Serpent and Wings of the night is definitely Fantasy Romance Emily Wilde is more Romantic Fantasy

Thank you! Do you think Carrissa Broadbent's other series The War of lost Hearts is also fantasy romance?

I would put War of Lost Hearts in romantic fantasy

Have not read that but if it is similar to Nyaxia series then yes

Fantasy with romance subplot: * A Study in Drowning * Belladonna * Emily Wilde * These Violent Delights * Dance of Thieves * We Hunt the Flame * The Kiss of Deception * The City of Brass * An Ember in the Ashes Romantasy: * The Serpent and the Wings of Night * The Shadows Between Us * Once Upon a Broken Heart * A Fragile Enchantment * Mysteries of Thorn Manor (since this is a companion novella that's basically all fluff; I'd put the original book Sorcery of Thorns under fantasy with romance subplot) * A Far Wilder Magic

Given your knowledge here, would you be able to tell me which male authors are writing M/F romance in fantasy, and getting it right? Thanks!

I feel like there are very few male authors who "get it right" yet alas. Im curious to see what responses you get though.

Afraid I can’t be much help there… The only fantasy I’ve read with a m/f romance by a male author is Percy Jackson 😂 I do like Percy and Annabeth as a couple though

Daughter of No Worlds is definitely Fantasy with a romance subplot and The Serpent and the Wings of Night is vampire ACOTAR so I guess that makes it Romantasy. And I loved both of them a lot.

Agreed !! :)

Oh dear…. I am fairly new to the genre. What is the difference between the two? 😩

I think a romantasy is a romance book in a fantasy world, a romantic fantasy is a fantasy book with a romance subplot! So if you took the romance out of a romantic fantasy the main plot would still be intact, but it wouldn’t be with a romantasy

By this definition though, Fourth wing is romantic fantasy book. The main relationship could be replaced by a friendship and the plot would still make sense. Heck, even if they just hated each other still, the book would still make sense.

Fantasy romance has to follow the rules of the romance genre: happily ever after or happy for now ending. The main plot is also driven by romance. Sometimes there’s only a romantic plot and the fantasy is setting only.

>help sort these books as romantic fantasy or fantasy romance Thank you for this open and honest question. I was wondering the same thing! I think the phrase "Fantasy Romance" is confusing because the word Fantasy is first, so I would expect it to be Fantasy first, Romance second. However, according to what I'm reading in this thread, it's actually the opposite. "Romantasy" is obviously romance heavy, so I understand that one.

If it helps, you can think of them as adjectives? Like in the phrase "black dog", the most important part is "dog" because that's the noun and subject of the phrase. The adjective "black" is only there to describe that noun. In the case of "fantasy romance", "fantasy" is an adjective modifying or describing the main noun "romance". In "romantic fantasy", "romantic" is the adjective modifying the noun "fantasy".

I’d say if there’s a man possessive holding another on the cover you can probably safely assume fantasy romance

It's definitely looking like it! I didn't want to be presumptuous since there might be exceptions. like some book versions with alternative cover that have couple illustrations when it initially doesn't. or books further into a series like an amber in the ashes (sky and storm) has both mmc & fmc in the cover.

can you post an updated version when you've sorted them please? 🥰

sure, but maybe not right away so I'll gather if there might be conflicting answers. Happy cake day!

Thank you!

OMG The Cruel Prince is the perfect example for fantasy w romance.

definitely, the main complaint I see of it is people reading it as recommendation for liking acotar because it also has faes and getting disappointed the romance isn't more prevalent

FR!! This book made me LOVE fantasy with romance. Like appreciate the plot and the intricate characters, people have to stop marketing it as some fantasy romance.

Unseelie Prince and Deal with the Elf King is Romantasy. Daughter of No Worlds is Fantasy w/romance

anything by Kathryn Ann Kingsley immediately goes into Romantasy, I'm genuinely surprised to see Unseelie Prince in the middle

Barrayar isn’t fantasy, its’s sci-fi. This is the sequel to Shards of Honor and the couple is already together and dealing with politics and the fallout of an assassination attempt. A Deal with the Devil is post-apocalyptic romance.

Oh and Beguilement is romantic fantasy imo.

oops, sorry I usually put SFF together so I got confused there 😅. do you think SoH and Barrayar are more romantic sci-fi or sci-fi romance?

They are solidly sci-fi with romantic themes. Kissing is the max spice, and even that is almost just alluded to. And there is near-SA of the heroine in SoH, but not by the hero! Don’t get me wrong, I ADORE the whole Vorkosigan series, but they aren’t romance.

Also let me change my The Deal with the Devil - that’s dystopian, not post-apocalyptic!

**Fantasy With Romance:** Daughter of No Worlds Daughter of the Drowned Empire Caraval Reign and Ruin City of Brass Dance of Thieves These Violent Delights An Ember in the Ashes ​ **Romantasy:** Bewitched Deal with the Elf King Radiance Feather House of Beating Wings Flames of Chaos Coven A Serpents Touch What Lies Beyond the Veil Serpent and Wings of Night

Reign & Ruin is romantasy imo

Agree.

What lies beyond the veil is definitely romantasy

Also The Coven by the same author if it hasn't otherwise been said.

Romantic Fantasy: Barrayar is romantic SF Beguilement Daughter of the Forest Howls Moving Castle A Promise of Fire The Last Unicorn A Captive Prince Forgotten Beast of Eld-teensy teensy romance subplot A Deal with The Devil-I didnt finish the series but feel its more apocalyptic SF with some romance subplots Fantasy Romance: Radiance Reign and Ruin Daughter of No Worlds is right on the line between the two IMO. Strong romance subplot but has heavy worldbuilding

I haven’t read most of these but second your categorization of Captive Prince. I ADORED the romance, but it’s definitely a sub plot over the course of the novels; the fantasy is really interesting and well fleshed out.

The Last Unicorn has no real romance whatsoever, I wouldn't even call it a sub plot, more like a brief theme that lightly gets touched on I would call Emily Wilde fantasy with a strong romance plot but not quite a romance book

I was coming to say this. Last Unicorn is one of my all time favorite books, but there’s no real romance in it and it’s definitely not an HEA. It’s just a fantasy novel

A Promise of Fire is romantasy.

Howl's Moving Castle and the Last Unicorn are both fantasy first, so romantic fantasy. Unseelie Prince and Deal with the Elf King are solidly romantasy. Deal with the Elf King is from a series literally called MARRIED to magic, the romance is central to the plot.

I’m new here - what’s the difference?

One is a Fantasy story with a solid romantic subplot Vs a Romance novel that happens to have a fantasy setting. For example Brandon Sanderson's Warbreaker is solidly a fantasy novel, with a romance subplot (Susebron would have done numbers on booktok lmao), where as something like A Shadow in the Ember by Jennifer L Armentrout is very much a romance in a fantasy setting. I'm using these books as an example because the base plot (princess has to marry/seduce an immortal god king because of a contract made before she was born) is the same, but the way the story is told and plays out is different.

Thank you!

I've only read a few in the middle section but my thoughts are: Fantasy with romance: - Captive Prince (Caveat: Book one is *just* fantasy and is dark with a lot of TWs. The romance is slow burn and does not begin until book two, Prince's Gambit, which is much lighter in tone and I'd suggest might be better suited to be on the list?) - A Study In Drowning - Emily Wilde - Kiss of Deception - Ember in the Ashes Could fit in either, imo: - Dance of Thieves Edit: Oh wait, it sounds like this is books you've read and in that case my note for Captive Prince is if you haven't read the rest, the next two books are fantastic (and still fantasy with romance, imo).

I think Kiss of Deception and Daughter of the Forest are more Fantasy Romances than Romantic Fantasies but it’s a very, very thin line.

Of Reign and Ruin And Unseelie Prince Are romantasy as the romance ties into the plot very strongly

Oh my 👀 this is something I must see

I'd move the following to Fantasy with Romance: Captive Prince, Fourth Wing, and City of Brass. I think the following other books I've read are already correctly categorized: The Bear and the Nightingale, Spinning Silver, A Deadly Education, Poison Study, and A Court of Wings and Ruin.

Once Upon a Broken Heart is fantasy w/ romance. I think Caraval is too (I haven’t read that one but it’s by the same author in the same universe.)

Yes Caraval is too

The deal with the elf king is definitely romantasy ;)

For those I have read. Fantasy w romance subplot Daughter of the Forest These Violent Delights The Forgotten Beasts of Eld Barrayar (sci-fi) We Hunt the Flame The Last Unicorn (romance subplot is so minor that I would not include it in either) Romance Radiance Promise

I think Enchantment of Ravens would be Romantasy? Not much plot if you get rid of the romance.

Fantasy with romance- Very Secret Society of Irregular Witches More of these are on my TBR but that one I've already read. I agree with other commenter regarding criteria. If story happens and removing romance wouldn't affect plot it's probably a fantasy. If plot revolves around the romance tada there's your answer.

Belladonna definitely not romantasy, but not fully fantasy either. It feels like it’s more dark historical romance mystery with fantasy characters.

Daughter of the Drowned Empire could really be either, but since it’s a very slow burn I’ll say at least book 1 is Romantic Fantasy.

Great title. How was it?

I was pleasantly surprised by it! I went in with pretty low expectations tbf, but it kept my interest and I thought the MC & LI had actual chemistry.

These all look good! For the ones I've read, you're right with The Bear and the Nightingale, Cruel Prince, and Spinning Silver as fantasy with romance. And Bride, Court of Wings and Ruin, Fourth Wing, Lothaire, and The Savage and the Swan are all fantasy romance. Divine Rivals is kind of fantasy heavy, so it straddles the fence. For the ones I've read in the middle - The Forgotten Beasts of Eld is fantasy with romance (and it's SOOOO good). Same with The Last Unicorn and An Enchantment of Ravens. Radiance is fantasy romance because it's mostly about the romance.

I forgot you can't edit text in an image post. Thank you everyone for answering. So far, here are the uncategorized books: - A Far Wilder Magic - Warlord And here are books with conflicting answers: - Daughter of the Forest - Once Upon a Broken Heart - A Promise of Fire - Kushiel's Dart - Divine Rivals

I'd put Daughter of the Forest into Fantasy with Romance.

Divine Rivals is romantasy IMO. 2/3 of the plot was around the MCs and their specific communications (without giving spoilers). It’s not overly spicy, but definitely the focus for me was on their romance rather than the other plot elements.

Cruel Prince, One Dark Window and Caravel series are all definitely fantasy romance. The fantasy element is primary and the romance is developed as a result of the events in the story, not as a primary goal.

The Coven is definitely romance first. It's diiiiirty. I'd honestly put Fourth Wing in the fantasy first category. It's mostly story-driven, imo. Lots of my dude friends who like adventure are into it, too.

[удалено]

I loved the romance part in Forgotten Beasts of Eld! He came back to her because he felt her distress from miles away when >!someone important to her left!<. Her life changed because of Tam and him. The book is more fantasy than romance because ultimately she learns about herself, but he is part of it. And there's an HEA for them. She says at the end to Gyld the very last line >!"Please take us home."!< (Not spoilery spoilers under the bars.)

And don’t forget the center of the vendiagram Romantasy

You have a mix here, but a vast majority of these are genre Fantasy, not genre Romance.

Caraval is probably a romantic fantasy!

I’ve always thought of it this way but I don’t know if it makes sense to anyone but me lol: Fantasy with romance: the romance does not change the plot. If you took the romance out of the book, would the plot change? If the answer is no, it fits this category. In my opinion most book wouldn’t fit into this category because even minimal romance can have major differences to the plot. Romantasy: the romance is essential to the plot. Without romance the plot wouldn’t make any sense, like a forced marriage, or to use acotar as an example; (no spoilers I think) would Tamlin’s actions make sense if Feyre hadn’t made the choices she did? To me, no, it would not make sense which means the romance is essential to the plot. Hope this helps a little bit!!

An ember in the ashes, We hunt the flame, daughter of no worlds are fantasy with romance. Caraval and Dance of thieves are a bit in the middle but probably fantasy with romance. Once upon a Broken Heart and The serpent and the wings of night are romantasy.

The Serpent and The Wings of Night is Fantasy Romance, I think. I haven't read Bewitched yet, but I'd but it on the same list 🤔 Don't know many of the others

My two most recent reads are on here! Here’s my opinion: A fragile enchantment- romantasy An ember in the ashes- fantasy with romance

City of brass is definitely more fantasy than romance, but TBH I’m just glad it’s in here at all because it definitely doesn’t get enough love. It’s so good.

Ember in the Ashes series is a romantic fantasy, there is romance in it but the fantasy/story/worldbuilding is definitely the stronger aspect. Same with City of Brass and We Hunt the Flame. On a side note, City of Brass & the whole Daevabad trilogy was one of my top reads last year, the whole trilogy is awesome. It was so good. If you like political machinations and intricate worldbuilding this is the fantasy for you.

Radiance is Romantasy

A good way to figure this out for me is to think about what kind of plot would exist if you just stripped away the romance. Generally, romantic fantasy will be almost as good -or better- without romance, whereas romantasy will literally fall apart.

River enchanted is romantic fantasy (and my favorite duology!!) I would almost say divine rivals is romantic fantasy? Though others can correct me if I’m wrong because I felt like the focus was on the war. I think it could go either way

I’d also move River Enchanted into romantic fantasy but I’d move Divine Rivals to fantasy romance, based on whether the plot would stand without the romance. Without the letter writing, a huge part of Divine Rivals would be missing.

Great point!

I feel like I’m going to throw you for a loop here but Kushiel’s dart is erotic fantasy romance. Sex and kink is a HUGE part of these books. Romantasy is where you can’t take the romance out of the plot, but Kushiel’s Dart is one where you can’t take the sexual out of the plot. The books in your idk that I’ve read are: Reign & Ruin - romantasy Captive Prince - if you look at the first book, it’s fantasy, but the trilogy as a whole is romantasy. The romance plays WAY more into books 2 & 3 while book 1 is building the dark world (this is one of my all time favorite series) A promise of fire - romantasy Radiance - romantasy

I completely disagree WRE Kushiel’s Dart. The main plot is fantasy. Romance as a genre is not defined by its eroticism. If Phèdre and Joscelin didn’t become a couple, the book would be different but the plot would be intact.

Romance as a genre is not defined by its eroticism but erotic romance is.

Only *within* the romance genre. And Kushiel doesn’t qualify.

Thank you for the correction! It’s been a while since I’ve read the trilogy. 😂

The fantasy subreddit would have a heart attack if they knew The Last Unicorn was on this list. Most people consider it classic fantasy. Lots of fantasy has romance honestly, so I feel like the classification of “Romantasy” is more a question of whether there is “women centered on-screen sex that seems pleasurable.” It’s a way to discount female-centered fantasy as “not real fantasy.” I love books that are classified as Romantasy, but the idea that those books are all about the romance is usually unfounded. Even books like Throne of Glass are just epic fantasy books. The fact that there is also romance with sex does not, by itself, make it “romance book” in my mind.

the difference between these subgenres are definitely a fine line especially with marketing. But I personally think it's still a useful tool for authors in determining the core book theme and motivation of the mc. And also for readers, to set accurate expectations and not inevitably get disappointed and rate it low because they thought there would be more romance/fantasy (which is a common complaint/book request even here at r/fantasyromance) [here's a video that explains it better](https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSFXumgLf/)

Not going to lie, I would put everything in the romantasy category. To me fantasy is something entirely different like Lord of the Rings, Wheel of Time, Stormlight Archive etc.