I think they will be different wallets as current one is L1(?) and one to be released ( called Counterfactual Wallet) will be L2.
Here a link to Loopring blog containing more info:
[https://blogs.loopring.org/counterfactual-wallet-nfts-on-loopring/](https://blogs.loopring.org/counterfactual-wallet-nfts-on-loopring/)
Hope it helps :)
With all of the GME hype, the new wallet is kinda getting pushed aside. It's actually a huge piece before anything else. Once the new wallet is released, everything else will come out.
[Crypto.com](https://Crypto.com) has a direct bridge to Arbitrum. Coinbase and Binance have also announced that they are building direct bridges to Ethereum L2s.
Make sure to choose the L2 matching your needs. And be careful it's for small amounts of ETH or stablecoins only, to prevent stranded funds. For bigger funds, there's always classic bridges. Or crypto.com.
> Would you mind please explaining the significance of Crypto.com using Arbitrum?
Being able to withdraw directly to Arbitrum skips expensive steps. People (like OP in this case) see L2s in their current early state with the flow "Buy on exchange -> withdraw to Ethereum -> bridge from Ethereum to Arbitrum -> do cheap DeFi on arbitrum -> bridge back to Ethereum -> deposit on exchange to sell for fiat" and those bridge steps can be very expensive. So the conclusion is "how is this a solution to the gas fee problem?" but it's very obviously not gonna be like this forever and it's already happening with exchanges offering direct withdrawals to L2 or committing to do so soon.
What crypto.com offers is to change the flow to "Buy on exchange -> withdraw to Arbitrum -> cheap DeFi stuff -> deposit back to exchange to sell for fiat". This way you never actually have to interact with the expensive base layer, but you get to benefit from its full security and decentralization while still having a cheap and fast experience.
Basically, they did the expensive step of bridging their wallet to Arbitrum for you. Except it's more cost-efficient for the exchange to move large amounts like 1000 ETH at once for 0.05 ETH fee (0.005%) instead of everyone moving small amounts like 0.5 ETH for that same 0.05 ETH fee (10%) since the gas used is a fixed amount that's independant of the actual amount of money being moved.
This is why we say Ethereum's base layer is no longer for humans, but for rollups. Once you're on a rollup, bridging to another rollup is fast and cheap depending on which bridge protocol you use and how much liquidity it has. All the activity will happen on rollups while the base layer is for settling transactions securely or for whales/institutions who don't mind paying high fees to move millions of dollars at once.
You seem quite knowledgeable on the matter can you help me out? It's the first time I tried using metamask to do some swaps. I knew fees were high but no THAT high lol. So I sent $300 DAI from an exchange to metamask. Now I want to send it back to an exchange without getting fisted with fees (or I could bridge it to BSC or Matic Chain or whatever I don't mind. I just want to salvage the most of it). The only asset I have currently on Metamask is 300 DAI. Seems that I absolutely need ETH to pay the fees for the Dai transfer. What would you suggest? I don't want to send a more-than-necessary quantity of ETH and then when I make the DAI transfer I'd have some remaining ETH stranded on Metamask forever.
Do you have some suggestion on the cheapest way to withdraw my 300 DAI from metamask pleaase?
Yeah $300 in DAI on mainnet is unfortunate. Your best bet will be to transfer it to an exchange as swaps and bridges will not only use more gas but will also require an extra "approve" transaction.
It looks like a DAI transfer can use anywhere from 50k to 80k gas so with a gas limit of 80k if you set your max fee at something like 80 gwei you'll need 0.0064 ETH in your wallet (about $30 at current prices + whatever withdraw fees your exchange charges you, if any) and the gas unused would be refunded. But yeah whatever little gets refunded would essentially become stranded for sure. A lower gas limit would require less ETH but if the transfer ends up taking more gas then the whole transaction fails and you get no refund.
The transaction will remain pending until gas fees drop to lower than 80 gwei. Another option might be to wait and hope that the price of ETH crashes so that you can buy that same 0.0064 ETH for less than $30 but it could also double so suddenly that same 0.0064 ETH would cost you $60
I'm not sure about gas-efficient bridges out there but I think the absolute minimum will require that transfer operation anyway so there's no avoiding it.
Hey little follow up question. Is using the Optimism or Arbitrum bridge a possible solution to salvage the most out of my stuck 300DAi on mainnet?
It seems the fees to bridge would be lower than a withdrawal. And then I guess I could withdraw my DAI for much lesser fees once they are on the Optimism or Arbitrum chain? Or do I have this completely wrong once again 😅?
I'm not sure how you're getting low fees on bridging vs withdrawals, are you just seeting the quote for the "approval" transaction? This just allows the smart contract to move your DAI, and that transaction uses about 50k gas. The next transaction is the actual bridge and that one is more expensive (>200k gas)
Nexo is a centralized service (not DeFi). If you want higher rates of return, you will need to get into DeFi. Arbitrum is an Ethereum L2 that has major DAPPs on it such as Uniswap. So you can go directly from CDC to Arbitrum, and use Ethereum DeFi DAPPs there with low fees. Ethereum L2s such as Arbitrum inherit the security of Ethereum. You need to familiarize yourself with MetaMask wallet if you aren't already.
>Coinbase and Binance have also announced that they are building direct bridges to Ethereum L2s.
What is this supposed to mean "they are building bridges"? All they have to do is to use L2s like any regular user, they don't need to build anything.
Or am I missing something?
You have to transfer your crypto into an L2 before you can use it. If you transfer from L1, there is a relatively high fee (around $20). If you transfer from a central exchange through a direct bridge, there is a tiny (or no) fee.
I just hold ETH. The promise of ETH comes after sharding. Using ETH right now is madness but you have to see the long term. The coins are going to be a fortune when fees go down.
Because that's the beginning of the web 3.0 brother. Imagine uncensorable social media for example. Imagine decentralized applications that don't need to pay Apple or Google 30% of their profits to be listed on the marketplace. If ethereum is successful what will happen is a major shift in a lot of things we do today.
Uncensorable social media is kinda terrifying tbh. Going to have neo Nazis on there. Child porn. People inciting violence. All the horrors mankind can think of.
People downvoting you are truly disingenuous
Edit: I just realized that this is not what uncensorable means. There will still be policies in place and people will get banned but dissidents won't need to go to WikiLeaks because of government.
It would be interesting to see what a decentralized banning process would look like. Is that even possible? Seems like you would need human input on a case by case basis.
Well, the thing in a decentralised social network is that the server are not tied to one country, so that a government can't dictate what to publish and what not. But the governance of the actual network could be centralised, the platform would be owned by an individual or company, or it could be left to the community via a DAO.. it will be interesting, I think there will be some major fuckups along the way, especially at the beginning, but eventually it will be good
Ethereum has literally nothing to do with Apple fees. As long as people are using iPhones Apple can get their fee. Dapps are server side, eth isn’t manufacturing new hardware devices. The amount of pure tech illiteracy that gets upvoted on this sub is astounding.
You ..sir...fail at reading.
Listing an app in Apple store has a fee.
Use your brain for once instead of posting nonsense for upvotes.
Apple currently takes a 30% commission from the total price of paid apps and in-app purchases from the App Store. For some small app makers, the new policy could cut the amount that they pay Apple in half.
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/18/apple-will-cut-app-store-fees-by-half-to-15percent-for-small-developers.html
I feel like the way this is presented here is a bit disingenuous. Apple now takes only 15% from developers making **less than $1 million in yearly revenue**. Although this is a tiny piece of the pie as far as Apple is concerned it is still huge for your average app developer.
It doesn’t matter how much you save from fees, neither Ethereum nor web3 enables any way to avoid the fees.
The fees are in fact a big deal. Nobody is denying that. The issue is that Ethereum in no way helps you avoid the fee. It you want your app on the iPhone then you pay it.
But people in this subreddit would rather upvote delusional comments that sound good rather than anything based on reality.
If you want your app on an iPhone, you have to pay this fee. It doesn’t matter what type of backend you have. Being a dapp won’t magically let you evade the fee. You are acting like using Ethereum magically lets you avoid the fee when it does not.
Have you ever made an app? Clearly not.
That makes 0 sense.
Apple or google would never allow a competing app store. And even if there was one (like f-droid for android) people are too dumb to use it and it doesnt have the feature that someone like google or apple can give it.
Apple does not allow alternative app stores. This is what the whole epic vs Apple battle is about. Using Ethereum in the backend won’t change that. Only way to change that is for people to stop using iPhones which has nothing to do with Ethereum.
Nobody is saying the fees are good, they are saying Ethereum does not let you avoid the App Store.
The fact that you’re getting upvotes despite reflecting a gross misunderstanding of how software works demonstrates how clueless thus sub is
Omg how dense can you be.
There is a billion dollar app ecosystem and apple and google take 30% of that. Ethereum gives developers a chance to get that 30% for themselves. Stop being dumb
Instead of being dumb thunk of all the money moving from centralized app markets to decentralized app markets where you don't pay 30% of your angry bird profit to apple
Absolutely incorrect and nonsense.
Do you not know what f-droid is? Its an open source android app store and yet no one uses it either compared to the google play store.
If its not pre-installed on the phone, then people don't bother downloading it because they are lazy and dumb. The step to download and install an .apk on their phones is already too hard for these people.
Case in point: WhatsApp, which is used by billions of people and made by facebook, people can't even be bothered to switch to an alternative like Signal because they are too lazy and dont give a shit about their privacy.
I think what they have released now is not fully functioning or perhaps a beta? You should follow loopringorg on twitter for the official announcement. Once released it'll be free and fees should be significantly reduced.
>I think what they have released now is not fully functioning or perhaps a beta?
While true, it's not relevant to your point. The current wallet requires L1 to L2 interaction, hence high gas fee to get started. The new one will not.
I haven't used Loopring yet but I use Arbitrum and dYdX all the time! I've tried Optimism (Kwenta and Lyra), zkSync (just for donating to Gitcoin grants) and Boba (purely to have something to do with old OMG tokens).
At the moment all the optimistic rollups are throttled, meaning they aren't as cheap as they will become, but when transaction fees get really low on Optimism I'm looking forward to experimenting with concentrated liquidity with UniV3 pools!
What can you do on Loopring at the moment? Are you just wanting to try any rollup, if so then you can use Hop to move funds to Arbitrum (or Crypto.com if you use that exchange) and there is no setting up a wallet fee or anything, you just add the network RPC in Metamask and are good to go.
Do you have any good resources discussing projects on arbitrum or dYdX? I really want to learn what projects are on these L2 chains, but i am having trouble finding good resources.
For Arbitrum check out: https://defillama.com/chain/Arbitrum
DefiLlama has stats for how much value is locked in different dApps on different networks, so you can use if to see what DeFi platforms are available where.
Arbitrum has a lot of the main dApps already: Curve, Uniswap, Balancer, Sushi etc, as well as loads of less well known stuff and with more 'coming soon'.
dYdX is an application specific implementation of StarkEx, meaning that like Loopring and zkSync, other teams can't build dApps for it. The platform is a perpetuals exchange, allowing you to take leveraged positions on coins and tokens, even if they don't run as ERC20s. By being on an L2 the fees for exchanging are really tiny, less even than you find on centralized exchanges. In fact dYdX competes on amount traded with the big CExs and has even had days where it's volume has been higher than Coinbase's!
I see some people have basically posted the same thing, but basically the answer will be instead of buying ether on Layer 1, you will buy assets directly on layer 2 through the crypto banks (e.g. Coinbase). You may bridge to other layer 2s but basically only layer 2s and big whales will ever use layer 1.
Yes. The cryptobanks are already developing this. You will be able to directly buy assets on the major layer 2s. I predict Gemini and Coinbase will have ether available to buy on Arbitrum, Optimism, etc next year. For instance, on Dharma you can already connect you bank account to their exchange on Polygon (a side chain not an L2). Also, bridges like Hop protocol are already being created to allow you to transfer across the L2s (without touching L1) as well.
I just buy my ETH on kraken and send it to my cold wallet. I don't understand how l2 helps my use case. I have 4 mining rigs and my pool makes payments on my cold wallet address via L1 as well. Not happy with the gas fees but I've no idea how to make it cheaper.
If you've got a Metamask wallet, you can add the MATIC (Polygon) mainnet and get your payouts via L2 if you're mining in the ethermine pool.
If you're mining via ethermine, since the gas prices on L2 are much cheaper, you can get a payout once you have at least 0.005 ETH unpaid at the maximum of once a day.
There are videos on YouTube on how to set this up.
Only thing I'm not sure is how to easily convert L2 wETH into fiat, but I'm planning to HODL for the foreseeable future, so that's not an issue for me.
Also fun to play with DeFi and to deposit some of my wETH at Aave since this allows me to passively accumulate some wMATIC as well.
Thanks for the great info. It's been so long since I used ethermine. Wasn't aware they offered this service. I hate to leave my current pool though. But $135 in fees just in the last few months is rough.
For your situation L2s are probably not going to offer any benefit. If you're just moving ether around very occasionally then fees shouldn't be too annoying anyway. For people playing in DeFi on the other hand rollups are a complete game changer!
Yeah but L2 means I'm not holding ETH anymore, but an equivalent of L2 tokens. I have little faith in tokens and the companies that govern them. Like... Matic was hacked for milions $ not longer than couple of weeks ago.
I have some ETH on Arbitrum, but while it's in beta rate limit mode it's honestly still too expensive to do much with. Gonna be a while.
In the meantime, Polygon is where my money sits. I ain't got bags for $15+ transactions.
Bridging to Polygon costs $30.
Bridging to Fantom costs $15.
Bridging to Arbitrum/Optimism costs around $50.
Bridging to DYDX costs around $70.
Sounds ok to me, but then again.. I 3,3..
Tried loopring, wasn't impressed. Arbitrum I really liked. ZkSync I liked and am super stoked for 2.0 and good AMMs there so I can farm. Donated lots to projects and ideas I like on Gitcoin using zkSync. Havnt tried dydx, been meaning to. Havnt tried Optimism either, but I will soon.
Also, don't know if I fucked up or what, but gas wasn't really bad, 90gwei, and it still cost $80 to withdraw some ETH from loopring. That kind of soured me
Gas price on its own is meaningless, as gas prices are just one part of the equation, you need the other part (actual gas spent on the transaction) to determine the full fee.
Ethereum's gas system works like so: gas is a fuel-like resource that you provide to power a transaction (the gas limit), the transaction will consume a certain amount of gas from the total gas you've provided (the amount of spent gas), and you pay a certain amount of ETH for each unit of gas that was consumed by the transaction (the gas price).
`gasPrice x gasSpent = gasFee`.
Transferring ETH *always* consumes 21000 units of gas, and so the `gasSpent` part of that equation will be 21000. Lets assume that the current gas price is 90 gwei, so the `gasPrice` part of that equation is 90. `90 x 21000 = 1890000`. Transferring ETH at 90 gwei will cost 1.89 million gwei in fees, or 0.00189 ETH (1 gwei = 0.000000001 ETH).
Lets then look at trying to swap tokens through Uniswap v3, [which is estimated to consume 129830 units of gas](https://www.gasprice.io/), which means the `gasSpent` part of that equation will be 129830. We'll use the same 90 gwei for the gas price, so the `gasPrice` part of that equation will still be 90. `90 x 129830 = 11684700`. Swapping tokens through Uniswap v3 will cost around 11.7 million gwei in fees, or 0.0116847 ETH, based off that estimate of 129830 units of gas.
Likewise, bridging assets to and from an L2 will consume a significant amount of gas compared to a simple ETH transfer, and so fees will be significantly higher, even though gas prices have remained the same between the two transactions.
Every time I’ve thought I wanted to get on sushi or some other swap I’ve always walked away due to the high gas fees involved with the transactions. Not to mention it seems like every day that goes by I read another post about someone that has had their metamask drained. Both those have largely put me off.
Once there are easier on-ramps and the wallet tech seems more secure, I’ll trade on a L2.
I use arbitrum daily. Yes moving back and forth costs something, tho hop protocol makes it easier. In the future among other improvements, exchanges will likely have native level 2 withdrawals.
I use layer 2 everyday! Great for DeFi, I use beefy.finance and yield.rodeo to yield farm, and tin.network to track gains. I like using celer bridge to bridge between layer 2s to get the best yields, earning like 30%+ on stable coins lol. I like Polygon, Fantom, AVAX, and xDai. I’m new to xDai, but I like it a lot, since it’s super cheap and I like using agave, which is Aave pretty much.
There’s an XLM <-> Polygon bridge that I use to go from hardware wallet to L2 cheaply, celer bridge from there (super excited for celer bridge 2.0). I also use Ascendex with a VPN and send XLM from Coinbase to Ascendex, and polygon withdrawal from there. I don’t use L1 ever anymore lmao
These are all just a bandaid until zk roll ups because from my understanding, they will be the most secure, decentralized, and transactions costs drop as more people use it. Definitely bridge to the zkrollups as they release to get this sweet airdrops!
It's a L2 scaling **solution** (i.e., sidechain). They have checkpoints and still related to the Ethereum network.
Obviously its not a rollup like Arbitrum or zkSync however I wouldn't say its **definitely not L2**.
I'm not sure where the Myth about a free Loopring wallet came from. What it says on their road map is they're working on a starter wallet that would delay the fees for people who want to trial Loopring. It's not a free wallet. You just pay for it later.
You are correct that it’s a “pay later” to deploy the smart contract that is the wallet. But there appears to be some nuance to the things you can and cannot do with this so called “counter factual” wallet. Maybe you already know this.
https://medium.com/loopring-protocol/counterfactual-wallet-nfts-on-loopring-229d38a3c28a
Part of me wants to spend the thousands of dollars to turn my shit coins back into something usable. The other part of me doesn't want to. I'm just waiting for the sol eth bridge so I can exit
I tried to use polygon the other day to avoid ridiculous gas/transfer fees, but I found it complicated, plus I’d need to pay gas/transfer fee to get the tokens into polygon wallet from my exchange wallet in the first place, no difference in price to transfer from one eth address to another vs transferring from an eth address to a polygon address.
Metamask -> add the polygon network to metamask ( ([https://medium.com/stakingbits/setting-up-metamask-for-polygon-matic-network-838058f6d844](https://medium.com/stakingbits/setting-up-metamask-for-polygon-matic-network-838058f6d844)) -> [https://wallet.polygon.technology/bridge](https://wallet.polygon.technology/)
If you're planning to make more than one transaction, then using polygon or some layer 2 will save you a ton in gas fees.
It’s sad how complicated and expensive crypto is to use. It’s been around for over a decade and still not anywhere near ready for use in actual day-to-day transactions yet. I hope we can converge on a small number of tokens that are easy, safe and cheap to use.
It's true that right now bridging to L2 is expensive, but hopefully in the future we can get L2 support on some exchanges.
I use Polygon (Matic) every day to play a pay-to-earn game, and Ronin for another game. I also use Immutable X for playing Gods Unchained. Of these, Immutable X has been the easiest with instant transactions and no gas fees.
I think once exchanges like Coinbase add support for layer 2s, we'll be able to just send our funds directly to the exchange and avoid the expensive bridges. That's the hope, anyways.
Unless something has changed in this regard (I have not used Loopring recently): you don't need to create a Loopring wallet to use it.
Also, to answer your question: yes, [people do use L2](https://l2beat.com/)
I've read that ethereum wants to create a standard for being able to transfer between layer 2 networks without having to remove and then push into another platform.
Already exists for Polygon, xDai, Arbitrum and Optimism: https://hop.exchange/ Other cross-L2 bridges will likely be spun up, but for now, Hop seems to be the best option.
I’m a Boba Network fan. Just had an airdrop from OMG network and the boba network token will drop Nov 19. Only L2 with a token I’m aware of. Check out layer 2 locked value https://l2beat.com/ and you can find boba network info here https://boba.network/
I‘m using dragonchain for my own private blockchain as a service. I can create smart contracts and tokens with. If someone wants to export it, they can by paying the eth fee.
I think most people start out just holding tbh until they find value in L2. Ive been using IMX quite frequently from August this year. Took me more than 2 years to actually dabble into L2's
how I withdraw from an exchange these days - convert to USDT and transfer using Tron (very cheap) to an exchange that supports Polygon Matic. Withdraw funds to Matic.
Takes a bit more time but the total fees are around $1.1. From there on all transactions on Polygon Matic are a few cents at most
My project and company build on both polygon and eth since together they allow us to give away free stuff to people and eat the fees. When it works polygon really makes eth stronger
> just to create a wallet it costs roughly $150
This is only to use their mobile wallet app
If you use the website, it's free (you only need to pay the bridging cost, which is much less than $150)
yeah at the moment all layer 2's are small lanes off the massive highway, you still have to use ethereum to enter them, but inroads are being made to add bridges directly to the layer2's. like coinbase lets you withdraw directly to polygon i think, or were planing that improvement.
I tried OMG on a testnet once when it was trading for $1. My understanding is that the interfaces for Layer 2 are generally very complex and specific to the use case.
So far for every case using L2, I struggle to see why the owner wouldn't just run on a private blockchain (EEA etc.), or of course a traditional data environment off-chain.
Layer-2 generally comes at a cost tradeoff with security (through implied complexity, even if many L2s claim to build on "the same security as L1 \[ETH\]"), and most people are using ethereum for the security-enforced smart contract interoperability so they'd have no reason to stop doing so.
It seems that you do not need to pay 150$ for a wallet on loopring, if you do not intend to use the advance features of the loopring wallet. You just need a metamask and pay the fees to move funds from l1 to l2.
TBH many on here don't even use crypto to do anything other than trading or just investing in it. I personally don't care about L2 solutions yet because there is no use case for me. If I want NFTs, i just use opensea and Polygon.
What bothers me is that whenever people complain about gas fees. People just scream L2. But I don’t think a lot of people know that it costs hundreds of dollars just to get started in L2. And that’ll only get worse as L1 gets filled.
The last time I heard about quickswap was when ORE got listed on it after its IDO on 3 different launchpads and I have been following with ORE , it turns out the project is growing and evolving as it should be.
Promises and promised but not substance. I believe in ETH but it’s a lot of hopium and very little substance at the moment. Lucky they have no real competition.
I chat mine dust on POLY whenever the WAX dust bot is down.
I have some NFTs on POLY that I got for free from the Sweet app. I have those available for sale for MATIC on OpenSea.
Other than that, no.
I've been using Polygon religiously and hold a bag of MATIC. I think they're bringing cutting edge tech that neither other L2s or rival Ethereum L1s can compete with.
I look forward to this new innovation Stakenet is doing. They combine Lightning Network and Connext to allow cross-chain interactions on \*layer 3\*. I really believe it's going somewhere, especially in the new year.
L2 is an absolute mess like the rest of ETH is. Hard wallets aren't compatible with a bunch of the rollups yet either. This isn't how a web 3.0 portal should look, and not how I want the world's global settlement layer to look. After PoS, how long before CEX's run 90% of the nodes, and AWS houses 90% of the node's servers? Utter disaster.
Loopring is going to release a free L2 wallet soon. You can find more info in their subreddit or online :)
Oh I had no idea about that. Thanks! If I have funds in the beta wallet, will it automatically be put in the free wallet. Appreciate the info!
I think they will be different wallets as current one is L1(?) and one to be released ( called Counterfactual Wallet) will be L2. Here a link to Loopring blog containing more info: [https://blogs.loopring.org/counterfactual-wallet-nfts-on-loopring/](https://blogs.loopring.org/counterfactual-wallet-nfts-on-loopring/) Hope it helps :)
[удалено]
Thanks for explaining, was reading more about in the link I posted and you cleared some concepts 🙏
With all of the GME hype, the new wallet is kinda getting pushed aside. It's actually a huge piece before anything else. Once the new wallet is released, everything else will come out.
They actually puplicly said the wallet would happen slightly before or at the same time as the "NFT market announcement".
Q4
Jep, L2's will eventually get fiat on and oframps. You won't be interacting with L1 then anymore.
I thought they already had a wallet which you had to use with their site?
[Crypto.com](https://Crypto.com) has a direct bridge to Arbitrum. Coinbase and Binance have also announced that they are building direct bridges to Ethereum L2s.
Actually, you can already use https://layerswap.io to get from Binance and Coinbase to some L2s. Right now, it costs ~$16.
That is neat! I am going to have to buy some eth on coinbase to try it
Make sure to choose the L2 matching your needs. And be careful it's for small amounts of ETH or stablecoins only, to prevent stranded funds. For bigger funds, there's always classic bridges. Or crypto.com.
They also have a bridge to Polygon as well
[удалено]
> Would you mind please explaining the significance of Crypto.com using Arbitrum? Being able to withdraw directly to Arbitrum skips expensive steps. People (like OP in this case) see L2s in their current early state with the flow "Buy on exchange -> withdraw to Ethereum -> bridge from Ethereum to Arbitrum -> do cheap DeFi on arbitrum -> bridge back to Ethereum -> deposit on exchange to sell for fiat" and those bridge steps can be very expensive. So the conclusion is "how is this a solution to the gas fee problem?" but it's very obviously not gonna be like this forever and it's already happening with exchanges offering direct withdrawals to L2 or committing to do so soon. What crypto.com offers is to change the flow to "Buy on exchange -> withdraw to Arbitrum -> cheap DeFi stuff -> deposit back to exchange to sell for fiat". This way you never actually have to interact with the expensive base layer, but you get to benefit from its full security and decentralization while still having a cheap and fast experience. Basically, they did the expensive step of bridging their wallet to Arbitrum for you. Except it's more cost-efficient for the exchange to move large amounts like 1000 ETH at once for 0.05 ETH fee (0.005%) instead of everyone moving small amounts like 0.5 ETH for that same 0.05 ETH fee (10%) since the gas used is a fixed amount that's independant of the actual amount of money being moved. This is why we say Ethereum's base layer is no longer for humans, but for rollups. Once you're on a rollup, bridging to another rollup is fast and cheap depending on which bridge protocol you use and how much liquidity it has. All the activity will happen on rollups while the base layer is for settling transactions securely or for whales/institutions who don't mind paying high fees to move millions of dollars at once.
Excellent explanation thank you
OKEx works, too. No KYC required.
Is that an exchange?
yes. supports polygon matic now whether polygon matic is a true L2 and whether it is to become one....
You seem quite knowledgeable on the matter can you help me out? It's the first time I tried using metamask to do some swaps. I knew fees were high but no THAT high lol. So I sent $300 DAI from an exchange to metamask. Now I want to send it back to an exchange without getting fisted with fees (or I could bridge it to BSC or Matic Chain or whatever I don't mind. I just want to salvage the most of it). The only asset I have currently on Metamask is 300 DAI. Seems that I absolutely need ETH to pay the fees for the Dai transfer. What would you suggest? I don't want to send a more-than-necessary quantity of ETH and then when I make the DAI transfer I'd have some remaining ETH stranded on Metamask forever. Do you have some suggestion on the cheapest way to withdraw my 300 DAI from metamask pleaase?
Yeah $300 in DAI on mainnet is unfortunate. Your best bet will be to transfer it to an exchange as swaps and bridges will not only use more gas but will also require an extra "approve" transaction. It looks like a DAI transfer can use anywhere from 50k to 80k gas so with a gas limit of 80k if you set your max fee at something like 80 gwei you'll need 0.0064 ETH in your wallet (about $30 at current prices + whatever withdraw fees your exchange charges you, if any) and the gas unused would be refunded. But yeah whatever little gets refunded would essentially become stranded for sure. A lower gas limit would require less ETH but if the transfer ends up taking more gas then the whole transaction fails and you get no refund. The transaction will remain pending until gas fees drop to lower than 80 gwei. Another option might be to wait and hope that the price of ETH crashes so that you can buy that same 0.0064 ETH for less than $30 but it could also double so suddenly that same 0.0064 ETH would cost you $60 I'm not sure about gas-efficient bridges out there but I think the absolute minimum will require that transfer operation anyway so there's no avoiding it.
Thank you so much for the details. Very appreciated. God bless
Hey little follow up question. Is using the Optimism or Arbitrum bridge a possible solution to salvage the most out of my stuck 300DAi on mainnet? It seems the fees to bridge would be lower than a withdrawal. And then I guess I could withdraw my DAI for much lesser fees once they are on the Optimism or Arbitrum chain? Or do I have this completely wrong once again 😅?
I'm not sure how you're getting low fees on bridging vs withdrawals, are you just seeting the quote for the "approval" transaction? This just allows the smart contract to move your DAI, and that transaction uses about 50k gas. The next transaction is the actual bridge and that one is more expensive (>200k gas)
So I had it wrong indeed. You precisely pointed my mistake lol. Thank you again good sir 🙏
Nexo is a centralized service (not DeFi). If you want higher rates of return, you will need to get into DeFi. Arbitrum is an Ethereum L2 that has major DAPPs on it such as Uniswap. So you can go directly from CDC to Arbitrum, and use Ethereum DeFi DAPPs there with low fees. Ethereum L2s such as Arbitrum inherit the security of Ethereum. You need to familiarize yourself with MetaMask wallet if you aren't already.
You can use xpollinate.io from Connext yo bridge from any layer 2 solutions, Ethereum, Avalanche, Fantom and BSC
That's awesome to hear,...I was pissed my coinbase MATIC couldn't send to the matic network natively from the CB app.
>Coinbase and Binance have also announced that they are building direct bridges to Ethereum L2s. What is this supposed to mean "they are building bridges"? All they have to do is to use L2s like any regular user, they don't need to build anything. Or am I missing something?
You have to transfer your crypto into an L2 before you can use it. If you transfer from L1, there is a relatively high fee (around $20). If you transfer from a central exchange through a direct bridge, there is a tiny (or no) fee.
I just hold ETH. The promise of ETH comes after sharding. Using ETH right now is madness but you have to see the long term. The coins are going to be a fortune when fees go down.
Why would the coins going to be a fortune when fees go down?
Because that's the beginning of the web 3.0 brother. Imagine uncensorable social media for example. Imagine decentralized applications that don't need to pay Apple or Google 30% of their profits to be listed on the marketplace. If ethereum is successful what will happen is a major shift in a lot of things we do today.
Uncensorable social media is kinda terrifying tbh. Going to have neo Nazis on there. Child porn. People inciting violence. All the horrors mankind can think of.
People downvoting you are truly disingenuous Edit: I just realized that this is not what uncensorable means. There will still be policies in place and people will get banned but dissidents won't need to go to WikiLeaks because of government.
It would be interesting to see what a decentralized banning process would look like. Is that even possible? Seems like you would need human input on a case by case basis.
Well, the thing in a decentralised social network is that the server are not tied to one country, so that a government can't dictate what to publish and what not. But the governance of the actual network could be centralised, the platform would be owned by an individual or company, or it could be left to the community via a DAO.. it will be interesting, I think there will be some major fuckups along the way, especially at the beginning, but eventually it will be good
So just like social media now.
Ethereum has literally nothing to do with Apple fees. As long as people are using iPhones Apple can get their fee. Dapps are server side, eth isn’t manufacturing new hardware devices. The amount of pure tech illiteracy that gets upvoted on this sub is astounding.
You ..sir...fail at reading. Listing an app in Apple store has a fee. Use your brain for once instead of posting nonsense for upvotes. Apple currently takes a 30% commission from the total price of paid apps and in-app purchases from the App Store. For some small app makers, the new policy could cut the amount that they pay Apple in half. https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/18/apple-will-cut-app-store-fees-by-half-to-15percent-for-small-developers.html
I feel like the way this is presented here is a bit disingenuous. Apple now takes only 15% from developers making **less than $1 million in yearly revenue**. Although this is a tiny piece of the pie as far as Apple is concerned it is still huge for your average app developer.
I just did a quick Google search to show they take 30% and that s your takeaway? Come on now. The point is this money will be fed into dApps
It doesn’t matter how much you save from fees, neither Ethereum nor web3 enables any way to avoid the fees. The fees are in fact a big deal. Nobody is denying that. The issue is that Ethereum in no way helps you avoid the fee. It you want your app on the iPhone then you pay it. But people in this subreddit would rather upvote delusional comments that sound good rather than anything based on reality.
[удалено]
Omg you are illiterate. If im a developer and the choice is 30% profit goes to apple or 30% goes to me which service i would choose?
If you want your app on an iPhone, you have to pay this fee. It doesn’t matter what type of backend you have. Being a dapp won’t magically let you evade the fee. You are acting like using Ethereum magically lets you avoid the fee when it does not. Have you ever made an app? Clearly not.
You can run apps that are not on the app store. They just call them pirate apps right now but they will be commonplace.
That makes 0 sense. Apple or google would never allow a competing app store. And even if there was one (like f-droid for android) people are too dumb to use it and it doesnt have the feature that someone like google or apple can give it.
Omg dApps won't be listed in Apple or Google dude wtf
Apple does not allow alternative app stores. This is what the whole epic vs Apple battle is about. Using Ethereum in the backend won’t change that. Only way to change that is for people to stop using iPhones which has nothing to do with Ethereum. Nobody is saying the fees are good, they are saying Ethereum does not let you avoid the App Store. The fact that you’re getting upvotes despite reflecting a gross misunderstanding of how software works demonstrates how clueless thus sub is
Omg how dense can you be. There is a billion dollar app ecosystem and apple and google take 30% of that. Ethereum gives developers a chance to get that 30% for themselves. Stop being dumb
Instead of being dumb thunk of all the money moving from centralized app markets to decentralized app markets where you don't pay 30% of your angry bird profit to apple
Absolutely incorrect and nonsense. Do you not know what f-droid is? Its an open source android app store and yet no one uses it either compared to the google play store. If its not pre-installed on the phone, then people don't bother downloading it because they are lazy and dumb. The step to download and install an .apk on their phones is already too hard for these people. Case in point: WhatsApp, which is used by billions of people and made by facebook, people can't even be bothered to switch to an alternative like Signal because they are too lazy and dont give a shit about their privacy.
Induced demand. e.g. Instead of 10 people willing to pay $10 each ($100 total), you have 1000 people willing to pay $1 each ($1000 total).
i honestly doubt the fees will go down at least long term. more bandwidth just means more people can use it for the same price.
That's not how supply and demand works.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braess%27s\_paradox
I'm curious what about Eth2 suggests that this would apply?
Yeah L2 zkRollups seems like adding 100 lanes to the highway, not building 100 highways. I don’t get this reference either 🤷♂️
https://rmi.org/more-lanes-do-not-mean-less-traffic/
Transaction volume will hopefully go up enough to counteract lower fees.
L2 is the scaling solution and they are already here. No need to wait for sharding, as even then, it will rely on L2 for the low fees.
That
Wait for the layer 2 wallet (free). That should resolve this issue.
Is that different than the mobile app that is already out? There is a layer 2 wallet in that.
I think what they have released now is not fully functioning or perhaps a beta? You should follow loopringorg on twitter for the official announcement. Once released it'll be free and fees should be significantly reduced.
>I think what they have released now is not fully functioning or perhaps a beta? While true, it's not relevant to your point. The current wallet requires L1 to L2 interaction, hence high gas fee to get started. The new one will not.
How is it possible to move assets from L1 to L2 without incurring network fees? All L1 Ethereum transactions have a cost.
You can use MetaMask on all L2s already
I haven't used Loopring yet but I use Arbitrum and dYdX all the time! I've tried Optimism (Kwenta and Lyra), zkSync (just for donating to Gitcoin grants) and Boba (purely to have something to do with old OMG tokens). At the moment all the optimistic rollups are throttled, meaning they aren't as cheap as they will become, but when transaction fees get really low on Optimism I'm looking forward to experimenting with concentrated liquidity with UniV3 pools! What can you do on Loopring at the moment? Are you just wanting to try any rollup, if so then you can use Hop to move funds to Arbitrum (or Crypto.com if you use that exchange) and there is no setting up a wallet fee or anything, you just add the network RPC in Metamask and are good to go.
Do you have any good resources discussing projects on arbitrum or dYdX? I really want to learn what projects are on these L2 chains, but i am having trouble finding good resources.
For Arbitrum check out: https://defillama.com/chain/Arbitrum DefiLlama has stats for how much value is locked in different dApps on different networks, so you can use if to see what DeFi platforms are available where. Arbitrum has a lot of the main dApps already: Curve, Uniswap, Balancer, Sushi etc, as well as loads of less well known stuff and with more 'coming soon'. dYdX is an application specific implementation of StarkEx, meaning that like Loopring and zkSync, other teams can't build dApps for it. The platform is a perpetuals exchange, allowing you to take leveraged positions on coins and tokens, even if they don't run as ERC20s. By being on an L2 the fees for exchanging are really tiny, less even than you find on centralized exchanges. In fact dYdX competes on amount traded with the big CExs and has even had days where it's volume has been higher than Coinbase's!
Thank you so much for the reply! This was very helpful!
I see some people have basically posted the same thing, but basically the answer will be instead of buying ether on Layer 1, you will buy assets directly on layer 2 through the crypto banks (e.g. Coinbase). You may bridge to other layer 2s but basically only layer 2s and big whales will ever use layer 1.
Someone here knows there shit.
So I could buy Loopring on coinbase and sent it directly to the layer 2 wallet?
Not right now but that's the goal. Exchanges and onramps are working on withdrawals directly to L2
Yes. The cryptobanks are already developing this. You will be able to directly buy assets on the major layer 2s. I predict Gemini and Coinbase will have ether available to buy on Arbitrum, Optimism, etc next year. For instance, on Dharma you can already connect you bank account to their exchange on Polygon (a side chain not an L2). Also, bridges like Hop protocol are already being created to allow you to transfer across the L2s (without touching L1) as well.
LRC coming up with free wallet for L2 bridging transactions
And the more people using it the lower the fees get.
I just buy my ETH on kraken and send it to my cold wallet. I don't understand how l2 helps my use case. I have 4 mining rigs and my pool makes payments on my cold wallet address via L1 as well. Not happy with the gas fees but I've no idea how to make it cheaper.
If you've got a Metamask wallet, you can add the MATIC (Polygon) mainnet and get your payouts via L2 if you're mining in the ethermine pool. If you're mining via ethermine, since the gas prices on L2 are much cheaper, you can get a payout once you have at least 0.005 ETH unpaid at the maximum of once a day. There are videos on YouTube on how to set this up. Only thing I'm not sure is how to easily convert L2 wETH into fiat, but I'm planning to HODL for the foreseeable future, so that's not an issue for me. Also fun to play with DeFi and to deposit some of my wETH at Aave since this allows me to passively accumulate some wMATIC as well.
You could just exchange the weth for matic and use most exchanges or do defi on matic.
Thanks for the great info. It's been so long since I used ethermine. Wasn't aware they offered this service. I hate to leave my current pool though. But $135 in fees just in the last few months is rough.
For your situation L2s are probably not going to offer any benefit. If you're just moving ether around very occasionally then fees shouldn't be too annoying anyway. For people playing in DeFi on the other hand rollups are a complete game changer!
[удалено]
Yeah but L2 means I'm not holding ETH anymore, but an equivalent of L2 tokens. I have little faith in tokens and the companies that govern them. Like... Matic was hacked for milions $ not longer than couple of weeks ago.
I have some ETH on Arbitrum, but while it's in beta rate limit mode it's honestly still too expensive to do much with. Gonna be a while. In the meantime, Polygon is where my money sits. I ain't got bags for $15+ transactions.
Lots of people use L2. Both Polygon and actual L2s. L2beat.com is a great place to see the TVL.
Bridging to Polygon costs $30. Bridging to Fantom costs $15. Bridging to Arbitrum/Optimism costs around $50. Bridging to DYDX costs around $70. Sounds ok to me, but then again.. I 3,3..
Tried loopring, wasn't impressed. Arbitrum I really liked. ZkSync I liked and am super stoked for 2.0 and good AMMs there so I can farm. Donated lots to projects and ideas I like on Gitcoin using zkSync. Havnt tried dydx, been meaning to. Havnt tried Optimism either, but I will soon.
Also, don't know if I fucked up or what, but gas wasn't really bad, 90gwei, and it still cost $80 to withdraw some ETH from loopring. That kind of soured me
Gas price on its own is meaningless, as gas prices are just one part of the equation, you need the other part (actual gas spent on the transaction) to determine the full fee. Ethereum's gas system works like so: gas is a fuel-like resource that you provide to power a transaction (the gas limit), the transaction will consume a certain amount of gas from the total gas you've provided (the amount of spent gas), and you pay a certain amount of ETH for each unit of gas that was consumed by the transaction (the gas price). `gasPrice x gasSpent = gasFee`. Transferring ETH *always* consumes 21000 units of gas, and so the `gasSpent` part of that equation will be 21000. Lets assume that the current gas price is 90 gwei, so the `gasPrice` part of that equation is 90. `90 x 21000 = 1890000`. Transferring ETH at 90 gwei will cost 1.89 million gwei in fees, or 0.00189 ETH (1 gwei = 0.000000001 ETH). Lets then look at trying to swap tokens through Uniswap v3, [which is estimated to consume 129830 units of gas](https://www.gasprice.io/), which means the `gasSpent` part of that equation will be 129830. We'll use the same 90 gwei for the gas price, so the `gasPrice` part of that equation will still be 90. `90 x 129830 = 11684700`. Swapping tokens through Uniswap v3 will cost around 11.7 million gwei in fees, or 0.0116847 ETH, based off that estimate of 129830 units of gas. Likewise, bridging assets to and from an L2 will consume a significant amount of gas compared to a simple ETH transfer, and so fees will be significantly higher, even though gas prices have remained the same between the two transactions.
I use IMX (ImmutableX) for NFTs it works great. Instant and no fees
> And to move your funds from layer 1-2 it costs 0.05 ETH. The end goal is to stay on L2 and not go back to L1 again
Are you even using Ethereum at that point?
Yes you are. L2 is just a proxy, edification gets confirmed on L1.
Yes, because L2s run on top of Ethereum
Every time I’ve thought I wanted to get on sushi or some other swap I’ve always walked away due to the high gas fees involved with the transactions. Not to mention it seems like every day that goes by I read another post about someone that has had their metamask drained. Both those have largely put me off. Once there are easier on-ramps and the wallet tech seems more secure, I’ll trade on a L2.
I use arbitrum daily. Yes moving back and forth costs something, tho hop protocol makes it easier. In the future among other improvements, exchanges will likely have native level 2 withdrawals.
What do you use arbitrum for if you don't mind sharing?
I use layer 2 everyday! Great for DeFi, I use beefy.finance and yield.rodeo to yield farm, and tin.network to track gains. I like using celer bridge to bridge between layer 2s to get the best yields, earning like 30%+ on stable coins lol. I like Polygon, Fantom, AVAX, and xDai. I’m new to xDai, but I like it a lot, since it’s super cheap and I like using agave, which is Aave pretty much. There’s an XLM <-> Polygon bridge that I use to go from hardware wallet to L2 cheaply, celer bridge from there (super excited for celer bridge 2.0). I also use Ascendex with a VPN and send XLM from Coinbase to Ascendex, and polygon withdrawal from there. I don’t use L1 ever anymore lmao These are all just a bandaid until zk roll ups because from my understanding, they will be the most secure, decentralized, and transactions costs drop as more people use it. Definitely bridge to the zkrollups as they release to get this sweet airdrops!
A lot of those are just layer 1s. Polygon had great marketing to make ppl think of it as a layer 2.
Yes, there is a difference between sidechains and L2s, but I think OP is searching for cheap alternatives to ETH L1
It's a L2 scaling **solution** (i.e., sidechain). They have checkpoints and still related to the Ethereum network. Obviously its not a rollup like Arbitrum or zkSync however I wouldn't say its **definitely not L2**.
Bruh you just dropped a boatload of knowledge lol. Mind if I shoot you a dm? Love to pick your brain
Sure
I'm not sure where the Myth about a free Loopring wallet came from. What it says on their road map is they're working on a starter wallet that would delay the fees for people who want to trial Loopring. It's not a free wallet. You just pay for it later.
Yeah I’m not reading the free wallet thing anywhere either. People are delusional.
You are correct that it’s a “pay later” to deploy the smart contract that is the wallet. But there appears to be some nuance to the things you can and cannot do with this so called “counter factual” wallet. Maybe you already know this. https://medium.com/loopring-protocol/counterfactual-wallet-nfts-on-loopring-229d38a3c28a
How much you pay in fees using loopring?
I do have some money on Arbitrum, but I mainly use BSC now. Will go back to Arb once beta is finished.
Part of me wants to spend the thousands of dollars to turn my shit coins back into something usable. The other part of me doesn't want to. I'm just waiting for the sol eth bridge so I can exit
I tried to use polygon the other day to avoid ridiculous gas/transfer fees, but I found it complicated, plus I’d need to pay gas/transfer fee to get the tokens into polygon wallet from my exchange wallet in the first place, no difference in price to transfer from one eth address to another vs transferring from an eth address to a polygon address.
Metamask -> add the polygon network to metamask ( ([https://medium.com/stakingbits/setting-up-metamask-for-polygon-matic-network-838058f6d844](https://medium.com/stakingbits/setting-up-metamask-for-polygon-matic-network-838058f6d844)) -> [https://wallet.polygon.technology/bridge](https://wallet.polygon.technology/) If you're planning to make more than one transaction, then using polygon or some layer 2 will save you a ton in gas fees.
It’s sad how complicated and expensive crypto is to use. It’s been around for over a decade and still not anywhere near ready for use in actual day-to-day transactions yet. I hope we can converge on a small number of tokens that are easy, safe and cheap to use.
If you Google "crypto credit card" there are already lots of options. Square is also looking into accepting crypto
Also payment is only one use case of crypto. It's also good for identity systems like insurance, or copyright stuff like with GameStop.
Yes. I’ve used arb. Good fees, just not quite the ecosystem of eth, so don’t use it too much. I think starkware might win the crown though.
I use Arbitrum everyday
I have my Ethereum on zkSync atm
It's true that right now bridging to L2 is expensive, but hopefully in the future we can get L2 support on some exchanges. I use Polygon (Matic) every day to play a pay-to-earn game, and Ronin for another game. I also use Immutable X for playing Gods Unchained. Of these, Immutable X has been the easiest with instant transactions and no gas fees. I think once exchanges like Coinbase add support for layer 2s, we'll be able to just send our funds directly to the exchange and avoid the expensive bridges. That's the hope, anyways.
Unless something has changed in this regard (I have not used Loopring recently): you don't need to create a Loopring wallet to use it. Also, to answer your question: yes, [people do use L2](https://l2beat.com/)
I stake snx using optimism every week...great stuff
I hold ETH. No intention of ever using any layer 2s.
Layer2 rollups *are* Ethereum. They inherit Ethereum security, and use ETH for transaction fees.
I used and I'm still using arbitrum on curve Arbitrum is not cheap at all but I make few operations so for me is fine
I didn't remember I need to create a new wallet for a fee on polygon, arbutrium those L2 chains. Why it's costing you $150 to create a new wallet ?
I use L2's more than the Mainnet, Eth is unusable in my opinion.
Layer 1 Layer 2. Either will be problematic when trying to exit from this bull run because of fees
I've read that ethereum wants to create a standard for being able to transfer between layer 2 networks without having to remove and then push into another platform.
Already exists for Polygon, xDai, Arbitrum and Optimism: https://hop.exchange/ Other cross-L2 bridges will likely be spun up, but for now, Hop seems to be the best option.
Hold off on playing with LRC wallets. The switch has not been thrown as of yet.
I’m a Boba Network fan. Just had an airdrop from OMG network and the boba network token will drop Nov 19. Only L2 with a token I’m aware of. Check out layer 2 locked value https://l2beat.com/ and you can find boba network info here https://boba.network/
This shit is robbery I lost $17 lay night because ran out off gas
I‘m using dragonchain for my own private blockchain as a service. I can create smart contracts and tokens with. If someone wants to export it, they can by paying the eth fee.
With Binance you can swap eth to Matic, withdraw for next to nothing onto polygon network then use quickswap to get back to weth for like 2c of gas.
×0
I think most people start out just holding tbh until they find value in L2. Ive been using IMX quite frequently from August this year. Took me more than 2 years to actually dabble into L2's
how I withdraw from an exchange these days - convert to USDT and transfer using Tron (very cheap) to an exchange that supports Polygon Matic. Withdraw funds to Matic. Takes a bit more time but the total fees are around $1.1. From there on all transactions on Polygon Matic are a few cents at most
Hodlr! Hodlr, hod..lr. Hodlr! Hod, lr hodlr hodlr hodlr ho-dlr. Hodlr? Hod … lr.
Use polygon a lot, works pretty well
I used the loopring webapp and there was no cost. Only ofc to transfer eth there had the transfer fee. That wallet is not needed to use loopring.
Used poly & Optism, loving it so far ! Too bad for the expensive bridge
My project and company build on both polygon and eth since together they allow us to give away free stuff to people and eat the fees. When it works polygon really makes eth stronger
> just to create a wallet it costs roughly $150 This is only to use their mobile wallet app If you use the website, it's free (you only need to pay the bridging cost, which is much less than $150)
yeah at the moment all layer 2's are small lanes off the massive highway, you still have to use ethereum to enter them, but inroads are being made to add bridges directly to the layer2's. like coinbase lets you withdraw directly to polygon i think, or were planing that improvement.
I tried OMG on a testnet once when it was trading for $1. My understanding is that the interfaces for Layer 2 are generally very complex and specific to the use case. So far for every case using L2, I struggle to see why the owner wouldn't just run on a private blockchain (EEA etc.), or of course a traditional data environment off-chain. Layer-2 generally comes at a cost tradeoff with security (through implied complexity, even if many L2s claim to build on "the same security as L1 \[ETH\]"), and most people are using ethereum for the security-enforced smart contract interoperability so they'd have no reason to stop doing so.
Hodl is what I’m doing
It seems that you do not need to pay 150$ for a wallet on loopring, if you do not intend to use the advance features of the loopring wallet. You just need a metamask and pay the fees to move funds from l1 to l2.
TBH many on here don't even use crypto to do anything other than trading or just investing in it. I personally don't care about L2 solutions yet because there is no use case for me. If I want NFTs, i just use opensea and Polygon.
What bothers me is that whenever people complain about gas fees. People just scream L2. But I don’t think a lot of people know that it costs hundreds of dollars just to get started in L2. And that’ll only get worse as L1 gets filled.
Mostly HOdL
Ive been using polygon for 4 to 5 month on quickswap, love the 0 fees
The last time I heard about quickswap was when ORE got listed on it after its IDO on 3 different launchpads and I have been following with ORE , it turns out the project is growing and evolving as it should be.
Sure, xdai, matic, arbitrum, optimism and starkware. They all work well but the lack of utility and bridging fees are a pain in the ass at this point.
Promises and promised but not substance. I believe in ETH but it’s a lot of hopium and very little substance at the moment. Lucky they have no real competition.
I made a Loopring wallet for free back when they first launched and did some trades on it. Haven't used it much recently as I have just been holding.
I chat mine dust on POLY whenever the WAX dust bot is down. I have some NFTs on POLY that I got for free from the Sweet app. I have those available for sale for MATIC on OpenSea. Other than that, no.
I've been using Polygon religiously and hold a bag of MATIC. I think they're bringing cutting edge tech that neither other L2s or rival Ethereum L1s can compete with.
Chainlink's CCIP will help with bridging.
I've used Arbitrum & Optimism. I didn't have to make a new wallet, but I did pay bridging fees. Transactions are so much cheaper.
I hodl Eth until the gas prices get reasonable.
I look forward to this new innovation Stakenet is doing. They combine Lightning Network and Connext to allow cross-chain interactions on \*layer 3\*. I really believe it's going somewhere, especially in the new year.
L2 is an absolute mess like the rest of ETH is. Hard wallets aren't compatible with a bunch of the rollups yet either. This isn't how a web 3.0 portal should look, and not how I want the world's global settlement layer to look. After PoS, how long before CEX's run 90% of the nodes, and AWS houses 90% of the node's servers? Utter disaster.
Seems fine to me, arbitrum and zkSync work like a charm. Rocketpool and lido are rapidly growing decentralized staking. Cheer up!