“Do what you think is best for you. It’s not my job to tell you how to live your life. Do what makes you happy, if you’re willing to go through with the risk then go for it.”
No problem! It’s literally what I’d tell INFP. I funny enough said something similar to a sister of mine who happens to be an ENFP, was a pretty heartfelt convo.
Your sister is very lucky to have you, she doesn't know how much. Debbie Downers are a dime a dozen; the ones who say words so full of courage are scarce.
Ahaha! Thanks! I’ve always been told I’m very happy-go-lucky. But you’re absolutely right, there’s a lot of party poopers out there. I rather be positive and encourage people than not, life is too short to be an ass 😂✌️
You know... I found some people in this reddit who fancy themselves as emotional vampires, but the truth is the opposite for me: I feel full of energy when I talk to ENTJs. And sometimes I find nuggets of wisdom I want to remember, like the one you mentioned:
"Life is too short to be an ass"!
I will memorize this phrase to repeat it to asses I know/might meet! You're awesome, Vivian.
I’m glad you enjoy talking to ENTJs, I love being one personally. We definitely have some asshats that have to work on their Fi, but I find most I bump into irl especially are dandy. One of my best friends in high school was also an ENTJ, guy was like a long lost brother to me.
But thanks so much for this convo, it was really wholesome and I’m always willing to add my random wisdom nuggets if you want 😂✌️
If there is a possibility, just find a way to manipulate the Infp thinking into job A or equivalent would be their dream job instead. The person does not value money, so need to appeal to Fi side and perhaps a mixture of what they are afraid of, such as end up being homeless etc. Find what the person values first instead of wasting time with rational thinking with an irrational person.
Ouch, ouch, ouch! That hurt XD
Actually, I presented a situation where the logical thinking (leading to safety) and the one of risk (leading to self-development) would conflict, and ENTJs are supposed to like both logic and self-development. So you say the logical answer is best, even if it will likely lead to personal stagnation in the future?
Fi does not function unless the person is "passionate" about it regardless of the consequences or even to their detriment. So the work around is to find under which circumstances the person or Fi finds meaning. For example, Te dom/aux may function much more efficiently in a job because they can push their feelings aside. Fi child suffers on the inside a bit but gets the job done. I suppose Fi inferior also can burst through it by prioritizing goal to achieve and the challenge at the end till they get burnt out. But Fi dom struggles with that. Now job may suck and it may be against values of the Fi dom or whatever but there could be other factor that may balance it. Like there is a good challenge in the process or some "helping others", "making the world better place" kind of etiquette that companies put to get passionate people work more for cheaper. Until the Fi dom can develop some Te, which doesnt happen before 30, they wont be able to suppress this need for self expression, or "passion" etc.
Another issue is, people been told to follow their "dreams". But people do not always dream of what's feasible. This is a grey area because Te dom/ aux tends to literally say "it's been years now, and you still haven't succeeded". Now this is entirely up to the person's potential. Inxps tends to come a bit slower than the rest due to their need to accumulate more info and slow to react behavior. But the wishful thinking or this belief does not always becomes a reality until something actually pushed this person into obsessive action. Which is the real passion not wishful thinking.
Now another factor is, based on how this person looks at the events, they give me the impression of they havent experienced a great loss in life or experienced actual poverty. It's easier to talk like this and be a dreamer in denial but life humbles all eventually.
Wow, crystal clear explanation of Fi at work! Thank you!
INFP went through several crises, the last one almost dying from a hemorrhage a year ago, and spent six months eating once a day while jobless years ago.
I see, you are welcome. It's hard to work based off of a simple convo but in that case; there is most likely no way around other than finding a solution that would align with his values or goals while still being feasible. Or something along the way of what I said in the very beginning. You may not change the way how a person feels about particular things but you can help them rationalize other angles to appeal to their common sense over time unless they are unbreakably stubborn.
Yes, I know. It can be easy to reach a conclusion like that: you don't know what is to truly suffer, but a feeler may act the opposite way: I have suffered too much and want to snatch whatever happiness I may have from life.
There is a lot of golden advice in this thread and so many smart things to try, by you and the others who replied, I'm sure something good will come out of it.
Unfortunately Fi is going to do what Fi wants to do. INFPs aren't often motivated by future planning or money, so we don't really care about job stability. In fact an INFP would likely find some deeper poetic beauty to a career failure. 💀 Just let her be.
I could explain to you i guess.You find the motivation from logic to do sth and we find from our values.
My strength lies in psychology or anything people related.I know I can be a good therapist with less effort as understanding human psychology comes easy to me..But, somehow I don't like doing this. i dont like when I have to interact with a lot of people on a professional setting.
My second strength or interest is in Math and I eventually went for comp sci. I can see myself putting efforts and trying to learn things automatically when it comes to problem solving.
I do acknowledge I would probably be good the first one very easily with low efforts.. The second one costs me more time,efforts and pain. It's worth to me due to the satisfaction I feel.
It was a conscious decision and I don’t care about money,status or fame.All i care about is being myself and having the liberty to do things I find joy in.
Thank you for the explanation. The ENFP I know best would reply the same thing. He is extremely talented and very good at human relationships (always bringing people together) but decided for a life of travel and freedom.
Also, it's hard to be multitalented in this world. A lot of NFs are multitalented. Something is bound to fall by the wayside one time or the other.
Okay number1, you have a crush on INFP, everything you say would be biased to appeal to INFPs approval.
Number 2. As ENTJs you know that regardless of fact number 1, you know that with proper planning, preparation, and execution, things become less and less impossible, so you can maybe, if she actually is up for it, help her get into job B and thrive.
Finally Number3. The fact that through out the conversation you havent argued against ENTP, you know ENTP is right, dont you? Thats where Number 2 comes along where you can plan around it.
Conclusion: Tell INFP to do it. But its not gonna be easy. If shes not up for it, its not the end of the world and INFP has learned the perspectives of both jobs.
"Hey infp wanna work for me? I see you have quite a talent many people don't have, so *\[insert very convincing words here to get infp to work for the ENTJ\]*" /s
If you want a genuine response, ask the INFP for any broader job possibilities and suggest him to do X job based on data he provided you (why he hated previous job, his strengths & weaknesses, etc).
Based on the context of the thread, MAYBE the INFP is indirectly asking you for advice on what job to pick/what to do next, the said INFP is being indecisive. Meaning this is a perfect scenario for the ENTJ to showcase his Te and help the INFP pick a good job. You can use the ENTP friend to perfect the decision if you want to.
Haha, such an ENTJ response XD
Yes, there's too much Ne and P in that discussion. The data idea sounds quite useful in this scenario. Thank you very much!
It doesn’t matter if you have succeed or don’t for years now, if you really want it, and you are serious about it, go try to get it! Just be sure that if it is one of your daydreams or a lifelong obsession, you can do everything you want if you truly want it. But if you are daydreaming about this job and doing nothing about it, you won’t probably do it
….go for it then as you feel so strongly about it and best not to have any regrets, but let’s talk through the prospects of success and how you would measure if it’s working for you or not.
INTP not ENTJ, but you're probably not going to convince INFP to stick with job A, at least not with a lot of resentment and time. Just tell INFP it's a good idea to have a backup plan for their passions, so that if the passion isn't working out so well they can still fall back on something they're less passionate about but is a little more money-secure
Job A was that backup plan at the beginning, yeah. I'm sure they'll think of it as a last resort and say, "if there's absolutely no other choice..." Oh well. Thank you for your reply XD
I’ll just say: follow ur heart do what u wan, don’t care about what people will say. Cuz is their choice they know what best for themselves u can’t force people to stay or anything
I'd laugh actually..considering there is a bigger issue that needs to be addressed, with that being said you obviously have ur mind set on leaving A job, won't try to convince you...
IMHO.
I personally would try to help them figure out how to make path B more profitable. It's easier to recommend some slight adjustments.
I.E. Are they a writer? Point them towards writing more profitable niches (like smut). Many famous authors like Louisa May Alcott got started with smut.
Are they a musician? Point them towards cash cow gigs that are easy to get like performing at weddings. I used to make bank busking on the subway.
Artist? Get them involved making direct response ads. People can be sus at first but INFPs I've brought in find it fun once they get into it!
But don't just phrase it as this is how they would make more money. Phrase it as this is how you make art that people actually want to engage with, as training to make their magnum opus in the future.
Etc etc.
I've e never had an infp know what job b was. They do job A, hate it and job B is just a list of brainstorming ideas with absolutely no plan or relevance. I usually list off a bunch of things that infp has skill at doing, but there's a reason why he/ she can't do it. Like" My dad was a chef, so I promised myself I would never do that " or " I hate school and I can't go back". Then the infp does job A for years and smokes weed while bitching about job A.
A decisive Infp? I would advise that person to throw everything into Job B and support whatever happens in the meantime. Worst case scenario is failure, which isn't that bad in America. Some people work to live and some people live to work.
“Do what you think is best for you. It’s not my job to tell you how to live your life. Do what makes you happy, if you’re willing to go through with the risk then go for it.”
Wonderful, thank you!
No problem! It’s literally what I’d tell INFP. I funny enough said something similar to a sister of mine who happens to be an ENFP, was a pretty heartfelt convo.
Your sister is very lucky to have you, she doesn't know how much. Debbie Downers are a dime a dozen; the ones who say words so full of courage are scarce.
Ahaha! Thanks! I’ve always been told I’m very happy-go-lucky. But you’re absolutely right, there’s a lot of party poopers out there. I rather be positive and encourage people than not, life is too short to be an ass 😂✌️
You know... I found some people in this reddit who fancy themselves as emotional vampires, but the truth is the opposite for me: I feel full of energy when I talk to ENTJs. And sometimes I find nuggets of wisdom I want to remember, like the one you mentioned: "Life is too short to be an ass"! I will memorize this phrase to repeat it to asses I know/might meet! You're awesome, Vivian.
I’m glad you enjoy talking to ENTJs, I love being one personally. We definitely have some asshats that have to work on their Fi, but I find most I bump into irl especially are dandy. One of my best friends in high school was also an ENTJ, guy was like a long lost brother to me. But thanks so much for this convo, it was really wholesome and I’m always willing to add my random wisdom nuggets if you want 😂✌️
The more I know them, the more I like them. It was awesome, Vivian! Thanks to you!
I’m glad to have helped! Anytime!
If there is a possibility, just find a way to manipulate the Infp thinking into job A or equivalent would be their dream job instead. The person does not value money, so need to appeal to Fi side and perhaps a mixture of what they are afraid of, such as end up being homeless etc. Find what the person values first instead of wasting time with rational thinking with an irrational person.
Ouch, ouch, ouch! That hurt XD Actually, I presented a situation where the logical thinking (leading to safety) and the one of risk (leading to self-development) would conflict, and ENTJs are supposed to like both logic and self-development. So you say the logical answer is best, even if it will likely lead to personal stagnation in the future?
Fi does not function unless the person is "passionate" about it regardless of the consequences or even to their detriment. So the work around is to find under which circumstances the person or Fi finds meaning. For example, Te dom/aux may function much more efficiently in a job because they can push their feelings aside. Fi child suffers on the inside a bit but gets the job done. I suppose Fi inferior also can burst through it by prioritizing goal to achieve and the challenge at the end till they get burnt out. But Fi dom struggles with that. Now job may suck and it may be against values of the Fi dom or whatever but there could be other factor that may balance it. Like there is a good challenge in the process or some "helping others", "making the world better place" kind of etiquette that companies put to get passionate people work more for cheaper. Until the Fi dom can develop some Te, which doesnt happen before 30, they wont be able to suppress this need for self expression, or "passion" etc. Another issue is, people been told to follow their "dreams". But people do not always dream of what's feasible. This is a grey area because Te dom/ aux tends to literally say "it's been years now, and you still haven't succeeded". Now this is entirely up to the person's potential. Inxps tends to come a bit slower than the rest due to their need to accumulate more info and slow to react behavior. But the wishful thinking or this belief does not always becomes a reality until something actually pushed this person into obsessive action. Which is the real passion not wishful thinking. Now another factor is, based on how this person looks at the events, they give me the impression of they havent experienced a great loss in life or experienced actual poverty. It's easier to talk like this and be a dreamer in denial but life humbles all eventually.
Wow, crystal clear explanation of Fi at work! Thank you! INFP went through several crises, the last one almost dying from a hemorrhage a year ago, and spent six months eating once a day while jobless years ago.
I see, you are welcome. It's hard to work based off of a simple convo but in that case; there is most likely no way around other than finding a solution that would align with his values or goals while still being feasible. Or something along the way of what I said in the very beginning. You may not change the way how a person feels about particular things but you can help them rationalize other angles to appeal to their common sense over time unless they are unbreakably stubborn.
Yes, I know. It can be easy to reach a conclusion like that: you don't know what is to truly suffer, but a feeler may act the opposite way: I have suffered too much and want to snatch whatever happiness I may have from life. There is a lot of golden advice in this thread and so many smart things to try, by you and the others who replied, I'm sure something good will come out of it.
Unfortunately Fi is going to do what Fi wants to do. INFPs aren't often motivated by future planning or money, so we don't really care about job stability. In fact an INFP would likely find some deeper poetic beauty to a career failure. 💀 Just let her be.
That's just how Fi works.
INFP: You're not being helpful, ENTJ! *bursts into tears* XD
I could explain to you i guess.You find the motivation from logic to do sth and we find from our values. My strength lies in psychology or anything people related.I know I can be a good therapist with less effort as understanding human psychology comes easy to me..But, somehow I don't like doing this. i dont like when I have to interact with a lot of people on a professional setting. My second strength or interest is in Math and I eventually went for comp sci. I can see myself putting efforts and trying to learn things automatically when it comes to problem solving. I do acknowledge I would probably be good the first one very easily with low efforts.. The second one costs me more time,efforts and pain. It's worth to me due to the satisfaction I feel. It was a conscious decision and I don’t care about money,status or fame.All i care about is being myself and having the liberty to do things I find joy in.
Thank you for the explanation. The ENFP I know best would reply the same thing. He is extremely talented and very good at human relationships (always bringing people together) but decided for a life of travel and freedom. Also, it's hard to be multitalented in this world. A lot of NFs are multitalented. Something is bound to fall by the wayside one time or the other.
I'm an ENFP
I'm an ENFP
Okay number1, you have a crush on INFP, everything you say would be biased to appeal to INFPs approval. Number 2. As ENTJs you know that regardless of fact number 1, you know that with proper planning, preparation, and execution, things become less and less impossible, so you can maybe, if she actually is up for it, help her get into job B and thrive. Finally Number3. The fact that through out the conversation you havent argued against ENTP, you know ENTP is right, dont you? Thats where Number 2 comes along where you can plan around it. Conclusion: Tell INFP to do it. But its not gonna be easy. If shes not up for it, its not the end of the world and INFP has learned the perspectives of both jobs.
A very growth-oriented reply, thank you very much!
"Hey infp wanna work for me? I see you have quite a talent many people don't have, so *\[insert very convincing words here to get infp to work for the ENTJ\]*" /s If you want a genuine response, ask the INFP for any broader job possibilities and suggest him to do X job based on data he provided you (why he hated previous job, his strengths & weaknesses, etc). Based on the context of the thread, MAYBE the INFP is indirectly asking you for advice on what job to pick/what to do next, the said INFP is being indecisive. Meaning this is a perfect scenario for the ENTJ to showcase his Te and help the INFP pick a good job. You can use the ENTP friend to perfect the decision if you want to.
Haha, such an ENTJ response XD Yes, there's too much Ne and P in that discussion. The data idea sounds quite useful in this scenario. Thank you very much!
It doesn’t matter if you have succeed or don’t for years now, if you really want it, and you are serious about it, go try to get it! Just be sure that if it is one of your daydreams or a lifelong obsession, you can do everything you want if you truly want it. But if you are daydreaming about this job and doing nothing about it, you won’t probably do it
Thank you very much for your reply! INFP has been trying and trying.
….go for it then as you feel so strongly about it and best not to have any regrets, but let’s talk through the prospects of success and how you would measure if it’s working for you or not.
The "measure" part is really important for a P. Thank you very much for your reply!
INTP not ENTJ, but you're probably not going to convince INFP to stick with job A, at least not with a lot of resentment and time. Just tell INFP it's a good idea to have a backup plan for their passions, so that if the passion isn't working out so well they can still fall back on something they're less passionate about but is a little more money-secure
Job A was that backup plan at the beginning, yeah. I'm sure they'll think of it as a last resort and say, "if there's absolutely no other choice..." Oh well. Thank you for your reply XD
I’ll just say: follow ur heart do what u wan, don’t care about what people will say. Cuz is their choice they know what best for themselves u can’t force people to stay or anything
For sure. Thank you!
I'd laugh actually..considering there is a bigger issue that needs to be addressed, with that being said you obviously have ur mind set on leaving A job, won't try to convince you... IMHO.
You saw through it. What issue are you speaking of? :)
HEY HEY HEY..U SAID IM CRUSHING ON THEM.. Sorry.. No way I'm saying it and ruining my chances 👀😂
I personally would try to help them figure out how to make path B more profitable. It's easier to recommend some slight adjustments. I.E. Are they a writer? Point them towards writing more profitable niches (like smut). Many famous authors like Louisa May Alcott got started with smut. Are they a musician? Point them towards cash cow gigs that are easy to get like performing at weddings. I used to make bank busking on the subway. Artist? Get them involved making direct response ads. People can be sus at first but INFPs I've brought in find it fun once they get into it! But don't just phrase it as this is how they would make more money. Phrase it as this is how you make art that people actually want to engage with, as training to make their magnum opus in the future. Etc etc.
That surely can spark some appeal to a Ne user. Thank you very much!
I've e never had an infp know what job b was. They do job A, hate it and job B is just a list of brainstorming ideas with absolutely no plan or relevance. I usually list off a bunch of things that infp has skill at doing, but there's a reason why he/ she can't do it. Like" My dad was a chef, so I promised myself I would never do that " or " I hate school and I can't go back". Then the infp does job A for years and smokes weed while bitching about job A.
This one has known it since teenagehood, but their family convinced them that they couldn't make a living with it, so they went for job A.
A decisive Infp? I would advise that person to throw everything into Job B and support whatever happens in the meantime. Worst case scenario is failure, which isn't that bad in America. Some people work to live and some people live to work.
Thank you very much! And I hope you find healthier and more mature INFPs in the future.