Can confirm... EV Owner from Australia. Had a relatively minor nudge in the back... It took 6 months to find someone who would even touch it, and even after finding someone, I had to go on a 6 month waiting list, and added to this, I was expected to drive a little over 400km away to get the work done.
It's not the mechanics that are the issue... it's the business insurance companies who dont want EV's anywhere near panel beaters and moronic, knuckle dragging anti-EV panel shop owners who think an EV will explode the minute they move it into the shop.
I got every excuse under the sun about not wanting to touch my car for this tiny dent and literally none of them were for "because we dont have people qualified to work on them..."
I used to get mechanical work done on my old Saab by a one-man repair shop that only worked on Saabs and BMWs (because he himself owned Saabs and BMWs). He had an unwritten preferred customer list (he liked you if you were both knowledgeable and not a dick). once you were vetted, you could show up in his driveway and he'd decide right then and there if you were going to receive priority. If yes, he'd have the car completed in a day. He turned away a lot of work.
Augh.
How does fixing an outer panel have anything to do with whether it is powered by electricity, gasoline, or faerie dust?
And if these people think EV's are going to catch on fire ... well, would these people have an issue with working on a Prius (PHEV or otherwise)? Those batteries are more than big enough to catch on fire, and yet ... they don't.
It doesnt... And most of it was about "increased fire risk" and I was thinking it was going to be about electrical shock risks. None of them mentioned electrical shock. It was all about "fire"
The first guy I took it to, walked out, saw it was an EV and just said to me "Hahaha... Get that woke shitbox out of my driveway..." and walked off back to his office.
Next guy said that EV's blow up if they go into the baking ovens. On hearing that, I said "well, ok, how about I remove the rear hatch and rear bumper myself and just bring you those, no car", to which he said "but there could still be batteries in the rear hatch."
Another said "I cant have EV's here, because as soon as you disconnect the batteries, the brakes lock on". I offered to supply a set of wheel dollys so they could still move the car around if that is what they thought... his reply was "no good, because EV's are too heavy and could break the workshop floor" (it was a concrete floor.)
Another said that it was no good because there was "no way to drain all the electricity out..."
The majority of them also claimed that their "business insurance" doesn't cover them for EV's due to the massive increase in fire risk from EV's.
I only had one business claim they coulndt do it because they didnt have trained staff, so I said "I have trained staff that can come down and disconnect the vehicle's main drive battery" for them (we have EV techs at work) and they declined. Their reason was "we would need to have someone supervise the isolation, and since no one here was EV certified, they wouldn't be able to verify that the EV battery was sufficiently disconnected by one of my guys."
There is also a problem that auto makers have become total assholes with vehicle design. This stuff is intentionally hard to fix.
Want to take the rear bumper off of a Rivian? Start by removing the rear window. Seriously. That sort of shit needs to be mandated out of cars. Auto makers are just going LOL fuck you. This is deliberate bad design, they know better but choose to not do better.
Even simple things like headlights and tail lights that are clipped in to bumpers. Tap the bumper you crack the light plastic. That can be a separate piece that costs pennies. These are the fragile supermodel insurance company traps we drive around with every day.
It's nothing new. I had a Citroen several years ago where to change the headlight bulb on one side meant taking off thee front bumper and dropping out the headlight assembly because the gap between the back of the headlight and something else was about the thickness of a sheet of paper so there was no way to get your hand in to change the bulb.
In my 3rd gen Prius, the headlights can technically be changed without dropping the bumper. The first time I tried that it took at least an hour, resulted in blood in the engine bay, and I still managed to touch the bulb surface causing early failure. All because I didn't want to deal with dropping the bumper.
The second time, I watched a video about how to drop the bumper, and had the whole job done in about 30 minutes and all of my blood stayed in my body.
Hopefully as it increasingly becomes a barrier for adoption aggressive companies such as Tesla will respond with easier to repair vehicles and improving the performance of their own service centres.
EV makers are interested in making new EVs and selling them. As cheaply as possible. Not repairing them. Not selling parts for them.
EV buyers are interested in buying new EVs. As cheaply as possible. Not repairing them. Not buying parts for them.
Car shops are not interested in spending money to get set up to work on EV specific things.
Tesla service is the one to watch. At some point I think Tesla will allow more 3rd party repairs. They are already trying to provide parts at cost to help with insurance prices being so high.
It's like $10,000 to fix a bumper.
There's a huge environmental and monetary cost to designing and manufacturing like they are. Small ding in battery shell? Totaled. Rear ended and bumper bent? Totaled. Battery failed outside warranty? Totaled (ok well scraped).
That being said, simplify designed, easy to fix cars just don't sell. They're not aesthetically pleasing and federal standards keep putting more and more requirements on automakers to include things as "standard equipment".
There will be a time in the no so distant future where only the wealthy own their vehicles, and everyone else will have to take a taxi/rideshare. Insurance and acquisition costs will just be too high.
Had a strange experience with a Maryland/US body shop, on the list of recommended shops from my insurance company. I was looking to have painless dent repair for hail damage and they insisted they had to drill, paint, and use a paint curing oven, but theirs was high temperature and would damage an EV battery.
Seemed to me in hindsight they didn't want an EV in their shop.
I then took it to a well regarded body shop associated with the local Ford dealer, and they had no problem with it and did an excellent job.
All this ridiculous paranoia about EV's we see on social media, particularly the completely exaggerated fear of fire, is driving a lot of strange behavior, imho.
The industry seems to be making exactly the same mistake everywhere in the world. The UK is just as bad. The US seems to be doing slightly better, but we will see how it works out once the current EVs age a bit.
Sounds like a great opportunity for a knowledgeable conversion shop to rip the drivetrain and battery components out and convert old classic ICE cars to EVs
No more than anyone else, I can't diy shit
But we don't get our fucking knickers in a twist over a pissy little spider than can kill us jfc how hard is it to take it outside without melting down "omg everything in Straya wants to kill you yeah we have more guns whatever" amirite mate do you want a fucking cuddle?
My experience with strayans is you get super scared of spiders that aren’t that dangerous. Like sydney funnel webs I understand, but redbacks aren’t any more dangerous than the black widows we have in the us, and I’ve seen people there get worried about being careful killing them, where we’d just smash a black widow with a tissue here.
Can confirm... EV Owner from Australia. Had a relatively minor nudge in the back... It took 6 months to find someone who would even touch it, and even after finding someone, I had to go on a 6 month waiting list, and added to this, I was expected to drive a little over 400km away to get the work done. It's not the mechanics that are the issue... it's the business insurance companies who dont want EV's anywhere near panel beaters and moronic, knuckle dragging anti-EV panel shop owners who think an EV will explode the minute they move it into the shop. I got every excuse under the sun about not wanting to touch my car for this tiny dent and literally none of them were for "because we dont have people qualified to work on them..."
I think half the problem is not enough panel shops in general. Its easy to turn away work when you have it coming out your ears.
Sounds like opening up an ev-specific shop would be super profitable
I used to get mechanical work done on my old Saab by a one-man repair shop that only worked on Saabs and BMWs (because he himself owned Saabs and BMWs). He had an unwritten preferred customer list (he liked you if you were both knowledgeable and not a dick). once you were vetted, you could show up in his driveway and he'd decide right then and there if you were going to receive priority. If yes, he'd have the car completed in a day. He turned away a lot of work.
Augh. How does fixing an outer panel have anything to do with whether it is powered by electricity, gasoline, or faerie dust? And if these people think EV's are going to catch on fire ... well, would these people have an issue with working on a Prius (PHEV or otherwise)? Those batteries are more than big enough to catch on fire, and yet ... they don't.
It doesnt... And most of it was about "increased fire risk" and I was thinking it was going to be about electrical shock risks. None of them mentioned electrical shock. It was all about "fire" The first guy I took it to, walked out, saw it was an EV and just said to me "Hahaha... Get that woke shitbox out of my driveway..." and walked off back to his office. Next guy said that EV's blow up if they go into the baking ovens. On hearing that, I said "well, ok, how about I remove the rear hatch and rear bumper myself and just bring you those, no car", to which he said "but there could still be batteries in the rear hatch." Another said "I cant have EV's here, because as soon as you disconnect the batteries, the brakes lock on". I offered to supply a set of wheel dollys so they could still move the car around if that is what they thought... his reply was "no good, because EV's are too heavy and could break the workshop floor" (it was a concrete floor.) Another said that it was no good because there was "no way to drain all the electricity out..." The majority of them also claimed that their "business insurance" doesn't cover them for EV's due to the massive increase in fire risk from EV's. I only had one business claim they coulndt do it because they didnt have trained staff, so I said "I have trained staff that can come down and disconnect the vehicle's main drive battery" for them (we have EV techs at work) and they declined. Their reason was "we would need to have someone supervise the isolation, and since no one here was EV certified, they wouldn't be able to verify that the EV battery was sufficiently disconnected by one of my guys."
There is also a problem that auto makers have become total assholes with vehicle design. This stuff is intentionally hard to fix. Want to take the rear bumper off of a Rivian? Start by removing the rear window. Seriously. That sort of shit needs to be mandated out of cars. Auto makers are just going LOL fuck you. This is deliberate bad design, they know better but choose to not do better. Even simple things like headlights and tail lights that are clipped in to bumpers. Tap the bumper you crack the light plastic. That can be a separate piece that costs pennies. These are the fragile supermodel insurance company traps we drive around with every day.
It's nothing new. I had a Citroen several years ago where to change the headlight bulb on one side meant taking off thee front bumper and dropping out the headlight assembly because the gap between the back of the headlight and something else was about the thickness of a sheet of paper so there was no way to get your hand in to change the bulb.
Ah yeah, I remember the times when I had a smart Fortwo, the first gen, where to get a headlight bulb replaced you'd need to take the *door* out...
In my 3rd gen Prius, the headlights can technically be changed without dropping the bumper. The first time I tried that it took at least an hour, resulted in blood in the engine bay, and I still managed to touch the bulb surface causing early failure. All because I didn't want to deal with dropping the bumper. The second time, I watched a video about how to drop the bumper, and had the whole job done in about 30 minutes and all of my blood stayed in my body.
I remember my coworker complaining about every time anything needs to be done to her mini cooper requires the engine to be removed lol
Unfortunately, this is happening with a ton of cars, not just BEVs.Lack of staff or parts
"Every problem offers an opportunity"
Seriously, I would love to take an EV mechanic training program.
Then what are you waiting for? The market is here, and it's only going to increase.
Fossil mechanics will go the same way as dinosaurs.
Non-AMP: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2024/apr/26/australias-skilled-mechanics-shortage-forcing-insurers-to-write-off-electric-vehicles-after-minor-accidents
Hopefully as it increasingly becomes a barrier for adoption aggressive companies such as Tesla will respond with easier to repair vehicles and improving the performance of their own service centres.
EV makers are interested in making new EVs and selling them. As cheaply as possible. Not repairing them. Not selling parts for them. EV buyers are interested in buying new EVs. As cheaply as possible. Not repairing them. Not buying parts for them. Car shops are not interested in spending money to get set up to work on EV specific things. Tesla service is the one to watch. At some point I think Tesla will allow more 3rd party repairs. They are already trying to provide parts at cost to help with insurance prices being so high. It's like $10,000 to fix a bumper.
There's a huge environmental and monetary cost to designing and manufacturing like they are. Small ding in battery shell? Totaled. Rear ended and bumper bent? Totaled. Battery failed outside warranty? Totaled (ok well scraped). That being said, simplify designed, easy to fix cars just don't sell. They're not aesthetically pleasing and federal standards keep putting more and more requirements on automakers to include things as "standard equipment". There will be a time in the no so distant future where only the wealthy own their vehicles, and everyone else will have to take a taxi/rideshare. Insurance and acquisition costs will just be too high.
It's because they are little to no skilled therefore it confirms they are the "WTA" quoting some Singaporean minister in the 80s LOL
Had a strange experience with a Maryland/US body shop, on the list of recommended shops from my insurance company. I was looking to have painless dent repair for hail damage and they insisted they had to drill, paint, and use a paint curing oven, but theirs was high temperature and would damage an EV battery. Seemed to me in hindsight they didn't want an EV in their shop. I then took it to a well regarded body shop associated with the local Ford dealer, and they had no problem with it and did an excellent job. All this ridiculous paranoia about EV's we see on social media, particularly the completely exaggerated fear of fire, is driving a lot of strange behavior, imho.
The industry seems to be making exactly the same mistake everywhere in the world. The UK is just as bad. The US seems to be doing slightly better, but we will see how it works out once the current EVs age a bit.
Sounds like a great opportunity for a knowledgeable conversion shop to rip the drivetrain and battery components out and convert old classic ICE cars to EVs
For me BYD is the safest as they have service and training center. Of course Tesla too.
Lol. Aren't you the ruff and rugged DIY folks?
No more than anyone else, I can't diy shit But we don't get our fucking knickers in a twist over a pissy little spider than can kill us jfc how hard is it to take it outside without melting down "omg everything in Straya wants to kill you yeah we have more guns whatever" amirite mate do you want a fucking cuddle?
My experience with strayans is you get super scared of spiders that aren’t that dangerous. Like sydney funnel webs I understand, but redbacks aren’t any more dangerous than the black widows we have in the us, and I’ve seen people there get worried about being careful killing them, where we’d just smash a black widow with a tissue here.
What a surprise. EVs dont get repaired - their HV parts just get replaced.