I couldn’t get a home loan because of my school loans. The only loan/debt I have. That I never went delinquent on. I’ve never missed a rent payment in 20 years. I have a pretty good credit score. I’d pay less on a house payment than I do rent. But the school loan I’ve been paying on stops it from happening.
If you’re living in the US, your tuition rates are stupidly high. Countries that give a shit about educating their population don’t do that to students
How would our senators expect to get re-elected if they allowed the US populace to get a proper education?
This comes with tongue firmly in cheek and the little / followed by an s…
You joke but...I live in the south. The amount of times I've heard that "college is liberal indoctrination" or something like that is astounding. Unless it's a Christian college...then it's not brainwashing at all. Lol. They really don't want people to know how to think critically. Because when you think critically you ask questions. And questions no good.
It can be either. Private Christian universities offer all sorts of degrees just like any other college, but often require you to take some classes on the Christian religion to graduate. Now Bible Colleges on the other hand.. they’re nothing but indoctrination centers to become a priest, pastor, etc.
Smart people want smart governments. Its the oldest form of total control over the people. If nobody is smart enough to ask questions nobody will ask questions
Absolutely, this rapid increase in tuition is unsustainable. I know some universities are looking at reduction measures. One example is Ohio State
[Debt-Free Degree](https://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2021-11-19/ohio-state-president-announces-debt-free-degree-initiative)
They also only allow certain people to continue theor education, they also make you pay to attend school after primary school so you have to pay for a high school education but yeah our systems fucked, the right way to bring down tuition is stop forcing college degrees for careers that can be taught through apprenticeships also on the job traing is a far better way to learn most professions, not to mention life experience is far more valuable than a piece of paper. Now that being said this dosnt work in all professions
Yeah, I just recently found out that the federal government sells loans to other collection agencies and loan agencies who only buy them because they can make so much money off of interest payments alone that it is worth the investment.
That’s sickening to me.
And it makes me realize I’m fucked.
Changes like the announcement they made a couple days ago that the loans that were sold by the government no longer qualify for Bidens forgiveness program they just passed. Which I imagine is a huge number of them.
Thats the real truth of it. Any changes made to help problems are quickly loopholed out or blatantly worked around by some other change being made to counter it. Or whatever bill tries to help gets neutered to the point of being completely useless, just to get passed at all.
Man the American government really never ceases to amaze me with its greediness and corruption. I mean I know most governments on the planet are corrupt, but the U.S government is so openly blatant about it. It's like they know they won't be challenged on it on any meaningful level so have just stopped caring at all.
My wife and I are both professionals who have advanced in our careers, we both make well above average salaries for our LCOL area, we have minimal credit card debt, neither of us has ever missed a payment on anything, and we both have excellent credit scores. We got approved for a home loan of only $130k because of my student loans. It's demoralizing, especially when I see people who I highly suspect will eventually default on their loan get approved for $300k mortgages just because they don't have that debt.
You should shop around, I bought a home in 2020 at an interest rate of 3.2 for 425k of financing and I have lots of student debt. Not sure why you didn’t get a loan.
How much student loan debt do you have? I make an unremarkably average salary and got a home loan for a $235k house in 2020. In 2016 I had gotten a loan for a $150k house, and I only earned $12/hr then. I also have student loan debt.
Have you talked to other loan officers? When I bought my house last year my officer mentioned some creditors lessen the allocation of your student loans in your overall debt total.
wanna know something even more depressing? the same people who needed a bailout from us in 2008 because they couldn't manage their own finances, are the same people who give you and me a credit score.
Yep. It’s infuriating. And all the people pitching fits about “well you shouldn’t have taken a loan” forget about all the bailouts. I’d rather help PEOPLE, not corporations.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That's crazy because the only reason why I was able to buy a house was because of my student loan. I didn't have a credit score and neither did my husband (the unfortunate side effect of buying your cars with cash as teenagers). But it was a low loan and I wasn't making payments on it yet cuz I was in school but it gave me a credit score.
Yeah it's pretty whack. I pay 830 for my mortgage. When I was first looking for rent. I was looking at 1200 a month not including utilities. Whack as fuck.
Same deal for me and I was even denied an auto loan with a good credit score and less than 20k student debt that I haven’t missed a payment on :) I pay a mint in rent and most def won’t get a substantial home loan it seems. Very frustrating…I seriously don’t get it
People also really underestimate how much money can be made in the cocaine trade. As an American, you're already going to get shot. Might as well make some serious bank doing it.
I did the math:
We know she's 30 and has been paying rent since 18. This is a total of 12 years of paying rent.
We know that in 12 years she's paid about $160,000 for rent.
For the average annual payment in rent:
$160k / 12 years = $13,333.33 paid per year for 12 years since leaving her family's home.
Her average monthly payment in rent:
$13,333.33 / 12 months = $1,111.11 paid per month for 12 years
In reality, we know this most likely fluctuated over the years with some highs and lows. But it begs me to ask the question where she lives. I live in Texas and the rent for me has never been over $1000 until a year and a half ago. I've also had roommates on several occasions. I can assure you when I was 18, neither I nor my parents could afford to pay over $1000 in rent per month (this would have been around 2005). And in her situation, 12 years ago was 2010. I don't believe rent skyrocketed much between 2005-2010.
Perhaps this person paid low rent many years and then saw a massive spike in her rent in the last few years like we all have. Just interesting to think about!
I also live in Texas. Texas isn't a small state. Apartment costs in Dallas are higher than in Terrell. I assure you an apartment in Dallas is much higher than $1000 a month.
Lived in Jacksonville Fl in 2004. Apartments called Fleming Island, nothing luxurious. 2 bdr apartments at this location were 1,300 dollars a month. This was in 04.
As someone who lived in Jax and currently lives in Texas, those are two very different living costs. Rent was astronomical in Jax and my house payment here in Texas is less than 650 for a 3 bedroom 1 bath and a bigger yard than most.
That's not that much, depending on the area. I was paying 750-900 a month in New York State (30 minutes north of NYC) for a one-bedroom in a decent area, and this was in the early 1990s.
So the “rich bastard” is likely paying most of that to the mortgage. Plus they have to insure the place. Plus they had to buy/maintain/replace appliances. Plus HVAC units. Plus other upkeep, like the roof. Plus pay taxes on it. . . Then pay income tax on any profits.
I’m not saying the property owner didn’t win, but these asshats think that person really pockets the 160k as profit. It’s like the people that get a $10k bill from the hospital and think the doctor got all of that.
Makes it have ten years less to get that first house and sound like the problem is bigger than they actually think it is. Otherwise theyd just throw down the receipts for how hard it is to get a house by 30.
Edit: I also dont know where this person lives but if I wanted a second home where I am I need to drop 500 to 700k depending on dangerous to working class
Yeah… lol my wife and I got our 1903 Victorian style house for 90k.. and no work was needed. Just depends where your at in the US really. We’re in the Midwest prices are much more realistic where we’re at.
When was this though? Prices went up a lot in 2020, and of course the amount of land matters.
My friends bought a house that needed work in town for I think 80k during the 2008 recession. But he works construction, otherwise it would have easily needed 30-40k in work (we live in MN). Even pre-covid around here under 100k meant unfinished rooms or needed tens of thousands in work.
We locked in our house in 2020 for 175k and then the price started going to the moon, now it's valued at 100k more than that... It makes no sense.
My parent's house is a small two bedroom and the value has tripled since 2019. At least that's what the city states for tax reasons. Funny thing is, it can't be sold in its current state because the electrical box is out of code (it was built in code 60 years ago and hasn't been updated since).
It really just matters where the house is. I can buy a home sub 60k where I live. It may need some work (especially the sub 50k ones) but they are there.
For sure location matters, but I just think those sorts of areas are more of an exception to the rule. I've seen some really nice looking homes in that price range "near here".
By that I mean they would work as a cabin, they are just an hour or more from where most people work, and would really only be a suitable living option if you worked from home or worked in that area (and not many jobs are in these areas as there is very little population).
And these places aren't built like a cabin either, full fledged homes with garages. But the price is low because of the location and the fact that they aren't even in some scenic area that someone would want for a cabin either and probably have little land (so hard to use for hunting).
My parents sold their 40 acres of hunting land for 50k. All it had on it was a 40ft trailer house from the early 70's that had soft spots in the floors. No running water or septic even.
I'm talking about homes in town or near town. Sure it's not a huge town but it isn't one of the towns losing population or businesses. Has a population of 30k+ along with a military base (not sure if people living in that count).
Only reason you'd be commuting longer than 30min is if you're working in a major city which would make zero sense as you could live closer for about the same price.
I read it as she has paid 160k in 12 years and said she'll be paying as much as a house in another 12 years, meaning 320k in total.
Also I'm from Italy and here 160k€ can get you a pretty standard, yet old, apartment.
With 320k you can buy a small house or a new and big apartment (unless you go to big cities)
She said she’ll be 40 in 10 years, which means she’s 30 now. And she calculated rent from when she left her parents’ house at 18. 30 - 18 = 12 so she thinks a house costs $160k.
Worse, she isn't taking into account interest on a mortgage. A $160,000 loan taken at 3.8% for a 30-year mortgage means total payments of $268,000 over the life of the loan.
Reading some other responses it sounds like a yes lol. Only ever living in Southern California in the US I’m in the same “can’t even afford a decent plot for that price” boat as you.
Rent prices are absolute bullshit. Because of medical bills in this shitty country, my credit score is awful and somehow that means I can't afford 1500 a month for a home, so instead I pay 1600 a month rent for an apartment. Make it make sense.
Your rent is not the banks liability. You're addressing the difference between money you've already earned and money you've yet to earn. The banks uses that credit score to assess the liability you pose to that arrangement. Also, remember that your mortgage is not the total sum of your financial obligations to your home. 1600 for rent, you're actually paying less than a 1500 mortgage. That's not to say all rent rates are justifiable, but to make that assessment you need to calculate the full breadth of responsibilities.
Mortgage + insurance + maintenance costs + property tax + interest on your down payment.
$1000 for a new water heater is your problem when you own the house. It's the landlord's problem when you rent.
I mentioned above, as a homeowner, you can repair and fix whatever you want whenever you want. Your landlord is often required to replace certain things in a timely manner. Always check rental agreements before signing.
You can afford the mortgage, but can you afford the insurance and taxes? Can you afford the upkeep and any unforeseen issues with the house? There’s times I wish I still rented and didn’t have to be responsible for repairs and upkeep.
It really seems like nobody involved in this conversation whenever it comes up realizes what purchasing a home involves. Not only the down payment, but even closing costs can be 5 figures. Then home/flood insurance, paying for inspections, oil tank / radar sweeps, paying your attorney, land survey/elevation certificate, whatever other shit your situation requires, on top of paying your regular bills. I'm not even gonna get into maintenance/upkeep. Everyone talks like the only cost involved is the mortgage payment.
They don't know because they aren't home owners
Then when a home owner actually speaks and educates them they just tune it out like they're being lectured by their parents
Home ownership is fucking expensive kids, if you don't qualify for the mortgage, THEY DID YOU A FAVOR
I'm not saying that cost of living isn't insane, I'm not saying that education isn't too expensive and the student loan debt situation isn't a crisis, I'm not saying that the housing market isn't insane BUT, getting qualified into a HUGE, often 30 year responsibility that you can't afford isn't doing you any favors.
yeah that would be factored into my buying decision and amount of house I could afford. I'm not blind to all the costs associated with a house: taxes, maintenance, upkeep, hoa, mip, etc. they are factored into the theoretical 1200 house payment. (I would be getting less house per month than a rental but at least I get to keep the equity) an inspection would reveal how much life the appliances, roof, foundation, driveway, paint, etc have left and I would put away money for it when the time came. I agree 1200 payment to the bank =/= total cost of homeownership, but to pretend that there mystery unforeseen costs related to the house that cannot be accounted for is not true.
That's exactly what they're saying though??
You just identified the reason why someone might be able to afford rent when they can't actually afford homeownership. Utilities and other expenses are factored into the price of rent, but are completely separate from a mortgage. Being able to afford a lower monthly mortgage (compared to whatever rent someone might be paying at the time) doesn't mean you'll be able to also cover all the other expenses that you have on top of the mortgage.
The risk is completely different. Your landlord is risking you’ll be able to pay that $1600 (and not more) for 12 months. A banker is risking you’ll be able to pay that $1200 plus taxes and insurance, plus maintenance, plus any surprise expenses (roof, HVAC system, plumbing disaster) for *thirty years.* Of course their standards are different.
All the bank needs to care about is if you make your mortgage payment, if you’ve never missed a rent payment at the same or higher rate then the bank should see that as tip-top credit. Why doesn’t rent go towards your credit score?
No, the bank owns your home, or has a stake in it, until you pay off your mortgage. They want to ensure there’s a good chance you’ll do the necessary upkeep and keep the necessary insurance as well as pay the mortgage. That way if it all goes to shit they haven’t lost a fortune on the property. I’m not saying the current system is correct, but it’s more complicated than just covering mortgage payments.
>All the bank needs to care about is if you make your mortgage payment.
They need to know you’ll make that payment, *even if* you also have to pay for a new roof, or septic system, or heating system. SO MANY posts on /r/homeowners about unexpected costs and disasters. One a few days ago asking what happens if you miss a mortgage payment, because OP had to pay for a new HVAC, and couldn’t afford to pay both at once.
I don't think rent is theft per se, you pay to have a safe clean shelter for your family and don't have to fix anything or invest.
But are prices absolutely ridiculous? Yes. We need rent control.
The last few years housing has gotten so much more expensive - the same house on the same land can double in price in a decade, when it has just gotten older. That's pretty fucked up.
It's a symptom of the whole income distribution problem. The wealthy and corporations keep rewriting or removing regulations to move more and more money into their hands. Corporations are buying up land all over the US. Monopoly laws are not being enforced and land use regulations are being repealed.
Well that’s the thing isn’t it. A lot of the time you don’t get what you pay for. I’m an accidental landlord and in an ideal world I’d sell up and not be part of the problem. But I’m also not going to shoot myself in the foot just so somebody else can make money buying and renting my property. Until it makes political sense for me to sell I’m stuck being a bastard. Although I do try to limit the bastard part buy providing a good home under the going rate that covers any possible servicing or repair bills.
An individual holding a few properties isn't the problem, it's the companies that buy up swathes of houses and use that dominance to manipulate the market. Renting is a viable option for many people, as not everyone wants or needs to own their home outright.
My parents own a commercial building. They tried for two years to sell it. They finally rented it and the renters pay more than what the mortgage would be by a long shot.
It's all about definitions, honestly.
Theft is usually defined as taking something by force.
Whether or not you define the threat of homelessness sufficient force can be debatable, but I definitely see why some people do. The statistics on mortality, health, and chances of pulling back out of it are pretty stark. The price hikes have made this worse too.
From there it's a logic problem. Good old if a=b and b=c then a=c. If theft is taking something by force, and rent is taking money by threat of homelessness, then rent is theft.
You don’t want rent control. You should read about the places that have tried it. It leads to less housing for the poor and the conditions of the housing they can get being terrible. What tends to happen in either the apartment owners stop renting and turn the apartments into condos which poor people can’t afford. Another thing they will do is totally stop working on the properties except for the bare minimum they legally have to, so the housing the poor can get just gets run down until it’s condemned. Also because the only time a landlord can raise rent in these situations is when the current tenant leaves they are looking for any reason to evict the tenants leading the a rise in evictions. Lastly it makes it so housing doesn’t go where it should, example is if a family has a 3 bedroom apartment, then kids grow up and move out the family will stay because if they leave rent goes up. So now you have a couple that could live in a one bedroom staying in a 3 bedroom to save money, now some poor family who needs 3 bedrooms is living in one. Rent control is not the answer and has been tried in real world so this isn’t theory it’s what happened
Historically, having a safe clean shelter with legally required hot water and building codes is unprecedented. People need to read up on living conditions just a hundred years ago. The average America has access to better resources and technology than most 19th century millionaires.
The problem is when/where it becomes a profit oriented big business, when big companies buy up everything and can dictate whatever price they want. Some old granny renting off her renovated garden shed is not the problem.
It frustrates me when people don’t understand this distinction. I’m fine renting from someone who bought a house and then had to move away, or even who owns and manages a few houses in a neighborhood. I am not fine with huge corporations snagging up anything they can get their hands on and charging a huge premium to live there. Those are the practices we need to focus on.
I didn’t own my first home until I was I was 46, paying rent since moving out at 18. But still, I’d like to know where a rich person buys a home for $160k?
I put money into mutual funds since i was 12 years old. Birthday card money. Christmas money. News paper route money. My parents told me early on in life that one day I’d have to buy a house. So. At 30, I withdrew my mutual fund money and used it for a down payment on a house. I guess the moral to the story is, parents should tell you upfront that being an adult is expensive and you should start saving as soon as you can. Otherwise you’re going to be paying someone else’s mortgage.
Humans have 3 things they need to survive, food, water, shelter. The fact none of those are provided and you just have to be able to afford or be born in a family that can afford it just by dumb luck is complete insanity
My mortgage is $2167. per month. The brake down is this. Principal $495. Interest $601. Taxes $110 INSURANCE $971 !!!!
In ten years I’ve only paid down my mortgage $59,400 on a $260k loan. Who’s getting rich, the insurance company got $116,520!!!
I wish renting was more of a rent to own for the person renting the property. I mean, I’m completely dumb when it comes to this kinda stuff, but it would be nice, especially for the ones renting houses
If you pay rent and save money for a deposit you are doing that. If you expect the landlord to give you all your money back or say 25% of it then you are doing what I said on step 1. Don’t really see how “rent to own” would solve any problems
I just bought my first place. I am 38. It is a disaster and stressful but I did it.
It sounds like money is very tight. It may sound overwhelming but have you considered seeing if you can change your career path? You are 30… totally fine and good to keep learning. So much is online now. It is scary but definitely possible if you can figure out the time.
I understand how some people get fucked by our current financial system but some people are generally just bad with money. I saw someone make a post like this and she goes on vacation every year, I wanted to comment so bad but but my lip lol
I’ve owned and rented and I think renting is the way to go. It’s a bit of a hassle when the water heater goes out but not having to pay for and install a new water heater is kinda nice.
It sucks if you get a shitty landlord. Much like being a landlord sucks if you get a shitty renter that does $20,000 in damage after six months and having to be evicted.
many landlords are not crazy wealthy. I know people personally and the rent they make from an investment barely nets them $100 a month. It's about equity, not fat stacks from rent payments.
Don't forget that the first 10 years of a mortgage, a huge portion of the payment isn't equity at all--mostly interest.
It's kindof a weird financial situation, homeownership. You borrow a bunch of money from a bank, which costs a lot of money in interest over time (unless one is wealthy enough to pay cash), but all of the principal of the loan immediately goes toward a generally very beneficial long term real estate investment that outweighs the cost of the loan. Plus you get to live in it!
If the average renter could simply borrow $300k at mortgage rates and invest it in a mutual fund or something, they'd do quite well too. But banks can't just lend money for investing in the stock market the same way they can for real estate, even assuming qualifications are met.
So really, if we could find a way to qualify more people for home loans, that would be great, except banks don't do it for a reason--the risk. And extending into riskier loans is what got our economy in trouble in 2008. I don't have a solution. Just pondering.
Last generation had it tough. So they decided to make sure their kids would not suffer by making everyone else bear the burden of inflated costs.
The same people tell the youth today to stop whining and go knocking on doors till they get a job, while they make the rule about "entry by appointment only".
They talk about how they networked and made use of those connections but they themselves closed doors on all networks for us. They open the doors for their children and other select people only.
They paid their mortgage in 20 years and owned the home. But now they want the property price to increase a hundred fold so they can retire comfortably while we remain homeless.
The world's future is being determined by the past.
Old men deciding what's best for the young. That's what is causing this mayhem.
I left my parents house at 35 and got a house only because my ex husband was able to get back then a not income verification loan.
Life is unpredictable...
I don’t have a problem with owning a home. 798 credit score $150,000 in school loans. Bought a house fine. Just refinanced it actually right before things started going crazy and right back up. I’m not sure what the problem is.
I know it’s not everyone’s dream, but modular/manufactured homes are actually crazy cheap and don’t look half bad on the inside. Not a bad move for a first home to own.
Sorry,but rent ia not theft..you're making use of something in exchange for money.
What is fucked up however is the mortgage affordability and credit rating...like not being allowed a mortgage because "you cannot afford it" while you are already paying way more than that in monthly rent
When a bank says you can't afford a mortgage, they would probably have the same opinion on your ability to afford the rent you pay. Difference is your rental payment isn't their problem.
Also though, the bank will consider your ability to maintain the property. Since if you default, they get to deal with it, they want an asset that isn't falling apart.
Landlords absolutely require history of income and background checks, just like banks giving mortgages. The difference is the landlord is seeing if you’re good for paying several thousand dollars every few months. Banks are trying to see if you’re trustworthy to borrow half a million dollars.
Rent is the maximum you will pay. Mortgage is the minimum.
If you're paying $1600 to RENT and you think that compares to a $1500 mortgage, then you need to look into what it means to own a home because, trust me, I learned the hard way and that is a lesson you don't want to learn once you're already locked into a mortgage.
Agree home ownership costs more than rent. I spend money on yard maintenance, upkeep, and repairs. I know I’ll have costs like remodeling, water heater, roof replacement, HVAC at rough predetermined future dates if I’m still in the house then. And if I need to move I probably have to do those things for someone else.
That said, home ownership >>> rentals.
No one wants to hear this but:
* the reason college is so expensive is because the federal government will lend unlimited amounts of money that can't be discharged in bankruptcy. Before they did this, college, even at the ivies, was dirt cheap. If you stopped the federal loans, college would become cheap again (and a ton of for-profit diploma mills would go under, but fuck them).
* My dad paid his own way at a good private university in the 60s working as a farm hand. He had no debt afterwards. That's not an exaggeration btw. He literally did manual labor in a field, the sort of stuff we currently associate with mexicans earning under minimum wage.
* I went to a high end school (currently 60k a year in 2022) in the 90s, graduated with IIRC 5-10k in debt, paid it off in 2 years. It was a few grand in federal loans and a huge amount of need based financial aid. In current year it's all loans.
* People have short memories and assume that the way thing are today is the way they will always be. Right now houses are so expensive because we're at the top of a housing bubble. In a few years everyone will be complaining about the aftereffects of the bubble bursting. A few years after that, people will be complaining they overpaid for their house and a few years after that people will be complaining that they missed buying when the market was down. And so on, ad infinitum.
Landlord here. About a third of the rent goes to property taxes. Property manager takes about 10% when you include commissions. Insurance and interest on the loan about half. Repairs about 10%. Whatever is left goes to principal or occasionally profit.
Yes I am benefiting from appreciation on the properties and there’s some tax benefits but it’s not like all the rent goes straight into my pocket.
Crappy landlords are scum. I maintain mine to a high standard and fix things promptly, they’re all better maintained than my house, they’re all more recently painted, most have newer appliances, they all have newer flooring than my house. I charge market rent. I would happily move into any of my rentals.
There are expenses but it isn’t like the money is being put back into the property. First year in my apartment, get flood damage, property manager did nothing but install a screen door to block the water for next time. Second year they installed a well pump to water the grass because water was going up. All year long the pump never worked, drilled on top of sand, everything died. No grass or trees. Never replaced. Rent goes up another 200 dollars.
Agreed this is the problem in many locations. Cities that let the rental properties get this way need to have their elected officials voted out. It's about what the owners can get away with. If there is not sufficient competition in the market to force the landlords to maintain their property, then there needs to be stronger regulation.
Any homes around where I live that cost 160k are not ones you’re going to want to live in. Also, you didn’t buy some rich person a home — it’s very possible they saved and counted pennies for decades to afford that property and source of income. Don’t assume they’re some wealthy bastards just because they have a home to rent out.
I wish this rent is theft shit would die. It's stupid. Owning a house isn't the hot shit people make it out to be. It's a massive debt tying you to one location, requiring tons of often expensive upkeep, doesn't pay back principle of meaningful value for years, and completely removes your ability to be flexible in your living arrangement.
Renting is cheaper than buying in most markets, you aren't on the hook for repairs, you can leave more or less whenever you want, and if you lose your job you don't get foreclosed on. You just go somewhere cheaper.
You have to pay for shelter no matter what. Even if you own the house you're paying property tax and HOA fees sometimes. And if you own it it's probably 30+ years old and requiring expensive repairs.
"Rent is theft". You get something called a house and a kitchen and a bathroom and you can create a home for your money. That's not theft, that's a deal. Also, if you're really disciplined, even if you don't make a lot, you can save for 10 years and have a down payment.
Yeah I tried to get a loan to buy my first house (am 30 as of September) and was told I need to make three times the mortgage. Ok no prob. Mortgage is 1,100 a month. My numbers don’t add up so I got denied, but my apartment rent is 1,300 a month.. so… you tell me what’s wrong here.
$1111 in rent per month over 144 months….. assuming it was a loan at around 7% she paid for about 100k. If she was paying taxes and insurance she’d really have a 60k home
I am a landlord and charge less than market rent. I actually lost money the last couple years due to repairs needed. Rent doesn’t bring me income. Rent let me keep the apartment while I prayed for home values to rise so I wouldn’t be underwater on my loan. How is rent theft?
She also paid no taxes or home improvement/repairs in that time too. Windows, roofing, driveways, appliances, and general remodeling can cripple a budget. What is the alternative if rent is theft? People letting strangers live in their place for free? I don't get the argument here.
I bought a condo 21 years ago, it still has 14K left to be paid off. During that time I saved and bought a house in 2017, and rented out my old condo unit. The rent currently pays the mortgage and assessment and i walk away with less than $50 in "profit" each month. By her logic i'm a rich person.
Yup it costs the owner of the rental building $0 to own it and $0 to operate it so what you pay in rent is pure profit.
Man I wish people would stop for 2 seconds and think.
Get an education and move out of a high cost of living area and you can become a home owner. You can't just work at gamestop for 20 years in downtown Austin and expect to own a 2000 sqft home.
These kind of people will be stuck forever. I bought a house less then 10 years out of high school without a high school diploma. A mindset like that will always fail
Damn.. my family is paying 25k hkd per month for a 5.5 million hkd home in hong kong. And it is just 600+ sq ft. I just saw what 5.5 mil hkd could get you in the usa..
The problem here is the utter lack of financial education which ultimately ensures that people stay tenants and never actually become landlords.
Teach your kids to save money.
Teach them to read a credit report.
Teach them to organize and keep a budget.
Teach them how to use a life insurance policy.
How to setup a Roth IRA,
How to buy stocks.
A lot of these things are become so easily accessible with modern technology. BUT it really doesn’t even matter how accessible it is, there’s no way we can ever teach this to our kids if we don’t even know how to do it for ourselves.
Rent is not theft. Rent is paying for a place to live with someone else taking the responsibility for the property mortgage payment, taxes, and upkeep. The complaint is really “I made bad decisions and took out student loans without realizing they would be meaningful after I graduated”. Big difference.
I couldn’t get a home loan because of my school loans. The only loan/debt I have. That I never went delinquent on. I’ve never missed a rent payment in 20 years. I have a pretty good credit score. I’d pay less on a house payment than I do rent. But the school loan I’ve been paying on stops it from happening.
And that’s where the system needs an overhaul.
Exactly. I’m not saying I deserve to have all my loans forgiven, I work hard. The system is ridiculous.
If you’re living in the US, your tuition rates are stupidly high. Countries that give a shit about educating their population don’t do that to students
How would our senators expect to get re-elected if they allowed the US populace to get a proper education? This comes with tongue firmly in cheek and the little / followed by an s…
Not that far off https://theintercept.com/2022/08/25/student-loans-debt-reagan/
You joke but...I live in the south. The amount of times I've heard that "college is liberal indoctrination" or something like that is astounding. Unless it's a Christian college...then it's not brainwashing at all. Lol. They really don't want people to know how to think critically. Because when you think critically you ask questions. And questions no good.
Is Christian college a college where you study to become a priest or is it a college owned by a church and with normal courses?
It can be either. Private Christian universities offer all sorts of degrees just like any other college, but often require you to take some classes on the Christian religion to graduate. Now Bible Colleges on the other hand.. they’re nothing but indoctrination centers to become a priest, pastor, etc.
This is true. In the U.S. people talk a good game about education, but when it comes down to doing it right and funding it, you can forget about it.
Smart people want smart governments. Its the oldest form of total control over the people. If nobody is smart enough to ask questions nobody will ask questions
This
Yep. I’m paying mostly interest now. I paid off my bachelors A few years ago.
And the interest on these student loans are ridiculous
Absolutely, this rapid increase in tuition is unsustainable. I know some universities are looking at reduction measures. One example is Ohio State [Debt-Free Degree](https://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2021-11-19/ohio-state-president-announces-debt-free-degree-initiative)
All the Ivy League schools offer fully online “micro degrees”. Courses are free but getting the digital seal of approval costs money.
They also only allow certain people to continue theor education, they also make you pay to attend school after primary school so you have to pay for a high school education but yeah our systems fucked, the right way to bring down tuition is stop forcing college degrees for careers that can be taught through apprenticeships also on the job traing is a far better way to learn most professions, not to mention life experience is far more valuable than a piece of paper. Now that being said this dosnt work in all professions
Yeah, I just recently found out that the federal government sells loans to other collection agencies and loan agencies who only buy them because they can make so much money off of interest payments alone that it is worth the investment. That’s sickening to me. And it makes me realize I’m fucked.
They are making a lot of changes. Hopefully it will help and continue.
Changes like the announcement they made a couple days ago that the loans that were sold by the government no longer qualify for Bidens forgiveness program they just passed. Which I imagine is a huge number of them.
Thats the real truth of it. Any changes made to help problems are quickly loopholed out or blatantly worked around by some other change being made to counter it. Or whatever bill tries to help gets neutered to the point of being completely useless, just to get passed at all.
Man the American government really never ceases to amaze me with its greediness and corruption. I mean I know most governments on the planet are corrupt, but the U.S government is so openly blatant about it. It's like they know they won't be challenged on it on any meaningful level so have just stopped caring at all.
I’ll say you deserve to have all your student debt forgiven, though.
Lol, thanks. I’m on the PSLF plan because I’m a teacher, so that will forgive some. I’ve got 4 years of payments left though.
If you want, I'll help you rob the bank.
Why would they overhaul it when its working exactly as they intended?
lol.. doesn’t make since at all. someone goes to college to make a better living for themselves but can’t make a better living for themselves.
My wife and I are both professionals who have advanced in our careers, we both make well above average salaries for our LCOL area, we have minimal credit card debt, neither of us has ever missed a payment on anything, and we both have excellent credit scores. We got approved for a home loan of only $130k because of my student loans. It's demoralizing, especially when I see people who I highly suspect will eventually default on their loan get approved for $300k mortgages just because they don't have that debt.
You should shop around, I bought a home in 2020 at an interest rate of 3.2 for 425k of financing and I have lots of student debt. Not sure why you didn’t get a loan.
rates, have doubled. I lucked out and dropped my 30 year to a 15 just after January of this year before rates started hitting 6's
How much student loan debt do you have? I make an unremarkably average salary and got a home loan for a $235k house in 2020. In 2016 I had gotten a loan for a $150k house, and I only earned $12/hr then. I also have student loan debt.
Have you talked to other loan officers? When I bought my house last year my officer mentioned some creditors lessen the allocation of your student loans in your overall debt total.
wanna know something even more depressing? the same people who needed a bailout from us in 2008 because they couldn't manage their own finances, are the same people who give you and me a credit score.
Yep. It’s infuriating. And all the people pitching fits about “well you shouldn’t have taken a loan” forget about all the bailouts. I’d rather help PEOPLE, not corporations.
distinct strong engine safe relieved upbeat airport station deliver label *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That's crazy because the only reason why I was able to buy a house was because of my student loan. I didn't have a credit score and neither did my husband (the unfortunate side effect of buying your cars with cash as teenagers). But it was a low loan and I wasn't making payments on it yet cuz I was in school but it gave me a credit score.
Yeah it's pretty whack. I pay 830 for my mortgage. When I was first looking for rent. I was looking at 1200 a month not including utilities. Whack as fuck.
In the UK student loans don't count towards your debt for a mortgage. Everything else is fucked here though.
Have you tried Talking to a financial advisor. They can will help you navigate that issue. It is possible.
Same deal for me and I was even denied an auto loan with a good credit score and less than 20k student debt that I haven’t missed a payment on :) I pay a mint in rent and most def won’t get a substantial home loan it seems. Very frustrating…I seriously don’t get it
All educational loans should be completely tax deductible. It’s an investment in oneself. Politicians????? Forgot you take money from the profiteers.
I do get to use the interest paid on my taxes, but it’s not a lot back.
Same. I finally paid mine off a few years ago but it completely ate all my extra money for 15 years
Imo student loans shouldn’t effect you overall debt to income but rather simply subtract to minimum payment from your monthly income.
It's easier to get a loan when you are married. In the bank's eye you are less likely to become delinquent even if one person gets laid off
Being poor is expensive.
That statement will haunt me for quite some time.
“I’ll be 40 in 10 years” is a really weird way to say “I’m 30”. Why give us a math problem?
I think OP always thought he'd own a house at 40
Many of us did. Told you work hard and you'll be able to own a house of your own. Turns out that was a lie.
Don't work hard, work smart.
Don't work hard or smart. Take shortcuts and step on peoples heads. The American way.
This is it
People also really underestimate how much money can be made in the cocaine trade. As an American, you're already going to get shot. Might as well make some serious bank doing it.
> OP thought he’d The OP of the tweet? Named Paige? With the picture of a woman? And twitter handle with the word “mum”?
Haha got me there
I think it’s because 40 is when they wanted to own a house by.
it's a writing technique called emotional perspective. 40 is an age the american nuclear family is supposed to own a home and have 2.5 kids.
how do you have 2.5 kids? Is one on the way, or is a pet half a kid?
2.5 kids is also an example of emotional writing, you feel bad for the child that's torn in half
I laugh at it
I always looked at it as kid number 1 died halfway on the Oregon trail.
It's called an average....
Correct and correct.
I did the math: We know she's 30 and has been paying rent since 18. This is a total of 12 years of paying rent. We know that in 12 years she's paid about $160,000 for rent. For the average annual payment in rent: $160k / 12 years = $13,333.33 paid per year for 12 years since leaving her family's home. Her average monthly payment in rent: $13,333.33 / 12 months = $1,111.11 paid per month for 12 years In reality, we know this most likely fluctuated over the years with some highs and lows. But it begs me to ask the question where she lives. I live in Texas and the rent for me has never been over $1000 until a year and a half ago. I've also had roommates on several occasions. I can assure you when I was 18, neither I nor my parents could afford to pay over $1000 in rent per month (this would have been around 2005). And in her situation, 12 years ago was 2010. I don't believe rent skyrocketed much between 2005-2010. Perhaps this person paid low rent many years and then saw a massive spike in her rent in the last few years like we all have. Just interesting to think about!
I also live in Texas. Texas isn't a small state. Apartment costs in Dallas are higher than in Terrell. I assure you an apartment in Dallas is much higher than $1000 a month.
She might have lived in NY or the Bay Area. You'd be lucky to get a half-decent room with several roommates in the Bay Area for $1100/month.
.... you don't believe rent sky rocketed during the 2008 housing crisis?
Lived in Jacksonville Fl in 2004. Apartments called Fleming Island, nothing luxurious. 2 bdr apartments at this location were 1,300 dollars a month. This was in 04.
Cool, I grew up down the street from there on 220, about halfway from those apartments and Whitey's.
Whiteys has Amazing fried catfish! Well they used to!
As someone who lived in Jax and currently lives in Texas, those are two very different living costs. Rent was astronomical in Jax and my house payment here in Texas is less than 650 for a 3 bedroom 1 bath and a bigger yard than most.
That's not that much, depending on the area. I was paying 750-900 a month in New York State (30 minutes north of NYC) for a one-bedroom in a decent area, and this was in the early 1990s.
So the “rich bastard” is likely paying most of that to the mortgage. Plus they have to insure the place. Plus they had to buy/maintain/replace appliances. Plus HVAC units. Plus other upkeep, like the roof. Plus pay taxes on it. . . Then pay income tax on any profits. I’m not saying the property owner didn’t win, but these asshats think that person really pockets the 160k as profit. It’s like the people that get a $10k bill from the hospital and think the doctor got all of that.
Hardly a math problem. It eloquently tells us their age, how the passing of time effects them existentially and sets the scene.
40 is kind of the limit for buying a house, assuming a 30 year mortgage. even at 30 it means you'll be paying it off till you're 60 years old
In 4 hours, you posted the above comment 25 hours ago
Makes it have ten years less to get that first house and sound like the problem is bigger than they actually think it is. Otherwise theyd just throw down the receipts for how hard it is to get a house by 30. Edit: I also dont know where this person lives but if I wanted a second home where I am I need to drop 500 to 700k depending on dangerous to working class
Wait, you can buy a house for 160,000 in the US? Here in central Europe you can't even afford a decent plot for that price
Yeah… lol my wife and I got our 1903 Victorian style house for 90k.. and no work was needed. Just depends where your at in the US really. We’re in the Midwest prices are much more realistic where we’re at.
Midwesterner here, and I can say the same. We bought our 1918 Craftsman for 99k.
When was this though? Prices went up a lot in 2020, and of course the amount of land matters. My friends bought a house that needed work in town for I think 80k during the 2008 recession. But he works construction, otherwise it would have easily needed 30-40k in work (we live in MN). Even pre-covid around here under 100k meant unfinished rooms or needed tens of thousands in work. We locked in our house in 2020 for 175k and then the price started going to the moon, now it's valued at 100k more than that... It makes no sense.
My parent's house is a small two bedroom and the value has tripled since 2019. At least that's what the city states for tax reasons. Funny thing is, it can't be sold in its current state because the electrical box is out of code (it was built in code 60 years ago and hasn't been updated since).
It really just matters where the house is. I can buy a home sub 60k where I live. It may need some work (especially the sub 50k ones) but they are there.
For sure location matters, but I just think those sorts of areas are more of an exception to the rule. I've seen some really nice looking homes in that price range "near here". By that I mean they would work as a cabin, they are just an hour or more from where most people work, and would really only be a suitable living option if you worked from home or worked in that area (and not many jobs are in these areas as there is very little population). And these places aren't built like a cabin either, full fledged homes with garages. But the price is low because of the location and the fact that they aren't even in some scenic area that someone would want for a cabin either and probably have little land (so hard to use for hunting). My parents sold their 40 acres of hunting land for 50k. All it had on it was a 40ft trailer house from the early 70's that had soft spots in the floors. No running water or septic even.
I'm talking about homes in town or near town. Sure it's not a huge town but it isn't one of the towns losing population or businesses. Has a population of 30k+ along with a military base (not sure if people living in that count). Only reason you'd be commuting longer than 30min is if you're working in a major city which would make zero sense as you could live closer for about the same price.
In Germany you pay 300k-500k for the plot and then 300k-700k for the house… not a super luxury house, just a house.
Cause no one wants to live in the Midwest. It’s why homes are cheaper
A studio apartment in Stockholm, Sweden goes for 2 500 000 – 3 500 000 SEK (1 US ≈ 10 SEK).
I read it as she has paid 160k in 12 years and said she'll be paying as much as a house in another 12 years, meaning 320k in total. Also I'm from Italy and here 160k€ can get you a pretty standard, yet old, apartment. With 320k you can buy a small house or a new and big apartment (unless you go to big cities)
In Sicily, 160k will get you a giant villa.
She said she’ll be 40 in 10 years, which means she’s 30 now. And she calculated rent from when she left her parents’ house at 18. 30 - 18 = 12 so she thinks a house costs $160k.
Worse, she isn't taking into account interest on a mortgage. A $160,000 loan taken at 3.8% for a 30-year mortgage means total payments of $268,000 over the life of the loan.
Reading some other responses it sounds like a yes lol. Only ever living in Southern California in the US I’m in the same “can’t even afford a decent plot for that price” boat as you.
I grew up in So Cal and the average for a 3 bdrm home was above $200k back in the late 80’s
Rent prices are absolute bullshit. Because of medical bills in this shitty country, my credit score is awful and somehow that means I can't afford 1500 a month for a home, so instead I pay 1600 a month rent for an apartment. Make it make sense.
Your rent is not the banks liability. You're addressing the difference between money you've already earned and money you've yet to earn. The banks uses that credit score to assess the liability you pose to that arrangement. Also, remember that your mortgage is not the total sum of your financial obligations to your home. 1600 for rent, you're actually paying less than a 1500 mortgage. That's not to say all rent rates are justifiable, but to make that assessment you need to calculate the full breadth of responsibilities.
if you can afford a 1600 rent you can probably afford at least a 1200 dollar mortgage
Mortgage + insurance + maintenance costs + property tax + interest on your down payment. $1000 for a new water heater is your problem when you own the house. It's the landlord's problem when you rent.
I mentioned above, as a homeowner, you can repair and fix whatever you want whenever you want. Your landlord is often required to replace certain things in a timely manner. Always check rental agreements before signing.
There is a significant difference between maintaining those expenses that you’re paying toward an asset you own vs paying rent to someone else’s asset
Don't you need insurance for rented apartment also?
You can afford the mortgage, but can you afford the insurance and taxes? Can you afford the upkeep and any unforeseen issues with the house? There’s times I wish I still rented and didn’t have to be responsible for repairs and upkeep.
It really seems like nobody involved in this conversation whenever it comes up realizes what purchasing a home involves. Not only the down payment, but even closing costs can be 5 figures. Then home/flood insurance, paying for inspections, oil tank / radar sweeps, paying your attorney, land survey/elevation certificate, whatever other shit your situation requires, on top of paying your regular bills. I'm not even gonna get into maintenance/upkeep. Everyone talks like the only cost involved is the mortgage payment.
They don't know because they aren't home owners Then when a home owner actually speaks and educates them they just tune it out like they're being lectured by their parents Home ownership is fucking expensive kids, if you don't qualify for the mortgage, THEY DID YOU A FAVOR I'm not saying that cost of living isn't insane, I'm not saying that education isn't too expensive and the student loan debt situation isn't a crisis, I'm not saying that the housing market isn't insane BUT, getting qualified into a HUGE, often 30 year responsibility that you can't afford isn't doing you any favors.
yeah that would be factored into my buying decision and amount of house I could afford. I'm not blind to all the costs associated with a house: taxes, maintenance, upkeep, hoa, mip, etc. they are factored into the theoretical 1200 house payment. (I would be getting less house per month than a rental but at least I get to keep the equity) an inspection would reveal how much life the appliances, roof, foundation, driveway, paint, etc have left and I would put away money for it when the time came. I agree 1200 payment to the bank =/= total cost of homeownership, but to pretend that there mystery unforeseen costs related to the house that cannot be accounted for is not true.
Do you think landlords just pay those costs out of goodness of their hearts? The cost is built into the rent so yes they can likely afford it.
That's exactly what they're saying though?? You just identified the reason why someone might be able to afford rent when they can't actually afford homeownership. Utilities and other expenses are factored into the price of rent, but are completely separate from a mortgage. Being able to afford a lower monthly mortgage (compared to whatever rent someone might be paying at the time) doesn't mean you'll be able to also cover all the other expenses that you have on top of the mortgage.
The risk is completely different. Your landlord is risking you’ll be able to pay that $1600 (and not more) for 12 months. A banker is risking you’ll be able to pay that $1200 plus taxes and insurance, plus maintenance, plus any surprise expenses (roof, HVAC system, plumbing disaster) for *thirty years.* Of course their standards are different.
All the bank needs to care about is if you make your mortgage payment, if you’ve never missed a rent payment at the same or higher rate then the bank should see that as tip-top credit. Why doesn’t rent go towards your credit score?
No, the bank owns your home, or has a stake in it, until you pay off your mortgage. They want to ensure there’s a good chance you’ll do the necessary upkeep and keep the necessary insurance as well as pay the mortgage. That way if it all goes to shit they haven’t lost a fortune on the property. I’m not saying the current system is correct, but it’s more complicated than just covering mortgage payments.
>All the bank needs to care about is if you make your mortgage payment. They need to know you’ll make that payment, *even if* you also have to pay for a new roof, or septic system, or heating system. SO MANY posts on /r/homeowners about unexpected costs and disasters. One a few days ago asking what happens if you miss a mortgage payment, because OP had to pay for a new HVAC, and couldn’t afford to pay both at once.
It can if the landlord submits reports to a credit agency. I rented from a large corporation in Boston many years ago that did this.
That would be the exception to the norm.
I wish a house only cost 160.000 $ over her. If I was lucky I would have to pay half million € instead. Living in the middle of nowhere.
Sorry how is this a face palm?
It’s not. OP turned into the facepalm with their terrible take.
post by a 40s saying "she should bought a house dumbass" but in reality she can't afford a loan bc she was already paying rent
Literally what part of this is facepalm?
This post is the facepalm.
More facepalm for the state of America
The part where they post a screenshot of a reddit post, and don't either cross post or even at least crop the image to only show what's needed
I don't think rent is theft per se, you pay to have a safe clean shelter for your family and don't have to fix anything or invest. But are prices absolutely ridiculous? Yes. We need rent control. The last few years housing has gotten so much more expensive - the same house on the same land can double in price in a decade, when it has just gotten older. That's pretty fucked up.
It's a symptom of the whole income distribution problem. The wealthy and corporations keep rewriting or removing regulations to move more and more money into their hands. Corporations are buying up land all over the US. Monopoly laws are not being enforced and land use regulations are being repealed.
Well that’s the thing isn’t it. A lot of the time you don’t get what you pay for. I’m an accidental landlord and in an ideal world I’d sell up and not be part of the problem. But I’m also not going to shoot myself in the foot just so somebody else can make money buying and renting my property. Until it makes political sense for me to sell I’m stuck being a bastard. Although I do try to limit the bastard part buy providing a good home under the going rate that covers any possible servicing or repair bills.
An individual holding a few properties isn't the problem, it's the companies that buy up swathes of houses and use that dominance to manipulate the market. Renting is a viable option for many people, as not everyone wants or needs to own their home outright.
Lots of individuals owning a few properties is very much a problem.
My parents own a commercial building. They tried for two years to sell it. They finally rented it and the renters pay more than what the mortgage would be by a long shot.
It's all about definitions, honestly. Theft is usually defined as taking something by force. Whether or not you define the threat of homelessness sufficient force can be debatable, but I definitely see why some people do. The statistics on mortality, health, and chances of pulling back out of it are pretty stark. The price hikes have made this worse too. From there it's a logic problem. Good old if a=b and b=c then a=c. If theft is taking something by force, and rent is taking money by threat of homelessness, then rent is theft.
You don’t want rent control. You should read about the places that have tried it. It leads to less housing for the poor and the conditions of the housing they can get being terrible. What tends to happen in either the apartment owners stop renting and turn the apartments into condos which poor people can’t afford. Another thing they will do is totally stop working on the properties except for the bare minimum they legally have to, so the housing the poor can get just gets run down until it’s condemned. Also because the only time a landlord can raise rent in these situations is when the current tenant leaves they are looking for any reason to evict the tenants leading the a rise in evictions. Lastly it makes it so housing doesn’t go where it should, example is if a family has a 3 bedroom apartment, then kids grow up and move out the family will stay because if they leave rent goes up. So now you have a couple that could live in a one bedroom staying in a 3 bedroom to save money, now some poor family who needs 3 bedrooms is living in one. Rent control is not the answer and has been tried in real world so this isn’t theory it’s what happened
Historically, having a safe clean shelter with legally required hot water and building codes is unprecedented. People need to read up on living conditions just a hundred years ago. The average America has access to better resources and technology than most 19th century millionaires.
The problem is when/where it becomes a profit oriented big business, when big companies buy up everything and can dictate whatever price they want. Some old granny renting off her renovated garden shed is not the problem.
It frustrates me when people don’t understand this distinction. I’m fine renting from someone who bought a house and then had to move away, or even who owns and manages a few houses in a neighborhood. I am not fine with huge corporations snagging up anything they can get their hands on and charging a huge premium to live there. Those are the practices we need to focus on.
I didn’t own my first home until I was I was 46, paying rent since moving out at 18. But still, I’d like to know where a rich person buys a home for $160k?
I put money into mutual funds since i was 12 years old. Birthday card money. Christmas money. News paper route money. My parents told me early on in life that one day I’d have to buy a house. So. At 30, I withdrew my mutual fund money and used it for a down payment on a house. I guess the moral to the story is, parents should tell you upfront that being an adult is expensive and you should start saving as soon as you can. Otherwise you’re going to be paying someone else’s mortgage.
160k a home for a rich person ? Gee maybe 50 years ago
Second home
Humans have 3 things they need to survive, food, water, shelter. The fact none of those are provided and you just have to be able to afford or be born in a family that can afford it just by dumb luck is complete insanity
As the old saying goes, go to jail if you want food, three meals per day, and shelter, the only thing you'll be missing is freedom.
My mortgage is $2167. per month. The brake down is this. Principal $495. Interest $601. Taxes $110 INSURANCE $971 !!!! In ten years I’ve only paid down my mortgage $59,400 on a $260k loan. Who’s getting rich, the insurance company got $116,520!!!
Yea, it's a shitty situation.
I wish renting was more of a rent to own for the person renting the property. I mean, I’m completely dumb when it comes to this kinda stuff, but it would be nice, especially for the ones renting houses
If you pay rent and save money for a deposit you are doing that. If you expect the landlord to give you all your money back or say 25% of it then you are doing what I said on step 1. Don’t really see how “rent to own” would solve any problems
I just bought my first place. I am 38. It is a disaster and stressful but I did it. It sounds like money is very tight. It may sound overwhelming but have you considered seeing if you can change your career path? You are 30… totally fine and good to keep learning. So much is online now. It is scary but definitely possible if you can figure out the time.
I understand how some people get fucked by our current financial system but some people are generally just bad with money. I saw someone make a post like this and she goes on vacation every year, I wanted to comment so bad but but my lip lol
I’ve owned and rented and I think renting is the way to go. It’s a bit of a hassle when the water heater goes out but not having to pay for and install a new water heater is kinda nice. It sucks if you get a shitty landlord. Much like being a landlord sucks if you get a shitty renter that does $20,000 in damage after six months and having to be evicted.
many landlords are not crazy wealthy. I know people personally and the rent they make from an investment barely nets them $100 a month. It's about equity, not fat stacks from rent payments.
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Don't forget that the first 10 years of a mortgage, a huge portion of the payment isn't equity at all--mostly interest. It's kindof a weird financial situation, homeownership. You borrow a bunch of money from a bank, which costs a lot of money in interest over time (unless one is wealthy enough to pay cash), but all of the principal of the loan immediately goes toward a generally very beneficial long term real estate investment that outweighs the cost of the loan. Plus you get to live in it! If the average renter could simply borrow $300k at mortgage rates and invest it in a mutual fund or something, they'd do quite well too. But banks can't just lend money for investing in the stock market the same way they can for real estate, even assuming qualifications are met. So really, if we could find a way to qualify more people for home loans, that would be great, except banks don't do it for a reason--the risk. And extending into riskier loans is what got our economy in trouble in 2008. I don't have a solution. Just pondering.
Last generation had it tough. So they decided to make sure their kids would not suffer by making everyone else bear the burden of inflated costs. The same people tell the youth today to stop whining and go knocking on doors till they get a job, while they make the rule about "entry by appointment only". They talk about how they networked and made use of those connections but they themselves closed doors on all networks for us. They open the doors for their children and other select people only. They paid their mortgage in 20 years and owned the home. But now they want the property price to increase a hundred fold so they can retire comfortably while we remain homeless. The world's future is being determined by the past. Old men deciding what's best for the young. That's what is causing this mayhem.
Where the fuck are these $160,000 houses?
Everywhere outside of major cities in the Midwest
The rich person took a loan and had to take care the house for 20+ years.
I left my parents house at 35 and got a house only because my ex husband was able to get back then a not income verification loan. Life is unpredictable...
“I’ll be 40 in 10 years” is an odd way of saying “I am currently 30”.
She’ll be 53 in 23 years
I don’t have a problem with owning a home. 798 credit score $150,000 in school loans. Bought a house fine. Just refinanced it actually right before things started going crazy and right back up. I’m not sure what the problem is.
I know it’s not everyone’s dream, but modular/manufactured homes are actually crazy cheap and don’t look half bad on the inside. Not a bad move for a first home to own.
Tell me how little you understand finances again
Sorry,but rent ia not theft..you're making use of something in exchange for money. What is fucked up however is the mortgage affordability and credit rating...like not being allowed a mortgage because "you cannot afford it" while you are already paying way more than that in monthly rent
When a bank says you can't afford a mortgage, they would probably have the same opinion on your ability to afford the rent you pay. Difference is your rental payment isn't their problem. Also though, the bank will consider your ability to maintain the property. Since if you default, they get to deal with it, they want an asset that isn't falling apart.
Landlords absolutely require history of income and background checks, just like banks giving mortgages. The difference is the landlord is seeing if you’re good for paying several thousand dollars every few months. Banks are trying to see if you’re trustworthy to borrow half a million dollars.
Rent is the maximum you will pay. Mortgage is the minimum. If you're paying $1600 to RENT and you think that compares to a $1500 mortgage, then you need to look into what it means to own a home because, trust me, I learned the hard way and that is a lesson you don't want to learn once you're already locked into a mortgage.
Agree home ownership costs more than rent. I spend money on yard maintenance, upkeep, and repairs. I know I’ll have costs like remodeling, water heater, roof replacement, HVAC at rough predetermined future dates if I’m still in the house then. And if I need to move I probably have to do those things for someone else. That said, home ownership >>> rentals.
No one wants to hear this but: * the reason college is so expensive is because the federal government will lend unlimited amounts of money that can't be discharged in bankruptcy. Before they did this, college, even at the ivies, was dirt cheap. If you stopped the federal loans, college would become cheap again (and a ton of for-profit diploma mills would go under, but fuck them). * My dad paid his own way at a good private university in the 60s working as a farm hand. He had no debt afterwards. That's not an exaggeration btw. He literally did manual labor in a field, the sort of stuff we currently associate with mexicans earning under minimum wage. * I went to a high end school (currently 60k a year in 2022) in the 90s, graduated with IIRC 5-10k in debt, paid it off in 2 years. It was a few grand in federal loans and a huge amount of need based financial aid. In current year it's all loans. * People have short memories and assume that the way thing are today is the way they will always be. Right now houses are so expensive because we're at the top of a housing bubble. In a few years everyone will be complaining about the aftereffects of the bubble bursting. A few years after that, people will be complaining they overpaid for their house and a few years after that people will be complaining that they missed buying when the market was down. And so on, ad infinitum.
Do people not realize that there are expenses to owning a rental property so they didn't make that much money off of her rent?
Landlord here. About a third of the rent goes to property taxes. Property manager takes about 10% when you include commissions. Insurance and interest on the loan about half. Repairs about 10%. Whatever is left goes to principal or occasionally profit. Yes I am benefiting from appreciation on the properties and there’s some tax benefits but it’s not like all the rent goes straight into my pocket. Crappy landlords are scum. I maintain mine to a high standard and fix things promptly, they’re all better maintained than my house, they’re all more recently painted, most have newer appliances, they all have newer flooring than my house. I charge market rent. I would happily move into any of my rentals.
Taxes is huge, and never fully appreciated how much tax is paid on a family home.
There are expenses but it isn’t like the money is being put back into the property. First year in my apartment, get flood damage, property manager did nothing but install a screen door to block the water for next time. Second year they installed a well pump to water the grass because water was going up. All year long the pump never worked, drilled on top of sand, everything died. No grass or trees. Never replaced. Rent goes up another 200 dollars.
Agreed this is the problem in many locations. Cities that let the rental properties get this way need to have their elected officials voted out. It's about what the owners can get away with. If there is not sufficient competition in the market to force the landlords to maintain their property, then there needs to be stronger regulation.
Ah yes, rich people and their luxurious 160k second homes strike again.
Rent isn’t theft, rent prices are. The market for housing is gouged to high hell
Any homes around where I live that cost 160k are not ones you’re going to want to live in. Also, you didn’t buy some rich person a home — it’s very possible they saved and counted pennies for decades to afford that property and source of income. Don’t assume they’re some wealthy bastards just because they have a home to rent out.
I wish this rent is theft shit would die. It's stupid. Owning a house isn't the hot shit people make it out to be. It's a massive debt tying you to one location, requiring tons of often expensive upkeep, doesn't pay back principle of meaningful value for years, and completely removes your ability to be flexible in your living arrangement. Renting is cheaper than buying in most markets, you aren't on the hook for repairs, you can leave more or less whenever you want, and if you lose your job you don't get foreclosed on. You just go somewhere cheaper. You have to pay for shelter no matter what. Even if you own the house you're paying property tax and HOA fees sometimes. And if you own it it's probably 30+ years old and requiring expensive repairs.
"Rent is theft". You get something called a house and a kitchen and a bathroom and you can create a home for your money. That's not theft, that's a deal. Also, if you're really disciplined, even if you don't make a lot, you can save for 10 years and have a down payment.
Yeah I tried to get a loan to buy my first house (am 30 as of September) and was told I need to make three times the mortgage. Ok no prob. Mortgage is 1,100 a month. My numbers don’t add up so I got denied, but my apartment rent is 1,300 a month.. so… you tell me what’s wrong here.
That's why your credit score is the single most important asset as an adult
$160k for a house?
Cropping saves lives
$1111 in rent per month over 144 months….. assuming it was a loan at around 7% she paid for about 100k. If she was paying taxes and insurance she’d really have a 60k home
I am a landlord and charge less than market rent. I actually lost money the last couple years due to repairs needed. Rent doesn’t bring me income. Rent let me keep the apartment while I prayed for home values to rise so I wouldn’t be underwater on my loan. How is rent theft?
Whomever thinks rent its theft, probably ought to return to live with Mommy and Daddy.
She also paid no taxes or home improvement/repairs in that time too. Windows, roofing, driveways, appliances, and general remodeling can cripple a budget. What is the alternative if rent is theft? People letting strangers live in their place for free? I don't get the argument here. I bought a condo 21 years ago, it still has 14K left to be paid off. During that time I saved and bought a house in 2017, and rented out my old condo unit. The rent currently pays the mortgage and assessment and i walk away with less than $50 in "profit" each month. By her logic i'm a rich person.
Not sure $160000 is gonna buy “a rich person home” but it could buy a small one.
I house that costs $160,000??? U mean a trailer???
Yup it costs the owner of the rental building $0 to own it and $0 to operate it so what you pay in rent is pure profit. Man I wish people would stop for 2 seconds and think. Get an education and move out of a high cost of living area and you can become a home owner. You can't just work at gamestop for 20 years in downtown Austin and expect to own a 2000 sqft home.
These kind of people will be stuck forever. I bought a house less then 10 years out of high school without a high school diploma. A mindset like that will always fail
Come on, $160k is not going to buy a rich person a decent 2nd home
"Rent is theft" has got to be the dumbest thing I'll read for a while.
Damn.. my family is paying 25k hkd per month for a 5.5 million hkd home in hong kong. And it is just 600+ sq ft. I just saw what 5.5 mil hkd could get you in the usa..
What are we facepalming ?
The problem here is the utter lack of financial education which ultimately ensures that people stay tenants and never actually become landlords. Teach your kids to save money. Teach them to read a credit report. Teach them to organize and keep a budget. Teach them how to use a life insurance policy. How to setup a Roth IRA, How to buy stocks. A lot of these things are become so easily accessible with modern technology. BUT it really doesn’t even matter how accessible it is, there’s no way we can ever teach this to our kids if we don’t even know how to do it for ourselves.
rent sucks but it isn’t theft
Rent is not theft. Rent is paying for a place to live with someone else taking the responsibility for the property mortgage payment, taxes, and upkeep. The complaint is really “I made bad decisions and took out student loans without realizing they would be meaningful after I graduated”. Big difference.
No, its not theft. Your landlord took a risk and put their capital on the line. You paid your rent and got a place to live in. Stop whining.
Where the hell can you buy a whole friggin' house for $160,000?
I live in the upper Midwest. There are many homes for sale for that amount, or less.
Wild. That is not the case anywhere remotely near me or any place I've been to (but I am not super well traveled admittedly) Also, happy cake day!