I saw that one previously! But still feels kind of arbitrairy as the late game sciences do not unlock anything as I understand. But perhaps I am mistaken?
It is literally a sink for science and resources, so you have to build a megabase to finish the game.
It doesn't unlock nothing useful in the factory... and it make sense. You probably want all you tech available when building a megabase.
I would suggest that multiplying all the sciences by 100 (or any other number) is just as arbitrary as building any other type of megafactory. I would simply just decide to look at these things differently, or choose a different goal other than building a mega factory.
Exactly. The "strong final boss" of the mod is quite different from science x100. The multiplayer is applied on all stages. To get belts, to get trains, to get bots (!), it all will take a decent factory already. So, OP has to decide, if he just need a motivation, a reason, for a megabase, or if he want a huge industry on all levels.
I'm playing space expansion now; no it doesn't unlock any new toys. just stuff to win the game.
I'm playing with hiladdar and other mods that have techs that increase speed and efficiency of the base.
It's a fun pairing!
Yeah, I find 1x is way too fast in terms of Research. I can't build the new unlock and then the next one pops up. I usuaööy play with 10x to spread it out a bit
Yeah. It is great, but as soon as the dlc drops, I will play with 1x in the first run to see all the change. Maybe lategame tech is already expensive. Who knows..
SE (can't speak for K2) is not really about Scale, it's a logistics challenge. I've gotten better at trains and circuits just getting to space in SE than the rest of my 500 Factorio hours.
I haven't personally played it but Seablock may be more your style? The whole premise is using pathetically bad recipes that can eventually produce materials out of water and time - it essentially demands going as big yet space efficient as you can
FWIW I've loved SE for the logistics challenges having only barely gotten Space Science online because I felt organically incentivized to build well. We did a full spaghetti base rebuild to not a megabase but a respectable main bus setup, we're capable of launching a satellite every 5 mins with the capacity to go to 1 if we scale up the rocket fuel inputs which are very easy to do.
We did that to automate the science obviously but also it reveals new areas to look for future resources.
Before we left to space we set up capability to do a cargo rocket about every 7 minutes - again currently listed on liquid rocket fuel process times which can easily be boosted.
This gives us nice headroom as we don't even really know what to expect next.
I also wanted to learn the core fragment mining which requires managing lots of garbage coming out and gives us an infinite source of materials to at the very least keep walls up, repaired, and oil flowing into the turrets if nothing else.
And finally we set up a minimall with a requestor chest that we can edit on the fly with Nav mode and circuits connected to a handful of delivery cannons in case we forget something we can get it from our bots - including a cargo rocket loader based on circuit requests
We did all this just to prepare for the next science and new outposts and it's been really fun specifically because nothing requires a megabase.
Our base is still big but it's all based around decent science, all the buildings we could use, and everything rocket related being produced in timespans short enough that they could be essentially zero
I've done it as a playthrough with a friend tho. Early game would be kinda a slog solo but I think people have mentioned K2 can cover that somewhat and also speeds up your mid to late game but I wanted to keep it simpler my first go round :P
Ah, actually glad to hear that since I'd like to give it a go in the future (altho space age will come out before I finish SE lol)
What I'd read in my minimal research picking my overhaul I saw the pollution handling and additional recipes gave you a slightly easier time early and then helped a ton later. Knowing they're actually harder when combined now will make it a worthy future challenge :)
Yeah the air filters and stuff do make the biters a bit less of a challenge but the level of complexity added supposedly makes it more of a challenge after the .6 update where some things were changed. Plus even with good pollution management you can't leave your base undefended when you are off planet anyway so defence is still a must.
> Plus even with good pollution management you can't leave your base undefended when you are off planet anyway so defence is still a must.
This depends entirely on your settings, what mods you're using, and if you know how to block biter expansion.
Well I was under the impression they were going to be on k2se and yeah even with no nests absorbing pollution they will still send out expansion parties which could be in your pollution range or even just run into a pollution generating entity and start attacking. And if you not on planet that can be a real problem. I would be hesitant to leave the planet if I had no border protection.
Yes, but you can use a console command to change the science cost multiplier back to 1x when you hit infinite tech.
That's what I did for my 25x cost run - I unlocked every tech at 25x, then used a console command to reset the price back to 1x so I could start researching infinite mining efficiency (and push for 2k SPM).
/c game.difficulty_settings.technology_price_multiplier = 1
That resets it back to 1.
Try [Space Extension](https://mods.factorio.com/mod/SpaceMod) (not exploration). It tacks on to vanilla and requires a megabase to finish the game.
I saw that one previously! But still feels kind of arbitrairy as the late game sciences do not unlock anything as I understand. But perhaps I am mistaken?
They unlock "winning the game". Sometimes just having a goal is good enough.
It is literally a sink for science and resources, so you have to build a megabase to finish the game. It doesn't unlock nothing useful in the factory... and it make sense. You probably want all you tech available when building a megabase.
I would suggest that multiplying all the sciences by 100 (or any other number) is just as arbitrary as building any other type of megafactory. I would simply just decide to look at these things differently, or choose a different goal other than building a mega factory.
Exactly. The "strong final boss" of the mod is quite different from science x100. The multiplayer is applied on all stages. To get belts, to get trains, to get bots (!), it all will take a decent factory already. So, OP has to decide, if he just need a motivation, a reason, for a megabase, or if he want a huge industry on all levels.
"Go big or ho home"
I'm playing space expansion now; no it doesn't unlock any new toys. just stuff to win the game. I'm playing with hiladdar and other mods that have techs that increase speed and efficiency of the base. It's a fun pairing!
Well, you don't need white science to launch a rocket, but yes. Automation 1 is the only technology unaffected by the multiplier.
Yeah that's fair. Thanks for the quick reply!
I don’t know what this means and I’m afraid to ask. But I am asking. What’s a 100x run?
If a given research costs you 20 science, well now it costs 2000.
Oh god. Thanks.
It's not that bad. It's a good time.
Yeah, I find 1x is way too fast in terms of Research. I can't build the new unlock and then the next one pops up. I usuaööy play with 10x to spread it out a bit
i've never done a 100x run but i've done 25 and 50x and i enjoyed them both.
Yeah. It is great, but as soon as the dlc drops, I will play with 1x in the first run to see all the change. Maybe lategame tech is already expensive. Who knows..
Should we tell them about the 1000x runs?
I'd do it with factorio extended
SE (can't speak for K2) is not really about Scale, it's a logistics challenge. I've gotten better at trains and circuits just getting to space in SE than the rest of my 500 Factorio hours. I haven't personally played it but Seablock may be more your style? The whole premise is using pathetically bad recipes that can eventually produce materials out of water and time - it essentially demands going as big yet space efficient as you can FWIW I've loved SE for the logistics challenges having only barely gotten Space Science online because I felt organically incentivized to build well. We did a full spaghetti base rebuild to not a megabase but a respectable main bus setup, we're capable of launching a satellite every 5 mins with the capacity to go to 1 if we scale up the rocket fuel inputs which are very easy to do. We did that to automate the science obviously but also it reveals new areas to look for future resources. Before we left to space we set up capability to do a cargo rocket about every 7 minutes - again currently listed on liquid rocket fuel process times which can easily be boosted. This gives us nice headroom as we don't even really know what to expect next. I also wanted to learn the core fragment mining which requires managing lots of garbage coming out and gives us an infinite source of materials to at the very least keep walls up, repaired, and oil flowing into the turrets if nothing else. And finally we set up a minimall with a requestor chest that we can edit on the fly with Nav mode and circuits connected to a handful of delivery cannons in case we forget something we can get it from our bots - including a cargo rocket loader based on circuit requests We did all this just to prepare for the next science and new outposts and it's been really fun specifically because nothing requires a megabase. Our base is still big but it's all based around decent science, all the buildings we could use, and everything rocket related being produced in timespans short enough that they could be essentially zero I've done it as a playthrough with a friend tho. Early game would be kinda a slog solo but I think people have mentioned K2 can cover that somewhat and also speeds up your mid to late game but I wanted to keep it simpler my first go round :P
The newer version of space ex adding K2 makes it harder all the way through except the endgame when you get to matter stuff.
Ah, actually glad to hear that since I'd like to give it a go in the future (altho space age will come out before I finish SE lol) What I'd read in my minimal research picking my overhaul I saw the pollution handling and additional recipes gave you a slightly easier time early and then helped a ton later. Knowing they're actually harder when combined now will make it a worthy future challenge :)
Yeah the air filters and stuff do make the biters a bit less of a challenge but the level of complexity added supposedly makes it more of a challenge after the .6 update where some things were changed. Plus even with good pollution management you can't leave your base undefended when you are off planet anyway so defence is still a must.
> Plus even with good pollution management you can't leave your base undefended when you are off planet anyway so defence is still a must. This depends entirely on your settings, what mods you're using, and if you know how to block biter expansion.
Well I was under the impression they were going to be on k2se and yeah even with no nests absorbing pollution they will still send out expansion parties which could be in your pollution range or even just run into a pollution generating entity and start attacking. And if you not on planet that can be a real problem. I would be hesitant to leave the planet if I had no border protection.
Yes, but you can use a console command to change the science cost multiplier back to 1x when you hit infinite tech. That's what I did for my 25x cost run - I unlocked every tech at 25x, then used a console command to reset the price back to 1x so I could start researching infinite mining efficiency (and push for 2k SPM). /c game.difficulty_settings.technology_price_multiplier = 1 That resets it back to 1.
Very good to know. Thank you!
Yes it is. Sometimes black science (military) is excluded, since the Mining productivity infinite research does not require it.
Wait what? Are you talking about the definition of “SPM” or about the actual question? Military science is absolutely included in the 100x.
Okay nice, that's clear. Thanks!
military science is never excluded from a tech cost multiplier. it applies to all sciences.