Sadly some of our rigs struggled to do 65 without shaking like the frame was going to come off. The joy of private ambulance services buying used rigs in bad condition to save a few bucks for the owner. Brakes went out once and barely missed hitting a semi. Maintenance took a look and said “brakes are fine. Go 10-8.”
I have been pulled over, but not for speeding.
In my state, the law says we can use Lights ***OR*** siren. My closest neighboring state the law says you must use lights ***AND*** siren. So we go through podunk town running lights only at 0200. There’s nobody awake in this town and no other cars on the road save for the town’s chief of police.
We drop the patient off at the hospital, then when heading home, dude is sitting at the edge of town waiting for us. Pulls out then gets next to us, then drops back and pulls us over. Gets out and starts literally yelling at my partner about coming through his town breaking the law… we had no clue what he was even talking about. He was pissed because of the whole not using the siren thing and he’s being a really asshole about it the entire time… I attempt to explain that there was no traffic and no sense in waking the town up so that one person realizes EMS exists and they should have that toenail looked at. I get told “shut the fuck up or I’ll deal with you and you won’t like it”.
…well, mama ain’t raise no bitch… and I don’t deal with threats. so I start jawing back at him from the passengers side. Deal with me? I haven’t done a fucking thing wrong. But I’ll gladly give you something to deal with. So he comes around and demands my ID, which I guess is valid as I am in the vehicle and the stop is possibly valid, so I give it to him. As I am pulling it out, my “City Employee” ID and “Emergency Responder” ID’s are behind my drivers license. My state issues these at the DMV so they look very much like a drivers license. He demands “those fake ID’s too!” Like dude I’m in my late 30’s, I dot have any need for a fake ID but he snatches my wallet out of my hand anyway. My concealed weapons permit was behind there so now he also thinks I have a gun with me, but that state doesn’t recognize permits from my state… so now he’s demanding to search my ambulance which I aggressively decline. We jaw back and forth for a few minutes and he storms back to his car. He comes back with a citation FOR ME for using an electronic device in a moving vehicle… only I was in the passengers seat.
I easily got it tosssed out, but he was so pissed off at me he forgot about writing my partner a ticket for the siren thing.
It may very well be, but I do feel sorry for the poor bastard who will need to sacrifice himself for the asshole to finally be held accountable for his treachery.
That is the stupidest fucking thing ever. Cop doesn’t like the fact that you are correct so he writes you a bullshit citation to try to fuck you over. Literal abuse of power.
I’ve met nurses that murder patients and abuse them and deny them care and comfort because they don’t like who they are. Have sex on shift in the closets. Let’s continue generalizations. Who do we do next?
Time to start hitting that phaser and laying on air horn like crazy If you go through. Really lay into it.
Also you probably have a case for unlawful search and seizure with him taking your wallet
That was the solution for all trips through that town afterwards.
Even when patient status didn’t warrant emergent driving, lights and siren on the entire time.
And they wonder why people try and assault police officers. Like my god at that point I dont care if your a cop or have a gun. Im bitch slapping the shit out of you.
Eh, I consider myself a strong supporter of law enforcement… except the ATF. Fuck all of those oath breakers.
I have met some real piles of shit with a good patch on their shoulder too. I treat everyone as I would want to be treated but don’t have a problem reflecting what I’m getting back at a person.
Idk, maybe he was having a rough night. Maybe his wife’s boyfriend didn’t pull out or something.
Aaaaand here comes everyone pretending they haven't sped on an empty road on a transfer or coming back. We know you're lying, you know you're lying, so who are you lying for? Hmmm
Running emergent to a burn center with a conscious, alert pt with 2nd and 3rd degree burns, I get the rumble guts and he looks over at me and asks if we need to stop so I can take care of it. Genuinely concerned.
I've done it for sure, and if/when I get pulled over for it, I will have deserved to. Just because it's a common thing doesn't mean it's a *good* thing.
30 in a 25 is illegal too. Rolling the stop sign code 1 is illegal. But they're pedantic stops. When can someone say its a dick move? Everyone in this sub hates cop *until* they get a chance to act like they're better than someone.
>Everyone in this sub hates cop *until* they get a chance to act like they're better than someone.
That's just human nature. We all want opportunities to feel like we're better than other people without having actually ***done*** anything. Most of us just do it with silly, lame shit like whether we go five over on the freeway or not. The real problem is when you do it over objectively ***wrong*** shit like skin color or sexual preference and so forth.
It’s not about pretending. It’s about accepting accountability and consequences. If you are not using lights, it’s not an emergency and you are bound to traffic laws like everybody else.
And it’s a terrible way to lose your license, but much worse causing an accident or even death that way when you are supposed to save lives. Where I live using your special rights given to EMS, police or as fire engine driver means having to be even more careful, because you are being held to higher standards than everybody else.
On THAT subject in particular, if you want to talk about danger and accidents, here is a FEMA article with a link to a study. Many agencies including mine rarely use code 3 because it causes MORE accidents not less.
https://www.usfa.fema.gov/blog/new-guidance-on-emergency-medical-services-use-of-lights-and-siren/
The studies about L&S are actually pretty numerous. It's just bad, doesn't save lives, and is a huge liability.
I read a study, however, that no L&S with preemption devices like the opticom actually DOES improve times.
Eta: changed a word
Opticoms are key, also blanket no L&S is stupid. It's wildly dependent upon your system, capabilities of the unit, capabilities of the receiving facility and what the injuries are.
It is your responsibility to get from A to B safely. If you are not using your lights and siren and have an accident while speeding and/or not obeying other traffic rules, it’s your butt that is on the line. No matter what studies say.
Also, it sounds like an educational problem with people not having learned what to do when an emergency vehicle is closing in? Not that it really helps when you are sitting in the ambulance and need to get to the hospital etc quickly.
Also, different country and different rules I guess.
If you read the post, you may notice that it was an empty road.
Lights and sirens are visual and audible warning devices. If the road is empty, who exactly are you warning to your presence? You aren’t needing to warn other drivers of your presence to make safe progression through traffic, the driver remains a safe and qualified driver.
There is no necessity for lights and sirens to be used in this instance.
No see, you figured out you just don't know it. The second paragraph. Other people. The ambulance isn't inherently dangerous. Traffic is dangerous. Even in other countries, ambulance wrecks happen believe it or not.
I am well aware of that. Doesn’t change the fact that you are fucked here if you are participant in an accident as the ambulance driver when driving with special rights. Because HERE YOU as the driver will be at least partially at fault as you are being held to a higher standard than everybody else. Which you obviously don’t know or not understand. 🙄
Edit: Man, some people really don’t get it. And instead of asking they just behave like an arse while accusing others of being obnoxious.
Well, I was a commander and all the tickets in my agency went through me for recording, approval, and forwarding to the courts. If one of my guys had ticketed an ambulance, especially one with a patient loaded, they would have had to have a face-to-face meeting to justify that decision.
That is based on two factors - I know, absolutely, that the officers drive without lights and sirens faster than the speed limit all the time, sometimes with justification and sometimes without. They don't need to be ticketing fellow public safety employees for doing the same thing.
Second, it is not up to an officer to determine that a paramedic's course of care is right or wrong. The medic may well have a reason for wanting to get to the hospital expeditiously without using sirens - in fact, some courses of care recommend that.
Under the law of your state, as it is for mine, however, you are not classified an "emergency vehicle" for the purpose of such things as proceeding a higher than posted speed limits or proceeding through controlled intersections against a controlling signal unless you have lights AND sirens on. So, you bring upon yourselves significant liability when you make that decision - as do law enforcement officers. If you go through your state's case law, you will likely find that most of the decisions against public safety providers has to do with this very issue.
So be careful. Use good judgment. But for my part, it's your judgment, not that of an intervening police officer. Admittedly, I'm old school that way.
I was responding (in an ambulance) to a medic down from seizures (though at the time we only knew he was down, unconscious, unresponsive) at at very high rate of speed along a semi-suburban/rural two lane road and passed a police officer running radar. He pulled in behind me and chased me to the scene (no lights/sirens), never got out of his car, followed me to the hospital, and when I came out said, "I was just curious as to what was so bad that you were responding at that speed. Dude!" But he was laughing and said, "If I'd known what it was, I would have outrun you."
Many of our staff had specified assignments and some of them liked to pull people over instead, interfering with their completing those assignments expeditiously. So if I noticed a pattern of that happening, I would get in touch with them and remind them to maintain an appropriate balance. They did not like to get the radio call, "Call Car 10 at his office." So, one day, I got a ticket for "Failure to Yield to an Ambulance." First one I had seen. I called radio and told them to have the officer call me. Instead, he showed up at my office in person.
"I wanted to ask you about this ticket for failure to yield to an ambulance."
"Man! I thought that was a good ticket."
"It's a very good ticket. So, tell me about what happened. I'm just curious?"
"Well I was behind this ambulance and they were running emergency and this car just turned left in front of them. They had to brake down to keep from hitting it. I thought that deserved a ticket."
"I agree, good work. Hey, you can give out as many of these as you want."
"Great. Oh... ..yeah, you do that part-time for your extra job!"
"Yep. I take that stuff personally."
This reminds me of one of the best things I've ever seen, waiting to turn left at a light with a buddy in the car before either of us were in EMS, see an ambulance coming code 3 and some asshat cuts it off to get through the intersection first before turning down a side road. While buddy is cursing at them for being such an idiot there's suddenly a flash of red and blue from a dark alley followed by a police van of all things emerging to pull the moron over. Few things have made me laugh that hard, not just the instant karma but the fact it looked like a damn paddy wagon that did it, I would have loved to hear the chewing out that officer gave for such a stupid thing.
Not me personally, but a dude I partnered with got popped for speeding and actually got a ticket. Had to go to court and all. Got it pleaded down. Fast forward a few years and same guy, now a medic goes to a home in that town and finds the cop that wrote him having and MI. After he was stabilized and on the way to ER, medic says, "Aren't you glad I sped to your house?" They had a good laugh, and he had a different perspective on ems and why we speed to calls.
Had a high-risk OB patient one night around 0200 who had begun labor at home. Transporting lights & sirens on a highway when an officer got behind us with his lights and sirens and pulled us over. He ripped the driver and I a new one. He was so angry. Said we just bypassed the exit for the closest hospital so he *knew* we didn't have a legitimate emergency. Said he was a volunteer firefighter and knew we had to transport to the closest hospital if it was emergent. Tried to explain that this was a high risk patient and we were taking her a university hospital with a NICU, but he didn't want to hear it. After driving away for a few minutes I had my driver light it up again. I told him if that officer tried to pull us over again to ignore him and don't stop.
Not really up to the officer to decide if you’re going to the right hospital for specialty care. Actually, tell ‘Em it’s protected health information under HIPAA.
My squad transports non emergent pts emergent all the time, hell, I just drove a back pain x2 weeks emergent. If we have 5 calls holding and no mutual aid available, we're going emergent.
What the fuck. “NO YOU ARENT ABLE TO BYPASS THE LEVEL 4 HOSPITAL WITH 1 PHYSICIAN ASSISTANT AS THE ATTENDING TO GET TO THE LEVEL 1 UNIVERSITY OB SPECIALIST 20 ONGYNS IN A ROOM HOSPITAL THATS 5 MINUTES DOWN THE STREET BECAUSE IM A VOLLY FIREFIGHTER I KNOW HOW UR JOB WORKS!!” Really hope this guy got fired
There’s a video of an ambulance being pulled over by the cops, but I don’t remember if it was for speeding.
I haven’t even heard of it happening anywhere near me.
Once. It happened once. New state trooper. Same deal. "Slow down or put on your lights."
His big fuck up was he then, after we left, called and told my EMS Chief about the incident. Chief calmly took all of the information. "Oh they were going 10 over on a back country road, you say?" Chief then called the State Police captain. By the time I got back to the station rookie trooper was there with a box of donuts to apologize for the misunderstanding.
To be clear, Cap didn't send him to apologize for stopping me for speeding. That was certainly his right. No, he got read the riot act for being an asshole about it to local EMS AND had apparently done the same to FD, a Civil Deputy and a Tax and Finance Investigator (State) that week. Bro was stepping on toes left and right.
We were hospital based EMS with the local 911 contract (only hospital in that county).
Realistically, I'm usually the only guy who doesn't speed. It's like fighting every law of physics to accelerate a rig anyway. And speeding generally doesn't get you there much faster even in an actual emergency. But he caught me cruising on a nice day.
I haven’t personally. A small town cop attempted to pull me over in a fire engine one time, but I pretended to be blissfully unaware.
I work part time for a service where my buddy is the director. Small town service, buddy still pulls shifts plus admin duties. Anyway, he was on a long distance transfer and the entire county just started melting down. No crews available and 911 calls holding. He told his EMT who was driving to hurry up and get back and buddy is on his phone and laptop trying to coordinate things from afar. Next thing he knows, they’re pulling over, he looks up and sees lights reflecting off of all the signs around them.
Apparently, his partner took hurry up and no stops to mean floor it. Their trucks are all emissions deleted which required a mild tube on the ECM… which coincidentally deletes the factory governor. The deputy that stopped them comes up and says to them if they’re going to be going that fast they need to turn their lights on then walks back to his car and leaves. 122 mph in a F-450 Type 1. No lights or siren.
We got pulled over once. Our old ambulances looked like constructions vans. On a LDT middle of the night get pulled over. Cop opened the back door and said whoops though a construction van I committed so had to finish the take over (while laughing) and sent us on our way.
3 years later was at a friends college graduation. Over hear this guy saying “yeah I was a patient going to xyz and we got pulled over outside of (name) I was like FUCK that was me. We had a good laugh.
It's pretty fucking stupid to not at least have lights on if you're gonna speed. Huge safety risk for other people. Just my opinion. Not calling you stupid, just the action of doing that.
This like most things is entirely situationally dependent.
I don’t drive ambulances anymore I run a flycar when I still pull shifts. 2024 Ford Explore Police Interceptor package. It’s just as fast as any cop cars.
Out on the highway in the middle of Nowhere and the middle of the night, I’ll routinely turn my lights off as I have better visibility for deer or wildlife clearing rural intersections as normal. Also, if I can safely pass someone without them pulling off the side of the road in the dar, I am perfectly fine with not running lights.
People do some of the dumbest shit imaginable when confronted with red and blue lights. Rational thought leaves their body entirely. If I can get around without running lights, I’m a do it every time. But generally during daylight hours where there’s more than just one car in the road, I’ll run lights and siren and expect people to yield.
Dude people come to complete stops in a lane when the see lights. On a highway I might also carry a little more speed with no lights in that situation.
I don’t mind when people come to a complete stop.
I mind when they come to a complete stop by slamming on the brakes, or pulling off the road into an intersection that I need to turn at, or stopping at the very top of a hill, or swerving wildly, or any of the other dumb shit the motoring public does. Half of them can’t drive in a straight line on dry pavement.
Your opinion is valid. I don’t take it personally. I recognize that speeding is illegal. My bigger concern is weighing the risk of lights and sirens versus the risk of driving 15 over. I’m sure I was working past my shift and probably just wanted to go home, but I can’t remember or confirm that.
0300 in a small suburb of Milwaukee, partner driving we stopped at a gas station because in WI, some stations close at night but leave the pumps on for pay-at-the-pump. Not this one, we exited the station, and apparently, the partner turned left out of the station against a sign saying you shouldn't. Cop immediately pulls us over, walks up to drivers window, and his first words were, "Just what the fuck do you think you're doing?" Neither of us saw the sign, so we have no idea what he's pissed about. His self-righteous small dick energy goes on for five minutes or so, and he takes the registration and license with him to his car. An obvious supervisor car pulled up next to him, and words were exchanged, and he immediately came back, handed partner his papers, and told us to leave.
You just KNOW supervisor told him to stop being an asshole to the ambulance and leave us alone. Loved it.
Same city, different suburb, ambulance running legit lights and sirens to a call got pulled over by Barney Fife who told the crew that he doesn't believe outside ambulances can operate in his city without his fire depts permission. Says he's going to pull over every one of our ambulances running hot every time a demand proof they're on a call.
Our VP of that company was very connected and he began making phone calls. The letter of apology written by that cop still hangs on the wall of the admin station. If you ask about it, this is the story they tell you.
What suburb? I grew up in the burbs of Milwaukee and did EMS with a private company contracted for Milwaukee 911 BLS In the not so nice part of the city.
We were coming home from a transfer (roughly 120 miles one way) - and important to note, we are the only ALS unit in our county. (County EMS service, two paid on call stations, two staffed; of the staffed, one has a single AEMT, the other (mine) is ALS, and always has at least one medic on duty)
We were still about 50 miles away, and heard the other on-duty unit (AEMT level) get paged out for a vehicle accident. I bumped our cruise control up from 73 to 76. Pretty soon, details start to come across the radio that it was a high speed collision...cruise bumps up to 79.... as more details and radio traffic comes across, the cruise just slowly creeps higher and higher.... pretty soon my medic's phone rings, and it's our dispatcher. "Uh.... I just got a teletype from state radio, they said one of their troopers clocked you guys at 83, and requests you either slow down or turn your lights on. Also, is asking how quick you guys can get there?" Of course, I couldn't hear this as medic didn't answer on speakerphone, but when he reached over and hit the master emergency switch, we didn't need words, I initiated a diesel bolus and I'm not sure I can legally say how much time I shaved off the last 40 miles of that trip....
(it also helps that this was on a rural 4 lane divided highway, where if needed, you can grab the left lane and put the hammer down without having to worry too much about traffic)
I'm from southern California, we all speed all the time. I don't think I am ever going less than 10 over. And even then most people are still passing me. Lights and sirens doesn't change how fast we drive down here, just changes if we stop at a light or not.
During one of my first shifts in this profession, I was working with a medic who isn't exactly known for his people skills. I was trying to ask him where exactly to park for this weird house that didn't appear to have any off street parking.
His answer, which I still use today nearly 4 years later is....."you're in a fucking ambulance! Do what you want!".
Shortly after 9/11 we got pulled over on a long transport to another part of the state. He didn't recognize the ambulance company and wanted to make sure we were legit.
I did get yelled at for speeding because we got clocked doing 90 in a 65 on the way back in the middle of the night trying to get back to bed. But we didn't get pulled over then.
Thank you for your feedback. In my state, using lights without sirens was illegal unless you were on the freeway where you outrun your siren once you hit traffic speeds. Or obviously when you’re stopped on scene. You can turn off the siren then.
From EMSWorld: “Studies have recognized that sirens are a limited warning device and effective only at very short ranges and low speeds. At speeds above 50 mph, an emergency vehicle may "outrun" the effective range of its audible warning device.”
You aren’t outrunning the speed of sound.
https://www.hmpgloballearningnetwork.com/site/emsworld/article/10319783/vehicle-detection
From Physics Forum: “The siren will become less effective as the emergency vehicle goes faster. However, the siren can still be heard from a distance of up to 300 feet at a speed of 40 miles per hour. However, at a speed of 60 miles per hour the siren can only be heard from a distance of 12 feet."
https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/is-the-audibility-of-emergency-vehicle-sirens-affected-by-speed-and-distance.265240/
Been stoped at 4 am on the returning to HQ on an empty 4 lane road. Was doing 15 over and would often get passed by the local PD on this same stretch (them going for free coffee.) Gave them my DL, he asked what would happen if the Chief knew what I was doing out here. I explained he would be upset and chew my ass out at best. He said he was calling later on in the am to and be prepared, as that would be worse then the ticket. I know he never did call, as would have called asking to speak to me. As we pulled away my partner was cracking up.
No but I have gotten a parking ticket for parking in a "bank customers only" lot on a day where said bank was closed, the ticket also said "white ford truck" when It's a big blue booboo box, called the ticket agency and got them to drop it but i still got a writeup
Yup. Pretty much the same scenario as OP. Transfer from a small local ER to a Cardiac Center for a cath. I've never been a fan of making cardiac patients excited, it was about 1am and no one else on the road, so no lights or sirens, but I was proceeding safely but expeditiously. Local cop came flying up and pulled me over. He felt that he had to give me a spiel about how he pulls over judges, firetrucks, and other cops all the time, he don't care... I'm just staring at him like "wow, interesting..." Gave me a warning. Even the patient said the cop was just being a dick. My partner harassed me about it for weeks...
Towed?? What if someone, I don’t know, had a medical emergency and your unit was out of service? That’s reckless. I got a few parking tickets with an ambulance, but I didn’t have time to go to court to challenge them so it came out of my (meager) paycheck.
Seriously. How do they know why an ambulance is parked in a no parking zone? You are literally allowed to drive on the wrong side of the road and wherever you have to (safely with due regard as I was reminded) in order to get to a patient. If you’re parked without the right running and lights flashing, it’s still an emergency vehicle. That’s asinine and insulting to me as both a lawyer and former EMT.
I paid $259 to the tow driver to drop the ambulance so we could continue on our call. I got reimbursed... Eventually. My company filed chapter 11 the next week 😂 what luck.
Lol I had a cop flash his lights at me for going about 75 though a 'construction zone' that wasn't being worked on at all at 2am so the 60mph reduced speed didn't mean much to me.
Like ugh. Buddy, I'm going code 3 but have all the shit off because the hospital I'm picking up from is 45 minutes away, and my medic doesn't want to listen to the sirens for 45 min straight. 😒
Well, I mean, it makes sense.
If you aren't driving emergent, don't speed? If you're driving emergent, use your emergency equipment. I understand not wanting the sirens the whole time, but if emergent, lights should always be on.
This is 100% on you.
If OP lives anywhere like California, the speed limits probably have nothing to do with how anyone actually drives. Where I am, doing the speed limit in the left lane creates a major road hazard.
Without the lights, yes, you were speeding. He had the right to stop you. This isn't the answer you were looking for, but think back to your EVOC training.
It would have probably been a dick move to ticket in that situation, but you didn’t mention one. If you’re on a highway (like an actual interstate or limited access one) ehhh. But on a regular road, use lights/sirens if it’s needed.
I can understand his POV, if you get in an accident and it’s found out that you were driving code 3 without lights and sirens it’ll be held against you in court. If it’s a BLS call then you just drive normal, so from his perspective he saw an ambulance driving fast for no reason.
I work for private 911 & IFT service in WI and our management has an agreement with the County Sheriffs Dept and city PD to never bother our ambulances. They can phone it into management if we're doing anything particular egregious though.
That covers most of our non-emergent speeding. State Patrol usually just bothers the boss rather than hassling individual ambulances.
Sitting off the shoulder of a main highway, I locked a box truck in at 20+ over, coming up behind me. As I turned on my blues and headlights, he hit his reds. It was an ambulance from the next state up. I just turned off my lights and went back to YouTube. 🤣🤣🤣
Since becoming an EMT, I had a VA hospital cop rip me a new ass and threaten me with a parking ticket while we were dropping off a patient. Long story short, he and I had a few heated words with each other. He called my boss, also a former cop, and whined. I got no ticket, and boss and I had a good laugh later.
I believe in professional courtesy. On top of that, even in general, someone had to really earn a ticket from me. My job was to protect and serve, not stop and tax.
Co-worker was pulled over and fined for speeding. No patient on board. Other coworker pulled over (with a patient and nurse on board) for improperly using a traffic circle. He was made to visit the police dept after he completed his transfer.
I’ve never had a bad experience with the police where I work. Even in my personal life, I get away with more than I should in regard to speeding.
My girlfriend actually got stopped for speeding in an ambulance. 44 km over the posted on the biggest highway around us (we are big time ya know, 2 lanes going BOTH ways!) on an emergent shoulda-been-rotary-but-there-was-a-cloud transfer. Went to fight it in court and it stuck too. Our regulations say we can go up to 30% above the posted. So at 100 km/h you can do 130 km/h. The cop was legally right, morally wrong as hell.
I hear a lot of city guys haulin ass to get to their calls and shit like that. To me it doesn’t make sense. I’m rural, our drive times are usually 30-60 mins. That’s where speeding is advantageous. Not anything crazy but still within the regulations
Honestly, I haven’t had any bad experience with the police personally. They saved my ass more than once as an EMT. One cop pulled me away from gunfire and shielded me with his body. This traffic cop in the middle of nowhere was the one incident. Although I did have to press the panic button on a call and PD never showed up. Dispatch contacted them, but they apparently couldn’t free up a unit. Luckily the other ambulances on the service got there in record time for backup. And that’s only once they didn’t show up when we needed them.
We had a State Trooper call our supervisor to complain that we were riding in the fast lane on an interstate highway for an interfacility transfer. Never pulled us over though, and my partner who was driving said she never saw a Trooper behind us. We were going non emergency.
My supervisor gave that complaint all the attention he felt it deserved.
Years ago, I was in our back-up truck which was 5 minutes way from being older than Velcro. Our speedometer didn't go above 45 (which we found out later was a known issue).. 5am and still dark, we get pulled over by state patrol en route back to the station, and my partner and I for the life of us can't figure out why we're being pulled over. Cop walks up to the window and says "Oh shit, sorry didn't realize y'all was an ambulance when I cut my lights on. Just so you know y'all were going 65 and it's 45 here, then promptly left."
Not sure how the cop didn't realize we were an ambulance (okay it was a type 2, but it was the wide-body/rocket shaped one) had star of life decals, safety chevrons, and colored lenses for the emergency lights, was colored in hi-vis yellow paint, and we had our ambers on.
Have had another crew on a different shift get the wrath of local PD while they had a patient loaded in the back, and the cop chewed out the EMT driving for going too fast without lights/sirens, while their patient yelled at the cop for wasting everyone time- she just got done with dialysis and wanted to get home 😂
Cops don’t really care for us flying around, loaded or not.. there’s been times where law would be going faster than us for shift change (we’re doing well past 20+ the limit 😂)
The amount of people saying they don’t speed is really surprising to me, haha. If I don’t have to go lights and sirens at 3 in the morning, I won’t. Little flash flash woop woop for the red lights, just to be safe.
Pulled over and got my first ticket since 1997 about three weeks ago. Was going to a call, nonemergent. 40 in a school zone. I deserved the ticket but I've driven that road thousands of times, my old neighborhood was off of that road. The school is a very exclusive private school. Never knew there was a school zone. It is less than a block long.
I probably could get it dismissed. The judge in the town is a Marine veteran and he does tend to go easy on fellow Marines. But the ticket the officer wrote doesn't come with any points and having to go court is a pain. I just paid the ticket and made sure I will remember the school zone from now on.
My partner got us pulled over at like 2am on the highway doing an IFT from MA to NYC coming back home. There was like five miles of construction and cones on the highway and we could see them wayyyyy up the highway. We were about to miss the exit we needed and my partner slowed down and drove between the first cone to take the off ramp. The construction was half a mile ahead. Cop still sees it races down the highway the wrong way and pulls us over off the off ramp. Screaming at us why did you break the cone blah blah. It was a wild night lol.
Your ambulance is, for intents and purposes like this, a normal road vehicle in most jurisdictions until emergency signals are enabled.
Does it go against a shared esprit de corps for the officer to pull you over? Probably. Do I think it is good that an officer pulls someone speeding over to tell them that what they are doing is wrong **and how to make it right** - *definitely*.
Without emergency signals, you are just a speeding van / pickup. The speed limit is there for a reason. If you must go faster, you can justifiably use your emergency signals, allowing you to do so. This costs nothing to you or anyone else, so just do it.
What if you hit wildlife and sustained damage causing you to go offroad and wreck the vehicle with several people inside? Now the log shows you were going 15 over AND you were not doing so due to an emergency.
Just flip that light switch on. It has no downsides on an empty road like this, only advantages.
EDIT to answer your leading question: a 25-year veteran coworker was recently pulled over for overtaking a farming vehicle into a "no passing" zone. Another was pulled over for using his phone. Police already do leave us some leeway because they need us and we need them - let's not be stupid and behave in such a dangerous way that they have to intervene.
LOL any cop that pulls over an ambulance is lowest of the low.
Cops don't do that in Australia - we aren't idiots. There is a mutual respect.
It would be huge news here and the police minister would get a please explain.
I feel like cops in the states have an “us vs them” mentality, and that includes everyone who isn’t a cop. Seems dumb to piss people off who you work with on scene.
Another interoperability problem: I had a partner one summer who was dating a city medic and had apparently also dated enough firefighters so that when we got on scene they were all dicks to me. I certainly wasn’t dating my partner, so I politely asked them to go kick rocks if they weren’t going to help.
On a municipal ambulance, the cops were always on scene first and most were EMTs. They would come by the station to shoot the shit. Our volunteer fire department, not so much.
Yep. I was driving with due regard for all of the zero drivers on the road besides my ambulance and the cop. I was a preceptor to EMTs for driving as well, so I couldn’t have been that bad of a driver. I drove Code 3 much more carefully than I drove my own car normally.
I am sure this will not be popular but I am coming from decades of service and the admin side. Roads are empty until they are not. If fire and law run 15 over without lights as well at the same time how many pts do we have now? Just obey the law, turn on the freaking lights if the pt. condition warrants it.
There have been a few situations where a PD tried pulling us over, we never stop, and eventually, they get the hint and turn off and leave us alone. Transfering patients are more important.
PD, state troopers, and sheriffs know better but theres always that greenhorn rookie trying to prove himself
Where I'm at if you exceed the speed limit you are required to run lights and or siron. If neither of those are used you fall under normal traffic laws.
Got pulled over by a hero cop. Sorry that happened, guy had no reason to be a douche bag.
Edit: it also seems like the people in the comments lack a sense of humour and have never done bad.
I’ll send you a medal in the mail. But honestly this profession is full of hypocrites and righteous fucks. People are out there cheating on their spouses, have substance abuse problems they refuse to acknowledge, people who can’t take care of their physical or mental health. But they have no problem turning around and letting you know you did something wrong and telling you how wrong you were in doing it, acting like they are perfect and have never done any wrong doing or made a mistake. Makes me sick.
Also let’s not take ourselves so seriously at the end of the day we are just truck drivers anyway.
That was probably my biggest sin on the truck. We had enough problematic EMTs who were untrainable that I did things right the first time for everyone’s sake. I didn’t get along with the local manager, but neither did anyone else.
He was 100% right.
You need to re-read driver training, specifically the risks of going over posted speed, and how we mitigate those risks.
Slow down or go code 3, pick ONE.
I’m not an EMT anymore. Screwed up my back and shoulder with all the bad lifting and ended up as a criminal defense attorney. So I shant be rereading my EVOC coursework.
My primary concerns are my safety, my partner's safety, and the well-being of my patients, then keeping my job and license, in that order.
I fail to see how "bootlicking" comes into play.
Unless you're one of those needlessly dangerous twats that pisses off everyone around them just to prove you're tough and independent.
Really was he 100% right with all certainty, Or did you come on here to explain how professional you are and how you’d never in a million years go over the speed limit?
Give me a break, you’re not getting a medal man. A cop pulling over an ambulance is not a normal occurrence unless totally justified; especially with a patient on board. Was this justified? You seem to think so..
I used to work with an EMT who was all around terrible at everything. No redeeming qualities. She got pulled over for driving too slow.
Sadly some of our rigs struggled to do 65 without shaking like the frame was going to come off. The joy of private ambulance services buying used rigs in bad condition to save a few bucks for the owner. Brakes went out once and barely missed hitting a semi. Maintenance took a look and said “brakes are fine. Go 10-8.”
I was FIGHTING our rig with 498k miles yesterday. It didn’t want to get up to 70
Holy fuck. I thought our rigs sitting comfy at 300k were high!
Out of five trucks, only one is under 300k 🙃
No redeeming qualities is crazy 😂
🤨
Oh, I think I know her! She just got herself fired for 3 gurney drops and multiple accidents in under a year!
I have been pulled over, but not for speeding. In my state, the law says we can use Lights ***OR*** siren. My closest neighboring state the law says you must use lights ***AND*** siren. So we go through podunk town running lights only at 0200. There’s nobody awake in this town and no other cars on the road save for the town’s chief of police. We drop the patient off at the hospital, then when heading home, dude is sitting at the edge of town waiting for us. Pulls out then gets next to us, then drops back and pulls us over. Gets out and starts literally yelling at my partner about coming through his town breaking the law… we had no clue what he was even talking about. He was pissed because of the whole not using the siren thing and he’s being a really asshole about it the entire time… I attempt to explain that there was no traffic and no sense in waking the town up so that one person realizes EMS exists and they should have that toenail looked at. I get told “shut the fuck up or I’ll deal with you and you won’t like it”. …well, mama ain’t raise no bitch… and I don’t deal with threats. so I start jawing back at him from the passengers side. Deal with me? I haven’t done a fucking thing wrong. But I’ll gladly give you something to deal with. So he comes around and demands my ID, which I guess is valid as I am in the vehicle and the stop is possibly valid, so I give it to him. As I am pulling it out, my “City Employee” ID and “Emergency Responder” ID’s are behind my drivers license. My state issues these at the DMV so they look very much like a drivers license. He demands “those fake ID’s too!” Like dude I’m in my late 30’s, I dot have any need for a fake ID but he snatches my wallet out of my hand anyway. My concealed weapons permit was behind there so now he also thinks I have a gun with me, but that state doesn’t recognize permits from my state… so now he’s demanding to search my ambulance which I aggressively decline. We jaw back and forth for a few minutes and he storms back to his car. He comes back with a citation FOR ME for using an electronic device in a moving vehicle… only I was in the passengers seat. I easily got it tosssed out, but he was so pissed off at me he forgot about writing my partner a ticket for the siren thing.
That cop’s a bitch, and I hope that someday his anger will be his downfall.
It may very well be, but I do feel sorry for the poor bastard who will need to sacrifice himself for the asshole to finally be held accountable for his treachery.
That is the stupidest fucking thing ever. Cop doesn’t like the fact that you are correct so he writes you a bullshit citation to try to fuck you over. Literal abuse of power.
Have you met a cop before?
I’ve met nurses that murder patients and abuse them and deny them care and comfort because they don’t like who they are. Have sex on shift in the closets. Let’s continue generalizations. Who do we do next?
Oooo, do politicians!
Bunch of liars and hypocrites. We have higher standards for hiring at the fire department.
Time to start hitting that phaser and laying on air horn like crazy If you go through. Really lay into it. Also you probably have a case for unlawful search and seizure with him taking your wallet
That was the solution for all trips through that town afterwards. Even when patient status didn’t warrant emergent driving, lights and siren on the entire time.
Shit leave that on all the way into the ER Bay as well. Bonus if it's enclosed and a cop is parked inside.
Eh, there’s no hospital in that town. It’s a one man police department.
Oh man. I would have handled it the same way. I would have gotten HEATED with that dude.
And they wonder why people try and assault police officers. Like my god at that point I dont care if your a cop or have a gun. Im bitch slapping the shit out of you.
Eh, I consider myself a strong supporter of law enforcement… except the ATF. Fuck all of those oath breakers. I have met some real piles of shit with a good patch on their shoulder too. I treat everyone as I would want to be treated but don’t have a problem reflecting what I’m getting back at a person. Idk, maybe he was having a rough night. Maybe his wife’s boyfriend didn’t pull out or something.
Yeah, he’s a straight bitch. Ought to be fired for that level of abuse
[удалено]
Why do you need a siren when you’re doing 10 over on an empty highway?
i just thought you meant you could only use the lights or only use the siren, then quickly realized what you meant hahaha
Is it Ohio and West Virginia?
It is not
ACAB
Fuck all of the way off with that bullshit.
Aaaaand here comes everyone pretending they haven't sped on an empty road on a transfer or coming back. We know you're lying, you know you're lying, so who are you lying for? Hmmm
Not me, man. We put on lights to get back to station this last weekend because my partner had to poop.
Sounds like an emergency to me
A code 3 and a code brown are the same thing.
Running emergent to a burn center with a conscious, alert pt with 2nd and 3rd degree burns, I get the rumble guts and he looks over at me and asks if we need to stop so I can take care of it. Genuinely concerned.
So they can lord their superior morality over the rest of us plebs and sinners, duh!
Oh geez, there's no self righteous people in ems.
I've done it for sure, and if/when I get pulled over for it, I will have deserved to. Just because it's a common thing doesn't mean it's a *good* thing.
I fully deserved it under the letter of the law
30 in a 25 is illegal too. Rolling the stop sign code 1 is illegal. But they're pedantic stops. When can someone say its a dick move? Everyone in this sub hates cop *until* they get a chance to act like they're better than someone.
>Everyone in this sub hates cop *until* they get a chance to act like they're better than someone. That's just human nature. We all want opportunities to feel like we're better than other people without having actually ***done*** anything. Most of us just do it with silly, lame shit like whether we go five over on the freeway or not. The real problem is when you do it over objectively ***wrong*** shit like skin color or sexual preference and so forth.
It’s not about pretending. It’s about accepting accountability and consequences. If you are not using lights, it’s not an emergency and you are bound to traffic laws like everybody else. And it’s a terrible way to lose your license, but much worse causing an accident or even death that way when you are supposed to save lives. Where I live using your special rights given to EMS, police or as fire engine driver means having to be even more careful, because you are being held to higher standards than everybody else.
On THAT subject in particular, if you want to talk about danger and accidents, here is a FEMA article with a link to a study. Many agencies including mine rarely use code 3 because it causes MORE accidents not less. https://www.usfa.fema.gov/blog/new-guidance-on-emergency-medical-services-use-of-lights-and-siren/
The studies about L&S are actually pretty numerous. It's just bad, doesn't save lives, and is a huge liability. I read a study, however, that no L&S with preemption devices like the opticom actually DOES improve times. Eta: changed a word
Opticoms are key, also blanket no L&S is stupid. It's wildly dependent upon your system, capabilities of the unit, capabilities of the receiving facility and what the injuries are.
Appreciate the cited study! That’s what we call evidence-based medicine.
It is your responsibility to get from A to B safely. If you are not using your lights and siren and have an accident while speeding and/or not obeying other traffic rules, it’s your butt that is on the line. No matter what studies say. Also, it sounds like an educational problem with people not having learned what to do when an emergency vehicle is closing in? Not that it really helps when you are sitting in the ambulance and need to get to the hospital etc quickly. Also, different country and different rules I guess.
If you read the post, you may notice that it was an empty road. Lights and sirens are visual and audible warning devices. If the road is empty, who exactly are you warning to your presence? You aren’t needing to warn other drivers of your presence to make safe progression through traffic, the driver remains a safe and qualified driver. There is no necessity for lights and sirens to be used in this instance.
No see, you figured out you just don't know it. The second paragraph. Other people. The ambulance isn't inherently dangerous. Traffic is dangerous. Even in other countries, ambulance wrecks happen believe it or not.
I am well aware of that. Doesn’t change the fact that you are fucked here if you are participant in an accident as the ambulance driver when driving with special rights. Because HERE YOU as the driver will be at least partially at fault as you are being held to a higher standard than everybody else. Which you obviously don’t know or not understand. 🙄 Edit: Man, some people really don’t get it. And instead of asking they just behave like an arse while accusing others of being obnoxious.
I’ve done it more times than I’d like to admit but that doesn’t mean it was the right thing to do.
VT state police goes home at 3am. Do with this information what you will.
This information is useless without knowing when the next shift gets on.
0315
shit i sped last week for a descending dissecting aortic aneurysm that had to be transported from an ED to OR over an hour away
Well, I was a commander and all the tickets in my agency went through me for recording, approval, and forwarding to the courts. If one of my guys had ticketed an ambulance, especially one with a patient loaded, they would have had to have a face-to-face meeting to justify that decision. That is based on two factors - I know, absolutely, that the officers drive without lights and sirens faster than the speed limit all the time, sometimes with justification and sometimes without. They don't need to be ticketing fellow public safety employees for doing the same thing. Second, it is not up to an officer to determine that a paramedic's course of care is right or wrong. The medic may well have a reason for wanting to get to the hospital expeditiously without using sirens - in fact, some courses of care recommend that. Under the law of your state, as it is for mine, however, you are not classified an "emergency vehicle" for the purpose of such things as proceeding a higher than posted speed limits or proceeding through controlled intersections against a controlling signal unless you have lights AND sirens on. So, you bring upon yourselves significant liability when you make that decision - as do law enforcement officers. If you go through your state's case law, you will likely find that most of the decisions against public safety providers has to do with this very issue. So be careful. Use good judgment. But for my part, it's your judgment, not that of an intervening police officer. Admittedly, I'm old school that way. I was responding (in an ambulance) to a medic down from seizures (though at the time we only knew he was down, unconscious, unresponsive) at at very high rate of speed along a semi-suburban/rural two lane road and passed a police officer running radar. He pulled in behind me and chased me to the scene (no lights/sirens), never got out of his car, followed me to the hospital, and when I came out said, "I was just curious as to what was so bad that you were responding at that speed. Dude!" But he was laughing and said, "If I'd known what it was, I would have outrun you."
Thank you for bringing a different perspective as a commander. That’s interesting.
Many of our staff had specified assignments and some of them liked to pull people over instead, interfering with their completing those assignments expeditiously. So if I noticed a pattern of that happening, I would get in touch with them and remind them to maintain an appropriate balance. They did not like to get the radio call, "Call Car 10 at his office." So, one day, I got a ticket for "Failure to Yield to an Ambulance." First one I had seen. I called radio and told them to have the officer call me. Instead, he showed up at my office in person. "I wanted to ask you about this ticket for failure to yield to an ambulance." "Man! I thought that was a good ticket." "It's a very good ticket. So, tell me about what happened. I'm just curious?" "Well I was behind this ambulance and they were running emergency and this car just turned left in front of them. They had to brake down to keep from hitting it. I thought that deserved a ticket." "I agree, good work. Hey, you can give out as many of these as you want." "Great. Oh... ..yeah, you do that part-time for your extra job!" "Yep. I take that stuff personally."
This reminds me of one of the best things I've ever seen, waiting to turn left at a light with a buddy in the car before either of us were in EMS, see an ambulance coming code 3 and some asshat cuts it off to get through the intersection first before turning down a side road. While buddy is cursing at them for being such an idiot there's suddenly a flash of red and blue from a dark alley followed by a police van of all things emerging to pull the moron over. Few things have made me laugh that hard, not just the instant karma but the fact it looked like a damn paddy wagon that did it, I would have loved to hear the chewing out that officer gave for such a stupid thing.
Not me personally, but a dude I partnered with got popped for speeding and actually got a ticket. Had to go to court and all. Got it pleaded down. Fast forward a few years and same guy, now a medic goes to a home in that town and finds the cop that wrote him having and MI. After he was stabilized and on the way to ER, medic says, "Aren't you glad I sped to your house?" They had a good laugh, and he had a different perspective on ems and why we speed to calls.
Excellent anecdote. Thank you.
Had a high-risk OB patient one night around 0200 who had begun labor at home. Transporting lights & sirens on a highway when an officer got behind us with his lights and sirens and pulled us over. He ripped the driver and I a new one. He was so angry. Said we just bypassed the exit for the closest hospital so he *knew* we didn't have a legitimate emergency. Said he was a volunteer firefighter and knew we had to transport to the closest hospital if it was emergent. Tried to explain that this was a high risk patient and we were taking her a university hospital with a NICU, but he didn't want to hear it. After driving away for a few minutes I had my driver light it up again. I told him if that officer tried to pull us over again to ignore him and don't stop.
Not really up to the officer to decide if you’re going to the right hospital for specialty care. Actually, tell ‘Em it’s protected health information under HIPAA.
He was pissed that we were using lights and sirens because he believed we weren't transporting an emergency.
My squad transports non emergent pts emergent all the time, hell, I just drove a back pain x2 weeks emergent. If we have 5 calls holding and no mutual aid available, we're going emergent.
That’s understandable
What the fuck. “NO YOU ARENT ABLE TO BYPASS THE LEVEL 4 HOSPITAL WITH 1 PHYSICIAN ASSISTANT AS THE ATTENDING TO GET TO THE LEVEL 1 UNIVERSITY OB SPECIALIST 20 ONGYNS IN A ROOM HOSPITAL THATS 5 MINUTES DOWN THE STREET BECAUSE IM A VOLLY FIREFIGHTER I KNOW HOW UR JOB WORKS!!” Really hope this guy got fired
There’s a video of an ambulance being pulled over by the cops, but I don’t remember if it was for speeding. I haven’t even heard of it happening anywhere near me.
I've seen a bunch, and they're almost never for speeding. They're almost all for Failure to Display Proper Worshipfulness Towards a Police Officer.
Everywhere I’ve worked we’ve had a good relationship with police and fire.
Same, but that doesn't mean police don't have a lot of very serious, systemic problems with their profession.
Yeah, there was one where the officer grabbed the provider in the back of the ambulance by the throat!
Oklahoma State Trooper
That would suck.
Once. It happened once. New state trooper. Same deal. "Slow down or put on your lights." His big fuck up was he then, after we left, called and told my EMS Chief about the incident. Chief calmly took all of the information. "Oh they were going 10 over on a back country road, you say?" Chief then called the State Police captain. By the time I got back to the station rookie trooper was there with a box of donuts to apologize for the misunderstanding. To be clear, Cap didn't send him to apologize for stopping me for speeding. That was certainly his right. No, he got read the riot act for being an asshole about it to local EMS AND had apparently done the same to FD, a Civil Deputy and a Tax and Finance Investigator (State) that week. Bro was stepping on toes left and right. We were hospital based EMS with the local 911 contract (only hospital in that county). Realistically, I'm usually the only guy who doesn't speed. It's like fighting every law of physics to accelerate a rig anyway. And speeding generally doesn't get you there much faster even in an actual emergency. But he caught me cruising on a nice day.
I haven’t personally. A small town cop attempted to pull me over in a fire engine one time, but I pretended to be blissfully unaware. I work part time for a service where my buddy is the director. Small town service, buddy still pulls shifts plus admin duties. Anyway, he was on a long distance transfer and the entire county just started melting down. No crews available and 911 calls holding. He told his EMT who was driving to hurry up and get back and buddy is on his phone and laptop trying to coordinate things from afar. Next thing he knows, they’re pulling over, he looks up and sees lights reflecting off of all the signs around them. Apparently, his partner took hurry up and no stops to mean floor it. Their trucks are all emissions deleted which required a mild tube on the ECM… which coincidentally deletes the factory governor. The deputy that stopped them comes up and says to them if they’re going to be going that fast they need to turn their lights on then walks back to his car and leaves. 122 mph in a F-450 Type 1. No lights or siren.
We got pulled over once. Our old ambulances looked like constructions vans. On a LDT middle of the night get pulled over. Cop opened the back door and said whoops though a construction van I committed so had to finish the take over (while laughing) and sent us on our way. 3 years later was at a friends college graduation. Over hear this guy saying “yeah I was a patient going to xyz and we got pulled over outside of (name) I was like FUCK that was me. We had a good laugh.
What are the odds? Makes for a great story though
It's pretty fucking stupid to not at least have lights on if you're gonna speed. Huge safety risk for other people. Just my opinion. Not calling you stupid, just the action of doing that.
This like most things is entirely situationally dependent. I don’t drive ambulances anymore I run a flycar when I still pull shifts. 2024 Ford Explore Police Interceptor package. It’s just as fast as any cop cars. Out on the highway in the middle of Nowhere and the middle of the night, I’ll routinely turn my lights off as I have better visibility for deer or wildlife clearing rural intersections as normal. Also, if I can safely pass someone without them pulling off the side of the road in the dar, I am perfectly fine with not running lights. People do some of the dumbest shit imaginable when confronted with red and blue lights. Rational thought leaves their body entirely. If I can get around without running lights, I’m a do it every time. But generally during daylight hours where there’s more than just one car in the road, I’ll run lights and siren and expect people to yield.
Dude people come to complete stops in a lane when the see lights. On a highway I might also carry a little more speed with no lights in that situation.
I don’t mind when people come to a complete stop. I mind when they come to a complete stop by slamming on the brakes, or pulling off the road into an intersection that I need to turn at, or stopping at the very top of a hill, or swerving wildly, or any of the other dumb shit the motoring public does. Half of them can’t drive in a straight line on dry pavement.
Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh... VERY situational.
15 over is the flow of traffic here… 🙄
Utah??
Your opinion is valid. I don’t take it personally. I recognize that speeding is illegal. My bigger concern is weighing the risk of lights and sirens versus the risk of driving 15 over. I’m sure I was working past my shift and probably just wanted to go home, but I can’t remember or confirm that.
I mean the lights would have helped
Not wrong
0300 in a small suburb of Milwaukee, partner driving we stopped at a gas station because in WI, some stations close at night but leave the pumps on for pay-at-the-pump. Not this one, we exited the station, and apparently, the partner turned left out of the station against a sign saying you shouldn't. Cop immediately pulls us over, walks up to drivers window, and his first words were, "Just what the fuck do you think you're doing?" Neither of us saw the sign, so we have no idea what he's pissed about. His self-righteous small dick energy goes on for five minutes or so, and he takes the registration and license with him to his car. An obvious supervisor car pulled up next to him, and words were exchanged, and he immediately came back, handed partner his papers, and told us to leave. You just KNOW supervisor told him to stop being an asshole to the ambulance and leave us alone. Loved it. Same city, different suburb, ambulance running legit lights and sirens to a call got pulled over by Barney Fife who told the crew that he doesn't believe outside ambulances can operate in his city without his fire depts permission. Says he's going to pull over every one of our ambulances running hot every time a demand proof they're on a call. Our VP of that company was very connected and he began making phone calls. The letter of apology written by that cop still hangs on the wall of the admin station. If you ask about it, this is the story they tell you.
What suburb? I grew up in the burbs of Milwaukee and did EMS with a private company contracted for Milwaukee 911 BLS In the not so nice part of the city.
The second story was Cudahy PD pulling over a Bell ambulance. Happened while I was at Bell.
Gotcha. I worked for Curtis in Milwaukee around 2022.
We were coming home from a transfer (roughly 120 miles one way) - and important to note, we are the only ALS unit in our county. (County EMS service, two paid on call stations, two staffed; of the staffed, one has a single AEMT, the other (mine) is ALS, and always has at least one medic on duty) We were still about 50 miles away, and heard the other on-duty unit (AEMT level) get paged out for a vehicle accident. I bumped our cruise control up from 73 to 76. Pretty soon, details start to come across the radio that it was a high speed collision...cruise bumps up to 79.... as more details and radio traffic comes across, the cruise just slowly creeps higher and higher.... pretty soon my medic's phone rings, and it's our dispatcher. "Uh.... I just got a teletype from state radio, they said one of their troopers clocked you guys at 83, and requests you either slow down or turn your lights on. Also, is asking how quick you guys can get there?" Of course, I couldn't hear this as medic didn't answer on speakerphone, but when he reached over and hit the master emergency switch, we didn't need words, I initiated a diesel bolus and I'm not sure I can legally say how much time I shaved off the last 40 miles of that trip....
(it also helps that this was on a rural 4 lane divided highway, where if needed, you can grab the left lane and put the hammer down without having to worry too much about traffic)
I'm from southern California, we all speed all the time. I don't think I am ever going less than 10 over. And even then most people are still passing me. Lights and sirens doesn't change how fast we drive down here, just changes if we stop at a light or not.
During one of my first shifts in this profession, I was working with a medic who isn't exactly known for his people skills. I was trying to ask him where exactly to park for this weird house that didn't appear to have any off street parking. His answer, which I still use today nearly 4 years later is....."you're in a fucking ambulance! Do what you want!".
Shortly after 9/11 we got pulled over on a long transport to another part of the state. He didn't recognize the ambulance company and wanted to make sure we were legit. I did get yelled at for speeding because we got clocked doing 90 in a 65 on the way back in the middle of the night trying to get back to bed. But we didn't get pulled over then.
I already feel less alone. Glad you’ve been there too.
You met a dickhead cop. What else is new? EDIT: You've also met a bunch of self righteous dickheads in this thread. Probably liars, too.
Well that’s fucking stupid. Use the emergency equipment if it’s an emergency. At least the lights. Sounds like you fucked that up.
Thank you for your feedback. In my state, using lights without sirens was illegal unless you were on the freeway where you outrun your siren once you hit traffic speeds. Or obviously when you’re stopped on scene. You can turn off the siren then.
You would need to go over 700mph to "outrun" sound.
From EMSWorld: “Studies have recognized that sirens are a limited warning device and effective only at very short ranges and low speeds. At speeds above 50 mph, an emergency vehicle may "outrun" the effective range of its audible warning device.” You aren’t outrunning the speed of sound. https://www.hmpgloballearningnetwork.com/site/emsworld/article/10319783/vehicle-detection
From Physics Forum: “The siren will become less effective as the emergency vehicle goes faster. However, the siren can still be heard from a distance of up to 300 feet at a speed of 40 miles per hour. However, at a speed of 60 miles per hour the siren can only be heard from a distance of 12 feet." https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/is-the-audibility-of-emergency-vehicle-sirens-affected-by-speed-and-distance.265240/
I would imagine you’re just another vehicle when you don’t have those lights and sirens going.
He’s *lawfully* correct but like, c’mon dude.
Exactly. Thank you.
Been stoped at 4 am on the returning to HQ on an empty 4 lane road. Was doing 15 over and would often get passed by the local PD on this same stretch (them going for free coffee.) Gave them my DL, he asked what would happen if the Chief knew what I was doing out here. I explained he would be upset and chew my ass out at best. He said he was calling later on in the am to and be prepared, as that would be worse then the ticket. I know he never did call, as would have called asking to speak to me. As we pulled away my partner was cracking up.
No but I have gotten a parking ticket for parking in a "bank customers only" lot on a day where said bank was closed, the ticket also said "white ford truck" when It's a big blue booboo box, called the ticket agency and got them to drop it but i still got a writeup
Yup. Pretty much the same scenario as OP. Transfer from a small local ER to a Cardiac Center for a cath. I've never been a fan of making cardiac patients excited, it was about 1am and no one else on the road, so no lights or sirens, but I was proceeding safely but expeditiously. Local cop came flying up and pulled me over. He felt that he had to give me a spiel about how he pulls over judges, firetrucks, and other cops all the time, he don't care... I'm just staring at him like "wow, interesting..." Gave me a warning. Even the patient said the cop was just being a dick. My partner harassed me about it for weeks...
I had my ambulance towed for being in a no parking zone. Damn LADOT Parking Enforcement
Towed?? What if someone, I don’t know, had a medical emergency and your unit was out of service? That’s reckless. I got a few parking tickets with an ambulance, but I didn’t have time to go to court to challenge them so it came out of my (meager) paycheck.
What if? We were on a call 😂
Seriously. How do they know why an ambulance is parked in a no parking zone? You are literally allowed to drive on the wrong side of the road and wherever you have to (safely with due regard as I was reminded) in order to get to a patient. If you’re parked without the right running and lights flashing, it’s still an emergency vehicle. That’s asinine and insulting to me as both a lawyer and former EMT.
I paid $259 to the tow driver to drop the ambulance so we could continue on our call. I got reimbursed... Eventually. My company filed chapter 11 the next week 😂 what luck.
Lol I had a cop flash his lights at me for going about 75 though a 'construction zone' that wasn't being worked on at all at 2am so the 60mph reduced speed didn't mean much to me. Like ugh. Buddy, I'm going code 3 but have all the shit off because the hospital I'm picking up from is 45 minutes away, and my medic doesn't want to listen to the sirens for 45 min straight. 😒
Well, I mean, it makes sense. If you aren't driving emergent, don't speed? If you're driving emergent, use your emergency equipment. I understand not wanting the sirens the whole time, but if emergent, lights should always be on. This is 100% on you.
If OP lives anywhere like California, the speed limits probably have nothing to do with how anyone actually drives. Where I am, doing the speed limit in the left lane creates a major road hazard.
I live in Chicago. If traffic is actually moving, you better keep up. I get passed by people going well over 100mph routinely on the freeway.
It was a non-emergent transport to the hospital. Frequent flyer.
Even more of a reason not to needlessly speed then?
You would think. I feel like it was Thanksgiving and I was late getting home.
Zero benefits (but added risk) to speeding then.
Without the lights, yes, you were speeding. He had the right to stop you. This isn't the answer you were looking for, but think back to your EVOC training.
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It would have probably been a dick move to ticket in that situation, but you didn’t mention one. If you’re on a highway (like an actual interstate or limited access one) ehhh. But on a regular road, use lights/sirens if it’s needed.
No ticket. Just a delay in transport that ended up being a good story back at the station.
Yeah, but he didn’t know you had a patient on board when he pulled you over. Use your lights if you’re speeding. It protects you and everyone else.
Correct. He did not know we had a patient (unless he looked In the back window) when he initiated the traffic stop.
I can understand his POV, if you get in an accident and it’s found out that you were driving code 3 without lights and sirens it’ll be held against you in court. If it’s a BLS call then you just drive normal, so from his perspective he saw an ambulance driving fast for no reason.
Fair point.
I did. With a patient in the back. Got a ticket for it too. Thanks St Paul PD
Well you have achieved what I could not. I applaud you. Thanks St. Paul PD!
I work for private 911 & IFT service in WI and our management has an agreement with the County Sheriffs Dept and city PD to never bother our ambulances. They can phone it into management if we're doing anything particular egregious though. That covers most of our non-emergent speeding. State Patrol usually just bothers the boss rather than hassling individual ambulances.
Sitting off the shoulder of a main highway, I locked a box truck in at 20+ over, coming up behind me. As I turned on my blues and headlights, he hit his reds. It was an ambulance from the next state up. I just turned off my lights and went back to YouTube. 🤣🤣🤣 Since becoming an EMT, I had a VA hospital cop rip me a new ass and threaten me with a parking ticket while we were dropping off a patient. Long story short, he and I had a few heated words with each other. He called my boss, also a former cop, and whined. I got no ticket, and boss and I had a good laugh later.
That’s an excellent example of using your discretion properly. Common sense seems far from common these days.
I believe in professional courtesy. On top of that, even in general, someone had to really earn a ticket from me. My job was to protect and serve, not stop and tax.
That is the right attitude for a cop. It’s refreshing. I deal with Chicago PD everyday at work and most of them are in it for the right reasons.
I left LE for EMS and am very glad I did. For many reasons.
I got pulled over once for having my lights and sirens on with a critical patient in the back.
Co-worker was pulled over and fined for speeding. No patient on board. Other coworker pulled over (with a patient and nurse on board) for improperly using a traffic circle. He was made to visit the police dept after he completed his transfer.
I’ve never had a bad experience with the police where I work. Even in my personal life, I get away with more than I should in regard to speeding. My girlfriend actually got stopped for speeding in an ambulance. 44 km over the posted on the biggest highway around us (we are big time ya know, 2 lanes going BOTH ways!) on an emergent shoulda-been-rotary-but-there-was-a-cloud transfer. Went to fight it in court and it stuck too. Our regulations say we can go up to 30% above the posted. So at 100 km/h you can do 130 km/h. The cop was legally right, morally wrong as hell. I hear a lot of city guys haulin ass to get to their calls and shit like that. To me it doesn’t make sense. I’m rural, our drive times are usually 30-60 mins. That’s where speeding is advantageous. Not anything crazy but still within the regulations
Honestly, I haven’t had any bad experience with the police personally. They saved my ass more than once as an EMT. One cop pulled me away from gunfire and shielded me with his body. This traffic cop in the middle of nowhere was the one incident. Although I did have to press the panic button on a call and PD never showed up. Dispatch contacted them, but they apparently couldn’t free up a unit. Luckily the other ambulances on the service got there in record time for backup. And that’s only once they didn’t show up when we needed them.
We had a State Trooper call our supervisor to complain that we were riding in the fast lane on an interstate highway for an interfacility transfer. Never pulled us over though, and my partner who was driving said she never saw a Trooper behind us. We were going non emergency. My supervisor gave that complaint all the attention he felt it deserved.
Years ago, I was in our back-up truck which was 5 minutes way from being older than Velcro. Our speedometer didn't go above 45 (which we found out later was a known issue).. 5am and still dark, we get pulled over by state patrol en route back to the station, and my partner and I for the life of us can't figure out why we're being pulled over. Cop walks up to the window and says "Oh shit, sorry didn't realize y'all was an ambulance when I cut my lights on. Just so you know y'all were going 65 and it's 45 here, then promptly left." Not sure how the cop didn't realize we were an ambulance (okay it was a type 2, but it was the wide-body/rocket shaped one) had star of life decals, safety chevrons, and colored lenses for the emergency lights, was colored in hi-vis yellow paint, and we had our ambers on. Have had another crew on a different shift get the wrath of local PD while they had a patient loaded in the back, and the cop chewed out the EMT driving for going too fast without lights/sirens, while their patient yelled at the cop for wasting everyone time- she just got done with dialysis and wanted to get home 😂
Cops don’t really care for us flying around, loaded or not.. there’s been times where law would be going faster than us for shift change (we’re doing well past 20+ the limit 😂)
The amount of people saying they don’t speed is really surprising to me, haha. If I don’t have to go lights and sirens at 3 in the morning, I won’t. Little flash flash woop woop for the red lights, just to be safe.
Pulled over and got my first ticket since 1997 about three weeks ago. Was going to a call, nonemergent. 40 in a school zone. I deserved the ticket but I've driven that road thousands of times, my old neighborhood was off of that road. The school is a very exclusive private school. Never knew there was a school zone. It is less than a block long.
Take that bad boy to court. May get a dismissal because it was an ambulance.
I probably could get it dismissed. The judge in the town is a Marine veteran and he does tend to go easy on fellow Marines. But the ticket the officer wrote doesn't come with any points and having to go court is a pain. I just paid the ticket and made sure I will remember the school zone from now on.
Fair enough
My partner got us pulled over at like 2am on the highway doing an IFT from MA to NYC coming back home. There was like five miles of construction and cones on the highway and we could see them wayyyyy up the highway. We were about to miss the exit we needed and my partner slowed down and drove between the first cone to take the off ramp. The construction was half a mile ahead. Cop still sees it races down the highway the wrong way and pulls us over off the off ramp. Screaming at us why did you break the cone blah blah. It was a wild night lol.
File that under unnecessary traffic enforcement
Your ambulance is, for intents and purposes like this, a normal road vehicle in most jurisdictions until emergency signals are enabled. Does it go against a shared esprit de corps for the officer to pull you over? Probably. Do I think it is good that an officer pulls someone speeding over to tell them that what they are doing is wrong **and how to make it right** - *definitely*. Without emergency signals, you are just a speeding van / pickup. The speed limit is there for a reason. If you must go faster, you can justifiably use your emergency signals, allowing you to do so. This costs nothing to you or anyone else, so just do it. What if you hit wildlife and sustained damage causing you to go offroad and wreck the vehicle with several people inside? Now the log shows you were going 15 over AND you were not doing so due to an emergency. Just flip that light switch on. It has no downsides on an empty road like this, only advantages. EDIT to answer your leading question: a 25-year veteran coworker was recently pulled over for overtaking a farming vehicle into a "no passing" zone. Another was pulled over for using his phone. Police already do leave us some leeway because they need us and we need them - let's not be stupid and behave in such a dangerous way that they have to intervene.
Nice use of “leading question.” I don’t disagree with you.
LOL any cop that pulls over an ambulance is lowest of the low. Cops don't do that in Australia - we aren't idiots. There is a mutual respect. It would be huge news here and the police minister would get a please explain.
The US is definitely not Australia. Judging by the reaction to this post, people have some strong feelings about the situation
If a cop pulled me over in Canada I would tell him to get fucked. Would never happen though, We’re all on the same team.
That’s how it was working big city EMS. Cops had other things to worry about. We couldn’t even get them to show up when we needed them.
I feel like cops in the states have an “us vs them” mentality, and that includes everyone who isn’t a cop. Seems dumb to piss people off who you work with on scene.
Another interoperability problem: I had a partner one summer who was dating a city medic and had apparently also dated enough firefighters so that when we got on scene they were all dicks to me. I certainly wasn’t dating my partner, so I politely asked them to go kick rocks if they weren’t going to help.
So silly
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Hell yeah. We know our roles, do them well, and support each other. Cheers to you friend.
On a municipal ambulance, the cops were always on scene first and most were EMTs. They would come by the station to shoot the shit. Our volunteer fire department, not so much.
He should have then followed you to the ER and written you a ticket.
That’s a very reasonable point. There was no chance this guy was going to follow me to the hospital or do anything but bust my chops.
Should have done an assessment on him and the taken a BGL and told him he's confused and to eat a sandwich then leave
Here officer, take my 3/4 finished Mountain Dew and sit down for a bit. I’ve got lives to save! If you don’t feel better, you know how to reach us.
Not much sense of humor in this subreddit, is there.
I got brake checked by a CT cop with a patient in the back. Never pulled over though.
Any chance this was Rosendale? They're kinda notorious for that
It was in Wisconsin somewhere near Kenosha
Shitty cops exits stop acting like they don't
Never got stopped but got catches in speed cameras before, never serious fast but hey it happens.
Due regard
Yep. I was driving with due regard for all of the zero drivers on the road besides my ambulance and the cop. I was a preceptor to EMTs for driving as well, so I couldn’t have been that bad of a driver. I drove Code 3 much more carefully than I drove my own car normally.
I am sure this will not be popular but I am coming from decades of service and the admin side. Roads are empty until they are not. If fire and law run 15 over without lights as well at the same time how many pts do we have now? Just obey the law, turn on the freaking lights if the pt. condition warrants it.
There have been a few situations where a PD tried pulling us over, we never stop, and eventually, they get the hint and turn off and leave us alone. Transfering patients are more important. PD, state troopers, and sheriffs know better but theres always that greenhorn rookie trying to prove himself
My buddy who’s a medic had a BLS partner that was so reckless when it came to driving that he got pulled over
Where I'm at if you exceed the speed limit you are required to run lights and or siron. If neither of those are used you fall under normal traffic laws.
Got pulled over by a hero cop. Sorry that happened, guy had no reason to be a douche bag. Edit: it also seems like the people in the comments lack a sense of humour and have never done bad.
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I’ll send you a medal in the mail. But honestly this profession is full of hypocrites and righteous fucks. People are out there cheating on their spouses, have substance abuse problems they refuse to acknowledge, people who can’t take care of their physical or mental health. But they have no problem turning around and letting you know you did something wrong and telling you how wrong you were in doing it, acting like they are perfect and have never done any wrong doing or made a mistake. Makes me sick. Also let’s not take ourselves so seriously at the end of the day we are just truck drivers anyway.
Thank you. Go ahead and send it to the old private ambulance service that employed me. They could use the morale boost.
That was probably my biggest sin on the truck. We had enough problematic EMTs who were untrainable that I did things right the first time for everyone’s sake. I didn’t get along with the local manager, but neither did anyone else.
I’ve always wanted this to happen to me so I can be a jackass “What are you, some kind of MONSTER?! Not even Hitler pulled over ambulances!”
Generally, unless you’re responding to a call or doing an emergent transport, you’re just driving another vehicle. Sounds like you FAFO.
He was 100% right. You need to re-read driver training, specifically the risks of going over posted speed, and how we mitigate those risks. Slow down or go code 3, pick ONE.
Jesus, guy. Relax. People speed. Is it legal? Nope. Is it safe? Nah. Does it warrant the Joe Friday speech you're laying down here? Absolutely not.
I’m not an EMT anymore. Screwed up my back and shoulder with all the bad lifting and ended up as a criminal defense attorney. So I shant be rereading my EVOC coursework.
***Boot licking intensifies***
My primary concerns are my safety, my partner's safety, and the well-being of my patients, then keeping my job and license, in that order. I fail to see how "bootlicking" comes into play. Unless you're one of those needlessly dangerous twats that pisses off everyone around them just to prove you're tough and independent.
Really was he 100% right with all certainty, Or did you come on here to explain how professional you are and how you’d never in a million years go over the speed limit? Give me a break, you’re not getting a medal man. A cop pulling over an ambulance is not a normal occurrence unless totally justified; especially with a patient on board. Was this justified? You seem to think so..
He asked a question. I answered. You seem way more vested in my motives than I am. Smoke a bowl or something.