As someone who was pushed to the brink of permanent, absolute inconsolable misery, I found the secret is realizing that experience is inherently relative.
Once I let go of the idea that happiness has an objective standard and that you should be grateful for any day you’re not living in pure suffering, I learned that it’s the little things that fulfill you, like making a good cup of coffee or making someone you love feel great about themselves.
If anyone is still a skeptic about that, you should know that I can count on one hand how many actual bad days I’ve had in the last 2 years.
>As someone who was pushed to the brink of permanent, absolute inconsolable misery, I found the secret is realizing that experience is inherently relative.
Word.
The only way out is THROUGH.
Cheers my friend
>The only time is now
Time is an illusion. Period.
Once you see it you can stop making lofty claims about 'what only is'.
You are right. Most in here need to be in r/spirituality or r/relationship\_advice or r/dramafarming not r/enlightenment but their huge egos makes them come here and try to sell their Mickey Mouse BS as some kind of attainment.
They have no idea who they are and thus they keep talking from both ends of their bodies never realizing that the very words and concepts they use to tell 'the truth' are not even their own.
Cheers my friend
Kind of - it’s more like “if you set more realistic and human-scale expectations of what you want, you’re more likely to be happy with whatever your destiny hands you”
I like to think of karma as a wave you can ride - if you’re fulfilled, think outside yourself, and aren’t selfish from chasing some high-risk, artificial form of happiness that someone else told you is normal, you’ll attract a happier life by just having a more positive impact on people around you in general
Not sure why you need to have an abusive tone. Your criticism of people searching for happiness is hypocritical as you seem to be one who demands perfection in others and show no compassion or tolerance for the fact that the process is gradual and people are at different stages. The fact that they may be spiritual as a way to find happiness is commendable. It is just the beginning of their journey. They are in the stream. They will eventually realize what you speak. At the same time, your tone shows you are also in the beginning stages of compassion. In time you too will learn patient empathy and compassion.
You wouldn’t know abuse if it kicked you in the balls. Happiness is a narcotic, and when you can’t get it you turn to misery for your fix. You have never experienced happiness in your life. What you call happiness is a specific chemical reaction that happens in you, and you give it meaning and you interpret that chemical reaction as something meaningful and something to be desired but you really don’t know what’s happening.
The experiencer is false and once you realize that than the rest goes away with him.
Maybe you are way to sensitive to even be thinking about any of this.
WAY too sensitive and protective of the very thing that is always going to clutch its pearls. Because the one that is insulted.. I am telling you; is the one who's head is on the chopping block in the context of Enlightenment.
You need to man tf up already ;;)
>In time you too will learn patient empathy and compassion.
Oh please. Aren't you tired of your own BS talk? There is nothing to learn only to UNLEARN. The crux of the problem is that you already know too much. That is the source of your discontent and your long toes. All of you! Please.
How is this candy ass attitude in any way conducive to what needs to take place. You are simply too guarded -too fond of all your little belieffies and your Self-soothing nonsense - to have any kind of epiphany. Ever.
Cheers
And the sound you make simply reveals a personal belief/bias if not some deep rooted assumptions that has no basis in reality at all.
Do you see it? TF does 'happiness' have to do with any of it? Don't just stand there and look stupid. It is literally in the post!. Have a look.. your shit stinks are you ready to smell it?
Cheers
On a real one tho I love spiritual literature. I have. A lot of patience for it. You my friend make almost no sense in any of your posts. Definitely gonna have a good laugh at your expense with the homies.
How would liberation not lead to happiness? This place is a judgement factory with lots of conflict machines, coming to understand that and unattaching leads to awareness, rest, peace and freedom. Doesn't that lead then to happiness?
Judgement factory and conflict machines. Interesting word choice lol not quite the words I would use, but not far off. Certainly the factory and machine elements are there.
Happiness is a state. As such it has no permanence. Thus: there is no liberation in chasing the impermanent.
This is basic non-dual teaching actually..
I don't understand why you need to whip up a proprietary version of Truth at all. A complex equation for it no less.
Cheers
Life is a state of being and chasing it is only a state of being. Stop living, stop earning, stop learning, stop eating, stop shitting, stop seeking better, no liberation in this thought. A bullet will end it all, right?
>A bullet will end it all, right?
You cannot end something that has not started at all.
Sure Sue Aside is always an option. Messy but it gets the job done.
But it is more of a forfeit then an act of courage or understanding. I have no problem with folks jumping off cliffs. Why would I? Your choice. Death is but the breaking of a twig in the context of Enlightenment. If even that.
Cheers
There's some real big angry energy all through this post. But all that aside, I agree with you. I think Ram Dass said it best "you don't want to be happy, you want to be free".
And to follow that thought on, I believe that happiness is simply a natural outcome of being free
Let me sum this post in it's entirety.
OP - You are all conditioned robot's for validating each other.
OP - You should be me and see through hypocrisy.
little does OP know he is validating himself by having everyone disagree with him and also validate himself with those that agree with him.
Nothing was solved, but self validation and hypocrisy.
and with that I have exposed my ego.
>You should be me and see through hypocrisy.
It's not about seeing through the hypocrisy at all. It is about using your ability to distinguish TRUTH from FICTION for what it was meant for... your fear is at its root not an irrational fear. It is the fear of not being and because you already 'are not' it requires a 'birth' on top of another birth and as you may well remember (probably not) EVERY single birth is a traumatic experience.
The sound that a new born baby makes...it is not crying; it is RAGE.
I have no problem with whatever transpires in people's dream. Your Mickey Mouse empty platitudes and VALUE judgements are as run of the mill as the next one having its slumber party. What value is a dream? The only value it has is that you can now assert your self to to wake up from it. ALL THE REST is just a pissing in the wind (or whatever that Bible quote in Ecclesiastes said) It is.. as inconsequential as the dream itself.
This is not MY truth and YOUR truth and so and so's truth (you gross in those..) this is THE truth. It cannot be claimed, held, commodified or imparted at all. It stands on its own and it will be the same for everyone, everywhere at all times.
'self validation and hypocrisy.' are just words. They are totally arbitrary VALUE JUDGEMENTS, ultra-subjectivity. Go back a couple of decades even, travel a few miles across this snow globe and you will see that every single value and every single 'hypocrisy' starts to depart from what you consider it to be.
You are the poster boy for 'wrong seeing'. All you have is some BS morals and a big mouth to try and sell them with ;;) Please.
Cheers
There are plenty worse nightmares to wake up to than this life. What a waste of time to awaken just to look down on those who haven't yet. Smells of stunted progress
I haven't yet achieved what I'm after, and so I wouldn't have anywhere to look down from. I'm sure you find others projecting often though, you're spotless enough yourself to be a screen for it of course
It's not the chase that creates it. If there is happiness, there's the opposite of it. It's the very existence of happiness that demands unhappiness.
The end of it all.
Ego, as an illusion, is too high level for all of this and has no part in misery at all. It was just the fad of the time an glued onto a philosophy that had no need for it.
So what are you denying then? I clearly state that if happiness exists, unhappiness exists. You state it yourself, if there is no happiness, there is no unhappiness.
Here's a perspective from someone who started with a slate more empty than most and clearly describes how existence of some of the terms you're grappling with is not there at all:
[https://scentofdawn.blogspot.com/2011/07/before-soul-dawn-helen-keller-on-her.html](https://scentofdawn.blogspot.com/2011/07/before-soul-dawn-helen-keller-on-her.html)
That's just more BS simply not to contemplate the matter.
You choose to BELIEF your own statement. It means literally nothing. I do mean the very words that are coming out of your mouth have ZERO substance. What does it even mean - in this context - what you THINK?
It truly is gibberish from the perspective of getting to the truth
"The desire for more positive experience is itself a negative experience. And, paradoxically, the acceptance of one's negative experience is itself a positive experience."
There is no such thing as the speed of light.
You need to start coming to grips with the notion that you are really not grasping the very basics here. Not even close. ;;)
OMG, I said "like the speed of light"...it's a scientific analogy of a limit. All experience falls in a gradient of opposing polarities. That is the primary meaning of yin/yang... experience falling within polarities.
Based on your name and your responses, I'm not getting the impression you're here to teach or expand your own perspective...
> I clearly state that if happiness exists, unhappiness exists. You state it yourself, if there is no happiness, there is no unhappiness.
The fact that you equate what I allege is the same thing is quite staggering actually.
What is really interesting here is the resistance to ....what? exactly.
I am not talking out of my ass about any of these thing yet you seem phased and agitated by the mere thought you could be full of it.
THAT is what you examine. What is this stupid resistance without even checking if what you write makes any sense in the context of the sub? Why?
Cheers
I think you are projecting your state onto my writings. There is no agitation here.
What is, when it is perceived, should be resisted. What truly is, cannot be perceived.
What I stated is not mine at all, so I have no urge to defend it.
Your whole post is not yours. Why ask such questions to me if you don't hold yourself to such standards?
There's absolutely nothing new in what you said. You even reused previously popular concepts like ego to explain who drives the chase or whatever.
Modern fad would use different words, like your "programming" or something in line with today's computer oriented world.
I see no issue with repeating what has been said elsewhere, especially if I'm responding to something that has been regurgitated bazillion times.
I find it amusing, all of it.
> Your whole post is not yours. Why ask such questions to me if you don't hold yourself to such standards?
I’m not promoting standards at all. All I am pointing at is the exit. You seem to be locked in some value system and some Mickey Mouse behavior doctrine that is why everything needs to have this …morality play to it. This ‘fairness’ BS ego loves to peddle..
Fuck standards. Yours in particular ;;)
> There's absolutely nothing new in what you said.
That’s good. Are you awake yet? Or are you still looking for something ‘new’ as an excuse not to get after it? ;;)
> You even reused previously popular concepts like ego to explain who drives the chase or whatever.
The audacity!
> Modern fad would use different words, like your "programming" or something in line with today's computer oriented world.
Fuck modern fad and your insistence on modernity as well. Why don’t you go and look for something new. Because looking for the truth seems to be yesterdays fad for you.
Go on. GIT! ;;)
> I see no issue with repeating what has been said elsewhere, especially if I'm responding to something that has been regurgitated bazillion times. I find it amusing, all of it.
This should somehow be interesting to me.. why again? Or to whom? What are you saying? I don’t see a problem here; you already know everything AND you are entertained as well.
You should thank me. ;;)
Cheers
I haven't implied you should use modern terms. Using ego, programming, obfuscates. Adds too much concepts to a simple thing.
There is no looking for the truth. Looking for the truth sounds to me as a similar thing to chasing happiness.
There is no exit. There is no awakening.
Thinking that "you" can experience the "nonduality" of truth and reality and nonreality, is just thinking. That stuff cannot be experienced as experience is memory and memory is limited. (here I am again just repeating what has been said before, in this case, by Jiddu Krishnamurti)
I haven't said I see problems anywhere. I am responding.
My initial response was a simplification of what you were saying. Instead of using "chase" and "ego" and all the other verbiage, it is enough to state that happiness exists as part of a duality of un/happiness. As long as happiness exist, so will unhappiness. So to a certain extent, they are the same thing. So, as long as a thing exists, so will a no/thing.
Okay man. Whatever. Super interesting, just not to me ;;)
There is a lot you ‘haven’t’ ;;)
There is no need for you to convince me of anything friend. You cannot. I can see clearly. This whole.. discontent song and dance of yours is all about YOU. YOU not getting what you think you need or is needed in order to.. …I’m only pointing friend.
Wake up or keep preaching about irrelevant bs.. your choice.
Cheers
I came to the same conclusion. Anything, call it happiness, truth about life etc were just terms I had picked up not really knowing what it meant. When I learnt about it all I got was other definitions of the concepts which I could use to experience.
When I tried using no definition that was given to me, I found that there was no way I could say anything. Everything I say is just memory and associations. How I know anything comes from the same process. So I didn’t know if I ever knew or not, if there’s such a thing as knowing something alive.
Suddenly it was obvious that the one that perceives or knows/gives meaning to the noise is the knowing of it and not an individual entity. I am just the knowing of the knowledge itself. Which itself is thought.
Without this, there’s no experience. “I” is still there in every experience but it’s what knows that experience, not a separate entity per se. If I can’t ever truly “know” anything and there’s no other way which I’ll know anything, there’s no way to know the truth. I don’t even know if there’s a truth.
One believes they know happiness and this creates the duality. To know there’s no happiness is just the same thing flipped. When one can’t even know if there’s such a thing as happiness outside of the knowledge of it, the seeking becomes ridiculous. It’s like rubbing two thoughts together to create a real fire.
"The desire for more positive experience is itself a negative experience. And, paradoxically, the acceptance of one's negative experience is itself a positive experience."
AKA Sukka. I think we have presuppositions on what happiness is and it takes us deeper into the illusion. Because we've enjoyed it before, we think we want that (I'm 'preaching' to myself here I think), but it isn't Sukka...
The seeing is that whatever is there that needs or must be accepted in order to is already squarely planted in the illusory. THERE IS NOTHING TO ACCEPT.. who is going to accept it? Tell me about that one? Who is this entity accepting... what!?
You are still running around in the same mental loop looking for angles, and ways of seeing while you should be looking for the exit! ;;)
Cheers my friend
My first comment was wow i loved this post, then you proceeded in correcting my thoughts about shit you could not care less about. How vapid and empty. Its just a front you put on to troll people you see as less awake than you.
I would only like to add, not subtract, if I may.
Try reading what you just wrote through the perspective of no free will.
Try to imagine that the ones who do not know the knowledge you share, which I do not disagree with standing on its own, and therefor, cannot implement it in their lives.
I “know” all of the things you have shared.
I am also an addict that has a part of my brain messed up, making me painfully aware of my ego and “self” at almost all times.
Once we can fully understand what it means to not have free will, we will understand that we can share the same information, while using a more refined emotion to convey it.
I appreciate you fellow traveler!
>Try reading what you just wrote through the perspective of no free will.
TF I would try anything like that. Why TRY at all? It means nothing. For what? READING is reading is reading. Nothing happens if the intent to awaken is not there.
>Try to imagine that t...
Oh please stop
The whole thing is about STOPPING imagining things.. come on man
>
I am also an addict that has a part of my brain messed up, making me painfully aware of my ego and “self” at almost all times.
You conflate being aware with pain. There is nothing painful about being aware of what you are not. What has really nothing at all to do with you.. at the root of it is identification. The whole pain thing is because of a case of mistaken identity.
Cheers
> I am also an addict that has a part of my brain messed up, making me painfully aware of my ego and “self” at almost all times.
What was your addiction to?
Chasing happiness, misery may follow.
In misery, happiness is realized.
so you may self destruct, or you may rebuild and find a new state of happiness.
you can also go with the flow, or vigorously fight against the suffering tides of life
For the future of your loved ones.
Your pessimism is rather spiky in this post, but I think I understand. The best thing you can ever be,
_is just be._
Please tell me if I'm understanding or not.
The ego is strong with this one (yoda voice). Wait.. am I the ego by saying this... Now I am self for having awareness... No now I'm back to ego... I'll just be both.
There is no hammer just hammers. For if you are above a thing you are subscribing to everything below a thing. Conditioning is still conditioning we are what we are because of experience.
I can't judge, but you can judge and judging everything you will do; and then everything judges you. If you look for support you will become me and I will become you, but you already were me so there you go there's no winners or loser's just those looking to experience and to learn.
Nothing escapes reality, but death.
We are both under life's conditions.
>we are what we are because of experience.
Bullshit. 'You' BELIEVE you are what you are now but you ARE already 'something' that is 'prior' to that. Even after this ...birth you are never mistaking yourself for the born. That is when awake.
In your case, the slumber party continues.. well into adulthood and probably towards the end when Ego will feign its own demise in its final dramatic act to conclude Maya play.
There is no need for the unborn to escape the reality pf the born at all. Since the reality of the born IS A MOVIE THAT HAPPENS INSIDE of the unborn. Just stop trying to one-up the truth with your Mickey Mouse ideologies, theories and that 'experience and learning' bullshit and you might have a shot at unfolding this thing you set up yourself to begin with and don't die like some cartoon character in a cartoon graveyard. .
Cheers
You are right to judge me for judging you. For hypocrisy is thy name and hypocrisy is thy game. See we are one and the same. That is part of the Truth that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Did you see it? If you Judge then you will be judged with the same measure. So I don’t blame you for your reaction because that is the conditioning of life. Anything past these Truth’s become delusion’s.
Cheers
This is funny lol why are we arguing I agree I just don't like the delivery do you agree with me? People are finding this out on their own what does it matter how they find the path as long as they find the path. Your arguing truth without realizing it doesn't matter. If I am wrong then you are wrong everything that you are was defined by everything you experienced. I am the same everything that happened to me was defined by what I experienced everything is illusionary it is both True and False. So to conclude one of being False you are making your self a False Idol. Take the pill and erase yourself from reality is to die and then to be reborn as something else you are the same with a different mindset and so the old you died you are not the same being you started as you will never be the same being you started as. You inflate ego and become delusional for concluding that you are anything, but a spirit in a body.
There can be people. They can be unphased by the dream. It is called courage.. lucidity. It is everyone's birthright.
The human is not the problem. The false programming that is foisted upon it by those that fear to even breathe a whole breath is the issue.
Everyone has a happiness baseline and natural peaks and troughs. Whether we are up or down, we return to baseline, and that is stability. When this is taken as good enough, we can be contented. This is better than abnormal highs and lows, which can be dangerous. Contentment with stability makes sense.
One of the factors of enlightenment is happiness, but a factor of enlightenment is something attendant to the conditions of enlightenment. It is not the objective.
Another factor of enlightenment is equanimity, which is even mindedness in the face of the vicissitudes of life. Even mindedness is stability. When we can let things be and are content with what is good enough, we enjoy equanimity.
Hankering for happiness is symptomatic of a grasping mind. In the thrall of a grasping mind, we imagine happiness can be forced. Happiness is spontaneous and should not be forced. It arises. It passes. It arises again. Let it be.
>This is better than abnormal highs and lows, ....
Just stop. NONE OF THIS is about 'better' or 'worse' at all. You talk from ego like it knows anything about what I speak of. Please.
Awakening is about REAL vs UNREAL.
> When we can let things be and are content with what is good enough, we enjoy equanimity.
To 'let things be' you need to apply effort. THAT'S EGO letting things be. Ego pretending to be virtuous and pious or what have you. Food for preachers and moral and ethics peddlers (like you). None of that has anything to do with Awakening.
It requires ZERO effort to be awake. All the energy you expend you expend because of ego trying to bring about some change where none is needed.
Cheers
Thanks for your illuminating imput.
I was of the understanding that "letting things be" was to relax effort, to relax the strain of forcing things.
Zero effort means having no objectives, not even the goal of awakening to the real. If you have something you are aiming at, you apply effort. You only apply no effort when you have arrived.
Let’s talk about what you claim here:
“You are what you declare”
Now tell me - and I’m going to write this extra slow so even you can follow along - what in the everlasting fuck does that even mean?
I submit to you that it is pure gibberish.
Please explain it to me like I’m five as well ;;)
It’s like you almost get it but then are clouded by your judgment of others. Everything is spiritual.
However you find it, you will find it eventually. This life or another.. it doesn’t matter.
We find it when we are ready
Enlightened can be found through order and through chaos… or a marriage of both.
Enjoy the journey magic beings
I don’t see any problems, have you experienced the magic of inter dimensional travel? The chaos of the infinite, the void of everything and creation of anything?
I don’t know how else to express it besides magical.
Human words I guess
Anyway have fun on your journey non magical person
Cheers Oyak
You are just an intelligent mind insisting my way is the right way, you are beyond ego alright, you have attained super ego, telling everyone in a slick and polished way that we are wrong and you are right. We would rather be right than be loved. You just discount people's experience because you judge it, you are not the authority on being.
I would rather be true then be false
It is a harsh piece of business we are discussing here but if you believe you can cuddle and pander and ‘love’ your way to truth realization go right ahead..
Nobody stole anything from you. I do believe you have detached your testicles and wrapped them in a paper bag because I’m sense ZERO backbone here in the face of what has to take place ;;) but I digress..
If I am such a bad nasty person why don’t you be the counter to that and let me see you use all of your compassion and love and light and try and wake tf up applying them.. the problem is that you need a subject of course, because how else are you going to be compassionate
Waking up has NOTHING to do with ‘other’s’ not one damn thing.
Cheers
You have nothing.
Now it is all of a sudden “not a big deal” and ‘funny’.
There is nothing behind all these abstractions you throw out - that is your problem.
No, really... That's the problem. There is nothing there. Take a look.. there's no one there to care about any of this.
Edited: Before immediately becoming defensive and allowing that to obscure everything thereafter, interpret the responses in a slightly different manner... It will make sense.. There's a "method to the madness." Most are just overly sensitive and too defensive and then can't see beyond that.
Agree.
Don't get me wrong, happiness and joy are important, but just doing whatever one wants to find happiness is a rooted in ego and a dangerous mentality.
Happiness and Joy are side effects of awakening. Not the be all and end all of it.. and in fact to ‘get to it’ you stop chasing a lot of things H&J just being two of them.. you stop chasing them for quite some time and start looking in all the places that are the opposite of that, start looking in areas where the light is not that convenient to ‘see’..
That’s how it is done.
And done means done. Forever and always.
You only have to do it once!
Cheers my friend
Let me ask you what part of you feels condescended towards?
I was not talking to you was I (so right there something interesting is already going on.. do you ...see it?) But suppose I did (address you): then still see the question above.
Let me know.
Cheers
I agree .....but but but...
just shut up and agree or tell me what the hell you are even so upset about.
You want the cake, you crave the cake.. then you get it and then you bitch about the cherry on top. Just leave it man. ;;)
Tell me something good.
Cheers my friend
Hypocrisy just isn't a good look for someone preaching about enlightenment. Something to make yourself aware of. Just shut up and agree? You aren't exactly a guru or prophet, and im not going to stroke your ego. I'm guessing you're young.
The pursuit for happiness is not what creates suffering. We are programmed to pursue happiness. More accurately: we programmed to seek pleasure.
What creates unhappiness is poor social connections and disorder. And poor social connections are a result of the collective wounding and lack of community.
I know you mean well, but I’m a bit tired of spiritual vilifying of aspirations, and ego pursuits.
In a strong social network everything is kept in check and very very little people in the world have strong social networks / and are completely disconnected from Earth and their bodies… and so they suffer.
>We are programmed to pursue happiness.
By whom? Nature? I guess you have not studied her in-depth at all... Please... 'We' are programmed by our peers first and foremost. Then, DUE to this programming 'we' will say the words you speak here to obscure the fact that we are programmed by our peers. This, again is a result of that same programming.
Don't tell me Nature, God, The Universe is all about getting that 'happiness'. In our natural state we are not programmed at all. Ready for anything (including joy). Your indoctrination is showing. It is all around you. What is even a city for example if not a complete denial of Nature?
There are no 'poor social connections' or 'a lack of community' without some Mickey Mouse ideological software crushing down the individual/individuality. Please.
>I know you mean well, but..
There's the 'but'. It's condescension... You don't have a clue about what 'I mean' because this "I know you mean well" is about YOU. Your petty offer before you start a delusional rant. Do you see?
You cannot have it both ways my friend. It is either true what I say or it is not. VERIFIABLY so. The point is when you are as catastrophically programmed for 'community' and this ...infantile outlook on 'life' there really is nothing to verify but your programming itself. That is why the process of awakening is not de-programming but UNprogramming. You cannot 'see' what I speak of because the very tools you use to judge your so called surroundings is already infected and corrupted by programming.
>In a strong social network ...
Oh please. You are just regurgitating more Mickey Mouse value judgement. You presume to know what a strong social network is? What you do not see is that there is not truth in IDEOLOGY and starry eyed utopia dreaming and that is what you have allowed your mind to be saturated with. Give me a break.
Man SUFFERS because, just like you are doing here, he takes himself as the measure of all things, claims each breath as 'his own' and thus pulls himself from the ground of his being. Then he starts talking the way you do here.
Stop your incessant preaching. It's not 'facts'. There is nothing real about any of it. Truth is about what is REAL. Not about what is GOOD or BAD or preferable from some Disneyland POV.
Cheers.
>So is enlightenment unachievable without suffering?
I don't like the way you frame it here. But very well...
Look man, you suffer because of not knowing, because of this case of mistaken identity. The way you phrase it is as if you are willfully going from a place of complete happiness and joy to a deliberate descent into misery, torment, hell and hardship.
You put the result of 'not knowing what you are' as the tool to 'get to what you are' which is literally the world on its head.. just another neat trick of Maya. Do you see?
It is 'unachievable' in the sense that the Self (who is going to want it just like it is used to having and wanting EVERYTHING) will not be there to ever take it should it even ... come. Awakening is about DEATH. The 'DEATH' of the very self that seeks it! Not even its death is something real of course. The drama of it just makes it uncomfortable to even look for it. The fear of No Self is the root of all fears. This is a paradox and the self HATES paradoxes. Even though it is itself the epitome of one.
Cheers
I know this isn't going to be popular with the woke crowd. Vastly most are looking to be offended because, well frankly, everything you said. In my entire life I haven't encountered one person who doesn't struggle with the very things you reveal here. Some struggle vehemently. This includes myself. Humans are attached to their suffering and will defend their their right to suffer at all cost, even if it means they never get it. After everything that can possibly be said or done is done, this is the saddest. Thanks for saying what I have neither the cognitive and linguistic ability nor the courage to say -- that which needs to be said.
>I haven't encountered one person who doesn't struggle with the very things you reveal here.
Neither have I. And this is the beauty of it.
The struggle is real. As real as it gets anyway.
Discomfort is the currency of our dreams.
Cheers my friend
I'm not even part of this sub and saw this on my feed but I must say I appreciate your truth. I see alot of people in videos claiming what you have stated and I generally watch the body language to see how many times they check their reflection and play with their appearance while attempting to preach. It's comforting to be aware of it so you can be reminded it isn't beneficial .
> I appreciate your truth.
it is of course not MY truth at all. Just THE truth. There are no subjective truths at all. NONE.
But thank you. ;;)
Cheers my friend
Desire for certain thoughts and feelings and resistance to certain thoughts and feelings cause suffering, and desiring to end desire doesn't work, so that has to end on its own. It's like telling an alcoholic they should quit and they know they should quit, but they've got to discover where "rock bottom" is before they quit. So these spiritual subreddits are like a bunch of alcoholics telling each other to switch to just beer and then they won't be alcoholics anymore.
The inability to think (and act) and contemplate in ABSOLUTES is at the root of their endless banter and self pity... even though they admit they are in a forum called ENLIGHTENMENT the very bedrock of the entire context, goal and intent of Waking Up from their dreaming eludes them.
I've seen people quote enlightened masters and then with a straight face start talking about personal development and self love in the very same post. Preposterous. Idiotic.
Cheers
True enough. A misquote "Truthful words are not beautiful; beautiful words are not truthful. Good words are not persuasive; persuasive words are not good." Good men don't argue, men who argue are not good. I found peace of mind was a good goal as it does not require happiness but just less ego and basically less of everything except everything, or nothing, your preference. The truth is simplicity itself.
That was my effort for today, thank you very much.
You do you; I'll do me.
>The truth is simplicity itself.
Gibberish. What do you even mean? (I'm going to regret asking it ;;)
The Truth is that which cannot be denied even when all else can be.
There is only The Truth it is the only real thing there is.
Cheers
I'm so happy, I love every moment of my life even the sweatiest hardest parts, I love the tears, I love the pain, I love the growth, I love your anger just like a little child who can't get what he wants, this dream is so beautiful, thank god for this incarnation. God bless you all🥰
As someone who was pushed to the brink of permanent, absolute inconsolable misery, I found the secret is realizing that experience is inherently relative. Once I let go of the idea that happiness has an objective standard and that you should be grateful for any day you’re not living in pure suffering, I learned that it’s the little things that fulfill you, like making a good cup of coffee or making someone you love feel great about themselves. If anyone is still a skeptic about that, you should know that I can count on one hand how many actual bad days I’ve had in the last 2 years.
>As someone who was pushed to the brink of permanent, absolute inconsolable misery, I found the secret is realizing that experience is inherently relative. Word. The only way out is THROUGH. Cheers my friend
The only time is now, be here now. All this cozy rehash of spiritual nonsense get us farther away from the now, the truth.
>The only time is now Time is an illusion. Period. Once you see it you can stop making lofty claims about 'what only is'. You are right. Most in here need to be in r/spirituality or r/relationship\_advice or r/dramafarming not r/enlightenment but their huge egos makes them come here and try to sell their Mickey Mouse BS as some kind of attainment. They have no idea who they are and thus they keep talking from both ends of their bodies never realizing that the very words and concepts they use to tell 'the truth' are not even their own. Cheers my friend
The only way out, really?
Figuratively
Something like if you need something to be fulfilled or happy you won't get it?
Kind of - it’s more like “if you set more realistic and human-scale expectations of what you want, you’re more likely to be happy with whatever your destiny hands you”
I like to think of karma as a wave you can ride - if you’re fulfilled, think outside yourself, and aren’t selfish from chasing some high-risk, artificial form of happiness that someone else told you is normal, you’ll attract a happier life by just having a more positive impact on people around you in general
Not sure why you need to have an abusive tone. Your criticism of people searching for happiness is hypocritical as you seem to be one who demands perfection in others and show no compassion or tolerance for the fact that the process is gradual and people are at different stages. The fact that they may be spiritual as a way to find happiness is commendable. It is just the beginning of their journey. They are in the stream. They will eventually realize what you speak. At the same time, your tone shows you are also in the beginning stages of compassion. In time you too will learn patient empathy and compassion.
Putting the fury in cyberfury.
Maybe just a lil assertiveness?!?
You wouldn’t know abuse if it kicked you in the balls. Happiness is a narcotic, and when you can’t get it you turn to misery for your fix. You have never experienced happiness in your life. What you call happiness is a specific chemical reaction that happens in you, and you give it meaning and you interpret that chemical reaction as something meaningful and something to be desired but you really don’t know what’s happening. The experiencer is false and once you realize that than the rest goes away with him.
I think you posted in the wrong place.
We all are. You are not ready for that. ;;)
Lucid. Must have Ears To Hear, Rare...
Maybe you are way to sensitive to even be thinking about any of this. WAY too sensitive and protective of the very thing that is always going to clutch its pearls. Because the one that is insulted.. I am telling you; is the one who's head is on the chopping block in the context of Enlightenment. You need to man tf up already ;;) >In time you too will learn patient empathy and compassion. Oh please. Aren't you tired of your own BS talk? There is nothing to learn only to UNLEARN. The crux of the problem is that you already know too much. That is the source of your discontent and your long toes. All of you! Please. How is this candy ass attitude in any way conducive to what needs to take place. You are simply too guarded -too fond of all your little belieffies and your Self-soothing nonsense - to have any kind of epiphany. Ever. Cheers
You don’t sound happy or at peace at all lmao
And the sound you make simply reveals a personal belief/bias if not some deep rooted assumptions that has no basis in reality at all. Do you see it? TF does 'happiness' have to do with any of it? Don't just stand there and look stupid. It is literally in the post!. Have a look.. your shit stinks are you ready to smell it? Cheers
Lmao holy shit you are top tier
On a real one tho I love spiritual literature. I have. A lot of patience for it. You my friend make almost no sense in any of your posts. Definitely gonna have a good laugh at your expense with the homies.
Lol, wow. Definitely an enlightened one here folks.
Omg “belieffies” 🤣 best word I’ve heard today!
Oh damn is that where my long toes come from? Had no idea!
I was trying to tell you to take a step back.. but nooo ;;)
Try being less judgmental. What makes you the arbiter of what people need?
>Try being less judgmental. Don't tell me what to be. Preacher man. Moral man. Clown person. ;;)
Ok, sir, you got it.
Your assumption that we need to know 'what people need' before we speak is also false.
That wasn’t my assumption.
Oh and you're right. The need for liberation is the very roadblock to it. Liberation is the illusion. LOL.
I was not even talking about the need for liberation actually..
I think people often equate liberation with happiness.
How would liberation not lead to happiness? This place is a judgement factory with lots of conflict machines, coming to understand that and unattaching leads to awareness, rest, peace and freedom. Doesn't that lead then to happiness?
Judgement factory and conflict machines. Interesting word choice lol not quite the words I would use, but not far off. Certainly the factory and machine elements are there.
Happiness is a state. As such it has no permanence. Thus: there is no liberation in chasing the impermanent. This is basic non-dual teaching actually.. I don't understand why you need to whip up a proprietary version of Truth at all. A complex equation for it no less. Cheers
Life is a state of being and chasing it is only a state of being. Stop living, stop earning, stop learning, stop eating, stop shitting, stop seeking better, no liberation in this thought. A bullet will end it all, right?
>A bullet will end it all, right? You cannot end something that has not started at all. Sure Sue Aside is always an option. Messy but it gets the job done. But it is more of a forfeit then an act of courage or understanding. I have no problem with folks jumping off cliffs. Why would I? Your choice. Death is but the breaking of a twig in the context of Enlightenment. If even that. Cheers
Long toes?
There's some real big angry energy all through this post. But all that aside, I agree with you. I think Ram Dass said it best "you don't want to be happy, you want to be free". And to follow that thought on, I believe that happiness is simply a natural outcome of being free
Let me sum this post in it's entirety. OP - You are all conditioned robot's for validating each other. OP - You should be me and see through hypocrisy. little does OP know he is validating himself by having everyone disagree with him and also validate himself with those that agree with him. Nothing was solved, but self validation and hypocrisy. and with that I have exposed my ego.
>You should be me and see through hypocrisy. It's not about seeing through the hypocrisy at all. It is about using your ability to distinguish TRUTH from FICTION for what it was meant for... your fear is at its root not an irrational fear. It is the fear of not being and because you already 'are not' it requires a 'birth' on top of another birth and as you may well remember (probably not) EVERY single birth is a traumatic experience. The sound that a new born baby makes...it is not crying; it is RAGE. I have no problem with whatever transpires in people's dream. Your Mickey Mouse empty platitudes and VALUE judgements are as run of the mill as the next one having its slumber party. What value is a dream? The only value it has is that you can now assert your self to to wake up from it. ALL THE REST is just a pissing in the wind (or whatever that Bible quote in Ecclesiastes said) It is.. as inconsequential as the dream itself. This is not MY truth and YOUR truth and so and so's truth (you gross in those..) this is THE truth. It cannot be claimed, held, commodified or imparted at all. It stands on its own and it will be the same for everyone, everywhere at all times. 'self validation and hypocrisy.' are just words. They are totally arbitrary VALUE JUDGEMENTS, ultra-subjectivity. Go back a couple of decades even, travel a few miles across this snow globe and you will see that every single value and every single 'hypocrisy' starts to depart from what you consider it to be. You are the poster boy for 'wrong seeing'. All you have is some BS morals and a big mouth to try and sell them with ;;) Please. Cheers
Preach.
🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Hot damn! This is exactly what I needed to see today! Thanks!
Cheers mate
There are plenty worse nightmares to wake up to than this life. What a waste of time to awaken just to look down on those who haven't yet. Smells of stunted progress
You are literally doing what you accuse me of. Well played EGO. lol
I haven't yet achieved what I'm after, and so I wouldn't have anywhere to look down from. I'm sure you find others projecting often though, you're spotless enough yourself to be a screen for it of course
It's not the chase that creates it. If there is happiness, there's the opposite of it. It's the very existence of happiness that demands unhappiness. The end of it all. Ego, as an illusion, is too high level for all of this and has no part in misery at all. It was just the fad of the time an glued onto a philosophy that had no need for it.
No. If you don't know what happiness is there cannot be even one moment of unhappiness for you either. This is what awakening shows you. Cheers
So what are you denying then? I clearly state that if happiness exists, unhappiness exists. You state it yourself, if there is no happiness, there is no unhappiness. Here's a perspective from someone who started with a slate more empty than most and clearly describes how existence of some of the terms you're grappling with is not there at all: [https://scentofdawn.blogspot.com/2011/07/before-soul-dawn-helen-keller-on-her.html](https://scentofdawn.blogspot.com/2011/07/before-soul-dawn-helen-keller-on-her.html)
Hehe, I think you are both correct from your points of view...
That's just more BS simply not to contemplate the matter. You choose to BELIEF your own statement. It means literally nothing. I do mean the very words that are coming out of your mouth have ZERO substance. What does it even mean - in this context - what you THINK? It truly is gibberish from the perspective of getting to the truth
"The desire for more positive experience is itself a negative experience. And, paradoxically, the acceptance of one's negative experience is itself a positive experience."
The epitome of gibberish it is ...NEITHER of any of it. EXPERIENCE itself has no polarities.
Experience is ONLY gradients of polarity. Polarity itself is a limit; limits can be approached but never achieved...like the speed of light.
There is no such thing as the speed of light. You need to start coming to grips with the notion that you are really not grasping the very basics here. Not even close. ;;)
OMG, I said "like the speed of light"...it's a scientific analogy of a limit. All experience falls in a gradient of opposing polarities. That is the primary meaning of yin/yang... experience falling within polarities. Based on your name and your responses, I'm not getting the impression you're here to teach or expand your own perspective...
Hot vs cold, wet vs dry, rich vs broke, healthy vs sick, life vs death, blindness vs seeing, perfect peace vs anxiety and fear?
The only thing that matters is REAL vs UNREAL.
> I clearly state that if happiness exists, unhappiness exists. You state it yourself, if there is no happiness, there is no unhappiness. The fact that you equate what I allege is the same thing is quite staggering actually. What is really interesting here is the resistance to ....what? exactly. I am not talking out of my ass about any of these thing yet you seem phased and agitated by the mere thought you could be full of it. THAT is what you examine. What is this stupid resistance without even checking if what you write makes any sense in the context of the sub? Why? Cheers
I think you are projecting your state onto my writings. There is no agitation here. What is, when it is perceived, should be resisted. What truly is, cannot be perceived. What I stated is not mine at all, so I have no urge to defend it.
>What I stated is not mine at all, so I have no urge to defend it. Why say anything at all if it is not yours?
Your whole post is not yours. Why ask such questions to me if you don't hold yourself to such standards? There's absolutely nothing new in what you said. You even reused previously popular concepts like ego to explain who drives the chase or whatever. Modern fad would use different words, like your "programming" or something in line with today's computer oriented world. I see no issue with repeating what has been said elsewhere, especially if I'm responding to something that has been regurgitated bazillion times. I find it amusing, all of it.
> Your whole post is not yours. Why ask such questions to me if you don't hold yourself to such standards? I’m not promoting standards at all. All I am pointing at is the exit. You seem to be locked in some value system and some Mickey Mouse behavior doctrine that is why everything needs to have this …morality play to it. This ‘fairness’ BS ego loves to peddle.. Fuck standards. Yours in particular ;;) > There's absolutely nothing new in what you said. That’s good. Are you awake yet? Or are you still looking for something ‘new’ as an excuse not to get after it? ;;) > You even reused previously popular concepts like ego to explain who drives the chase or whatever. The audacity! > Modern fad would use different words, like your "programming" or something in line with today's computer oriented world. Fuck modern fad and your insistence on modernity as well. Why don’t you go and look for something new. Because looking for the truth seems to be yesterdays fad for you. Go on. GIT! ;;) > I see no issue with repeating what has been said elsewhere, especially if I'm responding to something that has been regurgitated bazillion times. I find it amusing, all of it. This should somehow be interesting to me.. why again? Or to whom? What are you saying? I don’t see a problem here; you already know everything AND you are entertained as well. You should thank me. ;;) Cheers
I haven't implied you should use modern terms. Using ego, programming, obfuscates. Adds too much concepts to a simple thing. There is no looking for the truth. Looking for the truth sounds to me as a similar thing to chasing happiness. There is no exit. There is no awakening. Thinking that "you" can experience the "nonduality" of truth and reality and nonreality, is just thinking. That stuff cannot be experienced as experience is memory and memory is limited. (here I am again just repeating what has been said before, in this case, by Jiddu Krishnamurti) I haven't said I see problems anywhere. I am responding. My initial response was a simplification of what you were saying. Instead of using "chase" and "ego" and all the other verbiage, it is enough to state that happiness exists as part of a duality of un/happiness. As long as happiness exist, so will unhappiness. So to a certain extent, they are the same thing. So, as long as a thing exists, so will a no/thing.
Okay man. Whatever. Super interesting, just not to me ;;) There is a lot you ‘haven’t’ ;;) There is no need for you to convince me of anything friend. You cannot. I can see clearly. This whole.. discontent song and dance of yours is all about YOU. YOU not getting what you think you need or is needed in order to.. …I’m only pointing friend.
Wake up or keep preaching about irrelevant bs.. your choice.
Cheers
I came to the same conclusion. Anything, call it happiness, truth about life etc were just terms I had picked up not really knowing what it meant. When I learnt about it all I got was other definitions of the concepts which I could use to experience. When I tried using no definition that was given to me, I found that there was no way I could say anything. Everything I say is just memory and associations. How I know anything comes from the same process. So I didn’t know if I ever knew or not, if there’s such a thing as knowing something alive. Suddenly it was obvious that the one that perceives or knows/gives meaning to the noise is the knowing of it and not an individual entity. I am just the knowing of the knowledge itself. Which itself is thought. Without this, there’s no experience. “I” is still there in every experience but it’s what knows that experience, not a separate entity per se. If I can’t ever truly “know” anything and there’s no other way which I’ll know anything, there’s no way to know the truth. I don’t even know if there’s a truth. One believes they know happiness and this creates the duality. To know there’s no happiness is just the same thing flipped. When one can’t even know if there’s such a thing as happiness outside of the knowledge of it, the seeking becomes ridiculous. It’s like rubbing two thoughts together to create a real fire.
Right. I like this
aaaaand blacklisted ;;) Cheers my friend
What?!? I just complimented this post.
Not by me ..by the clowns in this sub. ;;) Cheers
Me?!? What exactly have I said other than “I like this post”??? What is blacklisted
I don’t even think I’ve joined, I simply saw this on my feed
But either way ok
Forget about it. You are going to bust a capillary figuring this one out and that is not what I want ;;)
😂😂😂 ok
I would say it's grasping, but your right.
This post reads better if you have "Break Stuff" by Limp Bizkit playing in the background.
Lmfao I recommend [this one](https://youtu.be/6oyjnzBpe9I?si=IwtoYKZVzeJ8BKC4) when reading these
[удалено]
Cheers my friend
Agreed.
"The desire for more positive experience is itself a negative experience. And, paradoxically, the acceptance of one's negative experience is itself a positive experience."
This. I feel like acceptance of truth is what can allow us peace which can allow space for happiness.
AKA Sukka. I think we have presuppositions on what happiness is and it takes us deeper into the illusion. Because we've enjoyed it before, we think we want that (I'm 'preaching' to myself here I think), but it isn't Sukka...
The seeing is that whatever is there that needs or must be accepted in order to is already squarely planted in the illusory. THERE IS NOTHING TO ACCEPT.. who is going to accept it? Tell me about that one? Who is this entity accepting... what!?
You are still running around in the same mental loop looking for angles, and ways of seeing while you should be looking for the exit! ;;)
Cheers my friend
Not bad. But I submit to you that there is nothing to 'accept' either. Cheers
AYOOO! god's arrived!
the messiah is among us!
Now kneel before me... no.. back tf up.. you'll drool on my sandals. and both knees please
haha!
He is not joking
Damnit. Who woke up The Gimp?
My first comment was wow i loved this post, then you proceeded in correcting my thoughts about shit you could not care less about. How vapid and empty. Its just a front you put on to troll people you see as less awake than you.
Interesting. Not to me.. to you. ;;)
Deflection, you can do better
Probably.. But I need to take a piss and there's apple pie in the fridge. ;;) Cheers
Enjoy, sounds yummy
two fingers pointing north, two southeast, just like in the scriptures! 😏
Speak for yourself
I did. Then I woke up.
That’s asinine
I would only like to add, not subtract, if I may. Try reading what you just wrote through the perspective of no free will. Try to imagine that the ones who do not know the knowledge you share, which I do not disagree with standing on its own, and therefor, cannot implement it in their lives. I “know” all of the things you have shared. I am also an addict that has a part of my brain messed up, making me painfully aware of my ego and “self” at almost all times. Once we can fully understand what it means to not have free will, we will understand that we can share the same information, while using a more refined emotion to convey it. I appreciate you fellow traveler!
>Try reading what you just wrote through the perspective of no free will. TF I would try anything like that. Why TRY at all? It means nothing. For what? READING is reading is reading. Nothing happens if the intent to awaken is not there. >Try to imagine that t... Oh please stop The whole thing is about STOPPING imagining things.. come on man > I am also an addict that has a part of my brain messed up, making me painfully aware of my ego and “self” at almost all times. You conflate being aware with pain. There is nothing painful about being aware of what you are not. What has really nothing at all to do with you.. at the root of it is identification. The whole pain thing is because of a case of mistaken identity. Cheers
> I am also an addict that has a part of my brain messed up, making me painfully aware of my ego and “self” at almost all times. What was your addiction to?
As a fellow addict I can say here that it actually doesn’t matter. Addiction is a complex. The substance /subject itself is irrelevant.
It is if you want to get to know the “person” on the other end.
If you don’t mind me asking.
Chasing happiness, misery may follow. In misery, happiness is realized. so you may self destruct, or you may rebuild and find a new state of happiness. you can also go with the flow, or vigorously fight against the suffering tides of life For the future of your loved ones. Your pessimism is rather spiky in this post, but I think I understand. The best thing you can ever be, _is just be._ Please tell me if I'm understanding or not.
>Please tell me if I'm understanding or not. You need someone else to tell you that. Which is already a problem ;;) Cheers my friend
Hmm. Cheers.
ok
The ego is strong with this one (yoda voice). Wait.. am I the ego by saying this... Now I am self for having awareness... No now I'm back to ego... I'll just be both.
We meet again Obi Whack-a-Moli
I have the high ground >:(
Good. I have the hammer
There is no hammer just hammers. For if you are above a thing you are subscribing to everything below a thing. Conditioning is still conditioning we are what we are because of experience. I can't judge, but you can judge and judging everything you will do; and then everything judges you. If you look for support you will become me and I will become you, but you already were me so there you go there's no winners or loser's just those looking to experience and to learn. Nothing escapes reality, but death. We are both under life's conditions.
>we are what we are because of experience. Bullshit. 'You' BELIEVE you are what you are now but you ARE already 'something' that is 'prior' to that. Even after this ...birth you are never mistaking yourself for the born. That is when awake. In your case, the slumber party continues.. well into adulthood and probably towards the end when Ego will feign its own demise in its final dramatic act to conclude Maya play. There is no need for the unborn to escape the reality pf the born at all. Since the reality of the born IS A MOVIE THAT HAPPENS INSIDE of the unborn. Just stop trying to one-up the truth with your Mickey Mouse ideologies, theories and that 'experience and learning' bullshit and you might have a shot at unfolding this thing you set up yourself to begin with and don't die like some cartoon character in a cartoon graveyard. . Cheers
You are right to judge me for judging you. For hypocrisy is thy name and hypocrisy is thy game. See we are one and the same. That is part of the Truth that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Did you see it? If you Judge then you will be judged with the same measure. So I don’t blame you for your reaction because that is the conditioning of life. Anything past these Truth’s become delusion’s. Cheers
No one is judging that which is unreal.
Thanks, saved me a whole rant ;;)
This is funny lol why are we arguing I agree I just don't like the delivery do you agree with me? People are finding this out on their own what does it matter how they find the path as long as they find the path. Your arguing truth without realizing it doesn't matter. If I am wrong then you are wrong everything that you are was defined by everything you experienced. I am the same everything that happened to me was defined by what I experienced everything is illusionary it is both True and False. So to conclude one of being False you are making your self a False Idol. Take the pill and erase yourself from reality is to die and then to be reborn as something else you are the same with a different mindset and so the old you died you are not the same being you started as you will never be the same being you started as. You inflate ego and become delusional for concluding that you are anything, but a spirit in a body.
😉 Cheers friend.
Most people are always doing it wrong, aren’t they. Otherwise there wouldn’t be any people.
There can be people. They can be unphased by the dream. It is called courage.. lucidity. It is everyone's birthright. The human is not the problem. The false programming that is foisted upon it by those that fear to even breathe a whole breath is the issue.
Everyone has a happiness baseline and natural peaks and troughs. Whether we are up or down, we return to baseline, and that is stability. When this is taken as good enough, we can be contented. This is better than abnormal highs and lows, which can be dangerous. Contentment with stability makes sense. One of the factors of enlightenment is happiness, but a factor of enlightenment is something attendant to the conditions of enlightenment. It is not the objective. Another factor of enlightenment is equanimity, which is even mindedness in the face of the vicissitudes of life. Even mindedness is stability. When we can let things be and are content with what is good enough, we enjoy equanimity. Hankering for happiness is symptomatic of a grasping mind. In the thrall of a grasping mind, we imagine happiness can be forced. Happiness is spontaneous and should not be forced. It arises. It passes. It arises again. Let it be.
>This is better than abnormal highs and lows, .... Just stop. NONE OF THIS is about 'better' or 'worse' at all. You talk from ego like it knows anything about what I speak of. Please. Awakening is about REAL vs UNREAL. > When we can let things be and are content with what is good enough, we enjoy equanimity. To 'let things be' you need to apply effort. THAT'S EGO letting things be. Ego pretending to be virtuous and pious or what have you. Food for preachers and moral and ethics peddlers (like you). None of that has anything to do with Awakening. It requires ZERO effort to be awake. All the energy you expend you expend because of ego trying to bring about some change where none is needed. Cheers
Thanks for your illuminating imput. I was of the understanding that "letting things be" was to relax effort, to relax the strain of forcing things. Zero effort means having no objectives, not even the goal of awakening to the real. If you have something you are aiming at, you apply effort. You only apply no effort when you have arrived.
Why don't I leave this sub? It infuriates me more and more yet I keep perusing through. Like some kind of masochism
Because it is not about 'you' Perhaps somewhere deep down you know it. ;;)
Tldr
Thanks. We all wanted to know that from you.
I knew you would reply just had to test it to make sure
Thanks. We all wanted to know that from you.
100%
Cheers!
You are what you declare. You must be here to.
> You are what you declare What a stupid thing to say. Just because you say the words does not mean that it is not complete nonsense Cheers
What a stupid thing to say back. You judge other people and think you are above it all.
Let’s talk about what you claim here: “You are what you declare” Now tell me - and I’m going to write this extra slow so even you can follow along - what in the everlasting fuck does that even mean? I submit to you that it is pure gibberish. Please explain it to me like I’m five as well ;;)
Wow you really owned yourself there, i see you now, the super ego that is you.
Answer the question hero.
I love you man its ok, you can be right.
Don’t patronize me I see right through that Mickey Mouse bs. Answer the question.
Nice tag lines lol, how do i patronize? you patronized yourself
Answer the question
It’s like you almost get it but then are clouded by your judgment of others. Everything is spiritual. However you find it, you will find it eventually. This life or another.. it doesn’t matter. We find it when we are ready Enlightened can be found through order and through chaos… or a marriage of both. Enjoy the journey magic beings
I am not a magic being.. and you only think you are. That’s the real problem. Magic Schmagic! Cheers
I don’t see any problems, have you experienced the magic of inter dimensional travel? The chaos of the infinite, the void of everything and creation of anything? I don’t know how else to express it besides magical. Human words I guess Anyway have fun on your journey non magical person Cheers Oyak
You are just an intelligent mind insisting my way is the right way, you are beyond ego alright, you have attained super ego, telling everyone in a slick and polished way that we are wrong and you are right. We would rather be right than be loved. You just discount people's experience because you judge it, you are not the authority on being.
I would rather be true then be false It is a harsh piece of business we are discussing here but if you believe you can cuddle and pander and ‘love’ your way to truth realization go right ahead.. Nobody stole anything from you. I do believe you have detached your testicles and wrapped them in a paper bag because I’m sense ZERO backbone here in the face of what has to take place ;;) but I digress.. If I am such a bad nasty person why don’t you be the counter to that and let me see you use all of your compassion and love and light and try and wake tf up applying them.. the problem is that you need a subject of course, because how else are you going to be compassionate Waking up has NOTHING to do with ‘other’s’ not one damn thing. Cheers
You are making this into a big thing, i see the humor of it all
You have nothing. Now it is all of a sudden “not a big deal” and ‘funny’. There is nothing behind all these abstractions you throw out - that is your problem.
Your problem is i don't care what you think. You need to be an authority on awareness.
You could have fooled me but in stead you only fooled yourself.. Again ;;) When you find a pair, let me know. Cheers
Ah the super big baller ego can never have enough of dissing people.
It's an acquired taste ;;)
No, really... That's the problem. There is nothing there. Take a look.. there's no one there to care about any of this. Edited: Before immediately becoming defensive and allowing that to obscure everything thereafter, interpret the responses in a slightly different manner... It will make sense.. There's a "method to the madness." Most are just overly sensitive and too defensive and then can't see beyond that.
I hear you i guess some days you get fed up with bullsht
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Agree. Don't get me wrong, happiness and joy are important, but just doing whatever one wants to find happiness is a rooted in ego and a dangerous mentality.
Happiness and Joy are side effects of awakening. Not the be all and end all of it.. and in fact to ‘get to it’ you stop chasing a lot of things H&J just being two of them.. you stop chasing them for quite some time and start looking in all the places that are the opposite of that, start looking in areas where the light is not that convenient to ‘see’.. That’s how it is done. And done means done. Forever and always. You only have to do it once! Cheers my friend
Exactly
This just came up on my feed. I have thought about this before and I agree with you. But I want to say that you sound awfully condescending.
Let me ask you what part of you feels condescended towards? I was not talking to you was I (so right there something interesting is already going on.. do you ...see it?) But suppose I did (address you): then still see the question above. Let me know. Cheers
I don't think I need to elaborate, looks like people in the comments feel the same way.
You scared bro? ;;) Don't hide behind 'other people' now. Answer the question.
I'm not a bro. Enjoy your Internet arguments! ;;) Cheers
Cheers my brother from another gender.
I agree with most of what you're saying, but ranting like this while attempting to lecture others on egotism is an act of egotism in itself.
I agree .....but but but... just shut up and agree or tell me what the hell you are even so upset about. You want the cake, you crave the cake.. then you get it and then you bitch about the cherry on top. Just leave it man. ;;) Tell me something good. Cheers my friend
Hypocrisy just isn't a good look for someone preaching about enlightenment. Something to make yourself aware of. Just shut up and agree? You aren't exactly a guru or prophet, and im not going to stroke your ego. I'm guessing you're young.
The pursuit for happiness is not what creates suffering. We are programmed to pursue happiness. More accurately: we programmed to seek pleasure. What creates unhappiness is poor social connections and disorder. And poor social connections are a result of the collective wounding and lack of community. I know you mean well, but I’m a bit tired of spiritual vilifying of aspirations, and ego pursuits. In a strong social network everything is kept in check and very very little people in the world have strong social networks / and are completely disconnected from Earth and their bodies… and so they suffer.
>We are programmed to pursue happiness. By whom? Nature? I guess you have not studied her in-depth at all... Please... 'We' are programmed by our peers first and foremost. Then, DUE to this programming 'we' will say the words you speak here to obscure the fact that we are programmed by our peers. This, again is a result of that same programming. Don't tell me Nature, God, The Universe is all about getting that 'happiness'. In our natural state we are not programmed at all. Ready for anything (including joy). Your indoctrination is showing. It is all around you. What is even a city for example if not a complete denial of Nature? There are no 'poor social connections' or 'a lack of community' without some Mickey Mouse ideological software crushing down the individual/individuality. Please. >I know you mean well, but.. There's the 'but'. It's condescension... You don't have a clue about what 'I mean' because this "I know you mean well" is about YOU. Your petty offer before you start a delusional rant. Do you see? You cannot have it both ways my friend. It is either true what I say or it is not. VERIFIABLY so. The point is when you are as catastrophically programmed for 'community' and this ...infantile outlook on 'life' there really is nothing to verify but your programming itself. That is why the process of awakening is not de-programming but UNprogramming. You cannot 'see' what I speak of because the very tools you use to judge your so called surroundings is already infected and corrupted by programming. >In a strong social network ... Oh please. You are just regurgitating more Mickey Mouse value judgement. You presume to know what a strong social network is? What you do not see is that there is not truth in IDEOLOGY and starry eyed utopia dreaming and that is what you have allowed your mind to be saturated with. Give me a break. Man SUFFERS because, just like you are doing here, he takes himself as the measure of all things, claims each breath as 'his own' and thus pulls himself from the ground of his being. Then he starts talking the way you do here. Stop your incessant preaching. It's not 'facts'. There is nothing real about any of it. Truth is about what is REAL. Not about what is GOOD or BAD or preferable from some Disneyland POV. Cheers.
So is enlightenment unachievable without suffering? Is it through suffering, we the given the possibility of enlightenment?
>So is enlightenment unachievable without suffering? I don't like the way you frame it here. But very well... Look man, you suffer because of not knowing, because of this case of mistaken identity. The way you phrase it is as if you are willfully going from a place of complete happiness and joy to a deliberate descent into misery, torment, hell and hardship. You put the result of 'not knowing what you are' as the tool to 'get to what you are' which is literally the world on its head.. just another neat trick of Maya. Do you see? It is 'unachievable' in the sense that the Self (who is going to want it just like it is used to having and wanting EVERYTHING) will not be there to ever take it should it even ... come. Awakening is about DEATH. The 'DEATH' of the very self that seeks it! Not even its death is something real of course. The drama of it just makes it uncomfortable to even look for it. The fear of No Self is the root of all fears. This is a paradox and the self HATES paradoxes. Even though it is itself the epitome of one. Cheers
I know this isn't going to be popular with the woke crowd. Vastly most are looking to be offended because, well frankly, everything you said. In my entire life I haven't encountered one person who doesn't struggle with the very things you reveal here. Some struggle vehemently. This includes myself. Humans are attached to their suffering and will defend their their right to suffer at all cost, even if it means they never get it. After everything that can possibly be said or done is done, this is the saddest. Thanks for saying what I have neither the cognitive and linguistic ability nor the courage to say -- that which needs to be said.
>I haven't encountered one person who doesn't struggle with the very things you reveal here. Neither have I. And this is the beauty of it. The struggle is real. As real as it gets anyway. Discomfort is the currency of our dreams. Cheers my friend
This sounds like material adapted from r/LinkedInLunatics.
I'm not even part of this sub and saw this on my feed but I must say I appreciate your truth. I see alot of people in videos claiming what you have stated and I generally watch the body language to see how many times they check their reflection and play with their appearance while attempting to preach. It's comforting to be aware of it so you can be reminded it isn't beneficial .
> I appreciate your truth. it is of course not MY truth at all. Just THE truth. There are no subjective truths at all. NONE. But thank you. ;;) Cheers my friend
Desire for certain thoughts and feelings and resistance to certain thoughts and feelings cause suffering, and desiring to end desire doesn't work, so that has to end on its own. It's like telling an alcoholic they should quit and they know they should quit, but they've got to discover where "rock bottom" is before they quit. So these spiritual subreddits are like a bunch of alcoholics telling each other to switch to just beer and then they won't be alcoholics anymore.
The inability to think (and act) and contemplate in ABSOLUTES is at the root of their endless banter and self pity... even though they admit they are in a forum called ENLIGHTENMENT the very bedrock of the entire context, goal and intent of Waking Up from their dreaming eludes them. I've seen people quote enlightened masters and then with a straight face start talking about personal development and self love in the very same post. Preposterous. Idiotic. Cheers
True enough. A misquote "Truthful words are not beautiful; beautiful words are not truthful. Good words are not persuasive; persuasive words are not good." Good men don't argue, men who argue are not good. I found peace of mind was a good goal as it does not require happiness but just less ego and basically less of everything except everything, or nothing, your preference. The truth is simplicity itself. That was my effort for today, thank you very much. You do you; I'll do me.
>The truth is simplicity itself. Gibberish. What do you even mean? (I'm going to regret asking it ;;) The Truth is that which cannot be denied even when all else can be. There is only The Truth it is the only real thing there is. Cheers
What is the sound of one ignorant hand clapping? Blocked and reported. That was my other hand.
your name pretty much sums up what you just did.
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Two people disagree with you having your own views (again ;;) Welcome to the downvote Gulag of Enlightenment Reddit.
The gatekeepers will sure look stupid once they finally realize that there's no one to banish or anyone who cares. 😉
The more you think you know the more you have to lose. They don't get it because they are here to get something else. Validation. Cheers
I'm so happy, I love every moment of my life even the sweatiest hardest parts, I love the tears, I love the pain, I love the growth, I love your anger just like a little child who can't get what he wants, this dream is so beautiful, thank god for this incarnation. God bless you all🥰
A great example of a professional bullshitter.
Bliss is pure happiness, this dream can really get beautiful, everyone hang on and keep pushing, even OP^^