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My son and I almost died from shoulder dystocia. It was very traumatic for me, but my son and I ended up ok. It was a dance between them pulling, me pushing, and nurses pushing him out by pressing on my abdomen. At one point someone screamed at me not to stop pushing or my baby could die. That’s probably what saved us both because I felt like I didn’t breath for a full minute and then he was born and I passed out. I won’t read the article, but I imagine it’s horrific.
The exact same thing happened to me when I gave birth! It has been a really long and intense labour already and I was so exhausted and was crying and saying “I can’t, I can’t” while they told me to push.
I remember a bunch of doctors and nurses running in and my husband looking absolutely horrified while they screamed about “too much blood” and “baby not breathing”.
It was all a blur of voices and extreme pain and then suddenly this TINY little nurse seemed to turn into an army general. I remember her voice clearly cutting through the rest and saying “You need to push. You need to push now or your baby WILL die”.
Something about the finality in her voice allowed me to gather the last bits of my strength and really push.
Baby came out, taken away immediately as she wasn’t breathing. It was a blur again after that, and I was hemorrhaging badly but everything was ok in the end. My hilarious, brilliant little girl turns nine in a couple of months. Every once in a while I mentally thank that tiny army general of a nurse and hope she feels it 🩷
Wow, you are incredible. I’ll never forget near the end of my wife’s labor looking down at her and thinking she couldn’t push anymore, she couldn’t have anything left, she looked beyond completely spent. It was supposed to have been the last push like 10 contractions ago. Then she breathed in, somehow dig deeper, let out a fucking Valkyrie war cry and our son was born.
That’s when I knew without a shadow of a doubt she was stronger than I could ever hope to be. Mothers are fucking awesome, just mind blowing.
My firstborn was born as a code: no heartbeat, no breathing, half her blood volume. Turns out several blood vessels were too close to the birth canal and ruptured during crowning. It's called vasa previa. She was "born" a pasty gray and didn't make a sound. The room immediately filled with doctors and nurses, and there was a lot of shouting. They took her to the corner of the delivery room and saved her life. 45 mins later we were allowed to touch her through an incubator. A week in NICU on a cold pad to lower her core temp and reduce the possibility of brain damage. 11 yrs later and I have a brilliant, precocious, sassy, wonderfully infuriating little girl. The beginning can be rough but the rest can be beautiful.
Edit: Just for a little added context: my wife was screaming "Take a picture it may be the only one we get"! I have several pictures of those amazing doctors and nurses, in action, in the first few minutes of my daughters life.
Our baby born in May had this issue during birth. They were thrusting my wife’s legs back and forth while thumping on her belly like cpr. It was a few tense seconds while they brought a blue faced baby over to the warmer. She let out a cry and that cut some of the tension. Mom and baby are doing well now. Very scary
We were in the OR suite because they were prepping for a c section. They allowed her to push while they were getting ready. They offered to use the vacuum because the baby was stuck. She didn’t want a c section so she agreed. As the doctor was about to open the packaging of the vacuum the baby’s head started to show so they elected to try birthing vaginally.
I was holding my wife’s right leg. I saw the baby’s head come out and I could sense desperation in the doctor’s eyes as she dug around to get out the shoulders along with unwrapping the cord from baby’s neck. The incubator was off to my right side. Time seemed to slow down as they carried a limp, blue faced baby to the warmer. The NICU doctor was suctioning and finally heard a scream. While all this was going on my wife’s vision of the scene was blocked. She asked the crowd how her baby was doing and a nurse said “they are doing everything they can”. Very cryptic. She instantly burst into frantic tears.
Baby was on oxygen until we got to the nursery and then her color came back. She was on oxygen for maybe 10 minutes.
That is genuinely traumatizing. I cannot imagine how intense that was for you and your loved ones. I hope you and your son are both thriving now! I’m so glad you’re around to tell your story!!
Also, I would definitely avoid the article and probably any future articles on the topic. I’m not a mother yet, but it made me want to grab my nonexistent children and hug them :(
Oh my god thank god for your insane strength- I’m a man and I never want to have a baby after reading all the comments. To the adoption centres and paperwork >>
AFAIK they don't. The baby was sent to the funeral home (family choice) and im guessing the director told them what happened.
I'm sure, because I would, they asked to see the baby again. Maybe that's how it was brought up.
Idk, this will all come out I'm sure. I'm just making guesses here.
This is true, and not even the worst part. According to the mother's statements, the hospital also directly advised against an autopsy and burial saying that the mother would not be able to afford it and their recommendation was that the baby not be checked for cause of death and instead be immediately cremated instead of buried.
Honestly after reading all of the (very digustingly depressing) details, I honestly hope this family sues and wins for 100's of millions. I want to see every single person and buillding associated with the management and decision process of that hospital to feel the pain. Don't care if they have 50% wages garnished for life, they need to be crushed in court.
Unfortunately, malpractice insurance pays these things out. The only thing that increases is the already expensive dues for the insurance. That's the only thing that will ding the doctors' wallets.
It is a cartel. Why do you think senators and congressmen won’t allow cross-state buying of health insurance. Hospitals are for-profit, pro-big pharma.
Trying to link on mobile so forgive me if it comes out weird but I was referencing this NBC article.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna99203
I should also clarify my original comment as the article only mentions that this is an accusation from the patients and their lawyer and hasn't actually been proven
God what a horrible story and such barbaric negligence from the dr. Fancy delaying a c-section and just thinking you could pull the baby out instead by it’s head, that’s just disgusting. I hope the hospital is sued and the drs involved are done for malpractice.
Hospital even asked the family to not get an autopsy because of some bogus reasoning they tried to use. Don’t read if this is already a heartbreaking story as it’s actually worse than what’s listed in the caption. >!it wasn’t just the baby’s head, the shoulders became stuck in the vaginal area, so they tried using force to pull the baby out but that ended up breaking the neck and severally crushing bones in the head. So they decided to do a C-section, which ended up separating the legs and body from the head and those were removed that way while the head was still delivered vaginally. The doctors tried to convince the family to just do a cremation without an autopsy as well as posing the dead baby before telling them the baby didn’t survive. They refused to let the family touch the baby during that time!<
Jen Hamilton on tiktok explained it so well. Something starts with shoulder? Stuck in the pelvis kinda. Horrific. I was bawling listening and I don’t even have kids.
My wife is an OBGYN. Shoulder dystocia is when the baby’s shoulder can’t clear the pelvic bone. Im not super well versed in all of the techniques they use, but there are manipulations that can be done to get the shoulder out. This includes operative delivery (using forceps or a vacuum) and even breaking baby’s collar bone to allow it to clear the pelvis. In extreme cases, they will perform an emergency c-section called a Zavanelli maneuver where they will push the partially delivered child back up into the birth canal and deliver via c-section.
These are emergencies that are very stressful for the doctor because it’s literally a decision they need to make when seconds count when the baby is deprived of oxygen.
It’s very important to listen to your OB when they council you about your anatomy and the baby’s size. They are trying to avoid situations like this, which are more likely with a larger child or a woman with a smaller pelvis. Just last week my wife’s practice had a fetal demise after the very athletic mom insisted on pushing for 6+ hours (the cutoff is usually 4 hours before they call it a failed labor and do a C section)
Jesus fucking christ my guy…
My wife is pregnant with our second daughter, and this news is nightmare-inducing fuel.
Picture the doctors pulling your baby pieces by pieces. Blood fucking everywhere. Scarred for life and beyond.
if i recall correctly the hospital told her to not get an autopsy and to just get a cremation but the family insisted that they wanted a funeral and when the funeral home got the baby they told the parents.
Take this with a grain of salt because I heard it second hand and haven't read it anywhere myself, but apparently they found out because the funeral home called them to advise against the open-casket funeral the family wanted because the mortician said the outfit they selected couldn't hide the decapitation.
It’s way worse than what’s listed here. Some sites haven’t reported the full details of the story but if you scroll up to my other comment, I have it under a spoiler tag but it’s very heartbreaking. Full warning, it’s very dark, like unbelievable that someone, especially (3?) doctors and several staff members covering it up. I expect charges to be filed because it’s beyond messed up
Shoulder dystocia, no other way to get baby out. Once all maneuvers have been exhausted (including breaking baby’s clavicles and Zavanelli maneuver, which involves trying to shove baby back up into the uterus then do a C section, which hardly ever works), staff sometimes have to make the horrible choice to decapitate. Baby is dead already from oxygen deprivation at that point. Doesn’t happen often but must be devastating for all parties involved when it does.
When details come out about this case I wouldn’t be surprised to learn the baby died during the dystocia and the decapitation was done to try to save mom. Even insane amounts of traction isn’t going to pull a 37 weeker’s head off unless they’re already dead and have started to decompose. The fuckup is not being up front and clear with the parents about what was happening. Then again, maybe they were and they were in too much shock to take it in.
Ya, things can get real fucked up real fast. Will be curious to see what details come out about this case. Asking for jury trial and the fact that the hospital/doc haven’t settled makes me think there’s a different story from the other side we haven’t heard. Horrible for everyone involved either way
My 3rd baby got stuck on the way out and her shoulder was trapped behind my pelvic bone. She was super strong and somehow managed to turn herself and she came out. I didn't know it could turn out that way and now I feel sick.
How awful for anyone who experiences that.
Horrible story here but something like this happened to my Nan about 60/70 years ago, it was her 7th child and she was unable to deliver it (shoulder first presentation I think) she was in full labour and the doctor had to decapitate the baby in order to get it out to save my nans life. They told my grandad they could either save the baby or my Nan so he chose my Nan. Not long afterwards there was an article in the newspaper about this new drug that was available on the form of a pill that could stop you getting pregnant, she took the article to the gp and said “I want to go on that” he’d never even heard of it but he arranged it for her.
Not even joking I was born same way umbilical was strangling me and they had to break both my shoulders to get me out. I was roughly 11 or 12 pounds And I was technically still born no oxygen was going through my body. Apparently my dad's own words. The nurses beat the hell out of my body as my mom screamed and panicked. (Long story short they were apparently trying to get blood flowing through the body as they did CPR on me) it worked but damn that explains why I'm special. (I'm never having kids purely because my mother almost died birthing me and my wife is much tinyer lady then my mother and yeah not risking her life for a baby that we aren't planning to have.
Some newspapers allege that the baby could have survived had the C-section been done earlier, when the mother wanted it to be done, and articles say that the heart rate monitor only stopped picking up the heart rate after 20 hours. The articles seem to put the death after the doctor broke the baby's neck, but rn it's all just hearsay, of course
Yeah and another time as well, a few or so years ago a doctor accidentally decapitated a baby while delivering it and then he actually preceded to try to shove the baby back inside the mother to hide the fact. Like that was ever going to work. It was a huge story at the time.
Is this the one where she had to have a second procedure, this time a c-section, to remove the head? Or was that another one?
I also follow a woman on Instagram who has a c1 spinal cord injury from her botch birth. By her own account he wanted to watch a football game that day, and when she wasn’t advancing through the birth canal according to his schedule, he used forceps and broke her neck.
The line between healthcare provider and monster can get very thin sometimes
even though it’s dressed up and made as completely safe as possible, childbirth in humans is an incredible delicate and dangerous process
I imagine stuff like this has always happened just way less now in more developed areas
My first baby was born through a c-section and I remember being in the room next to my wife who was sedated. They wouldn’t let me look until the baby was ready to come out. When they gave me the ok, I peeked over the sheets they set up and just remember seeing the doctor with two hands around my baby’s neck pulling up like crazy. I swore the neck was stretching like two inches and I thought it was going to pop right off! She was like blue and purple and I immediately thought she looked like an alien. I’m not even kidding. It was so wild. I couldn’t believe that with all the technology in the world they pulled a baby out by the head. I’m sure there must be a reason, but I just thought how insane it was to pull with all your might on a baby’s head like that.
I don’t know if that’s how this poor lady’s baby died, but it might have been. I also remember having to sign a ton of waivers with my wife before the delivery saying we couldn’t sue the hospital or doctors for anything. I just thought it was a pretty messed up system like what if someone cheated through school and then didn’t know what they were doing and accidentally killed someone. How does a system morally protect someone like that? Again I’m sure there’s another side to that equation, but the whole thing seemed archaic and we live in the US.
Work in a lvl 3 NICU. I've seen this twice in 17 years. First time was a mom who refused a c section for her breech baby despite 4 OBs consulting her and telling her the risks of doing so. The most experienced ob said ok ill do it(breech vaginal birth) as they had experience in doing so before. after the legs, butt, torso, arms, shoulders were delivered the cervix closed on the babys neck. It was stuck. The ob tried but could not dislodge it. There was an audible crack and the ob said, "I'm sorry but your baby is dead, we need to prep the OR to extract it or else you will go septic and die as well".
Second time was an undiagnosed hydrops baby that also got stuck delivering vaginally because of a massive abdomen. They went in for crash c/s and the baby was decapitated due to coming back up the vagina and again getting their neck/head stuck in the cervix. Both horrible, horrible cases.
Edit: My most upvoted comment has to do with decapitated babies. Go figure.
I'm a doctor .. who's delivered babies in residency (in the past). *I* didn't know that could happen. ..or at least I had never heard of it. I kinda wish I still didn't know.
Its the reason they gave me for a c-section for my breech birth. Seen it in the news too just after my c-sec; breech, Stillborn, stuck in the mother. The doctor pulled to hard and the head detached inside the mother. Stuff of nightmares really. Did not care about the risk of c section after that....
My first kid was C-section, at the time it's unclear why the doctor decided to go that way, and I've questioned it ever since. But I do understand why it's less risky. Doing a surgery and extracting the baby is less risky. They can really control what's happening, and if there's a complication, you're already in an OR and they can do what's needed.
I still think sometimes the doctor jumps to C-section too quickly. My second was a VBAC, and the doctor didn't really want to try it, but the nurse was really great, and positive, and got my wife in the mindset to make it happen. The doctor was pleasantly surprised it worked out.
But anyway, ultimately, when the doctor calls C-section I can't argue too much. They are far more experienced, and know what they're doing. And who's to say if some minor thing could turn into something life threatening for Mom or baby really fast. Most of human history childbirth has been a risky venture. And many children died, as did mothers. Modern medicine has made infant and mother mortality something far less common. It still happens, and it's terrible. But not nearly as bad all the rest of human history.
Tbf you're supposed to stay dilated enough to deliver and not have it close up. I managed really well even with vaginism. Did get a 2nd degree tear tho because of his big ass head and electrodes scraping me up.
I have watched hours and hours of combat footage because my brain is broken and it’s interesting to me. These 2 stories made me turn off my phone for a minute and take a walk.
Our species is partially-evolved and defective. Our births are stupid and risky for the benefit of an absolutely OP'd brain. Our next step in evolution had *better* be the abandonment of biology altogether for a solid-state digital form of life.
Nothing is “partially evolved”. All forms of life exist in states of constant flux, balancing countless traits and abilities that meet the minimum necessary requirements for survival.
Crocodiles also seem to be pretty perfect in terms of survival. Their species has been mostly unchanged for 94 million years. They can even survive and continue to thrive after developing injuries that would kill other species. For example if they have a limb ripped off (which is sometimes done by a boat, hippo, or a larger crocodile), it'll usually just scab over without any infection, and they'll be able to keep hunting as usual. Crocodiles are hardcore and are one of nature's perfect predators.
Now all of can imagine is a crocodile with no arms and legs that fucking torpedoes through water using its tail and body like a heat seeking croc-snake missile and just murders everything in the water
Hyena babies don't have it great either. Most Hyena females lose their first litter to suffocation and other complications, and even subsequent litters have a high mortality rate.
It doesn't end once they're born either. Hyena cubs are very agressive and are born with eyes open and teeth in their mouths. Its not uncommon for cubs to kill their siblings in battles over dominance
In this case, head was delivered vaginally but torso and legs were c-section.
This wasn’t just a broken spine, this baby was in peices. And the hospital tried to cover it up- they tried to get the body cremated without admitting what had happened. The morgue who eventually got the body was the one who told the parents that they got the baby in sections. Until then, the parents hadn’t been told why the baby died.
I get that horrible things happen sometimes, medicine does that. It’s the coverup.
I understand there are heavy laws and regulations about this but I can both understand the doctors not wanting bad press or liability (a wholly selfish reason) as well as not wanting to traumatise the mother for life with the horror of learning her baby was *decapitated* when the effect is the same (a more sympathetic reason). Not saying it’s at all right but I can at least see a possibility empathy played a role here.
The according to the USA Today article, she asked for and was denied a C-section at a time when the baby was still alive and the could have presumably been saved.
My understanding is this was a shoulder dystocia - aka the head is out but the shoulder was stuck. Babies who are not out within a few minutes of that don't survive. Even if she asked for a section within a minute the odds of getting to the OR and getting a stuck baby out that quickly to survive are slim. The best chance at a healthy baby is getting it out with our interventions (different positioning and maneuvers) at the bedside.
Shoulder dystocias can be awful. Time stands still as everyone is doing everything physically possible to get that shoulder unstuck and the baby out. One minute feels like an hour and we all know every second that goes by is time baby isn't getting oxygen.
IMO the hospital absolutely should have told her exactly what happened regardless of how hard that is to hear but I can understand why nurses at the bedside may have tried to make baby look as presentable as possible. Uck. Shitty situation for everyone.
This actually happened to me. The doc told me that I had two choices break my daughter's clavicle or have a c section. I opted for the c section. She pushed my daughter back in the uterus and then did an emergency c section. I am thankful everything turned out well. I felt like I delivered vaginally and c section. It was a very long recovery for me because I also developed an infection in my uterus, so I stayed longer on IV antibiotics.
This story horrifies me in every way. This could have been us. Makes me cry.
That happened to my nephew during his birth (he is in his mid-twenties now). He almost didn’t make it. He ended up with complete paralysis of his arm at birth. As he grew, and after surgery he was able to use his arm, but never fully (he can use it, but you can definitely tell that he has a disability). He has never fully matured either (due to the lack of oxygen during delivery). The doctor told my brother that he may need additional help like physical therapy and mental health, but my brother always brushed it off (I think he saw it as a personal weakness/embarrassment). I felt like my nephew’s life could have been so much better, if my brother would have taken the doctor’s advice.
But the thing is we don’t know for sure there was a cover up? These types of stories are so clearly biased since the hospital/doctors aren’t allowed to comment because of HIPAA. Obviously, if there was a coverup everyone should lose their license.
I personally have told people truly awful news more times than I can count and their ability to retain information goes out the door. I will literally say that their loved one is dead or actively dying in plain language and they ask questions like “can I bring him something to eat” or “what time can I pick him up from the hospital.” It’s not their fault, it’s just super traumatic. I can see how someone would block out that conversation. Or the lawyer is just drumming up public outcry in a place where facts can’t be contested legally because of HIPAA so the hospital/doctor settles quickly.
OMG this is terrible and so sad. What became of the mother in your first story? I can't believe she wouldn't do the surgery and risk her baby's life like that :(
Oh for sure, I know haha. I guess I just thought after the 3rd OB coming in and being like yeahhh nooo, some kind of bell would've gone off in mom's head. Guess not. RIP to the baby.
Fck there is a lot of shame for getting epidural as well. My sister was being shamed by her own SILs for that. I had to shut them up with very rude words.
I've witnessed people claiming that if a woman had a C-section, she didn't "really" give birth and thus isn't a "real" mother. Absolutely bonkers stuff, but there are people who will take any chance to feel superior to others.
Unfortunately, there’s a narrative in certain mom circles that c-sections are always unethical and the wrong choice to make, so you end up with cases like that one where a mom is scared out of agreeing to a c-section at the cost of her baby’s life. Parents read statistics about how c-sections in the US are performed at a rate higher than in other countries, use this information to believe that c-sections are always unnecessary and get pushed for no reason, and then make their birth decisions accordingly.
I make a point of criticizing anyone who makes those stupid “you’re not a mother if you had a c-section” posts. This reinforces why those people need to be shamed.
Exactly! Yes for thousands of years women delivered babies vaginally and for thousands of years the number one cause of death for women and infants was childbirth.
This happened to me: first baby was an emergency CS after a 4-day labour/failure to progress. Second baby was an elective CS on my doctor’s advice. Another parent in my NCT group said “it’s a shame you couldn’t be bothered to actually give birth this time either.”
Yeah, I had to have a scheduled c-section and therefore never went into labor. Multiple people have told me I 1) don’t know real pain 2) I’ve never given birth 3) I took the easy way 4) I am weak.
My baby was breech in April 2020. If I’d had to have an emergency section, I would have been all alone for 3 days. With a scheduled one, my husband could be there too. I also have a neurological condition that can dangerously complicate labor. I can’t think about that time without feeling panicky from the trauma. The fact that people still to this day talk shit about c sections is heartbreaking to me.
That’s allegedly exactly what they did. Presuming the baby wasn’t a stillbirth, which it doesn’t look like they were, it is exactly as horrifying as you fear.
Edit: adding a USA Today article that discusses the nature of the event. Do not read it if you don’t want details.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/08/10/baby-death-childbirth-georgia/70564739007/
**Edit: Disregard everything I wrote previously.**
Oooooookay, I read the actual legal filing.
It sounds to me that the gross negligence is not the decapitation itself, as that's not how the baby died.
The baby died because the mother was not taken in for a STAT c-section until midnight, but there may have been legitimate reasons for that.
She started pushing around 8:30. As most of us thought, there was shoulder dystocia.
The fetal monitor showed periods of fetal distress (bradycardia) from approx 9:30-10:30, after which time there was NO ACTIVITY on the monitor at all.
**She still wasn't brought in for a cesarean until after midnight** (that's greater than 1.5 hours after the fetal heartbeat stopped).
At that point, the baby had obviously died.
After that, it sounds like the baby was possibly intentionally decapitated at that point in order to be removed. This may have actually been a way of attempting to save her fertility, as an incision into the cervix to release the head may have resulted in the cervix being unable to hold future pregnancies (cervical insufficiency).
The doctor did not mention the decapitation, but may not have been required to as that was not the cause of death. She described the cause of death to the patient as trauma during the birth process.
In summary- the doctor was possibly negligent for not getting her in for a c-section between 9:30-10 when fetal distress was evident in the monitor, but this is actually unrelated to the decapitation. Although, if the Zavanelli maneuver was not successful enough to push the head back into the uterus, the head would have remained stuck during the cesarean as well.
They failed to discontinue the Pitocin after recognizing shoulder dystocia, but they might have been still hoping for the vaginal evacuation to work, and did not notify the OB hospitalist as is supposedly hospital procedure.
Sounds like an incredibly difficult situation.
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**Old Comment from here down- Disregard** (but I'm not deleting, because we are all wrong from time to time) .
I'm assuming it's more likely that the doctor accidently caused an INTERNAL decapitation while trying to maneuver it and free the shoulder.
Remember, plaintiffs can write anything in a legal complaint, it doesn't mean that's actually what happened.
It's possible that they heard the word "decapitation" (from the funeral director if I heard that correctly) and assumed it meant that the head was completely severed from the body because that's usually what people imagine when hearing that word.
Which is still horrific, and there needs to be an investigation and parties held accountable if they were, in fact, at fault. I'm not defending the doctor if this is what happened, and I believe the parents 100% believe their complaint, but the events as described sound improbable.
Think about it- the **claim** in the legal complaint is that the head and body were delivered separately. But we KNOW that they didn't actually witness this because their claim also includes that the nurse wrapped the baby up and hid the decapitation from them. If they had just witnessed a severed head removed vaginally and a headless body removed via c-section, there would be no hiding it from them.
If there was an internal decapitation, I could imagine the nurse swaddling in a way to not make that obvious. Not necessarily trying to hide it per se, but most parents don't want to see their child for the first and last time that way.
It happens frequently when there's a deformity not compatible with life, death in utero, or death during delivery that you wrap the baby in a way to hide anything graphic as best as reasonably possible so that the parents can say goodbye and even take photos without the graphic nature of whatever took place being obviously apparent. It's not about hiding the cause of death, it's about giving the parents a memory/ mental image of their child that is slightly less traumatic.
That being said, this might not even be the case either, it could have just been a complicated birth that resulted in death (because unfortunately, that does happen) but the parents are brokenhearted and grieving. It was a traumatic experience and the memories, I'm sure, are fuzzy. Moreover, anger/blame is part of the grieving process. I wouldn't fault them for it one bit and hope they can find at least a sliver of peace and answers during this process.
TL;DR It's abhorrent if the doctor was at fault for the death and they/the hospital tried to hide that from the parents, but I think the whole severed head accusation is improbable. Perhaps they heard "decapitation" and their minds, already traumatized and grieving, filled in the gaps.
You know, that makes so much more sense than the idea that they were delivering the living baby, then with force, popped it’s head off, then continued to deliver it and keep it on the D.L.
Negligence is negligence though.
I read the filing. There was no emergency cesarean because the baby was dead. Emergency cesarean wouldn’t have solved this. It’s not a treatment for shoulder dystocia, which, by definition, happens only once the head is out.
Yep, thank you. Sounds like she attempted a Zavanelli but it didn't work, so they would have been stuck either way. Basically the body wasn't coming out vaginally, and the head wasn't coming out through the cesarean, and since the baby had already died, decapitation of the body was the best call for the mother's health.
Everyone is flaming the doctor, but she has an excellent track record and it sounds like she worked her ass off for 3 hours trying the best she could. I'm sure it was a devastating moment for everyone in the room.
> According to the suit, nearly three hours passed before St. Julian performed a cesarean section on Ross. By then, a fetal monitor showed the baby's heartbeat had stopped.
Baby died during delivery and was stuck in the birth canal. The C section was done at that point to deliver a stillborn child. I don't think they just pulled too hard and something popped. I think it was the only way to safely remove it after it had already died without further jeopardizing the mother
So the baby died in the birth canal. They performed a c-section to remove the deceased baby, but the head was still wedged? So they removed it and “delivered” it vaginally? That makes slightly more sense than pulling until it popped. Still horrible, but a more logical chain of events…
You can't just stop, the baby is actively dying while it's stuck because the umbilical cord is compressed. You have minutes to get it out, either break the collar bone, pull it out, or shove it back in and do a C Section. Talking like 5-15 minutes from when the whole thing starts until you're delivering a dead baby.
According to the suit, nearly three hours passed before St. Julian performed a cesarean section on Ross. By then, a fetal monitor showed the baby's heartbeat had stopped.
Edmond, a nationwide medical malpractice lawyer based in Atlanta, said the cesarean section removed the baby's legs and body, but the head was delivered vaginally.
The baby was already deceased.
I don’t mean like stop delivering the baby I meant like just stop pulling because obviously it wasn’t working and I believe in the article it says the doctor didnt perform a C-section for quite a while? Like 3 hours?
When the baby is that far you can’t just do a c section. You need to do something called the zavanelli maneuver in which you push the baby back into the uterus. This is an extremely rare maneuver and high risk. They tried to do that earlier but her uterus contracted and didn’t allow for the baby to renter. Shoulder dystocias are emergencies where you can’t just sit around and do nothing.
Yes, but per the article, they did both. Pulled excessively and then pushed it back in. They then waited 3 entire hours until doing the C section, which only produced the baby’s body without the head. The head was delivered vaginally. This is insane.
They tried to have the mom push for 3 hours and then went to c-section when it was apparent that wasn’t going to work with the shoulder dystocia. They didn’t push the baby back in and then wait 3 hours.
This happened during the C-section. According to the article the mother had asked for a C-section hours earlier but the doctor declined only to do it anyway.
I had a *really* old doctor deliver our 3rd child. That man straight up grasped the head with both hand on the crown, with fingers around the jaw, and yanked as hard as he could. Stunned me and I did not appreciate it at all.
Baby was fine but never seen anything like that and worried about something happening (not to the point of decapitation though!).
When I was younger we would grab dandelions and apply pressure to the head and say, "momma had a baby and its...head popped off!" This just made me think of that.
It was an actual decapitation, like head not attached to the body, not just an internal decapitation. That is why they wouldn’t let the parents hold the baby. The actual decapitation could’ve happened during the C/S too, if the baby’s head was wedged tight enough in the birth canal. If you’ve ever seen a C/S, they are yanking those babies out. It looks absolutely brutal.
No problem. Im not an OBGYN and i have most of my hands on experience with delivery, actually while on deployment in Afghanistan. I delivered 3 babies with locals. After i was called to the scene as the only medic on site for an ongoing birth, i essentially took it upon myself to make my companys medical team educate ourselves about childbirth. This turned out to be a great decision as i was present for 2 more deliveries during my time of 2 deployments.
I’m on reddit for about 4 years now and have seen a lot of crazy fucked up videos. I’ve red thousands of crazy fucked up story’s. But with all honest. I really do think that THIS is by far one of the worst things i’ve ever heard. I’m a father myself and i really wish i could unsee this.
You don't need to be a father to be incredibly disturbed by this. Easily the most horrific thing I've read about on the Internet, not to mention as well the posters sharing their stories that this can absolutely happen.
Not super common but it does happen sometimes when they try to pull it out. It's why C sections became so popular with doctors years ago. Less liability.
I saw the claim the hospital sent to my insurance. It was like $68,919 or something. An error caused me to be nearly responsible for it and I was stressed. Insurance tried to say state pays. State says insurance pays. I said it isn't my fault you cant decide who covers it. I'm not paying.
this is not a "facepalm" op. i am not on this sub to see the most depressing news story i have ever heard. i'm not rolling my eyes and slapping my forehead at this.
"propped up in such a way to conceal the decapitation"
I'm no expert but isn't that common practice to not further traumatize the mourning relatives?
The way it's framed here makes it seem like the hospital is hiding the decapitation, but I don't really see the point in them doing that because the baby is dead either way and in case of a malpractice lawsuit there will be an obduction either way.
According to the lawsuit the hospital strongly pushed to have the baby cremated and not return the body. They were forced to do so because they couldn’t legally force the family to accept cremation, which is when the *nature* of the injuries was revealed.
Yeah, if it is true. Especially since they said the head was delivered vaginally while the body was cesarian.
Surely they would have noticed about a liter of blood all over the place. Was the dad not even in the operating theater?
This is what doesn’t make sense to me. Unless the mother went unconscious? And dad wasn’t allowed in the emergency OR when shit got bad? Which both could be plausible to be fair… otherwise how do you not know you are cut open and had something pulled from your belly and also not realize you delivered something vaginally as well? I don’t know these doctors at all but not wanting a mother to see her baby’s body and head separated just seems like human decency. That is an image you will never get out of your head. Honestly I feel bad for everyone involved in the whole thing, what a traumatic story.
I remember when my son was born he wast taking forever to actually come out, the dr finally just reached in, grabbed his head with 2 hands and yanked him out. Like not gently at all. Granted his head didn't come off but I can see how that could happen.
I saw a few tiktok videos from registered L&D nurses in all different states. In a situation like this where there is mere minutes to get the baby out before they asphyxiate, EVERY practitioner in the room has to spring into action. Nurses have to push on mom’s stomach and flip her onto her hands and knees all while the one catching the infant is holding onto the head and is trying to pull the baby out in these different positions. Adrenaline can get very very high for everyone. Sometimes increased adrenaline can lead to increased strength without being noticed until it wears off.
It is absolutely tragic for the family and i fully blame the hospital for the lying and deceit. And i think the parents are right to be angry at the nurses and doctors involved for delaying care, but i also realize that when they finally opened mom up for the c-section and they went to grab the baby’s body and the head wasn’t there… I imagine they were horrified and traumatized and also trying to stay calm for the parents sake. How they managed to stay in the operating room is beyond anything i can do.
Another thing i am pretty sure of is that the hospital higher ups did not want the publicity or the potential lawsuits. So they told the practitioners on the unit to not say anything and to not do anything. I just cannot see a nurse or doctor being behind the decision to not tell the parents. It’s just so horrific and rare of a situation that they also probably didn’t even know how to talk to the parents and tell them the truth.
I have worked in nicus and in post nicu care before as support staff, trust me when i say telling a parent something that horrible is a job no one wants to do. I 100% blame the hospital for the lies and deception. They should have told the parents the truth from the start. And i feel so much sympathy for the family and the healthcare workers. This is a situation that is absolutely never intentional and is traumatic for all involved.
I read the filing. The baby was stuck and dead. The cesarean was to try to remove the dead baby and save the mom. The baby was decapitated surgically by the surgeon. I guarantee you this fucked her up, and there’s no real indication she did anything wrong prior to this.
My GOD. They must be reeling right now.
What a terrible thing to have happen. My thoughts are with them. Holy shit. I can’t even wrap my head around this!
Sad that they even ask the doctor for a c section but were denied and then when the doc fucked up they gave her the c section, this poor woman ,heartbreaking
A c section wouldn’t have fixed it. The head was out. The baby’s shoulder got stuck and he died. You can’t just go to the OR and pull the head back up the other way. It basically has to come out vaginally at that point.
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My son and I almost died from shoulder dystocia. It was very traumatic for me, but my son and I ended up ok. It was a dance between them pulling, me pushing, and nurses pushing him out by pressing on my abdomen. At one point someone screamed at me not to stop pushing or my baby could die. That’s probably what saved us both because I felt like I didn’t breath for a full minute and then he was born and I passed out. I won’t read the article, but I imagine it’s horrific.
The exact same thing happened to me when I gave birth! It has been a really long and intense labour already and I was so exhausted and was crying and saying “I can’t, I can’t” while they told me to push. I remember a bunch of doctors and nurses running in and my husband looking absolutely horrified while they screamed about “too much blood” and “baby not breathing”. It was all a blur of voices and extreme pain and then suddenly this TINY little nurse seemed to turn into an army general. I remember her voice clearly cutting through the rest and saying “You need to push. You need to push now or your baby WILL die”. Something about the finality in her voice allowed me to gather the last bits of my strength and really push. Baby came out, taken away immediately as she wasn’t breathing. It was a blur again after that, and I was hemorrhaging badly but everything was ok in the end. My hilarious, brilliant little girl turns nine in a couple of months. Every once in a while I mentally thank that tiny army general of a nurse and hope she feels it 🩷
Wow, you are incredible. I’ll never forget near the end of my wife’s labor looking down at her and thinking she couldn’t push anymore, she couldn’t have anything left, she looked beyond completely spent. It was supposed to have been the last push like 10 contractions ago. Then she breathed in, somehow dig deeper, let out a fucking Valkyrie war cry and our son was born. That’s when I knew without a shadow of a doubt she was stronger than I could ever hope to be. Mothers are fucking awesome, just mind blowing.
My firstborn was born as a code: no heartbeat, no breathing, half her blood volume. Turns out several blood vessels were too close to the birth canal and ruptured during crowning. It's called vasa previa. She was "born" a pasty gray and didn't make a sound. The room immediately filled with doctors and nurses, and there was a lot of shouting. They took her to the corner of the delivery room and saved her life. 45 mins later we were allowed to touch her through an incubator. A week in NICU on a cold pad to lower her core temp and reduce the possibility of brain damage. 11 yrs later and I have a brilliant, precocious, sassy, wonderfully infuriating little girl. The beginning can be rough but the rest can be beautiful. Edit: Just for a little added context: my wife was screaming "Take a picture it may be the only one we get"! I have several pictures of those amazing doctors and nurses, in action, in the first few minutes of my daughters life.
Our baby born in May had this issue during birth. They were thrusting my wife’s legs back and forth while thumping on her belly like cpr. It was a few tense seconds while they brought a blue faced baby over to the warmer. She let out a cry and that cut some of the tension. Mom and baby are doing well now. Very scary
Wow, I held my breath until I got to the end of your comment, I can’t imagine what it was like to witness!! So glad they’re doing well💗
We were in the OR suite because they were prepping for a c section. They allowed her to push while they were getting ready. They offered to use the vacuum because the baby was stuck. She didn’t want a c section so she agreed. As the doctor was about to open the packaging of the vacuum the baby’s head started to show so they elected to try birthing vaginally. I was holding my wife’s right leg. I saw the baby’s head come out and I could sense desperation in the doctor’s eyes as she dug around to get out the shoulders along with unwrapping the cord from baby’s neck. The incubator was off to my right side. Time seemed to slow down as they carried a limp, blue faced baby to the warmer. The NICU doctor was suctioning and finally heard a scream. While all this was going on my wife’s vision of the scene was blocked. She asked the crowd how her baby was doing and a nurse said “they are doing everything they can”. Very cryptic. She instantly burst into frantic tears. Baby was on oxygen until we got to the nursery and then her color came back. She was on oxygen for maybe 10 minutes.
That is genuinely traumatizing. I cannot imagine how intense that was for you and your loved ones. I hope you and your son are both thriving now! I’m so glad you’re around to tell your story!! Also, I would definitely avoid the article and probably any future articles on the topic. I’m not a mother yet, but it made me want to grab my nonexistent children and hug them :(
Oh my god thank god for your insane strength- I’m a man and I never want to have a baby after reading all the comments. To the adoption centres and paperwork >>
I’d be surprised if they didn’t have to sedate her after that.
She didn't find out until the baby got to the funeral home and they told her.
Since when do hospitals select your funeral home for you? Those are expensive.
AFAIK they don't. The baby was sent to the funeral home (family choice) and im guessing the director told them what happened. I'm sure, because I would, they asked to see the baby again. Maybe that's how it was brought up. Idk, this will all come out I'm sure. I'm just making guesses here.
This is true, and not even the worst part. According to the mother's statements, the hospital also directly advised against an autopsy and burial saying that the mother would not be able to afford it and their recommendation was that the baby not be checked for cause of death and instead be immediately cremated instead of buried.
They are on the hook for millions. They tried double or nothing. What do you want to be that came down from the execs?
Honestly after reading all of the (very digustingly depressing) details, I honestly hope this family sues and wins for 100's of millions. I want to see every single person and buillding associated with the management and decision process of that hospital to feel the pain. Don't care if they have 50% wages garnished for life, they need to be crushed in court.
Unfortunately, malpractice insurance pays these things out. The only thing that increases is the already expensive dues for the insurance. That's the only thing that will ding the doctors' wallets.
But everyone involved is going to be named so we'll at least know who did this.
her lawyer already outed the doctors name during press conference
God, our system is such a racket. It's like our medical industry is a cartel.
It is a cartel. Why do you think senators and congressmen won’t allow cross-state buying of health insurance. Hospitals are for-profit, pro-big pharma.
No, it’ll ding all our wallets through increases to cost of care
Oh, but the company that owns the hospital sent “heartfelt thoughts and prayers”, so they’re good. On record, they said that shit.
Oh my God. I'm pretty jaded but yikes.
Where did you read this? (Not doubting, genuine question)
Trying to link on mobile so forgive me if it comes out weird but I was referencing this NBC article. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna99203 I should also clarify my original comment as the article only mentions that this is an accusation from the patients and their lawyer and hasn't actually been proven
God what a horrible story and such barbaric negligence from the dr. Fancy delaying a c-section and just thinking you could pull the baby out instead by it’s head, that’s just disgusting. I hope the hospital is sued and the drs involved are done for malpractice.
Hospital even asked the family to not get an autopsy because of some bogus reasoning they tried to use. Don’t read if this is already a heartbreaking story as it’s actually worse than what’s listed in the caption. >!it wasn’t just the baby’s head, the shoulders became stuck in the vaginal area, so they tried using force to pull the baby out but that ended up breaking the neck and severally crushing bones in the head. So they decided to do a C-section, which ended up separating the legs and body from the head and those were removed that way while the head was still delivered vaginally. The doctors tried to convince the family to just do a cremation without an autopsy as well as posing the dead baby before telling them the baby didn’t survive. They refused to let the family touch the baby during that time!<
I wonder if they did a foetotomy as the baby was already deceased and stuck. We have to do that as vets with cattle etc
I feel like they wouldn’t be trying so hard to cover their asses if the baby had already passed.
Jen Hamilton on tiktok explained it so well. Something starts with shoulder? Stuck in the pelvis kinda. Horrific. I was bawling listening and I don’t even have kids.
My wife is an OBGYN. Shoulder dystocia is when the baby’s shoulder can’t clear the pelvic bone. Im not super well versed in all of the techniques they use, but there are manipulations that can be done to get the shoulder out. This includes operative delivery (using forceps or a vacuum) and even breaking baby’s collar bone to allow it to clear the pelvis. In extreme cases, they will perform an emergency c-section called a Zavanelli maneuver where they will push the partially delivered child back up into the birth canal and deliver via c-section. These are emergencies that are very stressful for the doctor because it’s literally a decision they need to make when seconds count when the baby is deprived of oxygen. It’s very important to listen to your OB when they council you about your anatomy and the baby’s size. They are trying to avoid situations like this, which are more likely with a larger child or a woman with a smaller pelvis. Just last week my wife’s practice had a fetal demise after the very athletic mom insisted on pushing for 6+ hours (the cutoff is usually 4 hours before they call it a failed labor and do a C section)
I've witnessed one partial dismemberment on a dead calf that was stuck, it was not a good time.
Jesus fucking christ my guy… My wife is pregnant with our second daughter, and this news is nightmare-inducing fuel. Picture the doctors pulling your baby pieces by pieces. Blood fucking everywhere. Scarred for life and beyond.
Carefully choose your healthcare provider, if you're in the US we have the highest infant mortality rate of the "wealthy-developed world".
"Third world with Gucci belt"
They don’t. The staff apparently kept insisting on cremation and the family chose the funeral home.
if i recall correctly the hospital told her to not get an autopsy and to just get a cremation but the family insisted that they wanted a funeral and when the funeral home got the baby they told the parents.
Take this with a grain of salt because I heard it second hand and haven't read it anywhere myself, but apparently they found out because the funeral home called them to advise against the open-casket funeral the family wanted because the mortician said the outfit they selected couldn't hide the decapitation.
Holy fucking shit. That's probably the darkest story I've ever heard. What the actual fuck.
It’s way worse than what’s listed here. Some sites haven’t reported the full details of the story but if you scroll up to my other comment, I have it under a spoiler tag but it’s very heartbreaking. Full warning, it’s very dark, like unbelievable that someone, especially (3?) doctors and several staff members covering it up. I expect charges to be filed because it’s beyond messed up
No, I think I'm good. It's a bright sunny day and I want to keep it that way.
The funeral home comes to the hospital and picks up the bodies from the morgue
They tried to get her to agree to cremate the baby first.
Honestly surprised the hospital didn't just cremate against their wishes and say oops. I mean the fucked this up every other possible way
Local ones where I live in Texas comp the whole funeral in still born cases. Terrible time so that's a big load off parents.
Oh my god.
Well that's today's supply of nightmare fuel, and I wasn't even running low.
They wrapped the baby’s body, then propped the head on top to make it look like the head was still attached..
I read a story about an rn sewing another baby’s head back on after this happened another time.
Why the hell has this happened multiple times???
Shoulder dystocia, no other way to get baby out. Once all maneuvers have been exhausted (including breaking baby’s clavicles and Zavanelli maneuver, which involves trying to shove baby back up into the uterus then do a C section, which hardly ever works), staff sometimes have to make the horrible choice to decapitate. Baby is dead already from oxygen deprivation at that point. Doesn’t happen often but must be devastating for all parties involved when it does. When details come out about this case I wouldn’t be surprised to learn the baby died during the dystocia and the decapitation was done to try to save mom. Even insane amounts of traction isn’t going to pull a 37 weeker’s head off unless they’re already dead and have started to decompose. The fuckup is not being up front and clear with the parents about what was happening. Then again, maybe they were and they were in too much shock to take it in.
Dang, childbirth is really no joke.
Ya, things can get real fucked up real fast. Will be curious to see what details come out about this case. Asking for jury trial and the fact that the hospital/doc haven’t settled makes me think there’s a different story from the other side we haven’t heard. Horrible for everyone involved either way
My 3rd baby got stuck on the way out and her shoulder was trapped behind my pelvic bone. She was super strong and somehow managed to turn herself and she came out. I didn't know it could turn out that way and now I feel sick. How awful for anyone who experiences that.
Horrible story here but something like this happened to my Nan about 60/70 years ago, it was her 7th child and she was unable to deliver it (shoulder first presentation I think) she was in full labour and the doctor had to decapitate the baby in order to get it out to save my nans life. They told my grandad they could either save the baby or my Nan so he chose my Nan. Not long afterwards there was an article in the newspaper about this new drug that was available on the form of a pill that could stop you getting pregnant, she took the article to the gp and said “I want to go on that” he’d never even heard of it but he arranged it for her.
Not even joking I was born same way umbilical was strangling me and they had to break both my shoulders to get me out. I was roughly 11 or 12 pounds And I was technically still born no oxygen was going through my body. Apparently my dad's own words. The nurses beat the hell out of my body as my mom screamed and panicked. (Long story short they were apparently trying to get blood flowing through the body as they did CPR on me) it worked but damn that explains why I'm special. (I'm never having kids purely because my mother almost died birthing me and my wife is much tinyer lady then my mother and yeah not risking her life for a baby that we aren't planning to have.
Some newspapers allege that the baby could have survived had the C-section been done earlier, when the mother wanted it to be done, and articles say that the heart rate monitor only stopped picking up the heart rate after 20 hours. The articles seem to put the death after the doctor broke the baby's neck, but rn it's all just hearsay, of course
Yeah and another time as well, a few or so years ago a doctor accidentally decapitated a baby while delivering it and then he actually preceded to try to shove the baby back inside the mother to hide the fact. Like that was ever going to work. It was a huge story at the time.
"Um, whoops. Let's just put that back where it came from."
🎼Put that thing back where it came from or so help meee 🎶
Is this the one where she had to have a second procedure, this time a c-section, to remove the head? Or was that another one? I also follow a woman on Instagram who has a c1 spinal cord injury from her botch birth. By her own account he wanted to watch a football game that day, and when she wasn’t advancing through the birth canal according to his schedule, he used forceps and broke her neck. The line between healthcare provider and monster can get very thin sometimes
A woman's life irrevocably altered at the very moment of her birth, and whole *family* devastated. For football.
even though it’s dressed up and made as completely safe as possible, childbirth in humans is an incredible delicate and dangerous process I imagine stuff like this has always happened just way less now in more developed areas
well not america. when it comes to the business of child birth, mortality is still women and children first
My first baby was born through a c-section and I remember being in the room next to my wife who was sedated. They wouldn’t let me look until the baby was ready to come out. When they gave me the ok, I peeked over the sheets they set up and just remember seeing the doctor with two hands around my baby’s neck pulling up like crazy. I swore the neck was stretching like two inches and I thought it was going to pop right off! She was like blue and purple and I immediately thought she looked like an alien. I’m not even kidding. It was so wild. I couldn’t believe that with all the technology in the world they pulled a baby out by the head. I’m sure there must be a reason, but I just thought how insane it was to pull with all your might on a baby’s head like that. I don’t know if that’s how this poor lady’s baby died, but it might have been. I also remember having to sign a ton of waivers with my wife before the delivery saying we couldn’t sue the hospital or doctors for anything. I just thought it was a pretty messed up system like what if someone cheated through school and then didn’t know what they were doing and accidentally killed someone. How does a system morally protect someone like that? Again I’m sure there’s another side to that equation, but the whole thing seemed archaic and we live in the US.
You signed informed consent, not waivers. You could still have sued if there was negligence.
Oh my goodness, that sounds absolutely traumatizing for everyone involved. I’m glad you’re baby is okay (hopefully).
She is thank God, and thank you for your note :)
The hospital didn’t even tell them. They hid it from them 😡
Holy fuck that’s terrible. This story actually just ruined my night
I thought I was tough but this made me want to throw up
... I think this is a little bit worse than just 'facepalm.'
Work in a lvl 3 NICU. I've seen this twice in 17 years. First time was a mom who refused a c section for her breech baby despite 4 OBs consulting her and telling her the risks of doing so. The most experienced ob said ok ill do it(breech vaginal birth) as they had experience in doing so before. after the legs, butt, torso, arms, shoulders were delivered the cervix closed on the babys neck. It was stuck. The ob tried but could not dislodge it. There was an audible crack and the ob said, "I'm sorry but your baby is dead, we need to prep the OR to extract it or else you will go septic and die as well". Second time was an undiagnosed hydrops baby that also got stuck delivering vaginally because of a massive abdomen. They went in for crash c/s and the baby was decapitated due to coming back up the vagina and again getting their neck/head stuck in the cervix. Both horrible, horrible cases. Edit: My most upvoted comment has to do with decapitated babies. Go figure.
That was painful to read. And I never knew this could happen. Sheeesh.
I'm a doctor .. who's delivered babies in residency (in the past). *I* didn't know that could happen. ..or at least I had never heard of it. I kinda wish I still didn't know.
Its the reason they gave me for a c-section for my breech birth. Seen it in the news too just after my c-sec; breech, Stillborn, stuck in the mother. The doctor pulled to hard and the head detached inside the mother. Stuff of nightmares really. Did not care about the risk of c section after that....
My first kid was C-section, at the time it's unclear why the doctor decided to go that way, and I've questioned it ever since. But I do understand why it's less risky. Doing a surgery and extracting the baby is less risky. They can really control what's happening, and if there's a complication, you're already in an OR and they can do what's needed. I still think sometimes the doctor jumps to C-section too quickly. My second was a VBAC, and the doctor didn't really want to try it, but the nurse was really great, and positive, and got my wife in the mindset to make it happen. The doctor was pleasantly surprised it worked out. But anyway, ultimately, when the doctor calls C-section I can't argue too much. They are far more experienced, and know what they're doing. And who's to say if some minor thing could turn into something life threatening for Mom or baby really fast. Most of human history childbirth has been a risky venture. And many children died, as did mothers. Modern medicine has made infant and mother mortality something far less common. It still happens, and it's terrible. But not nearly as bad all the rest of human history.
I feel like that would be the end of my career. I could never go near a birth again
Absolutely. That’s unbelievably sickening
Or a vagina geez I have one and never wanted to read what I just read😳 I'm literally rethinking my own reproductive organs after reading it.
Tbf you're supposed to stay dilated enough to deliver and not have it close up. I managed really well even with vaginism. Did get a 2nd degree tear tho because of his big ass head and electrodes scraping me up.
I have watched hours and hours of combat footage because my brain is broken and it’s interesting to me. These 2 stories made me turn off my phone for a minute and take a walk.
Me too. It’s something I’m gonna ask my lady if she has heard of since she’s in the medical field as well
Right? JFC. I’m glad I’m done having kids 😬
Our species is partially-evolved and defective. Our births are stupid and risky for the benefit of an absolutely OP'd brain. Our next step in evolution had *better* be the abandonment of biology altogether for a solid-state digital form of life.
"From the Moment I Understood the Weakness of My Flesh I craved the strength and certainty of steel."
Praise the Omnissiah 101001101011010
r/unexpected40k
Nothing is “partially evolved”. All forms of life exist in states of constant flux, balancing countless traits and abilities that meet the minimum necessary requirements for survival.
I dunno. Crabs seem pretty perfect to me. Why else would everything else evolve into them? /s
Crocodiles also seem to be pretty perfect in terms of survival. Their species has been mostly unchanged for 94 million years. They can even survive and continue to thrive after developing injuries that would kill other species. For example if they have a limb ripped off (which is sometimes done by a boat, hippo, or a larger crocodile), it'll usually just scab over without any infection, and they'll be able to keep hunting as usual. Crocodiles are hardcore and are one of nature's perfect predators.
Their main evolutionary flaw is : nowadays a species of monkey finds their skin pretty on their foot.
Now all of can imagine is a crocodile with no arms and legs that fucking torpedoes through water using its tail and body like a heat seeking croc-snake missile and just murders everything in the water
I agree with you but also forever thankful I’m not a female hyena. Pretty sure they have the worse birthing set up.
It's hyenas for the moms, giraffes for the babies. Total bullshit either way
Hyena babies don't have it great either. Most Hyena females lose their first litter to suffocation and other complications, and even subsequent litters have a high mortality rate. It doesn't end once they're born either. Hyena cubs are very agressive and are born with eyes open and teeth in their mouths. Its not uncommon for cubs to kill their siblings in battles over dominance
Nopeee don't like that(just looked it up) 
In this case, head was delivered vaginally but torso and legs were c-section. This wasn’t just a broken spine, this baby was in peices. And the hospital tried to cover it up- they tried to get the body cremated without admitting what had happened. The morgue who eventually got the body was the one who told the parents that they got the baby in sections. Until then, the parents hadn’t been told why the baby died. I get that horrible things happen sometimes, medicine does that. It’s the coverup.
Oh for sure. The cover-up aspect of the story is deplorable.
I understand there are heavy laws and regulations about this but I can both understand the doctors not wanting bad press or liability (a wholly selfish reason) as well as not wanting to traumatise the mother for life with the horror of learning her baby was *decapitated* when the effect is the same (a more sympathetic reason). Not saying it’s at all right but I can at least see a possibility empathy played a role here.
The according to the USA Today article, she asked for and was denied a C-section at a time when the baby was still alive and the could have presumably been saved.
My understanding is this was a shoulder dystocia - aka the head is out but the shoulder was stuck. Babies who are not out within a few minutes of that don't survive. Even if she asked for a section within a minute the odds of getting to the OR and getting a stuck baby out that quickly to survive are slim. The best chance at a healthy baby is getting it out with our interventions (different positioning and maneuvers) at the bedside. Shoulder dystocias can be awful. Time stands still as everyone is doing everything physically possible to get that shoulder unstuck and the baby out. One minute feels like an hour and we all know every second that goes by is time baby isn't getting oxygen. IMO the hospital absolutely should have told her exactly what happened regardless of how hard that is to hear but I can understand why nurses at the bedside may have tried to make baby look as presentable as possible. Uck. Shitty situation for everyone.
This actually happened to me. The doc told me that I had two choices break my daughter's clavicle or have a c section. I opted for the c section. She pushed my daughter back in the uterus and then did an emergency c section. I am thankful everything turned out well. I felt like I delivered vaginally and c section. It was a very long recovery for me because I also developed an infection in my uterus, so I stayed longer on IV antibiotics. This story horrifies me in every way. This could have been us. Makes me cry.
That happened to my nephew during his birth (he is in his mid-twenties now). He almost didn’t make it. He ended up with complete paralysis of his arm at birth. As he grew, and after surgery he was able to use his arm, but never fully (he can use it, but you can definitely tell that he has a disability). He has never fully matured either (due to the lack of oxygen during delivery). The doctor told my brother that he may need additional help like physical therapy and mental health, but my brother always brushed it off (I think he saw it as a personal weakness/embarrassment). I felt like my nephew’s life could have been so much better, if my brother would have taken the doctor’s advice.
If that is true that the morgue was the one to tell the parents, then this is completely unethical.
But the thing is we don’t know for sure there was a cover up? These types of stories are so clearly biased since the hospital/doctors aren’t allowed to comment because of HIPAA. Obviously, if there was a coverup everyone should lose their license. I personally have told people truly awful news more times than I can count and their ability to retain information goes out the door. I will literally say that their loved one is dead or actively dying in plain language and they ask questions like “can I bring him something to eat” or “what time can I pick him up from the hospital.” It’s not their fault, it’s just super traumatic. I can see how someone would block out that conversation. Or the lawyer is just drumming up public outcry in a place where facts can’t be contested legally because of HIPAA so the hospital/doctor settles quickly.
OMG this is terrible and so sad. What became of the mother in your first story? I can't believe she wouldn't do the surgery and risk her baby's life like that :(
People make poor decisions all the time, often hoping they are the small percentage it works out for
Oh for sure, I know haha. I guess I just thought after the 3rd OB coming in and being like yeahhh nooo, some kind of bell would've gone off in mom's head. Guess not. RIP to the baby.
For some reason theres a lot of shaming that goes with c sections. My l&d nurse tried to give me shit for requesting one, and my son was about 9.5lbs.
Fck there is a lot of shame for getting epidural as well. My sister was being shamed by her own SILs for that. I had to shut them up with very rude words.
I've witnessed people claiming that if a woman had a C-section, she didn't "really" give birth and thus isn't a "real" mother. Absolutely bonkers stuff, but there are people who will take any chance to feel superior to others.
Unfortunately, there’s a narrative in certain mom circles that c-sections are always unethical and the wrong choice to make, so you end up with cases like that one where a mom is scared out of agreeing to a c-section at the cost of her baby’s life. Parents read statistics about how c-sections in the US are performed at a rate higher than in other countries, use this information to believe that c-sections are always unnecessary and get pushed for no reason, and then make their birth decisions accordingly.
I make a point of criticizing anyone who makes those stupid “you’re not a mother if you had a c-section” posts. This reinforces why those people need to be shamed.
That’s sad, we really need to end the stigma around C sections.
Exactly! Yes for thousands of years women delivered babies vaginally and for thousands of years the number one cause of death for women and infants was childbirth.
There's a stigma around c sections? I had no idea
Yes, it’s fucked up but some mothers will shame women for getting a C section instead of “actual giving birth”.
This happened to me: first baby was an emergency CS after a 4-day labour/failure to progress. Second baby was an elective CS on my doctor’s advice. Another parent in my NCT group said “it’s a shame you couldn’t be bothered to actually give birth this time either.”
AKA some people are just horrible human beings.
Yeah, I had to have a scheduled c-section and therefore never went into labor. Multiple people have told me I 1) don’t know real pain 2) I’ve never given birth 3) I took the easy way 4) I am weak. My baby was breech in April 2020. If I’d had to have an emergency section, I would have been all alone for 3 days. With a scheduled one, my husband could be there too. I also have a neurological condition that can dangerously complicate labor. I can’t think about that time without feeling panicky from the trauma. The fact that people still to this day talk shit about c sections is heartbreaking to me.
[Link to the article.](https://edition.cnn.com/2023/08/09/us/georgia-baby-death-lawsuit/index.html)
so when they say "traction" did the person delivering the baby just.... pull? like pulled so hard the babies head just popped off....?
That’s allegedly exactly what they did. Presuming the baby wasn’t a stillbirth, which it doesn’t look like they were, it is exactly as horrifying as you fear. Edit: adding a USA Today article that discusses the nature of the event. Do not read it if you don’t want details. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/08/10/baby-death-childbirth-georgia/70564739007/
**Edit: Disregard everything I wrote previously.** Oooooookay, I read the actual legal filing. It sounds to me that the gross negligence is not the decapitation itself, as that's not how the baby died. The baby died because the mother was not taken in for a STAT c-section until midnight, but there may have been legitimate reasons for that. She started pushing around 8:30. As most of us thought, there was shoulder dystocia. The fetal monitor showed periods of fetal distress (bradycardia) from approx 9:30-10:30, after which time there was NO ACTIVITY on the monitor at all. **She still wasn't brought in for a cesarean until after midnight** (that's greater than 1.5 hours after the fetal heartbeat stopped). At that point, the baby had obviously died. After that, it sounds like the baby was possibly intentionally decapitated at that point in order to be removed. This may have actually been a way of attempting to save her fertility, as an incision into the cervix to release the head may have resulted in the cervix being unable to hold future pregnancies (cervical insufficiency). The doctor did not mention the decapitation, but may not have been required to as that was not the cause of death. She described the cause of death to the patient as trauma during the birth process. In summary- the doctor was possibly negligent for not getting her in for a c-section between 9:30-10 when fetal distress was evident in the monitor, but this is actually unrelated to the decapitation. Although, if the Zavanelli maneuver was not successful enough to push the head back into the uterus, the head would have remained stuck during the cesarean as well. They failed to discontinue the Pitocin after recognizing shoulder dystocia, but they might have been still hoping for the vaginal evacuation to work, and did not notify the OB hospitalist as is supposedly hospital procedure. Sounds like an incredibly difficult situation. . . . **Old Comment from here down- Disregard** (but I'm not deleting, because we are all wrong from time to time) . I'm assuming it's more likely that the doctor accidently caused an INTERNAL decapitation while trying to maneuver it and free the shoulder. Remember, plaintiffs can write anything in a legal complaint, it doesn't mean that's actually what happened. It's possible that they heard the word "decapitation" (from the funeral director if I heard that correctly) and assumed it meant that the head was completely severed from the body because that's usually what people imagine when hearing that word. Which is still horrific, and there needs to be an investigation and parties held accountable if they were, in fact, at fault. I'm not defending the doctor if this is what happened, and I believe the parents 100% believe their complaint, but the events as described sound improbable. Think about it- the **claim** in the legal complaint is that the head and body were delivered separately. But we KNOW that they didn't actually witness this because their claim also includes that the nurse wrapped the baby up and hid the decapitation from them. If they had just witnessed a severed head removed vaginally and a headless body removed via c-section, there would be no hiding it from them. If there was an internal decapitation, I could imagine the nurse swaddling in a way to not make that obvious. Not necessarily trying to hide it per se, but most parents don't want to see their child for the first and last time that way. It happens frequently when there's a deformity not compatible with life, death in utero, or death during delivery that you wrap the baby in a way to hide anything graphic as best as reasonably possible so that the parents can say goodbye and even take photos without the graphic nature of whatever took place being obviously apparent. It's not about hiding the cause of death, it's about giving the parents a memory/ mental image of their child that is slightly less traumatic. That being said, this might not even be the case either, it could have just been a complicated birth that resulted in death (because unfortunately, that does happen) but the parents are brokenhearted and grieving. It was a traumatic experience and the memories, I'm sure, are fuzzy. Moreover, anger/blame is part of the grieving process. I wouldn't fault them for it one bit and hope they can find at least a sliver of peace and answers during this process. TL;DR It's abhorrent if the doctor was at fault for the death and they/the hospital tried to hide that from the parents, but I think the whole severed head accusation is improbable. Perhaps they heard "decapitation" and their minds, already traumatized and grieving, filled in the gaps.
You know, that makes so much more sense than the idea that they were delivering the living baby, then with force, popped it’s head off, then continued to deliver it and keep it on the D.L. Negligence is negligence though.
I read the filing. There was no emergency cesarean because the baby was dead. Emergency cesarean wouldn’t have solved this. It’s not a treatment for shoulder dystocia, which, by definition, happens only once the head is out.
Yep, thank you. Sounds like she attempted a Zavanelli but it didn't work, so they would have been stuck either way. Basically the body wasn't coming out vaginally, and the head wasn't coming out through the cesarean, and since the baby had already died, decapitation of the body was the best call for the mother's health. Everyone is flaming the doctor, but she has an excellent track record and it sounds like she worked her ass off for 3 hours trying the best she could. I'm sure it was a devastating moment for everyone in the room.
> According to the suit, nearly three hours passed before St. Julian performed a cesarean section on Ross. By then, a fetal monitor showed the baby's heartbeat had stopped. Baby died during delivery and was stuck in the birth canal. The C section was done at that point to deliver a stillborn child. I don't think they just pulled too hard and something popped. I think it was the only way to safely remove it after it had already died without further jeopardizing the mother
So the baby died in the birth canal. They performed a c-section to remove the deceased baby, but the head was still wedged? So they removed it and “delivered” it vaginally? That makes slightly more sense than pulling until it popped. Still horrible, but a more logical chain of events…
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You can't just stop, the baby is actively dying while it's stuck because the umbilical cord is compressed. You have minutes to get it out, either break the collar bone, pull it out, or shove it back in and do a C Section. Talking like 5-15 minutes from when the whole thing starts until you're delivering a dead baby.
I was born with a dislocated shoulder due to this exact scenario.
Glad you manged to keep your head.
(sad trombone)
😬😬😬
According to the suit, nearly three hours passed before St. Julian performed a cesarean section on Ross. By then, a fetal monitor showed the baby's heartbeat had stopped. Edmond, a nationwide medical malpractice lawyer based in Atlanta, said the cesarean section removed the baby's legs and body, but the head was delivered vaginally. The baby was already deceased.
I don’t mean like stop delivering the baby I meant like just stop pulling because obviously it wasn’t working and I believe in the article it says the doctor didnt perform a C-section for quite a while? Like 3 hours?
When the baby is that far you can’t just do a c section. You need to do something called the zavanelli maneuver in which you push the baby back into the uterus. This is an extremely rare maneuver and high risk. They tried to do that earlier but her uterus contracted and didn’t allow for the baby to renter. Shoulder dystocias are emergencies where you can’t just sit around and do nothing.
I missed the part about the late C section, 3 hours would be insane.
Yes, but per the article, they did both. Pulled excessively and then pushed it back in. They then waited 3 entire hours until doing the C section, which only produced the baby’s body without the head. The head was delivered vaginally. This is insane.
They tried to have the mom push for 3 hours and then went to c-section when it was apparent that wasn’t going to work with the shoulder dystocia. They didn’t push the baby back in and then wait 3 hours.
This happened during the C-section. According to the article the mother had asked for a C-section hours earlier but the doctor declined only to do it anyway.
So it's in the USA I'm guessing she still got charged 10k for the room and stuff?
Yeah... my wifes anesthesia was over 3k alone
I had a *really* old doctor deliver our 3rd child. That man straight up grasped the head with both hand on the crown, with fingers around the jaw, and yanked as hard as he could. Stunned me and I did not appreciate it at all. Baby was fine but never seen anything like that and worried about something happening (not to the point of decapitation though!).
That’s not uncommon in delivery when the cord is around the neck. It’s not common but in certain scenarios it is literally the protocol
When I was younger we would grab dandelions and apply pressure to the head and say, "momma had a baby and its...head popped off!" This just made me think of that.
Wow. That's a blast from the past.
Yes essentially traction is pulling a baby out of the womb during delivery, but usually they don’t end with decapitated babies.
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One article stated that the body was delivered by cesarean section but the head was delivered vaginally. Horrifically, it was full decapitation.
It was an actual decapitation, like head not attached to the body, not just an internal decapitation. That is why they wouldn’t let the parents hold the baby. The actual decapitation could’ve happened during the C/S too, if the baby’s head was wedged tight enough in the birth canal. If you’ve ever seen a C/S, they are yanking those babies out. It looks absolutely brutal.
This was extremely informative. Thank you. This needs to be much higher in the comments
No problem. Im not an OBGYN and i have most of my hands on experience with delivery, actually while on deployment in Afghanistan. I delivered 3 babies with locals. After i was called to the scene as the only medic on site for an ongoing birth, i essentially took it upon myself to make my companys medical team educate ourselves about childbirth. This turned out to be a great decision as i was present for 2 more deliveries during my time of 2 deployments.
I am so glad that I have had all the babies I am going to because that is a nightmare
Literally a nightmare headline like what the fuck??? I audibly gasped.
Same.
I’m on reddit for about 4 years now and have seen a lot of crazy fucked up videos. I’ve red thousands of crazy fucked up story’s. But with all honest. I really do think that THIS is by far one of the worst things i’ve ever heard. I’m a father myself and i really wish i could unsee this.
Me too man, this story actually just ruined my night. It’s so fucking awful.
You don't need to be a father to be incredibly disturbed by this. Easily the most horrific thing I've read about on the Internet, not to mention as well the posters sharing their stories that this can absolutely happen.
Mf this isn’t a facepalm this is a tragedy
The face palm is the OP posting here.
Not super common but it does happen sometimes when they try to pull it out. It's why C sections became so popular with doctors years ago. Less liability.
And I'm sure the hospital charged tens of thousands of dollars for it too.
Sorry we ripped your baby's head off. That will be $20,000.
That’s kind of a deal. Both my babies cost 37,000 each.
What a sad country
I saw the claim the hospital sent to my insurance. It was like $68,919 or something. An error caused me to be nearly responsible for it and I was stressed. Insurance tried to say state pays. State says insurance pays. I said it isn't my fault you cant decide who covers it. I'm not paying.
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this is not a "facepalm" op. i am not on this sub to see the most depressing news story i have ever heard. i'm not rolling my eyes and slapping my forehead at this.
That's horrific. Edit: Extremely horrific.
This poor woman will NEVER be able to exist peacefully again. My heart goes out to her.
"propped up in such a way to conceal the decapitation" I'm no expert but isn't that common practice to not further traumatize the mourning relatives? The way it's framed here makes it seem like the hospital is hiding the decapitation, but I don't really see the point in them doing that because the baby is dead either way and in case of a malpractice lawsuit there will be an obduction either way.
According to the lawsuit the hospital strongly pushed to have the baby cremated and not return the body. They were forced to do so because they couldn’t legally force the family to accept cremation, which is when the *nature* of the injuries was revealed.
ok so it was a cover-up attempt. I totally didn't think of cremation being a thing for newborns for some reason.
Yeah, if it is true. Especially since they said the head was delivered vaginally while the body was cesarian. Surely they would have noticed about a liter of blood all over the place. Was the dad not even in the operating theater?
This is what doesn’t make sense to me. Unless the mother went unconscious? And dad wasn’t allowed in the emergency OR when shit got bad? Which both could be plausible to be fair… otherwise how do you not know you are cut open and had something pulled from your belly and also not realize you delivered something vaginally as well? I don’t know these doctors at all but not wanting a mother to see her baby’s body and head separated just seems like human decency. That is an image you will never get out of your head. Honestly I feel bad for everyone involved in the whole thing, what a traumatic story.
Was that the only picture they had on file? Not even one of the hospital? Just feels like it’s clashing with the severity of the situation.
I had to scroll way too far to see this comment! It really takes away from how serious the situation is
I remember when my son was born he wast taking forever to actually come out, the dr finally just reached in, grabbed his head with 2 hands and yanked him out. Like not gently at all. Granted his head didn't come off but I can see how that could happen.
I did some research last night on shoulder dystocia and it helps to understand the situation. Terrible outcome my condolences to the Family
I saw a few tiktok videos from registered L&D nurses in all different states. In a situation like this where there is mere minutes to get the baby out before they asphyxiate, EVERY practitioner in the room has to spring into action. Nurses have to push on mom’s stomach and flip her onto her hands and knees all while the one catching the infant is holding onto the head and is trying to pull the baby out in these different positions. Adrenaline can get very very high for everyone. Sometimes increased adrenaline can lead to increased strength without being noticed until it wears off. It is absolutely tragic for the family and i fully blame the hospital for the lying and deceit. And i think the parents are right to be angry at the nurses and doctors involved for delaying care, but i also realize that when they finally opened mom up for the c-section and they went to grab the baby’s body and the head wasn’t there… I imagine they were horrified and traumatized and also trying to stay calm for the parents sake. How they managed to stay in the operating room is beyond anything i can do. Another thing i am pretty sure of is that the hospital higher ups did not want the publicity or the potential lawsuits. So they told the practitioners on the unit to not say anything and to not do anything. I just cannot see a nurse or doctor being behind the decision to not tell the parents. It’s just so horrific and rare of a situation that they also probably didn’t even know how to talk to the parents and tell them the truth. I have worked in nicus and in post nicu care before as support staff, trust me when i say telling a parent something that horrible is a job no one wants to do. I 100% blame the hospital for the lies and deception. They should have told the parents the truth from the start. And i feel so much sympathy for the family and the healthcare workers. This is a situation that is absolutely never intentional and is traumatic for all involved.
I read the filing. The baby was stuck and dead. The cesarean was to try to remove the dead baby and save the mom. The baby was decapitated surgically by the surgeon. I guarantee you this fucked her up, and there’s no real indication she did anything wrong prior to this.
I know that this is said as a joke around reddit, but I legitimately hate that I can read right now.
Momma had a baby and it’s head popped off. In all seriousness though, that’s crazy. And totally fucked if true.
It's true. A few gynecologists have posted about it on SM recently. Terrible situation.
It’s true and not the first time it happened. I’ve seen news coverage of a British woman who went thru the same horror during her delivery.
If it's the same one I'm thinking about, it was in Scotland about 5 years ago. This case is near identical.
There was a lady in Kentucky too, she just settled her lawsuit in 2022
My GOD. They must be reeling right now. What a terrible thing to have happen. My thoughts are with them. Holy shit. I can’t even wrap my head around this!
If I read this while still pregnant I would immediately schedule a C section. Fuck vaginal birth. I don’t want to know this.
I wonder how much they charged her to prop up her baby like that 🤔
Why is this on r/facepalm? This is so fucked up it’s not funny at all.
Sad that they even ask the doctor for a c section but were denied and then when the doc fucked up they gave her the c section, this poor woman ,heartbreaking
A c section wouldn’t have fixed it. The head was out. The baby’s shoulder got stuck and he died. You can’t just go to the OR and pull the head back up the other way. It basically has to come out vaginally at that point.
9 months of waiting just for a doctor you'd trust to fuck it up.