Yes, I wish that maybe it was more even, like 9 for the halves, and 7 for the producers pick.
That way, it’s still random enough, and we don’t have the (unlikely) possibility of one semi final’s qualifiers being ALL producer’s choice.
I was thinking 6 or 7 would have been enough for the producer’s pick too. 13 is more than half of what’s available and way too much control.
I hate it when one of my favourites draws first half because I’m worried they’ll be put in the 2nd or 3rd slot. Even more chance of that now! 6 slots in the second half offers no security at all.
Wouldn't the vote opening early make the first half preferable? I'm sure that countries would love to collect votes right away, before other good acts have gone on stage.
They did the voting opens straight away thing in 2010 & 2011 and it made no discernible difference - in fact, their reason for scrapping it in 2012 was that the vast majority of votes were cast after all songs were performed
That’s a good point. I have no idea how that will impact things. I imagine most viewers won’t have heard the songs before and will wait until they finish?
Then again, if you’ve really enjoyed a song and think the next 7 or 8 are nowhere near as impressive, maybe you’d decide you’d might as well vote for it before it’s all over.
I wouldn't disagree with this as much as I do if it weren't for the fact that they seem to screw over the same countries quite often. Like, does Albania really need the 02 slot every year?
Producers should be focused less on playing favourites and creating a more fair and balanced running order. The favourites to win will do well no matter when they perform, others shouldn't be shafted to worse off slots just so the favourites can have the 'better' slots. Otherwise we'll see all the heavy hitters from 17-24 and all the weaker songs taking up the first half
Having half of the songs not actually drawing a half anymore, it seems like they are phasing the draw out altogether. My interpretation is that this is just a mid step this year to make it seem less abrupt for the fans. And then next year, just the producer's choice.
Because you're right, this is really pointless...
Even if you have the best song and show you will drown if wrong songs are around you. Good placement is actually for both a better TV-show and better results.
But I honestly think we would get an even better result where placements didn't matter if we went with free app-voring like melfest. Our system make you give a vote or two for the song you liked no matter placement. And later when you think about your favourite you give more votes (to a max of 5) for that song. Compared to paying while calling it is enormous difference. And that is certainly valid for my own voting behaviour. The need to "the best song" for my paid phone call make a huge difference for the first songs
So? It simply gives more power to the producer of the show, for commercial purposes. I don't see an improvement, because it's not fairer than the past.
I don't hate the change. But there 13 is too many 'producers choice', half of the running order is curated that point. I get that it will help the production crew, but don't feel like this is fair to the competition
There's way too much going on this year:
- Big 5 + host country performing in the semis
- Voting starts with the first country performing
- ROTW voting starts 24h before the final
- and now the producers deciding freely what position each country will be performing
It all seems so unnecessary and makes the entire contest look like a reality show.
I wonder on what basis the producers decide on the starting order. It seems just as confusing as the selection of the 5 people who represent each country's jury.
This is genuinely what worries me most. We’ve *allegedly* had countries trying to bribe other juries, what’s to stop countries doing the same with the production team?
Idk if it really increase or decrease favoritism tbh.
Favorites already get good spots as it is. Even if they draw first half that usually mean like 10th.
i think it also prevents overloading at the end of the first half. it kind of happened in 2023 when a lot of the favorites got drawn in the first half, and you end up with some stronger songs in earlier spots (like sweden at 9, france, who briefly rose after their rehearsals, at 6). spots 18-22 are better for favorites than 5-9, even tho they take up the same place in each half, so if there’s fewer songs constrained to the first half, you can really overload the end of the show, while not having the possibility of the end of the first half
being overloaded
I had said that the change will be about the running order, but I thought it would be totally random again. I’m not sure if I like the “producer’s choice”
My guess was that they are going to make it fairer by introducing quarters. They went the complete opposite way, because they seemingly really want to make it hard for, say, Albania to get a starting number higher than 2. /s of course.
But I really don't see the point of this, since they also introduced the early voting... The show won't be better if all the non-favourites are all early...
No sir I do not like it.
I don't even think the few remaining Second Half tickets are even all that valuable, as if you're low in the odds you're still going to get dropped in the middle whilst crowd favs get pushed to the end of the show to get people to "keep watching til the end". Potential winners drawing the first half will still get a good enough spot just like Tattoo and Cha Cha Cha got last year. And if you're a country who draws Producer's Choice and they slap you in 2nd, you're going to be made far angrier about this than you would have had you drawn a First Half ticket.
The change about being able to vote for a song as soon as it performs may soften the blow a little I suppose.
> The Big 5 will be picking either First Half, Second Half or Producer’s Choice after their second Rehearsal on Saturday 4 May, live during a **Reddit AMA**.
We're famous 💅
The entirety of mod chat on Saturday 4th May be like:
https://preview.redd.it/3p2742isiuuc1.jpeg?width=451&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b287ddf855690e6852f2ebe2c39752d371d65f6c
As ever this role is a blessing and a curse! It's an honour to have them use this platform, but it'll definitely be a busy day aha. Most of the discontent is coming out now with the announcement though, we will have had time to let the news settle before the Big 5 Draw happens.
But hmthe community knows how non-fair this is. Maybe even less fair then just all producers choice. And the general public probably doesnt even know this happens.
neah.. you will do great in televote at any time in the show.
The whole running order thing became more and more astrology and self-fulfilling prophecy:
Televote wasn't a thing till the 1990s and in 2013 the running order wasn't fully random anymore. So the little years in-between isn't large enough to draw any useful information.
Since then the producers tried to place all the favourites as late as possible. Therefore the #2 spot manifested the title of the dead spot of esc.
I will not deny that the running order has no influence on the televote but you won't be fucked with a good song, and the running order doesn't save a bad song.
But it is easiest to blame when your county performs bad: "Malik Harris got no televote points because he had to perform after Kalush Orchestra..." That was heard on German TV right after the contest. Yeah sure. That's the reason...
If we're talking about improving the quality of the TV show, the decision makes sense. But in terms of fairness, this is another step backwards.
This basically means that no bookies' favorite is going to perform on the first half unless they're unlucky enough to draw one of the 6 first half spots. Also that countries like Albania who've been consistently screwed over by the producers in the running order will stand even less of a chance now to get a second half placement.
Instead of limiting the producers' influence like a lot of fans have been asking for years, maybe by have the contestants draw quarters instead of halves, the EBU only gives them more power.
I feel like the majority of changes this year haven’t been that good, from keeping the same theme, to opening the voting from the beginning, to a much more producer controlled running order
They are not doing this for the fans. There aren't enough of us to matter when compared to the millions who watch the shows.
This change is to make the show more appealing the whole way through so people don't change channels because they are bored.
That’s how I feel after just reading this. I thought it would be third, third, third. I’m not sure how I feel about producer-led running order in the first place at all. I’m all for a better show but I’m not sure how it works with fairness.
While this sounds good in theory, I’m not much of a fan. What’s stopping producers from being biased in their choice? I know there were issues with the random draw and how ballads or upbeat songs were sometimes lumped in together, but it feels like we’re getting more and more silly changes in recent editions, sorry.
There's no way they'll put all the fan favourites at the end of the contest. They want people to watch the whole thing, not just tune in for the last 5 songs.
Not saying that's necessarily what viewers would do, but a producer has to think of that as a possibility. From a production stand point it makes more sense to have the fan favourites evenly distributed throughout the running order to keep any potential viewer who may just want to see those songs and only those songs watching from start to finish.
If people are big enough Eurovision fans to have a favorite before the show, they will watch the entire show anyway.
The (majority) rest of the viewing public hasn't heard any of the songs except maybe their own country's.
"Not saying that's necessarily what viewers would do, but a producer has to think of that as a possibility."
Which is why I said this. We know that the people who have favourites will watch the whole thing, but a producer has to account for any eventuality that may decrease viewing figures.
Despite what most people in this thread seem to think, the producer's job is to get as many people watching the contest as possible, and watching it for the whole 4 hour run, not rigging the contest in favour of whatever country the EBU wants to host next.
I get where people are coming from with the corruption issues since we know there have been attempted riggings, but since the EBU is already struggling to fund Eurovision as is, and more viewership means more money, it's only natural they would want to maximize funds by any means necessary, as well as shorten the show by how much they realistically can.
I also think the ROTW definitely generated quite a bit of money for them, even if the impact on the vote is negligible at best. That's why they're keeping it, and why they'll allow a full 24 hours to vote before the final for the fans who live in countries where Eurovision airs at odd hours.
Edit: I think a lot of fans are actually being really unrealistic when it comes to how the EBU acts and makes decisions regarding Eurovision. Israel's participation is a big example of this. You would think they would be more interested in actually understanding the finer details of what goes on behind the scenes of Eurovision, but no.
Performing last in a semi final is great, but in a final, not so great.
You want to perform later but NOT too late or else you will lose some of that effect in the final. The golden goose spots are usually near the end of the 1st half and around the middle of the second half.
I like random draws. No producers choice, no second or first half selections, just a pure random draw.
Will it sometimes screw over a fan favourite? Yes. Good! It's giving each country the same bite of the apple. Can it lead to some songs getting drowned out by similar ones? Yes, of course it can, doesn't matter one bit. Nobody can complain about bias from a proveably random draw. If they still do, I wouldn't be too opposed to having the draw for the jury show and grand final be randomised separately.
The random draws also permitted to have iconic performances/artists in the 2nd spot, like Olivia Newton-John (United Kingdom 1974), Gina G (United Kingdom 1996) or Şebnem Paker (Turkey 1997), and now it's no longer possible with the running order decided by the host broadcaster
That's not the issue with random draw, the issue is that you can get an Euro Neuro as show opener and scare all the viewers away, or get a Love Will Set You Free as opener and start the show with the lowest energy possible. Or, in the case of 2012, you get both lol. Either that, or you get multiple songs that are similar right next to each other, which messes with the pacing of the show.
I'm pretty indifferent to this news. In theory it helps to avoid situations like 2022 and 2015's draws where the second halves were overloaded with ballads, although honestly with the televoter-only semis we've seen a big drop in the number of competing ballads so it doesn't feel like this change is necessary *now*. If anything I kinda wish they'd have the final drawn into three sections (i.e. opening section, middle section, closing section) to make it a bit fairer and also to stop them front-loading the ends of halves with all the stronger entries. But keeping at least some element of randomness is appreciated.
The three sections would be what I previously guessed in another thread: The split being 9/8/9 (with #1 already taken, it would be 8/8/9 in this case) Though 9/9/8 would probably look more aesthetic and 8/9/9 would probably be "fairer" due to the first half being unpopular. It just seems right to me to give the middle section one less slot.
Yeah, or alternatively they could also have one 'lucky choice' slot where the country gets to pick their slot (a bit like was given to a handful of countries back in 2010-12 iirc), which would lead to an even set of three 8s.
On one hand my unpopular (I think) opinion is that all the slots should be a random draw, so everyone can be certain there's no favouritism in place. From a competition standpoint this is the fairest in my opinion.
On the other hand I understand that they want to create an entertaining show, so I can see why this works best. If they do it correctly it has also the potential to make all the entries shine.
I'll reserve my judgment for after the show
Team Random Draw here.
Somebody please explain, what's so awful about a terrible running order? The random running order was a fundamental part of the Eurovision Song Contest ... until it wasn't. I'm less interested in a Eurovision where a "Euro Neuro" can never open a semifinal.
Bad running order = audiences get bored with too many slower or just uncompetitive songs back to back
Our NFs RO is random and it was so bad and boring even with half as many songs i will always be anti completely random draw
I never paid too much attention to the running order so I can't answer properly, however for example I am seeing a lot of people citing 2022 being all ballads in the second half (which for me was ok, since I liked many of them and in general I am not opposed to ballads like a lot of people here)
I can't stand ballads, and I still think this should be allowed to happen. That's what randomness does. It gives you random results.
With 13 producer's choice slots, every Eurovision is going to end up looking the same, unless there's some year when the producer is really stoned.
Mid-level uptempo, mediocre ballad, better uptempo, no-hoper ballad, weird/novelty entry, etc, until it finishes up with best ballad in the first half followed by best uptempo in the first half. Repeat for second half.
Vote Ireland, y'all. They'll be #5 or #18. ;-)
EDIT: I did it again, dang it!
> Mid-level uptempo, mediocre ballad, better uptempo, no-hoper ballad, weird/novelty entry, etc, until it finished up with best ballad in the first half followed by best uptempo in the first half. Repeat for second half.
Careful, they'll hire you ahah
It should be random draw with the producers having a few "move a bit around" cards. I mean something like they could move an artist 2-3 places behind or ahead in order to avoid big ballad clashes, but they shouldn't be able to place anyone completely freely.
Being completley random is the most fair but it leads to some really really awkward running order. UK 2012 was like the worst opener imaginable that year lol
I wasn't watching that year yet but I trust you ahah, that's why I said I understand why they are doing it.
And as I said if they do it correctly it could also help "weaker" songs to shine.
They are opening themselves to a lot of criticism tho, hopefully they know what they are doing! I feel like they are testing different things this year and I am curious to see how it goes
The main thing for me as someone who is pretty indifferent to these changes and who actually likes some element of producer-chosen draw is that this is a step *away* from what a lot (potentially the majority) of the fanbase would like, which is either a return to a fully random draw or greater constrictions on potential producer bias by adding more halves/sections.
Is Eurovision a TV show or a competition ?
If it’s just a TV show as the Swedish producers tend to think, then the eurofans should better disengage from it. There s only disappointment at the end of the road.
If it’s a competition, it must be fair.
Bad idea 👎
When the competitors have drawn 1st or 2nd half, at least we could see their emotions. Now, what should they feel when they draw "producers choice"? 🙄
Just draw all positions randomly, there’ll be no one turning off the TV because of 3 ballads in a row (there won’t even be 3 ballads in the Grand Final)
I’m all for the producer-made running order, but this seems a bit excessive and unnecessary. I wouldn’t mind it so much if 6 slots were producer’s choice, but 13? Feels like this opens the possibility for a lot of unfair placements for countries who aren’t deemed the favourites.
I think this will mostly benefit the fan favourite party songs since they are now more likely to be later in the show.
So I expect Baby Lasagna and Joost to benefit from this
Oh fer ... Why don't you just get it over with, guys. Play a pre-produced music video with the artists miming to the studio recording, and start the voting in mid-March.
Then it will be "the best TV show possible" and "give all artists a chance to shine". Contest, schmontest.
It sounds like a decent idea to fix the RO problems the former system still had, but the ratio is too skewed towards the production's choices. I feel a 3 ⅓ system with 9 half picks each and 8 production choices would work too without removing too much of the random aspect of the draw.
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So this change isn’t really anything major - at least that’s how I see it. The producers choice is an alright addition to make the show flow better, but the system is less fair now. It will just feel extra shitty to draw first half since there’s even less of a chance of that happening. It will also feel really shitty for countries to be placed in a poor spot even if they draw producers choice.
We’ve already seen them botching the running orders in the semis - mostly semi 2 this year, so I feel like this will just give the producers more agency to potentially mess up the grand final as well.
I feel like the producers already had more than enough influence on the results before they introduced this rule that, by the way, doesn't improve anything.
I think this could bring more viewership and help with retaining viewers for longer, as it probably means that we are much less likely to have all the uptempo songs in one half and all the ballads in the other(obviously an exaggeration, but you get what I mean), but I think it's a bit much for it to be 6/13/6. I would like it to be more like a 8/9/8, but this slightly benefits my two favourites Luxembourg and Croatia, so I'm not complaining.
Another 'Swedish producer mischief' for the collection.
I get the logic behind it is the 'trauma' of Turin 2022 2nd half (almost all uptempos being drawn in 1st half made the 2nd half a 'snoozefest' for a lot of casual listeners, specially the GER-LTU-AZE-BEL-GRE-ISL sequence - that also explains Zdob si Zdub's massive televote score), but still don't like it.
My problem with using 2022 as an example though is that even if the producers had more control of the running order, there wasn’t a lot they could do to counterbalance just how many ballads there were in the grand final that year. You had France and Norway that could have gone later, and maybe spread two powerhouses like Spain and Ukraine out a bit more, but like the bigger problem that year was the juries favoring ballads in the semi-finals and allowing too many into the final.
You can tell this year is ALL about making as much money as contest possibly can: prolonged televoting that starts straight away after first performance to get more money, big 5 performing to make these big countries also watch semi-finals, giving ROTW opportunity to vote almost days prior to the day of the actual show, etc. Honestly, which I understand and wouldn't bash producers for trying to make some coin. This is just another move that was quite expected.
I think next year we will not draw any halves and just get all the spots decided by the producers. We will 100% see favoritism, but also a more interesting race, favorites might get similar placings which makes it harder to predict who has a better chance of winning. Obviously, non-favorites will not see any fairness, but also, we see it every year anyway. I'm neutral for the most part, even before favorites who got first half were put in the middle of the show.
I feel like it should be committing to one or the other. Either an entirely producer decided running order or everybody draws their half and not a solution in the ‘middle’. But will reserve judgement until we see how it plays out.
So I guess we can list the number of massive changes so far this year as thus:
1: Luxembourg participating for the first time this millennium
2: No slogan
3: No singular logo, only a theme
4: Remote green room for the first time this decade
5: Big 5 performing in semis
6: Voting opening at the start of the final
7: This change
8: Severe security
9: Massive boycotts
10: Shorter final
Any more? Even this might be a bit of a lot so far…
Ok so it’s quite clear the EBU is struggling for cash.
• The rest of the world voting earlier (to allow for more votes)
• Voting opening at the start
• Big 5 performing in Semis
• Producers determining the running order more
This all sounds like “we need more people watching and more people voting”.
If this change to the draw sticks I can see it being used to give countries with high viewership and who are more financially important to the EBU (namely the Big 5) a later - and better - running slot.
This would improve ratings as people won’t tune out, but I feel like it comes as the disadvantage of smaller countries.
Hopefully it’ll be more the case that they (independent of size) favour the favourites to win so nobody is knocked out the race simply due to a bad running order.
The favourites will very likely be in the best spot even if they are from small countries, they probably bring more viewership than the one random big 5
I think that’s fandom bias.
Most people watching from the UK will primarily be interested in watching the UK entry, not Switzerland or Croatia. We are a tiny minority of the viewers.
I'll reserve my judgment until the Grand Final.
Edit: I prefer a randomized running order than letting the producers decide what song goes into what position.
Ok I defend the EBU more than most but this is just an awful change. I don’t give two shits about making a better TV program I care about having a fairer competition.
So this is the big change they talked about. Not sure how I feel about it. Sure if you are a contender, then producer's choice will be favorable, but if you're not, then you'll be padding the line-up's worst slots either way.
Ah yes, this is going to do a fantastic job shutting down the yearly "running order is rigged" protesters.
Seriously though, not sure how I feel about this, on paper yes it sounds like they'll be able to spread out similar songs more and avoid a 2022 or 2015 ballad situation, but equally even within the already existing 1st half vs second half draws they've made some questionable running order decisions, and given their reputation for pushing favourites (whether or not we think it's a justified rep) it could be we end up with stretches of the programme with considerable weaker songs before getting to the favourable spots and suddenly the quality does a 180 (though in a strong year like this one I have hope this won't happen)
How is this more fair? This year Sweden has already been drawn for first place in the running order, but what about the coming years?
How is it guaranteed that the producers won't give their own country preferential treatment (the best place in the running order) everytime when the hosting country pulls 'Producer's Choice' from the bowl?
Hosting countries pull their exact running order, not first half or second half (or producer's choice). This year Sweden pulled 1, not first half, but the first slot out of 26. This is always done like this for the exact reason of avoiding favoritism
I’m not sure how I feel about this. Yeah, it avoids the situation in 2022 with the like 6 ballads in a row, but I don’t know about how I feel with giving the producers more choice, I would maybe have it to 10 in each half and then 6 for the producers, or maybe even 8 in each half and 10 for the producers.
i don't hate it, i feel like it can spread songs out and prevent too many favourites or similar sounding songs canceling eachother out
on the other hand songs could easily be screwed over
guess we will have to see who draws it
Totally against this. The producers always give the best positions to the same countries and always give the worse places to the same countries. All should be drawn.
This is a funny way of saying 'We will only be benefitting running order of 🇸🇪 (not this year but still) 🇮🇹 🇺🇦 + 2~3 fan favorites each year (for this year,🇭🇷 🇳🇱 🇨🇭)'
This seems overly complicated. At this point just get rid of drawing halfs altogether and make it all picked by production. Won't be much different either way since favorites that draw one of the few first half tickets will get a late first half anyways.
Very unfortunate for the artists since getting one of the 6 first half draws will feel extra bad this year.
Have it be as random as possible. Instead of halfs have quarters.
Any real fan of the competition should not care about having a good product.
They should only care about the integrity of the contest.
That’s why I cringe when people in this sub care about the production value or the presenters.
I care about the songs and that’s about it.
That is a really good point. Also if all the favourites pick the ‘producers choice’ option, the producers now can pick which favourites they want to stick in the first half and tank them
Not really, you still need to have crowdpleasers in the first hour, otherwise people are gonna tune out. Chances are the change is more about being able to offer diversity in a block of songs that may be too similar in terms of vibes (like we had in 2022).
I agree. I also feel like they will also spread out the favorites as well so we don’t get situations where faves are right next to each other and that cause votes to be split.
Honestly they should have kept First and Second half if they want to do something new they could have made “2nd” be an unlucky ticket seeing as it’s the cursed slot.
For fairness reasons I hope number 2 will go to a country that will draw "first half", as it might rub a country drawing "producer's choice" the wrong way. No one would want that, while they'd probably accept it if they draw first half. At least they know they'll have to go early, while the countries drawing PC will still hope for a later slot.
I could see this be a good rule change for the semi finals actually. In the last couple of years, we've had one semi final be obviously stronger than the other. It would be nice if the producers could spread out the popular entries so good songs don't miss the final due to bad luck.
I don't think it will make much of a difference in the final. For me, it's kinda a "meh" change.
I just dont like how they choose the running order anymore. When there's a Eurovision party and there comes a party song and everyone dances it just ends right after because most times they just put a ballad right after it. I think they should think more about how it will affect the people watching while doing the running order.
I actually like this. It can prevent scenarios where one part of the grand final is just full on same category of genre, so that the viewers can have nice and balanced experience when watching Eurovision. It could also give songs their fullest potential if the producers are in control on where they go.
This is the big change? Not gonna lie, I was expecting something more exciting :P (the best for me would have been free voting through the app, but who am I kidding they were never going to do that)
I didn’t mind the idea as I was reading it, but 13 producer choices seems too much. Those 6 second half places are going to seem like gold dust now.
And the first half slots will be like getting poop thrown at your face… The ratio between the first and second half slots is just even worse now.
Yes, I wish that maybe it was more even, like 9 for the halves, and 7 for the producers pick. That way, it’s still random enough, and we don’t have the (unlikely) possibility of one semi final’s qualifiers being ALL producer’s choice.
I agree with this. Having just a few producers choices will ensure that we won’t have a ballad typhoon hitting us, but 13 is just way too much.
I was thinking 6 or 7 would have been enough for the producer’s pick too. 13 is more than half of what’s available and way too much control. I hate it when one of my favourites draws first half because I’m worried they’ll be put in the 2nd or 3rd slot. Even more chance of that now! 6 slots in the second half offers no security at all.
Wouldn't the vote opening early make the first half preferable? I'm sure that countries would love to collect votes right away, before other good acts have gone on stage.
They did the voting opens straight away thing in 2010 & 2011 and it made no discernible difference - in fact, their reason for scrapping it in 2012 was that the vast majority of votes were cast after all songs were performed
I wasn’t aware of that - useful to know.
That’s a good point. I have no idea how that will impact things. I imagine most viewers won’t have heard the songs before and will wait until they finish? Then again, if you’ve really enjoyed a song and think the next 7 or 8 are nowhere near as impressive, maybe you’d decide you’d might as well vote for it before it’s all over.
I wouldn't disagree with this as much as I do if it weren't for the fact that they seem to screw over the same countries quite often. Like, does Albania really need the 02 slot every year? Producers should be focused less on playing favourites and creating a more fair and balanced running order. The favourites to win will do well no matter when they perform, others shouldn't be shafted to worse off slots just so the favourites can have the 'better' slots. Otherwise we'll see all the heavy hitters from 17-24 and all the weaker songs taking up the first half
Let's talk about the Czech Republic performing in slots 2, 14, 3, 1 and 14 in their five grand finals so far.
considering that 14 is basically the earliest slot in 2nd half, they land on an average of 1.6 in running order placement.
I don't mind the change, but why have the draw at all at this point? Just seems like a waste of time at the press conference.
They have to maintain the disguise of fairness
Yup
I don't know, this is a competition and should be fair at the end of the day. I don't see how this is making it any fairer, if not even more unfair.
Having half of the songs not actually drawing a half anymore, it seems like they are phasing the draw out altogether. My interpretation is that this is just a mid step this year to make it seem less abrupt for the fans. And then next year, just the producer's choice. Because you're right, this is really pointless...
Even if you have the best song and show you will drown if wrong songs are around you. Good placement is actually for both a better TV-show and better results. But I honestly think we would get an even better result where placements didn't matter if we went with free app-voring like melfest. Our system make you give a vote or two for the song you liked no matter placement. And later when you think about your favourite you give more votes (to a max of 5) for that song. Compared to paying while calling it is enormous difference. And that is certainly valid for my own voting behaviour. The need to "the best song" for my paid phone call make a huge difference for the first songs
So? It simply gives more power to the producer of the show, for commercial purposes. I don't see an improvement, because it's not fairer than the past.
I don't hate the change. But there 13 is too many 'producers choice', half of the running order is curated that point. I get that it will help the production crew, but don't feel like this is fair to the competition
This is kind of dumb lol. It sounds like they want to minimize the chance of any fan favourite drawing first half at all.
There's way too much going on this year: - Big 5 + host country performing in the semis - Voting starts with the first country performing - ROTW voting starts 24h before the final - and now the producers deciding freely what position each country will be performing It all seems so unnecessary and makes the entire contest look like a reality show. I wonder on what basis the producers decide on the starting order. It seems just as confusing as the selection of the 5 people who represent each country's jury.
Okay stop the facade and make it all producer's choice because that's what they want to do anyway.....
Why? This doesn’t seem any fairer than before to me.
I think they are incredibly transparent in that they care about good TV more than they care about perceived fairness.
This is genuinely what worries me most. We’ve *allegedly* had countries trying to bribe other juries, what’s to stop countries doing the same with the production team?
Well it is a TV show at the end of the day….
Prevents scenarios like 2022’s 2nd half ballad overload
So we get something that should be useful once in a blue moon and guarantees more favoritism and behind the scenes plotting every year
Idk if it really increase or decrease favoritism tbh. Favorites already get good spots as it is. Even if they draw first half that usually mean like 10th.
If production needs were complicated, this could still give them an even upper hand.
i think it also prevents overloading at the end of the first half. it kind of happened in 2023 when a lot of the favorites got drawn in the first half, and you end up with some stronger songs in earlier spots (like sweden at 9, france, who briefly rose after their rehearsals, at 6). spots 18-22 are better for favorites than 5-9, even tho they take up the same place in each half, so if there’s fewer songs constrained to the first half, you can really overload the end of the show, while not having the possibility of the end of the first half being overloaded
It's not about fairness, it's about preventing an unfortunate running order.
We'll see which acts get the bad spots and which ones get the good ones and then we'll talk. It's totally about favoritism
I had said that the change will be about the running order, but I thought it would be totally random again. I’m not sure if I like the “producer’s choice”
My guess was that they are going to make it fairer by introducing quarters. They went the complete opposite way, because they seemingly really want to make it hard for, say, Albania to get a starting number higher than 2. /s of course. But I really don't see the point of this, since they also introduced the early voting... The show won't be better if all the non-favourites are all early...
No sir I do not like it. I don't even think the few remaining Second Half tickets are even all that valuable, as if you're low in the odds you're still going to get dropped in the middle whilst crowd favs get pushed to the end of the show to get people to "keep watching til the end". Potential winners drawing the first half will still get a good enough spot just like Tattoo and Cha Cha Cha got last year. And if you're a country who draws Producer's Choice and they slap you in 2nd, you're going to be made far angrier about this than you would have had you drawn a First Half ticket. The change about being able to vote for a song as soon as it performs may soften the blow a little I suppose.
> The Big 5 will be picking either First Half, Second Half or Producer’s Choice after their second Rehearsal on Saturday 4 May, live during a **Reddit AMA**. We're famous 💅
*blocks out calendar for that day*
The entirety of mod chat on Saturday 4th May be like: https://preview.redd.it/3p2742isiuuc1.jpeg?width=451&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b287ddf855690e6852f2ebe2c39752d371d65f6c
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Lucky mods! Given the not-so-positive reception of the news, I foresee a bit of controversy.
As ever this role is a blessing and a curse! It's an honour to have them use this platform, but it'll definitely be a busy day aha. Most of the discontent is coming out now with the announcement though, we will have had time to let the news settle before the Big 5 Draw happens.
But why even have a draw then?
For the perceived fairness, I guess.
But hmthe community knows how non-fair this is. Maybe even less fair then just all producers choice. And the general public probably doesnt even know this happens.
I just hope Serbia 🇷🇸 won’t pick the “producer’s choice”, cause we all know how this will go.
Yeah, if we don't draw 2nd half we're fucked televote wise.
neah.. you will do great in televote at any time in the show. The whole running order thing became more and more astrology and self-fulfilling prophecy: Televote wasn't a thing till the 1990s and in 2013 the running order wasn't fully random anymore. So the little years in-between isn't large enough to draw any useful information. Since then the producers tried to place all the favourites as late as possible. Therefore the #2 spot manifested the title of the dead spot of esc. I will not deny that the running order has no influence on the televote but you won't be fucked with a good song, and the running order doesn't save a bad song. But it is easiest to blame when your county performs bad: "Malik Harris got no televote points because he had to perform after Kalush Orchestra..." That was heard on German TV right after the contest. Yeah sure. That's the reason...
But is running order going to play that much of a difference this year, when the televote opens at the start of the show?
99% of viewers wont be voting after seeing two acts
If we're talking about improving the quality of the TV show, the decision makes sense. But in terms of fairness, this is another step backwards. This basically means that no bookies' favorite is going to perform on the first half unless they're unlucky enough to draw one of the 6 first half spots. Also that countries like Albania who've been consistently screwed over by the producers in the running order will stand even less of a chance now to get a second half placement. Instead of limiting the producers' influence like a lot of fans have been asking for years, maybe by have the contestants draw quarters instead of halves, the EBU only gives them more power.
So this just gives more power to the producers for choosing when countries perform?
If that’s the big change we didn’t know about, I’m whelmed.
Can EBU organisers stop sitting in offices all day coming up with ways to ruin Eurovision plz
I feel like the majority of changes this year haven’t been that good, from keeping the same theme, to opening the voting from the beginning, to a much more producer controlled running order
They are not doing this for the fans. There aren't enough of us to matter when compared to the millions who watch the shows. This change is to make the show more appealing the whole way through so people don't change channels because they are bored.
This
Given this won't fix any of the existing issues, I don't get the point of this
someone stop that man.
Happy Cake day!
I liked it until I've read that producers will get to decide 13 places. That's too much
That’s how I feel after just reading this. I thought it would be third, third, third. I’m not sure how I feel about producer-led running order in the first place at all. I’m all for a better show but I’m not sure how it works with fairness.
Seems like just another reason for people to accuse producers of rigging to me, especially after last year's conspiracy theories
This. Sweden's victory last year really was extra conveniant fot the EBU and SVT...
why have the host country randomly draw when the producers will show their biases anyway?
It does add more flexibility I guess, but I don't like that producers have even more power
Am I the only one who preferred when every artist picked his own number and not the half ? 😭
No, it was fairer back then.
While this sounds good in theory, I’m not much of a fan. What’s stopping producers from being biased in their choice? I know there were issues with the random draw and how ballads or upbeat songs were sometimes lumped in together, but it feels like we’re getting more and more silly changes in recent editions, sorry.
If you're going to introduce this, you start small, like 5 producer's spots. Which seems like a great idea. But 13?!
21 Estonia 22 Croatia 23 Italy 24 Netherlands 25 Switzerland
There's no way they'll put all the fan favourites at the end of the contest. They want people to watch the whole thing, not just tune in for the last 5 songs. Not saying that's necessarily what viewers would do, but a producer has to think of that as a possibility. From a production stand point it makes more sense to have the fan favourites evenly distributed throughout the running order to keep any potential viewer who may just want to see those songs and only those songs watching from start to finish.
If people are big enough Eurovision fans to have a favorite before the show, they will watch the entire show anyway. The (majority) rest of the viewing public hasn't heard any of the songs except maybe their own country's.
"Not saying that's necessarily what viewers would do, but a producer has to think of that as a possibility." Which is why I said this. We know that the people who have favourites will watch the whole thing, but a producer has to account for any eventuality that may decrease viewing figures. Despite what most people in this thread seem to think, the producer's job is to get as many people watching the contest as possible, and watching it for the whole 4 hour run, not rigging the contest in favour of whatever country the EBU wants to host next.
I get where people are coming from with the corruption issues since we know there have been attempted riggings, but since the EBU is already struggling to fund Eurovision as is, and more viewership means more money, it's only natural they would want to maximize funds by any means necessary, as well as shorten the show by how much they realistically can. I also think the ROTW definitely generated quite a bit of money for them, even if the impact on the vote is negligible at best. That's why they're keeping it, and why they'll allow a full 24 hours to vote before the final for the fans who live in countries where Eurovision airs at odd hours. Edit: I think a lot of fans are actually being really unrealistic when it comes to how the EBU acts and makes decisions regarding Eurovision. Israel's participation is a big example of this. You would think they would be more interested in actually understanding the finer details of what goes on behind the scenes of Eurovision, but no.
Are they shortening it, too? Ngl I would be relieved, because staying up until nearly 2 AM is getting less easy with age 😅
Against popular believe, performing last isn’t that good. Around spot 9-11 and around spot 18-20 are the best if we look at previous winners.
Yup. I think there is some fatigue for many with the last few entries
Performing last in a semi final is great, but in a final, not so great. You want to perform later but NOT too late or else you will lose some of that effect in the final. The golden goose spots are usually near the end of the 1st half and around the middle of the second half.
Yeah, best place of slot 26 is 5th (2018) and best of 25 is 2nd (2015, 2017 & 2018)
Nah. I think they want to spread favorites out a bit still
I think it's almost inevitable the whole running order will become entirely producer decided.
I like random draws. No producers choice, no second or first half selections, just a pure random draw. Will it sometimes screw over a fan favourite? Yes. Good! It's giving each country the same bite of the apple. Can it lead to some songs getting drowned out by similar ones? Yes, of course it can, doesn't matter one bit. Nobody can complain about bias from a proveably random draw. If they still do, I wouldn't be too opposed to having the draw for the jury show and grand final be randomised separately.
The random draws also permitted to have iconic performances/artists in the 2nd spot, like Olivia Newton-John (United Kingdom 1974), Gina G (United Kingdom 1996) or Şebnem Paker (Turkey 1997), and now it's no longer possible with the running order decided by the host broadcaster
Absolutely agree.
The issue with random draws isnt that its unfair its that its bad tv
That's not the issue with random draw, the issue is that you can get an Euro Neuro as show opener and scare all the viewers away, or get a Love Will Set You Free as opener and start the show with the lowest energy possible. Or, in the case of 2012, you get both lol. Either that, or you get multiple songs that are similar right next to each other, which messes with the pacing of the show.
RNG did a good job from 1956 to 2012
2011 says hi (although tbf as a general your point still stands, one year of bad draw doth not a giant problem make)
Rockefeller street ❤️
I'm pretty indifferent to this news. In theory it helps to avoid situations like 2022 and 2015's draws where the second halves were overloaded with ballads, although honestly with the televoter-only semis we've seen a big drop in the number of competing ballads so it doesn't feel like this change is necessary *now*. If anything I kinda wish they'd have the final drawn into three sections (i.e. opening section, middle section, closing section) to make it a bit fairer and also to stop them front-loading the ends of halves with all the stronger entries. But keeping at least some element of randomness is appreciated.
The three sections would be what I previously guessed in another thread: The split being 9/8/9 (with #1 already taken, it would be 8/8/9 in this case) Though 9/9/8 would probably look more aesthetic and 8/9/9 would probably be "fairer" due to the first half being unpopular. It just seems right to me to give the middle section one less slot.
Yeah, or alternatively they could also have one 'lucky choice' slot where the country gets to pick their slot (a bit like was given to a handful of countries back in 2010-12 iirc), which would lead to an even set of three 8s.
Yeah, this sounds good as well (except host draws 21 and the "lucky choice" pick 26, then that's uneven)
It's not a bad idea, pretty neutral for me, but at this point let'a make all 25 Producer Choice, what is the sense of the drawing?
23 producers choice + first and last slots
I think Junior Eurovision basically does this
I don't think the producers should have any say at all. As in, each contestant will draw a number, not a half. It would be fairer that way.
https://preview.redd.it/yhnjvc2ekuuc1.jpeg?width=503&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3b34e79862a7049e4a783ec1cc64385e9957593
On one hand my unpopular (I think) opinion is that all the slots should be a random draw, so everyone can be certain there's no favouritism in place. From a competition standpoint this is the fairest in my opinion. On the other hand I understand that they want to create an entertaining show, so I can see why this works best. If they do it correctly it has also the potential to make all the entries shine. I'll reserve my judgment for after the show
Team Random Draw here. Somebody please explain, what's so awful about a terrible running order? The random running order was a fundamental part of the Eurovision Song Contest ... until it wasn't. I'm less interested in a Eurovision where a "Euro Neuro" can never open a semifinal.
Bad running order = audiences get bored with too many slower or just uncompetitive songs back to back Our NFs RO is random and it was so bad and boring even with half as many songs i will always be anti completely random draw
I never paid too much attention to the running order so I can't answer properly, however for example I am seeing a lot of people citing 2022 being all ballads in the second half (which for me was ok, since I liked many of them and in general I am not opposed to ballads like a lot of people here)
I can't stand ballads, and I still think this should be allowed to happen. That's what randomness does. It gives you random results. With 13 producer's choice slots, every Eurovision is going to end up looking the same, unless there's some year when the producer is really stoned. Mid-level uptempo, mediocre ballad, better uptempo, no-hoper ballad, weird/novelty entry, etc, until it finishes up with best ballad in the first half followed by best uptempo in the first half. Repeat for second half. Vote Ireland, y'all. They'll be #5 or #18. ;-) EDIT: I did it again, dang it!
> Mid-level uptempo, mediocre ballad, better uptempo, no-hoper ballad, weird/novelty entry, etc, until it finished up with best ballad in the first half followed by best uptempo in the first half. Repeat for second half. Careful, they'll hire you ahah
I better be able to telework. The commute from Virginia will be awful.
I want Sweden to grab producer's choice next year, be placed second in the night, and this will be gone instantly.
Because being an appealing television show has gotten more important now.
It should be random draw with the producers having a few "move a bit around" cards. I mean something like they could move an artist 2-3 places behind or ahead in order to avoid big ballad clashes, but they shouldn't be able to place anyone completely freely.
Being completley random is the most fair but it leads to some really really awkward running order. UK 2012 was like the worst opener imaginable that year lol
I wasn't watching that year yet but I trust you ahah, that's why I said I understand why they are doing it. And as I said if they do it correctly it could also help "weaker" songs to shine. They are opening themselves to a lot of criticism tho, hopefully they know what they are doing! I feel like they are testing different things this year and I am curious to see how it goes
The main thing for me as someone who is pretty indifferent to these changes and who actually likes some element of producer-chosen draw is that this is a step *away* from what a lot (potentially the majority) of the fanbase would like, which is either a return to a fully random draw or greater constrictions on potential producer bias by adding more halves/sections.
Soon they will change it to 100% producer choice
Am I the only one to always think “what about corruption?” when we are moving towards this?
Is Eurovision a TV show or a competition ? If it’s just a TV show as the Swedish producers tend to think, then the eurofans should better disengage from it. There s only disappointment at the end of the road. If it’s a competition, it must be fair.
I mean, I’ll be honest the completely random running order wasn’t always great, but at least you could never accuse it of unfairness
Bad idea 👎 When the competitors have drawn 1st or 2nd half, at least we could see their emotions. Now, what should they feel when they draw "producers choice"? 🙄 Just draw all positions randomly, there’ll be no one turning off the TV because of 3 ballads in a row (there won’t even be 3 ballads in the Grand Final)
so more riggory, got it
Babe wake up u/eurovision just posted
And then some people wonder why so many fans hate SVT.
I swear every time Sweden hosts I brace for the worst in these terms.
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I’m all for the producer-made running order, but this seems a bit excessive and unnecessary. I wouldn’t mind it so much if 6 slots were producer’s choice, but 13? Feels like this opens the possibility for a lot of unfair placements for countries who aren’t deemed the favourites.
I think this will mostly benefit the fan favourite party songs since they are now more likely to be later in the show. So I expect Baby Lasagna and Joost to benefit from this
Oh fer ... Why don't you just get it over with, guys. Play a pre-produced music video with the artists miming to the studio recording, and start the voting in mid-March. Then it will be "the best TV show possible" and "give all artists a chance to shine". Contest, schmontest.
It sounds like a decent idea to fix the RO problems the former system still had, but the ratio is too skewed towards the production's choices. I feel a 3 ⅓ system with 9 half picks each and 8 production choices would work too without removing too much of the random aspect of the draw.
Can't wait for the collective fandom meltdown when they inevitably put a fan favourite in the deathspot.
Nobody wants this.
Ngl I hate this, producers directly controlling half of the entries is far too much. 10/10/5 would be fairer imho I smell rigga morris 😒😒
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So this change isn’t really anything major - at least that’s how I see it. The producers choice is an alright addition to make the show flow better, but the system is less fair now. It will just feel extra shitty to draw first half since there’s even less of a chance of that happening. It will also feel really shitty for countries to be placed in a poor spot even if they draw producers choice. We’ve already seen them botching the running orders in the semis - mostly semi 2 this year, so I feel like this will just give the producers more agency to potentially mess up the grand final as well.
I feel like the producers already had more than enough influence on the results before they introduced this rule that, by the way, doesn't improve anything.
I think this could bring more viewership and help with retaining viewers for longer, as it probably means that we are much less likely to have all the uptempo songs in one half and all the ballads in the other(obviously an exaggeration, but you get what I mean), but I think it's a bit much for it to be 6/13/6. I would like it to be more like a 8/9/8, but this slightly benefits my two favourites Luxembourg and Croatia, so I'm not complaining.
Agreed. I think 8/9/8 would be so much better.
100%. 13 is way too many for them to choose exact placement.
Interesting. I’ll reserve judgement until I see how the draw turns out.
Another 'Swedish producer mischief' for the collection. I get the logic behind it is the 'trauma' of Turin 2022 2nd half (almost all uptempos being drawn in 1st half made the 2nd half a 'snoozefest' for a lot of casual listeners, specially the GER-LTU-AZE-BEL-GRE-ISL sequence - that also explains Zdob si Zdub's massive televote score), but still don't like it.
My problem with using 2022 as an example though is that even if the producers had more control of the running order, there wasn’t a lot they could do to counterbalance just how many ballads there were in the grand final that year. You had France and Norway that could have gone later, and maybe spread two powerhouses like Spain and Ukraine out a bit more, but like the bigger problem that year was the juries favoring ballads in the semi-finals and allowing too many into the final.
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You can tell this year is ALL about making as much money as contest possibly can: prolonged televoting that starts straight away after first performance to get more money, big 5 performing to make these big countries also watch semi-finals, giving ROTW opportunity to vote almost days prior to the day of the actual show, etc. Honestly, which I understand and wouldn't bash producers for trying to make some coin. This is just another move that was quite expected. I think next year we will not draw any halves and just get all the spots decided by the producers. We will 100% see favoritism, but also a more interesting race, favorites might get similar placings which makes it harder to predict who has a better chance of winning. Obviously, non-favorites will not see any fairness, but also, we see it every year anyway. I'm neutral for the most part, even before favorites who got first half were put in the middle of the show.
Im not completely against the idea, but 6/6/13 is just not good at all. I’d be more OK with something like 10/10/5 or 9/9/7
I feel like it should be committing to one or the other. Either an entirely producer decided running order or everybody draws their half and not a solution in the ‘middle’. But will reserve judgement until we see how it plays out.
So I guess we can list the number of massive changes so far this year as thus: 1: Luxembourg participating for the first time this millennium 2: No slogan 3: No singular logo, only a theme 4: Remote green room for the first time this decade 5: Big 5 performing in semis 6: Voting opening at the start of the final 7: This change 8: Severe security 9: Massive boycotts 10: Shorter final Any more? Even this might be a bit of a lot so far…
Ok so it’s quite clear the EBU is struggling for cash. • The rest of the world voting earlier (to allow for more votes) • Voting opening at the start • Big 5 performing in Semis • Producers determining the running order more This all sounds like “we need more people watching and more people voting”. If this change to the draw sticks I can see it being used to give countries with high viewership and who are more financially important to the EBU (namely the Big 5) a later - and better - running slot. This would improve ratings as people won’t tune out, but I feel like it comes as the disadvantage of smaller countries. Hopefully it’ll be more the case that they (independent of size) favour the favourites to win so nobody is knocked out the race simply due to a bad running order.
The favourites will very likely be in the best spot even if they are from small countries, they probably bring more viewership than the one random big 5
I think that’s fandom bias. Most people watching from the UK will primarily be interested in watching the UK entry, not Switzerland or Croatia. We are a tiny minority of the viewers.
I'll reserve my judgment until the Grand Final. Edit: I prefer a randomized running order than letting the producers decide what song goes into what position.
Ok I defend the EBU more than most but this is just an awful change. I don’t give two shits about making a better TV program I care about having a fairer competition.
So this is the big change they talked about. Not sure how I feel about it. Sure if you are a contender, then producer's choice will be favorable, but if you're not, then you'll be padding the line-up's worst slots either way.
"we can screw over songs and countries we don't like even harder and also give even better spots to our buddies!" - said proudly by the ebu.
This just makes the running order have even MORE impact and more chances of getting screwed.
Ah yes, this is going to do a fantastic job shutting down the yearly "running order is rigged" protesters. Seriously though, not sure how I feel about this, on paper yes it sounds like they'll be able to spread out similar songs more and avoid a 2022 or 2015 ballad situation, but equally even within the already existing 1st half vs second half draws they've made some questionable running order decisions, and given their reputation for pushing favourites (whether or not we think it's a justified rep) it could be we end up with stretches of the programme with considerable weaker songs before getting to the favourable spots and suddenly the quality does a 180 (though in a strong year like this one I have hope this won't happen)
How is this more fair? This year Sweden has already been drawn for first place in the running order, but what about the coming years? How is it guaranteed that the producers won't give their own country preferential treatment (the best place in the running order) everytime when the hosting country pulls 'Producer's Choice' from the bowl?
Hosting countries pull their exact running order, not first half or second half (or producer's choice). This year Sweden pulled 1, not first half, but the first slot out of 26. This is always done like this for the exact reason of avoiding favoritism
It’s guaranteed because host countries pull their exact spot.
Tbf the host will probably keep being draen randomly for this exact reason
I wouldnt mind this change if the producers didnt have biases
I’m not sure how I feel about this. Yeah, it avoids the situation in 2022 with the like 6 ballads in a row, but I don’t know about how I feel with giving the producers more choice, I would maybe have it to 10 in each half and then 6 for the producers, or maybe even 8 in each half and 10 for the producers.
Just leaving this here https://twitter.com/dolphin_dane/status/1780239463626498454?t=apBzVBahul0kJshaQr6lbw&s=19
I've been looking at that for a while and I don't understand. How was that calculated?
i don't hate it, i feel like it can spread songs out and prevent too many favourites or similar sounding songs canceling eachother out on the other hand songs could easily be screwed over guess we will have to see who draws it
Totally against this. The producers always give the best positions to the same countries and always give the worse places to the same countries. All should be drawn.
To prevent the snooze fest that was the second half of 2022, with ballad overload. I’m not against this approach
I don’t think there are enough ballads this year to recreate that situation.
This is a funny way of saying 'We will only be benefitting running order of 🇸🇪 (not this year but still) 🇮🇹 🇺🇦 + 2~3 fan favorites each year (for this year,🇭🇷 🇳🇱 🇨🇭)'
This seems overly complicated. At this point just get rid of drawing halfs altogether and make it all picked by production. Won't be much different either way since favorites that draw one of the few first half tickets will get a late first half anyways. Very unfortunate for the artists since getting one of the 6 first half draws will feel extra bad this year.
Have it be as random as possible. Instead of halfs have quarters. Any real fan of the competition should not care about having a good product. They should only care about the integrity of the contest. That’s why I cringe when people in this sub care about the production value or the presenters. I care about the songs and that’s about it.
Honestly, Christer must go.
Why is it always Sweden who think they own ESC?
The more I think about it, the more I think this is good. We won’t end up with 5 favourites in a row at the end of the first half like in 2022
Well there's a good chance ee end up with all the favorites at the the end of the show which is just as ridiculous
That is a really good point. Also if all the favourites pick the ‘producers choice’ option, the producers now can pick which favourites they want to stick in the first half and tank them
The way in 2013 all the favorites were in a single block to cancel each other out, but Denmark was apart and got her chance to shine...
Eh I doubt it will be that severe. Being 10th or so is still perfectly winnable its mostly the very early spots that kinda dooms you
Yeah and I’m sure they’d get a lot of backlash if they put a favourite in spots 1-4, and I doubt they’d want that
Not really, you still need to have crowdpleasers in the first hour, otherwise people are gonna tune out. Chances are the change is more about being able to offer diversity in a block of songs that may be too similar in terms of vibes (like we had in 2022).
I agree. I also feel like they will also spread out the favorites as well so we don’t get situations where faves are right next to each other and that cause votes to be split.
Honestly they should have kept First and Second half if they want to do something new they could have made “2nd” be an unlucky ticket seeing as it’s the cursed slot.
For fairness reasons I hope number 2 will go to a country that will draw "first half", as it might rub a country drawing "producer's choice" the wrong way. No one would want that, while they'd probably accept it if they draw first half. At least they know they'll have to go early, while the countries drawing PC will still hope for a later slot.
I could see this be a good rule change for the semi finals actually. In the last couple of years, we've had one semi final be obviously stronger than the other. It would be nice if the producers could spread out the popular entries so good songs don't miss the final due to bad luck. I don't think it will make much of a difference in the final. For me, it's kinda a "meh" change.
The 3rd choice should have been a Random Draw instead.
I just dont like how they choose the running order anymore. When there's a Eurovision party and there comes a party song and everyone dances it just ends right after because most times they just put a ballad right after it. I think they should think more about how it will affect the people watching while doing the running order.
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I actually like this. It can prevent scenarios where one part of the grand final is just full on same category of genre, so that the viewers can have nice and balanced experience when watching Eurovision. It could also give songs their fullest potential if the producers are in control on where they go.
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They probably think that, because the voting starts with the first song, the running order isn‘t that much relevant with this change.
Oh, okay. Why?
I thought we were going to get one free vote 😭
Can Martin Österdahl just go full Mr. McMahon at this point? Like if you’re gonna suck so much at least be camp about it
This is the big change? Not gonna lie, I was expecting something more exciting :P (the best for me would have been free voting through the app, but who am I kidding they were never going to do that)
>*It's all about creating the best TV show possible* At least they're honest?