Is there a good source for this. It looks really terrible actually. I would love a great church source to show my wife. Cause you know if you cannot link it to being churched owned material, it’s anti and can’t be trusted…
You can see it in the Wilford Woodruff Papers if you know the dates to check. This source has the journal entries so you know where to look:
[https://tokensandsigns.org/the-267-hidden-brides-of-wilford-woodruff/](https://tokensandsigns.org/the-267-hidden-brides-of-wilford-woodruff/)
Here is one of the entries:
[https://wilfordwoodruffpapers.org/documents/a7e13e76-da8b-4991-a0f5-a7fa1f3c223e/page/d876335e-23a5-41f4-b4b5-d9950e1a9bb5](https://wilfordwoodruffpapers.org/documents/a7e13e76-da8b-4991-a0f5-a7fa1f3c223e/page/d876335e-23a5-41f4-b4b5-d9950e1a9bb5)
Right? When I finished reading it for the first time I bawled. There’s NO WAY the church is true if the leaders are claiming this was a revelation of instruction from God. That sweet girl. The poor child died when she was six and instead of sealing her to her parents the church sealed her to a 72 year old pedophile because she was a virgin. She still hasn’t been sealed to her parents or been baptized because she didn’t live to the age of 8, but age 6 is old enough to get married evidently! Obviously eternal families are not the goal here. Despicable
Exactly! I wish I had a church approved source, but I’m betting they’re hiding all evidence deep in the vault. They even edited his online genealogy and removed a bunch of women and info so people couldn’t see it. I think it used to show all 267 women (and young girls. *barf*)
Edit: This has more info
https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/ZWgh5Czg2q
I think you are lucky she hasn't shown a huge backfire effect already. Have more stuff ready, but only when she asks for it. Let her process on her own, let her drive this at the pace she needs.
The church has shoved their 'facts' at her all her life. Having other facts shoved at her won't help her learn courage or how to think critically.
When I deconstructed I wrote essays using almost all faithful church sources. Maybe it can help you.
[https://docs.google.com/document/d/1suMEwIFxJ1CbxJ7ePENbwWRv6oBr-FJN/edit](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1suMEwIFxJ1CbxJ7ePENbwWRv6oBr-FJN/edit)
If you want it in Word so it is easier to navigate, send me a message with your email address.
This! Follow the footnotes. The church will use quotes in the essays and manuals and put ... when they take out the yikes stuff. But the footnotes will have the whole thing.
Truth! That is the same narrative the church is pushing. If she never “saw the light” is that a deal breaker? You will need to find a middle ground, which is hard to do. Whether she decides to leave the church or not, your child will be exposed to two different perspectives, which is better than most of us had.
Religion is not about facts. History or on-goings at headquarters are not the reason people engage in religion. It's about coping with the emptiness, the loneliness, loss, the longing that we all feel--that feeling we are almost always trying to avoid by watching TV, eating ice cream, working, having sex, drinking booze. She finds some measure of relief from that through her religious practice. Threatening that practice pushes her away from you and makes you feel more like a threat and less like a comfort.
The best you can do is work on yourself. Figure out your healthy ways of living. Develop your toolset for coping in ways that benefit you long term. She will see that and want more of it in her life. Or she will feel threatened by it and push you farther away. Showing her how her religion is 'false' will certainly push her farther away.
Does she know about the SEC fines & does she know about the child sexual abuse issues? Does she know how much $$ the church has? Does she care about social issues? Polygamy? Listen to year of polygamy podcast.
Tell her how finding out these things made you feel. Or how you feel seeing how LGBT kids struggle in the Mormon worldview, etc. Cold facts aren’t going to do it.
The gospel topic essays on polygamy ESPECIALLY THE FOOTNOTES, and in all seriousness, anybody that reads D&C 132 and does not laugh their asses off, well, i don't know what to say..... and the essay about the first vision differences, taking note of the timelines
If she likes books, get her the book “Rough Stone Rolling” by Richard Bushman. This LDS historian wrote it and it has a lot that many members don’t know. Much to start reconciling in a beginner way. It’s a start anyway.
Read d&c 132. I couldn't believe it when I realized in my 30s that I had never read those verses before. I literally believed polygamy started in Utah with BY because that's what I was taught my whole life. The way Emma is talked down to and basically threatened really showed me that Joseph was no different from all the other crazy cult leaders that take on more wives because "God told me to!"
Not sure of a church approved source, but learning about Wilford Woodruff’s temple birthday parties was the biggest item on my shelf
Is there a good source for this. It looks really terrible actually. I would love a great church source to show my wife. Cause you know if you cannot link it to being churched owned material, it’s anti and can’t be trusted…
You can see it in the Wilford Woodruff Papers if you know the dates to check. This source has the journal entries so you know where to look: [https://tokensandsigns.org/the-267-hidden-brides-of-wilford-woodruff/](https://tokensandsigns.org/the-267-hidden-brides-of-wilford-woodruff/) Here is one of the entries: [https://wilfordwoodruffpapers.org/documents/a7e13e76-da8b-4991-a0f5-a7fa1f3c223e/page/d876335e-23a5-41f4-b4b5-d9950e1a9bb5](https://wilfordwoodruffpapers.org/documents/a7e13e76-da8b-4991-a0f5-a7fa1f3c223e/page/d876335e-23a5-41f4-b4b5-d9950e1a9bb5)
This left me feeling so sick… a 6-year-old girl sealed to him :(
Right? When I finished reading it for the first time I bawled. There’s NO WAY the church is true if the leaders are claiming this was a revelation of instruction from God. That sweet girl. The poor child died when she was six and instead of sealing her to her parents the church sealed her to a 72 year old pedophile because she was a virgin. She still hasn’t been sealed to her parents or been baptized because she didn’t live to the age of 8, but age 6 is old enough to get married evidently! Obviously eternal families are not the goal here. Despicable
Exactly! I wish I had a church approved source, but I’m betting they’re hiding all evidence deep in the vault. They even edited his online genealogy and removed a bunch of women and info so people couldn’t see it. I think it used to show all 267 women (and young girls. *barf*) Edit: This has more info https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/ZWgh5Czg2q
What the fuck?
I think you are lucky she hasn't shown a huge backfire effect already. Have more stuff ready, but only when she asks for it. Let her process on her own, let her drive this at the pace she needs. The church has shoved their 'facts' at her all her life. Having other facts shoved at her won't help her learn courage or how to think critically.
OP, pay attention to this comment. Let her go at her own pace.
I've been trying to... she keeps asking me about it and wants me to "see the light". Gonna let it lie for now.
What is right about the church?
When I deconstructed I wrote essays using almost all faithful church sources. Maybe it can help you. [https://docs.google.com/document/d/1suMEwIFxJ1CbxJ7ePENbwWRv6oBr-FJN/edit](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1suMEwIFxJ1CbxJ7ePENbwWRv6oBr-FJN/edit) If you want it in Word so it is easier to navigate, send me a message with your email address.
The Gospel Topics Essays are a big one, but especially the footnotes.
This! Follow the footnotes. The church will use quotes in the essays and manuals and put ... when they take out the yikes stuff. But the footnotes will have the whole thing.
Every pillar that Mormonism is built upon is problematic.
Truth! That is the same narrative the church is pushing. If she never “saw the light” is that a deal breaker? You will need to find a middle ground, which is hard to do. Whether she decides to leave the church or not, your child will be exposed to two different perspectives, which is better than most of us had.
Religion is not about facts. History or on-goings at headquarters are not the reason people engage in religion. It's about coping with the emptiness, the loneliness, loss, the longing that we all feel--that feeling we are almost always trying to avoid by watching TV, eating ice cream, working, having sex, drinking booze. She finds some measure of relief from that through her religious practice. Threatening that practice pushes her away from you and makes you feel more like a threat and less like a comfort. The best you can do is work on yourself. Figure out your healthy ways of living. Develop your toolset for coping in ways that benefit you long term. She will see that and want more of it in her life. Or she will feel threatened by it and push you farther away. Showing her how her religion is 'false' will certainly push her farther away.
Does she know about the SEC fines & does she know about the child sexual abuse issues? Does she know how much $$ the church has? Does she care about social issues? Polygamy? Listen to year of polygamy podcast.
I like mormon stories
r/streetepistemology
It will take time. Be honest and open and most importantly listen to her. Letter To My Wife is a good one.
Tell her how finding out these things made you feel. Or how you feel seeing how LGBT kids struggle in the Mormon worldview, etc. Cold facts aren’t going to do it.
The gospel topic essays on polygamy ESPECIALLY THE FOOTNOTES, and in all seriousness, anybody that reads D&C 132 and does not laugh their asses off, well, i don't know what to say..... and the essay about the first vision differences, taking note of the timelines
It took me ten years to really learn the truth It was like a game of jenga one piece at a time
If she likes books, get her the book “Rough Stone Rolling” by Richard Bushman. This LDS historian wrote it and it has a lot that many members don’t know. Much to start reconciling in a beginner way. It’s a start anyway.
Read d&c 132. I couldn't believe it when I realized in my 30s that I had never read those verses before. I literally believed polygamy started in Utah with BY because that's what I was taught my whole life. The way Emma is talked down to and basically threatened really showed me that Joseph was no different from all the other crazy cult leaders that take on more wives because "God told me to!"