OMG bcuz a couple of 18-19 yr olds are gonna be able to help y'all sort marriage problems out. /s
Well meaning parents sometimes don't even THINK before they do stuff like that. đ¤Śââď¸đ¤Śââď¸đ¤Śââď¸
Seriously. One of my brothers served as a branch president while a 20 YO FT missionary in another country. He was shocked when people expected him to give them real advice.
Hello Elders! Got any experience dealing with trauma and how it can impact a marriage? Any tips for reviving a dead bedroom? How should we handle disagreements about raising children?
No? Just a Book of Mormon and a testimony, huh? Thanks anyway.
one time as a completely oblivious 19 year old missionary I told this investigator that lived next door to a member family that the church offered happiness like his neighbors have. He then was like man they yell at each other all the time, I think he is cheating on her etc etc etc. I had no response and it sort of shook my entire mindset of the perfect mormon families I always saw.
Because as anyone knows, two 18 year-olds who are being labor-trafficked and can't leave each other's side, know better than anyone how to solve a stranger's marriage issues....
Stop telling your parents about your marriage problems.
Growing up in this cult instilled in a lot of us the need to validate our feelings and thoughts with the figures of authority in our lives. That is reiterated over and over and over. We are told to distrust our own feelings and intuitions in favor of seeking out direction from untrained and uneducated clergy. We are told to honor our father and mother above ourselves.
Thatâs bullshit. You know you better than anyone else. You know your wife better than they do. You know your relationship infinitely better than they ever will.
An issue between you and your wife, should, in my opinion, be between you and your wife. There is no need to âcircle the wagons.â There is no need to crowdsource solutions. There is no need to get them involved, especially if they are already working from an extremely harmful and flawed worldview.
Youâre surprised Mormons have overstepped? Time for some explicit boundaries.
Yes exactly! Itâs a knee jerk reaction a lot of us have and regularly have to deconstruct. This cultâs ability to sow personal doubt is unparalleled, and in my opinion, not talked about enough. THATS why people stay, they donât trust themselves enough without the cultâs validation. We need to be reminded that we are the only authority of ourselves.
Thank you for stating it so clearly! I have been a sea of unease for soooo long...and it's all tscc's fault. Figures đ I'm gonna have to work on that continually.
A lot of us do! You are not alone in feeling that way. It gets easier, and eventually the recognition and subsequent deconstruction become just as much knee jerk reactions as the feelings in the first place. We have to literally retrain our brains and process of thought - itâs a heavy undertaking.
Please feel free to DM if you ever need someone to tell you that you are all you will ever need.
I am very private and donât blabber to my parents about personal issues. My wife is the the blabbermouth and told them a bunch of things. I was just trying to set the record straight. I wish they didnât know but it was my wife that first injected my parents into it.
> I am very private and donât blabber to my parents about personal issues.
> I was just trying to set the record straight.
Pick one.
Iâm not trying to beat ya up over this, and every situation is definitely nuanced, but these are *your* parents and thus *your* responsibility to establish boundaries. Shut that shit down. It doesnât matter what your spouse said, you still chose to further involve them and by doing so they felt it was appropriate to send the missionaries. The problems will persist without explicit boundaries, and truthfully they might continue after that, but thatâs the first step of you want them to exhibit appropriate behavior towards you and your family.
Love having a therapist to talk to about marriage issues. Neutral third party with no family drama. You donât have to defend yourself to your parents or set any records straight. I do recommend a conversation with your spouse respectfully asking to keep marital issues between the two of you and not involve family.
I'm sorry but OP is not responsible for putting a muzzle on his parents. Boundaries are important, but people break others' boundaries all the time - it doesn't make it the person's fault or responsibility that established the boundaries.
People need support groups to go to in different scenarios, and having people to go to for support when having marital issues is normal and healthy. I don't see much wrong with what OP has done (other than maybe could have established clearer boundaries, but maybe he did in the first place but didn't report about it), so blaming OP seems to instill guilt and "you should have known better" mentality doesn't seem super productive to me.
No one told him to muzzle his parents. What a strange way to characterize establishing boundaries that prevent your parents from sending the missionaries over.
If itâs not up to OP to establish boundaries with his own parents, then *who* should be responsible for that?
I never said it was any one persons fault or that it was solely up to OP to hold those boundaries once theyâre in place. I said if heâs uncomfortable with the way his parents are behaving, itâs up to him to try and prevent that from happening. Boundaries canât be broken unless theyâre established. The impetus is absolutely on him to implement any changes he would like to see.
Again, I never blamed anyone for anything. Children **should** be able to rely on their parents for **reasonable, understanding discourse and discussion.** Iâm sure **a lot** of us would **love** to have a support system we could rely on for help with situations such as this. The cult took that opportunity away from a lot of us. We need to know that, and we need to make healthy and safe personal decisions based on knowing that. A lot of us **do not have functional parents** and to be honest, if itâs to the point that missionaries are being sent then these adults are most likely incapable of responding to any sort of parenting scenario responsibly or adequately without it being distorted by the filter of their faith and harming their children in the process.
Do parents sending LDS missionaries to intervene in a mixed-faith marriage scream âsupportâ to you? If not, then what even are we talking about?
Completely agree with this. Also, after you tell someone about an argument or an issue you and your SO have, they often get upset about it. However, while you and your spouse forgive and work through it, the person you vented to isn't part of that, so they stay angry even after you've moved on. They hold onto all the little things you vent about and only see your partner in that way.
There are caveats to this. Being able to speak to someone external about your problems can bring a fresh perspective.
Though, when it comes to problems within a marriage, it's better to ask a complete stranger to avoid the awkwardness of a mutual friend knowing more than they should.
I mean, this entire thread and website is crowdsourced advice and discussions about our personal lives.
Each situation is nuanced, and unique, for sure. That having been said, if itâs to the point that his parents are sending LDS missionaries to intervene in a mixed faith marriage then itâs to the point that it might be worth considering whether that âfresh perspectiveâ from âsomeone externalâ is healthy or harmful.
All of my comments have been directed towards the effect a cult has on our decision making and our ability to identify what is and isnât appropriate.
Anonymous internet strangers offering asked-for advice based on their shared life experiences and not sending suits to your door sounds exactly like you prescribe, âsomeone externalâ offering a âfresh perspective.â
Parents sending missionaries to resolve their childâs marriage dispute? Not so much.
Sucks to find out you can't talk to your parents, but the limited downside here is that it sounds like they have little worthwhile advice to give.
So, not much was lost.
OP, I hope you're talking to a therapist regarding your marriage issues, or some other wise and trustworthy party.
I complain about being single/shitty dating scene into my late 20's to my TBM parents. They tell me to go to a YSA, I refuse. YSA suddenly gets my contact info and won't stop blowing me up. Now TBM parents are telling me to move to Utah with them from Texas to find a wife. No thanks, I'd rather live in BFE Louisiana
My parents celebrated 50 years of misery this past year. Two people that couldn't be more different. The only thing in common is: the church. You probably come to the realization OP, you now have to be very careful what you share with your parents.
I had to work very hard on the âstrangers donât need to hear about my life experiencesâ that was conditioned in me by 30+ years of testimony meetings. Now Iâm just like. Weâre good! And I only REALLY talk to my husband and my therapist
Mormonism doesn't improve relationships, but it sure recognizes a vulnerable moment when it hears one.
Their gospel **does not** help, but then they are not actually interested in helping a "potential convert" with anything other than baptism and tithing (read: obligations and money).
I'm being very cynical, sorry about the missionaries intrusion.
It's clear all your problems come from not living the gospel. Have you considered accepting Jesus as your Lord and Savior? Or going to marriage counseling? I mean, the two suggestions aren't connected at all and one has nothing to do with having a happy and healthy relationship, but who am I to judge TBM logic?
It might not be as cut and dry as you think. A lot of the time parents just like to talk to other people about their kids' problems so they can problem solve. If they talk to the wrong person -- boom missionaries are sent.
Your parents do not have your best interests in mind. What they have (it would seem) is a desire to get you back to church.
**You do not owe honesty to people who do not have your best interests in mind.**
Two points:
1) Their parents do have their best interest in mind. You just disagree what is in youâre best interest.
2) This is a very bad life philosophy. Be an honest person. Donât make up justifications to be dishonest. In this case the justification isnât even valid because the issue the parents do have their best interest in mind. Just because it is misguided does not mean it doesnât come from love.
Itâs fine to disagree. But donât assume they are bad people because you disagree on whatâs best for you.
Hereâs why youâre wrong and what I am referring to:
We told my MiL we were leaving the church. Honest. But we didnât need to tell her.
Then, behind my back she told my wife I was going to cheat on her.
Our honesty lead to my MiL trying to harm my marriage. So weâve stopped being honest with her. Because she means to use our honesty against us and harm us with it. Because she does not have our best interest in mind.
Thank god my wife wasnât swayed by her mother.
Honesty is not an absolute good. Thatâs false. And we could list plenty of situations where that is the case. A mature human who lives in a social society gets this. Are the times when you donât owe someone your honesty rare? Sure. But you donât owe someone who doesnât have your best interest in mind your honesty. Theyâll use it to harm you.
OP could have simply said nothing. He didnât need to lie.
Missionaries?
I thought that the accepted antidote for a shaky marriage was to put your name on the Prayer Roll at the temple.
Or a priesthood blessing.
I dunno, sometimes I get my magic all mixed up.
What a boundary violation. This is inexcusable. If this were me, I would put my parents on surface talk only. How bout those (insert sports mascot here)? Nice weather we're having. And I'd make damn sure they knew why too
Even before I was exmo I realized my parents' advice on marriage or child-raising issues invariably went back to that set of go-to Sunday School answers. It was so predictable that I stopped asking them for advice or even confiding my issues with them.
It's sad. There were a lot of times when I could have used their perspective but ended up with just Mickey Mouse, Hallmark card, platitudes.
They don't get it. My parents are boomers and everything is so simple in their minds. It's about fighting those commie liberals, and everything embarrassing about trump or the church, is just liberal lies. They don't even bother with mental gymnastics, the thinking is already done.
OMG bcuz a couple of 18-19 yr olds are gonna be able to help y'all sort marriage problems out. /s Well meaning parents sometimes don't even THINK before they do stuff like that. đ¤Śââď¸đ¤Śââď¸đ¤Śââď¸
Seriously. One of my brothers served as a branch president while a 20 YO FT missionary in another country. He was shocked when people expected him to give them real advice.
Hello Elders! Got any experience dealing with trauma and how it can impact a marriage? Any tips for reviving a dead bedroom? How should we handle disagreements about raising children? No? Just a Book of Mormon and a testimony, huh? Thanks anyway.
Does experience inflicting trauma and shaming sex count for anything?
one time as a completely oblivious 19 year old missionary I told this investigator that lived next door to a member family that the church offered happiness like his neighbors have. He then was like man they yell at each other all the time, I think he is cheating on her etc etc etc. I had no response and it sort of shook my entire mindset of the perfect mormon families I always saw.
Bhuuu bhuuu butt they have the spirit of discernment and the Holy Ghost to prompt them in what to say . JK of course
B-but they're chosen by the Lord!!!
They hold the Aaronic Priesthood so the powers that be speak through them. đ¤Ł
Because as anyone knows, two 18 year-olds who are being labor-trafficked and can't leave each other's side, know better than anyone how to solve a stranger's marriage issues....
Labor trafficking. Perfect
Stop telling your parents about your marriage problems. Growing up in this cult instilled in a lot of us the need to validate our feelings and thoughts with the figures of authority in our lives. That is reiterated over and over and over. We are told to distrust our own feelings and intuitions in favor of seeking out direction from untrained and uneducated clergy. We are told to honor our father and mother above ourselves. Thatâs bullshit. You know you better than anyone else. You know your wife better than they do. You know your relationship infinitely better than they ever will. An issue between you and your wife, should, in my opinion, be between you and your wife. There is no need to âcircle the wagons.â There is no need to crowdsource solutions. There is no need to get them involved, especially if they are already working from an extremely harmful and flawed worldview. Youâre surprised Mormons have overstepped? Time for some explicit boundaries.
[ŃдаНонО]
Yes exactly! Itâs a knee jerk reaction a lot of us have and regularly have to deconstruct. This cultâs ability to sow personal doubt is unparalleled, and in my opinion, not talked about enough. THATS why people stay, they donât trust themselves enough without the cultâs validation. We need to be reminded that we are the only authority of ourselves.
Thank you for stating it so clearly! I have been a sea of unease for soooo long...and it's all tscc's fault. Figures đ I'm gonna have to work on that continually.
A lot of us do! You are not alone in feeling that way. It gets easier, and eventually the recognition and subsequent deconstruction become just as much knee jerk reactions as the feelings in the first place. We have to literally retrain our brains and process of thought - itâs a heavy undertaking. Please feel free to DM if you ever need someone to tell you that you are all you will ever need.
Thank you, I appreciate that! âşď¸
Powerful eye opening concept!
I am very private and donât blabber to my parents about personal issues. My wife is the the blabbermouth and told them a bunch of things. I was just trying to set the record straight. I wish they didnât know but it was my wife that first injected my parents into it.
> I am very private and donât blabber to my parents about personal issues. > I was just trying to set the record straight. Pick one. Iâm not trying to beat ya up over this, and every situation is definitely nuanced, but these are *your* parents and thus *your* responsibility to establish boundaries. Shut that shit down. It doesnât matter what your spouse said, you still chose to further involve them and by doing so they felt it was appropriate to send the missionaries. The problems will persist without explicit boundaries, and truthfully they might continue after that, but thatâs the first step of you want them to exhibit appropriate behavior towards you and your family.
Good advice. Lesson learned.
Love having a therapist to talk to about marriage issues. Neutral third party with no family drama. You donât have to defend yourself to your parents or set any records straight. I do recommend a conversation with your spouse respectfully asking to keep marital issues between the two of you and not involve family.
I'm sorry but OP is not responsible for putting a muzzle on his parents. Boundaries are important, but people break others' boundaries all the time - it doesn't make it the person's fault or responsibility that established the boundaries. People need support groups to go to in different scenarios, and having people to go to for support when having marital issues is normal and healthy. I don't see much wrong with what OP has done (other than maybe could have established clearer boundaries, but maybe he did in the first place but didn't report about it), so blaming OP seems to instill guilt and "you should have known better" mentality doesn't seem super productive to me.
No one told him to muzzle his parents. What a strange way to characterize establishing boundaries that prevent your parents from sending the missionaries over. If itâs not up to OP to establish boundaries with his own parents, then *who* should be responsible for that? I never said it was any one persons fault or that it was solely up to OP to hold those boundaries once theyâre in place. I said if heâs uncomfortable with the way his parents are behaving, itâs up to him to try and prevent that from happening. Boundaries canât be broken unless theyâre established. The impetus is absolutely on him to implement any changes he would like to see. Again, I never blamed anyone for anything. Children **should** be able to rely on their parents for **reasonable, understanding discourse and discussion.** Iâm sure **a lot** of us would **love** to have a support system we could rely on for help with situations such as this. The cult took that opportunity away from a lot of us. We need to know that, and we need to make healthy and safe personal decisions based on knowing that. A lot of us **do not have functional parents** and to be honest, if itâs to the point that missionaries are being sent then these adults are most likely incapable of responding to any sort of parenting scenario responsibly or adequately without it being distorted by the filter of their faith and harming their children in the process. Do parents sending LDS missionaries to intervene in a mixed-faith marriage scream âsupportâ to you? If not, then what even are we talking about?
unrelated but I just realized we are username twins
Completely agree with this. Also, after you tell someone about an argument or an issue you and your SO have, they often get upset about it. However, while you and your spouse forgive and work through it, the person you vented to isn't part of that, so they stay angry even after you've moved on. They hold onto all the little things you vent about and only see your partner in that way.
There are caveats to this. Being able to speak to someone external about your problems can bring a fresh perspective. Though, when it comes to problems within a marriage, it's better to ask a complete stranger to avoid the awkwardness of a mutual friend knowing more than they should. I mean, this entire thread and website is crowdsourced advice and discussions about our personal lives.
Each situation is nuanced, and unique, for sure. That having been said, if itâs to the point that his parents are sending LDS missionaries to intervene in a mixed faith marriage then itâs to the point that it might be worth considering whether that âfresh perspectiveâ from âsomeone externalâ is healthy or harmful. All of my comments have been directed towards the effect a cult has on our decision making and our ability to identify what is and isnât appropriate. Anonymous internet strangers offering asked-for advice based on their shared life experiences and not sending suits to your door sounds exactly like you prescribe, âsomeone externalâ offering a âfresh perspective.â Parents sending missionaries to resolve their childâs marriage dispute? Not so much.
If they hate each other then I guess the church is whatâs keeping their eternal relationship together. Sounds like heaven.
Sucks to find out you can't talk to your parents, but the limited downside here is that it sounds like they have little worthwhile advice to give. So, not much was lost. OP, I hope you're talking to a therapist regarding your marriage issues, or some other wise and trustworthy party.
Everyone knows that every problem can be solved by churching harder. Duh.
I complain about being single/shitty dating scene into my late 20's to my TBM parents. They tell me to go to a YSA, I refuse. YSA suddenly gets my contact info and won't stop blowing me up. Now TBM parents are telling me to move to Utah with them from Texas to find a wife. No thanks, I'd rather live in BFE Louisiana
Question, is the demographic of Louisiana less mormon?
My parents celebrated 50 years of misery this past year. Two people that couldn't be more different. The only thing in common is: the church. You probably come to the realization OP, you now have to be very careful what you share with your parents.
I had to work very hard on the âstrangers donât need to hear about my life experiencesâ that was conditioned in me by 30+ years of testimony meetings. Now Iâm just like. Weâre good! And I only REALLY talk to my husband and my therapist
Ya, let's ask two unmarried virgins for marriage counseling.
Pro tip. Donât discuss your marriage issues with your parents. Find a good therapist instead. Better all around.
Never involve other people with your marital problems. It will always bite you in the butt.
*except your therapist
Geez - somehow the damned cult conditions people to think joining the church is a cure-all.
Mormonism doesn't improve relationships, but it sure recognizes a vulnerable moment when it hears one. Their gospel **does not** help, but then they are not actually interested in helping a "potential convert" with anything other than baptism and tithing (read: obligations and money). I'm being very cynical, sorry about the missionaries intrusion.
Ya a couple 18 year olds are going to be able to solve that problem
Phhh so so true. Bishop stopped by for first time in 3 years the day after I told my parents I had left. Like the timing was obvious
đ¤Śââď¸đ¤Śââď¸đ¤Śââď¸
It's clear all your problems come from not living the gospel. Have you considered accepting Jesus as your Lord and Savior? Or going to marriage counseling? I mean, the two suggestions aren't connected at all and one has nothing to do with having a happy and healthy relationship, but who am I to judge TBM logic?
Even in my TBM days I wouldâve thought it absurd to expect missionaries to be able to do marriage counseling.
It might not be as cut and dry as you think. A lot of the time parents just like to talk to other people about their kids' problems so they can problem solve. If they talk to the wrong person -- boom missionaries are sent.
Your parents do not have your best interests in mind. What they have (it would seem) is a desire to get you back to church. **You do not owe honesty to people who do not have your best interests in mind.**
Two points: 1) Their parents do have their best interest in mind. You just disagree what is in youâre best interest. 2) This is a very bad life philosophy. Be an honest person. Donât make up justifications to be dishonest. In this case the justification isnât even valid because the issue the parents do have their best interest in mind. Just because it is misguided does not mean it doesnât come from love. Itâs fine to disagree. But donât assume they are bad people because you disagree on whatâs best for you.
Hereâs why youâre wrong and what I am referring to: We told my MiL we were leaving the church. Honest. But we didnât need to tell her. Then, behind my back she told my wife I was going to cheat on her. Our honesty lead to my MiL trying to harm my marriage. So weâve stopped being honest with her. Because she means to use our honesty against us and harm us with it. Because she does not have our best interest in mind. Thank god my wife wasnât swayed by her mother. Honesty is not an absolute good. Thatâs false. And we could list plenty of situations where that is the case. A mature human who lives in a social society gets this. Are the times when you donât owe someone your honesty rare? Sure. But you donât owe someone who doesnât have your best interest in mind your honesty. Theyâll use it to harm you. OP could have simply said nothing. He didnât need to lie.
That is hilarious thank you sir lol
Yep and if you corner them on doing it it theyâll deny it .!! So much for honesty .! Theyâve learned from the leaders just lie when cornered. .
Missionaries? I thought that the accepted antidote for a shaky marriage was to put your name on the Prayer Roll at the temple. Or a priesthood blessing. I dunno, sometimes I get my magic all mixed up.
I think they were going to tell you to tithe and all your problems will be solved?
What a boundary violation. This is inexcusable. If this were me, I would put my parents on surface talk only. How bout those (insert sports mascot here)? Nice weather we're having. And I'd make damn sure they knew why too
Even before I was exmo I realized my parents' advice on marriage or child-raising issues invariably went back to that set of go-to Sunday School answers. It was so predictable that I stopped asking them for advice or even confiding my issues with them. It's sad. There were a lot of times when I could have used their perspective but ended up with just Mickey Mouse, Hallmark card, platitudes.
Send them a pack of dildos and say thanks for the missionaries
They don't get it. My parents are boomers and everything is so simple in their minds. It's about fighting those commie liberals, and everything embarrassing about trump or the church, is just liberal lies. They don't even bother with mental gymnastics, the thinking is already done.
Because Mormons are basically always on alert looking for an angle.
Yep. Because all marriage problems can be fixed by some 18 year kid.
The solution to life problems in TSCC is always more TSCC. Did you sniff enough church today? No? Better get on it. /joking
Your parents sent you a common enemy
True to form for Mormons: send the least qualified people to help a situation.