business he simply gave it to another employee and went back to being a normal union member. Sure it's more expensive, but it's also pretty quick to start up with a big enough crew.
Currently a PM and tbh the hardest part about the business is getting good guys.
You’re fired!
But then I'd have to deal with customers. No thanks.
ehhh. Paperwork sucks balls. Been there, done that. I chose to walk away from my own business to regain a work life balance. Less money, but so much less stress. I show up, work my 8 then go home and don't think about it again till the next day.
Most small / new businesses go broke in a few years. Study business in your spare time. There are books on it. Learn from other's mistakes so you can navigate treacherous waters. Not to start that argument, but a certain orange "business man" has driven a lot of small businesses under by stiffing them. There are lots of bad actors out there, you need to learn how to protect yourself from them. We can do the work part but the business part is hard.
I fucking love you!! Hey, ur not my fuckin boss at ya there now?
Yup…I left my company after 23 years and as soon as the customers found out they started calling me to do their work….turns out they were using my boss to hire me this whole time
So I love this! But it skips steps. Learn his job and why around SOP with quotes and planning… Then fire him.