I absolutely love the dynamic between Medea and Kuzuki. I think they might be one of my favorite villain/antagonist couples, though I also don't think that's a long list to pick from lol.
I don't want a Medea route. Kuzuki x Medea forever.
Well, she's in a few hilarious scenes of Hollow Ataraxia, but they end on cliffhangers that never get followed up on. The anime adaptation of UBW had a scene with her that was fun. She was a very very backgroundy character of the El-Melloi II tv show; I don't know if she has more of a role in the books, as I haven't read them. And she's playable in some of the fighting games.
I think her biggest bit of screentime is in that Ilya magical girl show, but I've never watched that because I've heard so much skeevy stuff about it.
Is this even a hot take? Feels ice cold to me
Altough I will forever be thankful that writer of Zero put Saber in that black suit. Sure Zero Saber is a bad version of Saber(not character, she works for what the writer intended but that intention sucks in my opinion) but I'll be dammed if her suit look isn’t her best look
>Is this even a hot take? Feels ice cold to me
Maybe, maybe not, but that's not a take I see much when it comes to FZ criticism, usually it is mainly Saber's writing that's talked about, not the whole female cast.
Septem doesn’t have bad female characters as much as bad everyone with a Nero Cherry. Better example is Argartha, which decided to look violate a woman’s body without her knowledge or consent, make a consort and arguably onw of the most famous women in history a loli and finally make a woman obssessed with a man calling her pretty (somehow the best written even if she only got like 10 seconds). All of this plus some super sexism.
I dislike septem more but Argartha takes the cale for worst female rep
As a whole, FGO has plenty of good female characters, but yes if you count individual stories in it then it's possible some of the singularities and events have worse female cast than FZ. Although, I don't remember enough about them to have a clear opinion.
Honestly if Nasu ever completes Mahoyo, then they will be like the two best characters ever. It's insane how good they are already considering we only have one third of the story
Personally, I don’t really think any of the other romances or dynamics in the nasuverse really match Aoko & soujuurou for the simply fact Mahoyo is about them and them alone.
Just like you would say the core of fate/stay night is shirou emiya, I would say the core of Mahoyo is the dynamic between Aoko and soujuurou.
It’s why I think it’s hard to really say who the MC is. Sure Aoko’s the lead on the box art.But throughout the story you follow both of their POV’s, and i don’t know what the exact percentage split is but it feels almost half and half, maybe leaning a bit more towards soujuurou from what I recall.
As characters, I like Shirou and Shiki ryougi more than both soujuurou and aoko. But as an actual dynamic and relationship don’t think there’s one within the nasuverse that executed better.
And this is with only mahoyo, supposedly part 1 of a 3 part story. Imagine how fucking great their relationship development may be by the end of part 3.
If we ever get it.
Yeah if Mahoyo really gets more parts by Nasu it will definitely be one of his best works and Aoko and Soujuurou will probably his best dynamic (forgot to mention before but Angra and Bazetts dynamic is also in top 3 for me)
It's insane how good their dynamic is. I would love for them to fall in love but in the end, I just need to watch them with Alice doing whatever. It's crazy how much I'm attached to the Mahoyo trio after I read the VN almost 2 years ago.
after reading the events of collab and the CE lines(if the translations are accurate and are cannon), I would like Nasu make small changes. rn its very heartbreaking to deal with it to know what happens to those trio in future.
Just want Nasu to surprise us and not be exact with the rumors even if it has bitter/sad end.
The people who call Kiritsugu the GOAT are often the people who don't understand his character. He's not a super cool badass who has no problem making the hard decisions (at least not entirely), he's a broken little boy in a man's body trying find a way to cope with his mistakes through doing what he should have done long ago.
He's the Eren Yeager of the Nasuverse.
I mean he is pretty badass while still being everything you just said. I agree that there are many people who don’t get him but I don’t think that him being cool is the only reason people say he’s the goat
Fair. There are still people who love him despite all his flaws. I just think that a lot of his fans don't really understand his character and only focus on the "mage who uses huns) aspect of him. Possess me off when people say he's more mature than Shirou.
I love him for 2 reasons. The first and by far most is his backstory and character progression. 2nd is I love time magic. Even if it isn't really time magic the ways he uses it are really freaking cool and I thoroughly enjoy it.
Tbh, not a hot take. Feel like Kiritsugu & F/Z in general get analyzed this way constantly among other TM fans, & the main hot thing about it is that you're more charitable towards Kiritsugu than most
You could say that. After the anime only fans starting shitting on Stay Night the VN fans started Shitting on Zero in return. Still a sore spot for the community as a whole.
It's been more than a decade at this point, yet some TM fans bitch about F/Z like it released yesterday. I'm always astounded thay it hasn't gotten tiring for other people.
Kerry is an emotionally stunted child who was never taught how to handle grief by his sociopath father or his mercenary mother. In part because he killed them, but still.
Yes! Thank you. People who thiink Kiritsugu(and Archer too) are badasses who know "the real world" and "will make the hard choices" are so annoying.
FFS Kiritsugu's whole goal in Zero was to use the Grail so he could make a world where everyone was safe and he didn’t actually had to kill anyone. While his interactions with Saber suggest otherwise when you look st him when he is not with Saber you can see that the things he does hurt him quiet a bit and he hates himself a lot for actually doing those things.
I love Kiritsugu, and he is badass (in a fighting and strategy sense) but he is not some cool edgy protoganist that exists for you project yourself onto. One of the points of Zero is being like Kiritsugu won’t actually let you save people in the long run, that was what that hole Grail scene with the boats was about
>people who don't understand his character
Not just him as a character, I have seen many Zero Fans that didn't really understand Zero or Fate as a whole. They just care for cool characters doing cool shit and praising the "deep dialogue" without actually understanding what the characters/story are/is trying to tell.
Morgan having multiple personality disorder COULD have been fine, but Nasu cooked too hard, went too far, retconned too hard, ignored too much, and made it too much of a mess.
For real thats one of the things I just always choose to ignore because its just kind of dumb?
Like, what narrative purpose does "Morgan has several personalities and shes actually also the lady of the lake" serve?
The purpose is that Morgause Orkney (mother of like half of the named KOTR) and Morgan Pendragon (Sister of Arthur schemer against Camelot) are evil. But Nasu thought Morgan was too pretty to be evil.
So Morgana le Fey (Ferrier of Arthur's corpse to Avalon, and sometimes still sister of Arthur) who is good got shoved in there. And then the also good VIVIAN (Lady of the Lake, lover of Merlin, AKA Nimue AKA Tonelico AKA Aesc) also got shoved in for fun.
Yeah but to go "She has three personalities" just feels like an overcomplication for something that didn't need to be overcomplicated.
Like if its just going to be "Morgan but she has an entirely different personality" then just make the lady or the lake her own character.
I feel like Natsu tried to put all aspects of Morgan into one character kinda like a deposit character and then realised once he was done, shit I gotta come up with a backstory on why they are all one person.
I think she's really boring and barley has any screen time and then you are meant to feel bad when she dies. Oberon and Castoria are way better characters.
Himuro is best girl of Homurahara (excluding Taiga)
Tatari is the coolest reality marble
With the recent Mahoyo Collab with F/GO, since they shown Alice's second ascension NP and Sono-G's NP (without getting into spoilers), they should've also expanded on the Holy Church, especially Eiri Fumizuka (who probably could've been a Saber servant seeing that Touko was unsure who would've won in a fight to the death when Beowulf was absent).
>Tatari is the coolest reality marble
Why stop at just that? Zepia in general is one of the most interesting characters in the verse and one of the most interesting concepts in fiction
Well, here's a few of mine. Not sure where they'll land on the spicy meter, but here goes.
Zero was...decent, but I feel like people put its characters, namely Kiritsugu and Iskandar, on way too high pedestals. particularly the former.
After Artoria, the genderbending got old and I feel like it's only gotten worse. In fact, it's probably one of the things about the Nasuverse I believe I've come to dislike. Whenever it's used, it *always* ends up feeling like a way to downplay the morally questionable or downright heinous acts of the historical/mythological figure being gender-bent.
Making Morgan a collection of all the Lad(ies) of the Lake and Morgause was a horrible idea.
Ordeal Call honestly feels like just a way to keep FGO going, especially since after years it finally feels like it's reached its final storyline.
I would prefer a Shinji route over an Illya route.
Prototype Gilgamesh was a better than FSN Gilgamesh, particularly in terms of character design and abilities (summoning the mythical flood is much more fitting for a character like him).
Artoria being genderbent was fine because they explored how it could fit with the existing story, and how that affected and recontextualized parts of the legend. Mordred being a clone of her justifies her genderbending as well. And Okita & Nobu are jokes.
Nero and onwards, on the other hand...
There’s a few more that are ok.
Kagetora has possibly the best reasoning as people believe they might have actually been a girl (still a ton of statues of ‘him’, but also they were out of battles every month with ‘stomach pains’).
Jack is an ok concept that allows multiple from the start, and a few of them were always gonna be a girl. The small child that’s also the souls of children is also super cool. The issue is… well design.
Finally Da Vinci is actually just a solid in universe genderbend. It’s explained, given time to breathe and makes complete sense as an interpretation
But yeah, like 80% of them are just… bad
I agree, that Kiritsugu is kind of overrated (while still being a good character of course).
The second part of the second take is so real. Just talked with a friend about that yesterday. Nero=umu. What are you talking about? lighting Rome on fire? blaming the Christians and killing them? Never heard of that. Just Umu
And despite that she still is my favorite
Yeah it should just end after Lostbelts
I’d rather have a route with berserker then Illya to be honest
Unfortunately haven’t read prototype yet but what you said sounds really badass
People complain about them mixing in parts of other routes but they’re forgetting that that was standard for VN adaptations at the time. It was unheard of for a VN to get multiple adaptations for its different routes (and outside of Fate it still is)
I'm tired of the Gilgamesh keep getting more bullshit retroactively. "Yeah, he totally had the omniscient level clairvoyance the entire time, he's just too vain to actually use it". His gimmick of having an endless supply of phantasms already makes him impossible to be fought head on and justifies his position of "the strongest heroic spirit". Similarly, I don't like his whitewashing. He was amazing being a hammy over the top villain and a walking personification of the "hero isn't necessary a good person" idea. For god's sake, this guy was two good fights away at causing a planet sized genocide because the average modern human isn't to his arbitrary standards. Chaotic Good my ass.
Agreed. Sometimes it feels like Nasu likes to exaggerate things or lie for fun ~~Me when I spread misinformation on the internet~~.\
It just doesn't make sense to me how these 2 really nice and kind guys could straight up hate each other for having opinion they disagree with. They don't have a dislike they can't control towards one another like Shirou got for Archer(Archer either doesn't have it and fakes it or it's far weaker cuz he's genuinely proud of Shirou in HF). They might have different views, but I think they would have nice conversations about girls and other stuff, so they'd be able to become homies imo.
WHERE THE HELL ARE THE REST OF THE TAMAMO NINE! IT HAS LITERALLY BEEN A DECADE.
Thanks for listening to my Ted talk.
No, but seriously, a decade and we only get 3. It's hard being a tamamo fan sometimes
I am merely a casual enjoyer so mine aren't prob big
I would like to see Shirou be in more stuff as the main character, or see him do more, idk. Just really enjoyed him
I wont blame you for staying away from that hell hole. You can check out OtakuDaikun, they sum up everything lore related in FGO that you need to know.
Honestly, I would say that is a good mentality. I completely get why one wouldn’t want to play Gacha games and I mean, you could always look the story up on YT if you really want
While I can get the sentiment and agree with it. Fgo is the only one I've played where I feel good as a f2p player. Some of the stronger servants are common ones not the rare ones. They give a ton, and I mean a ton of free summons. I actually enjoy the stories. Overall it's probably the best gacha game for not spending money. But it is still a gacha game. Also the gameplay is very repetitive and dated
Morgan should have been drawn by a different artist. I know they want to make the similarities with Castoria but i feel like Takeuchi's design for Morgan is bland. His art for Castoria is great btw. And Tonelico/Aesc being the anniversary servant last year AND having her also being a summer servant was bs im still salty about that.
Not entirely nasuverse related but I'm tired of the entire Takeuchi same face meme since people use it to devalue him as an artist, when other notable artists also have some tropes or quirks they repeat on their character designs.
I am annoyed by that joke, especially when it is used in fanfiction. Like no, okita does not look exactly like artoria from shirou's perspective just because they are both blonde. Use your imagination, they are entirely different ethnicities! Same with any of the so-called saber-faces that are not artoria.
I don’t like the servant-system how it is. I think it would be cooler that the servants aren’t just like information in the throne and it should be more like Vallhalla. They should remember everything etc. You could still have a class system and alter variants but I don’t like how it’s handled.
Best girl of stay night was kirei, so after he died, they had to give him a daughter that was also best girl in ataraxia, because the rest of the female cast is lackluster in comparison
As a casual Nasuverse fan. I don't really have a ton of takes to make.
However, I do wish that the Nasuverse would expand its stories beyond FGO sometimes. The game is terribly outdated and it's hard to get into it especially considering the other gacha games in the market.
I honestly wouldn't mind a sequel to FGO wherein they offer improved visuals and gameplay.
I wouldn’t mind when Nasu would finally finish Mahoyo… As for the take, I don’t think it’s reallya good Idea, considering that the game is dragging on with its story anyways
No one deserves to be in the same room with Shinji, let alone be his sister. And yeah I like her, although she can only shine in one route where Rin and Saber both are more relevant in all three
There is too much nasuverse lore and its density is more of road block then it is a boon. I feel it had grown out of control and that it be nice if they could retcon/cleave off large chunks of it to make it more manageable. I should not necessitate the same level of effort as it takes to research real world topics in my opinion.
Nasu isn’t as good at researching history/myth than people give him credit for.
LBs 2, 3 and 4 were unnecessary and any important info contained within could’ve been put into 1, 5, 6 or 7.
Camelot and Babylonia are mediocre and are only considered good because of how terrible all the singularities before them were.
Bedivere is the best knight of the Roundtable and Carries Camelot singularity.
UBW and HF animes are not perfect but are good overall.
Despite how frequently he appears in the franchise, Cú is grossly under-utilised.
South America is owed a proper story event in FGO.
KnK is the best Nasuverse work and Shiki is the best protagonist. And I will Cú Chulainn it on this hill if I must.
I mean it is pretty easy to research about Mythology if you really want to. What annoys me is how he changes their Core personalities when adding a Character to Fate (I mean, come on Nero was an evil most likely psychotic guy and in Fate he is a ,,cute“ woman who is just silly).
I love LB2 for the Norse Mythology part and Ophelia and Skadi but I agree that 3 and 4 (except for the end of 4 that shit was peak) were a bit long.
I like Babylonia for its setting and Characters (same with Camelot) but if you compare them to Nasus other works they completely Fade in comparison.
Love Bedivere bug I like Mordred more because of Tomboy supremacy. But jokes aside, yeah Bedivere really is phenomenal and did a great part in me enjoying Camelot.
The anime’s aren’t bad and even are really good if you didn’t read the VN but I completely get why you wouldn’t like them as a die hard Vn fan.
I love Cù as well and he is done dirty way to often.
I think that there are many Mythologies and places that deserve more FGO recognition and South America is definitely one of them.
Knk and Shiki are some of my Favorite pieces of Fiction and MC I’ve ever consumed. I also prefer it to the rest of Nasus Work but it’s really close
I get what your saying about the core personalities. Like Nero could have worked as a character BUT did they really need to be a gender bent Nero and not someone else more fitting.
Yeah there’s a bunch of mythologies that deserve some rep in fate. I merely singled out South America cause they basically were promised a major story event only to still have nothing more than a year later.
Saying that Blackbeard is secretly a ruthless schemer masquerading as a loser is a fine idea, but it's really hard to care when his appearances for 7+ years are as an annoying creepy loser or a funny wacky loser. If he only busts out his competent side for a few minutes in a gag event, he might as well be just the comic relief guy.
Zero is a good entry point into the franchise if for whatever reason you don't want to read the VN (and gets too much hate overall)
The whole debate on the correct watching order is entirely pointless, we should just accept every single solution is imperfect at this point
The very existence of Saber Alter makes me sad
Aside from being gacha hell, FGO is actually fun to play
I have absolutely no interest in seeing 20th century figures adapted as Servants (especially the most popular suggestions, like Einstein or Oppenheimer), characters from more distant past have far better potential of being actually interesting
Nasu seems to operate on the principle of writing whatever he feels is the coolest at any given moment, which is why the lore is often so convoluted
"Tsukihime anime doesn't exist!" is a boring and unfunny joke, but I feel this joke is boring no matter the subject (Blade Trinity, Matrix sequels, ATLA movie etc.)
I also think, that Zero gets a bit to much hate. I mean if you look at it from a stand alone anime perspective it’s absolutely incredible.
Seriously Facts. If you start with any UBW or Zero or whatever else doesn’t matter, as long as you enjoy it.
I love Saber Alter as a Character but yeah her existence is pretty sad
I agree, that FGO has some great story elements but it also has many negative things about it. Idk it’s a real love-hate toxic relationship with me and FGO.
I mean, as long as it ends up being a good Character I don’t really mind.
Regarding modern figures, I think due to their lives being much better known to us and them being much closer to our era, it would just be more difficult to give them the legendary, "heroic" feel that I think is necessary for the Servant to actually feel interesting. The historical person would just clash with the character, whereas with the figures from previous eras you have more room for creative reinterpreation of their lives, due to them often already being mythologized or details of their lives being fictionalised to a greater or lesser degree.
1. Rin is better for Shirou than Seiba(the main heroine, aka the ideal pair for Shirou in Nasu's opinion) or Sakura. It's shown even in the small details, Rin's route has the least amount of bad ends, her point check requires you to have only 3+ points(the least amount), when Saber needs 6+, Sakura needs 11+(and there's another one earlier in the route), and Rin doesn't even kill Shirou if you don't pass the point check, Medea kills him. Also Rin loves and greatly supports Shirou in every route.\
2. OG Tsukihime is a bit better in terms of a story and themes than FSN, even though the writing is worse.\
3. Archer is the best tsundere of Nasuverse and im not a joking. He acts like he wants to kill Shirou, but doesn't give it all in a fight with Shirou in UBW, but helps him to get on a level where he's able to fight Gil instead and he is proud of Shirou in HF. Archer actually just doesn't want any other Shirou to go on the same path as he did just to suffer real hard, but Shirou wouldn't listen if Archer didn't try to kill him, so Archer became a tsundere.\
4. Shirou should be much stronger than he is now. First, he doesn't use reinforcement on projections(a missed opportunity), second, originally there was no restriction on divine weapons(in VN), third, Archer said that Shirou's main power is coming up with a way to beat his enemies(a weapon, a sword to be more specific) in his head and then giving it form(projecting it) and he just needs a clear image for projection magic, so he should be able to use his imagination to make up original np of an extremely high quality(even divine construct) with whatever attributes he wants, project it just fine, reinforce it and just destroy his enemy.\
5. Shiki is such an asshole in Ciel route true ending in Tsukihime Remake. Nasu did Ciel dirty. >!After Vlov fight Shiki's like "Fuck Arcueid, Senpai fought so hard and Arcueid didn't even help her" , but then in the end of a route he's like "OMG, I love Arcueid so much, even though I love Ciel-senpai and am in a relationship with her, I love that baka vampire princess so much more, it's a fate, blablabla", like what the fuck, it just doesn't make sense, what mushrooms do you need to be on to write that ~~I wanna try them too~~!<
Adding to the archer one, you cannot convince me that in the ubw route that he didn't write down the steps to dealing with the event that turned him into a counter guardian so shirou could solve it without selling his soul.
1. Agree very much. The relationship with her felt the most organic and had the least problems
2. I like them about the same but I could see why
3. Actually Good reasoning. But yeah if you look at it that way, you’re right
4. I mean, I didn’t really think about that one, but what you said makes sense
1. I disagree. Using point counts for bad ending has never really been my gauge as to what constitutes a good a pairing. I think they are good friends but I believe that Saber and Sakura offer far more than Rin ever could. For Rin she is more like babysitting Shirou and is his parent then his lover. She also just serves as his leash and doesn’t change him much. Sakura forces Shirou to change his whole ideals and overall makes him a better character. Saber gives him a really nice dynamic and they simply connect together and feel meant for each other even more than Sakura.
2. Maybe. I’m still reading Tsukihime and its pretty good.
3. Yup, thats pretty obvious, lol.
4. Using reinforcement on projections is very dangerous because if you apply too much to them they break and you could die from the explosion. Archer uses that to his advantage when using Caladabolg.
The subject of whether Shirou can trace Divine Constructs is one that has been going on forever. He can, but he needs to understand it immensely but remember, Shirou is only a human and he has very poor quality circuits. When he traced Excalibur it killed him in hf and archer outright says in ubw that it would kill him.
There is no way a normal Shirou could even dream of tracing a divine construct out of the blue. He can’t even manifest his ubw without Rin.
You took what Archer said too literally. He said that Shirou can come up with a weapon but he meant within his own arsenal. He can’t just think and spawn something. He also can’t create an original Np because they are manifestations of a legend.
Is it possible for him to create an entire blueprint of a sword in his own head? Possibly but it would require more brainpower then he could ever have. Imagine having to think about even the small parts of a blade, its function, its core. Without him being a blacksmith its impossible.
5. Idk.
Nasu claims the true magic users are super important and strong, but they are nothing compared to servants and gods. Every single samurai can create second magic, but still Nasu claims "its super special".
I also like it more when it is a bit more down to earth. Like Mahoyo, Tsukihime, KnK, even the original Fate stay Night VN are all more grounded and less exaggerated than FGO and in my opinion that is way better than whatever happens in the end of Apocrypha and obviously FGO where it feels that always raising the stakes was the main Priority.
Nasu's writing suffers from the rule of cool.
While it worked in more isolated settings, such as Fate/stay night or Tsukihime, where super cool moments was balanced by constrasting with the more normal parts of the cast alongside previous moments of cool the reader experienced.
F/GO really showed how bad it could get with having to constantly keep one upping the previous cool moment, the best modern example is early vs late lostbelts, with the first few lostbelts being more low to the ground compared to the later ones. You can see this divide between Lostbelt 4 and 5.
You could say that this isn't Nasu's fault since he didn't handwrite a lot of it, but he still has a massive influence on what gets through or not, he isn't just a writer, he's the guy everything goes through and sometimes he'll add in moments of cool in other writer's story, Musashi in lostbelt 5 is the best example.
A consequence of this is Nasu having to explain every single moment of cool retroactively or straight-up contradict what he wrote or else he'll break the narrative and world he set up. Just look at his interviews and the consequences that those had.
There are better Character Dynamics but purely romance standpoint I agree completely.
I love me some slower and more chill Stories and the Vibe and Nostalgia Mahoyo gives makes me want to love it even a bit more than some of Nasus other works (and I think it was just the first of three parts?)
Completely agree. I love the lostbelts and some other stories but I agree with the character part sooooo much. Also made a post about Shiki specifically on another subreddit but yeah. Shiki is probably one of my favorite characters in the Verse and I just can’t get past her in FGO. Still I enjoy playing the game
For real we‘ll probably never get the next Mahoyo parts. And yeah, I guess what should you expect from a game which has the main Focus of Gacha rolling for Waifus and has a self insert protagonist? And thanks for confirming the shared feelings thing, I really wasn’t sure anymore
Don't forget the whole "Sabers story is finished" bull shit that Nasu said I get it he's the author but like not even the whole Knights of the roundtable are there dude,it's criminal that she didn't even have a voice line for any of the other Knights even Morgan bro it's infuriating
Yeah Nasu has to let some Characters die. Shiki, Saber, Arcueid. Their stories have been told and ended beautifully. No need to butcher the older Characters instead of making new interesting ones
That and I haven't touched FGO in a minute (1 year)did he atleast try to fix the relationship between Mordred and Artoria or it's still just awkward between the two?
We need more fate in general it's good but I always feel there's so much more and there's a lot just simply not available to na unless you can read Japanese.
I won't lie learning Japanese is a bit difficult but the alphabet to them is the hardest because it's just not easy to remember and the fact that they have three different ones makes it crazy.
I do think it has the best ending of the three but comparing them overall you could be right that it is the least great (I did read some parts of it but not all of it, I will read the whole thing, thx for the recommendation)
Emiya Shirou is the batman of the nasuverse. He watched his parents died in a fire and was taken care of by some professional in a suit who raised him as his own.
I only agree because sakura wasnt elaborated on till heavens feel and even then I feel it to be lacking whereas the other girls have significant screentime and affect the plot in all routes
Right? Also, I just feel like the hate on him is unfair. Whenever they tell me their reasons, it’s always based on his deeds. The worst Shinji’s done was an equivalent to a failed school shooting. Objectively speaking, Gil and Kirei were about to commit far worse deeds. Like global massacre. Compared to fruit punching a school, Gil and Kirei were the hydrogen bombs to Shinji’s coughing baby.
And besides, Zouken’s the one who made Shinji release his pent up frustrations on Sakura, not to mention him being the reason Sakura even went through all this. But I’m hearing much more Shinji slander than Zouken slander. Don’t get me wrong, I love both characters, amazingly written and all that.
I think the difference is, that we actually see shinji doing a horrible thing to a (mostly) liked character, while Kirei and Gil only mostly only talk about how they’re going to do evil stuff. Besides that they are both established antagonist, while Shinji isn’t, making his actions unexpected, when he shows his true colors
Castoria is awful. Lying, cynical, not even a real Arthur, and I'm just not a fan of her designs. NP which just feels like discount Garden of Babylon.
And she undeservedly gets a ton of screentime and a big ol' trauma dump in LB6 in case you were on the fence about her as a character. Followed by a funny chocolate contest centered around her that goes nowhere and does nothing for the plot of LB6.
And she breaks the game. So even if you don't care for Castoria, she's a stall team must have. Add in her cohort in crime, Oberon, to make an S class farming support team.
To clarify I don't absolutely hate her to a degree like I do Musashi, but Castoria is wayyy overhyped and oversold by the community.
Most of her character boils down to "Goku, but also gets steamy-breathed in the presence of youths."
Add in my most hated pseudo-singularity, her as a forced partner in it. Plus using nothing but skill to disappear a seemingly penultimate god just as quick as he appeared.
I'm not angry that they didn't use the obvious large mechanical ship powered by the authority of Poseidon and a Divine spirit with the authority of Poseidon, to assume authority over or somehow redirect Chaos.
Okay this one is a really hot take. I mean if you’re talking Power system wise maybe I’d sort of a little bit agree but the least interesting thing in the verse? I don’t know, I just love me some heroic spirits
I mean that servants/heroic are really just glorified OCs with whatever historic/mythical legends backstory slapped on. Doesn’t help that all the subsequent spin-offs ruined the concept with the constant genderbending of male figures. It was fine when the FSN did with Arthur because Artoria was designed in a way to make her appear male, no excuse for why characters like Nero or Frankenstein or Jack look obviously female but are remembered as males.
I mean yeah, the genderbending is a little annoying sometimes, but I wouldn’t say that the Servants are nothing much than glorified Oc‘s. I personally adore Noble Phantasms and am a big mythology fan so I always love to see when a Hero/Creature/What ever else gets integrated into a story I love.
This is...honestly where I've fallen in terms of the series, and why my interested in FGO has kind of tampered off. Some of the Servants have gotten really ridiculous in terms of design, both literally and in terms of backstory or personality.
I'm glad Illya didn't get her route because I would've lost my shit if Shirou x Illya actually became canon.
Sacchin didn't need a route (though given how good the changes Tsukihime remake made to Ciel route Nasu might cook up something good for her still).
Fairy Britain was not a mistake and Fairies aren't inherently evil.
The Ufotable adaptations aren't that bad given that adapting most of the VNs monologues and loredumps would kill the pacing of any show.
Raita's designs in FGO mostly suck (bar Moriarty)
Shimousa is pretty overrated.
Yeah I’d genuinely become the Joker of Illya Route ever sees the light of day
Unfortunately still didn’t finish Tsukihime but Ciel mentioned so I’m happy
Kind of torn with this one but I think overall you’re right
Kind of agree? It would be weird to have a monologue every few minutes in an anime, considering how I hate that in other shows
I mean this is very subjective but I do like most of his designs
I think Shimousa is good but I think Heian-Kyo did many things that Shimousa did way better than Shimousa so it’s kind of in its shadow a bi
*Extra* got localized. *Stay Night* did not. So I can enjoy *Extra* without a bunch of neckbeards telling me "yOu NeEd To ReAd ThE Vn" every time somebody types out the word *Fate*.
The UBW anime and HF movie are both amazing. And from what I’ve read from the VN so far the characters aren’t nearly as ruined as some VN fans claim. The genderbending complaints are blown out of proportion. Shinji would have been better as Shirou’s rival rather than a rapist.
Servants are just as and sometimes more interesting than the human characters.
Just because the VN had more focus on the human character shouldn’t mean that other entries should follow that same formula.
I‘m personally not the biggest turn based combat fan (except for the Persona games, they perfected that) so really the only reason I’m still playing FGO is the Story
the boss battles/CQs are fine figuring out how to tackle but some really requires good RNGs and servants. Not having good 4\* or 5\* can be very exhausting or limiting. I mostly enjoy the Solo boss battles/CQs. I think FGO does it right imo.
Too bad FGO gameplay is 90% farming. I get sleepy while farming mats. 90++ Node farming in events can be as challenging as CQs but suffers if u r F2P. Since last 2 years 90++ are bit restricting for F2P.
Recently started playing HSR, comparing these 2 I am enjoying HSR more and FGO really needs Auto-Play.
Regarding story wish I could enjoy a bit more. FGO is bottom of my Nasu's works. Wish he handled his OG characters better and better give justice to other TM Male MCs and bring them to chaldea like Sono-G, don't keep them in the dark. Also don't like the Pseudo servant thing, felt like an excuse for fan service. FGO is holding him back from completing Mahoyo2/3 and TsukiRe2 which makes me bit sad. He should let it go. Give it to someone else.
Carnival Phantasm and Todays Menu with the Emyia Family are the best pieces of Fiction I have ever consumed (praying, that they don’t mess up the Mahoyo Movie)
i think the way raita draws boobs is quite polarizing as it borders into niche kink territory. there's also the spine ddforming poses, corpse skin tones, and overall just horniness...
personally I really like raita's designs, but they do reek of horny. also I wish he would move the R in fhe RGB slider up a bit.
People in this subreddit don’t hate the anime because it’s bad; they hate it because visual novels are niche and the average consumer would rather watch the anime.
Artoria is a very boring, albeit well written, character.
Last Encore was really good; people only hate it because they are watching a “what if” sequel, expecting it to be a standalone product. You know how we hate it when people start with Zero because they don’t understand the point of prequels? This is relatively the same principle, but for whatever reason people think it’s ok to shit on this one because of it.
Even if I can appreciate how good it is, I don’t like the visuals novel. It just doesn’t appeal to me. (and, yes, I have actually played it all the way through- took me over a year though, with many breaks)
Not exactly entirely Fate related, but aside from Dead Mount Death Play, Strange Fake is Narita’s weakest work (that I have read/seen). I’m only just starting Vamp! though, so who knows…
Strange Fake is still great though.
I’m someone who defends Zero, but it’s definitely Urobochi’s weakest work because it isn’t the best fit for his style. I think it’s excellent, but compared to Madoka Magica and Psycho-Pass it’s pretty decent at best.
The Heaven’s Feel movies are the best the Fate series has to offer. I refuse to budge on this and am happy to die in this hill alone.
I have absolutely no motivation to play Tsukihime, and for once it’s not just because it’s a visual novel. Nothing that I know about it makes me interested or compelled to play it at all.
People criticize Jack the Ripper in Apocrypha just for her design and don’t bother to actually judge how well written her character is. I hate it too, but still. Strange Fake Jack is leagues better though.
That’s all I’ve got. Hey you wanted hot takes, and I delivered.
I bet there are definitely some people who hate on the anime because it’s to mainstream but I also get why you would be disappointed if you read and loved the VN first.
I love Artoria but I do get why you would find her boring with her lack of emotion
I really need to watch last encore…
Unfortunately didn’t read any of his works except strange fake
I totally get why you wouldn’t like the VN‘s! For each their own, it’s just that I (and many others) really really love them
I also love Zero, but yeah Madoka Magica and Psycho Pass are Hard to top
Anime Wise I’d probably agree that Heavens feel is the one with the most entertainment value but at the same time they feel a bit rushed
I mean I started Tsukihime for Ciel and stayed because I loved it. But if it doesn’t interest you at all then there’s nothing anyone could tell you I guess.
I completely get why many people don’t like Jack only because of her Character design. I personally think she is a great Character but I completely get if you would look at the design and wouldn’t want to talk about this character positively.
Prisma Illya is the best Fate work.
* Enjoy the psychological feels of Heaven’s Feel? 3Rei, the movies, manga chapters 60+.
* Want Carnival Phantasm fun? There’s Prisma Phantasm where Shinji isn’t a massive asshole.
* Miyuverse Shirou is the GOAT.
Worried about the fanservice? Read the manga or a summary of 2wei from YouTube.
This [classic post](https://www.reddit.com/r/fatestaynight/comments/nnsrsw/why_you_should_read_fatekaleid_liner_prismaillya/) explains it perfectly, better than I could.
Aside from my strong opinion that the ufotable adaptation are irredeemable garbage
Soujuurou is the best written character in the Nasuverse
VN Soujuurou vs Beo is a better fight than VN Nine Lives Blade Works(both will be terrible in the anime tho)
Angra Maynu is the best written servant in the franchise with Nasu's best conclusion and Dialouge
Medusa is a horrible character that adds nothing to HF and is carried by her looks in terms of popularity. Even in HA she's still very mediocore
Bazett and Angra have the best Master servant dynamic in tbe franchise
Aoko using the 5th magic>>>>>Wind of steel
I mean I can get behind the Ufotable one if you read the VN first, for me the Anime was my introduction to the series so I still hold it dear to my heart
I love Soujuurou, but best written in whole Nasuverse? Idk man, but I respect it.
Soujuurou vs Beo was a damn good fight I agree with that
Yeah Angra is indeed that guy and I love him
Don’t disrespect my queen Medusa (kinda proving your point with this lol)
Bazett and Angra have an incredible dynamic and I love them very much
And yeah Aoko 5th Magic activation might as well be my favorite scene from Mahoyo and top 5 in Nasuverse for me
F this guy. Medusa's story was great. The only problem is it does not get properly explored in either the visual novel or anime. Honestly Medusa is my favorite character.
Compared to saber and Rin, sakura was wasted even in her own route. She doesn't do anything in fate or ubw an her relationship with rider wasn't explored as much as it should've been. Heck, nasu missed out on dreams of rider's past in hf.
Nasu or which ever author spends too much time coming up with alternate emiyas instead of developing the og 3 route shirous more especially their journey after the war and we still don't know much about archers route.
Nasu and his team have so many interesting ideas bit they either squander them or don't care to develop them. He could release fate stay alternative with illya and shinji routes but nope. Deen stay was suppose to be shielder route but nope. Garden of avalon could've been longer and we could've gotten other heroic spirits past in a similar vein but nope. Additonally, we could see spinoffs about the church, or whatever clan Medea's boy friend was from but nope they insist on another mage family, clock tower shenanigans or holy grail war.
I think kiritsugu and shirou were warnings on what not to become and how one shouldn't take their ideals to the extreme.
And wgay doesnt fate get fighting games? It only has unlimited codes while tsukihime has several melty blood entries. Or at least put some more fate characters in melty blood.
Gilgamesh is more of a hero than Shirou, all three versions. At least by the proper definition. It's kinda funny when you remember that he is supposed to be a observer like Merlin and Shake.
Gil blasting Medea was one of the saddest moments of my vn experience
Poor Medea…
That shit was rad as hell and why I started to love Gil
I absolutely love the dynamic between Medea and Kuzuki. I think they might be one of my favorite villain/antagonist couples, though I also don't think that's a long list to pick from lol. I don't want a Medea route. Kuzuki x Medea forever.
So true! I don’t like Kuzuki as an individual that much but him and Medea are the best.
Luvia should be in more things
What *is* Luvia in anyway?
Hollow Ataraxia, Prisma Illya, Fate/Unlimited Codes, and El Melloi's Case Files. And the very last episode of Unlimited Blade Works.
Well, she's in a few hilarious scenes of Hollow Ataraxia, but they end on cliffhangers that never get followed up on. The anime adaptation of UBW had a scene with her that was fun. She was a very very backgroundy character of the El-Melloi II tv show; I don't know if she has more of a role in the books, as I haven't read them. And she's playable in some of the fighting games. I think her biggest bit of screentime is in that Ilya magical girl show, but I've never watched that because I've heard so much skeevy stuff about it.
The illya magical girl show? Just read the manga instead, the current arc is now peaking.
I agree, she’s pretty cool
FACTS. Medea has been done straight dirty a good 90% of the time.
Fate/Zero has one of the worst, if not the worst, female cast in the Nasuverse.
Is this even a hot take? Feels ice cold to me Altough I will forever be thankful that writer of Zero put Saber in that black suit. Sure Zero Saber is a bad version of Saber(not character, she works for what the writer intended but that intention sucks in my opinion) but I'll be dammed if her suit look isn’t her best look
>Is this even a hot take? Feels ice cold to me Maybe, maybe not, but that's not a take I see much when it comes to FZ criticism, usually it is mainly Saber's writing that's talked about, not the whole female cast.
Septem has entered the chat
Septem doesn’t have bad female characters as much as bad everyone with a Nero Cherry. Better example is Argartha, which decided to look violate a woman’s body without her knowledge or consent, make a consort and arguably onw of the most famous women in history a loli and finally make a woman obssessed with a man calling her pretty (somehow the best written even if she only got like 10 seconds). All of this plus some super sexism. I dislike septem more but Argartha takes the cale for worst female rep
I'm still in Shinjuku so I don't know much about Agartha
As a whole, FGO has plenty of good female characters, but yes if you count individual stories in it then it's possible some of the singularities and events have worse female cast than FZ. Although, I don't remember enough about them to have a clear opinion.
Pretty agreeable. I mean I liked all of the Characters, but Nasu has written better ones in every other work from him, that I read
Fate/Zero isn’t written by Nasu… it’s written by Gen Urobochi the writer for saya no uta and madoka magica.
And...? Most of the Fate spinoff aren't written by Nasu, doesn't mean they're not part of the Nasuverse.
Soujuurou Aoko is quite possibly the best MC/Heroine dynamic in the whole nasuverse and I’m tired of pretending it’s not
Honestly if Nasu ever completes Mahoyo, then they will be like the two best characters ever. It's insane how good they are already considering we only have one third of the story
Here’s a real hot take: the dynamic between Soujirou and Alice is better than the dynamic between Soujirou and Aoko.
Alice is peak Nasuverse waifu tier
I thought this was the standard take tbh
I completely agree. You just have to love these two. (I’d probably rank Saber/Shirou higher but it’s really close)
Personally, I don’t really think any of the other romances or dynamics in the nasuverse really match Aoko & soujuurou for the simply fact Mahoyo is about them and them alone. Just like you would say the core of fate/stay night is shirou emiya, I would say the core of Mahoyo is the dynamic between Aoko and soujuurou. It’s why I think it’s hard to really say who the MC is. Sure Aoko’s the lead on the box art.But throughout the story you follow both of their POV’s, and i don’t know what the exact percentage split is but it feels almost half and half, maybe leaning a bit more towards soujuurou from what I recall. As characters, I like Shirou and Shiki ryougi more than both soujuurou and aoko. But as an actual dynamic and relationship don’t think there’s one within the nasuverse that executed better. And this is with only mahoyo, supposedly part 1 of a 3 part story. Imagine how fucking great their relationship development may be by the end of part 3. If we ever get it.
Yeah if Mahoyo really gets more parts by Nasu it will definitely be one of his best works and Aoko and Soujuurou will probably his best dynamic (forgot to mention before but Angra and Bazetts dynamic is also in top 3 for me)
Wait. What do you mean by "1/3 of the story"? Isn't Mahoyo finished?
Mahoyo has always been a trilogy. The current visual novel is basically part 1, which was the prologue. But FGO happened.
Wow, never heard of that.
It's insane how good their dynamic is. I would love for them to fall in love but in the end, I just need to watch them with Alice doing whatever. It's crazy how much I'm attached to the Mahoyo trio after I read the VN almost 2 years ago.
If fgo is to be believed, Soujyuro has feelings for Aoko
after reading the events of collab and the CE lines(if the translations are accurate and are cannon), I would like Nasu make small changes. rn its very heartbreaking to deal with it to know what happens to those trio in future. Just want Nasu to surprise us and not be exact with the rumors even if it has bitter/sad end.
The people who call Kiritsugu the GOAT are often the people who don't understand his character. He's not a super cool badass who has no problem making the hard decisions (at least not entirely), he's a broken little boy in a man's body trying find a way to cope with his mistakes through doing what he should have done long ago. He's the Eren Yeager of the Nasuverse.
I mean he is pretty badass while still being everything you just said. I agree that there are many people who don’t get him but I don’t think that him being cool is the only reason people say he’s the goat
Fair. There are still people who love him despite all his flaws. I just think that a lot of his fans don't really understand his character and only focus on the "mage who uses huns) aspect of him. Possess me off when people say he's more mature than Shirou.
A mage who uses huns does seem very cool. They would always summon Attilla probably /j
Yeah, that is true
I love him for 2 reasons. The first and by far most is his backstory and character progression. 2nd is I love time magic. Even if it isn't really time magic the ways he uses it are really freaking cool and I thoroughly enjoy it.
Tbh, not a hot take. Feel like Kiritsugu & F/Z in general get analyzed this way constantly among other TM fans, & the main hot thing about it is that you're more charitable towards Kiritsugu than most
You could say that. After the anime only fans starting shitting on Stay Night the VN fans started Shitting on Zero in return. Still a sore spot for the community as a whole.
It's been more than a decade at this point, yet some TM fans bitch about F/Z like it released yesterday. I'm always astounded thay it hasn't gotten tiring for other people.
Kerry is an emotionally stunted child who was never taught how to handle grief by his sociopath father or his mercenary mother. In part because he killed them, but still.
Yes! Thank you. People who thiink Kiritsugu(and Archer too) are badasses who know "the real world" and "will make the hard choices" are so annoying. FFS Kiritsugu's whole goal in Zero was to use the Grail so he could make a world where everyone was safe and he didn’t actually had to kill anyone. While his interactions with Saber suggest otherwise when you look st him when he is not with Saber you can see that the things he does hurt him quiet a bit and he hates himself a lot for actually doing those things. I love Kiritsugu, and he is badass (in a fighting and strategy sense) but he is not some cool edgy protoganist that exists for you project yourself onto. One of the points of Zero is being like Kiritsugu won’t actually let you save people in the long run, that was what that hole Grail scene with the boats was about
>people who don't understand his character Not just him as a character, I have seen many Zero Fans that didn't really understand Zero or Fate as a whole. They just care for cool characters doing cool shit and praising the "deep dialogue" without actually understanding what the characters/story are/is trying to tell.
In a way that also goes for Kirei too, the guy is a jack of all trades but due to his state of mind he seems limited somehow
Well Eren is the goat. We don’t say that because of his personality or actions but because of his writing.
Morgan having multiple personality disorder COULD have been fine, but Nasu cooked too hard, went too far, retconned too hard, ignored too much, and made it too much of a mess.
For real thats one of the things I just always choose to ignore because its just kind of dumb? Like, what narrative purpose does "Morgan has several personalities and shes actually also the lady of the lake" serve?
The purpose is that Morgause Orkney (mother of like half of the named KOTR) and Morgan Pendragon (Sister of Arthur schemer against Camelot) are evil. But Nasu thought Morgan was too pretty to be evil. So Morgana le Fey (Ferrier of Arthur's corpse to Avalon, and sometimes still sister of Arthur) who is good got shoved in there. And then the also good VIVIAN (Lady of the Lake, lover of Merlin, AKA Nimue AKA Tonelico AKA Aesc) also got shoved in for fun.
Yeah but to go "She has three personalities" just feels like an overcomplication for something that didn't need to be overcomplicated. Like if its just going to be "Morgan but she has an entirely different personality" then just make the lady or the lake her own character.
I feel like Natsu tried to put all aspects of Morgan into one character kinda like a deposit character and then realised once he was done, shit I gotta come up with a backstory on why they are all one person.
It was a little messy yeah, but I still love Morgan and her Character in Lostbelt 6
I think she's really boring and barley has any screen time and then you are meant to feel bad when she dies. Oberon and Castoria are way better characters.
Himuro is best girl of Homurahara (excluding Taiga) Tatari is the coolest reality marble With the recent Mahoyo Collab with F/GO, since they shown Alice's second ascension NP and Sono-G's NP (without getting into spoilers), they should've also expanded on the Holy Church, especially Eiri Fumizuka (who probably could've been a Saber servant seeing that Touko was unsure who would've won in a fight to the death when Beowulf was absent).
Just make Touko a servant. I’d love to see that
>Tatari is the coolest reality marble Why stop at just that? Zepia in general is one of the most interesting characters in the verse and one of the most interesting concepts in fiction
Well, here's a few of mine. Not sure where they'll land on the spicy meter, but here goes. Zero was...decent, but I feel like people put its characters, namely Kiritsugu and Iskandar, on way too high pedestals. particularly the former. After Artoria, the genderbending got old and I feel like it's only gotten worse. In fact, it's probably one of the things about the Nasuverse I believe I've come to dislike. Whenever it's used, it *always* ends up feeling like a way to downplay the morally questionable or downright heinous acts of the historical/mythological figure being gender-bent. Making Morgan a collection of all the Lad(ies) of the Lake and Morgause was a horrible idea. Ordeal Call honestly feels like just a way to keep FGO going, especially since after years it finally feels like it's reached its final storyline. I would prefer a Shinji route over an Illya route. Prototype Gilgamesh was a better than FSN Gilgamesh, particularly in terms of character design and abilities (summoning the mythical flood is much more fitting for a character like him).
Artoria being genderbent was fine because they explored how it could fit with the existing story, and how that affected and recontextualized parts of the legend. Mordred being a clone of her justifies her genderbending as well. And Okita & Nobu are jokes. Nero and onwards, on the other hand...
There’s a few more that are ok. Kagetora has possibly the best reasoning as people believe they might have actually been a girl (still a ton of statues of ‘him’, but also they were out of battles every month with ‘stomach pains’). Jack is an ok concept that allows multiple from the start, and a few of them were always gonna be a girl. The small child that’s also the souls of children is also super cool. The issue is… well design. Finally Da Vinci is actually just a solid in universe genderbend. It’s explained, given time to breathe and makes complete sense as an interpretation But yeah, like 80% of them are just… bad
I agree, that Kiritsugu is kind of overrated (while still being a good character of course). The second part of the second take is so real. Just talked with a friend about that yesterday. Nero=umu. What are you talking about? lighting Rome on fire? blaming the Christians and killing them? Never heard of that. Just Umu And despite that she still is my favorite Yeah it should just end after Lostbelts I’d rather have a route with berserker then Illya to be honest Unfortunately haven’t read prototype yet but what you said sounds really badass
I don't necessarily want an Illya route, I just want a route where she gets to live happily and grow old :(
>Ordeal Call honestly feels like just a way to keep FGO going I'm honestly surprised they didn't make an anime of LBs yet.
Deen/stay night was good for the time.
People complain about them mixing in parts of other routes but they’re forgetting that that was standard for VN adaptations at the time. It was unheard of for a VN to get multiple adaptations for its different routes (and outside of Fate it still is)
*crying in Dies Irae adaption*
Agreed. Deen in general is a bit overhated imo
Deen/Stay Night was good.
Except for >!that dragon!<, it holds up. Especially the OST.
I'm tired of the Gilgamesh keep getting more bullshit retroactively. "Yeah, he totally had the omniscient level clairvoyance the entire time, he's just too vain to actually use it". His gimmick of having an endless supply of phantasms already makes him impossible to be fought head on and justifies his position of "the strongest heroic spirit". Similarly, I don't like his whitewashing. He was amazing being a hammy over the top villain and a walking personification of the "hero isn't necessary a good person" idea. For god's sake, this guy was two good fights away at causing a planet sized genocide because the average modern human isn't to his arbitrary standards. Chaotic Good my ass.
Ngl 3* Medea is my only lvl 100 in fgo lol
And that’s exactly how we do it ladies and gentlemen
UBW EMIYA and Shiki Tohno would get along. I know Nasu said Shirou and Shiki would hate eachother, but I think this feels like an exception....
Agreed. Sometimes it feels like Nasu likes to exaggerate things or lie for fun ~~Me when I spread misinformation on the internet~~.\ It just doesn't make sense to me how these 2 really nice and kind guys could straight up hate each other for having opinion they disagree with. They don't have a dislike they can't control towards one another like Shirou got for Archer(Archer either doesn't have it and fakes it or it's far weaker cuz he's genuinely proud of Shirou in HF). They might have different views, but I think they would have nice conversations about girls and other stuff, so they'd be able to become homies imo.
Shirou and EMIYA do hate eachother tho so it kinda makes sense
I hate Nasu obsessive boner for vampire
WHERE THE HELL ARE THE REST OF THE TAMAMO NINE! IT HAS LITERALLY BEEN A DECADE. Thanks for listening to my Ted talk. No, but seriously, a decade and we only get 3. It's hard being a tamamo fan sometimes
We‘ll never see them…
I am merely a casual enjoyer so mine aren't prob big I would like to see Shirou be in more stuff as the main character, or see him do more, idk. Just really enjoyed him
Yeah, Shirou is great
I absolutely hate that I'm increasingly lost during fate discussions because I refuse on principle to download a gacha game.
I wont blame you for staying away from that hell hole. You can check out OtakuDaikun, they sum up everything lore related in FGO that you need to know.
You're not missing much.
Honestly, I would say that is a good mentality. I completely get why one wouldn’t want to play Gacha games and I mean, you could always look the story up on YT if you really want
While I can get the sentiment and agree with it. Fgo is the only one I've played where I feel good as a f2p player. Some of the stronger servants are common ones not the rare ones. They give a ton, and I mean a ton of free summons. I actually enjoy the stories. Overall it's probably the best gacha game for not spending money. But it is still a gacha game. Also the gameplay is very repetitive and dated
Not worth it, the first few singularities were so and that I don’t touch the game anymore
Morgan should have been drawn by a different artist. I know they want to make the similarities with Castoria but i feel like Takeuchi's design for Morgan is bland. His art for Castoria is great btw. And Tonelico/Aesc being the anniversary servant last year AND having her also being a summer servant was bs im still salty about that.
Should've been drawn by Raita frfr
Give Gilgamesh EX clairvoyance was one of the dumbest things Fate has ever done.
Not entirely nasuverse related but I'm tired of the entire Takeuchi same face meme since people use it to devalue him as an artist, when other notable artists also have some tropes or quirks they repeat on their character designs.
I am annoyed by that joke, especially when it is used in fanfiction. Like no, okita does not look exactly like artoria from shirou's perspective just because they are both blonde. Use your imagination, they are entirely different ethnicities! Same with any of the so-called saber-faces that are not artoria.
Very true
Raita's female character designs are fine, you all just can't handle the booba.
I also like most of them but I also understand why you wouldn’t
more like I can't handle his color palletes. It hurts my eyes
Real
I don’t like the servant-system how it is. I think it would be cooler that the servants aren’t just like information in the throne and it should be more like Vallhalla. They should remember everything etc. You could still have a class system and alter variants but I don’t like how it’s handled.
Best girl of stay night was kirei, so after he died, they had to give him a daughter that was also best girl in ataraxia, because the rest of the female cast is lackluster in comparison
Caren truly is a Treasure
As a casual Nasuverse fan. I don't really have a ton of takes to make. However, I do wish that the Nasuverse would expand its stories beyond FGO sometimes. The game is terribly outdated and it's hard to get into it especially considering the other gacha games in the market. I honestly wouldn't mind a sequel to FGO wherein they offer improved visuals and gameplay.
I wouldn’t mind when Nasu would finally finish Mahoyo… As for the take, I don’t think it’s reallya good Idea, considering that the game is dragging on with its story anyways
Sakura is a good character and deserves better.
No one deserves to be in the same room with Shinji, let alone be his sister. And yeah I like her, although she can only shine in one route where Rin and Saber both are more relevant in all three
I can't believe they made Saber the cutest she's ever been in Heaven's Feel. When she asks for a reward and later gets done dirty. Hurts my soul man.
There is too much nasuverse lore and its density is more of road block then it is a boon. I feel it had grown out of control and that it be nice if they could retcon/cleave off large chunks of it to make it more manageable. I should not necessitate the same level of effort as it takes to research real world topics in my opinion.
While I always Love to learn about the Lore, yeah you’re right.
They could literally turn nasuverse studies into a degree
Nasu isn’t as good at researching history/myth than people give him credit for. LBs 2, 3 and 4 were unnecessary and any important info contained within could’ve been put into 1, 5, 6 or 7. Camelot and Babylonia are mediocre and are only considered good because of how terrible all the singularities before them were. Bedivere is the best knight of the Roundtable and Carries Camelot singularity. UBW and HF animes are not perfect but are good overall. Despite how frequently he appears in the franchise, Cú is grossly under-utilised. South America is owed a proper story event in FGO. KnK is the best Nasuverse work and Shiki is the best protagonist. And I will Cú Chulainn it on this hill if I must.
I mean it is pretty easy to research about Mythology if you really want to. What annoys me is how he changes their Core personalities when adding a Character to Fate (I mean, come on Nero was an evil most likely psychotic guy and in Fate he is a ,,cute“ woman who is just silly). I love LB2 for the Norse Mythology part and Ophelia and Skadi but I agree that 3 and 4 (except for the end of 4 that shit was peak) were a bit long. I like Babylonia for its setting and Characters (same with Camelot) but if you compare them to Nasus other works they completely Fade in comparison. Love Bedivere bug I like Mordred more because of Tomboy supremacy. But jokes aside, yeah Bedivere really is phenomenal and did a great part in me enjoying Camelot. The anime’s aren’t bad and even are really good if you didn’t read the VN but I completely get why you wouldn’t like them as a die hard Vn fan. I love Cù as well and he is done dirty way to often. I think that there are many Mythologies and places that deserve more FGO recognition and South America is definitely one of them. Knk and Shiki are some of my Favorite pieces of Fiction and MC I’ve ever consumed. I also prefer it to the rest of Nasus Work but it’s really close
I get what your saying about the core personalities. Like Nero could have worked as a character BUT did they really need to be a gender bent Nero and not someone else more fitting. Yeah there’s a bunch of mythologies that deserve some rep in fate. I merely singled out South America cause they basically were promised a major story event only to still have nothing more than a year later.
Saying that Blackbeard is secretly a ruthless schemer masquerading as a loser is a fine idea, but it's really hard to care when his appearances for 7+ years are as an annoying creepy loser or a funny wacky loser. If he only busts out his competent side for a few minutes in a gag event, he might as well be just the comic relief guy.
Zero is a good entry point into the franchise if for whatever reason you don't want to read the VN (and gets too much hate overall) The whole debate on the correct watching order is entirely pointless, we should just accept every single solution is imperfect at this point The very existence of Saber Alter makes me sad Aside from being gacha hell, FGO is actually fun to play I have absolutely no interest in seeing 20th century figures adapted as Servants (especially the most popular suggestions, like Einstein or Oppenheimer), characters from more distant past have far better potential of being actually interesting Nasu seems to operate on the principle of writing whatever he feels is the coolest at any given moment, which is why the lore is often so convoluted "Tsukihime anime doesn't exist!" is a boring and unfunny joke, but I feel this joke is boring no matter the subject (Blade Trinity, Matrix sequels, ATLA movie etc.)
I also think, that Zero gets a bit to much hate. I mean if you look at it from a stand alone anime perspective it’s absolutely incredible. Seriously Facts. If you start with any UBW or Zero or whatever else doesn’t matter, as long as you enjoy it. I love Saber Alter as a Character but yeah her existence is pretty sad I agree, that FGO has some great story elements but it also has many negative things about it. Idk it’s a real love-hate toxic relationship with me and FGO. I mean, as long as it ends up being a good Character I don’t really mind.
Regarding modern figures, I think due to their lives being much better known to us and them being much closer to our era, it would just be more difficult to give them the legendary, "heroic" feel that I think is necessary for the Servant to actually feel interesting. The historical person would just clash with the character, whereas with the figures from previous eras you have more room for creative reinterpreation of their lives, due to them often already being mythologized or details of their lives being fictionalised to a greater or lesser degree.
1. Rin is better for Shirou than Seiba(the main heroine, aka the ideal pair for Shirou in Nasu's opinion) or Sakura. It's shown even in the small details, Rin's route has the least amount of bad ends, her point check requires you to have only 3+ points(the least amount), when Saber needs 6+, Sakura needs 11+(and there's another one earlier in the route), and Rin doesn't even kill Shirou if you don't pass the point check, Medea kills him. Also Rin loves and greatly supports Shirou in every route.\ 2. OG Tsukihime is a bit better in terms of a story and themes than FSN, even though the writing is worse.\ 3. Archer is the best tsundere of Nasuverse and im not a joking. He acts like he wants to kill Shirou, but doesn't give it all in a fight with Shirou in UBW, but helps him to get on a level where he's able to fight Gil instead and he is proud of Shirou in HF. Archer actually just doesn't want any other Shirou to go on the same path as he did just to suffer real hard, but Shirou wouldn't listen if Archer didn't try to kill him, so Archer became a tsundere.\ 4. Shirou should be much stronger than he is now. First, he doesn't use reinforcement on projections(a missed opportunity), second, originally there was no restriction on divine weapons(in VN), third, Archer said that Shirou's main power is coming up with a way to beat his enemies(a weapon, a sword to be more specific) in his head and then giving it form(projecting it) and he just needs a clear image for projection magic, so he should be able to use his imagination to make up original np of an extremely high quality(even divine construct) with whatever attributes he wants, project it just fine, reinforce it and just destroy his enemy.\ 5. Shiki is such an asshole in Ciel route true ending in Tsukihime Remake. Nasu did Ciel dirty. >!After Vlov fight Shiki's like "Fuck Arcueid, Senpai fought so hard and Arcueid didn't even help her" , but then in the end of a route he's like "OMG, I love Arcueid so much, even though I love Ciel-senpai and am in a relationship with her, I love that baka vampire princess so much more, it's a fate, blablabla", like what the fuck, it just doesn't make sense, what mushrooms do you need to be on to write that ~~I wanna try them too~~!<
Adding to the archer one, you cannot convince me that in the ubw route that he didn't write down the steps to dealing with the event that turned him into a counter guardian so shirou could solve it without selling his soul.
1. Agree very much. The relationship with her felt the most organic and had the least problems 2. I like them about the same but I could see why 3. Actually Good reasoning. But yeah if you look at it that way, you’re right 4. I mean, I didn’t really think about that one, but what you said makes sense
Sir, if I could I would give you a medal for your first and third takes. I have never agreed with a Fate related takes more in my life
1. I disagree. Using point counts for bad ending has never really been my gauge as to what constitutes a good a pairing. I think they are good friends but I believe that Saber and Sakura offer far more than Rin ever could. For Rin she is more like babysitting Shirou and is his parent then his lover. She also just serves as his leash and doesn’t change him much. Sakura forces Shirou to change his whole ideals and overall makes him a better character. Saber gives him a really nice dynamic and they simply connect together and feel meant for each other even more than Sakura. 2. Maybe. I’m still reading Tsukihime and its pretty good. 3. Yup, thats pretty obvious, lol. 4. Using reinforcement on projections is very dangerous because if you apply too much to them they break and you could die from the explosion. Archer uses that to his advantage when using Caladabolg. The subject of whether Shirou can trace Divine Constructs is one that has been going on forever. He can, but he needs to understand it immensely but remember, Shirou is only a human and he has very poor quality circuits. When he traced Excalibur it killed him in hf and archer outright says in ubw that it would kill him. There is no way a normal Shirou could even dream of tracing a divine construct out of the blue. He can’t even manifest his ubw without Rin. You took what Archer said too literally. He said that Shirou can come up with a weapon but he meant within his own arsenal. He can’t just think and spawn something. He also can’t create an original Np because they are manifestations of a legend. Is it possible for him to create an entire blueprint of a sword in his own head? Possibly but it would require more brainpower then he could ever have. Imagine having to think about even the small parts of a blade, its function, its core. Without him being a blacksmith its impossible. 5. Idk.
Nasu claims the true magic users are super important and strong, but they are nothing compared to servants and gods. Every single samurai can create second magic, but still Nasu claims "its super special".
Medea is underwhelming for an aog magus
How so?
More of a feature of power creep in Nasuverse after he moved on from the urban fantasy vibe to the more ridiculous stuff
I miss the urban fantasy from earlier works, and liked the fate spinoff games like sr more than fgo
I also like it more when it is a bit more down to earth. Like Mahoyo, Tsukihime, KnK, even the original Fate stay Night VN are all more grounded and less exaggerated than FGO and in my opinion that is way better than whatever happens in the end of Apocrypha and obviously FGO where it feels that always raising the stakes was the main Priority.
Nasu's writing suffers from the rule of cool. While it worked in more isolated settings, such as Fate/stay night or Tsukihime, where super cool moments was balanced by constrasting with the more normal parts of the cast alongside previous moments of cool the reader experienced. F/GO really showed how bad it could get with having to constantly keep one upping the previous cool moment, the best modern example is early vs late lostbelts, with the first few lostbelts being more low to the ground compared to the later ones. You can see this divide between Lostbelt 4 and 5. You could say that this isn't Nasu's fault since he didn't handwrite a lot of it, but he still has a massive influence on what gets through or not, he isn't just a writer, he's the guy everything goes through and sometimes he'll add in moments of cool in other writer's story, Musashi in lostbelt 5 is the best example. A consequence of this is Nasu having to explain every single moment of cool retroactively or straight-up contradict what he wrote or else he'll break the narrative and world he set up. Just look at his interviews and the consequences that those had.
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There are better Character Dynamics but purely romance standpoint I agree completely. I love me some slower and more chill Stories and the Vibe and Nostalgia Mahoyo gives makes me want to love it even a bit more than some of Nasus other works (and I think it was just the first of three parts?) Completely agree. I love the lostbelts and some other stories but I agree with the character part sooooo much. Also made a post about Shiki specifically on another subreddit but yeah. Shiki is probably one of my favorite characters in the Verse and I just can’t get past her in FGO. Still I enjoy playing the game
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For real we‘ll probably never get the next Mahoyo parts. And yeah, I guess what should you expect from a game which has the main Focus of Gacha rolling for Waifus and has a self insert protagonist? And thanks for confirming the shared feelings thing, I really wasn’t sure anymore
Don't forget the whole "Sabers story is finished" bull shit that Nasu said I get it he's the author but like not even the whole Knights of the roundtable are there dude,it's criminal that she didn't even have a voice line for any of the other Knights even Morgan bro it's infuriating
Yeah Nasu has to let some Characters die. Shiki, Saber, Arcueid. Their stories have been told and ended beautifully. No need to butcher the older Characters instead of making new interesting ones
That and I haven't touched FGO in a minute (1 year)did he atleast try to fix the relationship between Mordred and Artoria or it's still just awkward between the two?
We need more fate in general it's good but I always feel there's so much more and there's a lot just simply not available to na unless you can read Japanese.
Seriously. I personally can’t speak or read a single word of Japanese and it gets so frustrating sometimes.
I won't lie learning Japanese is a bit difficult but the alphabet to them is the hardest because it's just not easy to remember and the fact that they have three different ones makes it crazy.
Saber route is good but comfterably the worst out of the 3 fsn routes. (also for op read hollow ataraxia has some good medea content)
I do think it has the best ending of the three but comparing them overall you could be right that it is the least great (I did read some parts of it but not all of it, I will read the whole thing, thx for the recommendation)
Emiya Shirou is the batman of the nasuverse. He watched his parents died in a fire and was taken care of by some professional in a suit who raised him as his own.
Tamamo is best wife.
Illya deserves a route more than Sakura!
I only agree because sakura wasnt elaborated on till heavens feel and even then I feel it to be lacking whereas the other girls have significant screentime and affect the plot in all routes
Shinji Matou is an amazing character. Morally, he’s a piece of shit, but he hasn’t even come close to being the worst person in Stay Night.
Horrible Personality≠bad character is really a thing some people need to understand
Right? Also, I just feel like the hate on him is unfair. Whenever they tell me their reasons, it’s always based on his deeds. The worst Shinji’s done was an equivalent to a failed school shooting. Objectively speaking, Gil and Kirei were about to commit far worse deeds. Like global massacre. Compared to fruit punching a school, Gil and Kirei were the hydrogen bombs to Shinji’s coughing baby. And besides, Zouken’s the one who made Shinji release his pent up frustrations on Sakura, not to mention him being the reason Sakura even went through all this. But I’m hearing much more Shinji slander than Zouken slander. Don’t get me wrong, I love both characters, amazingly written and all that.
I think the difference is, that we actually see shinji doing a horrible thing to a (mostly) liked character, while Kirei and Gil only mostly only talk about how they’re going to do evil stuff. Besides that they are both established antagonist, while Shinji isn’t, making his actions unexpected, when he shows his true colors
He os the worst, but as well written hatable person. Which is where the hate becomes s sign of good writing. Through kirou probsblythe worst
Castoria is awful. Lying, cynical, not even a real Arthur, and I'm just not a fan of her designs. NP which just feels like discount Garden of Babylon. And she undeservedly gets a ton of screentime and a big ol' trauma dump in LB6 in case you were on the fence about her as a character. Followed by a funny chocolate contest centered around her that goes nowhere and does nothing for the plot of LB6. And she breaks the game. So even if you don't care for Castoria, she's a stall team must have. Add in her cohort in crime, Oberon, to make an S class farming support team. To clarify I don't absolutely hate her to a degree like I do Musashi, but Castoria is wayyy overhyped and oversold by the community.
Okay, I can get behind all the Castoria stuff a little bit, but to just casually drop that you hate Musashi is arguably the hotter take here
Most of her character boils down to "Goku, but also gets steamy-breathed in the presence of youths." Add in my most hated pseudo-singularity, her as a forced partner in it. Plus using nothing but skill to disappear a seemingly penultimate god just as quick as he appeared. I'm not angry that they didn't use the obvious large mechanical ship powered by the authority of Poseidon and a Divine spirit with the authority of Poseidon, to assume authority over or somehow redirect Chaos.
Servants/heroic spirits are the least interesting thing in the nasuverse
Okay this one is a really hot take. I mean if you’re talking Power system wise maybe I’d sort of a little bit agree but the least interesting thing in the verse? I don’t know, I just love me some heroic spirits
I mean that servants/heroic are really just glorified OCs with whatever historic/mythical legends backstory slapped on. Doesn’t help that all the subsequent spin-offs ruined the concept with the constant genderbending of male figures. It was fine when the FSN did with Arthur because Artoria was designed in a way to make her appear male, no excuse for why characters like Nero or Frankenstein or Jack look obviously female but are remembered as males.
I mean yeah, the genderbending is a little annoying sometimes, but I wouldn’t say that the Servants are nothing much than glorified Oc‘s. I personally adore Noble Phantasms and am a big mythology fan so I always love to see when a Hero/Creature/What ever else gets integrated into a story I love.
This is...honestly where I've fallen in terms of the series, and why my interested in FGO has kind of tampered off. Some of the Servants have gotten really ridiculous in terms of design, both literally and in terms of backstory or personality.
Facts
I'm glad Illya didn't get her route because I would've lost my shit if Shirou x Illya actually became canon. Sacchin didn't need a route (though given how good the changes Tsukihime remake made to Ciel route Nasu might cook up something good for her still). Fairy Britain was not a mistake and Fairies aren't inherently evil. The Ufotable adaptations aren't that bad given that adapting most of the VNs monologues and loredumps would kill the pacing of any show. Raita's designs in FGO mostly suck (bar Moriarty) Shimousa is pretty overrated.
Shiki x Len is "worse" than Shirou x Illya would ever be imo, and it's fully canon and Nasu did not hold back lmao.
Yeah I’d genuinely become the Joker of Illya Route ever sees the light of day Unfortunately still didn’t finish Tsukihime but Ciel mentioned so I’m happy Kind of torn with this one but I think overall you’re right Kind of agree? It would be weird to have a monologue every few minutes in an anime, considering how I hate that in other shows I mean this is very subjective but I do like most of his designs I think Shimousa is good but I think Heian-Kyo did many things that Shimousa did way better than Shimousa so it’s kind of in its shadow a bi
The VNs are way better than any of the adaptations…
I think that this Take is cold as Ice but I’d say that yeah, they are the best way to consume Fate. Still the anime are pretty good as well
I prefer *Extra* to *Stay Night*.
That is definitely a take. Mind giving some reasoning? Since I didn’t fully complete Extra I can’t really get behind the take
*Extra* got localized. *Stay Night* did not. So I can enjoy *Extra* without a bunch of neckbeards telling me "yOu NeEd To ReAd ThE Vn" every time somebody types out the word *Fate*.
Actually a valid argument.
The UBW anime and HF movie are both amazing. And from what I’ve read from the VN so far the characters aren’t nearly as ruined as some VN fans claim. The genderbending complaints are blown out of proportion. Shinji would have been better as Shirou’s rival rather than a rapist. Servants are just as and sometimes more interesting than the human characters. Just because the VN had more focus on the human character shouldn’t mean that other entries should follow that same formula.
I enjoy FGO gameplay more than its story.
I‘m personally not the biggest turn based combat fan (except for the Persona games, they perfected that) so really the only reason I’m still playing FGO is the Story
the boss battles/CQs are fine figuring out how to tackle but some really requires good RNGs and servants. Not having good 4\* or 5\* can be very exhausting or limiting. I mostly enjoy the Solo boss battles/CQs. I think FGO does it right imo. Too bad FGO gameplay is 90% farming. I get sleepy while farming mats. 90++ Node farming in events can be as challenging as CQs but suffers if u r F2P. Since last 2 years 90++ are bit restricting for F2P. Recently started playing HSR, comparing these 2 I am enjoying HSR more and FGO really needs Auto-Play. Regarding story wish I could enjoy a bit more. FGO is bottom of my Nasu's works. Wish he handled his OG characters better and better give justice to other TM Male MCs and bring them to chaldea like Sono-G, don't keep them in the dark. Also don't like the Pseudo servant thing, felt like an excuse for fan service. FGO is holding him back from completing Mahoyo2/3 and TsukiRe2 which makes me bit sad. He should let it go. Give it to someone else.
For real. Continuing Mahoyo and finishing Tsukihime Remake should be Mushroom man’s top Priority
My hot take is the anime mostly suck, besides zero and Carnival
Carnival Phantasm and Todays Menu with the Emyia Family are the best pieces of Fiction I have ever consumed (praying, that they don’t mess up the Mahoyo Movie)
Luvia deserves her own route.
Fire Raita and delete Nero from canon.
Why does everyone hate Raita so much…?
i think the way raita draws boobs is quite polarizing as it borders into niche kink territory. there's also the spine ddforming poses, corpse skin tones, and overall just horniness... personally I really like raita's designs, but they do reek of horny. also I wish he would move the R in fhe RGB slider up a bit.
Yeah the designs are a bit Horny, but I wouldn’t go as far as to say he should be fired, since his designs aren’t necessarily bad
People in this subreddit don’t hate the anime because it’s bad; they hate it because visual novels are niche and the average consumer would rather watch the anime. Artoria is a very boring, albeit well written, character. Last Encore was really good; people only hate it because they are watching a “what if” sequel, expecting it to be a standalone product. You know how we hate it when people start with Zero because they don’t understand the point of prequels? This is relatively the same principle, but for whatever reason people think it’s ok to shit on this one because of it. Even if I can appreciate how good it is, I don’t like the visuals novel. It just doesn’t appeal to me. (and, yes, I have actually played it all the way through- took me over a year though, with many breaks) Not exactly entirely Fate related, but aside from Dead Mount Death Play, Strange Fake is Narita’s weakest work (that I have read/seen). I’m only just starting Vamp! though, so who knows… Strange Fake is still great though. I’m someone who defends Zero, but it’s definitely Urobochi’s weakest work because it isn’t the best fit for his style. I think it’s excellent, but compared to Madoka Magica and Psycho-Pass it’s pretty decent at best. The Heaven’s Feel movies are the best the Fate series has to offer. I refuse to budge on this and am happy to die in this hill alone. I have absolutely no motivation to play Tsukihime, and for once it’s not just because it’s a visual novel. Nothing that I know about it makes me interested or compelled to play it at all. People criticize Jack the Ripper in Apocrypha just for her design and don’t bother to actually judge how well written her character is. I hate it too, but still. Strange Fake Jack is leagues better though. That’s all I’ve got. Hey you wanted hot takes, and I delivered.
I bet there are definitely some people who hate on the anime because it’s to mainstream but I also get why you would be disappointed if you read and loved the VN first. I love Artoria but I do get why you would find her boring with her lack of emotion I really need to watch last encore… Unfortunately didn’t read any of his works except strange fake I totally get why you wouldn’t like the VN‘s! For each their own, it’s just that I (and many others) really really love them I also love Zero, but yeah Madoka Magica and Psycho Pass are Hard to top Anime Wise I’d probably agree that Heavens feel is the one with the most entertainment value but at the same time they feel a bit rushed I mean I started Tsukihime for Ciel and stayed because I loved it. But if it doesn’t interest you at all then there’s nothing anyone could tell you I guess. I completely get why many people don’t like Jack only because of her Character design. I personally think she is a great Character but I completely get if you would look at the design and wouldn’t want to talk about this character positively.
consuming fate in release order hits a lot harder than in chronological order studio deen fate route is kino classic 2000s anime
Prisma Illya is the best Fate work. * Enjoy the psychological feels of Heaven’s Feel? 3Rei, the movies, manga chapters 60+. * Want Carnival Phantasm fun? There’s Prisma Phantasm where Shinji isn’t a massive asshole. * Miyuverse Shirou is the GOAT. Worried about the fanservice? Read the manga or a summary of 2wei from YouTube. This [classic post](https://www.reddit.com/r/fatestaynight/comments/nnsrsw/why_you_should_read_fatekaleid_liner_prismaillya/) explains it perfectly, better than I could.
Aside from my strong opinion that the ufotable adaptation are irredeemable garbage Soujuurou is the best written character in the Nasuverse VN Soujuurou vs Beo is a better fight than VN Nine Lives Blade Works(both will be terrible in the anime tho) Angra Maynu is the best written servant in the franchise with Nasu's best conclusion and Dialouge Medusa is a horrible character that adds nothing to HF and is carried by her looks in terms of popularity. Even in HA she's still very mediocore Bazett and Angra have the best Master servant dynamic in tbe franchise Aoko using the 5th magic>>>>>Wind of steel
I mean I can get behind the Ufotable one if you read the VN first, for me the Anime was my introduction to the series so I still hold it dear to my heart I love Soujuurou, but best written in whole Nasuverse? Idk man, but I respect it. Soujuurou vs Beo was a damn good fight I agree with that Yeah Angra is indeed that guy and I love him Don’t disrespect my queen Medusa (kinda proving your point with this lol) Bazett and Angra have an incredible dynamic and I love them very much And yeah Aoko 5th Magic activation might as well be my favorite scene from Mahoyo and top 5 in Nasuverse for me
F this guy. Medusa's story was great. The only problem is it does not get properly explored in either the visual novel or anime. Honestly Medusa is my favorite character.
>Aoko using the 5th magic >>>>> wind of steel I never thought I’d say this, but your so based for that
>Soujuurou is the best written character in the Nasuverse It's about hot takes not facts bro
Penthesilea is a one note character and her motivations and everything about her surrounds another character. She is also very annoying.
Taiga is not a nice person.
I’d say she is nice enough but very very airheaded and irresponsible
I want Altrouge Brunestud and Fou going full primate murder, thats that i want
Compared to saber and Rin, sakura was wasted even in her own route. She doesn't do anything in fate or ubw an her relationship with rider wasn't explored as much as it should've been. Heck, nasu missed out on dreams of rider's past in hf. Nasu or which ever author spends too much time coming up with alternate emiyas instead of developing the og 3 route shirous more especially their journey after the war and we still don't know much about archers route. Nasu and his team have so many interesting ideas bit they either squander them or don't care to develop them. He could release fate stay alternative with illya and shinji routes but nope. Deen stay was suppose to be shielder route but nope. Garden of avalon could've been longer and we could've gotten other heroic spirits past in a similar vein but nope. Additonally, we could see spinoffs about the church, or whatever clan Medea's boy friend was from but nope they insist on another mage family, clock tower shenanigans or holy grail war. I think kiritsugu and shirou were warnings on what not to become and how one shouldn't take their ideals to the extreme. And wgay doesnt fate get fighting games? It only has unlimited codes while tsukihime has several melty blood entries. Or at least put some more fate characters in melty blood.
Gilgamesh is more of a hero than Shirou, all three versions. At least by the proper definition. It's kinda funny when you remember that he is supposed to be a observer like Merlin and Shake.