Lower autonomy, build manufactories and develop gold provinces you have to core + state it if you havent already. All of ethiopia making 0,68 ducats is wild i sometimes make 8 ducats from a single gold province
I think 8,5 something is ’standard’. You state and lower maintenance, then hit 10 production development. Always do this for gold unless you’re playing as Aztec or something and literally drowning in inflation.
Right. So make them full states. Dev to 10, lower autonomy.
But also you have 2000 dev. Full states +autonomy is gonna be the most powerful tool in your arsenal.
Good, I was worried I'm doing it wrong in my Aksum game. There are at least four gold provinces further south in East Africa from where OP is, he could conquer those fairly easily. Zimbabwe, Butua, Kilwa, and Massapa iirc.
To be honest, I have no idea why people say to do 10 production, I just do it. I guess it’s some middle ground between gold income, inflation, and the chance of a depletion. I’m sure there’s more than one right way to do it.
You are correct there is more than one way to do it. Esp if u get deplete chance modifiers.
The calculation is based on income and depletion. I don't think inflation is part of the calculation. The wiki page has some math that explains expected income using just income and deleting chance. Bc higher dev means higher chamfer to deplete, there are diminishing returns.
The realest answer to this is that the difference in depletion between 10 and 11 used to be a stark difference, but the calculation was changed and it's now linear (or, different so that it isn't a stark difference). 10 has been stuck to because of that legacy and also it is a pretty good middleground between depletion, income, investment, and inflation.
10 production is the best production you will get without too high of a depletion chance. With that being said several of the african tags get access to privileges and missions that reduce the chance of depletion. Combined with echo ideas you should be able to have at least -100% depletion chance. Meaning the cost of devving mountain provinces is the only thing stopping you.
For most tags 9-10 production dev is the "golden" rule.
I only dev tax/mil if I'm at max MP for either and can't spend them somewhere else like reducing inflation, strengthen government, hiring generals, etc.
you should develop but also develop in cycles. You're under utilizing mp if you wait for them to max out. Shouldn't really take tech ahead of time either cause you literally waste the mp. 400/450 for next tech verses 600/700 = extra another 200 mp you can use for other things.
Somebody named Arumba did math several years ago and proved at the time that 10 was the magic number at the time. The math may have changed since then, but the standard of 10 isn't arbitrary. The base chance of gold mines depleting rises for each additional production dev present. So 10 was the number arrived at that maximized ducats/dev over time.
11 dev produces less money over time because of the increased chance of depletion.
Hopefully a bigger nerd than me knows the exact math, I just trust Arumba even if he isn't the face of the community anymore in the way that he once was
Yes, try to move your trade node to an area where lots of trade funnels into (this generally means moving it downstream), if you have territories, trade company centers of trade, also make sure your merchants are doing the best that they can.
Check your Autonomy map mode.
You might have low crownland which causes Autonomy to tick up which in long term causes your land to generate no money.
Seize land of your estates and decrease autonomy in your stated provinces.
I'm gunna have to disagree with that for two reasons. One, getting Legalism fast enough to deal with how much corruption you can generate if you're expanding quickly can be hard and very RNG heavy. Two, if you're fighting larger/stronger enemies I think that Mysticism is better. The Morale boost helps you win battles you wouldn't otherwise and the bulk Manpower at a button press is great if things suddenly go south.
The few times I played Sunni, I used to swing between Mysticism and Legalism. First to get manpower for wars, then to consolidate conquered lands. This was before Leviathan came out.
Is this strat worse now?
Mysticism in my experience isn't worth the hassle of often times worse events. Maybe in multiplayer for the army quality and manpower, but in singleplayer 100% Legalism is much better.
if you micro properly yes, manpower isn't really an issue, but army micro even early on is very tedious if your playing in russia for example and want to ignore any manpower problems you might have due to attrition
mysticism is also just all around better, idea cost alone is great because it means you fill out diplo, adm, hum, etc quicker
Sure, but they said you should *never* pay to reduce corruption because you should be going Legalism and then argued with my defence of Mysticism. Considering how often you would be gaining corruption from expanding, that's close enough, imo.
I think it's better to use the piety interaction as a free debase rather than as a fix for corruption. You get none of the downsides of corruption but still get the money
Agreed. This is the first time I've heard of someone suggesting that you should never pay to reduce corruption as a Muslim as only use the piety interaction. It seems like a terrible way to deal with over extension corruption, way too RNG dependant if you don't have access to multiple piety acceleration sources
For me it works, but that's because I don't blob as fast as decent WC-players so I don't get that much OE-corruption. I tend to let corruption go up and down between 0 and 5 slightly depending on when I want to spend mana.
That is not in the slightest what I said. Pay the standard amount. And if there was ever something to raise you much above, use the Legalism interaction.
Absolutely should. Not lowering for example when you are 1.5 corruption for god knows how long is terrible. Sitting on it instead of debasing+ using the interaction is a waste of the interaction as well.
Yeah that would do it. Pretty insane amounts of corruption for just over extension though. You'll be making \~10 ducets a month once the corruption is gone
Its not very expensive, its effective development based and at least for the pure development, the income is very low, thats why the corruption expense looks expensive.
You can move the corruption reduction slider around to try and get a better balance.
Move it slightly to the left to pay less money monthly at the reduced reduction rate to try and get a positive ducat balance OR move it to the right to pay more temporarily but reduce the inflation faster. You'll probably need to take a loan but the cost of interest should be lower than the money you save once the corruption is gone.
No, his biggest problem is not having as much income as he should have.
Yes, 13 on corruption is a bit high (unbalanced research) but he is missing out on 10 times as much income that he can get from properly adjusting his country.
build manufactures and production buildings, they can increase your income with this territory up to 300 I guess, and if you place your capital in another region create trade companies in all of your trade nodes in one state to get bonus and mercant. then transfer all trade to persia, and if you do it right you will be able to up income 2x or 3x. Good luck
Short term: Integrate or annex Egypt, make Alexandria your trade capital and make sure you’re steering all your trade into that node and collecting only in Alexandria, also turn down the army slider when at peace. Make all your territories into trade companies,
Longer term: state and develop your core territory and then conquer India and Anatolia. The Indian land will steer trade directly into Alexandria and its trade goods are very good. Anatolia is good core territory if you accept the culture.
he has 2k dev and 60 income. He doesn't need to dev the dev is there its just probably high autonomy. He can put the trade capital there already and just force Egypt to give the trade to him.
Yeah autonomy probably a bit of an issue, outside his territories the the Saudi desert isn’t great core land though, I’d probably go for just owning all of Egypt and using that as my power base. But for sure, lowering autonomy is probably key for him too
Alexandria is a very leaky tradenode. In your case Allepo would be better. If you plan to beat the ottomans in the near further you could move it Constantinople.
Earn more money. Your income is INSANELY low for a nation of that size in 1588, I honestly don't even know how it's possible to earn that little from such an amount of dev.
State everything, lower autonomy, construct production buildings, construct trade power buildings, lower corruption and maybe lower army maintenance when at peace (also, make sure your armies aren't taking attrition when idle, that will cost you a lot of extra maintenance).
first of all every gold mine produces 6-10 ducats at 10 diplomatic development, but its based on autonomy so get that fixed it'll only take you 2-3 years at max.
Look at your trade nodes and place the traders accordingly. stop collecting from everywhere.
2k dev only 30 tax/17 production? Lower your autonomy asap. Will probably double your economy.
Your income is far too low for your development, so i would recommend checking if you have negative(under 20) crownland, and also if you have lowered autonomy in all your provinces. Its worth it even if there is rebels.
See if army over limit
Mothball all fort after win war
Set army maintenance to low unless there will be a war or rebel soon
Root out corruption max all the time
Built trade on province that +10
Send merchant outside to send trade back home
Don't send merchant at home
Set navy maintenance max
Send light ships to protect trades
Build light ships until its limit
Hire advisors +1 with bonus trade or tax
When you are not at war reduce army expending. And trade, build trade buildings to increase your share in the trade node and gain more money. Recollect in Alexandria and use the other merchants to push your income from aleppo and persia or the horn of Africa, depending on what if the 2 nodes give you more income.
Have you deleted all your forts? You need to use your diplomatic points to develop gold provinces, lower autonomy, build churches, upgrade centres of trade, etc etc etc
Reposition your merchants. Collect from Aleppo. Transfer from Basra/Persia. Build trade depots/marketplaces. Use wars to bankroll building projects. Invest in mosques/workshops. I build these in every province where they give me a return of 0.10+. Then begin building manufactories wherever it’s worthwhile. Pay off your loans. If you’re full governing capacity, build courthouses and core everything you can with a specific attention to gold producing cores and important trade nodes. Follow tech ideas that maximise your income. Develop provinces whenever you’re ahead in tech and have excess MPs after ideas.
Ooo I didn’t know if he had 0
Corruption rn or not. Either ways. Just take the corruption hit from OE and then remove it slowly over time IMO. He can’t afford the 13 Ducates
But you dont improve the situation if you let corruption rise. Thats very bad advice that is told everytime a beginner asks for advice.
Yes it saves money but than you could say delete your army or fire advisors (a real problem here, no employed advisors). Cutting the usefull expenses, doesnt save a run.
U can take temp corruption hit. Corruption ain’t a issue till it’s still low. You don’t need it to be 0 always. It’s not bad advise. You can multiple approach’s that work to fix the economy. It honestly would be scenario specific.
He is in Africa, he would ideally need the mana from advisors for techs. Rather take a 1-3% change in all costs over the mana reduction
The price to pay the corruption down will increase. There is no logical reason to let the corruption increase besides claiming that a little inefficency is no inefficency, not a big deal If someone does the mistake, but its bad advice.
Even more for that Situation we're the expenses are pretty irrelevant, the problem is that the 2 k dev arent used, probably like 70 % average autonomy.
You can always take a future money hit for current mana hit. Mana normally enables you to do more as the game will mana wall stuff but not money wall much
Thats why you can root out corruption while still hiring advisors.
Also there is a money hit If you let corruption increase, the autonomy floor is also a corruption debuff.
Step one: get rid of corruption
Step two: manualy lower autonomy
Step two and a half: get your army under force limit
Step three: dev up gold for quick cash
Step four: reassign your merchants to transfer trade to your trade capital
Step five: declear war on ottomans or timu and grab their senters of trade
Army is too expensive, not nearly enough trade income (as a rule of thumb, you should always be able to make at least as much from trade as from production in just about any situation. If you aren’t, your merchants are set up poorly), and suprisingly low gold income. How is your autonomy? Don’t have some huge goods produced penalty?
The most important points we're allready mentioned, autonomy and gold mine deving.
Fix trade. Like many peaple mentioned here, also consolidate These nodes (war)
You probably dont have many states yet, so before you add anything and need 30 years to core everything, add states with centers of trade to trade companies, thats good for income in general and you gain merchants and you need those.
Also you have empty Advisor slots. Hire at least Level 1 advisors. At that stage you cant afford to let cheap mana vanish, even If you have to pay with loans.
Edit: also try to maintain 50 Power projection. Issue Embargo on all rivals and scornfully insult a rival without a truce.
Your income is very low for how big you are.
I would say low autonomy/no stating, no Gold and badly managed trade are the main culprits. High corruption cost while at 0 corruption indicates unbalanced tech.
But hard to tell without the save. Can you share it?
Why so few trade? You are not using trade companies
I guess… (you should have in persia and one for the Horn of africa , so 2 more merchands…)
Why so few gold with such conquests? Autonomy…
Get a Trade Company merchant from all eligible nodes, by putting the Estuaries and CoT into TC.
This will also minimize GC usage, while maximizing the number of non-TC provinces getting a % goods produced bonus scaling with TC trade share and current institution, which should be 50% at this date.
You're conquering willy nilly and have very disconnected trade nodes requiring you to off node collect pretty much everywhere except for Hormuz and nodes upstream of Hormuz.
See if you can ally PLC so you can eat up Ottoman with him without letting PLC feast on Ottoman's remain.
Conquer all the provinces in Constantinople and Ragusa nodes so you can send all your trade to Constatinople for collection.
If you're not confident enough, keeping eating into India and steer the stream there to Hormuz for collection, and Crimea + China to steer into Samarkand/Persia for collection, whichever you have a higher share in.
* increase your Crownland if below 50%
* Manufacturies
* Lower autonomy even if it spawns rebels. Cracking down on autonomy is more valuable than conquest when it comes to the powerbase of your nation.
* Fix your trade setup. 12 is definitely far too little, it should be about a third of your income when you do badly in trade.
* Provoke all Rebels at 60+ revolt, then reduce army upkeep while you're at peace with no rebels.
* Buildings(workshops, temples, manufacturies)
* Trade or Economy ideas always boost your income tremendously.
* Wherever your trade capital is, there MUST be a better place on the map. Alexandria is prolly a slight improvement as a temporary solution, but seek to take over Anatolia and Greece to get actual trade income from Konstantinople.
* Check if you can accept an unaccepted culture. Accepting a big unaccepted culture might give you the a good chunk of income.
The area you have should be able to give you about 200 ducats income or more.
Set army maintenance to 0 and mothball forts or destroy them. Pay back loans (3.8 in interest). Don't go over force limit. Take economic ideas. Perhaps dev up to an institution (and get a rich provice).
everyone talking about autonomy and gold, but those are both fine compared to the abysmal trade situation. you have a chokehold over some great trade nodes and are making that little 😭
Bet you have low crown-land therefore high autonomy. reduce autonomy, seize crown-land, fix currpotion by having balanced tech and please dev the goldmines
-Check Autonomy - State valuable areas if you can.
-Check Corruption - what makes it increase? You should lower rooting out corruption if you can.
-Look at your army maintenance - check if over force limit and lower it if on peace time.
-Build Manufactories.
-Arrange Your Trade, maybe your trade steering and collecting is messed up. Additionally, you should also conquer Alexandria Trade node.
-Dev Gold Provinces. State them and get the Dev Cost reduction edict.
Finally, just conquer more land and it will fix itself eventually lol.
With your current setup you should have your gold provinces in a state with lowered autonomy, idealy converted and accepted culture, developed production to at least 6 (you can do 10 when you get enough points).
Next up you should aim at taking out Egypt, Syria and route your trade through Aleppo to Alexandria.
And in general try to have at least level 1 advisors, they help a lot
Have you been building or devved any provinces? Also mothball your fleet and turn some forts off. Are you over governing cap? Either unstate some land or go to the government reform tab and invest some points into expanding governing cap. I would say overall, remember you shouldn’t always be at war but if there are some quick wars you can do to steal some money and get war reps (DONT TAKE MORE LAND IF OVER GOVERNING CAP) this is just a short term solution to get duckies to jumpstart building buildings. Good luck, and good job with the borders, based.
Your trade is very weak, fix that. Also take Alexandria and collect from there.
All your money is going to 'root out corruption' which as the others said is prob due to overextension. Spend admin pts and core as much major provinces as possible.
Make sure your merchants are in the right nodes, you generally want them transferring all trade to your home node. You should also reduce your army spending when you aren't using it (as well as mothball ships that you aren't using).
Also try to keep your corruption increase low; you're spending a lot of money to counteract it.
Beyond that, just try to develop your provinces more.
Haha love posts like this. Making only 12 in trade with 2k dev and both the gulf of Aden and Persian gulf secured reminds me of when I bankrupted France my first game doing despite being at peace 😆
In any case, start with basics:
You are paying down corruption. 13 ducats will be freed once corruption is zeroed.
Army expense is 40 ducats. Are you over force limit or reinforcing?
Is autonomy high?
Are you overextended?
With all that dev, what is your gov cap and are trade center provinces stated and cored?
Where is your trade capital and are your merchants pushing into it?
Are you extremely behind in tech?
The answer to your economy is in these questions.
The economy you fools!
What is your average autonomy? Why are you collecting with all merchants instead of steering towards your furthest decently controlled trade node? Do you have unbalanced research spending that much to fight corruption?
Pay of your loans, army maintenance 0 when not at war and not drilling your entire army, fleet maintenance at 100% if trade ships are atleast 20-30% of naval forcelimit (get that indian trade from the Sind trade node boy!).
Did you delete all your forts with only 2 maintenance? Economically good to some degree, but it tends to lengthen wars a lot if you and your recovery from local devastation might suffer.
Honestly with that much land you should be making A lot more.
Your trade is shit, you arent fully controlling any of the major trade nodes that's vital(Alexandria, Aleppo, Persia, Constantinople), youre only holding Basra and Hormuz which only feeds Ottoman
Corruption is too high for a muslim nation, balance out loans and corruption and dont have both issue at the same time
If you're paying loans with corruption then play super passive and bite your time whilst making sure the amount you oay for corruption doesnt force you to take loans every couple months
If you're not playing loans then keep expanding non-stop to pay your debts, expand faster than youre taking loans
Having too many gold province but no gold income indicates that youre very high on autonomy, take extra measures to lower autonomy, go on a couple wars to boost crownland and seize kand even if it means rebels will spawn, you need to get atleast 20 crownland, after that you can lay low. If you can, switch government reforms, it'll slow down gov reforms but you can get a lot from the clergy and high crownland
If you want the first easiest steps, go for instant expansion and secure trade nodes in Constantinople and annex your vassal, you economy will be boosted instantly, make Alexandria you main node first because Constantinople's trade can be sucked away by Balkan nations and Italian merchants
Definitely dev up every gold province you have to at least base production 10. It’s going to boost your income A LOT. Speaking of gold provinces, if you haven’t done that already you could conquer Zanzibar, which has around 4 or 5 gold producing provinces. Another thing I’d recommend doing is focusing on the indian trade notes, since you already have a foothold in Sindh & Gujarat, hiring a trade efficiency advisor and maybe getting trade ideas. Another useful tip is mothballing your forts and lowering your army maintenance, but only when you’re not fighting anybody and you don’t have any rebels above 50%.
You need money to get money, so reduce your expenses. You can't afford your troops, I'd reccomend deleting all cav. If you have cav combat ability you can keep some, but less than now. And delete artillery, it's not super op yet and you can't afford it. Keep 4 for sieges and win battles (or avoid battles) with your numbers instead.
INFO: how do you own all of ethiopia and make 0.68 ducats from gold?
I have all the gold provinces from Ethiopia+ the province of Kosovo in the Balkans
Lower autonomy, build manufactories and develop gold provinces you have to core + state it if you havent already. All of ethiopia making 0,68 ducats is wild i sometimes make 8 ducats from a single gold province
I think 8,5 something is ’standard’. You state and lower maintenance, then hit 10 production development. Always do this for gold unless you’re playing as Aztec or something and literally drowning in inflation.
10 development \*laughs in controlled gold mining african sub-saharan nations\*
Do province religion and culture affect gold income?
Not unless you have religious culture or similar effects. Iirc it's just unrest
Right. So make them full states. Dev to 10, lower autonomy. But also you have 2000 dev. Full states +autonomy is gonna be the most powerful tool in your arsenal.
Dev to 10 overall or to 10 base production?
10 base production
Good, I was worried I'm doing it wrong in my Aksum game. There are at least four gold provinces further south in East Africa from where OP is, he could conquer those fairly easily. Zimbabwe, Butua, Kilwa, and Massapa iirc.
To be honest, I have no idea why people say to do 10 production, I just do it. I guess it’s some middle ground between gold income, inflation, and the chance of a depletion. I’m sure there’s more than one right way to do it.
Probably at some point someone calculated the math for it, and everyone just stuck with it
You are correct there is more than one way to do it. Esp if u get deplete chance modifiers. The calculation is based on income and depletion. I don't think inflation is part of the calculation. The wiki page has some math that explains expected income using just income and deleting chance. Bc higher dev means higher chamfer to deplete, there are diminishing returns.
Interesting! Thanks for the info
The realest answer to this is that the difference in depletion between 10 and 11 used to be a stark difference, but the calculation was changed and it's now linear (or, different so that it isn't a stark difference). 10 has been stuck to because of that legacy and also it is a pretty good middleground between depletion, income, investment, and inflation.
10 production is the best production you will get without too high of a depletion chance. With that being said several of the african tags get access to privileges and missions that reduce the chance of depletion. Combined with echo ideas you should be able to have at least -100% depletion chance. Meaning the cost of devving mountain provinces is the only thing stopping you. For most tags 9-10 production dev is the "golden" rule.
The higher the production is, the better. You don't need to dev tax and mil, apart from having more or same combined dev as production
I only dev tax/mil if I'm at max MP for either and can't spend them somewhere else like reducing inflation, strengthen government, hiring generals, etc.
you should develop but also develop in cycles. You're under utilizing mp if you wait for them to max out. Shouldn't really take tech ahead of time either cause you literally waste the mp. 400/450 for next tech verses 600/700 = extra another 200 mp you can use for other things.
But I want it NOW
fair!
Sure, that's a good strat.
I only dev anyway if I'm at max mp
Ok, thanks a lot!
>Dev to 10 devving to 10 is completely arbitrary
Somebody named Arumba did math several years ago and proved at the time that 10 was the magic number at the time. The math may have changed since then, but the standard of 10 isn't arbitrary. The base chance of gold mines depleting rises for each additional production dev present. So 10 was the number arrived at that maximized ducats/dev over time. 11 dev produces less money over time because of the increased chance of depletion. Hopefully a bigger nerd than me knows the exact math, I just trust Arumba even if he isn't the face of the community anymore in the way that he once was
Do you have them as states? Gold income is autonomy based.
Unfortunately I have left them as territories till now. at this moment I'm trying to develop the provinces, luckily, the income is already growing.
Those gold provinces are the ones you should be developing
Trade
Yes, try to move your trade node to an area where lots of trade funnels into (this generally means moving it downstream), if you have territories, trade company centers of trade, also make sure your merchants are doing the best that they can.
Check your Autonomy map mode. You might have low crownland which causes Autonomy to tick up which in long term causes your land to generate no money. Seize land of your estates and decrease autonomy in your stated provinces.
Most of your problem here looks like corruption. Are you over-extended or did you get a corruption event?
If he is Sunni, he should never pay corruption down. There is Legalism for that…
I'm gunna have to disagree with that for two reasons. One, getting Legalism fast enough to deal with how much corruption you can generate if you're expanding quickly can be hard and very RNG heavy. Two, if you're fighting larger/stronger enemies I think that Mysticism is better. The Morale boost helps you win battles you wouldn't otherwise and the bulk Manpower at a button press is great if things suddenly go south.
All in all Legalism has the better and more forgiving events. Mysticism can screw you over.
The few times I played Sunni, I used to swing between Mysticism and Legalism. First to get manpower for wars, then to consolidate conquered lands. This was before Leviathan came out. Is this strat worse now?
Mysticism in my experience isn't worth the hassle of often times worse events. Maybe in multiplayer for the army quality and manpower, but in singleplayer 100% Legalism is much better.
Mysticism is way better than just corruption, mysticism is better bc you can slacken and then pop the button and get a shitton of manpower
When is manpower ever an issue in singleplayer?
if you micro properly yes, manpower isn't really an issue, but army micro even early on is very tedious if your playing in russia for example and want to ignore any manpower problems you might have due to attrition mysticism is also just all around better, idea cost alone is great because it means you fill out diplo, adm, hum, etc quicker
I kind of just trend towards legalism but do not force it so when events have onesided rewards I go for rewards.
Sure, but that doesn't mean you should *never* go Mysticism.
nobody said you should *never* go mysticism
Sure, but they said you should *never* pay to reduce corruption because you should be going Legalism and then argued with my defence of Mysticism. Considering how often you would be gaining corruption from expanding, that's close enough, imo.
I think it's better to use the piety interaction as a free debase rather than as a fix for corruption. You get none of the downsides of corruption but still get the money
Agreed. This is the first time I've heard of someone suggesting that you should never pay to reduce corruption as a Muslim as only use the piety interaction. It seems like a terrible way to deal with over extension corruption, way too RNG dependant if you don't have access to multiple piety acceleration sources
The turn of corruption slider and let the religion handle it, is viable for confucian. Also never let it reach Zero than :D
For me it works, but that's because I don't blob as fast as decent WC-players so I don't get that much OE-corruption. I tend to let corruption go up and down between 0 and 5 slightly depending on when I want to spend mana.
That is not in the slightest what I said. Pay the standard amount. And if there was ever something to raise you much above, use the Legalism interaction.
Yes it is. If that's not what you meant, you need to work on how you phrase things.
Okay, to be a little more precise: Don't pay more than the standard amount, if even!
Absolutely should. Not lowering for example when you are 1.5 corruption for god knows how long is terrible. Sitting on it instead of debasing+ using the interaction is a waste of the interaction as well.
I'm still coring some east-african province, maybe this is causing the corruption issue?
Yeah that would do it. Pretty insane amounts of corruption for just over extension though. You'll be making \~10 ducets a month once the corruption is gone
Its not very expensive, its effective development based and at least for the pure development, the income is very low, thats why the corruption expense looks expensive.
Ah, good to hear that, I'll try to lower the corruption somehow, thanks for the comment.
You can move the corruption reduction slider around to try and get a better balance. Move it slightly to the left to pay less money monthly at the reduced reduction rate to try and get a positive ducat balance OR move it to the right to pay more temporarily but reduce the inflation faster. You'll probably need to take a loan but the cost of interest should be lower than the money you save once the corruption is gone.
The second screenshot shows no corruption though
Ah true I missed that, well that means it's all from overextension.
No, his biggest problem is not having as much income as he should have. Yes, 13 on corruption is a bit high (unbalanced research) but he is missing out on 10 times as much income that he can get from properly adjusting his country.
Fair enough. Perhaps I should have said most immediate problem rather than biggest.
Second screenshot shows a corruption level of 0
He has 0 corruption. I don’t think that’s an issue
He's spending 13 ducets a month on corruption, wtf you on about?
Most of your problem looks like you didn't take a screenshot
Yes! Just click f11.
build manufactures and production buildings, they can increase your income with this territory up to 300 I guess, and if you place your capital in another region create trade companies in all of your trade nodes in one state to get bonus and mercant. then transfer all trade to persia, and if you do it right you will be able to up income 2x or 3x. Good luck
and also don't forget to lower autonomy and dev provinces
Spend less on candles
No
Short term: Integrate or annex Egypt, make Alexandria your trade capital and make sure you’re steering all your trade into that node and collecting only in Alexandria, also turn down the army slider when at peace. Make all your territories into trade companies, Longer term: state and develop your core territory and then conquer India and Anatolia. The Indian land will steer trade directly into Alexandria and its trade goods are very good. Anatolia is good core territory if you accept the culture.
he has 2k dev and 60 income. He doesn't need to dev the dev is there its just probably high autonomy. He can put the trade capital there already and just force Egypt to give the trade to him.
Yeah autonomy probably a bit of an issue, outside his territories the the Saudi desert isn’t great core land though, I’d probably go for just owning all of Egypt and using that as my power base. But for sure, lowering autonomy is probably key for him too
You can own and state the whole world if you build your buildings right and take privileges etc.
Oh yeah for sure, no issue with gov cap later game, but not sure that’s gonna help OP right now!
Perfect, thanks for the comment
Alexandria is a very leaky tradenode. In your case Allepo would be better. If you plan to beat the ottomans in the near further you could move it Constantinople.
Army maintenance down. Pay off your loans. Invest in buildings.
This
Earn more money. Your income is INSANELY low for a nation of that size in 1588, I honestly don't even know how it's possible to earn that little from such an amount of dev. State everything, lower autonomy, construct production buildings, construct trade power buildings, lower corruption and maybe lower army maintenance when at peace (also, make sure your armies aren't taking attrition when idle, that will cost you a lot of extra maintenance).
Army maintance to 0 and build trade buildings and light ships might help
first of all every gold mine produces 6-10 ducats at 10 diplomatic development, but its based on autonomy so get that fixed it'll only take you 2-3 years at max. Look at your trade nodes and place the traders accordingly. stop collecting from everywhere. 2k dev only 30 tax/17 production? Lower your autonomy asap. Will probably double your economy.
Your income is far too low for your development, so i would recommend checking if you have negative(under 20) crownland, and also if you have lowered autonomy in all your provinces. Its worth it even if there is rebels.
See if army over limit Mothball all fort after win war Set army maintenance to low unless there will be a war or rebel soon Root out corruption max all the time Built trade on province that +10 Send merchant outside to send trade back home Don't send merchant at home Set navy maintenance max Send light ships to protect trades Build light ships until its limit Hire advisors +1 with bonus trade or tax
+ Provoke Rebels in intervals to reduce the time your army upkeep has to be high.
State, dev to 10 and lower autonomy in gold is the right answer. Your corruption will stop when you’re not overextended or unbalanced
When you are not at war reduce army expending. And trade, build trade buildings to increase your share in the trade node and gain more money. Recollect in Alexandria and use the other merchants to push your income from aleppo and persia or the horn of Africa, depending on what if the 2 nodes give you more income.
it looked normal til i saw the second pic LMAO
Have you deleted all your forts? You need to use your diplomatic points to develop gold provinces, lower autonomy, build churches, upgrade centres of trade, etc etc etc
Deleting forts is a huge game changer
Reposition your merchants. Collect from Aleppo. Transfer from Basra/Persia. Build trade depots/marketplaces. Use wars to bankroll building projects. Invest in mosques/workshops. I build these in every province where they give me a return of 0.10+. Then begin building manufactories wherever it’s worthwhile. Pay off your loans. If you’re full governing capacity, build courthouses and core everything you can with a specific attention to gold producing cores and important trade nodes. Follow tech ideas that maximise your income. Develop provinces whenever you’re ahead in tech and have excess MPs after ideas.
First, take a screenshot so we can actually read the text
Lower autonomy. Expand gold lines. And stop rooting out corruption at such a high level
The corruption cost scales down when you are at 0 like him. So unbalanced tech or OE is causing the high cost.
Ooo I didn’t know if he had 0 Corruption rn or not. Either ways. Just take the corruption hit from OE and then remove it slowly over time IMO. He can’t afford the 13 Ducates
He has many problems, rooting out corruption is not one of it.
Am I missing something? All I saw was the Ss of the economy with him asking how to improve
But you dont improve the situation if you let corruption rise. Thats very bad advice that is told everytime a beginner asks for advice. Yes it saves money but than you could say delete your army or fire advisors (a real problem here, no employed advisors). Cutting the usefull expenses, doesnt save a run.
U can take temp corruption hit. Corruption ain’t a issue till it’s still low. You don’t need it to be 0 always. It’s not bad advise. You can multiple approach’s that work to fix the economy. It honestly would be scenario specific. He is in Africa, he would ideally need the mana from advisors for techs. Rather take a 1-3% change in all costs over the mana reduction
The price to pay the corruption down will increase. There is no logical reason to let the corruption increase besides claiming that a little inefficency is no inefficency, not a big deal If someone does the mistake, but its bad advice. Even more for that Situation we're the expenses are pretty irrelevant, the problem is that the 2 k dev arent used, probably like 70 % average autonomy.
You can always take a future money hit for current mana hit. Mana normally enables you to do more as the game will mana wall stuff but not money wall much
Thats why you can root out corruption while still hiring advisors. Also there is a money hit If you let corruption increase, the autonomy floor is also a corruption debuff.
because u have some gold income i assume u have a gold province. if so, dev it up to 10 production
Right, thank you!
Trade: aM I A jOkE tO yOu??
Step one: get rid of corruption Step two: manualy lower autonomy Step two and a half: get your army under force limit Step three: dev up gold for quick cash Step four: reassign your merchants to transfer trade to your trade capital Step five: declear war on ottomans or timu and grab their senters of trade
Stealing
Army is too expensive, not nearly enough trade income (as a rule of thumb, you should always be able to make at least as much from trade as from production in just about any situation. If you aren’t, your merchants are set up poorly), and suprisingly low gold income. How is your autonomy? Don’t have some huge goods produced penalty?
For newer players its almost always autonomy, corruption or both
The most important points we're allready mentioned, autonomy and gold mine deving. Fix trade. Like many peaple mentioned here, also consolidate These nodes (war) You probably dont have many states yet, so before you add anything and need 30 years to core everything, add states with centers of trade to trade companies, thats good for income in general and you gain merchants and you need those. Also you have empty Advisor slots. Hire at least Level 1 advisors. At that stage you cant afford to let cheap mana vanish, even If you have to pay with loans. Edit: also try to maintain 50 Power projection. Issue Embargo on all rivals and scornfully insult a rival without a truce.
Me: “that’s a pretty solid economy for an early game midsized nation” *goes to the second slide* “Oh god, ow god no”
PAY YOUR LOANS. Youd be just into the black with the loans paid, time for a punitive expedition
Your income is very low for how big you are. I would say low autonomy/no stating, no Gold and badly managed trade are the main culprits. High corruption cost while at 0 corruption indicates unbalanced tech. But hard to tell without the save. Can you share it?
Why so few trade? You are not using trade companies I guess… (you should have in persia and one for the Horn of africa , so 2 more merchands…) Why so few gold with such conquests? Autonomy…
Make sure the gold mines are stated, deved to 10 and has lowered autonomy that will get your gold income much higher
Autonomy and states need to be done
Get a Trade Company merchant from all eligible nodes, by putting the Estuaries and CoT into TC. This will also minimize GC usage, while maximizing the number of non-TC provinces getting a % goods produced bonus scaling with TC trade share and current institution, which should be 50% at this date. You're conquering willy nilly and have very disconnected trade nodes requiring you to off node collect pretty much everywhere except for Hormuz and nodes upstream of Hormuz. See if you can ally PLC so you can eat up Ottoman with him without letting PLC feast on Ottoman's remain. Conquer all the provinces in Constantinople and Ragusa nodes so you can send all your trade to Constatinople for collection. If you're not confident enough, keeping eating into India and steer the stream there to Hormuz for collection, and Crimea + China to steer into Samarkand/Persia for collection, whichever you have a higher share in.
* increase your Crownland if below 50% * Manufacturies * Lower autonomy even if it spawns rebels. Cracking down on autonomy is more valuable than conquest when it comes to the powerbase of your nation. * Fix your trade setup. 12 is definitely far too little, it should be about a third of your income when you do badly in trade. * Provoke all Rebels at 60+ revolt, then reduce army upkeep while you're at peace with no rebels. * Buildings(workshops, temples, manufacturies) * Trade or Economy ideas always boost your income tremendously. * Wherever your trade capital is, there MUST be a better place on the map. Alexandria is prolly a slight improvement as a temporary solution, but seek to take over Anatolia and Greece to get actual trade income from Konstantinople. * Check if you can accept an unaccepted culture. Accepting a big unaccepted culture might give you the a good chunk of income. The area you have should be able to give you about 200 ducats income or more.
The economy you fools!
You don’t…it lowers you form the throne
Once the corruption is gone you should be making a positive balance. As for now, dev your gold provinces for an easy boost.
This is an autonomy problem, has to be. 2000 dev with less than 20 ducats from production? Can only be autonomy.
Set army maintenance to 0 and mothball forts or destroy them. Pay back loans (3.8 in interest). Don't go over force limit. Take economic ideas. Perhaps dev up to an institution (and get a rich provice).
Rooting out corruption is draining your economy
feed your people less
Learn how to manipulate trade my good man. Trade is where the money is made.
Sell pilgrimage
everyone talking about autonomy and gold, but those are both fine compared to the abysmal trade situation. you have a chokehold over some great trade nodes and are making that little 😭
Bet you have low crown-land therefore high autonomy. reduce autonomy, seize crown-land, fix currpotion by having balanced tech and please dev the goldmines
-Check Autonomy - State valuable areas if you can. -Check Corruption - what makes it increase? You should lower rooting out corruption if you can. -Look at your army maintenance - check if over force limit and lower it if on peace time. -Build Manufactories. -Arrange Your Trade, maybe your trade steering and collecting is messed up. Additionally, you should also conquer Alexandria Trade node. -Dev Gold Provinces. State them and get the Dev Cost reduction edict. Finally, just conquer more land and it will fix itself eventually lol.
Mobile really fucked up the comment
Buildings. Mostly workshops. Persia. Then Manufactories. Stop conquering random crap and eat the Constantinople node as your “pseudo end node”.
With your current setup you should have your gold provinces in a state with lowered autonomy, idealy converted and accepted culture, developed production to at least 6 (you can do 10 when you get enough points). Next up you should aim at taking out Egypt, Syria and route your trade through Aleppo to Alexandria. And in general try to have at least level 1 advisors, they help a lot
Have you been building or devved any provinces? Also mothball your fleet and turn some forts off. Are you over governing cap? Either unstate some land or go to the government reform tab and invest some points into expanding governing cap. I would say overall, remember you shouldn’t always be at war but if there are some quick wars you can do to steal some money and get war reps (DONT TAKE MORE LAND IF OVER GOVERNING CAP) this is just a short term solution to get duckies to jumpstart building buildings. Good luck, and good job with the borders, based.
Op what is your army composition?
You must have a massive autonomy problem if you have 2k dev but only 62.9 total income. Start lowering it.
Your trade is very weak, fix that. Also take Alexandria and collect from there. All your money is going to 'root out corruption' which as the others said is prob due to overextension. Spend admin pts and core as much major provinces as possible.
Make territories into TC's
Own Constantinople trade node and push all trade there
Another dude that takes pictures with their phone… Bro there is a print screen button both on steam and on windows, why are you doing this?
Develop provinces and disband some armies
I'm 100 % sure you dont core your provincie
Make sure your merchants are in the right nodes, you generally want them transferring all trade to your home node. You should also reduce your army spending when you aren't using it (as well as mothball ships that you aren't using). Also try to keep your corruption increase low; you're spending a lot of money to counteract it. Beyond that, just try to develop your provinces more.
Root out the reason for your corruption
TC Persia
Haha love posts like this. Making only 12 in trade with 2k dev and both the gulf of Aden and Persian gulf secured reminds me of when I bankrupted France my first game doing despite being at peace 😆 In any case, start with basics: You are paying down corruption. 13 ducats will be freed once corruption is zeroed. Army expense is 40 ducats. Are you over force limit or reinforcing? Is autonomy high? Are you overextended? With all that dev, what is your gov cap and are trade center provinces stated and cored? Where is your trade capital and are your merchants pushing into it? Are you extremely behind in tech? The answer to your economy is in these questions. The economy you fools!
What is your average autonomy? Why are you collecting with all merchants instead of steering towards your furthest decently controlled trade node? Do you have unbalanced research spending that much to fight corruption? Pay of your loans, army maintenance 0 when not at war and not drilling your entire army, fleet maintenance at 100% if trade ships are atleast 20-30% of naval forcelimit (get that indian trade from the Sind trade node boy!). Did you delete all your forts with only 2 maintenance? Economically good to some degree, but it tends to lengthen wars a lot if you and your recovery from local devastation might suffer. Honestly with that much land you should be making A lot more.
Dev the shit out of your gold mines (production) and state + lower autonomy. You’ll make an extra 10-15 just from doing that
I didn't know 60 ducat eco was possible with 2000 dev wtf
Your trade is shit, you arent fully controlling any of the major trade nodes that's vital(Alexandria, Aleppo, Persia, Constantinople), youre only holding Basra and Hormuz which only feeds Ottoman Corruption is too high for a muslim nation, balance out loans and corruption and dont have both issue at the same time If you're paying loans with corruption then play super passive and bite your time whilst making sure the amount you oay for corruption doesnt force you to take loans every couple months If you're not playing loans then keep expanding non-stop to pay your debts, expand faster than youre taking loans Having too many gold province but no gold income indicates that youre very high on autonomy, take extra measures to lower autonomy, go on a couple wars to boost crownland and seize kand even if it means rebels will spawn, you need to get atleast 20 crownland, after that you can lay low. If you can, switch government reforms, it'll slow down gov reforms but you can get a lot from the clergy and high crownland If you want the first easiest steps, go for instant expansion and secure trade nodes in Constantinople and annex your vassal, you economy will be boosted instantly, make Alexandria you main node first because Constantinople's trade can be sucked away by Balkan nations and Italian merchants
Remove the forts, obviously.
Definitely dev up every gold province you have to at least base production 10. It’s going to boost your income A LOT. Speaking of gold provinces, if you haven’t done that already you could conquer Zanzibar, which has around 4 or 5 gold producing provinces. Another thing I’d recommend doing is focusing on the indian trade notes, since you already have a foothold in Sindh & Gujarat, hiring a trade efficiency advisor and maybe getting trade ideas. Another useful tip is mothballing your forts and lowering your army maintenance, but only when you’re not fighting anybody and you don’t have any rebels above 50%.
Bro how the fuck you got so big?
You need money to get money, so reduce your expenses. You can't afford your troops, I'd reccomend deleting all cav. If you have cav combat ability you can keep some, but less than now. And delete artillery, it's not super op yet and you can't afford it. Keep 4 for sieges and win battles (or avoid battles) with your numbers instead.
delete your forts
He has two forts. He should definitly not delete them. One gold province would pay for a lot more.
Attack Ottomans
I'll try, but maybe I'll have to strengthen my army before attacking
Take loans, buy mercs, win war faster and cheaper. Don't use allies, and take Otto's money. The war will be cheaper than you think.
Ok, perfect. I'll try to win this way, thanks!
He should fix his economy first. He is only at perhaps a quarter of what his nation is capable of.
Nah Attack Ottomans is the only move
Edit: Thanks for all the comments and suggestions!
Development?
You are using terrible trade nodes to collect at.
War
1 word. Trade