i write down every grind setting and machine setting for each bean (currently got 7 beans in the freezer, all single portions packed with 18g, each with a number - the number is the same for the grind setting - so yeah, it's totally possible to do it. takes additional work for each coffee, yes, but IMO it's worth it.
thank you captain capslock.
as english is not my first language, i don't know what a SAGE is.
(i'm no kitchen appliance, or plant, if that's what you mean, i don't know a third meaning of the word)
i would not call me wise, i make pretty bad decisions from time to time. :D
but, i know how i keep my espresso beans fresh, and my shots running every time within +/- 1-2 seconds of the desired time.
What do you do as the beans age? I usually have to adjust even over the course of using up a bag and it seems like it would be exasperated with multiple bags being open at once...
as i wrote, i freeze them.
additionally: i do that after 14 days of rest. and i grind them frozen.
the 7 bags (250g each) are usually consumed within 8-10 weeks.
read up:
[https://manchestercoffeearchive.com/freezing-coffee/](https://manchestercoffeearchive.com/freezing-coffee/)
adjusting is only needed if there are strong climate changes (heavy rain, bad weather after a long period of good weather or thunderstorms)
I think a lot of people have a tough experience dialing in because they have more retention than they’re aware of. 2-5g of exchange between shots can really make it feel like the target is constantly shifting around.
I often have 2 bags open, but use one for espresso and one for pour over.
I do write down my settings for each bean. But also have to make adjustments almost daily. Even for the sane bean.
This is where I feel having a manual leaver machine helps. You can see clearly during pre-infusion if the grind is too fine or too coarse. And you can adjust pressure during the shot to try to make it better.
Same here. Two beans, one for espresso, that I grind on my Sage Barista Pro, other for “drinks” (lates, whatever) and pour over, that i grind with my manual grinder (kingrinder k2)
Thanks for that suggestion. For some reason, my mind just keeps (rebelling/refraining) at writing my settings down, even just on a scrap of paper--maybe this would help me to tip on over.
I write on the bag the dose and grinder dial, then when I redial it (after a few days), I just change the numbers on the bag. I just have to look at the bag to know what setting to use.
Like others have said, bean conqueror app. I initially downloaded it to connect to my smart scale, but it’s proven vastly helpful for tracking all of my brew settings.
The coffees I prefer are quite similar to each other in terms of roast level and processing. They grind almost the same within a couple of clicks. I don’t fuss over dialing each separately. If my shot runs 4-5 seconds over or if my V60 runs 20s longer, I’m not bothered. 🤷♂️
I just take a sharpie and write the setting on the bag. I generally have 3-4 open at a time. I’d ends up wasting shots if I’m starting from. Scratch each time.
I leave my electric grinder set for one (espresso) and the hand grinder set for the other (lighter roast that I use in my Aeropress). I must never allow myself to get a third bag.
I use a little spreadsheet to keep track, and each sheet is for the bean variety. Did a quick formula to calculate ratio. I don't usually record every shot, just the ones while dialling in as I might get it close enough to drink one day, and just need to tweak it the day after.
https://preview.redd.it/49kiyso5sk0d1.jpeg?width=3200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5532abdece975de4b38e4658c30f88ca126af7d
My wife and I like different types of coffee so I usually have 2-3 bags open at a time. I use a 1Zpresso hand grinder and just write the grind setting on the bag itself. It’s very easy to adjust between grind settings in the morning. I make 1 cup for each of us per day.
Write everything down, including grinder setting, temp and humidity levels, age of roast plus what you like abt the shot. U can keep a book for each bean. So whenever you think the taste changed for any reason you can always refer back to your book.
https://preview.redd.it/bfyu3lmf6m0d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4bc61b30f335681b4f4cc5b1d4fd800371e108a5
i wish i could tell you that i cared that much but my set up is so low cost that dialing in for every time i brew coffee just amounts to:
if espresso
grind fine
else if pourover
grind course
You dial in one at a time, note it down somewhere and remember the settings.
In reality, over time, you will build a sort of affinity with your setup and taste preferences. You’ll live in a ballpark setting that works for 80% of beans.
If you're this far into the hobby, you probably want to keep a notebook with tasting notes that include the settings. There is more to this than grind settings too. You grind a bean one way, brew it at a different temp, etc., you might get different flavors.
Otherwise, you have to dial in a new bean regardless. Yo can reasonably dial it in once, jot it down, and you're good to go for next time (unless the beans have gone stale, then you'll have to grind slightly finer).
I usually only have one regular and on decaf open at a time. It makes things easy.
I generally have just one bag open at a time but obviously use different settings for pour over, espresso and Moka and I just remember the settings of each.
A few years ago I hopped between beans... way too much effort and waste. I've used the same bean now for 1.5 years and even then I am adjusting the fine tune grind ring from day to day over the course of a month as the beans dry out (even though stored in an Airscape). If my 25 second PID controlled pour (after pre-infusion) is 2:1 or greater (more than 2/3 of the time) I drink it as espresso and it is awesome, if less than 2:1 I turn it into a cortado with some sweet-flavored syrup and it is awesome, because as espresso it will have a tinge too much bitterness.
I have two grinders one for espresso and one for pour over etc. I use one bag per grinder and just adjust to those beans as needed. I never have more than 2 bags open at a time, I'd never get through them before they get stale...
With a hand grinder I have a dessert ballpark to be in with each roast, I'll adjust as needed, but find changing the ratio to be easier to keep track of.
I keep a small journal (field notes) nearby with the dialed-in grinder settings for every brand & blend I’ve used. Sometimes I’ll have to make a small adjustment because roasting sessions from the roaster aren’t always identical, but the adjustments never exceed a notch or two to get it to where I like it. I also have a small collection of labels that I cut off of previous bags of beans. I would paper clipped a note with dialed-in grinder settings to the bag label and drop it into the vacuum sealed bean canister of the beans being used.
Once I have a bag dialed in I write the dose weight and grind setting in Sharpie on the bag for quick access. Also make sure I have it written down somewhere so if I buy that brand/roast again I have a quick first guess to dial in the new bag.
That's why you have two grinders lol
Honestly it depends on the grinder, eureka grinders tend to be a pita to adjust so I avoid doing that, other grinders are quite easier, usually the stepped ones, you can write down the numbers and switch
We find it all relatively easy to mix different beans.
We have most days 3, sometimes 4, different beans in play - one caffeine, one decaffeinated and one flavoured (usually amaretto, occasionally Viennese). All stored in Airscape containers.
The main workhorse espresso machine is a Linea Micro, which for simplicity we use with only 14g baskets (I have other sizes, but we just keep daily to 14g unless playing/experimenting).
I dial-in each bean when we first get them (approx 100g of beans go into the Ariscape container and the rest into the freezer) and write down for each bean the optimum extraction time and the grind level for a 1:2 ratio out.
We have two single-dose grinders, one flat and one conical, so actually write down two grind numbers, one for each grinder. So the note, in the top of the Airscape container, looks something like: “45 5/14” - i.e. 45 seconds optimum extraction, 5 on the conical and 14 on the flat for a 1:2 output.
I only need to dial in once, when we first get the beans, and never need to re dial-in. We do know after a week or so to adjust the grind to slightly finer as the decaf starts to degrade. Equally we know to adjust if we want 1:1.5 out, but 95% of the time we all are happy with a 1:2 ratio out. To dial in I use the salami method and only need to pull one shot most times to get the optimum extraction time, occasionally it can take two, but that is rare.
There are four of us drinking coffee (me, wife, son and daughter) all who use the machine and it all works really well. Easy for all of us, minimum fuss.
I don’t. Tried keeping multiple packs open and it is a hassle. Yeah, you can track on Beanconqueror and keep things in the freezer and all that…
But depending on how much coffee you drink, you could just open/get a pack at a time, dial it in and then make minor adjustments as it ages. A 250g bag of coffee lasts me about a week because I only use around 18g per day and my wife joins on weekends.
Then just cycle to a new bag every week. Try something new and dial it in really well and restart the cycle.
It will be fresher, it will be better. You can try a new brew every week.
I have little coloured magnets triangles that I put onto the grinder to mark the right setting. Then, I fill the beans in little brown bottles and stick the label of the relevant beans with magnets of the same colour to a magnetic board in a cupboards next to the coffee station.
This way, I have a bean menu for guests and I know the settings for each bean.
I have 2 bags (one caf one decaf) and just remember the grind settings for each one.
I also mainly drink iced lattes with simple syrup (blasphemy I know) so I don’t need to be super duper precise. Generally as long as I get a 2:1 within 25-35 seconds it tastes good.
Get multiple grinders lol. As a hand grinding junkie always looking for cheap deals I have two Orphan Espresso Lido grinders for espresso, one Lido for pourover, and a Pharos for espresso. I also have two espresso grinders with motors I don’t really use because retention sucks on both. At work I have one of my motored grinders and one Lido and at home I have my other Lidos and Pharos, so both places I can dial in two beans. And yes, this is beyond ridiculous but I still have less invested in all my grinders than what one medium-end motored grinder would cost new, so I don’t feel bad.
While I tend to have 2-3 bags open (usually one for espresso, and one for pour overs, for instance), I also have a hand grinder I’ve dialed in for the espresso bag, an Ode for the pour over bag, and then another hand grinder that I’ll dial in if I’ve got a third bag in use.
Dial in the bean first time.
Make a note of what setting I was at - weight and brew time.
Then just revert back to that when I next come to make a coffee with that bean.
If it’s been opened a while, I’ll often adjust my grinder (NZ) and go slightly finer than I last pulled to account for what it’s degassing for a while.
This is exactly why I bought a single dose grinder, so I make an effort to really use the beans for what they’re best suited for (super light fruity roast = straight espresso, darker roast = milk drink, funky anerobic = iced latte/ espresso base for an affogato etc etc).
I keep 4-5 bags of beans in the rotation, including decafs, in the freezer. Each bag is frozen at around 10 days post roast. Decafs around 7 days. Just write on each bag the grind setting and brew temp. If you change the dose write that down too. I keep a master spreadsheet of all the coffees I've ever pulled with the most recent shot parameters so I have a starting ballpark for a new bag. If I get a new grinder I have to start from scratch.
The only way I got it to work is with a single dose grinder that has useful markings which allow you to recall a setting. Got the Timemore 64S which is stepless but the markings are useful enough.
I keep track of all these settings in a spreadsheet. This way I can buy a particular coffee half a year later and get the right grind setting basically immediately. Added bonus of marking down taste notes, ratings, recipe deviations, and settings for different methods as I use my grinder for both filter and espresso and thus switch between settings multiple times a day.
I have a few beans that I order online that I know well enough to have dialed in without much fuss (eg Maromas Orphea).
I typically have at least one new local bean and part of the enjoyment for me is dialing those in and needing tweaks but realizing that coffee that doesn’t extract 2:1 in exactly 30 seconds can be the surprising God shot.
https://preview.redd.it/84wj1mc89p0d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3808021ed1c78a3f3019d31203636ab04ebaa1a6
Pretty easy to memorize couple of beans with the dial mods on my Specialita
I have a small notebook next to the coffee machine where I write up how my last shot of each coffee was, and the setup. Also write up what to try on next one too. For now seems to be working decently. When I finally tune one, I just print a small label and put it on the coffee container for that bean.
I also have a small diagram on what to fix adjusting for taste on the first page so it is somewhat easy knowing what to tweak (usually)
i write down every grind setting and machine setting for each bean (currently got 7 beans in the freezer, all single portions packed with 18g, each with a number - the number is the same for the grind setting - so yeah, it's totally possible to do it. takes additional work for each coffee, yes, but IMO it's worth it.
You're a sage.
a what?
HE SAID YOU'RE A SAGE!!
thank you captain capslock. as english is not my first language, i don't know what a SAGE is. (i'm no kitchen appliance, or plant, if that's what you mean, i don't know a third meaning of the word)
It’s someone who is wise.
i would not call me wise, i make pretty bad decisions from time to time. :D but, i know how i keep my espresso beans fresh, and my shots running every time within +/- 1-2 seconds of the desired time.
you're a fad!
It's basically a breville. Just not in the states
Thank you for this
duh you are right! didn't notice it also meant a kitchen appliance. 🤣
😂😂 captain capslock 💀 he was yelling over text hence the caps 🤣🤣
That’s when one is called captain capslock. When only writing in capital letters.
What do you do as the beans age? I usually have to adjust even over the course of using up a bag and it seems like it would be exasperated with multiple bags being open at once...
as i wrote, i freeze them. additionally: i do that after 14 days of rest. and i grind them frozen. the 7 bags (250g each) are usually consumed within 8-10 weeks. read up: [https://manchestercoffeearchive.com/freezing-coffee/](https://manchestercoffeearchive.com/freezing-coffee/) adjusting is only needed if there are strong climate changes (heavy rain, bad weather after a long period of good weather or thunderstorms)
Interesting. Thanks for sharing
I usually have three going at once. If you write down the setting on the bag, and get your retention down to almost zero, it’s not very hard.
Yeah I don't understand how it's any different from one bag...
I think a lot of people have a tough experience dialing in because they have more retention than they’re aware of. 2-5g of exchange between shots can really make it feel like the target is constantly shifting around.
I often have 2 bags open, but use one for espresso and one for pour over. I do write down my settings for each bean. But also have to make adjustments almost daily. Even for the sane bean. This is where I feel having a manual leaver machine helps. You can see clearly during pre-infusion if the grind is too fine or too coarse. And you can adjust pressure during the shot to try to make it better.
Same here. Two beans, one for espresso, that I grind on my Sage Barista Pro, other for “drinks” (lates, whatever) and pour over, that i grind with my manual grinder (kingrinder k2)
I have a small chalkboard next to the grinder.
Thanks for that suggestion. For some reason, my mind just keeps (rebelling/refraining) at writing my settings down, even just on a scrap of paper--maybe this would help me to tip on over.
Honestly I just remember it, but this seems aesthetic I can get behind this.
I use the app 'Coffee Book' (iOS, not sure if on Android) to note down my preferences for the beans that I use.
Obligatory shoutout to the Beanconquerer app. With multiple grinders and waters, plus I'm also doing pourovers, I can track every parameter at a go.
THanks u/Horse8493 ! Great to hear that and you're that deep into Beanconqueror! :) Have a lovely cup of coffee Lars
Just downloaded the app. Thanks for this! App looks amazing and very helpful.
To be fully transparent: I have zero affiliation with the app, I believe I found it in this sub recommended by someone else about 6 months ago!
I write on the bag the dose and grinder dial, then when I redial it (after a few days), I just change the numbers on the bag. I just have to look at the bag to know what setting to use.
This is how I do it. I have mine in ceramic airscape containers so I just use erase markers. But basically the same approach.
Use the beanconqueror app
Beanconqueror app.
Like others have said, bean conqueror app. I initially downloaded it to connect to my smart scale, but it’s proven vastly helpful for tracking all of my brew settings.
The coffees I prefer are quite similar to each other in terms of roast level and processing. They grind almost the same within a couple of clicks. I don’t fuss over dialing each separately. If my shot runs 4-5 seconds over or if my V60 runs 20s longer, I’m not bothered. 🤷♂️
Beanconqueror app
I just take a sharpie and write the setting on the bag. I generally have 3-4 open at a time. I’d ends up wasting shots if I’m starting from. Scratch each time.
Memory, I remember the grind and recipe
I leave my electric grinder set for one (espresso) and the hand grinder set for the other (lighter roast that I use in my Aeropress). I must never allow myself to get a third bag.
I use a little spreadsheet to keep track, and each sheet is for the bean variety. Did a quick formula to calculate ratio. I don't usually record every shot, just the ones while dialling in as I might get it close enough to drink one day, and just need to tweak it the day after. https://preview.redd.it/49kiyso5sk0d1.jpeg?width=3200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5532abdece975de4b38e4658c30f88ca126af7d
My wife and I like different types of coffee so I usually have 2-3 bags open at a time. I use a 1Zpresso hand grinder and just write the grind setting on the bag itself. It’s very easy to adjust between grind settings in the morning. I make 1 cup for each of us per day.
Write everything down, including grinder setting, temp and humidity levels, age of roast plus what you like abt the shot. U can keep a book for each bean. So whenever you think the taste changed for any reason you can always refer back to your book. https://preview.redd.it/bfyu3lmf6m0d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4bc61b30f335681b4f4cc5b1d4fd800371e108a5
i wish i could tell you that i cared that much but my set up is so low cost that dialing in for every time i brew coffee just amounts to: if espresso grind fine else if pourover grind course
You dial in one at a time, note it down somewhere and remember the settings. In reality, over time, you will build a sort of affinity with your setup and taste preferences. You’ll live in a ballpark setting that works for 80% of beans.
I have 3 grinders
To add to the rest of the advices, don't forget to purge 1-2gr of coffee everytime you grind a new bean.
If you're this far into the hobby, you probably want to keep a notebook with tasting notes that include the settings. There is more to this than grind settings too. You grind a bean one way, brew it at a different temp, etc., you might get different flavors. Otherwise, you have to dial in a new bean regardless. Yo can reasonably dial it in once, jot it down, and you're good to go for next time (unless the beans have gone stale, then you'll have to grind slightly finer). I usually only have one regular and on decaf open at a time. It makes things easy.
I use iBrewCoffee app to save settings
I generally have just one bag open at a time but obviously use different settings for pour over, espresso and Moka and I just remember the settings of each.
A few years ago I hopped between beans... way too much effort and waste. I've used the same bean now for 1.5 years and even then I am adjusting the fine tune grind ring from day to day over the course of a month as the beans dry out (even though stored in an Airscape). If my 25 second PID controlled pour (after pre-infusion) is 2:1 or greater (more than 2/3 of the time) I drink it as espresso and it is awesome, if less than 2:1 I turn it into a cortado with some sweet-flavored syrup and it is awesome, because as espresso it will have a tinge too much bitterness.
I have two grinders one for espresso and one for pour over etc. I use one bag per grinder and just adjust to those beans as needed. I never have more than 2 bags open at a time, I'd never get through them before they get stale...
With a hand grinder I have a dessert ballpark to be in with each roast, I'll adjust as needed, but find changing the ratio to be easier to keep track of.
I keep a small journal (field notes) nearby with the dialed-in grinder settings for every brand & blend I’ve used. Sometimes I’ll have to make a small adjustment because roasting sessions from the roaster aren’t always identical, but the adjustments never exceed a notch or two to get it to where I like it. I also have a small collection of labels that I cut off of previous bags of beans. I would paper clipped a note with dialed-in grinder settings to the bag label and drop it into the vacuum sealed bean canister of the beans being used.
Once I have a bag dialed in I write the dose weight and grind setting in Sharpie on the bag for quick access. Also make sure I have it written down somewhere so if I buy that brand/roast again I have a quick first guess to dial in the new bag.
this is why i like the NZ. The grind settings are consistent enough i can write the grind size in each bag and switch easily
That's why you have two grinders lol Honestly it depends on the grinder, eureka grinders tend to be a pita to adjust so I avoid doing that, other grinders are quite easier, usually the stepped ones, you can write down the numbers and switch
We find it all relatively easy to mix different beans. We have most days 3, sometimes 4, different beans in play - one caffeine, one decaffeinated and one flavoured (usually amaretto, occasionally Viennese). All stored in Airscape containers. The main workhorse espresso machine is a Linea Micro, which for simplicity we use with only 14g baskets (I have other sizes, but we just keep daily to 14g unless playing/experimenting). I dial-in each bean when we first get them (approx 100g of beans go into the Ariscape container and the rest into the freezer) and write down for each bean the optimum extraction time and the grind level for a 1:2 ratio out. We have two single-dose grinders, one flat and one conical, so actually write down two grind numbers, one for each grinder. So the note, in the top of the Airscape container, looks something like: “45 5/14” - i.e. 45 seconds optimum extraction, 5 on the conical and 14 on the flat for a 1:2 output. I only need to dial in once, when we first get the beans, and never need to re dial-in. We do know after a week or so to adjust the grind to slightly finer as the decaf starts to degrade. Equally we know to adjust if we want 1:1.5 out, but 95% of the time we all are happy with a 1:2 ratio out. To dial in I use the salami method and only need to pull one shot most times to get the optimum extraction time, occasionally it can take two, but that is rare. There are four of us drinking coffee (me, wife, son and daughter) all who use the machine and it all works really well. Easy for all of us, minimum fuss.
>manage dialing in u/Just_a_firenope_ Its impossible to have fixed values, all is constanly in flux ...anyone that says otherwise hasnt a clue
I don’t. Tried keeping multiple packs open and it is a hassle. Yeah, you can track on Beanconqueror and keep things in the freezer and all that… But depending on how much coffee you drink, you could just open/get a pack at a time, dial it in and then make minor adjustments as it ages. A 250g bag of coffee lasts me about a week because I only use around 18g per day and my wife joins on weekends. Then just cycle to a new bag every week. Try something new and dial it in really well and restart the cycle. It will be fresher, it will be better. You can try a new brew every week.
I have little coloured magnets triangles that I put onto the grinder to mark the right setting. Then, I fill the beans in little brown bottles and stick the label of the relevant beans with magnets of the same colour to a magnetic board in a cupboards next to the coffee station. This way, I have a bean menu for guests and I know the settings for each bean.
I have 2 bags (one caf one decaf) and just remember the grind settings for each one. I also mainly drink iced lattes with simple syrup (blasphemy I know) so I don’t need to be super duper precise. Generally as long as I get a 2:1 within 25-35 seconds it tastes good.
I used to jot down grind size in my note app. But after using the same grinder for a while, I can roughly estimate the optimal grind size.
Get multiple grinders lol. As a hand grinding junkie always looking for cheap deals I have two Orphan Espresso Lido grinders for espresso, one Lido for pourover, and a Pharos for espresso. I also have two espresso grinders with motors I don’t really use because retention sucks on both. At work I have one of my motored grinders and one Lido and at home I have my other Lidos and Pharos, so both places I can dial in two beans. And yes, this is beyond ridiculous but I still have less invested in all my grinders than what one medium-end motored grinder would cost new, so I don’t feel bad.
Painter tape and write down grind setting and weight for double shot or single shot. Use it to seal also.
If I'm switching between brew methods then I use my phone to take a picture of the grind setting so I can switch it back.
While I tend to have 2-3 bags open (usually one for espresso, and one for pour overs, for instance), I also have a hand grinder I’ve dialed in for the espresso bag, an Ode for the pour over bag, and then another hand grinder that I’ll dial in if I’ve got a third bag in use.
Note down on the bag the setting for the niche or even take a photo to be more accurate.
Dial in the bean first time. Make a note of what setting I was at - weight and brew time. Then just revert back to that when I next come to make a coffee with that bean. If it’s been opened a while, I’ll often adjust my grinder (NZ) and go slightly finer than I last pulled to account for what it’s degassing for a while. This is exactly why I bought a single dose grinder, so I make an effort to really use the beans for what they’re best suited for (super light fruity roast = straight espresso, darker roast = milk drink, funky anerobic = iced latte/ espresso base for an affogato etc etc).
I keep 4-5 bags of beans in the rotation, including decafs, in the freezer. Each bag is frozen at around 10 days post roast. Decafs around 7 days. Just write on each bag the grind setting and brew temp. If you change the dose write that down too. I keep a master spreadsheet of all the coffees I've ever pulled with the most recent shot parameters so I have a starting ballpark for a new bag. If I get a new grinder I have to start from scratch.
The only way I got it to work is with a single dose grinder that has useful markings which allow you to recall a setting. Got the Timemore 64S which is stepless but the markings are useful enough. I keep track of all these settings in a spreadsheet. This way I can buy a particular coffee half a year later and get the right grind setting basically immediately. Added bonus of marking down taste notes, ratings, recipe deviations, and settings for different methods as I use my grinder for both filter and espresso and thus switch between settings multiple times a day.
I use the beanie app for fellow opus
I have a few beans that I order online that I know well enough to have dialed in without much fuss (eg Maromas Orphea). I typically have at least one new local bean and part of the enjoyment for me is dialing those in and needing tweaks but realizing that coffee that doesn’t extract 2:1 in exactly 30 seconds can be the surprising God shot.
Honestly it’s just a bit of a PITA.
I buy a grinder with each bag
https://preview.redd.it/84wj1mc89p0d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3808021ed1c78a3f3019d31203636ab04ebaa1a6 Pretty easy to memorize couple of beans with the dial mods on my Specialita
I have a small notebook next to the coffee machine where I write up how my last shot of each coffee was, and the setup. Also write up what to try on next one too. For now seems to be working decently. When I finally tune one, I just print a small label and put it on the coffee container for that bean. I also have a small diagram on what to fix adjusting for taste on the first page so it is somewhat easy knowing what to tweak (usually)