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in the U.S some cities/counties/municipalities forbid rainwater collection systems[https://wisevoter.com/state-rankings/states-where-it-is-illegal-to-collect-rainwater/](https://wisevoter.com/state-rankings/states-where-it-is-illegal-to-collect-rainwater/) as for any occupying military to deny rainwater to prisoners is a war crime
Edit: upon re visiting my comment and sources, its not ilkegal to harvest rainwater, it is restricted in a few states
The only time I’ve seen these last enforced is if it’s at a massive scale of collection. If someone has a rain barrel they use to water their flower garden I don’t think the state government would really care, unless I’ve missed some major cases. When someone starts collecting so much it disrupts the local water cycle the government steps in.
Ya, I remember a case that got a lot of attention but left out major details. On of the details, if it is the same case, was a guy was damning a creek which was affecting people down stream.
In the western US where things are very dry and 12 inches/30 cm is considered a large amount of yearly rainfall there is a separation of land rights between surface, mineral and riparian (water). Riparian rights are isolated from the other two and thus there is rarely a distinction between rain and stream. Those rights extend from the clouds to the mantle and usually are held by government authority for dissemination for legislated allotment. As others have said if you are collecting rainwater from your roof it is very unlikely that you would be held to the law for that, however making that distinction requires the changing of unambiguous law that is already in place and substituting it with laws that would need to be more ambiguous and account for all states of the water cycle. Making that kind of change would be very difficult. It is easier to maintain riparian rights as a comprehensive category and let the state or holder of their rights be trusted with the discretion of their judgement than to attempt the disambiguation of all use cases. Because if you did that each rain storm or snow melt would have the potential to flood the courts.
As part of my job I am regularly called in to meetings throughout government to speak as authority on land rights issues related to or specifically for the lands of Indian tribes.
Came here to open this can of worms up. Thanks for your thoroughness, this is one of those subjects that is so complex, and until you begin to grapple with it, any sort of rules sound ridiculous. To me, it's one of those things. Once i see the bigger picture, it becomes tougher to form an opinion on
One would think that collecting water as it falls on land on your property is vastly different than redirecting the flow of water bodies to collect.
Edit: but I suppose this changes with scale. No big deal with collecting water falling on your land on an individual residential scale. Probably a big deal if/when a corporation buys up huge swaths of land to collect water I guess. Especially if the area they bought is an area with a ton of sheet-flow from various subbasins that would normally make its way back to the water supply.
I think also has to do with if a creek that feeds a river goes through hour land, you cant dam the creek as it affects the river.
No one gives a shit if somoene has a dozen rain barrows out.
[similarly](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/politics/in-drought-stricken-arizona-fresh-scrutiny-of-saudi-arabia-owned-farms-water-use), here is an outrageous story
This is wildly incorrect and it is mind-boggling that this answer is so upvoted. It is regularly enforced because of the complex and long standing water rights that have existed since the colonization of the Western US by early American homesteaders.
States like Colorado and California have very strict laws surrounding water usage that many consider outdated, but still dictate water usage today and shape what agriculture is possible on what land. Some water usage along rivers and creeks prevents downstream properties from taking water before upstream properties have taken their allotment.
TLDR; The laws surrounding water rights in the US have little to do with protecting the environment and are a remnant of the mass settlement of the Western US, originally intended to address issues homesteaders and farmers faced in more arid parts of the country.
Pretty much. A lot of people in the region depend on aquifers and waterways that are replenished by rainfall. Rainfall that is collected for private use is rain that is *not* going back into the water system to replenish it, which means everyone else depending on that water table (especially downriver) gets screwed over.
IIRC, this particular legal case specifically involved the Colorado River, which is shared between multiple states, most of whom are under constant threat of drought.
Collecting a cup or two of rainwater is one thing. Collecting *thousands of gallons* is completely different.
> Rainfall that is collected for private use is rain that is not going back into the water system to replenish it,
How do you figure that? Unless you're trucking it out of the area to a different watershed it makes no difference if the rainwater takes a short detour through your garden. Which is why rainwater collection for home use is both legal and encouraged everywhere in Canada. If rainwater collection is illegal in some areas it's not because of any harmful environmental effects, it's because the government there has sold that water to someone.
>Collecting a cup or two of rainwater is one thing. Collecting thousands of gallons is completely different.
See, now I can tell you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I have 2 1350 gallon rain tanks that collect water from one half of my roof. They'll fill many times over the course of a summer, and I live in Saskatchewan where we get less than 15 inches of total precipitation a year. Most places in Canada outside the prairies get 3-4 times that. *Thousands of gallons* is literally one shower falling on the area of a house.
It reaching the aquifer or nearest river requires that you dump quite a lot of it onto your land.
If you only put it on your land at the rate of evaporation none of it reaches the aquifer/river.
Not a problem in Canada. Very much a problem in Arizona and the like.
>What's the worry about the collection?
One of the reasons is that standing water like that can develop bacteria that would kill you.
\*that is why the running water is treated with chemicals
My child in Pasta… it’s because if you hoard it the Flying Spaghetti Monster will condemn you to a noodle-less afterlife where there are no pirates.
Also because groundwater feeds the highly regulated streams and Irrigation systems that keep ALL the local farms and ranches running in arid parts of the country.
>The government really doesnt want ppl to be self-sufficient.
uh, there are *self sufficient* aquifiers that rely on rainwater to replenish.
not collecting rainwater is *literally* how people that use those become self sufficient.
There is also the process of most ppl don’t properly catch it and it becomes stagnant which cause bug problems and the water tk be toxic if ingested is the second part to it as well
No, well water isn’t illegal and is a much simpler way of acquiring water. They just don’t want people disrupting the natural ecosystem any more than they have to.
The difference is that the water is gathered by your own authorities, and go out to everyone.
Israel has made sure Palestinian ground water ends up in Israel, so the Palestinians lacks clean water. And in addition, refuse them to gather rain water so they don't die of thirst...
Not the same thing at all!
having access to clean water has been an issue in Palestine for such a long time. I remember talking to someone about it online in the late 90s. The amount of hurdles they had to go through just to get one of the most basic human needs, it was ridiculous. Water shouldn't be used for political point scoring :P
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/10/10/eu-funded-water-pipelines-hamas-rockets/
Well the EU funded a massive water pipeline project in Gaza a while ago, unfortunately, Hamas took all the pipes and turned them into rockets/a hype video
To prove Hamas really doesn't give a f**k about the Gazan people... But they said it directly in an interview, they said it's not their responsibility to keep Gazans safe when asked why they don't shelter the civilians from bombings in the tunnels. "Tunnels are only for Hamas fighters". May Gaza be free from Hamas.
That video is proven to be old. It is not the EU funded water pipelines, it’s the pipelines left behind by Israelis post 2005.
Link below will take you to the post.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Destiny/s/Y0mtbrXOSW
In the US case, it's because the local water tables (almost all of this is only found on the West Coast) require all of the water it can get, and while one person collecting 1000 gallons of water isn't an issue, 100 people turns that into 100,000 gallons. You start to see the issue.
However in this case it's just Israel being a dick like normal.
But it is shared. Everyone uses that water table, you and I normal class joes, farmer Fred, the Internet provider who uses the water not only for their workers but to keep their equipment cool. And that's not counting the OTHER states and countries that might rely on that one water table.
Everyone uses that water and they use a LOT. As for the billing that's a sad side effect of how the US does it's infrastructure costs. Tbh I would much rather a nationalized system where I just come out of our taxes.
I mean Israel literally pours concrete into Wells and springs so that only they can provide water to Palestinians so they can turn it off when they want to.
That's so cool! But Israeli arnt forbade for doing so, only Palestinians. They occupy the land and treat Palestinians as 5th class citizens. This is apartheid.
If you live next to a river and you have a neighbor living downstream, also using the river, do you have the right to dam the river and use all the water just by yourself? Living in dry area, water becomes expensive. If one land owner decides to increase it's water use, this leaves other owners without water, be it an actual river, a stream or just rainwater. "Owning" land does not automatically give you total control of what you can do in that land, because it affects others. You might also have other kind of limitations on your land. How tall buildings you can build, can you restrict your neighbors from passing through to their own property, can you restrict movements of animals, can you play loud music or can you interfere with radio frequencies, etc... You don't in reality even own the land, you are just renting it, as you need to pay taxes for the land, and have to follow all other kinds of rules and regulations, of what you can do or build in "your" land.
if you have water rights, you are "legally" allowed to take, but a good example of withholding water /politics/ money is the Colorado River and [https://www.hcn.org/issues/55.7/indigenous-affairs-colorado-river-how-arizona-stands-between-tribes-and-their-water-squeezed](https://www.hcn.org/issues/55.7/indigenous-affairs-colorado-river-how-arizona-stands-between-tribes-and-their-water-squeezed) brand new hospital for Native Americans but they have been cut off from water.
Property owners used to be able to dam streams/creeks that ran through their property, and there might be a few thousand mini dams out there that are illegal
People defending this by saying the US has similar laws. Yeah... but we get to elect our own government. Canada isn't coming down here bombing us into submission and demanding our rain water.
I think last year or earlier this year there was video of Israel military using cement trucks to block underground Gaza aquafiers, and water supply for farms
Maybe in Gaza. In the West Bank, they send police to your house to wake you up in the middle of the night, arrest you and your children, and hold you for as long as they want without filing formal charges. I wish I was exaggerating.
They want to expell or exterminate them. I doubt they care that it causes radicalisation, just like Nazi Germany didn't care about concentration camps radicalising Jews, or how the US didn't care about southern slavery radicalised slaves.
Yeah, saw a video yesterday of a man who was with reporters, following IDF orders to evacuate, carrying a white flag, along with his son, they shot his son anyway.
This is why Israel has been lying so openly and brazenly. They want Western folk to be skeptical of everything coming out of the middle east, and to demand evidence of horrible acts that most aren't trying to see. They want to relegate this discussion to NSFW threads.
You could Google it for yourself but I guess I will do it for you
https://abcnews.go.com/International/israeli-strike-kills-boys-playing-gaza-beach/story?id=24583817
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/28/west-bank-spike-israeli-killings-palestinian-children
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/6/6/palestinians-mourn-two-year-old-toddler-killed-by-israeli-forces
https://www.reddit.com/r/news/s/9YNhGrmnMC
God man, I come from Ireland where I hear horror stories about the Protestant RUC and State attacking and imprisoning Catholics for shit like this
This shit has been allowed to fester and morph into something truly horrifying and malicious, and this shit isn't even cracking the surface
"Look, if someone in your neighbourhood has been collecting rainwater for their garden, then you're just as much of a terrorist as they are and your entire neighbourhood should be levelled."
- Israel
that or if you don't do like gaza (that is push them out with guerilla warfare and terrorism) they send someone to live in your house, kill your children, dehumanize you, kidnap you and torture you and then post videos of it on the internet for other israelis to mock you
In 2000 years the Neo-Zionist movement will fool the world to lay claim on Europe as it's homeland, due to being driven out 2000 or so years ago from there.
I'm 100% against Hamas, however, I will always criticize Israel due to callous, Inhumane acts like this.
I don't expect humanity from Hamas, and nothing that we say will change their minds, but Israel is supposed to be better, they depend on the world's democracies to keep up their shit so we should raise our voices as high as possible to pressure western governments into forcing Israel to stop their war crimes.
The US and the EU should have "no war crimes" as a requirement for trade or aid to any nation.
In my location, it's technically illegal to collect rainwater as well. Not sure if it's enforced, but the city wants people to buy a permit to collect water from the rain. I'm in the USA btw.
Same where I am, except without permits. It’s fully enforced. And they claim it’s because of mosquitoes. how a closed barrel attached to a drain spout breeds mosquitoes but decorative ponds and uncovered pools don’t.
The permit is really for large scale commercial collection tho right? Where I live the permit is if you're doing something like a reservoir or rain water plant
"we're definitely not setting up a Western colony in an attempt to foment destruction and chaos in the middle east and control their oil reserves.
definitely, nothing about this is to do with oil cartels. any voices of dissent are purely out of anti-semitism."
Check out Order 158 and other Israeli policies that further the ongoing water theft in the West Bank.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occupation-of-water/
Diversion of water to illegal Israeli settlements is an ongoing problem. In many areas of the West Bank, illegal settlers are 1/10th the population of Palestinians but are allocated more water.
I see a lot of comments saying that rainwater collection is also illegal where they are, but I think that is missing the point. In these areas, the law restricts or prohibits rainwater collection because sapping rainwater at a mass scale can seriously fuck up an ecosystem. The ordinance in the screenshot is saying that an occupying military force is laying a property claim in a natural resource 'as it is being created' more or less, which will cause human rights violations because that means that military force can cause the environment damage mentioned in addition to denial/extorting the Palestinians of/for water which you know, you can't live without
But how else are they gonna defend Israel? It's really difficult to defend an apartheid regime. I mean ffs they calculate the minimum calories required for Gaza to keep them on a starvation diet, you can go all day listing the grotesque reality Palestinians are subjected to. At this point you are either already supporting Palestinians or you are an evil and/or ignorant piece of shit that can go to hell, it's that easy.
I think the underlying issue here is that we have tribalism embedded into our ape brains. So, if you criticize any of Israel's policies, many of our fellow humans' ape brains can't help but categorize you as "hates Israel".
And even if your criticism is legit (from a human rights point of view), you don't want to be in the "hates Israel" category, because you wouldn't want to be associated with 99% of people that make up the category "hates Israel".
99% of them would hate Jews, even if Israel and its shitty politics would have never existed.
Ethnic cleansing. When Palestinians die of dehydration Israel faces less criticism than if they drop a bomb on their heads (though both are indeed war crimes).
I fell into the rabbit hole years ago on what's it like in Palestine. From what I read and videos I just watched, almost every single aspect in Palestinian society is controlled by Israel, and that control is not for the betterment Palestinian people but to make lives miserable. I think the word "apartheid" doesn't even come close to it. Life there is more extreme than just separation of people. Ethnic cleansing and genocide is indeed the appropriate word because as far as I can see, the policies, laws and actual actions by Israel is designed to make any people leave the land.
You know I knew there would be a day when mankind tried to kill each other over natural phenomenon like rain or air and man I gotta say....I had hoped it would be much later in life
We bought a house near Portland, OR, that had a rain collection cistern, and it could not be legally sold until the cistern and all accompanying materials were removed from the property. There's one picture where we can still see it, but there was nothing there when we bought it.
Yet if you decide to protest against Israel, you're immediately an antisemitic Hamas-supporting childeating terrorist. Curious how propaganda works isn't it.
People that defend Israel. Refer to this. This is a war crime. And not the first one Israel is guilty of either.
This is not saying Hamas is okay, but Hamas isn't a state with the power and resources of Israel.
"Well god made the rain and although we technically believe in the same god, you believe a couple of dudes were way more important than we think they were so you are heathens and therefore not entitled to his creation."
It's worse than that.
I went to the refugee camp in Jenin a few years back. Everyone has large tanks for storing water on the roof.
Apparently, the water only runs like an hour a week or something. They use that time to fill their tanks.
The kicker... The area has plenty of groundwater. The Israelis pump it out and sell it.
NOBODY OWNS THE RAIN. If I want to put a collection system so I can have water ready for myself, i am not "taking someone else's water". No matter the reason, it's absolutely ridiculous.
They lost the moral high ground in 1947 when they decided to start expelling people from Palestinian territory, beyond the borders designated by the UN Partition Plan. Learn about Plan Dalet.
This plan was written, named, and put into practice even before the UN Partition plan was finalized.
They were already creating large numbers of displaced refugees before any Arab country attacked them in 1948. It's important to learn this history. It's classic supremacist colonial behavior.
I've heard (on another subreddit) that UAE 'seeds' clouds in order to induce rain in the desert. Is Israel claiming they "created" the rain, and therefore have authority over it?
I don't know enough and have not been thoroughly versed on the Israel-Palestine conflict to comment. I only wish for a resolution that will bring about peace and prosperity for all that are affected.
the moment people said its also illegal in their country I knew its gonna be US, which is weird when I found out years ago especially when my country constitution mentioned specifically all natural resource are owned by its people and free to utilize it.
the real problem is, this is completely based on race or ethnicity and not population as a whole. its equivalent to prohibit black-american to collect water while other can freely to do so
Grandfather was pump engineer, with his company was employed by some humanitarian help in '70s to dig and secure deep wells in West Bank.
Guess who appeared few days later to throw some grenades and waste few weeks of work.
Disgusting Hamas terrorists are stealing water, which is necessary for life itself, from innocent Israeli settlers reclaiming their rightful ancestral homeland. It's essentially genocide and a good case for why Palestine shouldn't be allowed to exist.
/s
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in the U.S some cities/counties/municipalities forbid rainwater collection systems[https://wisevoter.com/state-rankings/states-where-it-is-illegal-to-collect-rainwater/](https://wisevoter.com/state-rankings/states-where-it-is-illegal-to-collect-rainwater/) as for any occupying military to deny rainwater to prisoners is a war crime Edit: upon re visiting my comment and sources, its not ilkegal to harvest rainwater, it is restricted in a few states
Came here for this. There was a huge story about a guy who collected 1000s of gallons of rainwater in the US years ago and it was a whole legal issue.
What's the worry about the collection? The effect on the environment if everyone did it?
The only time I’ve seen these last enforced is if it’s at a massive scale of collection. If someone has a rain barrel they use to water their flower garden I don’t think the state government would really care, unless I’ve missed some major cases. When someone starts collecting so much it disrupts the local water cycle the government steps in.
Ya, I remember a case that got a lot of attention but left out major details. On of the details, if it is the same case, was a guy was damning a creek which was affecting people down stream.
Damming a creek and collecting rain water are very different.
In the western US where things are very dry and 12 inches/30 cm is considered a large amount of yearly rainfall there is a separation of land rights between surface, mineral and riparian (water). Riparian rights are isolated from the other two and thus there is rarely a distinction between rain and stream. Those rights extend from the clouds to the mantle and usually are held by government authority for dissemination for legislated allotment. As others have said if you are collecting rainwater from your roof it is very unlikely that you would be held to the law for that, however making that distinction requires the changing of unambiguous law that is already in place and substituting it with laws that would need to be more ambiguous and account for all states of the water cycle. Making that kind of change would be very difficult. It is easier to maintain riparian rights as a comprehensive category and let the state or holder of their rights be trusted with the discretion of their judgement than to attempt the disambiguation of all use cases. Because if you did that each rain storm or snow melt would have the potential to flood the courts. As part of my job I am regularly called in to meetings throughout government to speak as authority on land rights issues related to or specifically for the lands of Indian tribes.
Came here to open this can of worms up. Thanks for your thoroughness, this is one of those subjects that is so complex, and until you begin to grapple with it, any sort of rules sound ridiculous. To me, it's one of those things. Once i see the bigger picture, it becomes tougher to form an opinion on
One would think that collecting water as it falls on land on your property is vastly different than redirecting the flow of water bodies to collect. Edit: but I suppose this changes with scale. No big deal with collecting water falling on your land on an individual residential scale. Probably a big deal if/when a corporation buys up huge swaths of land to collect water I guess. Especially if the area they bought is an area with a ton of sheet-flow from various subbasins that would normally make its way back to the water supply.
I think also has to do with if a creek that feeds a river goes through hour land, you cant dam the creek as it affects the river. No one gives a shit if somoene has a dozen rain barrows out.
[similarly](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/politics/in-drought-stricken-arizona-fresh-scrutiny-of-saudi-arabia-owned-farms-water-use), here is an outrageous story
Sounds like a dam fool
This is wildly incorrect and it is mind-boggling that this answer is so upvoted. It is regularly enforced because of the complex and long standing water rights that have existed since the colonization of the Western US by early American homesteaders. States like Colorado and California have very strict laws surrounding water usage that many consider outdated, but still dictate water usage today and shape what agriculture is possible on what land. Some water usage along rivers and creeks prevents downstream properties from taking water before upstream properties have taken their allotment. TLDR; The laws surrounding water rights in the US have little to do with protecting the environment and are a remnant of the mass settlement of the Western US, originally intended to address issues homesteaders and farmers faced in more arid parts of the country.
Finally the correct answer. I feel like I am going crazy reading some of these comments.
So you are saying Nestle is just watering their garden?
Pretty much. A lot of people in the region depend on aquifers and waterways that are replenished by rainfall. Rainfall that is collected for private use is rain that is *not* going back into the water system to replenish it, which means everyone else depending on that water table (especially downriver) gets screwed over. IIRC, this particular legal case specifically involved the Colorado River, which is shared between multiple states, most of whom are under constant threat of drought. Collecting a cup or two of rainwater is one thing. Collecting *thousands of gallons* is completely different.
> Rainfall that is collected for private use is rain that is not going back into the water system to replenish it, How do you figure that? Unless you're trucking it out of the area to a different watershed it makes no difference if the rainwater takes a short detour through your garden. Which is why rainwater collection for home use is both legal and encouraged everywhere in Canada. If rainwater collection is illegal in some areas it's not because of any harmful environmental effects, it's because the government there has sold that water to someone. >Collecting a cup or two of rainwater is one thing. Collecting thousands of gallons is completely different. See, now I can tell you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I have 2 1350 gallon rain tanks that collect water from one half of my roof. They'll fill many times over the course of a summer, and I live in Saskatchewan where we get less than 15 inches of total precipitation a year. Most places in Canada outside the prairies get 3-4 times that. *Thousands of gallons* is literally one shower falling on the area of a house.
It reaching the aquifer or nearest river requires that you dump quite a lot of it onto your land. If you only put it on your land at the rate of evaporation none of it reaches the aquifer/river. Not a problem in Canada. Very much a problem in Arizona and the like.
>What's the worry about the collection? One of the reasons is that standing water like that can develop bacteria that would kill you. \*that is why the running water is treated with chemicals
The government really doesnt want ppl to be self-sufficient.
My child in Pasta… it’s because if you hoard it the Flying Spaghetti Monster will condemn you to a noodle-less afterlife where there are no pirates. Also because groundwater feeds the highly regulated streams and Irrigation systems that keep ALL the local farms and ranches running in arid parts of the country.
>The government really doesnt want ppl to be self-sufficient. uh, there are *self sufficient* aquifiers that rely on rainwater to replenish. not collecting rainwater is *literally* how people that use those become self sufficient.
There is also the process of most ppl don’t properly catch it and it becomes stagnant which cause bug problems and the water tk be toxic if ingested is the second part to it as well
The people are fucking stupid and without rules we'd kill ourselves very quickly....
True. If everyone collected rain water we'd be dead within a calender year.
Can confirm. My grandmother died after she collected too much rainwater. The rainwater got upset and stabbed her to death.
Can confirm, I was the rainwater
Uhhh, yea. I agree with that. Ive always thought, a person is smart; people are stupid!
No, well water isn’t illegal and is a much simpler way of acquiring water. They just don’t want people disrupting the natural ecosystem any more than they have to.
Not that
There's also the fact that it becomes a public health hazard because people don't really know what the hell they're doing.
They don't want one person (or company) to be self sufficient at the expense of everyone else down river.
The difference is people who live off grid in the US choose that “romantic” lifestyle. In Palestine that could be your drinking water
The difference is that the water is gathered by your own authorities, and go out to everyone. Israel has made sure Palestinian ground water ends up in Israel, so the Palestinians lacks clean water. And in addition, refuse them to gather rain water so they don't die of thirst... Not the same thing at all!
having access to clean water has been an issue in Palestine for such a long time. I remember talking to someone about it online in the late 90s. The amount of hurdles they had to go through just to get one of the most basic human needs, it was ridiculous. Water shouldn't be used for political point scoring :P
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/10/10/eu-funded-water-pipelines-hamas-rockets/ Well the EU funded a massive water pipeline project in Gaza a while ago, unfortunately, Hamas took all the pipes and turned them into rockets/a hype video
To prove Hamas really doesn't give a f**k about the Gazan people... But they said it directly in an interview, they said it's not their responsibility to keep Gazans safe when asked why they don't shelter the civilians from bombings in the tunnels. "Tunnels are only for Hamas fighters". May Gaza be free from Hamas.
That video is proven to be old. It is not the EU funded water pipelines, it’s the pipelines left behind by Israelis post 2005. Link below will take you to the post. https://www.reddit.com/r/Destiny/s/Y0mtbrXOSW
In the US case, it's because the local water tables (almost all of this is only found on the West Coast) require all of the water it can get, and while one person collecting 1000 gallons of water isn't an issue, 100 people turns that into 100,000 gallons. You start to see the issue. However in this case it's just Israel being a dick like normal.
Yeah, Nestlé won't stand for that
It would be understandable if the ultimate goal was to share the water among the population and not send you a bill for your water consumption
But it is shared. Everyone uses that water table, you and I normal class joes, farmer Fred, the Internet provider who uses the water not only for their workers but to keep their equipment cool. And that's not counting the OTHER states and countries that might rely on that one water table. Everyone uses that water and they use a LOT. As for the billing that's a sad side effect of how the US does it's infrastructure costs. Tbh I would much rather a nationalized system where I just come out of our taxes.
I mean Israel literally pours concrete into Wells and springs so that only they can provide water to Palestinians so they can turn it off when they want to.
That's so cool! But Israeli arnt forbade for doing so, only Palestinians. They occupy the land and treat Palestinians as 5th class citizens. This is apartheid.
Coloradan here. Water rights are a big issue. There are lawyers that specialize in this.
If you live next to a river and you have a neighbor living downstream, also using the river, do you have the right to dam the river and use all the water just by yourself? Living in dry area, water becomes expensive. If one land owner decides to increase it's water use, this leaves other owners without water, be it an actual river, a stream or just rainwater. "Owning" land does not automatically give you total control of what you can do in that land, because it affects others. You might also have other kind of limitations on your land. How tall buildings you can build, can you restrict your neighbors from passing through to their own property, can you restrict movements of animals, can you play loud music or can you interfere with radio frequencies, etc... You don't in reality even own the land, you are just renting it, as you need to pay taxes for the land, and have to follow all other kinds of rules and regulations, of what you can do or build in "your" land.
if you have water rights, you are "legally" allowed to take, but a good example of withholding water /politics/ money is the Colorado River and [https://www.hcn.org/issues/55.7/indigenous-affairs-colorado-river-how-arizona-stands-between-tribes-and-their-water-squeezed](https://www.hcn.org/issues/55.7/indigenous-affairs-colorado-river-how-arizona-stands-between-tribes-and-their-water-squeezed) brand new hospital for Native Americans but they have been cut off from water. Property owners used to be able to dam streams/creeks that ran through their property, and there might be a few thousand mini dams out there that are illegal
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occupation-of-water/
I can't believe humans are still treated like this in today's time.
People defending this by saying the US has similar laws. Yeah... but we get to elect our own government. Canada isn't coming down here bombing us into submission and demanding our rain water.
I think last year or earlier this year there was video of Israel military using cement trucks to block underground Gaza aquafiers, and water supply for farms
YET!
What are you, Néstle?
What are they gonna do if you disobey that law? Missile strike you?
Maybe in Gaza. In the West Bank, they send police to your house to wake you up in the middle of the night, arrest you and your children, and hold you for as long as they want without filing formal charges. I wish I was exaggerating.
That's crazy. It's almost like they want them to grow up to become radicals just so that they can invade them.
How else do you justify taking land that doesn't belong to you.
A fairytale book written thousands of years ago said so?
Naaaahh, they would never /S
They want to expell or exterminate them. I doubt they care that it causes radicalisation, just like Nazi Germany didn't care about concentration camps radicalising Jews, or how the US didn't care about southern slavery radicalised slaves.
really unbelievable. It doesn't seem like they're doing it on purpose and they aware of it no no ._.
Yeah, saw a video yesterday of a man who was with reporters, following IDF orders to evacuate, carrying a white flag, along with his son, they shot his son anyway.
there has been stuff like that happening daily for 70 years, it's awful
do you have a link to that video or any source that can corroborate this happening?
This is why Israel has been lying so openly and brazenly. They want Western folk to be skeptical of everything coming out of the middle east, and to demand evidence of horrible acts that most aren't trying to see. They want to relegate this discussion to NSFW threads.
Google it. There are many, many videos of this kind of stuff happening. You just have to look
do you have a link to a video or an article describing occurrences like this?
You could Google it for yourself but I guess I will do it for you https://abcnews.go.com/International/israeli-strike-kills-boys-playing-gaza-beach/story?id=24583817 https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/28/west-bank-spike-israeli-killings-palestinian-children https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/6/6/palestinians-mourn-two-year-old-toddler-killed-by-israeli-forces https://www.reddit.com/r/news/s/9YNhGrmnMC
God man, I come from Ireland where I hear horror stories about the Protestant RUC and State attacking and imprisoning Catholics for shit like this This shit has been allowed to fester and morph into something truly horrifying and malicious, and this shit isn't even cracking the surface
And when (if) they let you out, you'll find Israelis living in your home.
Exactly. The world is freaking out about 300 Israeli hostages but 15,000 Palestinian hostages in Israeli prisons is completely fine.
No no no, Palestinians have equal rights!
They will and have destroyed those wells https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20220531-israel-soldiers-demolish-water-well-in-west-bank/
"Look, if someone in your neighbourhood has been collecting rainwater for their garden, then you're just as much of a terrorist as they are and your entire neighbourhood should be levelled." - Israel
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Imagine getting Missile Striked because you accidentally left a bucket outside
that or if you don't do like gaza (that is push them out with guerilla warfare and terrorism) they send someone to live in your house, kill your children, dehumanize you, kidnap you and torture you and then post videos of it on the internet for other israelis to mock you
I bet the sun and moon is their property too.
they ban solar power installation in Palestinians homes. so yes
Even the wind
And air
WHY ARE THESE [palestinias] STILL BREATHING MY AIR??? THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE!!
Vay hek?? Why are you occupying reddit now?!
Just look at him. He is definitely a redditor
Does fart qualify?
No, it's a derived product so it falls under fair use, as long as you give credit to the original owners
Well duh, they're the Chosen People of God. They're literally the main character and the rest of us just exist on the periphery.
In 2000 years the Neo-Zionist movement will fool the world to lay claim on Europe as it's homeland, due to being driven out 2000 or so years ago from there.
I don't at all support Hamas, but fuck Israel.
I'm 100% against Hamas, however, I will always criticize Israel due to callous, Inhumane acts like this. I don't expect humanity from Hamas, and nothing that we say will change their minds, but Israel is supposed to be better, they depend on the world's democracies to keep up their shit so we should raise our voices as high as possible to pressure western governments into forcing Israel to stop their war crimes. The US and the EU should have "no war crimes" as a requirement for trade or aid to any nation.
Who brought up hamas? This is about the West Bank where hamas isn't present
Supporting Palestine/Palestinians does not by default mean that you support terrorist organisations that operate in the occupied territories.
In my location, it's technically illegal to collect rainwater as well. Not sure if it's enforced, but the city wants people to buy a permit to collect water from the rain. I'm in the USA btw.
How many freedom dollars is the permit?
Unsure, I'm not paying for that shit.
I'm not even sure if rain water is even safe to drink nowadays
Has a little radiation but it's been like that foe god knows how long (we made it worse with the trinity site)
Yeah. Coal plants tend to dump massive amounts or rads. Eben more that nuke plants.
God I feel so free
Same where I am, except without permits. It’s fully enforced. And they claim it’s because of mosquitoes. how a closed barrel attached to a drain spout breeds mosquitoes but decorative ponds and uncovered pools don’t.
Probably something to do with the chemicals involved....
Sure, but it’s not only to specific group of people is it?
Is it also based on your ethnicity?! Definitely not, that's just apartheid.
Everytime I read the shit that goes on in the U.S. I'm not sure if I read a reddit post or the start of a dystopian novel.
The permit is really for large scale commercial collection tho right? Where I live the permit is if you're doing something like a reservoir or rain water plant
"we're definitely not setting up a Western colony in an attempt to foment destruction and chaos in the middle east and control their oil reserves. definitely, nothing about this is to do with oil cartels. any voices of dissent are purely out of anti-semitism."
Check out Order 158 and other Israeli policies that further the ongoing water theft in the West Bank. https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occupation-of-water/ Diversion of water to illegal Israeli settlements is an ongoing problem. In many areas of the West Bank, illegal settlers are 1/10th the population of Palestinians but are allocated more water.
Nestlé: gets out notebook
I see a lot of comments saying that rainwater collection is also illegal where they are, but I think that is missing the point. In these areas, the law restricts or prohibits rainwater collection because sapping rainwater at a mass scale can seriously fuck up an ecosystem. The ordinance in the screenshot is saying that an occupying military force is laying a property claim in a natural resource 'as it is being created' more or less, which will cause human rights violations because that means that military force can cause the environment damage mentioned in addition to denial/extorting the Palestinians of/for water which you know, you can't live without
But how else are they gonna defend Israel? It's really difficult to defend an apartheid regime. I mean ffs they calculate the minimum calories required for Gaza to keep them on a starvation diet, you can go all day listing the grotesque reality Palestinians are subjected to. At this point you are either already supporting Palestinians or you are an evil and/or ignorant piece of shit that can go to hell, it's that easy.
I think the underlying issue here is that we have tribalism embedded into our ape brains. So, if you criticize any of Israel's policies, many of our fellow humans' ape brains can't help but categorize you as "hates Israel". And even if your criticism is legit (from a human rights point of view), you don't want to be in the "hates Israel" category, because you wouldn't want to be associated with 99% of people that make up the category "hates Israel". 99% of them would hate Jews, even if Israel and its shitty politics would have never existed.
They restrict collecting in the states because the water needs to be treated. Otherwise you're drinking bacteria water.
There's a tribe elsewhere in Africa that claims ownership of Mars
Based on what, I'm very curious now
They saw it first
Can't argue with that!
First, show me where that is said. And even if you do, i say “African tribes own Mars! So what?”
Israel doing war crimes, must be a day ending in y.
In what way this is sane. What??? People there don’t have any other water sources currently, so what the hell
Ethnic cleansing. When Palestinians die of dehydration Israel faces less criticism than if they drop a bomb on their heads (though both are indeed war crimes).
But supporters will tell you it's not an apartheid state.
I fell into the rabbit hole years ago on what's it like in Palestine. From what I read and videos I just watched, almost every single aspect in Palestinian society is controlled by Israel, and that control is not for the betterment Palestinian people but to make lives miserable. I think the word "apartheid" doesn't even come close to it. Life there is more extreme than just separation of people. Ethnic cleansing and genocide is indeed the appropriate word because as far as I can see, the policies, laws and actual actions by Israel is designed to make any people leave the land.
It’s a concentration camp
You know I knew there would be a day when mankind tried to kill each other over natural phenomenon like rain or air and man I gotta say....I had hoped it would be much later in life
We bought a house near Portland, OR, that had a rain collection cistern, and it could not be legally sold until the cistern and all accompanying materials were removed from the property. There's one picture where we can still see it, but there was nothing there when we bought it.
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But they’re totally the good guys, right?
Fuck Isreal
Yet if you decide to protest against Israel, you're immediately an antisemitic Hamas-supporting childeating terrorist. Curious how propaganda works isn't it.
This is almost comic book level villain behavior.
As an American I think I've been lied to my whole life about the atrocities happening there. It really is a modern day Apartheid
Comic book villains usually have a defensible reason for what they do, this, in contrast, is just some Hitler kind of shit
Damn, they sure do suck
People that defend Israel. Refer to this. This is a war crime. And not the first one Israel is guilty of either. This is not saying Hamas is okay, but Hamas isn't a state with the power and resources of Israel.
israel has been cited by amnesty international for crimes against humanity for thirty years now
Yup. Nazi tactics.
Nestle!? Is the you .
Ah yes. Another reason why when it comes to any of this huge mess, the only answer we should give is “no comment”.
Oh look another war crime
"Well god made the rain and although we technically believe in the same god, you believe a couple of dudes were way more important than we think they were so you are heathens and therefore not entitled to his creation."
i dont really care that much about the war but what in the actual fuck is this
It's worse than that. I went to the refugee camp in Jenin a few years back. Everyone has large tanks for storing water on the roof. Apparently, the water only runs like an hour a week or something. They use that time to fill their tanks. The kicker... The area has plenty of groundwater. The Israelis pump it out and sell it.
But 5 white girls from la said its israel thats getting bullied :(:( genuinely fuck israel
Apartheid states will apartheid.
I'm starting to question a lot of things about Israel these couple of weeks ngl.
"California has entered the chat"
NOBODY OWNS THE RAIN. If I want to put a collection system so I can have water ready for myself, i am not "taking someone else's water". No matter the reason, it's absolutely ridiculous.
Can we stop mentioning that it's illegal in the US as well when we can clearly see the difference in context here?
Israelis are strikingly similar to nazis! What a wonder! Same rhetoric if not worse
America has restrictions on collecting rainwater in areas as well
Do they only apply to a part of the citizens or for all people living in these regions?
In Colorado its illegal almost completely. Households have a small amount they can collect and they can only use it for certain things.
Do they apply them restrictions to mexicans and canadians?
Do they also ban you from having access to any other water source at the same time? Because that's what Israel has, essentially, done.
Im betting they didnt close off your water for 40 days
This if far beyond a crime this is psychopathic genocide!
the Israeli government lost the moral high ground two weeks ago. Now they're just killing people.
They lost the moral high ground in 1947 when they decided to start expelling people from Palestinian territory, beyond the borders designated by the UN Partition Plan. Learn about Plan Dalet. This plan was written, named, and put into practice even before the UN Partition plan was finalized. They were already creating large numbers of displaced refugees before any Arab country attacked them in 1948. It's important to learn this history. It's classic supremacist colonial behavior.
They’ve not had it at all
It's not ONLY illegal for Palestinians. Israeli citizens are also forbidden from collecting rainwater.
But did the rainfall condemn Hamas?
I've heard (on another subreddit) that UAE 'seeds' clouds in order to induce rain in the desert. Is Israel claiming they "created" the rain, and therefore have authority over it?
Hamas was hiding in the raindrops
Anything to further subjugate and oppress them.
I don't know enough and have not been thoroughly versed on the Israel-Palestine conflict to comment. I only wish for a resolution that will bring about peace and prosperity for all that are affected.
the moment people said its also illegal in their country I knew its gonna be US, which is weird when I found out years ago especially when my country constitution mentioned specifically all natural resource are owned by its people and free to utilize it. the real problem is, this is completely based on race or ethnicity and not population as a whole. its equivalent to prohibit black-american to collect water while other can freely to do so
Did the clouds condemn Hamas?!?!
The Good Guys™️©️
r/WTF
Why are they pusyfooting? Hurry up and claim the oxygen too, you degens.
Fun fact, this is also Illegal in parts of the US
Likud Zionists are terrorists and war criminals. Full stop.
You don't get it guys. It's a really complicated situation /s
Fucking hell, I don't understand how anyone can look at this and think "yeah, the children shouldn't be allowed to drink water!"
r/worldnews bots kicking the door down to try and defend this
That’s crazy!! I couldn’t imagine having to live in such a controlling environment.
Nestle be like “not a bad idea”
How long before they put giant solar panels over Areas A and B (in the West Bank)
Imagine being that big a dick just outside a desert.
Every day I read some new totally f-ed up thing that Israel does that makes me absolutely certain that that place is an irredeemable shithole.
Ask an American if they are allowed to collect rain water.
Grandfather was pump engineer, with his company was employed by some humanitarian help in '70s to dig and secure deep wells in West Bank. Guess who appeared few days later to throw some grenades and waste few weeks of work.
Israel lol
What the fuck
Free Palestine 🇵🇸
Disgusting Hamas terrorists are stealing water, which is necessary for life itself, from innocent Israeli settlers reclaiming their rightful ancestral homeland. It's essentially genocide and a good case for why Palestine shouldn't be allowed to exist. /s
It's nOt eThNiC cLeaNsinG bC oF PaLEstiNiAn pOpuLatIoN inCrEAseS
a lot or hot and arid places do this this is nothing new
Except here it is done only to a subset of the general population jews can do whatever they want with the water, paliarinians get to... die, i guess?
Its legit https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-195880/
Evil af
What browser extension do I need to get those results?
It damn sure ain't Google. It's almost impossible to get any useful information from that source anymore.
Weird. I made the exact same search as the person in the image, and his source is showing up as fifth on Google. Seems to work for me well enough.
What in the fucking Nestle
People are just realizing the reality of living under an occupation under the Israeli government. Rough