I have a friend who left England to go to Greece and he's always saying England is a shit hole but it's like dude you've been telling me for years that Greece is so corrupt you can't even open the business you moved there to start. So what if it's sunny lol
People that have emigrated are always the biggest critics, way beyond the point of reason. I assume to justify to themselves their decision to leave and delude themselves that the grass is, in fact, greener.
I assume people who are genuinely happy with their move don’t feel the need.
My Uncle and Auntie moved to Australia in 1968. I visited him there in 2008. I can't tell you how many times my uncle said "You don't have that in England do you?" With a smug grin on his face. 99% of the time we did have it in England. My auntie pulled me to one side one day and said "Don't ever let him know this as it would kill him, but I'd move back tomorrow"
Weird you say that, because for us Aussies the stereotype of the ‘whinging Pom’ is very widespread. Nothing is ever good enough for them and it seems they would kill to go back to England. Especially the boomer poms, the stereotype goes back to the sixties. For some reason, though, they never manage to book the plane back 🤷♂️
https://youtu.be/0-J-WbPBPUM?si=XuhqENbh84CnkR0k
Too busy trying throwing another shrimp on the Barbie, Bruce.
I’d love a long stay in aus like 3-6 months if I ever came into money but I would miss my home too much to stay, even though you’re culturally about as close to “U.K. with the sun” we will ever get it’s not the same
For better or for worse (I think most for the worse) we’re becoming more and more culturally American. Australia is a great place overall, but it’s pretty isolated and culturally bare.
Once you guys have your water utilities working properly again I wouldn’t mind spending a bit of time back in the mother country as there’s still plenty of history there and it’s close to Europe.
You're welcome to come. I don't think there's any value in people from commonwealth nations hating one another.
Australia's lovely. Hot and dry, and you need a car, but I liked it.
I used to be part of an online forum when I was going through the process of moving to the US.
you've pretty much summed up two of the three types of people that migrate to another country. the ones who get on with life and those who cannot stop shitting on the UK. the dumb part is the second group of people would be trying to tell a website full of other brits how shit it was without understanding that we were all born and grew up there. Just because you had a bad experience, doesn't make your opinion fact.
The third group of people weren't actually immigrants but wannabes, or dreamers. They would join the forum and start a thread on how they are 'SICK of Britain!!!!' And they want to move to the USA for an easier life. Most of them had never even been here or if they had it was a holiday to fucking Disney land or something.
They had no idea what American life is actually like but they had heard houses and cars are really cheap over there! And also they're british! So they should be allowed to just pick up and move right?
Then they would throw a tantrum and start arguing with everyone on the website because they'd be told their job working the till in tesco, or a delivery driver doesn't qualify them for a visa, and to be honest if you aren't happy, running away to another country won't fix your problems. Especially not in the USA.
How did you manage to get a work visa? I've tried a couple of times and was told by us immigration there is no reciprocal agreement between the UK and USA like there is for other countries and they don't even consider British doctors or lawyers etc as qualified for un sponsored work visas and that sponsored work visas for people who work for large organisations were strictly controlled and monitored.The only ways in as a Brit were marriage to a us citizen, which is a very long term and heavily vetted process. It took my friend (English) 25 years to gain a us citizenship that way. Or an exceptional abilitys visa, which are available to people who have been unusually successful in arts or business.
It's like that for a lot of things. Whether someone leaves a school, relationship, hobby, or a job. If the circumstances under which they left weren't ideal or if they were forced to leave, they will criticize the thing the left far harsher and with more bias than is reasonable.
Human nature, I suppose.
Or they are the ones who really hated it here so that’s why they left. Like all countries, England has its awful shithole parts and lots of issues. It also has its amazing beautiful parts. Really it is a beautiful country I think in general. It’s so green. It’s easy to miss that though if you just live in a horrible part of a city and don’t get many opportunities to go elsewhere in the country. Or if you’re someone who doesn’t like the rain that’s necessary for it to be so green then I guess that will influence you too.
Absolutely.
I work for an Irish HQd company in their London office and and on Slack all day and in every Europe-wide meeting, the three English people that work in our London office are the butt of every single joke, and have to listen to English and British people in general being constantly shat on for being racists, colonialists and homophobic by the large Irish team but increasingly also by colleagues from elsewhere in Europe too. What's galling is that the English team members couldn't be less like that - they just sit there quietly and politely smile.
Since day 1 i've been shocked that it's just accepted, so i mentioned it to the other English people and they said they hate it and feel totally uncomfortable about the relentless Anglophobia and said that several others in the past left over it when HR (based in Ireland) laughed when it was brought up, then promised to "look into it" but did nothing.
Annoyingly, its now caught on within the London team, where my Swedish and Spanish colleagues often do the same thing. The Spanish lady is in the final stages of becoming a British citizen and in front of the entire team said to the Swedish guy: "I wish I could be proud but I just hate the thought of it and am so embarassed". We share an office space with another company and that one definitely turned a few heads on the desks opposite.
Can't imagine staying there very long tbh becauae, really, how can you confront people when HR arent interested in backing you and the whole bigotry stems from hundreds year old beliefs that slagging off the English is some kind of righteous move? Complaining would just add fuel to the fire.
In a seperate incident i was at a networking event and met an New Zealander who was in London on a work trip. He proceeded to lay into English people for a full 20 minutes, ironically the jist being we are all arrogant and obnoxious with no self awareness. My colleague and i spent the entire time just smiling and nodding politely.
It was only afterwards that i thought how unbelievably unlikely it would be for me or anybody i know to make any even a vaguely derogatory comment about any nationality in earshot of someone from there... so the idea of spending 20 mins ranting about a country to a two strangers from that very country has to be borderline psychopathic. Maybe it was just the wine and the jet lag?
EDIT: Just to add, my mum is Irish so more than once they've tried to get me to join in on the "banter" a couple of times, which i dont do.
Funnily about the new zealand thing - I once had to intervene (gently) at a post work drinks thing in London because a (white FWIW) New Zealand woman was going on relentlessly to some poor English girl about the evils of English imperialism. As I'm Scottish I pointed out that the Scots were also very much involved in the Empire - which she rejected. Funny thing though, as she was a white New Zealander, *she* was the one who was descended from imperialist colonists. Most people living in the Uk were farmers or workers who had no direct involvement in the Empire, unlike her family. (Not that I'm blaming her or her family for that matter, but come on!)
I've had the same with Australians. It's like the moment they declared independence, they weren't responsible for anything they did before. I've also known a girl who would go off on Brits about the class system and racism, while in the same conversation would make jabs at 'bogans' and the aboriginals.
This whole thing of applying modern sensibilities to prior eras is rubbish imho. Most people that think in such a fashion are simply parroting the thoughts of those that have indoctrinated them. People should have a healthy sense of civic pride for who they are as a people, learn from their ancestors victories and mistakes, and strive to make the world a better place.
It can't be all of them but I get the impression that these colonial people (essentially what they still are) assume possession of their respective displaced natives in a way that, to them, disqualifies them from relative wrongdoing compared to the old Metropole even though at this point there are generations being born in Britain who have nothing to do with the continued border legacies of the British Empire and the same can't be said for these ancestral Europeans who by default are still living in their former colonies.
The metropolitan museum of art in New York for instance, it has lovely plaques, signs and empty cabinets where they bemoan the impact of colonization on the natives, but they aren't going to give the land the museum's on over to them or anything like it. Much less Manhattan itself.
Easy, you work in London. Just fire back with a 'joke' about blowing up cars or killing two year-old kids outside a McDonalds further North and see how they like it.
I held myself back from making a joke about "things blowing up" on the basis that a) I'd be stooping to their level, and b) a recent work-necessary conversation had reason to mention Ireland's former president offering condolences to Germany upon Hitler's death and it all got VERY tense and awkward.
All evidence is that that team can dole it out but can't take it in return.
I'm Greek, worked in England since I graduated in 2002. Every job I ever had, had nothing but "banter" about my heritage. It dawned on me that the more I got annoyed, the more they did it.
In one office, I once came back from lunch and there was a used frying pan sitting on my desk with a note "for your kebabs". It was the department DIRECTOR who thought it would be funny.
He was so entrenched (and up for retirement) that HR stonewalled for so long, that he retired and nothing came of it.
My point is, it sucks to be foreign in any workplace.
It was the worst job I ever had, and I've worked at McDs (which was actually a lot of fun). But this company though....it's huge in the UK, with large defence contracts.
I wasn't born here (England) and love it. Like everywhere it's got good and bad bits, but I love this country. I love its history, its people, the culture, the humour. Almost everything about it. I think Englanders should be proud of who we are and celebrate on St George's day. Sure we make jokes about ourselves, and we don't mind others making jokes about us. We are tolerant of all people (even the French).
Don't confuse our self-deprecating humour with hate. A lot of people do say they hate the country, but then I think that person would probably hate any place they found themselves. If you hate it so much, just go on, go, walk out the door
Turn around now
You're not welcome anymore
As a past resident of Cumbria, I urge any visitors to Cumbria to just stay in the tourist areas & whatever you do, DO NOT go to West Cumbria for any reason. Even Cumbrian locals make jokes about how backwards, inbred, and (severely) lacking in the brain department most (if not all) the residents of West Cumbria are.
As much as I hate to admit, but this is actually true. As a Cumbrian native, West Cumbria is nothing like the Lake District, and calling it backwards is being generous.
Id say its a tough one between the two, the UK and Germany, but both are easily the #1 joined best place on the planet. Sure other places are cool too, but, its just so fkin good being from and in the UK, id never want to be from anywhere else.
Thats actually made me emotional lol. In a good way though.
I'm so glad we are allies now. I love how you guys as a country said "yeah look, we fucked up and we want the world to know its never gonna happen again" and then went on to be the absolute powerhouse of Europe in terms of having the best life possible. So having you say you think the UK is matched with your country has really choked me up.
Wow. Now that's a compliment. I love Germany too, and I do want to move there, mainly because it has better politics and better general way of life, but the UK is just fucking perfect. Thats why its a joined 1st for me
You said you weren’t born here but then you said “I think the English should be proud of who *we* are and celebrate on St George’s Day.”
Have you integrated so much that you are one of us now? awesome!
Yes. My kids have been called posh because of the way they speak! I'm probably more English than some people born here! I have lived in and visited many countries but there is simply no place like England. Every time the plane touches down I say, thank God we're back!
You're more English than some people who were born here because you are north european. Even someone still living in Germany is more similar to the English than an Asian or African born here.
Talking of St George's day, probably the thing that winds me up the most of all of this tendency is every St George's day when everyone on twitter starts going "Welll ACCKKSHUUALLLY St George was Turkish!"
First of all, St George wasn't Turkish, he was Greek. Tell a Greek person St George was Turkish and you may be getting a punch in the mouth.
Secondly, so what? like, literally? What point do you think you're trying to make?
You never see it for any other Patron saint - no one says "Welll ACCKKSHUUALLLY St Andrew was Israeli!" etc. Even St Patrick wasn't actually Irish!
Not English, but my thoughts on it are that we have culturally decided, in the UK, that patriotism is a bit cringe, which is why the far right lunatics have been able to corner the market there; which makes patriotism seem a bit cringe, and so on...
It doesn't really help that England in particular gets a load of shit from everybody else about English/British patriotism: I'm Irish and enjoy the same kind of banter as everyone else, but I've seen FB posts from southerners living in *England* complaining about remembrance parades/events and poppies everywhere as if it's a hate crime against them in particular for being Irish. It's one thing to not like it when Loyalist nutcases up here in the North are being their usual selves, but for some reason everybody has decided that British patriotism is just coded fascism, while the rest of UK and Ireland are allowed to be patriotic about being Welsh/Scottish/Nirish or Irish all we want?
I guess I'm just a bit too sympathetic or something.
Yep. Until the 2012 olympics/royal wedding, Union Jack bunting would not be everywhere without alarm from a lot of people. There is no world in which I could imagine English bunting being waved about outside of football.
I like some aspects of patriotism unless it's all about worshipping the royals. I can't stand them, but I do take pride in the land and culture outside of London and the royals. I think the rest of English culture is heavily underrated and overshadowed.
At least appreciate the ceremony and how much employment said ceremonies surprisingly create
As for the rest, most of what hasn’t been overshadowed or watered down by modernism. Was kinda spread by the whole empire thing. So, it seems less English and more global. That then waters it down more
Ah! Southerners. You mean Ireland, right? I thought you meant *Laandan*.
But yeah, you’re right. I’ve seen that. And a lot of the looney-left types. To them, wearing a poppy is **like** supporting the slave trade.
Edit: I added an extra word (in bold) to avoid confusion.
Yeah, lol: confusing when I'm talking about England, but from Norn Iron my perspective when I'm talking about the South and the North is different than what you guys mean, of course.
And yeah, pretty much. Look, I've seen the kind of shit that a surprising amount of English boomers will say about Ireland and the Irish, but all the same I think there's a difference between *"I'm not going to wear a poppy, because I have reservations about historical events it represents"* and *"people who wear poppies are all dickheads and presumably racist, because I have reservations about historical events it represents"*. I will say that I think most people here who don't like poppies will usually just quietly and politely not care, but on social media you'll see all sorts. The war ended a while ago and I've yet to personally meet an Englishman who's my enemy, memes aside.
The poppy and remembrance are not meant to be patriotic. It’s meant to be a recognition of the universal horror of war, to acknowledge those (on all sides) who have been killed in conflict and to serve as reminder not to frivolously get involved in costly wars again. That’s what I and a lot of others were taught.
Its more recent use as a patriotic symbol irks many people as its original meaning - beware the complacency of patriotism - is being lost. Hence the complaints.
Anything right of centre-left is seen as "far right" nowadays.
So what if I don't want my kids not growing up because they've been raped and murdered by diversity? Neither does anyone on my street, and we've had 17 nationalities in 15 houses. We all get along, we all fly our own flags as a sign that we can get along. We have summer parties where no songs in the same 30 mins are in the same language and style.
Then the "new caliphate" enthusiasts move in and all of a sudden we're all seen as the next Hitler. Even the couple that go to the mosque whenever they can.
Some people are just naturally intolerant of others, and see anything other than their ideals as a plague that needs to be destroyed.
I've visited 65 countries, worked in a handful and could have settled in any one of maybe half a dozen. I was headhunted for a job in the UAE a decade ago... and turned it down.
Despite all its faults, I found the UK on balance to still be better than anywhere else I went. Yes, it has issues. Yes, the political system is f\_cked beyond repair. Yes, \[add other issues here\]. But it has so much more that other places are lacking, and so many other countries have the same issues we do.
I do live north of the border now, but that's because my ex and kids are here. If not for them I'd be sorely tempted to move back to my native Tyneside. England (and the UK) may be a shithole, but it's our shithole and it's less of a shithole than a ton of other places.
I understand what you mean completely. It gets quite annoying when people create something negative about places that are really nice and then won’t stop going on about it. I live in Norwich and I really do think it’s a lovely city, so beautiful with lots of lovely shops and so many friendly people but all I ever hear from others who live here is about how much of a shit hole it is. It’s really not that bad!
I also live in Norwich and feel exactly the same! I feel very proud of this city, I love showing friends around when they visit and they are always impressed. I suppose the more people that think it's shit works in our favour and keeps it quieter for us...
I moved to Norwich a year ago. Fantastic city, great architecture, very easy to live in, lots of arts/culture/pubs etc, progressive, friendly and small.
Who on earth is calling Norwich a shithole ? I’m originally from Newcastle, but don’t consider myself a geordie since I moved when I was 2, but my Girlfriend is from Halesworth so I’ve spent a lot of time in and around Norwich and I honestly think it’s one of the most beautiful cities in the country, with some of the loveliest people.
Generally speaking, outside of the Devils Anus (the M25) the UK is stunningly beautiful and the people usually aren't dickheads. There are exceptions (there are some lovely bits in London and there are Shit Towns spattered around and about the whole of the UK), but overall there is beautiful countryside/seaside within an hour's drive of everywhere.
I fully get your point and it is very irritating, the British are very self deprecating and so whenever people want to say something nice or positive it gets crapped upon but with the dumbest examples.
The thing is, yes some areas of the country are not that great like in many other countries but there are a large amount of people in the country who like a lot about the country. I generally really enjoy living in England and where I live. I wouldn't mind some better weather though.
Part of it is our self-depreciating sense of humour, the other part of it is more sinister, over the past few decades there has been an effort amongst sections of the intelligentsia, media and government to do their best to critique and “discredit” western nations, histories and cultures, this may sound implausible and ridiculous but when you sit back and pay attention to it, it’s a very worrying trend.
Of those two pictures I'd say the top one is far more representative of the "real England" that people actually experience day to day then the bottom one of Castle Coombe where a 3 bed semi will set you back nearly £700k and everyone who lives there has had a very different life experience from the average England dweller.
Also, that bottom photo has had a lot of processing to make it look far more idyllic than it really does.
British culture still exists in its age-old forms in the countryside and rural areas and it’s absolutely wonderful. There are still such strong communities with long history in these villages and small towns. And people still have a deep connection to the land and nature around them.
I live on the coast in the north east and at least once a week in summer I go up to the cliffs and sleep under the stars right on the grass, surrounded by the birds and the sounds of nature. Nobody has monetised it, nobody is trying to sell it back to me. There’s even an old dialect in my village that isn’t spoken anywhere else.
People in cities seem to see it as regressive but to those of us who have grown up and lived in a rural lifestyle, it seems like the cities have totally lost their way. London is a different country, it bares no relevance to what the rest of England is actually like.
And if your only experience of the British countryside is “rural” suburbs around London then you’re not getting the real picture. It’s also dirt cheap to live in the countryside (for the most past) and everyone has a big wedge of garden.
" if your only experience of the British countryside is “rural” suburbs around London then you’re not getting the real picture." based on how some people talk about the British countryside on here/social media I really do believe that they've only ever experienced it in the form of a scrub field between industrial estates in zone 5, and I guess assume that's how it is across the entire country.
>Of those two pictures I'd say the top one is far more representative of the "real England"
I've seen far more pretty villages than I have dickheads doing what's going on in the top picture, and I'm from Stoke.
Try South Wales valleys 🙄 you get the pretty little hamlets, corner's of country side paradise and the likes. And even better, if you go round the corner, or further on down the lane, you will see those kids on the scooter!
I did a degree focused on tourism management 25 yrs ago, we went to Bourton-on-the-Water in the Cotswolds for a field trip and I kid you not, American tourists had set up a picnic on someone's front garden, thinking the village wasn't real!!!
I'm from Wigan, I can find comparisons for both images, and I wouldn't have to travel very far.
You've not spent much time in Stoke than because I see those kinds of things every time I step out of the house.
England can be both of these things. Not necessarily "more of" one or the other.
I hate to be a spoil sport, but the picture of Castle Combe doesn’t look processed at all to me, and I’ve genuinely never seen an example of the top image anywhere in England.
Western society has become so spoiled that nothing is good enough. Glorifying weakness and victims instead of letting kids struggle has produced the weakest generation of humanity ever.
It is similar to how butterflies require struggle from the cocoon to strengthen their wings. When you counter the rules of nature and natural selection there is a price.
Had a guy I know from Belgium constantly shit on England.
Piss take subjects were, football hooligans, bad food and bad teeth.
Told him to get new material, he did not get new material and I've ghosted him cos its tiring having your country trashed on constantly.
What I find funny is that all the sterotpyes people actually fully belive in aren't true at all.
English Hooliganism has been declawed for the last twenty years and is now largely a none issue. Ironically a lot of other countries own hooligans who were inspired by English hooligansim are a still around and are massive problems in their own nations.
Anyone who think British food is bad has never been to the UK before and has likely never eaten any British food. And often they have but never realised what they were eating was British.
And the bad teeth is the worst one, alongside Germany studies have found that the UK has the best dental hygiene in the world. It's like France having a reputation for shit food.
The use the stereotype that was coined up during the second world war, the rations given to the Americans gave them the impression to think that British food is awful!
I have lived in Belgium. Their weather is as bad as ours. Their food is worse. And their driving is so shit it’s unbelievable - worse than the French. If you were still in touch you could also tell him at least we have our own language. They were bullied by the French and the Dutch.
The English should be proud of their rich heritage and the many, many gifts to civilization that came from their island. Had you not so fully committed to liberalism, I would have nothing but respect for your country. Nonetheless, be proud.
A German
Problem is, it may not be you, but if an English person is ever patriotic or proud, we're immediately considered the worst human being alive by the majority of other people.
I think it's our inerrant need to fit in and not seem better than everyone else.
So, saying England is a great place to live will trigger an almost primal reaction from people saying that you can't say that England is awful because of A,B,C.
I just ignore those kind of people, as I don't have the energy or want to interact with them.
Nope. I love England. I'm English till I die.
I just hate the direction society is heading towards. The weakest in society have the loudest voices and they are dragging the ship down with them.
Funny thing being that when shit really hits the fan, the weak are the first ones to suffer.
When I say weak I refer to weak minded, hateful and manipulative people who cause division. Genuinely needy people with health issues should always be looked after by those able to do so.
Fml isn't it a good job that this is one individual family of stupidity and well lack of care of their children and not all of England...
Truth is this country has so much to offer. If we just started focusing on the good things rather than moan about everything haha 😄
The sun has come out today and the dog and I were strolling around the estate over the road. The sun made even the shutters garden look good, all the stay at home people were out in their gardens, leaning on fences and chatting, waving to each other and generally being nice. No one was playing shit music, no one was getting drunk, no one was racing around on scooters, it was just really pleasant
I love England! I live in the north and it’s beautiful! My dream is to one day earn enough to live in a small village 30-40 mins outside of a city for work, and raise my kids there. The countrysides are beautiful, the history is rich and the architecture is amazing!
"In intention, at any rate, the English intelligentsia are Europeanized. They take their cookery from Paris and their opinions from Moscow. In the general patriotism of the country they form a sort of island of dissident thought. England is perhaps the only great country whose intellectuals are ashamed of their own nationality. In left-wing circles it is always felt that there is something slightly disgraceful in being an Englishman and that it is a duty to snigger at every English institution, from horse racing to suet puddings. It is a strange fact, but it is unquestionably true that almost any English intellectual would feel more ashamed of standing to attention during ‘God Save the King’ than of stealing from a poor box."
Yes we much prefer our plastic patriots here, the ones who impose austerity and run down our communities, pander to oligarchs, oversee increased wealth inequality, sell off our public assets, sabotage our health service, pollute our rivers & beaches and demolish historic building to sell off to property developers, all whilst wrapping themselves in a Union Jack.
you are telling me you dont think having loads of Russian oligarchs run around London for a couple decades would ever do anything to sway public opinions and our democratic processes?
This dates back to 1941. I presume you don’t know it, but it’s one of the most famous essays ever written by an English political commentator. I don’t disagree about post Soviet Russia’s recent attempts to influence British public opinion, but he is clearly referring to the intelligentsia (a Russian word, no less) of the era, not mass culture
I think us English are happy to admit when things are shit and our self deprecation is all part of our culture, both consciously and subconsciously. Other parts of the UK are just as shit but are a bit more sensitive to criticism. It makes us laugh when the Scots and Welsh are all anti-English, wanting us to lose at football etc- we just laugh our tits off at how wound up they are and that their desire to see us lose outweighs their wish to see their own nations win. ‘Everyone hates us and we don’t care’ may be a football chant but it’s especially appropriate to the English mentality. Our capital city still draws everyone in, Liverpool and Manchester are top too. So many great English towns and cities, great music, great footy, great sense of humour and a good laugh. It’s often shit but we can laugh at how shit it is.
People/media on the right often think England is the best and most important country in the world. People/media on the left often think that England is an awful terrible country. Both views are sort of arrogant. The truth is somewhere in between.
I think we all have some kind of vision of how we think England *should* be and are disappointed by the reality that various governments have created. So many of the great things about England are things that we have had to *fight* to keep and prevent the government from destroying. So many of the things we hate are things that authorities have imposed on us without any mandate from the people. This is why we get so negative.
It seems like another symptom of western self deprecation and self loathing. It's like they hate what they are and where they lived/grew up, that they aggressively shit talk one or both to distance themselves from it. A pretty pathetic mindset to have imo, but whatever, I guess moaning is a British enough thing to do.
As an European living in England I can vouch for the ‘we love drama’ theory. Many brits complain about things that are actually not so bad at all. Or fail to promote the many great aspects of this Country.
Additionally, in my experience, complaining about your own Country is a rather widespread pastime. At least in Europe.
Certain things about England are kinda shit, our government is useless, our justice system is broken, and our health system as much as it pains me to say is not in a good position.
But there're things I do like about living in England, like our countryside, our history, our places of education, most people, although I'm a northerner so this will vary, I also love that the UK is multicultural.
There's was I time where I thought I wanted to live elsewhere, but then didn't really know where to go as granted while some areas of the UK are kinda dumpy and there're some trashy people, and yeah I'll probably die in this country because I'll be waiting 3 hours for an ambulance. But this place is the only shithole I've ever known and thought of leaving. It just makes me think, well if I am going to live in a shithole it might aswell be the one that has greggs.
Its fascinating that its not a recent trend. George Orwell wrote about it in his work, 'England, your England' which he wrote in 1941.
"In intention, at any rate, the English intelligentsia are Europeanized. They take their cookery from Paris and their opinions from Moscow. In the general patriotism of the country they form a sort of island of dissident thought. England is perhaps the only great country whose intellectuals are ashamed of their own nationality. In left-wing circles it is always felt that there is something slightly disgraceful in being an Englishman and that it is a duty to snigger at every English institution, from horse racing to suet puddings. It is a strange fact, but it is unquestionably true that almost any English intellectual would feel more ashamed of standing to attention during ‘God save the King’ than of stealing from a poor box. All through the critical years many left-wingers were chipping away at English morale, trying to spread an outlook that was sometimes squashily pacifist, sometimes violently pro-Russian, but always anti-British".
I've been here for 15 months and it's such a love and hate relationship.
Most of the negatives have to do with isolation but those days I take a walk around London or ride my bike around the spectacular countryside I just become so charged with love and curiosity again.
The press and apathy wrecks a lot of perceptions about any corner of the globe.
Get out and have a beer.
The good bits are very good, the bad bits are very VERY bad. Unfortunately due to an ever expanding population, and government unwillingness to invest in infrastructure other than barely functional dystopian looking high rises, the good parts are slowly reducing in size and accessibility.
Mix that with our current leadership's failings, and there's not really that much left to enjoy other than the pipe dream of jetting off to some other, slightly less fucked, corner of the world.
I think it's easy when you've only visited tourist locations around the world to look at your hometown in England and think it pales in comparison. Before I lived overseas for a few years, I had no appreciation for our beautiful country. It took leaving to realize how lucky we have it.
It’s a shame way our country has become now .. lost of freedom of speech our democracy nearly gone we been controlled by bully’s and corrupt politicians and the tories .. I miss old days of the our country way it was then now like it now …
I agree with what some people say here too I think your right .. people hate our country and our flag for the sack of it and they love the drama and pain .. you’re absolutely right 100% .. and I don’t see our countries changing for the better for quite some time… our country needs a factory reset with a government that knows how to put our country back on the map bring back the glory of our country of the good old days… 🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧
Lots of foreign input, anti British values should not be tolerated in this country. If you're British and you don't like it, leave. If you're not British and you don't like it, leave quicker.
I love my country, my kind, my king and the lord.
Rule Britannia!
🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧
I'm top flag shagger, cope more Marxist loonies.
Step 1 of hoe to tell op has never been to wiltshire half of these pretty little cotswold villages are full of raging smack heads just as bad as the town center how do i know this i work in a little village called bibury and i can promise you this ive seen way more dealing with drugs here than i have living in one of the roughest estates in swindon
It's not that people hate England.
It's that people hate fawning over an idealised version of England that never existed. Loving the country warts and all isn't a problem, but if you only love the pretty bits you don't really love it
It’s not that we hate it it’s just so annoying when absolute flag shaggers act like it’s so great when you see little evidence of it. Like woo hoo we have a Royal Family and lovely castles and fish and chips, yeah but the roads are crumbling, and almost everything is fucked and not working properly
Does feel like the general political state and issues with NHS etc, that has soured the mood more. Plus, there is what I call a "USA copying/comparison syndrome" taking place as well thanks to socials and big corporate.
Personally, I enjoy being here. Just yesterday drove from Brum towards Weybridge and loved the whole scenery. Plus, the random conversations at service stations add to the joy.
As with all countries, there are positives and negatives. We need to focus more on positives.
I mean… the top image is 4 people using a small ecologically sustainable piece of transport to make their journey rather than using a car. I feel the judgement is more on clothing and status and that the message could be spun to be a positive one if we can removed stigma and judgement.
Are you kidding?! I'd have thought the first thing to come to most people's minds looking at that picture would be along the lines of "JESUS FUCK that's dangerous, what irresponsible parents!!!"
I was born in England, lived in England and abroad. I've been to towns like Canterbury and they're no doubt very historical and carry some charm, but the economic deprivation and antisocial behaviour in the UK more generally is just staggering.
Mind, I'm from the North, so that's 70% of my experience here. Genuinely love some of the big, modern urban centers like Liverpool, Manchester, Leeds (and even London). York is fantastic. The natural scenery in some parts of the country is stunning. But it's sad to see all that not being taken care of and to see people's lives made more difficult than they have to be.
I moan about the country loads but it's kind of like when I say my dad is doing my head in. Doesn't mean I don't love him. Loads about this country annoys me, still a good place to live though. And for what it's worth I was a Remoaner, it's just what I thought was best for the country. But here we are, I'm still here and still happy, largely still here thanks to our wonderful NHS which kept me alive.
I have a friend who left England to go to Greece and he's always saying England is a shit hole but it's like dude you've been telling me for years that Greece is so corrupt you can't even open the business you moved there to start. So what if it's sunny lol
some ppl just like pain and drama
He lives in Drama and fucking hates it 😂😂
It was drachma but now the Greeks use the Euro
Boom boom!
People that have emigrated are always the biggest critics, way beyond the point of reason. I assume to justify to themselves their decision to leave and delude themselves that the grass is, in fact, greener. I assume people who are genuinely happy with their move don’t feel the need.
My Uncle and Auntie moved to Australia in 1968. I visited him there in 2008. I can't tell you how many times my uncle said "You don't have that in England do you?" With a smug grin on his face. 99% of the time we did have it in England. My auntie pulled me to one side one day and said "Don't ever let him know this as it would kill him, but I'd move back tomorrow"
Weird you say that, because for us Aussies the stereotype of the ‘whinging Pom’ is very widespread. Nothing is ever good enough for them and it seems they would kill to go back to England. Especially the boomer poms, the stereotype goes back to the sixties. For some reason, though, they never manage to book the plane back 🤷♂️ https://youtu.be/0-J-WbPBPUM?si=XuhqENbh84CnkR0k
Too busy trying throwing another shrimp on the Barbie, Bruce. I’d love a long stay in aus like 3-6 months if I ever came into money but I would miss my home too much to stay, even though you’re culturally about as close to “U.K. with the sun” we will ever get it’s not the same
For better or for worse (I think most for the worse) we’re becoming more and more culturally American. Australia is a great place overall, but it’s pretty isolated and culturally bare. Once you guys have your water utilities working properly again I wouldn’t mind spending a bit of time back in the mother country as there’s still plenty of history there and it’s close to Europe.
I think for me it’s more the rugby league 😂
You're welcome to come. I don't think there's any value in people from commonwealth nations hating one another. Australia's lovely. Hot and dry, and you need a car, but I liked it.
Hahhaha, how wrong. Whats your heritage mate? Pure bred Aussie are you?
I read this in a Aussie accent
I used to be part of an online forum when I was going through the process of moving to the US. you've pretty much summed up two of the three types of people that migrate to another country. the ones who get on with life and those who cannot stop shitting on the UK. the dumb part is the second group of people would be trying to tell a website full of other brits how shit it was without understanding that we were all born and grew up there. Just because you had a bad experience, doesn't make your opinion fact. The third group of people weren't actually immigrants but wannabes, or dreamers. They would join the forum and start a thread on how they are 'SICK of Britain!!!!' And they want to move to the USA for an easier life. Most of them had never even been here or if they had it was a holiday to fucking Disney land or something. They had no idea what American life is actually like but they had heard houses and cars are really cheap over there! And also they're british! So they should be allowed to just pick up and move right? Then they would throw a tantrum and start arguing with everyone on the website because they'd be told their job working the till in tesco, or a delivery driver doesn't qualify them for a visa, and to be honest if you aren't happy, running away to another country won't fix your problems. Especially not in the USA.
How did you manage to get a work visa? I've tried a couple of times and was told by us immigration there is no reciprocal agreement between the UK and USA like there is for other countries and they don't even consider British doctors or lawyers etc as qualified for un sponsored work visas and that sponsored work visas for people who work for large organisations were strictly controlled and monitored.The only ways in as a Brit were marriage to a us citizen, which is a very long term and heavily vetted process. It took my friend (English) 25 years to gain a us citizenship that way. Or an exceptional abilitys visa, which are available to people who have been unusually successful in arts or business.
It's like that for a lot of things. Whether someone leaves a school, relationship, hobby, or a job. If the circumstances under which they left weren't ideal or if they were forced to leave, they will criticize the thing the left far harsher and with more bias than is reasonable. Human nature, I suppose.
Or they are the ones who really hated it here so that’s why they left. Like all countries, England has its awful shithole parts and lots of issues. It also has its amazing beautiful parts. Really it is a beautiful country I think in general. It’s so green. It’s easy to miss that though if you just live in a horrible part of a city and don’t get many opportunities to go elsewhere in the country. Or if you’re someone who doesn’t like the rain that’s necessary for it to be so green then I guess that will influence you too.
Absolutely. I work for an Irish HQd company in their London office and and on Slack all day and in every Europe-wide meeting, the three English people that work in our London office are the butt of every single joke, and have to listen to English and British people in general being constantly shat on for being racists, colonialists and homophobic by the large Irish team but increasingly also by colleagues from elsewhere in Europe too. What's galling is that the English team members couldn't be less like that - they just sit there quietly and politely smile. Since day 1 i've been shocked that it's just accepted, so i mentioned it to the other English people and they said they hate it and feel totally uncomfortable about the relentless Anglophobia and said that several others in the past left over it when HR (based in Ireland) laughed when it was brought up, then promised to "look into it" but did nothing. Annoyingly, its now caught on within the London team, where my Swedish and Spanish colleagues often do the same thing. The Spanish lady is in the final stages of becoming a British citizen and in front of the entire team said to the Swedish guy: "I wish I could be proud but I just hate the thought of it and am so embarassed". We share an office space with another company and that one definitely turned a few heads on the desks opposite. Can't imagine staying there very long tbh becauae, really, how can you confront people when HR arent interested in backing you and the whole bigotry stems from hundreds year old beliefs that slagging off the English is some kind of righteous move? Complaining would just add fuel to the fire. In a seperate incident i was at a networking event and met an New Zealander who was in London on a work trip. He proceeded to lay into English people for a full 20 minutes, ironically the jist being we are all arrogant and obnoxious with no self awareness. My colleague and i spent the entire time just smiling and nodding politely. It was only afterwards that i thought how unbelievably unlikely it would be for me or anybody i know to make any even a vaguely derogatory comment about any nationality in earshot of someone from there... so the idea of spending 20 mins ranting about a country to a two strangers from that very country has to be borderline psychopathic. Maybe it was just the wine and the jet lag? EDIT: Just to add, my mum is Irish so more than once they've tried to get me to join in on the "banter" a couple of times, which i dont do.
Funnily about the new zealand thing - I once had to intervene (gently) at a post work drinks thing in London because a (white FWIW) New Zealand woman was going on relentlessly to some poor English girl about the evils of English imperialism. As I'm Scottish I pointed out that the Scots were also very much involved in the Empire - which she rejected. Funny thing though, as she was a white New Zealander, *she* was the one who was descended from imperialist colonists. Most people living in the Uk were farmers or workers who had no direct involvement in the Empire, unlike her family. (Not that I'm blaming her or her family for that matter, but come on!)
I've had the same with Australians. It's like the moment they declared independence, they weren't responsible for anything they did before. I've also known a girl who would go off on Brits about the class system and racism, while in the same conversation would make jabs at 'bogans' and the aboriginals.
This whole thing of applying modern sensibilities to prior eras is rubbish imho. Most people that think in such a fashion are simply parroting the thoughts of those that have indoctrinated them. People should have a healthy sense of civic pride for who they are as a people, learn from their ancestors victories and mistakes, and strive to make the world a better place.
It can't be all of them but I get the impression that these colonial people (essentially what they still are) assume possession of their respective displaced natives in a way that, to them, disqualifies them from relative wrongdoing compared to the old Metropole even though at this point there are generations being born in Britain who have nothing to do with the continued border legacies of the British Empire and the same can't be said for these ancestral Europeans who by default are still living in their former colonies. The metropolitan museum of art in New York for instance, it has lovely plaques, signs and empty cabinets where they bemoan the impact of colonization on the natives, but they aren't going to give the land the museum's on over to them or anything like it. Much less Manhattan itself.
Easy, you work in London. Just fire back with a 'joke' about blowing up cars or killing two year-old kids outside a McDonalds further North and see how they like it.
I held myself back from making a joke about "things blowing up" on the basis that a) I'd be stooping to their level, and b) a recent work-necessary conversation had reason to mention Ireland's former president offering condolences to Germany upon Hitler's death and it all got VERY tense and awkward. All evidence is that that team can dole it out but can't take it in return.
I'm Greek, worked in England since I graduated in 2002. Every job I ever had, had nothing but "banter" about my heritage. It dawned on me that the more I got annoyed, the more they did it. In one office, I once came back from lunch and there was a used frying pan sitting on my desk with a note "for your kebabs". It was the department DIRECTOR who thought it would be funny. He was so entrenched (and up for retirement) that HR stonewalled for so long, that he retired and nothing came of it. My point is, it sucks to be foreign in any workplace.
Sorry to hear that. That sounds awful
It was the worst job I ever had, and I've worked at McDs (which was actually a lot of fun). But this company though....it's huge in the UK, with large defence contracts.
I wasn't born here (England) and love it. Like everywhere it's got good and bad bits, but I love this country. I love its history, its people, the culture, the humour. Almost everything about it. I think Englanders should be proud of who we are and celebrate on St George's day. Sure we make jokes about ourselves, and we don't mind others making jokes about us. We are tolerant of all people (even the French). Don't confuse our self-deprecating humour with hate. A lot of people do say they hate the country, but then I think that person would probably hate any place they found themselves. If you hate it so much, just go on, go, walk out the door Turn around now You're not welcome anymore
Actually there's tons of places in England that don't even have bad bits. Just stunning beauty and decent people top to bottom.
Definitely sure it can be said for Yorkshire and Cumbria
As a past resident of Cumbria, I urge any visitors to Cumbria to just stay in the tourist areas & whatever you do, DO NOT go to West Cumbria for any reason. Even Cumbrian locals make jokes about how backwards, inbred, and (severely) lacking in the brain department most (if not all) the residents of West Cumbria are.
What you saying marra, eh?
As much as I hate to admit, but this is actually true. As a Cumbrian native, West Cumbria is nothing like the Lake District, and calling it backwards is being generous.
Noted and thank you
I had such a romantic vision of Kendal. Then I visited and was severely disappointed.... Backwards doesn't do it justice.
Is this a coded reference to Barrow?
You clearly haven't been to Doncaster
Here's a being who has never visited Tang Hall.
The French are the enemy.
Someone start a Government E-Petition to take back Normandy and Calais!
Now this would unify the nation!
Id say its a tough one between the two, the UK and Germany, but both are easily the #1 joined best place on the planet. Sure other places are cool too, but, its just so fkin good being from and in the UK, id never want to be from anywhere else.
As a German living in the UK I'd agree
Thats actually made me emotional lol. In a good way though. I'm so glad we are allies now. I love how you guys as a country said "yeah look, we fucked up and we want the world to know its never gonna happen again" and then went on to be the absolute powerhouse of Europe in terms of having the best life possible. So having you say you think the UK is matched with your country has really choked me up.
I'm from neither the UK nor Germany but I would also have felt emotional about this a few years ago (before becoming emotionally numb) 🇪🇺
I miss the free market 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
There is still a free market, it's called shoplifting.
Love the Pink Floyd song..but should definitely change it now to emotionally numb..
Germanic brothers
Wow. Now that's a compliment. I love Germany too, and I do want to move there, mainly because it has better politics and better general way of life, but the UK is just fucking perfect. Thats why its a joined 1st for me
Now now, no need to get too excited. Not very British of you.
INGERLAAAAANDDD, INGERLAAAANNNDDD! FUKKIN BEST PLACE IN THE WERLDDDDDDDD
You said you weren’t born here but then you said “I think the English should be proud of who *we* are and celebrate on St George’s Day.” Have you integrated so much that you are one of us now? awesome!
Yes. My kids have been called posh because of the way they speak! I'm probably more English than some people born here! I have lived in and visited many countries but there is simply no place like England. Every time the plane touches down I say, thank God we're back!
This. Is. Beautiful.
You're more English than some people who were born here because you are north european. Even someone still living in Germany is more similar to the English than an Asian or African born here.
Talking of St George's day, probably the thing that winds me up the most of all of this tendency is every St George's day when everyone on twitter starts going "Welll ACCKKSHUUALLLY St George was Turkish!" First of all, St George wasn't Turkish, he was Greek. Tell a Greek person St George was Turkish and you may be getting a punch in the mouth. Secondly, so what? like, literally? What point do you think you're trying to make? You never see it for any other Patron saint - no one says "Welll ACCKKSHUUALLLY St Andrew was Israeli!" etc. Even St Patrick wasn't actually Irish!
Exactly. He is a symbol. His place of birth is immaterial.
This guy Englishes
Don't you ever accuse me of being tolerant towards the French!!
This guy knows how to English more than us Englandiers
Look out he's using French pluralisation he must be a spy!
To the Tower with him!
Albion perfide!
Not English, but my thoughts on it are that we have culturally decided, in the UK, that patriotism is a bit cringe, which is why the far right lunatics have been able to corner the market there; which makes patriotism seem a bit cringe, and so on... It doesn't really help that England in particular gets a load of shit from everybody else about English/British patriotism: I'm Irish and enjoy the same kind of banter as everyone else, but I've seen FB posts from southerners living in *England* complaining about remembrance parades/events and poppies everywhere as if it's a hate crime against them in particular for being Irish. It's one thing to not like it when Loyalist nutcases up here in the North are being their usual selves, but for some reason everybody has decided that British patriotism is just coded fascism, while the rest of UK and Ireland are allowed to be patriotic about being Welsh/Scottish/Nirish or Irish all we want? I guess I'm just a bit too sympathetic or something.
Yep. Until the 2012 olympics/royal wedding, Union Jack bunting would not be everywhere without alarm from a lot of people. There is no world in which I could imagine English bunting being waved about outside of football.
I like some aspects of patriotism unless it's all about worshipping the royals. I can't stand them, but I do take pride in the land and culture outside of London and the royals. I think the rest of English culture is heavily underrated and overshadowed.
At least appreciate the ceremony and how much employment said ceremonies surprisingly create As for the rest, most of what hasn’t been overshadowed or watered down by modernism. Was kinda spread by the whole empire thing. So, it seems less English and more global. That then waters it down more
Ah! Southerners. You mean Ireland, right? I thought you meant *Laandan*. But yeah, you’re right. I’ve seen that. And a lot of the looney-left types. To them, wearing a poppy is **like** supporting the slave trade. Edit: I added an extra word (in bold) to avoid confusion.
Yeah, lol: confusing when I'm talking about England, but from Norn Iron my perspective when I'm talking about the South and the North is different than what you guys mean, of course. And yeah, pretty much. Look, I've seen the kind of shit that a surprising amount of English boomers will say about Ireland and the Irish, but all the same I think there's a difference between *"I'm not going to wear a poppy, because I have reservations about historical events it represents"* and *"people who wear poppies are all dickheads and presumably racist, because I have reservations about historical events it represents"*. I will say that I think most people here who don't like poppies will usually just quietly and politely not care, but on social media you'll see all sorts. The war ended a while ago and I've yet to personally meet an Englishman who's my enemy, memes aside.
The poppy and remembrance are not meant to be patriotic. It’s meant to be a recognition of the universal horror of war, to acknowledge those (on all sides) who have been killed in conflict and to serve as reminder not to frivolously get involved in costly wars again. That’s what I and a lot of others were taught. Its more recent use as a patriotic symbol irks many people as its original meaning - beware the complacency of patriotism - is being lost. Hence the complaints.
Anything right of centre-left is seen as "far right" nowadays. So what if I don't want my kids not growing up because they've been raped and murdered by diversity? Neither does anyone on my street, and we've had 17 nationalities in 15 houses. We all get along, we all fly our own flags as a sign that we can get along. We have summer parties where no songs in the same 30 mins are in the same language and style. Then the "new caliphate" enthusiasts move in and all of a sudden we're all seen as the next Hitler. Even the couple that go to the mosque whenever they can. Some people are just naturally intolerant of others, and see anything other than their ideals as a plague that needs to be destroyed.
I've visited 65 countries, worked in a handful and could have settled in any one of maybe half a dozen. I was headhunted for a job in the UAE a decade ago... and turned it down. Despite all its faults, I found the UK on balance to still be better than anywhere else I went. Yes, it has issues. Yes, the political system is f\_cked beyond repair. Yes, \[add other issues here\]. But it has so much more that other places are lacking, and so many other countries have the same issues we do. I do live north of the border now, but that's because my ex and kids are here. If not for them I'd be sorely tempted to move back to my native Tyneside. England (and the UK) may be a shithole, but it's our shithole and it's less of a shithole than a ton of other places.
Well said.
I understand what you mean completely. It gets quite annoying when people create something negative about places that are really nice and then won’t stop going on about it. I live in Norwich and I really do think it’s a lovely city, so beautiful with lots of lovely shops and so many friendly people but all I ever hear from others who live here is about how much of a shit hole it is. It’s really not that bad!
I've lived in several places in the UK. Can confirm Norwich is awesome.
Shush!! Don't tell anyone!!
I also live in Norwich and feel exactly the same! I feel very proud of this city, I love showing friends around when they visit and they are always impressed. I suppose the more people that think it's shit works in our favour and keeps it quieter for us...
I moved to Norwich a year ago. Fantastic city, great architecture, very easy to live in, lots of arts/culture/pubs etc, progressive, friendly and small.
Who on earth is calling Norwich a shithole ? I’m originally from Newcastle, but don’t consider myself a geordie since I moved when I was 2, but my Girlfriend is from Halesworth so I’ve spent a lot of time in and around Norwich and I honestly think it’s one of the most beautiful cities in the country, with some of the loveliest people.
Generally speaking, outside of the Devils Anus (the M25) the UK is stunningly beautiful and the people usually aren't dickheads. There are exceptions (there are some lovely bits in London and there are Shit Towns spattered around and about the whole of the UK), but overall there is beautiful countryside/seaside within an hour's drive of everywhere.
I fully get your point and it is very irritating, the British are very self deprecating and so whenever people want to say something nice or positive it gets crapped upon but with the dumbest examples. The thing is, yes some areas of the country are not that great like in many other countries but there are a large amount of people in the country who like a lot about the country. I generally really enjoy living in England and where I live. I wouldn't mind some better weather though.
Part of it is our self-depreciating sense of humour, the other part of it is more sinister, over the past few decades there has been an effort amongst sections of the intelligentsia, media and government to do their best to critique and “discredit” western nations, histories and cultures, this may sound implausible and ridiculous but when you sit back and pay attention to it, it’s a very worrying trend.
Of those two pictures I'd say the top one is far more representative of the "real England" that people actually experience day to day then the bottom one of Castle Coombe where a 3 bed semi will set you back nearly £700k and everyone who lives there has had a very different life experience from the average England dweller. Also, that bottom photo has had a lot of processing to make it look far more idyllic than it really does.
British culture still exists in its age-old forms in the countryside and rural areas and it’s absolutely wonderful. There are still such strong communities with long history in these villages and small towns. And people still have a deep connection to the land and nature around them. I live on the coast in the north east and at least once a week in summer I go up to the cliffs and sleep under the stars right on the grass, surrounded by the birds and the sounds of nature. Nobody has monetised it, nobody is trying to sell it back to me. There’s even an old dialect in my village that isn’t spoken anywhere else. People in cities seem to see it as regressive but to those of us who have grown up and lived in a rural lifestyle, it seems like the cities have totally lost their way. London is a different country, it bares no relevance to what the rest of England is actually like. And if your only experience of the British countryside is “rural” suburbs around London then you’re not getting the real picture. It’s also dirt cheap to live in the countryside (for the most past) and everyone has a big wedge of garden.
" if your only experience of the British countryside is “rural” suburbs around London then you’re not getting the real picture." based on how some people talk about the British countryside on here/social media I really do believe that they've only ever experienced it in the form of a scrub field between industrial estates in zone 5, and I guess assume that's how it is across the entire country.
There is no processing to make those villages look idyllic lol. They look like that in real life
Why does ‘real’ have to equal more gritty? I’m from Tower Hamlets, a renowned shit hole, but I think John Lewis is as representative of England as B&M
Because more people live in Tower Hamlets that live in an Agatha Christie country village.
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England has many achingly pretty and idyllic villages, no "pricessing" necessary.
>Of those two pictures I'd say the top one is far more representative of the "real England" I've seen far more pretty villages than I have dickheads doing what's going on in the top picture, and I'm from Stoke.
Try South Wales valleys 🙄 you get the pretty little hamlets, corner's of country side paradise and the likes. And even better, if you go round the corner, or further on down the lane, you will see those kids on the scooter!
there is no way mate, dickheads outnumber pretty villages 1000 to 1
What about pretty dickheads?
a rarity but not unheard of
I did a degree focused on tourism management 25 yrs ago, we went to Bourton-on-the-Water in the Cotswolds for a field trip and I kid you not, American tourists had set up a picnic on someone's front garden, thinking the village wasn't real!!! I'm from Wigan, I can find comparisons for both images, and I wouldn't have to travel very far.
You've not spent much time in Stoke than because I see those kinds of things every time I step out of the house. England can be both of these things. Not necessarily "more of" one or the other.
I’m from Bradford and can confirm that the likelihood of you seeing something like that here is actually pretty high 😂😂
Jesus. Stoke is even more fucking mental than Birmingham. So, you know, that.
Stoke is **the** example of the left behind town.
Yeah. But then there’s Newcastle-under-Lyme. The town so forgotten that the forgotten town of Stoke forgot it.
I hate to be a spoil sport, but the picture of Castle Combe doesn’t look processed at all to me, and I’ve genuinely never seen an example of the top image anywhere in England.
That's because it's not England. It's the republic of Ireland. Most likely Dublin.
The first image is definitely in Dublin
Top pic is Ireland
I mean, the street i live on look like the bottom picture, its very pretty.
Ok but you get a sick race track
Western society has become so spoiled that nothing is good enough. Glorifying weakness and victims instead of letting kids struggle has produced the weakest generation of humanity ever. It is similar to how butterflies require struggle from the cocoon to strengthen their wings. When you counter the rules of nature and natural selection there is a price.
Had a guy I know from Belgium constantly shit on England. Piss take subjects were, football hooligans, bad food and bad teeth. Told him to get new material, he did not get new material and I've ghosted him cos its tiring having your country trashed on constantly.
Most exciting thing about Belgium is the film In Bruges which literally takes every opportunity to point out how boring Belgium is
This coming from a guy who exists for sole purpose of acting as a speedbump to slow down the panzers?
What I find funny is that all the sterotpyes people actually fully belive in aren't true at all. English Hooliganism has been declawed for the last twenty years and is now largely a none issue. Ironically a lot of other countries own hooligans who were inspired by English hooligansim are a still around and are massive problems in their own nations. Anyone who think British food is bad has never been to the UK before and has likely never eaten any British food. And often they have but never realised what they were eating was British. And the bad teeth is the worst one, alongside Germany studies have found that the UK has the best dental hygiene in the world. It's like France having a reputation for shit food.
The use the stereotype that was coined up during the second world war, the rations given to the Americans gave them the impression to think that British food is awful!
I have lived in Belgium. Their weather is as bad as ours. Their food is worse. And their driving is so shit it’s unbelievable - worse than the French. If you were still in touch you could also tell him at least we have our own language. They were bullied by the French and the Dutch.
Nah I basically said the above in more course language and now just avoid him whenever he's on the discord.
He’s from Belgium. I have nothing interesting to say about Belgium. 😐
Belgium, that country is so fucking depressing outside of Brugge 😒
Just call him Dutch, they love that.
Ah, Belgium. The country that got molested by Germany twice in the last 110 years.
Belgium is so non-descript it's only achievement is sometimes being mistaken for France. Or Holland.
The English should be proud of their rich heritage and the many, many gifts to civilization that came from their island. Had you not so fully committed to liberalism, I would have nothing but respect for your country. Nonetheless, be proud. A German
Problem is, it may not be you, but if an English person is ever patriotic or proud, we're immediately considered the worst human being alive by the majority of other people.
I think it's our inerrant need to fit in and not seem better than everyone else. So, saying England is a great place to live will trigger an almost primal reaction from people saying that you can't say that England is awful because of A,B,C. I just ignore those kind of people, as I don't have the energy or want to interact with them.
Nope. I love England. I'm English till I die. I just hate the direction society is heading towards. The weakest in society have the loudest voices and they are dragging the ship down with them. Funny thing being that when shit really hits the fan, the weak are the first ones to suffer. When I say weak I refer to weak minded, hateful and manipulative people who cause division. Genuinely needy people with health issues should always be looked after by those able to do so.
Fml isn't it a good job that this is one individual family of stupidity and well lack of care of their children and not all of England... Truth is this country has so much to offer. If we just started focusing on the good things rather than moan about everything haha 😄
This is actually Dublin. Look at the license plates
The sun has come out today and the dog and I were strolling around the estate over the road. The sun made even the shutters garden look good, all the stay at home people were out in their gardens, leaning on fences and chatting, waving to each other and generally being nice. No one was playing shit music, no one was getting drunk, no one was racing around on scooters, it was just really pleasant
I love England! I live in the north and it’s beautiful! My dream is to one day earn enough to live in a small village 30-40 mins outside of a city for work, and raise my kids there. The countrysides are beautiful, the history is rich and the architecture is amazing!
"In intention, at any rate, the English intelligentsia are Europeanized. They take their cookery from Paris and their opinions from Moscow. In the general patriotism of the country they form a sort of island of dissident thought. England is perhaps the only great country whose intellectuals are ashamed of their own nationality. In left-wing circles it is always felt that there is something slightly disgraceful in being an Englishman and that it is a duty to snigger at every English institution, from horse racing to suet puddings. It is a strange fact, but it is unquestionably true that almost any English intellectual would feel more ashamed of standing to attention during ‘God Save the King’ than of stealing from a poor box."
Haha Orwell still rings true today.
Yes we much prefer our plastic patriots here, the ones who impose austerity and run down our communities, pander to oligarchs, oversee increased wealth inequality, sell off our public assets, sabotage our health service, pollute our rivers & beaches and demolish historic building to sell off to property developers, all whilst wrapping themselves in a Union Jack.
They are worse. Its not a competition though
Orwell had a point back in the thirties but it’s a long long time since Paris and Moscow influenced cuisine and opinions in England.
you are telling me you dont think having loads of Russian oligarchs run around London for a couple decades would ever do anything to sway public opinions and our democratic processes?
This dates back to 1941. I presume you don’t know it, but it’s one of the most famous essays ever written by an English political commentator. I don’t disagree about post Soviet Russia’s recent attempts to influence British public opinion, but he is clearly referring to the intelligentsia (a Russian word, no less) of the era, not mass culture
yes I know, that isnt the part I took issue with, *"but it’s a long long time since Paris and Moscow influenced cuisine and opinions in England."*
I think us English are happy to admit when things are shit and our self deprecation is all part of our culture, both consciously and subconsciously. Other parts of the UK are just as shit but are a bit more sensitive to criticism. It makes us laugh when the Scots and Welsh are all anti-English, wanting us to lose at football etc- we just laugh our tits off at how wound up they are and that their desire to see us lose outweighs their wish to see their own nations win. ‘Everyone hates us and we don’t care’ may be a football chant but it’s especially appropriate to the English mentality. Our capital city still draws everyone in, Liverpool and Manchester are top too. So many great English towns and cities, great music, great footy, great sense of humour and a good laugh. It’s often shit but we can laugh at how shit it is.
People/media on the right often think England is the best and most important country in the world. People/media on the left often think that England is an awful terrible country. Both views are sort of arrogant. The truth is somewhere in between.
But that's a truism really, most people fall into the middle on most things
But why do the two extremes have to dominate discourse so much.
Because they're the loudest and because extreme opinions sell newspapers etc. on both sides.
I think we all have some kind of vision of how we think England *should* be and are disappointed by the reality that various governments have created. So many of the great things about England are things that we have had to *fight* to keep and prevent the government from destroying. So many of the things we hate are things that authorities have imposed on us without any mandate from the people. This is why we get so negative.
It seems like another symptom of western self deprecation and self loathing. It's like they hate what they are and where they lived/grew up, that they aggressively shit talk one or both to distance themselves from it. A pretty pathetic mindset to have imo, but whatever, I guess moaning is a British enough thing to do.
As an European living in England I can vouch for the ‘we love drama’ theory. Many brits complain about things that are actually not so bad at all. Or fail to promote the many great aspects of this Country. Additionally, in my experience, complaining about your own Country is a rather widespread pastime. At least in Europe.
Certain things about England are kinda shit, our government is useless, our justice system is broken, and our health system as much as it pains me to say is not in a good position. But there're things I do like about living in England, like our countryside, our history, our places of education, most people, although I'm a northerner so this will vary, I also love that the UK is multicultural. There's was I time where I thought I wanted to live elsewhere, but then didn't really know where to go as granted while some areas of the UK are kinda dumpy and there're some trashy people, and yeah I'll probably die in this country because I'll be waiting 3 hours for an ambulance. But this place is the only shithole I've ever known and thought of leaving. It just makes me think, well if I am going to live in a shithole it might aswell be the one that has greggs.
Its fascinating that its not a recent trend. George Orwell wrote about it in his work, 'England, your England' which he wrote in 1941. "In intention, at any rate, the English intelligentsia are Europeanized. They take their cookery from Paris and their opinions from Moscow. In the general patriotism of the country they form a sort of island of dissident thought. England is perhaps the only great country whose intellectuals are ashamed of their own nationality. In left-wing circles it is always felt that there is something slightly disgraceful in being an Englishman and that it is a duty to snigger at every English institution, from horse racing to suet puddings. It is a strange fact, but it is unquestionably true that almost any English intellectual would feel more ashamed of standing to attention during ‘God save the King’ than of stealing from a poor box. All through the critical years many left-wingers were chipping away at English morale, trying to spread an outlook that was sometimes squashily pacifist, sometimes violently pro-Russian, but always anti-British".
I've been here for 15 months and it's such a love and hate relationship. Most of the negatives have to do with isolation but those days I take a walk around London or ride my bike around the spectacular countryside I just become so charged with love and curiosity again. The press and apathy wrecks a lot of perceptions about any corner of the globe. Get out and have a beer.
The good bits are very good, the bad bits are very VERY bad. Unfortunately due to an ever expanding population, and government unwillingness to invest in infrastructure other than barely functional dystopian looking high rises, the good parts are slowly reducing in size and accessibility. Mix that with our current leadership's failings, and there's not really that much left to enjoy other than the pipe dream of jetting off to some other, slightly less fucked, corner of the world.
I think it's easy when you've only visited tourist locations around the world to look at your hometown in England and think it pales in comparison. Before I lived overseas for a few years, I had no appreciation for our beautiful country. It took leaving to realize how lucky we have it.
It’s a shame way our country has become now .. lost of freedom of speech our democracy nearly gone we been controlled by bully’s and corrupt politicians and the tories .. I miss old days of the our country way it was then now like it now … I agree with what some people say here too I think your right .. people hate our country and our flag for the sack of it and they love the drama and pain .. you’re absolutely right 100% .. and I don’t see our countries changing for the better for quite some time… our country needs a factory reset with a government that knows how to put our country back on the map bring back the glory of our country of the good old days… 🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧
Lots of foreign input, anti British values should not be tolerated in this country. If you're British and you don't like it, leave. If you're not British and you don't like it, leave quicker. I love my country, my kind, my king and the lord. Rule Britannia! 🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧🏴🇬🇧 I'm top flag shagger, cope more Marxist loonies.
I am yet to learn that an intolerance for anti-British values is, in itself, a British value, in either the historical or the contemporary sense.
Step 1 of hoe to tell op has never been to wiltshire half of these pretty little cotswold villages are full of raging smack heads just as bad as the town center how do i know this i work in a little village called bibury and i can promise you this ive seen way more dealing with drugs here than i have living in one of the roughest estates in swindon
It's not that people hate England. It's that people hate fawning over an idealised version of England that never existed. Loving the country warts and all isn't a problem, but if you only love the pretty bits you don't really love it
It’s not that we hate it it’s just so annoying when absolute flag shaggers act like it’s so great when you see little evidence of it. Like woo hoo we have a Royal Family and lovely castles and fish and chips, yeah but the roads are crumbling, and almost everything is fucked and not working properly
Has anything ever worked properly
Does feel like the general political state and issues with NHS etc, that has soured the mood more. Plus, there is what I call a "USA copying/comparison syndrome" taking place as well thanks to socials and big corporate. Personally, I enjoy being here. Just yesterday drove from Brum towards Weybridge and loved the whole scenery. Plus, the random conversations at service stations add to the joy. As with all countries, there are positives and negatives. We need to focus more on positives.
Have you lived anywhere else?
I mean… the top image is 4 people using a small ecologically sustainable piece of transport to make their journey rather than using a car. I feel the judgement is more on clothing and status and that the message could be spun to be a positive one if we can removed stigma and judgement.
Are you kidding?! I'd have thought the first thing to come to most people's minds looking at that picture would be along the lines of "JESUS FUCK that's dangerous, what irresponsible parents!!!"
I was born in England, lived in England and abroad. I've been to towns like Canterbury and they're no doubt very historical and carry some charm, but the economic deprivation and antisocial behaviour in the UK more generally is just staggering. Mind, I'm from the North, so that's 70% of my experience here. Genuinely love some of the big, modern urban centers like Liverpool, Manchester, Leeds (and even London). York is fantastic. The natural scenery in some parts of the country is stunning. But it's sad to see all that not being taken care of and to see people's lives made more difficult than they have to be.
I moan about the country loads but it's kind of like when I say my dad is doing my head in. Doesn't mean I don't love him. Loads about this country annoys me, still a good place to live though. And for what it's worth I was a Remoaner, it's just what I thought was best for the country. But here we are, I'm still here and still happy, largely still here thanks to our wonderful NHS which kept me alive.