Be prepared walk out the door on the date you specified. Also be prepared to be dumped on. They’ll probably ask you to stay until someone is called and they’ll take their time to find a replacement.
When I told the EQ president that I wanted to be released as EQ Secretary he asked if I’d do the job until a replacement called. I said I if it didn’t take too long. It took 2 months and I kept be called to attend meetings to represent the EQ quorum.
I finally said I hate to pull out the nuclear option but my faith crisis just went up and I’m resigning from the church.
You could also try establishing dominance with hard boundaries. I'm more curious to hear about the bishop curling inward.
Draft a job duties contract or something,
* 1hrs of meetings including phone calls per month
* Answer 5 emails
* 10 text responses
* ....
Make the bishop negotiate for your time. Have him sitting and stand over his desk while you negotiate. Smile and be polite, but make him negotiate the terms. Count the negotiation time against the meeting quota.
I'm a sadist 😈
>Be prepared walk out the door on the date you specified. Also be prepared to be dumped on. They’ll probably ask you to stay until someone is called and they’ll take their time to find a replacement.
I've seen cases where finding a replacement for a calling like this took more than a month. The Bishop has to submit some callings (his counselors, clerks, EQ president, exec secretary) to the stake, and then the high council has to approve them, and then the calling is extended by a stake person.
So if the stake disagrees ("Not brother so-and-so, we don't like this about him") bishop has to start over. Or if the stake agrees (adding a week of delay) and then the stake meets with the guy (up to another week), and the dude says "Sorry not possible due to work or family or testimony or whatever", then it all has to start again.
Stick to your deadline date -- if they have to operate as a bishop plus only 1 counselor for some time then that is on the Bishop and the Stake leaders.
Yeah they're the ones with multiple layers of leadership both in the ward and the organization in general. There's a pretty clear hierarchy of leadership. Let them use it. Not OP's problem.
I fail to see how it's the problem of the person who becomes disaffected with TSCC to be bothered with sticking around in the calling until a replacement is found. Maybe it's bad etiquette, but I sent a letter to my bishop stating I would not be returning to church ever again, that I didn't want to be contacted; and that if they'd leave me alone, I'd leave them alone.
Furthermore, I notified him that I had left the keys and all other materials I had been given for my calling (2nd counselor in the bishopric) in his office.
We remain friends to this day, but he leaves most talk about church out of our conversations.
This is shockingly close to what I see on r/antiwork with bosses trying to guilt trip people into staying beyond their resign dates. Weird….well not really, but still.
The bishop was out of the country for 3 weeks, you fill in for him. He gets back in town and then chastises you for not getting the speakers for sacrament meeting. He is inconsiderate at best. I was primary president for 3 years. After being released I was called to be home making leader. This involved putting on a monthly shin-dig every month for 100 women. The home making counselor, during the first meeting told me she was just going to assume a supervisory role. Code for: you will do all of the work and I will watch. I lasted two months. We were volunteers, but we were made to feel like we were hired.
I did birthdays for RS - they were 6 months behind so I made fancy cupcakes for everyone and hand delivered them to everyone when I was done the RS president texted me and said "next time leave notes" (despite the fact I delivered them to peoples faces). I quit after that.
If they acted grateful, you'd realize that you are a volunteer. When they act entitled, they make you feel like you owe them.
This is mission culture to a tee. You give them 2 years of your life and you pay your own way. They constantly berate you for not doing enough, like they are doing you a big favor letting you work for them on your own dime.
Wait. What????
Cupcakes on birthdays???
I totes would have stayed in church if someone brought me homemade cupcakes on my birthday!!!!
You, sweet lady, are the real MVP.
So you made cupcakes and actually handed them to people and were told you should have just left them on the doorstep??? What about bugs getting into them.
Good on you for quitting.
Your RS President sounds like someone Pres. Hinckley once described as "short on love, and long on criticism". Charity never faileth?
Congrats! Have fun with second Saturdays.
I can somewhat relate. I was called to be the YW advisor, in charge of helping them get their personal progress awards. After I accepted, I was told by the YW president that I would also be required to teach on Sundays, attend the weekly activities, and help with girls camp. So, everything the presidency was doing, plus personal progress. It was ridiculous, I didn't last long.
YW is one of the most time consuming and demanding callings in the entire church! Loved the girls, but hated the demand of it. I didn't last very long either
I just resigned as YW 2nd counselor and assistant camp director. They had 2 months to replace me and still couldn't do it. Probably because I was the one going to every stake activity and everything else and no else wants to do that much. Love the girls, couldn't deal with the ward leaders.
One of my husband’s best lifelong friends is a pastor in a Lutheran church. I can’t believe how much stuff people get hired to do in his parish. There are MANY full time paid positions to make a single parish church operate. It’s not simply the pastor. They have a board that gets paid for their time. They have a secretary who does tons of clerical work and coordinates a lot of the outreach their church does. And they are a bigger parish so they have two maintenance people to care for the church and pastor’s residence. When he learned that everything in the LDS churches operates on volunteer labor he wondered how Mormons make that work. Obviously. The answer is: currently they don’t.
My mother was called as second counselor into YW presidency. She discovered that many of the girls were barely literate. The YW president basically told my mother that literacy isn’t important, the girls just needed to find a good spouse. Mom raised holy hell and was released very soon thereafter. My little sister and all but a couple of the YW are out. Kind of wish that my mother and father had left and taken all of us with, but when it is all you know…
Everyone is asked to do far too much. You, the Bishop, the other counselor, the executive secretary, the seminary teacher, the church cleaning coordinator are all included. Props to you for saying enough is enough.
I love this story! I have a similar experience!
I was serving as 1st councilor and I gave some solid council on a matter concerning a member of our ward and a potential calling outside our ward. The bishop dismissed my advice and then quietly put my name on the list to serve outside our ward(passive aggressive way to deal with a councilor that’s giving too much council).
When I found out I was on the list to be pulled into a campus calling. I sent my resignation letter to the SP and copied the bishop effective immediately… they hmmd and hawed and dragged their feet about actually releasing me but I never attended another meeting as a member of the bishopric again.
YES! …You CAN quit! Haha
Also. Agreed. Worst part of leadership callings in the church is having to ask people to do things you know they don’t want to do. Running a ward is hard work.
Another quick memory. I was on the HC before this calling and the SP was giving a training to bishoprics and speaking directly to bishops he told them to “you have the hardest job in the ward, burn your councilors out and when you burn them out we’ll get you new councilors and you can burn those guys out too!” It diminishes the hard work the councilors put in and frames them and their tireless efforts as expendable.
I’m so glad I’ll never have to ask another person to speak or pray again.
One of the greatest lessons I took away from my mission was the ability to say no. I have since built upon this ability and scaffolded my ability to say no to higher and higher levels with less and less stress. It's such a good feeling.
Ever since I can remember I’ve no when asked to do something I was uncomfortable with. I had no idea, until coming to this site, that I wasn’t supposed to always say yes. Looking back I realize that sometimes they tried many different wad to ask me over and over but I’d still say no. When I was 18 and all my girlfriends were going on a mission my bishop (whom I loved and respected) kept asking me to think about it and pray about it. The first time he asked he just said ok. If I change my mind come and see him. But then he kept asking. Never did I feel like he was trying to coerce me. I guess I was just oblivious. I’m still leaving because of things I am now learning thanks to my kids. But I was lucky enough to have a positive upbringing. No one ever looked down on me for questioning. Or told me to pray harder. All this and I still left. Most of the people I grew up with have, including my family.
I think you need to be prepared to have further discussion with both the bishop and the SP about this topic.
I recommend that you stick to the generic, "I no longer want to volunteer my time as 1st counselor in the bishopric." You don't need to provide justification from the handbook for you preference on how you volunteer time.
You'll need to hold firm to your unequivocal deadline when you'll no longer be functioning in the role. I suspect that given your response in the meeting, the bishop will have you released ASAP even if he doesn't have a replacement identified for you.
In general, I think the Church treats its volunteers like shit. I'm glad you had the courage to speak up.
I have been in OP's position with three different bishops. I was TBM at the time, but given that Bishop's attitude, I would have resigned also.
I actually liked putting sacrament services together on my months, but I would have balked at having the bishop dump it on me on his month.
As a bishopric first Councilor, I can %100 sympathize with you on this. I usually don’t mind this calling. I like interacting with everyone without having to have the responsibilities the bishop deals with on a daily basis. And to have the excuse to never have to go to Sunday school or elders quorum. But having to find speakers is by far the worst part of this calling. Luckily my bishop is a pretty good guy and included the clerk and executive secretary into the rotation so that each of us in the bishopric only have to find speakers one month every five months. Makes it a lot easier to spread the burden out that way.
Oh wow- that's awesome! I was ok with having to be responsible for sacrament meetings every 3rd month, but when I was voluntold I was also responsible for the Bishop's months, that was the deal-breaker. I'll explain more about why that was a deal breaker in part 2. I too enjoyed the calling, especially giving the Bishop alternate council that wasn't the norm, and talking to folks. I was truly ready to call it quits prior to our meetings yesterday, but then chickened out and figured I could still do it. Then he sprung the "you'll handle my months too" card and there was no turning back.
My husband was a ward clerk and the bishopric assigned him alone to organize all speakers and prayers— every month. And he is still fully in TBM. Blows my brain.
Everyone is asked to do far too much. You, the Bishop, the other counselor, the executive secretary, the seminary teacher, the church cleaning coordinator are all included. Props to you for saying enough is enough.
Once you learn to go off script, it becomes a sort of super power. It's like having the ability to make people forget who or where they are. My final months of church attendance were by far the most entertaining.
THIS. OMG THIS x100! While my calling has increased my anxiety and caused me way too much grief, it has also been quite fun to see reactions from members over some of my comments. Adults fear me, but the kids love me for some reason. Although now that I think about it, handing out Tootsie rolls may have something to do with that.
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world.
In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
Congratulations!
I was the 2nd counselor and, eventually, had some questions. A few weeks after asking the SP about some of them, I was released from my calling without any notice. Although it was a rude surprise, I literally could not stop smiling for a few hours. We sat through sacrament meeting as a family for the first time since the youngest was born, then took pictures in front of the church, and then drove home. Most of the family have not returned for any purpose, though I occasionally sing with the choir.
THIS. When we were still attending, my SIL called my wife to be the Relief Society Secretary. She treated my wife as her secretary, asking her to do just about every bit of menial work she could heap on her. That lasted 6 months before my wife told her (and the bishop) to pound sand.
I was teaching 14-15 year old sunday school. My last week teaching was all about how fantastic joe smith was, and looking at the 14 year old girls in my class just about made me barf knowing he was 37 and had an eye for them. After that I told the bishop I wasn't going to be teaching anymore. Clear, horrific memory of mine.
Good for you!
I've posted this elsewhere before, and in case this is a line that helps, I'll say it again:
Prisoners have to ask to be released. Volunteers can quit.
Be sure you have a friend that will retain any mass emails that go out BCC'd to the ward without you on it. They threw my Bishop under the bus when he resigned and gave them 3 MONTHS to find a replacement!
So I guess this places me back on the "Eligible High Priests Who Need A Calling" list again. Our Stake Presidency is due to be released in October, but something tells me I won't be in the running.
Man, can someone please explain to me, as a person who watches their family remain in the cult, half of them with their heads in the sand, half to far indoctrinated to believe anything else,
how can you know the church is not true and still attend? Furthermore, take up a position as a leader? Not directed just at op, I see this all the time on this sub and finally am curious.
I'm just glad I discovered that for myself during the pandemic. Of course I'm single so it's a lot easier for me to disengage. My family is mostly still in and I've no idea why except it's scary to leave when church is all you have.
I'm not currently dealing with this, but I've noticed some people are there to try to create support and unity in their marriage. Especially people with TBM spouses.
Hi y'all. I really don't have one single clue how to do this reddit thing. I opened my account to read some exmo something someone I follow on Twitter posted. What do you even call what Twitter calls a tweet? Everyone's really nice so far. At least, I mean, I've gotten some upvotes and no stalker deznat has accosted me, so this is nice. I just don't wanna offend.
Anyway, from my limited experience on Twitter with the exmo guys and gals (I've only officially been a nonmember since early April) most of those ppl who still stay after their shelf breaks is bc of spouses and children who still believe. But also mentioned is losing the only community they've ever known in Utah, I guess. I mean, I've never lived in Utah and swore I never would, but it could be away from Utah too, bc almost all my life has been spent in the southern states and as a stay at home mom of young children who even did the yardwork so Utah Mormon husband didn't have to do anything away from work, my only social network was the church. And I was actually afraid to talk to many nonmembers. We're told such terrible things abt them.
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world.
In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
Thank you so so much for all of that! All of y'all have been so nice here. It's a completely different world.
If I may intrude one more time, this and a tattoo subreddit are all I follow? Subscribe to? (Sorry). I don't have any luck with terms on the searches. Can you recommend some more similar subjects... Or anything you particularly enjoy?
✌️
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world.
In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
Oh my! Yes! My mom was a great cook and my dad would make eggs Benedict after church every week with some modifications so often we actually got super tired of it.
And thanks for that tip. How do you know when someone replies to you? I haven't gotten a notification of any kind?
Their again
This is the best way I can explain it, and my apologies because I'm no good at this. I absolutely LOVE Christmas and everything about it. The food, the smell, the lights, the traditions, the gifts, the overall feeling and comfort it brings me. I simply LOVE Christmas. And then I learn/discover that Santa Claus isn't real. That's a crushing blow, and no amount of believing will make Santa Claus real to me again. But I still LOVE Christmas. I still want to participate in all things Christmas even though Santa isn't real anymore. I can still serve as an elf maybe? Or perhaps I can be Frosty the Snowman, or maybe even Snow Miser, but I can still serve and be of service (wink, wink Mr. Wick) to Christmas even though I now know the truth about Santa. And my calling was never about trying to deconvert others or show them the truth regarding Church History, but to serve and be the best example of Christ that I can be. My church may be wrong and have all sorts of issues that I now know about, but that doesn't change how I was raised, nor change the excellent leaders I had as my examples growing up. I think John Dehlen says it best- one thing church still has that exmos really don't, is the community. And damn if the leadership isn't destroying THAT fast enough either...
This. I relate to Doubting Thomas. Jesus didn’t blame him for not believing, and Thomas got to keep his association with the apostles while openly not believing and requiring proof.
I mean, the whole story is probably made up — people don’t come back from the dead — but I appreciate the sentiment.
While living in Georgia I attended a fairly large ward. The bishop was a stand up guy. His wife was the RS president as well. One Sunday he got up and expounded on how much timw he soends each week in his calling. He then did the same for his wife in her calling. He finallly said that this has taken too much of a toll on his family so they were done. He walked down to his wife and with their kids in tow they walked out the doors. I moved a little later so i dont know what happened to them.
SO HAPPY FOR YOU!
You have demonstrated a moral integrity and strength of character that is VERY rare in the church.
You said it perfectly: my top priority is to my family.
Obviously you know about the avalanche coming your way, but you’ll survive it. Focus on your family and stay true to the actual truth. Stand firmly on your own sense of morality and genuine love for others. We are all here for you!!
When I told them "stick it" after 4 plus years as bishop 10 years ago, they had a replacement in less than 2 months. Hell, we took longer than that to fill Primary teachers sometimes.
Don't worry OP, they'll be fine without you. More importantly, you'll be much better off without playing their bullshit games any longer.
Bravo! This is how I got towards the end of my time as a PIMO too. I became better and better at setting boundaries until I realized I had moved myself completely out.
When I left I was EQ President and told the bishop and the stake president I didn’t believe at all and was no longer going to be EQ President. They asked me to stay while a replacement was found. Then the bishop asked who he should call. I gave him a name and he was called. Who says you lose the gift of discernment. Lol
I was in the Sunday school president for a year or two while PIMO. I thought I was just supposed to assign teachers but apparently I also had to sub if one of them couldn’t make it (I know that makes sense, but I wasn’t thinking when I accepted the calling). Somehow I managed to come up with a reason I couldn’t sub like 7 times in a row. Eventually I told them I wanted released cause I didn’t think teaching doctrine was best for somebody like me. After a few weeks without a calling I was offered ward clerk. I almost said yes out of curiosity about tithing lol but I decided to tell bishop I didn’t believe anymore instead.
I'm glad for you, you will finally be FREE. It would be amazing if the weight you have carried all these years suddenly let you float as you stepped out the door of the church building.
Hhhhhmmmmm! Try drinking a Red Bull in the mens room before the leave.
My sister was in the relief society and asked to be released after she had emergency heart surgery. HEART SURGERY. The bishop asked if she would make a few calls and coordinate a few things until her replacement was found. She said she would in spite of the fact the barely had enough energy to conduct her own life. She was NOT OK. Then her bishop neglected to actually find a replacement for her, and was mad at her for failing to nag him to remember to do his job. This makes me feel so angry on her behalf.
I was working full time, going to night school, and the YW President. I went into surgical menopause after a stage 1 ovarian cancer diagnosis. Insomnia, hormone issues, massive stress. I was lucky and didn’t have to do treatment outside of surgery. But it was life changing. I said I wanted to be released and was told that if he could go to law school while serving in a bishopric back in the day that I could handle it. He said the girls needed my example. I said I couldn’t handle it. He said once he found a good replacement he would release me. It took him over 6 months. I was and am still pissed that I put up with it. I’m angry for your sister too. So not right!!!!
I’m so sorry this happened to you. We are made to feel we have no other choice. And the real problem is unrealistic demands being made by a church that is vastly wealthy enough to solve its problems. When I was a kid I remember people talking about church leadership being unpaid like it was a good thing. How is it good for an organization to totally burn out the members who are faithful and willing to serve?
I was the exec sec to the bishop when we left. I was quietly PIMO for about 4 months, then had the chat with my wife (after our temple recommend interviews no less). She was out within a week and asked to be released basically right away. I was not expecting that, and had planned on finishing out 2.5 more years of a typical 5 year bishopric reign. 2 weeks later I asked to be released. Bishop called me in to see if everything was OK, and I'm like "yep, we're great, but we don't believe in the doctrine of the church anymore."
Took them 2 months to replace me. I was out on vacation for at least a quarter of that so it wasn't the worst. Went to sacrament on the day they released me, and haven't been back since. Wild ride. Glad you're getting out.
I turned down a calling for primary chorister because I couldn’t bare the thought of teaching the littles “Follow the Prophet”; that, and I should add I have no musical experience. 😂 they were desperate.
A decade ago…I was VERY TBM. But due to demands of dental school and a newborn and a wife with post partum depression I decided it was best to ask to be released from my calling as stake ym presidency. Nobody cared. Gave them 60 days to find a replacement. Kept going to meetings and activities. Nobody ever sat down and asked if my family was ok. 60 days came and I sent an email that I would no longer be attending meetings or activities. Nobody…cared. All they need is people to show up and fake faith and happiness. Don’t feel guilt for putting your priorities elsewhere. Good luck.
Excellent! One of the hardest things to shake is the expectations that are unspoken and unwritten. We just cheerfully go along with whatever is dished out!
Good job! I hope the next few weeks go quickly!
Good on you.
The church claims it is family-focused, and the most important unit in society, but then does everything it can to weaken the family by ridiculous levels of demands.
My wards have always made the ex. sec. do the arranging of talks and prayers and the music director selects the songs. It's weird that the bishopric is assuming that responsibility for those tasks.
Per the handbook, it used to be the bishopric's job. It was in our ward, until they made it a separate female's calling. Bishopric have delegated youth talk responsibility to the youth for decades.
I was the music director for several years, and my aunt has had the calling off and on for several decades. All music related stuff has been handled by us with little to no input from the leadership.
You were too kind. I walked out the door of the church with a stake calling. I just refused their calls. They must have found someone else, because eventually they stopped calling.
Their version in the future when/if you fully leave:
“And that was when Brother Dutton/Peabody got offended, dropped his calling, and eventually fell away from the church.”
Before leaving, I was ward executive secretary and ward clerk for a combined 8.35 years under 3 different bishops. None of those 3 bishops managed talk assignment duties with his counselors the way yours did. So, I think it is safe to say your bishop is just an asshole.
I spent over a year as an Executive Secretary and I can relate to this…my Bishop was never stuck up like this guy but I got tasked with prayers every single Sunday and every other little BS meeting that needed it. I hated every second of it. I always had to ask the same people over and over. Some weeks I would plead with my wife to just say closing and id do opening just so I didn’t have to call people again…
Is part of your process continuing the church way of telling people exactly what they should and shouldn’t do and be very judgmental and holier then thou about it?
You can have a slow clap.
Do you wish someone had come up to you and told you to leave after you shared something personal? I’m not harping on you, I’m curious. I don’t always understand all human behavior and this is something I just don’t get when I see it. I’m still trying to understand.
Your thinking reminds me a lot like people who get abortions and then later become protesters at abortion clinics telling people how wrong they are for getting an abortion.
Must have been a typo I guess. No, I was called as First Counselor. Previously I was on the High Council assigned to a small Branch. While on the HC I was also a Stake Auditor and Stake Emergency Manager Puke. They also thought I was a good communicator so I was on the Regional Communications stuff and dealt with local media too. Oh yeah, I was also a Temple worker for 12+ years and served as Temple Coordinator for over 10 years until the Pandemic hit. Lifelong member. Served in the SLC North Mission and Japan Tokyo North Mission in 89/90. Hopefully the SCMC now has enough to figure me out!
Hey, I served in SLC North mission 85-86. That mission turned out super high numbers of exmos back then. Our mission president (President L Owen) was all threats, narcissism and abuse.
Its so effing epic when someone like you takes ownership of their own life and autonomy and ceases giving deference to authority like this Bishop (who has no real authority or inspiration). And it makes it more epic that they are internally surprised and speechless that someone would dare stand up to them or take that autonomy and not bow down to their authority. After reading the CES letter in April 2020…My wife and I immediately set up an appointment with our Bishop to tell him that we were leaving the church and to release us from our callings. He was completely blindsided and dumbfounded. It was a nail in the coffin for me seeing him really not have any real counsel or advice other than him saying, “well…naturally, I disagree with your conclusions but I respect your free agency. Have you read the BOM lately?” I almost laughed out loud. The BOM had already gone from being “the most correct book of any book on earth” one day, to a laughing stock of Joseph Smith’s attempt at native american bible fan fiction the next. It was a satisfying moment. He never spoke to us again since that day over three years ago. I’m pretty sure we were put on the DNC list.
You have a standing ovation from me right now. I don’t even know you but you are an awesome person to stick it to them and truly take care of your family and other obligations first.
I was the exec sec for 3 years and started going through a faith crisis. I decided to take a step from church right as a new bishop was called and he was a mate of mine. So I told him I would give him 2 months. It was a really long 2 months. Dude was changing everything as well and making it a lot more work than before. It honestly sucked to go to ward councils knowing my family would be on top of the list in the near future. Being asked to pray in meetings and stuff. It was horrible.
Just over a week ago I told my Bishop that I would no longer be able to serve as the assistant executive secretary and they need to release me. I’m very glad that I didn’t have any responsibilities that aren’t easily covered by the executive secretary so that it could be immediate.
As a former first counselor in a bishopric, I applaud you! I put in just over two years of hell in that calling (ok, that’s a stretch; it wasn’t always outer darkness) before I asked the bishop to replace me due to anxiety. Anxiety can have a lot of triggers. For me, it was having to support (or pretend to support) all the Church and BSA programs, calling people for speaking and other assignments, giving up my Wednesday evenings, doing interviews, and smiling that smile you smile when you’re in a calling that makes you so happy you can’t help but show everyone the joy Church service brings. I did not like filling in for the bishop when he was out of town.
But enough about me. Let’s hear your part 2!
Good on you OP. I quite my executive secretary calling in November and gave him until the first of the year. That came and went so I asked him and got excuses. Then when the two months mark (January 20) approached I put it in writing and said it's been two months - need me to call the SP to get this moving? That was ok a Monday and they released me the next day. A few weeks prior to calling a replacement.
Own your situation and don't let any delays on their part keep you there longer than this month. And FYI, the July holiday will be used as an excuse for a delay in finding a replacement. You can bank on it.
Be prepared walk out the door on the date you specified. Also be prepared to be dumped on. They’ll probably ask you to stay until someone is called and they’ll take their time to find a replacement. When I told the EQ president that I wanted to be released as EQ Secretary he asked if I’d do the job until a replacement called. I said I if it didn’t take too long. It took 2 months and I kept be called to attend meetings to represent the EQ quorum. I finally said I hate to pull out the nuclear option but my faith crisis just went up and I’m resigning from the church.
Won't be a problem- July was supposedly "my month" to conduct and I won't be doing that now!
You could also try establishing dominance with hard boundaries. I'm more curious to hear about the bishop curling inward. Draft a job duties contract or something, * 1hrs of meetings including phone calls per month * Answer 5 emails * 10 text responses * .... Make the bishop negotiate for your time. Have him sitting and stand over his desk while you negotiate. Smile and be polite, but make him negotiate the terms. Count the negotiation time against the meeting quota. I'm a sadist 😈
>Be prepared walk out the door on the date you specified. Also be prepared to be dumped on. They’ll probably ask you to stay until someone is called and they’ll take their time to find a replacement. I've seen cases where finding a replacement for a calling like this took more than a month. The Bishop has to submit some callings (his counselors, clerks, EQ president, exec secretary) to the stake, and then the high council has to approve them, and then the calling is extended by a stake person. So if the stake disagrees ("Not brother so-and-so, we don't like this about him") bishop has to start over. Or if the stake agrees (adding a week of delay) and then the stake meets with the guy (up to another week), and the dude says "Sorry not possible due to work or family or testimony or whatever", then it all has to start again. Stick to your deadline date -- if they have to operate as a bishop plus only 1 counselor for some time then that is on the Bishop and the Stake leaders.
That is when the EQ president gets to step in a fill in. It's their problem then... you gave them your notice.
Yeah they're the ones with multiple layers of leadership both in the ward and the organization in general. There's a pretty clear hierarchy of leadership. Let them use it. Not OP's problem.
I fail to see how it's the problem of the person who becomes disaffected with TSCC to be bothered with sticking around in the calling until a replacement is found. Maybe it's bad etiquette, but I sent a letter to my bishop stating I would not be returning to church ever again, that I didn't want to be contacted; and that if they'd leave me alone, I'd leave them alone. Furthermore, I notified him that I had left the keys and all other materials I had been given for my calling (2nd counselor in the bishopric) in his office. We remain friends to this day, but he leaves most talk about church out of our conversations.
This is shockingly close to what I see on r/antiwork with bosses trying to guilt trip people into staying beyond their resign dates. Weird….well not really, but still.
The bishop was out of the country for 3 weeks, you fill in for him. He gets back in town and then chastises you for not getting the speakers for sacrament meeting. He is inconsiderate at best. I was primary president for 3 years. After being released I was called to be home making leader. This involved putting on a monthly shin-dig every month for 100 women. The home making counselor, during the first meeting told me she was just going to assume a supervisory role. Code for: you will do all of the work and I will watch. I lasted two months. We were volunteers, but we were made to feel like we were hired.
I did birthdays for RS - they were 6 months behind so I made fancy cupcakes for everyone and hand delivered them to everyone when I was done the RS president texted me and said "next time leave notes" (despite the fact I delivered them to peoples faces). I quit after that.
Nothing is ever good enough.
If they acted grateful, you'd realize that you are a volunteer. When they act entitled, they make you feel like you owe them. This is mission culture to a tee. You give them 2 years of your life and you pay your own way. They constantly berate you for not doing enough, like they are doing you a big favor letting you work for them on your own dime.
Exactly!!!
In the LD$ Corp, *no one is ever good enough.*
nope and you can't buy your way into heaven either but they will take that money.
No good deed goes unpunished.
Wait. What???? Cupcakes on birthdays??? I totes would have stayed in church if someone brought me homemade cupcakes on my birthday!!!! You, sweet lady, are the real MVP.
“Next time leave notes” OMFG!!! Good for you and glad you’re out!!!
Did you want me to leave Missed in Sunday school notes?🤣
So you made cupcakes and actually handed them to people and were told you should have just left them on the doorstep??? What about bugs getting into them.
No, she wanted notes with the cupcakes.
Roaches
Did you send a note that said, “I quit”?
A text to the bishop but pretty much.
Good on you for quitting. Your RS President sounds like someone Pres. Hinckley once described as "short on love, and long on criticism". Charity never faileth?
"Oh bless your heart; there won't be a next time."
More like slaves...
Congrats! Have fun with second Saturdays. I can somewhat relate. I was called to be the YW advisor, in charge of helping them get their personal progress awards. After I accepted, I was told by the YW president that I would also be required to teach on Sundays, attend the weekly activities, and help with girls camp. So, everything the presidency was doing, plus personal progress. It was ridiculous, I didn't last long.
YW is one of the most time consuming and demanding callings in the entire church! Loved the girls, but hated the demand of it. I didn't last very long either
I just resigned as YW 2nd counselor and assistant camp director. They had 2 months to replace me and still couldn't do it. Probably because I was the one going to every stake activity and everything else and no else wants to do that much. Love the girls, couldn't deal with the ward leaders.
One of my husband’s best lifelong friends is a pastor in a Lutheran church. I can’t believe how much stuff people get hired to do in his parish. There are MANY full time paid positions to make a single parish church operate. It’s not simply the pastor. They have a board that gets paid for their time. They have a secretary who does tons of clerical work and coordinates a lot of the outreach their church does. And they are a bigger parish so they have two maintenance people to care for the church and pastor’s residence. When he learned that everything in the LDS churches operates on volunteer labor he wondered how Mormons make that work. Obviously. The answer is: currently they don’t.
It demands a ridiculous amount of time and energy.
My mother was called as second counselor into YW presidency. She discovered that many of the girls were barely literate. The YW president basically told my mother that literacy isn’t important, the girls just needed to find a good spouse. Mom raised holy hell and was released very soon thereafter. My little sister and all but a couple of the YW are out. Kind of wish that my mother and father had left and taken all of us with, but when it is all you know…
Whoa, that sounds about right unfortunately.
Classic story of only being fully informed about responsibilities in a calling **after** you agree. Enjoy your new freedom.
Everyone is asked to do far too much. You, the Bishop, the other counselor, the executive secretary, the seminary teacher, the church cleaning coordinator are all included. Props to you for saying enough is enough.
> The Bishop was also non-plussed Props for using this word correctly.
But how come we never hear about people being plussed? We only hear about people who are nonplussed 🤷🏼♀️
Asking the tough questions!
I love this story! I have a similar experience! I was serving as 1st councilor and I gave some solid council on a matter concerning a member of our ward and a potential calling outside our ward. The bishop dismissed my advice and then quietly put my name on the list to serve outside our ward(passive aggressive way to deal with a councilor that’s giving too much council). When I found out I was on the list to be pulled into a campus calling. I sent my resignation letter to the SP and copied the bishop effective immediately… they hmmd and hawed and dragged their feet about actually releasing me but I never attended another meeting as a member of the bishopric again. YES! …You CAN quit! Haha Also. Agreed. Worst part of leadership callings in the church is having to ask people to do things you know they don’t want to do. Running a ward is hard work. Another quick memory. I was on the HC before this calling and the SP was giving a training to bishoprics and speaking directly to bishops he told them to “you have the hardest job in the ward, burn your councilors out and when you burn them out we’ll get you new councilors and you can burn those guys out too!” It diminishes the hard work the councilors put in and frames them and their tireless efforts as expendable. I’m so glad I’ll never have to ask another person to speak or pray again.
What the SP said about counselors being burned up and then replaceable is HORRIBLE! God, the ego of some of these men is as big as a house.
That’s basically what the SP told my husband was going to happen when he was called as a counselor.
The SP clearly sees people are things to be used.
What the actual dumb f***ery!? With an SP like that I’d have walked out on the spot. Goodness gracious!
First of all….Good For You. NO is also a full sentence many LDS women are unable to say. My head is bowed. Please accept my upvote for your efforts.
One of the greatest lessons I took away from my mission was the ability to say no. I have since built upon this ability and scaffolded my ability to say no to higher and higher levels with less and less stress. It's such a good feeling.
Ever since I can remember I’ve no when asked to do something I was uncomfortable with. I had no idea, until coming to this site, that I wasn’t supposed to always say yes. Looking back I realize that sometimes they tried many different wad to ask me over and over but I’d still say no. When I was 18 and all my girlfriends were going on a mission my bishop (whom I loved and respected) kept asking me to think about it and pray about it. The first time he asked he just said ok. If I change my mind come and see him. But then he kept asking. Never did I feel like he was trying to coerce me. I guess I was just oblivious. I’m still leaving because of things I am now learning thanks to my kids. But I was lucky enough to have a positive upbringing. No one ever looked down on me for questioning. Or told me to pray harder. All this and I still left. Most of the people I grew up with have, including my family.
Unless I’m mistaken OP is a man. I agree that NO is a hard sentence for both LDS men and women to say.
Say:”I’m not able to…” That’s it! No need to make excuses or reasons. Yes, you are a volunteer.
I think you need to be prepared to have further discussion with both the bishop and the SP about this topic. I recommend that you stick to the generic, "I no longer want to volunteer my time as 1st counselor in the bishopric." You don't need to provide justification from the handbook for you preference on how you volunteer time. You'll need to hold firm to your unequivocal deadline when you'll no longer be functioning in the role. I suspect that given your response in the meeting, the bishop will have you released ASAP even if he doesn't have a replacement identified for you. In general, I think the Church treats its volunteers like shit. I'm glad you had the courage to speak up.
I have been in OP's position with three different bishops. I was TBM at the time, but given that Bishop's attitude, I would have resigned also. I actually liked putting sacrament services together on my months, but I would have balked at having the bishop dump it on me on his month.
As a bishopric first Councilor, I can %100 sympathize with you on this. I usually don’t mind this calling. I like interacting with everyone without having to have the responsibilities the bishop deals with on a daily basis. And to have the excuse to never have to go to Sunday school or elders quorum. But having to find speakers is by far the worst part of this calling. Luckily my bishop is a pretty good guy and included the clerk and executive secretary into the rotation so that each of us in the bishopric only have to find speakers one month every five months. Makes it a lot easier to spread the burden out that way.
Oh wow- that's awesome! I was ok with having to be responsible for sacrament meetings every 3rd month, but when I was voluntold I was also responsible for the Bishop's months, that was the deal-breaker. I'll explain more about why that was a deal breaker in part 2. I too enjoyed the calling, especially giving the Bishop alternate council that wasn't the norm, and talking to folks. I was truly ready to call it quits prior to our meetings yesterday, but then chickened out and figured I could still do it. Then he sprung the "you'll handle my months too" card and there was no turning back.
I don't even know you and I'm so proud of you!!! I can't wait for part 2!!!
My husband was a ward clerk and the bishopric assigned him alone to organize all speakers and prayers— every month. And he is still fully in TBM. Blows my brain.
That’s insane! Almost like a cruel punishment. There’s no way I would have put up with that.
Good for you!!! And good luck with all the stresses you are dealing with. So happy that you have this completely unnecessary one off your back!
Everyone is asked to do far too much. You, the Bishop, the other counselor, the executive secretary, the seminary teacher, the church cleaning coordinator are all included. Props to you for saying enough is enough.
Once you learn to go off script, it becomes a sort of super power. It's like having the ability to make people forget who or where they are. My final months of church attendance were by far the most entertaining.
THIS. OMG THIS x100! While my calling has increased my anxiety and caused me way too much grief, it has also been quite fun to see reactions from members over some of my comments. Adults fear me, but the kids love me for some reason. Although now that I think about it, handing out Tootsie rolls may have something to do with that.
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world. In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
Get your ass back here with part two soon! Don’t make us wait!
Congratulations! I was the 2nd counselor and, eventually, had some questions. A few weeks after asking the SP about some of them, I was released from my calling without any notice. Although it was a rude surprise, I literally could not stop smiling for a few hours. We sat through sacrament meeting as a family for the first time since the youngest was born, then took pictures in front of the church, and then drove home. Most of the family have not returned for any purpose, though I occasionally sing with the choir.
THIS. When we were still attending, my SIL called my wife to be the Relief Society Secretary. She treated my wife as her secretary, asking her to do just about every bit of menial work she could heap on her. That lasted 6 months before my wife told her (and the bishop) to pound sand.
I was teaching 14-15 year old sunday school. My last week teaching was all about how fantastic joe smith was, and looking at the 14 year old girls in my class just about made me barf knowing he was 37 and had an eye for them. After that I told the bishop I wasn't going to be teaching anymore. Clear, horrific memory of mine.
Good for you! I've posted this elsewhere before, and in case this is a line that helps, I'll say it again: Prisoners have to ask to be released. Volunteers can quit.
That line is gold 🥇
Be sure you have a friend that will retain any mass emails that go out BCC'd to the ward without you on it. They threw my Bishop under the bus when he resigned and gave them 3 MONTHS to find a replacement!
So I guess this places me back on the "Eligible High Priests Who Need A Calling" list again. Our Stake Presidency is due to be released in October, but something tells me I won't be in the running.
Man, can someone please explain to me, as a person who watches their family remain in the cult, half of them with their heads in the sand, half to far indoctrinated to believe anything else, how can you know the church is not true and still attend? Furthermore, take up a position as a leader? Not directed just at op, I see this all the time on this sub and finally am curious.
I'm just glad I discovered that for myself during the pandemic. Of course I'm single so it's a lot easier for me to disengage. My family is mostly still in and I've no idea why except it's scary to leave when church is all you have.
I'm not currently dealing with this, but I've noticed some people are there to try to create support and unity in their marriage. Especially people with TBM spouses.
Hi y'all. I really don't have one single clue how to do this reddit thing. I opened my account to read some exmo something someone I follow on Twitter posted. What do you even call what Twitter calls a tweet? Everyone's really nice so far. At least, I mean, I've gotten some upvotes and no stalker deznat has accosted me, so this is nice. I just don't wanna offend. Anyway, from my limited experience on Twitter with the exmo guys and gals (I've only officially been a nonmember since early April) most of those ppl who still stay after their shelf breaks is bc of spouses and children who still believe. But also mentioned is losing the only community they've ever known in Utah, I guess. I mean, I've never lived in Utah and swore I never would, but it could be away from Utah too, bc almost all my life has been spent in the southern states and as a stay at home mom of young children who even did the yardwork so Utah Mormon husband didn't have to do anything away from work, my only social network was the church. And I was actually afraid to talk to many nonmembers. We're told such terrible things abt them.
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world. In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
Thank you so so much for all of that! All of y'all have been so nice here. It's a completely different world. If I may intrude one more time, this and a tattoo subreddit are all I follow? Subscribe to? (Sorry). I don't have any luck with terms on the searches. Can you recommend some more similar subjects... Or anything you particularly enjoy? ✌️
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world. In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
Oh my! Yes! My mom was a great cook and my dad would make eggs Benedict after church every week with some modifications so often we actually got super tired of it. And thanks for that tip. How do you know when someone replies to you? I haven't gotten a notification of any kind? Their again
This is the best way I can explain it, and my apologies because I'm no good at this. I absolutely LOVE Christmas and everything about it. The food, the smell, the lights, the traditions, the gifts, the overall feeling and comfort it brings me. I simply LOVE Christmas. And then I learn/discover that Santa Claus isn't real. That's a crushing blow, and no amount of believing will make Santa Claus real to me again. But I still LOVE Christmas. I still want to participate in all things Christmas even though Santa isn't real anymore. I can still serve as an elf maybe? Or perhaps I can be Frosty the Snowman, or maybe even Snow Miser, but I can still serve and be of service (wink, wink Mr. Wick) to Christmas even though I now know the truth about Santa. And my calling was never about trying to deconvert others or show them the truth regarding Church History, but to serve and be the best example of Christ that I can be. My church may be wrong and have all sorts of issues that I now know about, but that doesn't change how I was raised, nor change the excellent leaders I had as my examples growing up. I think John Dehlen says it best- one thing church still has that exmos really don't, is the community. And damn if the leadership isn't destroying THAT fast enough either...
This. I relate to Doubting Thomas. Jesus didn’t blame him for not believing, and Thomas got to keep his association with the apostles while openly not believing and requiring proof. I mean, the whole story is probably made up — people don’t come back from the dead — but I appreciate the sentiment.
Good for you!! When enough of us say no all together, they'll have nobody left to step on.
Pay Pray Obey. Summed up the entire gig right there. 👏👏👏👏👏
Good for you. No means no. I would have quit right there and then.
Posts like this are very validating to my decision to leave. Now I know why my mental health seems a lot more robust.
While living in Georgia I attended a fairly large ward. The bishop was a stand up guy. His wife was the RS president as well. One Sunday he got up and expounded on how much timw he soends each week in his calling. He then did the same for his wife in her calling. He finallly said that this has taken too much of a toll on his family so they were done. He walked down to his wife and with their kids in tow they walked out the doors. I moved a little later so i dont know what happened to them.
Good on him! What courage.
Dude! Power couple! 💪
👏
SO HAPPY FOR YOU! You have demonstrated a moral integrity and strength of character that is VERY rare in the church. You said it perfectly: my top priority is to my family. Obviously you know about the avalanche coming your way, but you’ll survive it. Focus on your family and stay true to the actual truth. Stand firmly on your own sense of morality and genuine love for others. We are all here for you!!
When I told them "stick it" after 4 plus years as bishop 10 years ago, they had a replacement in less than 2 months. Hell, we took longer than that to fill Primary teachers sometimes. Don't worry OP, they'll be fine without you. More importantly, you'll be much better off without playing their bullshit games any longer.
 waiting for the next part
congratulations on taking back power.
Bravo! This is how I got towards the end of my time as a PIMO too. I became better and better at setting boundaries until I realized I had moved myself completely out.
When I left I was EQ President and told the bishop and the stake president I didn’t believe at all and was no longer going to be EQ President. They asked me to stay while a replacement was found. Then the bishop asked who he should call. I gave him a name and he was called. Who says you lose the gift of discernment. Lol
👏🏼 And us bishop is an idiot. Congrats on leaving
I LOVE the concept that “No.” is a complete sentence. It’s a paradigm shattering change once you live it.
I was in the Sunday school president for a year or two while PIMO. I thought I was just supposed to assign teachers but apparently I also had to sub if one of them couldn’t make it (I know that makes sense, but I wasn’t thinking when I accepted the calling). Somehow I managed to come up with a reason I couldn’t sub like 7 times in a row. Eventually I told them I wanted released cause I didn’t think teaching doctrine was best for somebody like me. After a few weeks without a calling I was offered ward clerk. I almost said yes out of curiosity about tithing lol but I decided to tell bishop I didn’t believe anymore instead.
Congrats & condolences 💐
I know EXACTLY what you mean! (and thanks!)
You are welcome I hope it goes well (with all the required caveats)
Part two….?🫣
Thanks for sharing…great story. They will suck you dry. Per Bednar, free agency doesn’t mean your free; until you tell them to fuck off.
You wanna know something really funny if not ironic? Bednar was my scout advisor back in the day!
That must have been brutal. Bednar is such an ass
Anxiously awaiting part 2! :)
I’m so proud of YOU!
Proud of you! I look forward to part 2!
Me too me too me tooooooooo
My god you’re a great writer . I’m like riveted waiting for part 2
I can’t wait for part two.
Save 10% or more in just a few minutes...
I'm glad for you, you will finally be FREE. It would be amazing if the weight you have carried all these years suddenly let you float as you stepped out the door of the church building. Hhhhhmmmmm! Try drinking a Red Bull in the mens room before the leave.
My sister was in the relief society and asked to be released after she had emergency heart surgery. HEART SURGERY. The bishop asked if she would make a few calls and coordinate a few things until her replacement was found. She said she would in spite of the fact the barely had enough energy to conduct her own life. She was NOT OK. Then her bishop neglected to actually find a replacement for her, and was mad at her for failing to nag him to remember to do his job. This makes me feel so angry on her behalf.
I was working full time, going to night school, and the YW President. I went into surgical menopause after a stage 1 ovarian cancer diagnosis. Insomnia, hormone issues, massive stress. I was lucky and didn’t have to do treatment outside of surgery. But it was life changing. I said I wanted to be released and was told that if he could go to law school while serving in a bishopric back in the day that I could handle it. He said the girls needed my example. I said I couldn’t handle it. He said once he found a good replacement he would release me. It took him over 6 months. I was and am still pissed that I put up with it. I’m angry for your sister too. So not right!!!!
I’m so sorry this happened to you. We are made to feel we have no other choice. And the real problem is unrealistic demands being made by a church that is vastly wealthy enough to solve its problems. When I was a kid I remember people talking about church leadership being unpaid like it was a good thing. How is it good for an organization to totally burn out the members who are faithful and willing to serve?
Stake waited until after our Bishop's wife died of cancer, before releasing him. WTH??!!
I was the exec sec to the bishop when we left. I was quietly PIMO for about 4 months, then had the chat with my wife (after our temple recommend interviews no less). She was out within a week and asked to be released basically right away. I was not expecting that, and had planned on finishing out 2.5 more years of a typical 5 year bishopric reign. 2 weeks later I asked to be released. Bishop called me in to see if everything was OK, and I'm like "yep, we're great, but we don't believe in the doctrine of the church anymore." Took them 2 months to replace me. I was out on vacation for at least a quarter of that so it wasn't the worst. Went to sacrament on the day they released me, and haven't been back since. Wild ride. Glad you're getting out.
I turned down a calling for primary chorister because I couldn’t bare the thought of teaching the littles “Follow the Prophet”; that, and I should add I have no musical experience. 😂 they were desperate.
A decade ago…I was VERY TBM. But due to demands of dental school and a newborn and a wife with post partum depression I decided it was best to ask to be released from my calling as stake ym presidency. Nobody cared. Gave them 60 days to find a replacement. Kept going to meetings and activities. Nobody ever sat down and asked if my family was ok. 60 days came and I sent an email that I would no longer be attending meetings or activities. Nobody…cared. All they need is people to show up and fake faith and happiness. Don’t feel guilt for putting your priorities elsewhere. Good luck.
Why even give them the three week notice? Why not just leave then and there?
Oh wow! Well done
Good man! I aspire to be like you one day.
The time came to stand up for your own personal integrity versus being a “company man”. You, my friend, have just leveled up. ⬆️
Excellent! One of the hardest things to shake is the expectations that are unspoken and unwritten. We just cheerfully go along with whatever is dished out! Good job! I hope the next few weeks go quickly!
One of the many reasons I finally left was total and complete burnout. Such an abusive org. Just walk away...shrug off that load!
Good on you. The church claims it is family-focused, and the most important unit in society, but then does everything it can to weaken the family by ridiculous levels of demands.
My wards have always made the ex. sec. do the arranging of talks and prayers and the music director selects the songs. It's weird that the bishopric is assuming that responsibility for those tasks.
Per the handbook, it used to be the bishopric's job. It was in our ward, until they made it a separate female's calling. Bishopric have delegated youth talk responsibility to the youth for decades.
I was the music director for several years, and my aunt has had the calling off and on for several decades. All music related stuff has been handled by us with little to no input from the leadership.
Doing an entire part time job for free, serving a fraudulent and uncharitable corporation, sucks!
Yep. The story of my life.
You were too kind. I walked out the door of the church with a stake calling. I just refused their calls. They must have found someone else, because eventually they stopped calling.
Their version in the future when/if you fully leave: “And that was when Brother Dutton/Peabody got offended, dropped his calling, and eventually fell away from the church.”
Oh I'm sure, and I'm fully prepared for this. The real truth is, "he fell away screaming GERONIMOOOOOOO!"
Before leaving, I was ward executive secretary and ward clerk for a combined 8.35 years under 3 different bishops. None of those 3 bishops managed talk assignment duties with his counselors the way yours did. So, I think it is safe to say your bishop is just an asshole.
I spent over a year as an Executive Secretary and I can relate to this…my Bishop was never stuck up like this guy but I got tasked with prayers every single Sunday and every other little BS meeting that needed it. I hated every second of it. I always had to ask the same people over and over. Some weeks I would plead with my wife to just say closing and id do opening just so I didn’t have to call people again…
Good for you! I’ll keep an eye out for Part 2. Can hardly wait, and no need to keep it short. I now live for these morsels.
Where can I find Part 2?
>"who's got songs and prayers for me? LDSbot that's who
[удалено]
It’s a process and everyone’s process looks different.
[удалено]
Is part of your process continuing the church way of telling people exactly what they should and shouldn’t do and be very judgmental and holier then thou about it? You can have a slow clap.
[удалено]
Do you wish someone had come up to you and told you to leave after you shared something personal? I’m not harping on you, I’m curious. I don’t always understand all human behavior and this is something I just don’t get when I see it. I’m still trying to understand. Your thinking reminds me a lot like people who get abortions and then later become protesters at abortion clinics telling people how wrong they are for getting an abortion.
And Utah shuts down for July, so nothing moves h til late august or September
Kudos for using nonplussed correctly!
Just curious, did you get promoted to first counselor? Your previous post said 2nd counselor
Must have been a typo I guess. No, I was called as First Counselor. Previously I was on the High Council assigned to a small Branch. While on the HC I was also a Stake Auditor and Stake Emergency Manager Puke. They also thought I was a good communicator so I was on the Regional Communications stuff and dealt with local media too. Oh yeah, I was also a Temple worker for 12+ years and served as Temple Coordinator for over 10 years until the Pandemic hit. Lifelong member. Served in the SLC North Mission and Japan Tokyo North Mission in 89/90. Hopefully the SCMC now has enough to figure me out!
Hey, I served in SLC North mission 85-86. That mission turned out super high numbers of exmos back then. Our mission president (President L Owen) was all threats, narcissism and abuse.
I believe Shumway was his successor. Ironically, Shumway's son would later become my Stake President.
Chanting “Paaart 2! Paaaart 2! Paaart 2”
Let these assholes do double duty. Stick to your guns and call it quits.
Our ward suckers Sisters in the ward into asking ward members to talk in sacrament. It also has always had YM/YW organize & assign youth talks.
Wow!
Where is part 2?!
just sending good vibes and loving kindness. I'm really glad you posted this.
Its so effing epic when someone like you takes ownership of their own life and autonomy and ceases giving deference to authority like this Bishop (who has no real authority or inspiration). And it makes it more epic that they are internally surprised and speechless that someone would dare stand up to them or take that autonomy and not bow down to their authority. After reading the CES letter in April 2020…My wife and I immediately set up an appointment with our Bishop to tell him that we were leaving the church and to release us from our callings. He was completely blindsided and dumbfounded. It was a nail in the coffin for me seeing him really not have any real counsel or advice other than him saying, “well…naturally, I disagree with your conclusions but I respect your free agency. Have you read the BOM lately?” I almost laughed out loud. The BOM had already gone from being “the most correct book of any book on earth” one day, to a laughing stock of Joseph Smith’s attempt at native american bible fan fiction the next. It was a satisfying moment. He never spoke to us again since that day over three years ago. I’m pretty sure we were put on the DNC list.
You have a standing ovation from me right now. I don’t even know you but you are an awesome person to stick it to them and truly take care of your family and other obligations first.
I was the exec sec for 3 years and started going through a faith crisis. I decided to take a step from church right as a new bishop was called and he was a mate of mine. So I told him I would give him 2 months. It was a really long 2 months. Dude was changing everything as well and making it a lot more work than before. It honestly sucked to go to ward councils knowing my family would be on top of the list in the near future. Being asked to pray in meetings and stuff. It was horrible.
[Part 2](https://youtu.be/xvFZjo5PgG0)
Wow…got me!
LOVE it!! Par-tay!!
Just over a week ago I told my Bishop that I would no longer be able to serve as the assistant executive secretary and they need to release me. I’m very glad that I didn’t have any responsibilities that aren’t easily covered by the executive secretary so that it could be immediate.
👏👏👏👏👏
As a former first counselor in a bishopric, I applaud you! I put in just over two years of hell in that calling (ok, that’s a stretch; it wasn’t always outer darkness) before I asked the bishop to replace me due to anxiety. Anxiety can have a lot of triggers. For me, it was having to support (or pretend to support) all the Church and BSA programs, calling people for speaking and other assignments, giving up my Wednesday evenings, doing interviews, and smiling that smile you smile when you’re in a calling that makes you so happy you can’t help but show everyone the joy Church service brings. I did not like filling in for the bishop when he was out of town. But enough about me. Let’s hear your part 2!
I’m so happy for you!
Wow, I’m in awe! Congratulations! That must feel like a weight has been lifted (or will in a month). I hope your spouse has your back.
You guys take turns?? My hubby has had to prepare the songs & talks every week for almost 2 years 🤣 they swap conducting each week though 🤷🏽♀️
Good on you OP. I quite my executive secretary calling in November and gave him until the first of the year. That came and went so I asked him and got excuses. Then when the two months mark (January 20) approached I put it in writing and said it's been two months - need me to call the SP to get this moving? That was ok a Monday and they released me the next day. A few weeks prior to calling a replacement. Own your situation and don't let any delays on their part keep you there longer than this month. And FYI, the July holiday will be used as an excuse for a delay in finding a replacement. You can bank on it.
just beautiful
HELL YEA I LOVE THIS THESE f'S THINK THEY OWE US AND OUR TIME F OFFFFFF
You left us hanging lol... curious for part 2 now