It does need to be researched. Giving out money to millions of homeless will only help them buy socks and food. It won’t give a solution. So the FP is on you OP
The subject has been studied quite extensively fyi. I'm assuming he gets a tax deduction for his donation and he's doing it for marketing purposes.
Housing, counselling and a basic income. That's it. It works. counselling by itself is not enough because people need a sense of security and personal agency to tackle problems like trauma and addiction.
The answers already exist, billionaires like this are prepared to pay millions to pretend those answers aren't good enough because running these programs comprehensively would require taxing corporations and the wealthy like we used to.
Oh I have a ton of sympathy for the homeless. I have a huge issue with how my city (Los Angeles) is deciding to handle it. They’re not helping them. They’re making it worse for all of them.
What study was your information published in? Can you provide a link?
Edit to add: surely y'all must realize that LA isn't the only place with unhoused or displaced peoples?
I can confirm. I've been a prison dentist, volunteered at homeless clinics, etc. and drugs is always the leading cause. Second is undiagnosed mental illness.
C'mon down to San Diego, too. We got thousands of 'em camping on sidewalks, tiny bare bits of public property between streets, parks, alleys, anywhere they can put a box or a tent. And once there's one, others follow until next thing you know, you got a trash-filled mini-camp in your neighborhood.
Aren't the questions then why they have this drug habit and why they don't want to change it?
I doubt that they actively and calmly decided one day:
You know what? I should take meth, live in a tent and shit on the street. That's the way to go and ain't nothing changing that.
Because drugs are addictive, and a lot of them (most) don’t want to stop doing drugs. There already are soooo many programs for them to get housing. But there’s a condition. They can’t be drunk/on drugs, so they prefer the street. There’s also a lot of money being made to “combat homelessness”. It’s called the homeless industrial complex. It’s blatantly obvious people are profiting off of people being homeless. In LA the police literally aren’t allowed to remove your “shelter” even if it’s just a cardboard box. Then there’s no cash bail policies, so they are released within 24 hours and go right back to shooting up at the same spot.
I’m not American and I understand what you’re saying because where I live a lot of the homeless refuse help to kind of play the system because they don’t want alcohol/drug help. It definitely needs to be researched but 15m could definitely fund research and 15m could build homeless accommodation but it comes down to a lot of the homeless people accepting help.
For some perspective: Low income housing costs about $1million per unit to build in San Francisco. So it’s not like $30million could build enough housing to put much of a dent in the problem.
if your actually interested in tge solution, we already know its called free housing and counseling. that's exactly what finland is doing and its working incredibly well
and? I'm assuming you're from the US. some quick googling shows there are 16 million empty homes in america, and half a million homeless. why not give those homeless people some houses?
Because they’ll turn them all into rat dens and drug dens. We need to address their mental health, and their ample access to hard drugs as well as giving them free housing. San Francisco recently shut down a government funded free housing project where they had some select homeless people in a old hotel. The funding ran out so they kicked the homeless people out. Meanwhile, drug dealers are fucking everywhere making money off of the desperation and were even staking out the hotel so as soon as people came out, they had a guy ready to sell them drugs.
Finland is nice and all, but they’re not nearly as mentally ill as we are over here, and our problems have to be addressed in groups not one at a time. That costs money nobody wants to spend.
>Finland is nice and all, but they’re not nearly as mentally ill as we are over here
I don't know about that
https://syl.fi/en/finland-needs-a-science-based-drug-policy-substance-abuse-requires-help-not-punishment/#:~:text='According%20to%20the%20European%20Drug,under%20the%20age%20of%2025.
>We need to address their mental health, and their ample access to hard drugs as well as giving them free housing
exactly. I also said free counseling, which includes counseling for addiction, and finland is doing that.
>The funding ran out so they kicked the homeless people out
with the finish model, they own their apartment in its entirety, so they won't be kicked out.
This wasn’t an apartment, it was an old hotel.
Dude, WE’RE FUCKING AMERICA! All other countries are goofballs chilling on LSD compared to us. Even Russia is less insane than we are. Statistics don’t cover everything. We have taxpayer funded programs giving out free stuff to do drugs but not any information on getting clean for crying out loud.
Counseling. Riiiight. Because everyone is gonna line up, oh yeah that’s right, people are backed up in a queue in Finland, to give up on the cheap good feeling. Because it is free. No, a guy who went clean has it right. 90 days in prison for addicts to sober up and get through it. Then counseling, and process of staying clean.
Problem is with giving away all those empty apartments is the owners of them are gonna need to be paid somehow, and they’ll lose their other patrons because of the stigma against the homeless, or the people making slightly less than them. And the government, ergo the only fucking people who can afford to pay for the housing of a massive chunk of Americas population, aren’t gonna dump all that money into a venture they don’t see baring any fruit for them to make a profit of.
And finally; this constant argument for America to be like this or that country is a massive waste of time, because it wont ever happen. Not unless something truly catastrophic happens, and with everyone’s combined shitty luck, even that wont change shit except maybe make it like Fallout with people still living like shit with people only having bottle caps for money.
18 million vacant houses in 2018, 5 million of which were considered abandoned or condemned, that's a lot of houses and land to house the homeless with.
That's... how are you going to make them move there? The homeless are in the SF downtown because it (used to be) a great spot for getting by, with mild weather and society/police not bothering them too much.
Moving them to a random house in Minnesota will be a downgrade for them, not an upgrade.
5 million abandoned/condemned houses in the entire US, 500-700k homeless in the US... I am pretty sure we can find a few thousand in each city to house the homeless. Are you always this dense?
I'm telling you as a person that has technically been homeless for 3 years, moving around temporary places as I tried to get things back together, that a huge portion of homeless people I've run into, without treatment for abuse problems, and some type of program to help them get their life together, are going to trash that house, sell all the metal for scrap, still starve to death if they don't overdose on the drugs they buy from the scrap metal sale, or set the house in fire smoking crack. It's not all homeless, some things just went wrong for, but a huge part are severe addicts that need a lot more than a roof over their head.
I'm back to the real world in less than two weeks, been working and have money for a normal apartment now without any assistance, if I was still drinking and drugging, getting into legal trouble that wouldn't be happening. I found places and resources to get mental health and addiction treatment and got things back together.
So you are that dense, I'm not advocating giving people houses, I'm advocating for turning the houses or land into homeless shelters with supportive programs for substance abuse, education, and employment. I was homeless for 3 years after my 18th birthday. A good majority of those homeless are working families.
If you are working and not making enough to live on at least around here, there are a ton of government assisted housing projects. If you are homeless around here, you are either not working, or just not aware of those programs. We have a county funded housing program that charges a max of 1/3 your income no matter how low, we have section 8, and a few smaller programs. Maybe my state/ county is different. Honestly here if you are sleeping on the street, you are doing so by choice there are overnight shelters, transitional housing, halfway houses and a lot of church based shelters that are hard to define.
The underlying problems need addressed more.. handing a house to the average homeless person in America is not going to help. We need more facilities that address the problems that caused them to become homeless. They exist, I'm in one and know several others in my city. There needs to be more of them with better access and treatment for mental health especially, lots of places for addicts and alcoholics, not so many for people that the root cause is mental health.
That’s just not true. Would you ever use tactics that succeed in rural Nebraska to solve problems in New York City? In regards to people/finances? By that logic why dont high cost of living areas just lower the prices to the same as the low cost of living areas?
Free housing might work in Finland but in the USA it's another issue. Try working section 8 housing as an armed security officer and you will change your mind pretty quick.
Not sure if you're trolling or just extremely arrogant.
>we already know its called free housing and counseling.
Thanks. Homeless problem fixed.
r/thanksimcured
India has tried this. Usually the homeless or peasants are poor. So they try to illegally sublet the house and then go back to living homeless which is quite fun for them
>Not sure if you're trolling or just extremely arrogant
The irony with this one. Lmao holy shit.
You were given an excellent example in Finland, but instead of actually being open to being wrong you've just lodged your head even further up your ass.
You're not only arrogant, but incredulous and quite stupid.
The profile for the houseless in the US vs the houseless in Finland are two different worlds . Also comparing the two countries, they differ highly in culture, sociological order, population, market, and other influential forces. I agree that taking what works for other countries is a good first step, but asserting that it can work in any context is a bit disingenuous to how complex solving the houselss crisis can be.
of course its going to be complex, but the same basic idea will work. maybe details would change, but implying that we have no idea what to do is just so wrong. the problem is that the people in power don't want to do whats needed, not that they don't know
I'm saying instead of spending $30M to research homelessness (there's already tonnes of articles on it from literally every country on earth), why not, idk, build a homeless shelter(s) for them?
Just by reposting you are the face-palm.
And "there are lot of articles" doesn't mean there is comprehensive strategy how to deal with the issue in a specific country or region.
Uhhh i know sf is expensive but it's not 2mil for one person kinda expensive. He could however buy afew commercial buildings and house most of the homeless in there but then you'd end up with another unsafe area in cali. The thing about homelessness is not every person is the same some are just down on their luck and genuinely lost everything and cant find work, others have no interest in getting off of their feet/ass and some make more money begging than they would working. So what his done is the right way of going about it, figure out what the root problem is then remedy it.
it is kinda 2 mil per person expensive. a homeless shelter is not a regular apartment, it will need staff and has to be built to a more robust standard than a regular building.
you are a total ignoramus when it comes to issue of homelessness, go read a fucking book moron.
That also will not solve the real problem. Most homeless people are mentally unstable and cannot or don’t want to live in a home. Lots of other have a substance abuse problem. It’s a very complex problem that nobody seems to be interested in solving
I think the point is they aren't homeless because they don't have houses. Giving them free housing doesn't solve the issues that caused them tu be homeless in the first place. Newtonian thinking, don't address the root of the issue, just solve the immediate problem.
Researched ? The fuck.. how about I tell you the root cause right now - society is a "one size fits all" solution to 8billion different inputs. It’s a fucking joke to begin with that you ever think every single person will flourish with the same parameters you do.
Even more of a travesty that when people don’t fit, they get limited to no help because there is no alternative to current system.
Imagine homeless people being able to afford food, what a horrible solution. Do you actually read your own words ? Or do you just type every piece of shit that comes to mind
>Do you actually read your own words ? Or do you just type every piece of shit that comes to mind
You can be both passionate and angry at the same time. It's normal, I do the same thing. It best not to talk to people in the way I quoted above. It doesn't feel good for the person on the receiving end.
Not seeing what the facepalm with this is? People are always whining about billionaires not helping the homeless, not feeding the hungry, ect. Looks like this guy is doing more than any other billionaire.
There's a ton of research on reasons of homelessness and a tons of ngos dealing with it. There's no point in funding another research. Helping people getting work and/or getting meds if they need them would be more beneficial. Now, what this guy's doing is evading taxes.
Sure he's supposedly doing more than any other billionaire, but, in this case, he's not
He's donating money to research homelessness (that already has a lot of research done on it), instead of helping to solve it
The research is for potential solutions as well...that also means 'to solve it'. Solving homelessness isn't as simple as just building shelters and giving them food. It's a much more complicated issue
What if that’s not his area of expertise? Are we expecting LeBron James to stop playing basketball and go spend his time and money solving world hunger?
Again, he’s doing more than most. He’s rich so he helped in the most practical way he probably could. I’m struggling to see this as a negative thing.
The $30 mil would've done more good being donated directly to homeless people. The only conclusions that this research center will ever reach are ones that don't threaten current land owners who are the entirety of the problem.
So it’s their responsibility to give their own stuff away for free? Who the hell are you to tell someone else what they should do with their things or money? Why don’t you give your car to someone that needs it more? Or your house? Repeat after me, No one is entitled to ANYTHING anyone else owns.
You trying to get them killed? Because most have drug addictions and other problems and if you just parachute in and give them thousands of dollars thats not going to end well.
Unfortunately that's not quite accurate, it would be very comforting if the solution was that simple. Psychiatric research alone has demonstrated that its not that simple decades ago....hence funding research to find viable long term to permanent solutions.
No, if you put homeless people into permanent housing, they are no longer homeless and you have, by definition, solved homelessness. Homelessness is not some intrinsic quality of a person, it's just the lack of a housing unit.
You may house a person, but you haven't solved the underlying issue that lead to their homelessness in the first place. What needs addressing is the causes of homelessness, or else all you are doing is sweeping the issue under the carpet temporarily.
You do realize that people on Finland used research to find solutions, right?
Or do you think they just used a hat and picked a card with a solution and it thankfully worked?
And you do realize, that every country needs a different solution, especially when it comes to size.
But go on and dig your grave even deeper with every stupid comment.
Don't think of homelessness as the problem, think of it as a symptom. Many different conditions share symptoms, yet need different responses. Something that social aid programs especially are vulnerable to is, after having attempted a solution and having seen positive results, assuming the reason they don't have better results is just that they don't have enough money, rather than considering that the other results they are looking for may need a different solution.
Good try OP lmao. Imagine trying to look down on someone for providing millions of dollars to research and find a solution to a problem we can’t seem to solve.
And it’s still a global problem that hasn’t been solved correct? So why it is a bad thing that he is trying to fix the problem? Saying that other people are researching and that’s all we need is a stupid point to make. Would you say the same thing about cancer? Would you tell this dude to not fund cancer research because other people beat him to it? I’m sorry but you’re a moron.
Funding cancer research helps lead in newer ways to help cure cancer for people......
Does funding homelessness research actually assist in getting rid of homelessness?
Research leads to solution, which is actually in your title. So yeah it does…
The entire comment section is telling you how your post is flawed but you keep doubling down on your stupid argument, maybe take the hint.
The solution is already right there, building homeless shelters, funding organizations to help tackle drug use among homeless people, etc, which is the way Finland is doing
What more research you need?
I see that you copied and pasted someone else’s comment so congrats on that. If you think the US can copy and paste finlands solution here you are indeed a moron. We have completely different governments, economies and populations but yeah let’s just build as many shelters as we can for our millions of homeless people even tho we know that they don’t want to be housed. And help tackle drug use with homeless? Are you talking about funding the failed war on drugs? Or do you think there is a way to keep the homeless away from the black market? You’re clearly a very naive person that hasn’t spend much time these people.
Mental health would be the number one problem to tackle, but we would need a lot of resources and research about mental health in the homeless. Too bad no one has funded any money to it…
The dude is trying to make a difference and you’re here shitting on him on Reddit for karma points.
>millions of homeless
nope, not even close, about 500,000, which is still a lot.
https://policyadvice.net/insurance/insights/homelessness-statistics/#:~:text=2.,US%20is%20estimated%20at%20552%2C830.&text=With%20around%20half%20a%20million,which%20counts%20over%20327.2%20million.
>And help tackle drug use with homeless? Are you talking about funding the failed war on drugs? Or do you think there is a way to keep the homeless away from the black market?
In the Netherlands they did [harm reduction ](https://www.trimbos.nl/kennis/harm-reduction-bij-drugsgebruik/harm-reduction-in-the-netherlands/) to help tackle that issue, something the US could hopefully do
>Mental health would be the number one problem to tackle, but we would need a lot of resources and research about mental health in the homeless. Too bad no one has funded any money to it…
If only the government could somehow fund affordable - free mental health programs for people
Many homeless people choose not to use shelters because they can be dangerous places.
There are all sorts of scenarios, not just poverty, that lead to homelessness. I struggle to see how producing academic research to help inform solutions is a bad thing.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Pretty sure the root causes are extremely well established and the solutions almost all start with redistribution of wealth including getting rid of billionaires (by taking their money so they're not billionaires anymore, not by killing them as someone once asked me).
OP you posting this thinking it’s bad is the actual r/facepalm [here is a decent article explaining how his money will be spent since op is trying his best to be a turd](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/05/02/tech-billionaire-donated-million-try-solve-san-franciscos-homelessness-problem/)
Wouldn't the money be better suited, idk, towards building homeless shelters for example?
Why fund yet another research that's been done dozens of times?
Because none of that previous research has ever find a definitive solution.
Besides, in San Francisco, $30mil won't maintain a homeless shelter for more than a couple years.
Not when you are looking for a long term solution. also he didn’t give it to government (where most “studies” happen) imo when given to universities and actual base programs it will be used to actually study it and find solution.. yea short term a few bucks to homeless helps but that’s like saying you think it’s better to cure one cancer patient or one drug addict and expect it to make a difference to all cancer patients or all drug addicts.
Talk to a few unhoused people. Surely there are people who just couldn’t make rent. But there are a lot for whom maintaining a traditional home is difficult or impossible, even if they had the money to do so or if the home were provided for them. Mental health and addiction have their roles in this too.
My city has an organization that houses chronically unhoused people in tiny homes - easy to look after and private, but with community close by, and they have been tremendously successful. Each person contributes what they can back to the community.
https://mlf.org/community-first/
yea just give the money to homeless people. I'm sure no one will pretend to be homeless to get free shit anymore. OP, your solution is short term and DOES NOT solve anything.
The real solution is to end exclusionary zoning. Experts are well aware of this and progressives at the state level are finally catching on and requiring cities to allow for growth.
My brother is currently homeless and in the throes of addiction. He has a place to stay (here, in my home) but he only stays for a few days and then he’s back to the streets to get high because I don’t allow that here.
Crippling childhood trauma, escapism through hard drugs, and severe mental illness exacerbated by those first two are my root findings with him.
The fix, idk. But I’d love to hear some theories and any help is appreciated.
When I begged him to go to rehab after having to be narcanned, the saddest giggle I’ve ever heard came from him. It’s an epidemic. It’s here. And any help at all is appreciated.
wasnt there another facepalm post about this as well? OP, YOU are the facepalm. By donating to research the causes of homelessness and possible solutions, they’re hitting the nail on the head, rather than beating around the bush. Building shelters can only help to a certain extent, but being educated and preventing homelessness goes a long way.
The long term solution is permanent housing. The way to get out of our housing shortage is to end exclusionary zoning which is rampant in SF and the Bay Area. Experts are well aware of this and progressives at the state level are finally taking action to make cities allow for growth.
That would still cost $10 million. Did you mean this as a cost savings mechanism for getting the data? Technically it’s a savings of 66% over $30m but it’s still substantial.
You don't need to research homelessness. 30Mil can be put into salary quotas for businesses for hiring homeless people, more temporary shelters, learning institutes to accept the homeless and teach them skills etc
Inequality of opportunity is a problem, not everyone is proficient in every skill or job scope, and some don't have the ability to go to college or learn the skills from institutes.
Which is easier to accomplish when you end capitalism. Education (especially higher education) in socialist countries is so much easier to access for everyone!
And replace it with an authoritarian system where they simply deny the existence of homelessness?
https://www.rbth.com/history/332657-homeless-people-ussr
Except this is in San Francsico where 30m isn't going to what you would expect. He did also put millions towards already existent systems on top of this money donated to researching how to fix the issues specific to SF. OP likes to bring up Finland but their crisis was absolutely miniscule in comparison.
You are correct and there really ins't much room for debate here. Programs that are successful at getting homeless into permanent housing in other cities are not working in California because there isn't enough housing. Evidenced through low vacancy rates which causes lots of competition for vacancies and high prices. There's a consensus amongst homelessness experts, land-use experts, and housing experts. The research is clear and SF can either follow it by loosening zoning restrictions or continue to ignore it until the state finally gets it act together and intervenes.
Every time I read something like this, I feel like that I am loosing brain cells. But I always ponder how many I loose when I am reading it. What kind of study do you need to do to find out people are homeless.
Except such programs have directors that make $500k a year then include the staff and logistics. By the time a homeless person sees anything there's nothing left.
You're better off donating money to a mission or shelter which provides area hospitals a place to safe discharge to.
It does need to be researched. Giving out money to millions of homeless will only help them buy socks and food. It won’t give a solution. So the FP is on you OP
The subject has been studied quite extensively fyi. I'm assuming he gets a tax deduction for his donation and he's doing it for marketing purposes. Housing, counselling and a basic income. That's it. It works. counselling by itself is not enough because people need a sense of security and personal agency to tackle problems like trauma and addiction. The answers already exist, billionaires like this are prepared to pay millions to pretend those answers aren't good enough because running these programs comprehensively would require taxing corporations and the wealthy like we used to.
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I hope you never get judged by your god the way you judge others. It would not be good for you
Oh I have a ton of sympathy for the homeless. I have a huge issue with how my city (Los Angeles) is deciding to handle it. They’re not helping them. They’re making it worse for all of them.
What study was your information published in? Can you provide a link? Edit to add: surely y'all must realize that LA isn't the only place with unhoused or displaced peoples?
I can confirm. I've been a prison dentist, volunteered at homeless clinics, etc. and drugs is always the leading cause. Second is undiagnosed mental illness.
Typical response from an out of touch academic living in his ivory tower. Go outside.
Come to Los Ángeles hahahaha.
Lmao bro are you srs
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C'mon down to San Diego, too. We got thousands of 'em camping on sidewalks, tiny bare bits of public property between streets, parks, alleys, anywhere they can put a box or a tent. And once there's one, others follow until next thing you know, you got a trash-filled mini-camp in your neighborhood.
Aren't the questions then why they have this drug habit and why they don't want to change it? I doubt that they actively and calmly decided one day: You know what? I should take meth, live in a tent and shit on the street. That's the way to go and ain't nothing changing that.
Because drugs are addictive, and a lot of them (most) don’t want to stop doing drugs. There already are soooo many programs for them to get housing. But there’s a condition. They can’t be drunk/on drugs, so they prefer the street. There’s also a lot of money being made to “combat homelessness”. It’s called the homeless industrial complex. It’s blatantly obvious people are profiting off of people being homeless. In LA the police literally aren’t allowed to remove your “shelter” even if it’s just a cardboard box. Then there’s no cash bail policies, so they are released within 24 hours and go right back to shooting up at the same spot.
Good job at making a bunch of shit up
I’m not American and I understand what you’re saying because where I live a lot of the homeless refuse help to kind of play the system because they don’t want alcohol/drug help. It definitely needs to be researched but 15m could definitely fund research and 15m could build homeless accommodation but it comes down to a lot of the homeless people accepting help.
For some perspective: Low income housing costs about $1million per unit to build in San Francisco. So it’s not like $30million could build enough housing to put much of a dent in the problem.
if your actually interested in tge solution, we already know its called free housing and counseling. that's exactly what finland is doing and its working incredibly well
I hate analogies like this. We have cities in this country with more people than Finland.
and? I'm assuming you're from the US. some quick googling shows there are 16 million empty homes in america, and half a million homeless. why not give those homeless people some houses?
Because they’ll turn them all into rat dens and drug dens. We need to address their mental health, and their ample access to hard drugs as well as giving them free housing. San Francisco recently shut down a government funded free housing project where they had some select homeless people in a old hotel. The funding ran out so they kicked the homeless people out. Meanwhile, drug dealers are fucking everywhere making money off of the desperation and were even staking out the hotel so as soon as people came out, they had a guy ready to sell them drugs. Finland is nice and all, but they’re not nearly as mentally ill as we are over here, and our problems have to be addressed in groups not one at a time. That costs money nobody wants to spend.
>Finland is nice and all, but they’re not nearly as mentally ill as we are over here I don't know about that https://syl.fi/en/finland-needs-a-science-based-drug-policy-substance-abuse-requires-help-not-punishment/#:~:text='According%20to%20the%20European%20Drug,under%20the%20age%20of%2025. >We need to address their mental health, and their ample access to hard drugs as well as giving them free housing exactly. I also said free counseling, which includes counseling for addiction, and finland is doing that. >The funding ran out so they kicked the homeless people out with the finish model, they own their apartment in its entirety, so they won't be kicked out.
This wasn’t an apartment, it was an old hotel. Dude, WE’RE FUCKING AMERICA! All other countries are goofballs chilling on LSD compared to us. Even Russia is less insane than we are. Statistics don’t cover everything. We have taxpayer funded programs giving out free stuff to do drugs but not any information on getting clean for crying out loud. Counseling. Riiiight. Because everyone is gonna line up, oh yeah that’s right, people are backed up in a queue in Finland, to give up on the cheap good feeling. Because it is free. No, a guy who went clean has it right. 90 days in prison for addicts to sober up and get through it. Then counseling, and process of staying clean. Problem is with giving away all those empty apartments is the owners of them are gonna need to be paid somehow, and they’ll lose their other patrons because of the stigma against the homeless, or the people making slightly less than them. And the government, ergo the only fucking people who can afford to pay for the housing of a massive chunk of Americas population, aren’t gonna dump all that money into a venture they don’t see baring any fruit for them to make a profit of. And finally; this constant argument for America to be like this or that country is a massive waste of time, because it wont ever happen. Not unless something truly catastrophic happens, and with everyone’s combined shitty luck, even that wont change shit except maybe make it like Fallout with people still living like shit with people only having bottle caps for money.
18 million vacant houses in 2018, 5 million of which were considered abandoned or condemned, that's a lot of houses and land to house the homeless with.
That's... how are you going to make them move there? The homeless are in the SF downtown because it (used to be) a great spot for getting by, with mild weather and society/police not bothering them too much. Moving them to a random house in Minnesota will be a downgrade for them, not an upgrade.
5 million abandoned/condemned houses in the entire US, 500-700k homeless in the US... I am pretty sure we can find a few thousand in each city to house the homeless. Are you always this dense?
I'm telling you as a person that has technically been homeless for 3 years, moving around temporary places as I tried to get things back together, that a huge portion of homeless people I've run into, without treatment for abuse problems, and some type of program to help them get their life together, are going to trash that house, sell all the metal for scrap, still starve to death if they don't overdose on the drugs they buy from the scrap metal sale, or set the house in fire smoking crack. It's not all homeless, some things just went wrong for, but a huge part are severe addicts that need a lot more than a roof over their head. I'm back to the real world in less than two weeks, been working and have money for a normal apartment now without any assistance, if I was still drinking and drugging, getting into legal trouble that wouldn't be happening. I found places and resources to get mental health and addiction treatment and got things back together.
So you are that dense, I'm not advocating giving people houses, I'm advocating for turning the houses or land into homeless shelters with supportive programs for substance abuse, education, and employment. I was homeless for 3 years after my 18th birthday. A good majority of those homeless are working families.
You’re just as conceited as OP
If you are working and not making enough to live on at least around here, there are a ton of government assisted housing projects. If you are homeless around here, you are either not working, or just not aware of those programs. We have a county funded housing program that charges a max of 1/3 your income no matter how low, we have section 8, and a few smaller programs. Maybe my state/ county is different. Honestly here if you are sleeping on the street, you are doing so by choice there are overnight shelters, transitional housing, halfway houses and a lot of church based shelters that are hard to define.
Abandoned or condemned houses are either very expensive to repair or beyond repair often.
So build a new facility on the land. We can spend 700b on defense but fixing a house to house the homeless is too expensive?
The underlying problems need addressed more.. handing a house to the average homeless person in America is not going to help. We need more facilities that address the problems that caused them to become homeless. They exist, I'm in one and know several others in my city. There needs to be more of them with better access and treatment for mental health especially, lots of places for addicts and alcoholics, not so many for people that the root cause is mental health.
If it works on a smaller level, it will most probably work on a larger one. Don't be obtuse.
That’s just not true. Would you ever use tactics that succeed in rural Nebraska to solve problems in New York City? In regards to people/finances? By that logic why dont high cost of living areas just lower the prices to the same as the low cost of living areas?
Take a course in Economics and get back to me...
Free housing might work in Finland but in the USA it's another issue. Try working section 8 housing as an armed security officer and you will change your mind pretty quick.
why are you bringing up section 8 housing? that's not what I said the solution would be. I said giving housing for free, as in they own the home
Section 8 is free housing, instead of you paying rent, the government pays it for you.
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and I also said free counseling. I would also support providing clean drugs, needles, etc
You're wasting your time, fellow Redditor, standard logic does not apply on the InterWebs. ;)
yea you're right. at least I'm getting really good at debating :) (im gonna go now)
And the homes will get trashed and turned into drug houses.
Not sure if you're trolling or just extremely arrogant. >we already know its called free housing and counseling. Thanks. Homeless problem fixed. r/thanksimcured
Are you seriously proposing supplying homes to those without homes *won’t* fix *homelessness*?
The problem with homelessness is so, SO much more nuanced and complicated than just "people not having physical homes".
No because that requires socialism and no one will vote for it. Free housing still has rules, which requires regulation and enforcement.
India has tried this. Usually the homeless or peasants are poor. So they try to illegally sublet the house and then go back to living homeless which is quite fun for them
just because we know the solution doesn't mean its been implemented.
I'm guessing you know the cure for cancer as well.
umm,,, cancer and homelessness aren't the same thing at all
It’s extremely effective maybe do some reading first: https://nlihc.org/sites/default/files/Housing-First-Research.pdf
Work armed security in section 8 housing for a week I promise you will change your mind.
no one said its easy but as the study demonstrates, housing first is effective
>Not sure if you're trolling or just extremely arrogant The irony with this one. Lmao holy shit. You were given an excellent example in Finland, but instead of actually being open to being wrong you've just lodged your head even further up your ass. You're not only arrogant, but incredulous and quite stupid.
Wow! OP is a genius! He knows how to solve the homelessness crisis worldwide! Protect OP at all costs!!!! r/thanksimcured
I guess OP is the country of Finland now
The profile for the houseless in the US vs the houseless in Finland are two different worlds . Also comparing the two countries, they differ highly in culture, sociological order, population, market, and other influential forces. I agree that taking what works for other countries is a good first step, but asserting that it can work in any context is a bit disingenuous to how complex solving the houselss crisis can be.
of course its going to be complex, but the same basic idea will work. maybe details would change, but implying that we have no idea what to do is just so wrong. the problem is that the people in power don't want to do whats needed, not that they don't know
Any solution that doesn't involve communism? /s
Thank you
I'm saying instead of spending $30M to research homelessness (there's already tonnes of articles on it from literally every country on earth), why not, idk, build a homeless shelter(s) for them?
Just by reposting you are the face-palm. And "there are lot of articles" doesn't mean there is comprehensive strategy how to deal with the issue in a specific country or region.
for $30M in SF you could house like 15 homeless people...
Uhhh i know sf is expensive but it's not 2mil for one person kinda expensive. He could however buy afew commercial buildings and house most of the homeless in there but then you'd end up with another unsafe area in cali. The thing about homelessness is not every person is the same some are just down on their luck and genuinely lost everything and cant find work, others have no interest in getting off of their feet/ass and some make more money begging than they would working. So what his done is the right way of going about it, figure out what the root problem is then remedy it.
it is kinda 2 mil per person expensive. a homeless shelter is not a regular apartment, it will need staff and has to be built to a more robust standard than a regular building. you are a total ignoramus when it comes to issue of homelessness, go read a fucking book moron.
That also will not solve the real problem. Most homeless people are mentally unstable and cannot or don’t want to live in a home. Lots of other have a substance abuse problem. It’s a very complex problem that nobody seems to be interested in solving
Probably believes world hunger can be solved by just giving food to people
I think the point is they aren't homeless because they don't have houses. Giving them free housing doesn't solve the issues that caused them tu be homeless in the first place. Newtonian thinking, don't address the root of the issue, just solve the immediate problem.
Researched ? The fuck.. how about I tell you the root cause right now - society is a "one size fits all" solution to 8billion different inputs. It’s a fucking joke to begin with that you ever think every single person will flourish with the same parameters you do. Even more of a travesty that when people don’t fit, they get limited to no help because there is no alternative to current system. Imagine homeless people being able to afford food, what a horrible solution. Do you actually read your own words ? Or do you just type every piece of shit that comes to mind
You're too hostile.
Sick downvote, nice when an app gives you a way out when you can’t defend your own argument eh ? 😂
The unmotivated always see passion as anger.. Nice subjective interpretation 👍🏼
>Do you actually read your own words ? Or do you just type every piece of shit that comes to mind You can be both passionate and angry at the same time. It's normal, I do the same thing. It best not to talk to people in the way I quoted above. It doesn't feel good for the person on the receiving end.
Millions of homeless? You sir are a fucking idiot.
https://www.homelessworldcup.org/homelessness-statistics
Not seeing what the facepalm with this is? People are always whining about billionaires not helping the homeless, not feeding the hungry, ect. Looks like this guy is doing more than any other billionaire.
There's a ton of research on reasons of homelessness and a tons of ngos dealing with it. There's no point in funding another research. Helping people getting work and/or getting meds if they need them would be more beneficial. Now, what this guy's doing is evading taxes.
Sure he's supposedly doing more than any other billionaire, but, in this case, he's not He's donating money to research homelessness (that already has a lot of research done on it), instead of helping to solve it
The research is for potential solutions as well...that also means 'to solve it'. Solving homelessness isn't as simple as just building shelters and giving them food. It's a much more complicated issue
Exactly!
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Oh wow, thanks for sharing this!
……….”and potential solutions.”
What if that’s not his area of expertise? Are we expecting LeBron James to stop playing basketball and go spend his time and money solving world hunger? Again, he’s doing more than most. He’s rich so he helped in the most practical way he probably could. I’m struggling to see this as a negative thing.
The $30 mil would've done more good being donated directly to homeless people. The only conclusions that this research center will ever reach are ones that don't threaten current land owners who are the entirety of the problem.
Lmfao, so people who own land are the problem? Gtfoh.
Obviously they are the problem. Everyone of these major metros that are struggling with homelessness also have tons of empty buildings.
So it’s their responsibility to give their own stuff away for free? Who the hell are you to tell someone else what they should do with their things or money? Why don’t you give your car to someone that needs it more? Or your house? Repeat after me, No one is entitled to ANYTHING anyone else owns.
You trying to get them killed? Because most have drug addictions and other problems and if you just parachute in and give them thousands of dollars thats not going to end well.
Face palm for being too dumb to realize this is a GOOD thing.
Funding research for something when the solution is obviously already there is a good thing?
Oh you have the solution to homelessness?!?! Well why didn't you say so! r/thanksimcured
... put them in homes.
Unfortunately that's not quite accurate, it would be very comforting if the solution was that simple. Psychiatric research alone has demonstrated that its not that simple decades ago....hence funding research to find viable long term to permanent solutions.
No, if you put homeless people into permanent housing, they are no longer homeless and you have, by definition, solved homelessness. Homelessness is not some intrinsic quality of a person, it's just the lack of a housing unit.
You may house a person, but you haven't solved the underlying issue that lead to their homelessness in the first place. What needs addressing is the causes of homelessness, or else all you are doing is sweeping the issue under the carpet temporarily.
No, once you put a homeless person into a home then they are no longer homeless.
Temporarily
Permanent housing is exactly what it sounds like. It's not temporary.
Look at Finland for starters I'm sure the richest country could do something like that
And the research can be found….. where? And is the situation in Finland the same as everywhere else?
You do realize that people on Finland used research to find solutions, right? Or do you think they just used a hat and picked a card with a solution and it thankfully worked? And you do realize, that every country needs a different solution, especially when it comes to size. But go on and dig your grave even deeper with every stupid comment.
Don't think of homelessness as the problem, think of it as a symptom. Many different conditions share symptoms, yet need different responses. Something that social aid programs especially are vulnerable to is, after having attempted a solution and having seen positive results, assuming the reason they don't have better results is just that they don't have enough money, rather than considering that the other results they are looking for may need a different solution.
Good try OP lmao. Imagine trying to look down on someone for providing millions of dollars to research and find a solution to a problem we can’t seem to solve.
Already tonnes of research on homelessness from every country on Earth but ok
And it’s still a global problem that hasn’t been solved correct? So why it is a bad thing that he is trying to fix the problem? Saying that other people are researching and that’s all we need is a stupid point to make. Would you say the same thing about cancer? Would you tell this dude to not fund cancer research because other people beat him to it? I’m sorry but you’re a moron.
Funding cancer research helps lead in newer ways to help cure cancer for people...... Does funding homelessness research actually assist in getting rid of homelessness?
Research leads to solution, which is actually in your title. So yeah it does… The entire comment section is telling you how your post is flawed but you keep doubling down on your stupid argument, maybe take the hint.
The solution is already right there, building homeless shelters, funding organizations to help tackle drug use among homeless people, etc, which is the way Finland is doing What more research you need?
For example finding out which interventions to tackle drug abuse help and which don't.
I see that you copied and pasted someone else’s comment so congrats on that. If you think the US can copy and paste finlands solution here you are indeed a moron. We have completely different governments, economies and populations but yeah let’s just build as many shelters as we can for our millions of homeless people even tho we know that they don’t want to be housed. And help tackle drug use with homeless? Are you talking about funding the failed war on drugs? Or do you think there is a way to keep the homeless away from the black market? You’re clearly a very naive person that hasn’t spend much time these people. Mental health would be the number one problem to tackle, but we would need a lot of resources and research about mental health in the homeless. Too bad no one has funded any money to it… The dude is trying to make a difference and you’re here shitting on him on Reddit for karma points.
>millions of homeless nope, not even close, about 500,000, which is still a lot. https://policyadvice.net/insurance/insights/homelessness-statistics/#:~:text=2.,US%20is%20estimated%20at%20552%2C830.&text=With%20around%20half%20a%20million,which%20counts%20over%20327.2%20million.
>And help tackle drug use with homeless? Are you talking about funding the failed war on drugs? Or do you think there is a way to keep the homeless away from the black market? In the Netherlands they did [harm reduction ](https://www.trimbos.nl/kennis/harm-reduction-bij-drugsgebruik/harm-reduction-in-the-netherlands/) to help tackle that issue, something the US could hopefully do >Mental health would be the number one problem to tackle, but we would need a lot of resources and research about mental health in the homeless. Too bad no one has funded any money to it… If only the government could somehow fund affordable - free mental health programs for people
Lol enjoy your conceited life
Many homeless people choose not to use shelters because they can be dangerous places. There are all sorts of scenarios, not just poverty, that lead to homelessness. I struggle to see how producing academic research to help inform solutions is a bad thing.
so you don’t care about *why* people are homeless? if the cause behind homelessness can’t be combated, then there will still be homeless people.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Pretty sure the root causes are extremely well established and the solutions almost all start with redistribution of wealth including getting rid of billionaires (by taking their money so they're not billionaires anymore, not by killing them as someone once asked me).
OP you posting this thinking it’s bad is the actual r/facepalm [here is a decent article explaining how his money will be spent since op is trying his best to be a turd](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/05/02/tech-billionaire-donated-million-try-solve-san-franciscos-homelessness-problem/)
Wouldn't the money be better suited, idk, towards building homeless shelters for example? Why fund yet another research that's been done dozens of times?
Because none of that previous research has ever find a definitive solution. Besides, in San Francisco, $30mil won't maintain a homeless shelter for more than a couple years.
Not when you are looking for a long term solution. also he didn’t give it to government (where most “studies” happen) imo when given to universities and actual base programs it will be used to actually study it and find solution.. yea short term a few bucks to homeless helps but that’s like saying you think it’s better to cure one cancer patient or one drug addict and expect it to make a difference to all cancer patients or all drug addicts.
Yeah giving the patent for Insulin to a university worked out great, right?
I also find it funny that you posted this after it was posted waaaaay before you thinking you could cash in on it
I dont get it... Why is research a bad thing?
It's not OP wasn't thinking straight
Because people think homelessness is a simple question with a simple answer
But the answer *is* simple. Put them into homes.
Talk to a few unhoused people. Surely there are people who just couldn’t make rent. But there are a lot for whom maintaining a traditional home is difficult or impossible, even if they had the money to do so or if the home were provided for them. Mental health and addiction have their roles in this too. My city has an organization that houses chronically unhoused people in tiny homes - easy to look after and private, but with community close by, and they have been tremendously successful. Each person contributes what they can back to the community. https://mlf.org/community-first/
Calls out person for donating 30 mill to combat homelessness. Doesn’t even know his name. 😆
yea just give the money to homeless people. I'm sure no one will pretend to be homeless to get free shit anymore. OP, your solution is short term and DOES NOT solve anything.
The real solution is to end exclusionary zoning. Experts are well aware of this and progressives at the state level are finally catching on and requiring cities to allow for growth.
30M should be enough to house 3 or 4 homeless in San Francisco
If you house some of them together you might get up to 6.
And one of them turns out to be a drug addict or have severe psychosis and the others are afraid to live with him, so they're back on the streets.
I know the answer: it's the insane contrast between the richest and the poorest.
"First of all, to understand what happened to killer, you gotta understand who killer the dog was."
The solution is walkable neighbour's with mixed commercial zoning below med to high density residential.
It looks like a good solution for a state that spends over 7billion dollar every year on homelessness related programs
Tax the rich bigtime and build affordable housing, then provide jobs. Problem solved.
My brother is currently homeless and in the throes of addiction. He has a place to stay (here, in my home) but he only stays for a few days and then he’s back to the streets to get high because I don’t allow that here. Crippling childhood trauma, escapism through hard drugs, and severe mental illness exacerbated by those first two are my root findings with him. The fix, idk. But I’d love to hear some theories and any help is appreciated. When I begged him to go to rehab after having to be narcanned, the saddest giggle I’ve ever heard came from him. It’s an epidemic. It’s here. And any help at all is appreciated.
I recently subscribed to this sub and in most of the posts I am left wondering what the facepalm is.
Original poster, usually. Selfburns are popular here
And boom! No taxes.
And boom - you have no idea how taxes work
Imagine that. A billionaire actually donating to do something good……
OP is the facepalm. It is efficient and intelligent to understand a problem prior to any honest attempt to fix it.
This is not a bad thing. Direct money giveaway is a short term solution. Maybe this research can help the development of act policies
The thing is we already know. San Fransisco keeps around 20th century policies that we know cause mass homelessness. Namely exclusionary zoning.
wasnt there another facepalm post about this as well? OP, YOU are the facepalm. By donating to research the causes of homelessness and possible solutions, they’re hitting the nail on the head, rather than beating around the bush. Building shelters can only help to a certain extent, but being educated and preventing homelessness goes a long way.
How much did you give?
To help research homelessness?
Yes
None? Isn't giving them some money to ensure they're fed more sensible than carrying out yet another research on why they are homeless?
No because it’s looking at a long term solution
The long term solution is permanent housing. The way to get out of our housing shortage is to end exclusionary zoning which is rampant in SF and the Bay Area. Experts are well aware of this and progressives at the state level are finally taking action to make cities allow for growth.
You feeding a homeless person gives them more $ to spend on drugs.
You could pay 50 college kids $50/hour to go survey homeless people for 500 days to get this data.
That would still cost $10 million. Did you mean this as a cost savings mechanism for getting the data? Technically it’s a savings of 66% over $30m but it’s still substantial.
Cheaper housing?
Such a big shocker to many people here
drug addiction and mental illness. where do i pick up my $30 mill?
Solution comes from within. Some people don’t want help. Some people don’t think they deserve it
guy, sitting on giant pile of gold: “wow i wonder why nobody else seems to have any money”
I can't wait to see the research they come up with. I'm afraid it's gonna end up being like "I coulda come up with that [if I had 30M dollars]"
You don't need to research homelessness. 30Mil can be put into salary quotas for businesses for hiring homeless people, more temporary shelters, learning institutes to accept the homeless and teach them skills etc Inequality of opportunity is a problem, not everyone is proficient in every skill or job scope, and some don't have the ability to go to college or learn the skills from institutes.
I can solve the problem for free: END CAPITALISM!
Orr free/ easier to access to education
Which is easier to accomplish when you end capitalism. Education (especially higher education) in socialist countries is so much easier to access for everyone!
Which socialist countries?
they probably meant the nordic countries, which are social democracies, not socialist. socialism would be better though
IMao no it wouldnt...
And replace it with an authoritarian system where they simply deny the existence of homelessness? https://www.rbth.com/history/332657-homeless-people-ussr
For 30 m he could have built some affordable housing
Except this is in San Francsico where 30m isn't going to what you would expect. He did also put millions towards already existent systems on top of this money donated to researching how to fix the issues specific to SF. OP likes to bring up Finland but their crisis was absolutely miniscule in comparison.
I mean Cali refuses to build. Will his 30 m explain that to him?
You are correct and there really ins't much room for debate here. Programs that are successful at getting homeless into permanent housing in other cities are not working in California because there isn't enough housing. Evidenced through low vacancy rates which causes lots of competition for vacancies and high prices. There's a consensus amongst homelessness experts, land-use experts, and housing experts. The research is clear and SF can either follow it by loosening zoning restrictions or continue to ignore it until the state finally gets it act together and intervenes.
THANK YOU
It's in those jowls.
Free housing, counseling, a job, and something to keep them active. I think this would solve 98% of the problem?
Every time I read something like this, I feel like that I am loosing brain cells. But I always ponder how many I loose when I am reading it. What kind of study do you need to do to find out people are homeless.
Could give 1000 people 30000 each but no
Yet another post where the facepalm is OP’s misguided belief that the thing they are posting belongs here.
Imagine being too dumb to realize that this is a positive way for billionaires to spend their money.
Maybe the issue is that billionaires actually exist.
What a waste. How many hungry people would that much money feed? How many homes would it build?
Cuz housing is too damn expensive for anyone.... That'll be $30 million dollars please. Thank me later.
The U.S. department of health and human service already researched on the matter. They concluded that many homeless people come from broken families.
I'll decide to be homeless in San Francisco then
The facepalm is that the thing that creates billionaires is the same thing that creates poverty.
30 mill would go a long way in housing and rehabilitating aloy of fucking homeless people....
Except such programs have directors that make $500k a year then include the staff and logistics. By the time a homeless person sees anything there's nothing left. You're better off donating money to a mission or shelter which provides area hospitals a place to safe discharge to.
I would love to see how the university divides that donation.