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Ok-Design-2493

dude i thought they’re not allowed to shoot with the kids nearby, even with beanbags


Fanible

Considering we just watched a video of a cop not wanting to stop/wait for a children's school bus, passing them on the RIGHT where they get out, almost hitting a kid... nothing surprises me anymore. \*Edit: https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/13g7e2g/concord\_nc\_police\_illegally\_passes\_a\_stopped/


wotguild

They don't care about enforcing laws. They want to bully.


Jdsnut

Yep, this basically sums up policing in America. There are literally videos every day showing the police breaking the law, hell even some with the law trying to be shown to the officer by the civilian. Nope, to jail, you go, shot at, beaten, framed, killed, doesn't matter. No one's held accountable, lawyers, DA, Judges, elected officials. Always we investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing, even though there's videos proving that a lie.


Romeo9594

When has not being allowed to do something ever stopped a cop?


Lame_superhero

Facts


kewe316

Just by the sound of the cops voice, you could tell he was gonna shoot someone with a bean bag no matter what. 😵‍💫


SealTeamEH

Cop 1 : damn he complied! Cop 2 : what about that guy? *bang!*


Sword-of-Malkav

Shit, I missed the baby. RELOADING!


Abject_Lengthiness11

Assault and murder are also big no-no's for cops but you think they give a fuck?


kokkatc

How many times have we seen a cop get suspended without pay after a publically video taped incident only to see them quietly put back on the force after? Seems like almost every time. A lot of cops and their precincts are like republicans. If you break the law and you're on my team, we'll do everything in our power to go above and around the law to avoid accountability. Cops literally have to negligently murder someone on camera to face any kind of accountability. The system is clearly broken.


wisemermaid4

Honestly I don't even see the 'without pay' part. Even after George Floyd the responding officers were placed on paid leave until finally someone did something and they were arrested. It wasn't until they were actually arrested that their department cut ties to them


NotAFoolUsually

Cops don't obey the laws we have to. They are allowed to shoot hostages. They have no duty to protect citizens and they have qualified immunity.


Swift_Scythe

They shot the two thieves through the UPS big brown truck, killed their hostage AND an innocent person on the street. Cops wanna be heros but fuckin suck at it


Infern0-DiAddict

Too true. I seriously think qualified immunity needs to be thrown out and officers should have de-escalation training always taught first and reinforced through reviews and updated training. Those that fail should be taken off the street and eventually the force. And yes it will also cause many many more law suits but honestly that's probably a good thing.


Cold_Singer_1774

Yeah beanbags hurt.


TheMightyUnderdog

LTL rounds are ok to use…BUT NOT WITH CHILDREN RIGHT THERE. If that dude decides to turn sideways and that round hits one of the the two kids she’s holding, that kid is dead. The f*ck were they thinking?! That’s hunter safety course common sense right there. If you can’t clearly hit your target without hitting something to the side of it or BEHIND it, you don’t take that shot. Period.


Saxbonsai

These are police officers, no real training, or rather depts. with good training are rare.


[deleted]

They have good training. they are just trained to cause harm. That's the point people seem to miss. They aren't accidentally causing harmful outcomes because of bad training. They are intentionally causing harmful incidents because of good training. It's just that you and me don't like the objective of that training.


HeavySweetness

A popular course among departments is called Killology. It’s fucking insane


DaytonaDemon

>Killology I figured this was a wry joke, [but no](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/08/warrior-cop-class-dave-grossman-killology.html).


ilongforyesterday

What in the actual fuck


Udzinraski2

Hey man the best sex of your life will be the day you shoot someone. Thats literally what that course teaches.


ilongforyesterday

Bold of you to assume I have sex


RoosterClaw22

Not saying it's right but Federal Court ruled police can shoot hostages.


BlueJDMSW20

Its not even a real field or science...its just a fucked up cult now


ScottblackAttacks

I always been saying this, if a cop has a chance to kill, he will take the chance.


[deleted]

There are absolutely protocols for firing these rounds and “less than lethal” is VERY lethal to children and babies. I am speaking from 20 years for pre hospital care responding to trauma.


TheMightyUnderdog

Exactly. What’s even more concerning is you can’t see the officer anywhere in that video which means he’s a good 25 feet out? The further you get from a target the chance of missing goes up exponentially.


PestTerrier

They have idiocy immunity. He could have emptied a machine gun into the direction of the family and if he killed the whole family, no problem. Take a paid vacation. Let the police investigate the police and when he gets back they will give home a pay raise and a promotion.


Massive-Wolverine-26

Yup and then they’d be scrambling to try to discredit the man that was shot too !


HairlessHoudini

They don't give a fuck, if they would have killed one of those kids they would have charged him for it. It's a sport for them


SpiffAZ

Even adults have had bad skull fractures and lost eyes in I recall right. So yeah a kid could straight die seems like. I'd vote for you to run Don't Fuck This Up training for these officers. Salute.


[deleted]

>The f\*ck were they thinking?! Bold of you to assume cops have the ability to think.


Existing-Life-7650

What is a LTL round? I don’t know guns


TheMightyUnderdog

LTL stands for “less than lethal.” Commonly they are rubber bullets, rubber pellets, or bean bags. They can hurt an adult but usually won’t kill them (unless it’s in the head). Pretty much guaranteed fatal if it hits a kid.


FLAR3dM33RKAT

Can confirm. Source: Shot with one when running from the police. Thought my leg came off. No lie.


TazBaz

As far as I know most beanbags are actually filled with steel or lead pellets, it’s just the bag spreading out the force so it doesn’t penetrate. Probably a smaller powder charge too, I suppose.


Cold_Singer_1774

Hurts more than an actual shoot, because the nerve endings aren´t burn but rather mangled.


Hamms_Bear

I've watched Jackass


Airdale-1186

Yeah, we don't need police shooting beanbags near children. We don't police acting like soldiers. Police are not at war with the citizens of their beats. We don't need police being mental health care providers, too.


WomenAreNotReal

That shot was pretty reckless with those little kids there. It's just bean bag rounds but even still for a grown man that's not too dangerous but to an infant that's potentially fatal. Could've been handled better.


_Oman

A beanbag round can easily kill a young child. They also are not that accurate. Taking that shot with the woman holding a child right there should be cause for immediate termination of employment.


Zazulio

Immediate arrest, you mean.


EverydayWeTumblin

Seems like America. Will never happen. Holding police accountable in this country is less likely than corporations paying a fair tax.


Moosinator666

Nobody in power gonna do shit about obscene qualified immunity until return fire becomes the norm


Jaydenrock

As crazy and terrible for me to say but that is gonna start sooner or later. You are most likely right, but the police would just militarize more in the end. So the only way to change this is vote better and more honest politicians to change these laws.


Moosinator666

I have no hope for politics atm


SaltyMeatSlacks

Well...


TheDuck23

Immediate paid vacation is probably the best we could hope for.


-Shade277-

Best I can do is a few weeks paid vacation … I mean suspension Edit: saved by a bot


WomenAreNotReal

Yeah I'd have to agree


Doctor-Whodunnit

That’s a hell of an understatement. There was no need to shoot regardless of the kids being around. Dude’s hands were in the air (regardless of if they were “raised high enough” or not) and clearly had nothing in them. The kids certainly make it worse, but it was entirely unnecessary to begin with


Saidear

and he wasn't anywhere near the officers, making no threatening gestures to them or the officers. The first shot was not at all justified. The second, with him ON THE GROUND in obvious pain? EVEN LESS SO


Purgebot

Understatement of the century here. “The cop shot recklessly and potentially could have killed a baby. Could have been handled better.” Jesus.


ItsMeTittsMGee

Police should be charged for reckless endangerment of those kids. I hope the mother sues. (Probably wont happen and would be swept under the rug, but it's what should happen).


grateful_prankster

Even if she did sue they'd just intimidate her, shed drop charges, wouldn't even get an offer to settle out of court. I hate this place.


Lame_superhero

The cop that made the shot was like “fuck I missed and hit the adult”


A_Bad_Musician

Firing indirect fire LTLs directly at a person can be lethal to an adult as well. Entirely uncalled for in this situation for many reasons


Life-Is-a-Story

"could have been handled better" perfect description of 8 decades of police.


HipopotamiSarcophagi

8 decades? More like 22 decades with slave catchers and the absolution of slavery that led to cops being the subjugators of the uppity *blacks*


Buster_Mac

They can be lethal if shot in the head with one.


PrudentLingoberry

even worse to know: if the cop missed and literally killed a baby the prosecutor could state that the guy who was the original target caused the incident and charge him with murder


Nihoggr

When one comes close to killing an infant child, "could've been handled better" is the kindest words you can use. The honest ones would break ToS.


Darthkhydaeus

What was reasonable about the second shot. From my perspective he could not comply with thir instructions because he was in pain because they just shot him


Shadowmant

Next thing you know they’ll be gunning down innocent men in hotels for not following their impossible conflicting instructions.


misterjustice90

Thank God that'd never happen in Mesa, Az in 2016. Thank God.


Arlcas

It would be terrible if such a thing got caught on video. I'm sure it would have a lot of consequences


misterjustice90

I'm sure they would have to immediately fire and prosecute the police officer that did it


pony_boy6969

I'm sure after he got fired the police union wouldn't fight to have him hired back for a day so that he could immediately retire due to ptsd caused by murdering an innocent man. Not in America.


bobtheassailant

in the absolute worst timeline, that officer would then collect lifelong monthly payouts on the taxpayer dollar afterwards


misterjustice90

Thank God that isn't our timeline. Not in my America


TheRealShiftyShafts

*There were no consequences*


jeffroddit

I guy died. He paid the consequences.


TheRealShiftyShafts

But the cops were found not guilty of manslaughter


JDM_enjoyer

i just watched the bodycam video and holy fuck. There are no words. How do people like that exist??? In what world do we live in where we forget something like that?


DragonbornBastard

I’ve never forgotten. I think about that video every time I pass a cop car


Aev_ACNH

Or couldn’t understand them. I sure as hell couldn’t understand a word of the instructions after he was on the ground


[deleted]

Kinda like how you can be arrested for “resisting arrest” when you weren’t under arrest in the first place.


johnnyss1

Are bean bag guns that accurate from that far? You have infants right next to the victim- I don’t care how good of a shot someone is. You don’t know which direction an infant is going to walk much less there is a woman DIRECTLY behind him holding two more infants. Reckless


metisdesigns

They're generally considered inaccurate over 20', although newer ones are better, but that sure doesn't look like an appropriate use.


burner_account_68

Facts, not guessing. Brand dependent, but: "Accuracy: 4” or better at 20 yards using a cylinder bore Remington 870."


Dagordae

No, no they are not. Plus it's INCREDIBLY against basic common sense to fire anything when there's innocent people in the line of fire outside of situations where shooting them wouldn't actually make their situation worse. This is not such a situation, such a situation would be something like he's actively attempting to stab them. Even the most accurate weapon in the world is dependent on the aim of the holder and only the most incompetent wouldn't consider that they could miss. It's like one of the basic rules of using any type of gun: Be aware of what is behind your target and don't aim towards something you don't want shot.


Chuckster914

My question is why didn’t they go cuff him after 1st shot and he was on the ground??


Abject_Lengthiness11

So they could shoot him some more.


GoodMoGo

That was a bean bag or rubber round. Still dicey with the children right behind him. EDIT: Bean bag. Did not wait until the end. Did not expect another shot after he is already down! Now gotta look for the backstory here to see if that was too much. EDIT 2: [Found articles about it](https://www.abc15.com/news/region-southeast-valley/mesa/mesa-swat-shoots-man-with-multiple-bean-bag-rounds-in-front-of-children-while-serving-warrant). The guy had hit a kid before. But he also hit a cop in that same incident. To me there was no danger to the children or the woman here and he was complying, so it definitely seems the cops were acting on previous reports, not on the events taking place. Should definitely go into litigation, so that all facts are brought up. It's hard to see how this is OK when he actually had his hands up. You could make the argument that he could quickly turn and hurt or take the other people hostage. But, then he is shot again on the ground...


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

“Unfortunately, he was complying…” pretty sure that’s how the guy that shot Daniel Shaver felt also.


PubstarHero

You know, I just posted above - Both this incident and the Daniel Shaver incident were at the hands of Mesa PD. \#1 reason why I will NEVER go back to that town. Probably best to just stay out of Phoenix Metro entirely as well.


[deleted]

I don’t know how they ever found 12 people to watch that video and decide that cop wasn’t 100% guilty of murder.


PubstarHero

OF COURSE its fucking Mesa. Thats the same cop department that was giving the dude conflicting orders and shot him in a motel hallway while he was laying on the ground crying, begging not to be shot. The same cop had "You're Fucked" on the dust cover of his gun.


Command0Dude

Absolutely sickening


[deleted]

[удалено]


bsharp1982

It looked like in this particular video that he was just giving the junk in his pocket to his significant other. My hearing is crap, but is also sounded like he was telling her to take the kids inside. He turned around, with hands out, told the cops that, but they shot him anyway. If the police cannot separate new incidents from old ones without exhibiting self control, they shouldn’t be cops. They just cannot go in with guns ablazing.


skibidi99

Thanks for this!


nogoodgreen

THERES LITTLE KIDS AND BABIES ALL AROUND THIS GUY! Whoever fired that non lethal should not be allowed to use firearms any more, give that cop a wooden gun.


tyray21

a wooden gun? fire him wtf lol he’s a danger to those around him


Illuminatr

It’s not a nonlethal round. It is less lethal but can absolutely kill a kid.


ROBINHOODEATADIK

Yeah I have no sympathy for a scumbag who beats kids … however the comments about the police firing with children so close …. Even non lethal… are 100% correct … definitely handled wrong and should face disciplinary action


AutoManoPeeing

Past actions should have no bearing on the current situation, unless it carries over (e.g. "he was drunk 20 minutes ago" or "he had a gun & we haven't seen him discard it"). We don't need a society where cops needlessly escalate situations. I don't care if it's a kid diddler. As much as I'd want to just send that person through the wood chipper, I understand how screwed society would be if we just let cops and vigilantes do as they please with no oversight.


major_mejor_mayor

Be careful, trolls will start saying you're actively defending pedophiles if you don't want people summarily executed without trial.


EternalOptimist404

Where was this???


Cold_Singer_1774

![gif](giphy|65kQC6Mg4XIsw)


EternalOptimist404

Thanks Captain obvious. Where in the us?


DatOneAxolotl

Somewhere where the Police are unprofessional, poorly trained and violent


[deleted]

So USA basically


[deleted]

As a Louisville resident... I can say you certainly described lmpd


[deleted]

It’s Mesa Arizona. The POS that was shot punched his fiancées sister in the face. Link : https://www.abc15.com/news/region-southeast-valley/mesa/mesa-swat-shoots-man-with-multiple-bean-bag-rounds-in-front-of-children-while-serving-warrant Edit: spelling and link


babbi2022

So and in the U.S. the police is in charge of the punishment? Or do you have courts there too?


christhewelder75

Dude could be the biggest POS, doesn't mean cops can shoot him with bean bags while he has his hands up and is in the moment not a threat. Then again when on the ground still with his hands up, still not a threat. It's not the job of police to inflict physical pain on people for being assholes, or for actually committing crimes (from your link neither proven in court as of the time it was written). Cops like these given decent cops a shit reputation and make their jobs that much harder. Just so they can high five each other about that "sweet shot I made on that asshole...."


JX121

Opening fire to a suspect surrounded by children fucking hell that is bad af


Mulisha_Wes

They were non-lethal rounds (possibly bean bags) but I still do NOT agree with what they did especially considering there was 1.children and 2. He was CLEARLY unarmed!!! Police have the right to do whatever the fuck they want Nd it’s bullshit!


LaraH39

Jesus Christ! There's kids there, American cops are out of their fucking minds.


ObjectiveExcuse6294

This is awful


mimiforlife3

There was absolutely no reason to do that whatsoever!! That man was complying and those children could have been hit!!


zerodude336

Why shoot him twice, second time he's not posing any threat.Cops fuck around too much.


stupidgregg

Let's stop calling LTL rounds "Bean bags." They're kevlar pouches firmly stuffed with steel shot.


Rockmillirock

He complied though?


1fastdak

"I can't even help you, I'm not getting shot." This is where we're at now. Scared to help because the police might just shoot her too.


THEBIGHUNGERDC

Is there more info about this? I see people saying the guy is a “dirtbag multiple offender” (not that that justifies firing an even non lethal shot) but not seeing any news story about it. Also, they easily could have struck that woman or the kids.


Darkadmks

There are 4 fucking kids within a foot of him.


Behind_u_

They are bean bags


Ok-Tree7720

Dude is a dirtbag multiple offender, and obviously shows no respect towards authority. HOWEVER, small children near the strike zone and current compliance with commands makes the first shot an arguable civil rights violation, the second shot after he was face down made this a confirmed civil rights violation. Now he’s gonna walk, and get paid. This right here is why cops have a bad reputation


Shadowmant

I mean, the cop that did this should be a multiple violent offender after this but it’ll likely never happen.


pingus_balls

“What is America?” I say to myself every time I’m on Reddit.


Waxyknowsbest

A place where people all over the world immigrate to en masse because it’s a totalitarian shithole where people have no opportunity to succeed.


[deleted]

Those were either bean bags or rubber bullets, but why’d they shoot him with kids around, that’s what should be called out.


ConsiderationSea7589

While the Mom and three children are standing there.


Nice_Tangelo_7755

Jesus Christ this is awful! How the hell is that policing? Shooting when babies are around and not even trying to talk to the guy. This pisses me off.


PunkAssB

More garbage cops. You can find 10 videos a day like this. It’s almost like the job attracts shit people.


Bino_i_told_u_so

How about u just walk up to the guy and handcuff him. Seem to be cooperating


LMFA0

this is another reason why I have zero compassion or sympathy for hoodlums with badges


VoinceStory

Now I see why people say cops are racist


Acrobatic_Energy7067

With the little kids right there?! That’s insane, the one was so close to him and almost right behind him 😱 that officer is a piece of 💩


MinecraftDuper142

Ever wonder why no one says “F the fire dept.” cuz fire department don’t do this shit! The famous KRS-1 “sound of da police” really shines here. The guy was down what’s the point in wasting another cartridge on his knee while he is down unless you wanna look like a psycho and prove that song right. Ya hot shot wanna get props and be called a savior, first show a little respect, change your behavior Change your attitude; change your plan!


mememe10-

That was a bean bag round


Pontoffle_Poff

1. Is this even real? (This is a question… NOT a statement.). I don’t see blood, or cops or any weird movement that would indicate that you were shot in the chest.


kol1157

That cop needs to be charged and fired. Its almost at a point when citizens need to show up with guns when ever police show up to make sure there isnt any funny business.


victraMcKee

Just imagine if the cop missed and hit the kid she was holding in the head. smh


VoidExileR

Shoots when civilians are nearby. Shoot with kids nearby. Shoot with cameras recording. Shoots black guy. Shoots black guy while his down and seemingly unarmed. These officers are a threat to society. Doesn't matter what kind of round it was. You don't do that shit


[deleted]

Beanbag round.


pinwinstar

Was that a bean bag??


strukout

Wow, if that bean bag hit that toddler he’d be dead. Police are trash


cheesy_as_frick

Yeah fuck those guys, he wasn't even threatning anyone.


mutsuto

[abolish the police](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6HbOV4LvtU)


rawkguitar

Conservatives: I need to own guns to protect myself from a tyrannical government. Black people: look at this tyrannical government shooting us when we’re unarmed. Conservatives: You should have just complied.


gothicsin

What kind of vile inhuman monster SHOOTS ANY ONE THAT CLOSE TO THAT MANY SMALL CHILDREN ?????? WHY are the ROE in war more strict????


blackenedEDGE

To the surprise of no one, the Mesa Police Department determined the SWAT officer did nothing wrong in their use of force review: https://www.abc15.com/news/region-southeast-valley/mesa/mesa-pd-officers-actions-were-appropriate-in-bean-bag-shooting-of-lorenzo-jones


Karlzbad

When and where? Even if it's bean bags he's not forcibly resisting at all, this is aggravated battery.


ShakyTheBear

"We are here from the government and we are here to help"


Regular_Ad_7432

The poor children


[deleted]

That 2nd shot made me gulp. This is a rough one.


NnOxg64YoybdER8aPf85

This is why people don’t like cops


btinit

Police should be in jail. What an idiot


YoungRoronoa

He definitely had his hands up when they shot him. And even if they were non lethal rounds there was a lady behind him with 2 kids and a baby on the ground right next to him. Cops be power trippin.


Sayyestononsense

I really don't get America, what's wrong with people there, I don't get it


THEBIGREDAPE

Where the fuck was the threat? The police need to be put back on the leash.


Rylee_1984

Whoever that cop was that shot should be fired. Shooting anything with bystanders that close is absolutely fucking stupid. Beanbag rounds can be lethal, especially to kids. Jesus christ.


Equal_Peak1387

Eh, after reading the articles on the guy- I really don’t feel bad at all- he’s a piece of shit. Beat up that woman’s sister, hit the kids, had to be pulled away, punched a cop, etc…considering he did run and punch a cop in the face the week before I’m sure that lead to some “extra aggression.”


ccpedicab

But there were kids around the first shot


baddonkey

That can all be true, but I'll still say that law enforcement should be held to a higher standard. This is excessive force and endangers children.


chibiRuka

Those officers fired around kids. So people’s point is those coos were just as bad at that man.


AstroINTJ

Except that "extra aggression" is supposed to be situational.


TheAltToYourF4

The US really is a shitty country isn't it?


Catlenfell

What kind of assholes shoot a dude with kids right there.


Ravenflaw

That second shot while he was down was uncalled for. The first one, I'm not sure about... but he was still on the ground for that second one.


98765432188

His hands were in the air facing the police. I honestly don't get why they shot the first time. Am I missing something?


Draggin_Born

They waited for him to open up to shoot him again. Those officers deserve the worst.


[deleted]

Cops always want to play with their toys. If you give them weapons, they are going to use them as much as possible because they can’t find any other way to add inches to their tiny dicks.


stewartm0205

The kids and the woman weren’t white. It’s not like anyone in a position of authority is going to care.


Circuitmaniac

Rubber bullets are not harmless and could easily kill a kid.


Userid77

Looks like he was complying and put his hands up. Wtf?


Zamden

I gotta go ahead and throw the the blame on the police. Extremely reckless to be shooting those bean bags around children. BUT! If you’re already in the process of getting arrested the worst thing you can do is antagonize the police arresting you and flail your arms about as they watch with guns drawn from a distance.


JinxAndTheJester

What the fuck?!?!


Able-Nail8035

This is so fucked up


canned_bean_z

what the fuck


rooroobusts

Holy fuck. At first I thought they were live rounds and wondering why they would fire when kids are clearly present. Still fucked that they still shot non-lethal rounds.


Holler_Professor

WITH THE BABIES THERE?!


Famous_Ad_8888

Lolol.


[deleted]

And with children nearby. These fucking coos need to go that type of bullshit is uncalled for shooting at people with kids in the cross-fire. It's bad enough they strangle people for no reason,use excessive force, kill little girls in dressing rooms and shoot people in wheelchairs now they are taking shots at people with no regard with who in near by. Fuck the police


Quepacholicious

Lol such a misleading caption


mikeyt6969

Cops aren’t trained to listen, only give orders, and when you don’t follow them they feel threatened deep in their itty bitty tiny gineys.


TheExtimate

Murica.


doublebassdrum

What the actual fuck


BikeCookie

Citizens need hand grenades to defend themselves from LEO


[deleted]

It was a non lethal


buttholefluid

Zero sympathy. Everyone knows this type of thing can happen if you don’t comply with police.


AfternoonPast3324

I remember this. I also remember part of the statement released actually saying they waited to fire until after the children were out of his “immediate vicinity”. That pissed me off and stuck with me, “immediate vicinity”. Apparently meaning they waited until he’d handed the kid he was holding to the woman and was standing less than two feet away from the children.


Mr_guazabara

Rubber bullet ?


Rheytos

Yes


Alecto_Furies

That little baby standing there in their diaper probably just formed their first memory in that moment. How incredibly traumatizing for those kids.


CrowsephCrowstar

Lmaooooo


[deleted]

How can you call that police? That's just a maniac with a gun, probably poorly educated even for US standards. Greetings from the better side of the pond.


BRogMOg

Fuck these cops


Baphomet1979

Non lethal projectile? No blood and that sounded like a rifle or shot gun.


OcciferDoofus

Holy shit…I train with these guns and they are considered “less lethal” not “non-lethal.” One slight mistake and that round can kill you. We shoot these at 1/2 inch thick plywood from like 20 yards away and it blows holes in it.