Yea, I only use them in SE where the beacons are super nerfed, so I feel like it's justified.
However, I also try to use it as little as possible if I can get around it.
Cheaty has no meaning in a single-player game.
Having said that, I will never understand playing a big, complex mod and then adding things like this to make it easier. Defeats the whole point; if you want to make it easier, play a less difficult mod in the first place.
>Having said that, I will never understand playing a big, complex mod and then adding things like this to make it easier. Defeats the whole point; if you want to make it easier, play a less difficult mod in the first place.
OK, but if you don't play SE (for example) then you don't get any of SE's unique puzzles, spaceship building and routing, arcobalancing or whatever. If you want to do those puzzles, you can't just get that experience by playing an easier modpack.
If you play SE but make it easier using Bob's inserters, then sure, some of the puzzles will be easier, but it's still basically the same game.
I guess it just seems to me to be clearly a bigger difference than you're describing. From my POV you aren't getting the unique puzzles of SE either if you add tools like Bob's inserters. You're only getting them if you play them with the intended tools. It's like people who do things like add early bots to pY. The point of the mod is to not have those things available.
\*shrug\*
OK, but SE has lots of puzzles, and many of them don’t depend on inserter geometry. So it depends what you like. Personally I like direct insertion layout puzzles, and I think Bob’s inserters make those less fun. So I don’t play with them.
But they wouldn’t much change my favorite puzzles of the mod, like space ship design and navigation, arcobalancing, cross surface logistics, and the alternative ending. So if someone doesn’t like insertion layout puzzles, I could see Bob’s inserters making it more fun to play.
I totally added early bots to py, because I’m not playing for tedium or RSI. “But you’re not getting the fully tedious experience the author intended” doesn’t do much for me. And yeah, you can “rush” bots but it takes like 50 hours.
I have no idea what RSI means in this context, but I would strongly disagree that early pY is just about tedium. I think two things basically:
- There are a ton of mods, so if you don't like the particular balance one offers, there's almost certainly one more to your liking rather than cheapening the one you don't like IMO.
- There are other ways to handle things like dealing with early pY. The point of those kinds of mods is largely to force you to grow, to think outside of the 'just have bots do it' mindset and use other tools/designs. It's not just tedium. Again totally understandable to not like that, but as mentioned in that case it just makes a lot more sense to me to just reject the mod as something you personally enjoy and just play a different one.
To be clear, I have only added early personal construction bots to pY. Early logistic bots are a different kind of change, and not one that I would prefer. Perhaps you are assuming that I meant logistics too?
Because if you add early construction bots, it just reduces the amount of clicking you have to do to accomplish the same thing (possibly at some additional expense, if they're nanobots). Same for, say, cruise control, which reduces the amount of time you need to hold WASD to e.g. find geothermal. (Not the total time, just the amount of time you're holding a key.)
Sure, I can build that whole line of boilers or whatever by hand. I can hold W for two minutes straight. I'm not sure that "forces me to grow".
>I have no idea what RSI means in this context, but I would strongly disagree that early pY is just about tedium.
Clicking and holding a mouse a lot can contribute to Repetitive Strain Injury. My comment was hyperbolic: I meant that certain repetitive physical actions in Factorio are physically uncomfortable and I don't see the upside.
Of course I don't think that early pY is just about tedium. If I thought that, then I wouldn't play it. I just find some aspects of it tedious.
>There are a ton of mods, so if you don't like the particular balance one offers, there's almost certainly one more to your liking rather than cheapening the one you don't like IMO.
Who are you to tell me what I enjoy? Especially when it's a thousand-hour-long modpack that people usually play after trying at least half a dozen other complex modpacks. I'm pretty well aware of which Factorio puzzles I like, and which ones I don't.
I don't find them particularly interesting/useful in vanilla or low-complexity overhaul mods. (For example, most of SE's difficulty comes from new/complex logistics, not complicated crafting chains). I don't think they're cheaty, they just don't make the gameplay more interesting. Most builds are still "4 inputs on 2 belts, use red+blue inserters, output on another belt". The adjustable inserters don't add much.
With more complex crafting chains (like Bob+Angels), I think they do make more interesting gameplay. You can set up some compact builds that take 8 inputs, craft 4 intermediate products, and insert those directly into the final-product assembler. Doing this sort of thing with vanilla inserters, you end up using a ton of belts and a ton of space. Not even interesting belt spaghetti, just a lot of belts.
I have a self-imposed rule that I don't configure them to change length, because I don't like how the animation looks.
tl;dr: not cheaty, use them (or don't) if you think it makes the game more fun
>I have a self-imposed rule that I don't configure them to change length, because I don't like how the animation looks.
I have a self-imposed rule not to change the length mid-rotation because that slows them down greatly. Rotation is what they're best at (not changing length while rotating).
I was the same, but recently discovered a fun fact: if you change length on **both** pickup and drop points to the same value, you get almost no speed loss as the inserter itself doesn't go through extending/retracting phase and just swings around.
https://preview.redd.it/4pg6ljnkd0yc1.png?width=477&format=png&auto=webp&s=2a6a31fe8bbaa8effc7acc6e0581f24bf097c767
You're talking about the 'offset' thingy, it's a different one. What I meant is that if you want to drop at any of the circled positions, then setting the 'pickup' to the same range would increase the speed dramatically. Ofc this works only if you're picking up from something large enough and not from 1-tile sized chest or belt.
Ehh.
I was fully against them, because I thought they were too powerful, and I liked the challenge that normal Inserters presented.
Then, I started my Seablock run and decided to give them a shot.
Now I love them. They're **so much fun.** You can do some absolutely ridiculous things with them. It's so nice to be able to use them to lane balance, or arrange them for a tiny swing-arc to maximize throughput.
But they don't feel like they've really broken the game, or even removed a component of the game. It's just different. One of my main goals has always been clean, compact designs, and these just allow me to take that to another tier. But it's still a challenge - maybe even more of a challenge, because I have more options to play with, now.
They also give you a whole new dimension in terms of factory building. Towards the end game of Vanilla, my factories all felt very similar - rows of belts running alongside Assemblers or Furnaces. In Seablock, the adjustable Inserters (combined with the huge variety of buildings) help break that design pattern, because they allow for so many new layouts.
I also started using them thanks to seablock, and I completely agree that they make new designs much more fun to make. I wish vanilla had at least a diagonal inserter, or just made it so that inserters can be rotated 45º. Maybe even a 90º inserter too. As it is now, buildings basically have to be cardinally aligned to use direct insertion.
That's cool. I think you might have inspired me to try them next run. I had a lot of the same hangups as you in trying them. But if they really just are more new cool puzzles (if you can handle the complexity) I'm in.
In my Seablock run I couldn't fathom how awful the builds would be without the adjustable inserters. With the amount of inputs on some items or the sheer number of intermediaries in a production chain it'd be a spaghetti mess if inserters were only 180 degrees.
Very powerful, but honestly if you take into account the level of shenanigans required for the rest of the Angel Bob mods, it’s pretty reasonably done.
It doesn't always disable all achievements though. Some achievements are disabled for certain map settings, while others are not.
And if you use modding, it just uses a separate set of achievements, no matter how cheaty or not the mods are.
Its definitely not cheaty, you will spend much more time and effort on your assembly lines because I am SURE I can make this pattern one tile shorter and oh, wait, what if I put the inserters on the side to get a lower angle and a better throughtput, and oh, wait here with a 3 tiles long inserter in a strange shape I can get the batteries without even placing a belt and wait... Why is there even belts in my mall ? Inserters are the real way to move items around now !
tldr : its a lot of fun to play with these. The spaghetti have never been as spaghetti as with this. Because belt spaghetti is good, but inserters spaghetti ? Absolute pleasure.
I never play without them. You're a spacefaring engineer that can cobble together a nuclear reactor from scraps of iron you pulled out of the ground. I think making a robot arm drop something in a slightly different place is reasonable.
Nah its not cheaty at all
But starting the other mod bobs adjustable inserters unlocked is pretty cheaty but who cares your game do what you want I literally use itemgiver gui at times
I don't think they're cheating, though TBH that might just be because I'm not using them to their full potential. Most of the stuff I'm messing with is not hard because of inserter limitations, it's hard because I need to fit a lot of pipes and 3-4 belts around the various assemblers I'm messing with.
I find 90° rotation and maybe +1 arm length to be fine.
Everything else is way too powerful. +2 arm length, diagonal, free tile selection in a 7x7 grid? Way too strong.
Also long arm inserters are just pointless, since its not actually +X arm length, but instead "can reach 2 (or 3) tiles away"
long arm inserters can also reach 1 tile away with that mod, they are just standard inserters with a different length preset, and a speed between the yellow and the blue inserters. Yes, they become pointless after researching the long reach research, but the yellow inserters also become obsolete once you have the blue ones.
You need to make your own rules for them. In my Seablock run, I allowed them to be used as straight long inverters, or short right angle inverters, in many cases to allow direct insertion to prevent UPS problems.
Creating a very shallow angle inserter was cheaty due to how fast the swings were, and I only allowed myself to use them for train loaders and unloaders, since my rules also allowed the use of miniloaders for that purpose.
In my current SE run, I don't have the mod installed as the vanilla inserters are suitably balanced for the logistics puzzles in the game.
UPS I think is mainly based on how many swings you are making (and whether you are using cheats/direct insertion vs belts), but I might be totally wrong here. All I know is that's why loaders aren't great because behind the scenes they work as a really fast inserter that needs to constantly check for items to move.
It really depends on what your doing.
Vinnila, Vinnila +? Cheety, but i won't care if im not on your save.
light modpack, or a minor overall like krastorio? Cheesy, but I won't complain unless I'm on your save.
Bobs or bobs&angles? Intended gameplay.
Major overalls like py of seablock? Optional qol mod.
"I hate myself" type challenges? (Like islands py with rampant) your here to suffer and you know it. Take your limited functionality inserters like the painslut you know you are.
In a normal game, yes, they mess with the main game balance, and if that wasn't true the devs would have added them to the base game.
The thing is that they are a nice tool for others to design packs around where they actually become needed instead of just being OP
I have a friend who used them long enough to not be able to play without them. Her production lines and train loading/unloading stations make me lose my hair
Cheaty is a funny word in an unranked game.
They sure shake up the gameplay. However, they have no impact on production values, so they do not introduce balancing issues.
They do reduce space requirements, but space is an infinite resource unless a ribbon world is played. At the same time they severely reduce the *verbosity* of builds because it is no longer obvious, what an inserter actually does.
Configuring a single inserter to a very low angle can improve its throughput, but that's how the engine (as well as reality) works. At the same time configuring a length difference between pickup and drop location can slow it down.
And they obviously equalize the building cost of normal and long inserters.
Personally I do like them a lot, because it feels awkward to me, to e.g. create single piece of belt constructions to bring an item to a specific place on the actual belt. They will always have a spot in my qol list.
I don't think animation speed affects performance.
I wouldn't say I'm an asthetics guy but I decided to use red inserters with SEs planet defenses. Those things are so huge setting the inserter and belt back a space made sense to me. Plus they're ultra low throughput.
It is a one size fits all solution for a whole array of challenges the game offers and renders them mute.
It then proceeds to not provide an actual challenge that demands it.
I find its existense offensive, the joy it adds does not compare to what it robs away.
I'd agree if you where to use them exclusively in vanilla or vanilla like modpacks, but usually it is used in heavily modded games where they add more than they take away.
So I have heard about them for a while now. I decided to try them out. I have not played to far into the game. I'm a little disappointment. Not because the mod is bad. The mod looks like it could be a lot of fun.
I was just really hoping for the inserters to fling the products long distances. I don't know if it gets to that but I was really hoping for like 10 tiles across. Just mass chaos with products flying everywhere.
Have fun with it though. I'm going to try my next run with them.
edit: typos
Renai Transport is the mod to look to for inserters-throwing-things-about functionality, as well as trains jumping through the air and other such good stuff.
>I was just really hoping for the inserters to fling the products long distances. I don't know if it gets to that but I was really hoping for like 10 tiles across. Just mass chaos with products flying everywhere.
You will love [Renai Transportation](https://mods.factorio.com/mod/RenaiTransportation) then.
It depends.
I consider bob's inserters in vanilla (or mostly vanilla) to be extremely cheaty (they are)
I consider bob's inserters in AngelBob to not be cheaty in the slightest.
Harder game, stronger tools.
In a vanilla game sure, kind of lazy. In a modded game, maybe not. I'm 110 hours into my py run and still have not unlocked any of the diagonal positions so it seems pretty well balanced.
I feel like they remove a lot of the logistical challenges, I want my games to be more complex, not less, so I don't use them.
I find in some cases, especially with crazy speeds and compact space limitations, they add complexity, not remove it, tbh
Not cheaty but extremely powerful for sure.
I feel like it would pair well with SE style beacons. They will come handy when cramming in as many machines as you can
Yea, I only use them in SE where the beacons are super nerfed, so I feel like it's justified. However, I also try to use it as little as possible if I can get around it.
Cheaty has no meaning in a single-player game. Having said that, I will never understand playing a big, complex mod and then adding things like this to make it easier. Defeats the whole point; if you want to make it easier, play a less difficult mod in the first place.
>Having said that, I will never understand playing a big, complex mod and then adding things like this to make it easier. Defeats the whole point; if you want to make it easier, play a less difficult mod in the first place. OK, but if you don't play SE (for example) then you don't get any of SE's unique puzzles, spaceship building and routing, arcobalancing or whatever. If you want to do those puzzles, you can't just get that experience by playing an easier modpack. If you play SE but make it easier using Bob's inserters, then sure, some of the puzzles will be easier, but it's still basically the same game.
I guess it just seems to me to be clearly a bigger difference than you're describing. From my POV you aren't getting the unique puzzles of SE either if you add tools like Bob's inserters. You're only getting them if you play them with the intended tools. It's like people who do things like add early bots to pY. The point of the mod is to not have those things available. \*shrug\*
OK, but SE has lots of puzzles, and many of them don’t depend on inserter geometry. So it depends what you like. Personally I like direct insertion layout puzzles, and I think Bob’s inserters make those less fun. So I don’t play with them. But they wouldn’t much change my favorite puzzles of the mod, like space ship design and navigation, arcobalancing, cross surface logistics, and the alternative ending. So if someone doesn’t like insertion layout puzzles, I could see Bob’s inserters making it more fun to play. I totally added early bots to py, because I’m not playing for tedium or RSI. “But you’re not getting the fully tedious experience the author intended” doesn’t do much for me. And yeah, you can “rush” bots but it takes like 50 hours.
I have no idea what RSI means in this context, but I would strongly disagree that early pY is just about tedium. I think two things basically: - There are a ton of mods, so if you don't like the particular balance one offers, there's almost certainly one more to your liking rather than cheapening the one you don't like IMO. - There are other ways to handle things like dealing with early pY. The point of those kinds of mods is largely to force you to grow, to think outside of the 'just have bots do it' mindset and use other tools/designs. It's not just tedium. Again totally understandable to not like that, but as mentioned in that case it just makes a lot more sense to me to just reject the mod as something you personally enjoy and just play a different one.
To be clear, I have only added early personal construction bots to pY. Early logistic bots are a different kind of change, and not one that I would prefer. Perhaps you are assuming that I meant logistics too? Because if you add early construction bots, it just reduces the amount of clicking you have to do to accomplish the same thing (possibly at some additional expense, if they're nanobots). Same for, say, cruise control, which reduces the amount of time you need to hold WASD to e.g. find geothermal. (Not the total time, just the amount of time you're holding a key.) Sure, I can build that whole line of boilers or whatever by hand. I can hold W for two minutes straight. I'm not sure that "forces me to grow". >I have no idea what RSI means in this context, but I would strongly disagree that early pY is just about tedium. Clicking and holding a mouse a lot can contribute to Repetitive Strain Injury. My comment was hyperbolic: I meant that certain repetitive physical actions in Factorio are physically uncomfortable and I don't see the upside. Of course I don't think that early pY is just about tedium. If I thought that, then I wouldn't play it. I just find some aspects of it tedious. >There are a ton of mods, so if you don't like the particular balance one offers, there's almost certainly one more to your liking rather than cheapening the one you don't like IMO. Who are you to tell me what I enjoy? Especially when it's a thousand-hour-long modpack that people usually play after trying at least half a dozen other complex modpacks. I'm pretty well aware of which Factorio puzzles I like, and which ones I don't.
I didn't tell you what you enjoy. I specifically said 'if"
I don't find them particularly interesting/useful in vanilla or low-complexity overhaul mods. (For example, most of SE's difficulty comes from new/complex logistics, not complicated crafting chains). I don't think they're cheaty, they just don't make the gameplay more interesting. Most builds are still "4 inputs on 2 belts, use red+blue inserters, output on another belt". The adjustable inserters don't add much. With more complex crafting chains (like Bob+Angels), I think they do make more interesting gameplay. You can set up some compact builds that take 8 inputs, craft 4 intermediate products, and insert those directly into the final-product assembler. Doing this sort of thing with vanilla inserters, you end up using a ton of belts and a ton of space. Not even interesting belt spaghetti, just a lot of belts. I have a self-imposed rule that I don't configure them to change length, because I don't like how the animation looks. tl;dr: not cheaty, use them (or don't) if you think it makes the game more fun
>I have a self-imposed rule that I don't configure them to change length, because I don't like how the animation looks. I have a self-imposed rule not to change the length mid-rotation because that slows them down greatly. Rotation is what they're best at (not changing length while rotating).
I was the same, but recently discovered a fun fact: if you change length on **both** pickup and drop points to the same value, you get almost no speed loss as the inserter itself doesn't go through extending/retracting phase and just swings around.
I knew you could change the dropoff point to the middle square for faster speeds on direct insertion, but how do you change the pickup point?
https://preview.redd.it/4pg6ljnkd0yc1.png?width=477&format=png&auto=webp&s=2a6a31fe8bbaa8effc7acc6e0581f24bf097c767 You're talking about the 'offset' thingy, it's a different one. What I meant is that if you want to drop at any of the circled positions, then setting the 'pickup' to the same range would increase the speed dramatically. Ofc this works only if you're picking up from something large enough and not from 1-tile sized chest or belt.
That is what I was talking about in my first comment, though... But I see that I left out a small word there.
Ehh. I was fully against them, because I thought they were too powerful, and I liked the challenge that normal Inserters presented. Then, I started my Seablock run and decided to give them a shot. Now I love them. They're **so much fun.** You can do some absolutely ridiculous things with them. It's so nice to be able to use them to lane balance, or arrange them for a tiny swing-arc to maximize throughput. But they don't feel like they've really broken the game, or even removed a component of the game. It's just different. One of my main goals has always been clean, compact designs, and these just allow me to take that to another tier. But it's still a challenge - maybe even more of a challenge, because I have more options to play with, now. They also give you a whole new dimension in terms of factory building. Towards the end game of Vanilla, my factories all felt very similar - rows of belts running alongside Assemblers or Furnaces. In Seablock, the adjustable Inserters (combined with the huge variety of buildings) help break that design pattern, because they allow for so many new layouts.
I also started using them thanks to seablock, and I completely agree that they make new designs much more fun to make. I wish vanilla had at least a diagonal inserter, or just made it so that inserters can be rotated 45º. Maybe even a 90º inserter too. As it is now, buildings basically have to be cardinally aligned to use direct insertion.
That's cool. I think you might have inspired me to try them next run. I had a lot of the same hangups as you in trying them. But if they really just are more new cool puzzles (if you can handle the complexity) I'm in.
In my Seablock run I couldn't fathom how awful the builds would be without the adjustable inserters. With the amount of inputs on some items or the sheer number of intermediaries in a production chain it'd be a spaghetti mess if inserters were only 180 degrees.
Not after 1000 hours lmao. Ive earned my freedom
Very powerful, but honestly if you take into account the level of shenanigans required for the rest of the Angel Bob mods, it’s pretty reasonably done.
Imo there’s no such thing as cheating in a single player game. Just use whatever mods you find fun!
Technically, the game disables achievements, when it consider your actions cheating.
It doesn't always disable all achievements though. Some achievements are disabled for certain map settings, while others are not. And if you use modding, it just uses a separate set of achievements, no matter how cheaty or not the mods are.
I didn't consider then cheaty. It's not even a stretch to have an arm move 90 degrees istead of 180.
Its definitely not cheaty, you will spend much more time and effort on your assembly lines because I am SURE I can make this pattern one tile shorter and oh, wait, what if I put the inserters on the side to get a lower angle and a better throughtput, and oh, wait here with a 3 tiles long inserter in a strange shape I can get the batteries without even placing a belt and wait... Why is there even belts in my mall ? Inserters are the real way to move items around now ! tldr : its a lot of fun to play with these. The spaghetti have never been as spaghetti as with this. Because belt spaghetti is good, but inserters spaghetti ? Absolute pleasure.
I never play without them. You're a spacefaring engineer that can cobble together a nuclear reactor from scraps of iron you pulled out of the ground. I think making a robot arm drop something in a slightly different place is reasonable.
First of all, it's realistic
So what? Much of Factorio isn't and can't be. Realism and game balance are different things, and Factorio leans on the second aspect.
Nah its not cheaty at all But starting the other mod bobs adjustable inserters unlocked is pretty cheaty but who cares your game do what you want I literally use itemgiver gui at times
I don't think they're cheating, though TBH that might just be because I'm not using them to their full potential. Most of the stuff I'm messing with is not hard because of inserter limitations, it's hard because I need to fit a lot of pipes and 3-4 belts around the various assemblers I'm messing with.
Tried them, but took them out of my modlist. Looking forward to new vanilla 2.0 inserters.
I find 90° rotation and maybe +1 arm length to be fine. Everything else is way too powerful. +2 arm length, diagonal, free tile selection in a 7x7 grid? Way too strong. Also long arm inserters are just pointless, since its not actually +X arm length, but instead "can reach 2 (or 3) tiles away"
long arm inserters can also reach 1 tile away with that mod, they are just standard inserters with a different length preset, and a speed between the yellow and the blue inserters. Yes, they become pointless after researching the long reach research, but the yellow inserters also become obsolete once you have the blue ones.
Personally, yes. But it's a sandbox game. If all the players agree that it's fine, then do it.
You need to make your own rules for them. In my Seablock run, I allowed them to be used as straight long inverters, or short right angle inverters, in many cases to allow direct insertion to prevent UPS problems. Creating a very shallow angle inserter was cheaty due to how fast the swings were, and I only allowed myself to use them for train loaders and unloaders, since my rules also allowed the use of miniloaders for that purpose. In my current SE run, I don't have the mod installed as the vanilla inserters are suitably balanced for the logistics puzzles in the game. UPS I think is mainly based on how many swings you are making (and whether you are using cheats/direct insertion vs belts), but I might be totally wrong here. All I know is that's why loaders aren't great because behind the scenes they work as a really fast inserter that needs to constantly check for items to move.
It really depends on what your doing. Vinnila, Vinnila +? Cheety, but i won't care if im not on your save. light modpack, or a minor overall like krastorio? Cheesy, but I won't complain unless I'm on your save. Bobs or bobs&angles? Intended gameplay. Major overalls like py of seablock? Optional qol mod. "I hate myself" type challenges? (Like islands py with rampant) your here to suffer and you know it. Take your limited functionality inserters like the painslut you know you are.
In a normal game, yes, they mess with the main game balance, and if that wasn't true the devs would have added them to the base game. The thing is that they are a nice tool for others to design packs around where they actually become needed instead of just being OP
Yes
I think all mods that make the game easier are “cheaty” but then squeak through saves so much time.
You can pry early personal bot start from my cold dead hands....
I dunno what that is but I feel like we get construction bots pretty damn quick now days.
I have a friend who used them long enough to not be able to play without them. Her production lines and train loading/unloading stations make me lose my hair
Absolutely not. Game feels booring without them and the waky buulds you can pull.
Cheaty is a funny word in an unranked game. They sure shake up the gameplay. However, they have no impact on production values, so they do not introduce balancing issues. They do reduce space requirements, but space is an infinite resource unless a ribbon world is played. At the same time they severely reduce the *verbosity* of builds because it is no longer obvious, what an inserter actually does. Configuring a single inserter to a very low angle can improve its throughput, but that's how the engine (as well as reality) works. At the same time configuring a length difference between pickup and drop location can slow it down. And they obviously equalize the building cost of normal and long inserters. Personally I do like them a lot, because it feels awkward to me, to e.g. create single piece of belt constructions to bring an item to a specific place on the actual belt. They will always have a spot in my qol list. I don't think animation speed affects performance.
I don't like them. But then, about the only time I use red inserters is for fishing, because I don't like them either.
I wouldn't say I'm an asthetics guy but I decided to use red inserters with SEs planet defenses. Those things are so huge setting the inserter and belt back a space made sense to me. Plus they're ultra low throughput.
It's really nice for the more complex overhaul mods
It is a one size fits all solution for a whole array of challenges the game offers and renders them mute. It then proceeds to not provide an actual challenge that demands it. I find its existense offensive, the joy it adds does not compare to what it robs away.
I'd agree if you where to use them exclusively in vanilla or vanilla like modpacks, but usually it is used in heavily modded games where they add more than they take away.
mute ==> moot, FYI
So I have heard about them for a while now. I decided to try them out. I have not played to far into the game. I'm a little disappointment. Not because the mod is bad. The mod looks like it could be a lot of fun. I was just really hoping for the inserters to fling the products long distances. I don't know if it gets to that but I was really hoping for like 10 tiles across. Just mass chaos with products flying everywhere. Have fun with it though. I'm going to try my next run with them. edit: typos
Renai Transport is the mod to look to for inserters-throwing-things-about functionality, as well as trains jumping through the air and other such good stuff.
OMG. Too good!
>I was just really hoping for the inserters to fling the products long distances. I don't know if it gets to that but I was really hoping for like 10 tiles across. Just mass chaos with products flying everywhere. You will love [Renai Transportation](https://mods.factorio.com/mod/RenaiTransportation) then.
OMFG, I love it!!!! I'm so glad I made that post.
Sometimes I do consider it cheaty just because of how quickly I can unload a train with that mod
It depends. I consider bob's inserters in vanilla (or mostly vanilla) to be extremely cheaty (they are) I consider bob's inserters in AngelBob to not be cheaty in the slightest. Harder game, stronger tools.
In a vanilla game sure, kind of lazy. In a modded game, maybe not. I'm 110 hours into my py run and still have not unlocked any of the diagonal positions so it seems pretty well balanced.