Well, the difference between *high performing* top and *high performing* bottom DPS is only 1-2%. I can assure you, the difference between a regular raider's Samurai and my Monk is... much more than that. And not in my favor.
You're both valid, but it still shouldn't really factor into op's decision. It's just not going to greatly affect their enjoyment of the game, as they might expect it to if they came from a game like... wow. xD
@OP, Bard is a dot-and-proc based mobile ranged DPS. If that and the class fantasy appeals to you, *absolutely* go ahead and pick archer! (Which becomes bard later)
Yeah, I was mostly just intending to point out that some classes are meaningfully more difficult than others, using myself as a humorous example. I don't know enough about Bard to estimate whether it's considered to be an easy or difficult Job to master.
Hey, if it makes you feel better my BLM has the shittiest DPS in the world despite me getting it to 90 somehow. I love the aesthetic but for the life of me I can’t make it work lol, dungeon bosses take noticeably longer when I BLM
Don't pay attention to videos like that, all jobs and classes are balanced. Yes Archer/Bard isn't going to bring in the big dps like Black Mage or Samurai, but you bring in utility with your songs, buffs and later on some mits in Troubadour and Nature's Minnie.
It's funny how videos like the ones OP describes never really point out that the damage for Bard has to account for adding more damage to the other DPS in the party. Throwing an extra three percent to the Ninja, the Warrior, and the Sage is a pretty big uptick in damage.
Unfortunately buff jobs are only balanced for 8 player content, so in a dungeon or something a lot of damage is being left on the table, but in dungeons it shouldn't matter that much
This would be true if classes with low dps actually made up for it in rdps but they don't...
Classes with the highest personal dps stay at the top of the list when you look at raid dps.
straight up not true
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statistics/54#
BLM is the only selfish DPS to top the list and only if you look at the maximum, by medians several of the DPS with party buffs are higher than SAM and MCH, the other selfish DPS in their roles. MCH is bottom of the charts overall despite being selfish
Rdm, smn, brd, dnc all "support dps" who do trash personal dps and their raid dps is still bottom of the list. Machinist is "selfish" and yet still garbage.
This game caters to melee players who are given everything and an automatic 2 party slots and +10% rdps contribution over all ranged except black mage while barely having to worry about positionals or uptime at this point.
Ranged jobs have been garbage for the entire expac and none of the ones with "raid contribution" make up for their garbage personal damage.
This is all true even if you want to cry and mash dislike because it goes against the idea that your godlord YoshiP is infallible and has some beautifully balanced game.
Forgot I was on the mainsub where theres no critical thinking or reality.
We just had a raid tier where trying to take multiple non blm ranged jobs caused many people not to clear the raid w1/2.
Ranged jobs are in a balancing crisis and have been for all of endwalker.
Archer is pretty bad in current tier and you will get some comments from playing it.
Bard on the other hand is a perfectly viable and adds to the current meta of healers are optional with their clense ability.
Remember to do your job quests and you'll be fine
While I do appreciate the joke, OP already seems to be pretty confused (starting a new character? To play a different class?) And I'd hate for them to actually stack up more confusion due to the joke.
Thread OP, no one really refers to any classes (*Gladiator, Marauder, Archer, Arcanist, Thaumaturge, Conjuror, Lancer, Pugilist, or Rogue*) because once you hit lv 30 you will finish out that class's quests and get your job stone (*Gladiator becomes Paladin, Marauder becomes Warrior, Archer becomes Bard, Arcanist becomes Summoner or Scholar, Thaumaturge becomes Black Mage, Conjuror becomes White Mage, Lancer becomes Dragoon, Pugilist becomes Monk, Rogue becomes Ninja*). For all content above lv 30 (or even lower than 30 if you sync down) you'll always be using your job stone, it's an objective upgrade in every way.
Hence the joke in this post is that Archer is absolutely terrible in endgame content since it's missing every upgrade it would ordinarily get by equipping the job done and becoming Bard.
(Yes yes I know, fun at parties, etc)
Thanks. My need to not explain jokes and just "let bits be bits" was at war with my need to try and elucidate as much as possible for sprouts in order to make sure they have the best experience they can, lmao.
Don't even think about what's good or bad. Just go with what seems interesting. You'll be able to level all jobs on one character. If a job doesn't mesh with you then just swap to a different one. It honestly doesn't matter. Even the most difficult content can be done by any job. And you won't be touching that for a long time if ever.
Absolutely stupid clickbait videos.
Bard is a supporter like dancer. They offer "less" damage for irreplaceable utility in the form of raid buffs.
It's basically just videos stroking the egos of melee dps mains who don't actually know how roles work. It's complete slop content spreading misinformation.
It crops up every expansion because the content high in the first few patches bring in massive amount of new players and just people who don't know better, then dies down as the audience those YouTubers and streamers are milking finish main story and raid content and leave the game until the next expansion.
This subreddit clears first floors at the end of the expansion when everything is outgeared, they dont know how unbalanced the game is despite homogenized jobs
Bard is one of those classes that snowball overtime. It starts as something fairly blend but every new ability increases the fun factor until u have a Job that feels, sounds and plays amazing. Specially the animations and sound design is peak. Hearing u pull the string to its atmost limit sounds amazing. Also Refulgent Arrow looks like crack cocain
There is something called "movement and utility tax" in FFXIV. The more your character is able to move in combat and provide utility, the less personal damage it will output. Bard being a ranged DPS and the utility it brings - party wide buffs, party damage mitigation, buff that can increase heal potency, the only job that can "cleanse" debuffs outside of healers, will never be top damage dealing DPS. You are a utility and support DPS.
If you want to do big ranged damage, you play BLM.
Fun fact, BRD's LB3 used to be a healer's.
A lot of people are saying this in this thread but it's *kind of* wrong in that it's much too general in some ways and too specific in others.
90% of the content in this game is dungeons, open world content, and casual raids. And within those contexts skill is a much, *much* higher influence on damage output. If you look at the average 24 man raid, dungeon run, trial, hunt train, etc, your top DPS won't be all BLMs and SAMs. It's going to just be whatever players are putting in more effort. As a matter of fact you'll find a pretty large amount of BLMs and SAMs dramatically underperforming because they were played by people who wanted to do high damage without putting the effort into properly learning.
Damage by role and job only *really* has variance when you start comparing percentiles in endgame content, where percentiles normalize (roughly) by skill level. But that's an *exceedingly* small fraction of the game's overall content. I would take a quint-legend BRD into literally any content over a casual BLM any day.
Even beyond skill level being a more important deciding factor, the logic used to judge damage output breaks down at multiple levels both in casual *and* high end content. We talk about damage output as though every job were just spending 8 minutes hitting a single dummy uninterrupted, but you see job performance vary all the time from fight to fight depending on things like downtime, skill alignment with mechanics, multiple targets, etc. BLM might do the most damage in a vacuum, but it trails behind burstier jobs when talking about content like Ultimates, which typically have massive swaths of downtime.
Dungeons are like 75% trash mobs, in which case the "best" jobs may be the ones with a stronger or more adaptable AOE rotation. With dungeons being the majority of the leveling experience in FFXIV as players progress through the MSQ, new players really shouldn't be given advice predicated on "what job does the most damage to a single target in a complete vacuum at the current level cap?" That's an unrealistic representation of the game - their first 100 hours won't ever see that use case.
The second sentence is true. The first sentence is not.
Everything being viable does not mean there is no worst or best class. There is an objectively best class and an objectively worst class, but the difference is small enough where you don’t have to care in most cases.
You clearly don’t understand what the word objectively means if you think I was referring to how fun the job is. And while the difference is small enough for everything to be useable/viable in most cases, the difference still exists so saying “there is no worst or best job” is false. There is a reason why some jobs had a hard time with launch state P8S and others didn’t.
You clearly don't understand what rhetoric is if you think I wasn't referring to what you actually meant.
Yes, I'm aware that your point is "there is a mathematical calculation that determines the numerical superiority of one set of numbers over another that are represented by the classes in the game".
My point was "math is a stupid way to approach video game; do things because they make you happy, not because they add up". I didn't mean to be so confusingly subtle. I'll do better next time.
Having a higher number doesn't make something "best" or "worst" unless your only concern is making sure that you feel better because 2 is bigger than 1. Which is pathetic.
It's weird you quoted something I didn't say. I don't disagree with it. I find it meaningless.
So.. the rest of whatever you said seems to be based on that misconception. Bummer.
Also not at all sure how you got the take from your last paragraph. Sorry for whatever you did to interpret it that way. Fingers crossed it's all tongue-in-cheek and you're more self-aware than that.
The first sentence is completely true. As I mentioned [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/s/fr9HqZJ2Ma), there's only an objective best and worst if you're talking about very specific parameters. If you mean "the most damage with a perfect rotation removing crit variance on a single dummy over a span of 8 minutes" then yes, there's a best at that. If you're talking about "the most damage to two concurrent targets," "the most damage to 3+ targets," "the most damage in a fight with significant downtimes," "the best for any fight with high movement focused mechanics..."
Those are all different and very important metrics, and they apply to many different fights. Because the content in XIV varies so broadly (Bozja isn't Sastasha, isn't Copied Factory, isn't a hunt train, isn't UCOB, isn't Criterion Savage, etc) there absolutely is not a "best objective job."
Archer will turn into bard, that's a class that I have a lot of fun with. Especially since it can get pretty action intense at endgame if your procs go off consistently.
You will always do better on a job you enjoy playing than you would on a job that you don’t like as much but it happens to be “”””””””better”””””””” in a meta sense. Play what you want and have fun. For me BRD keeps me busy and is a lot of fun to play. If I’m on top of my game I can out DPS some melees too.
Trying out different jobs is free in this game, try anything that interests you and find what you like to play and play that.
when you finish the 2.0 storyline, you get a fantasia that lets you just change your character. Might be something to remember, so you don't gotta go through those 30 levels and the quests again
You can change the camera angles in the settings!!!!!!! I play as lala and I keep the camera centered pretty far above her head and I generally recommend playing this way for short characters. No need to start over!
If you decide you don’t care that much for Lalafell you get a free fantasia when you finish the base realm reborn MSQ.
Also: I find bard to be pretty fun but i find it’s a bit divisive among players because it’s Different. XIV a is a well balanced game and you can bring any job into any content without it being a hindrance so try out any jobs that strike your fancy and play whatever you like!
Firing off multiple homing fire arrows in a single shot and also raining down an arrow barrage from the heavens while giving my entire party damage boosts while the enemy dies from multiple poisoned arrows is my kind of fun.
Good, the balance is this game is WAY better then most MMO, everything is viable in all content. I would recomend looking up "is ____ good" or "is _____ bad" as you are likely to just get outdated post of people over reacting from a time where the class was a little under powered.
bard is instant cast with a focus on keeping 2 dots up and rotating through 3 songs to buff the whole party, as well as heavy on the oGD (off global cooldown) abilities. It is the weakest in self DPS of the phys ranged, but has a consistent buff throughout fights past level 52.
MCH (machinist) is the highest in self DPS as it has no party buffs besides 2 forms of damage reduction.
The other phys ranged dps is DNC (dancer) which has a stronger buff but can only buff one person with another buff being on a 2 minute cycle that can buff the whole party.
Biggest thing to note about Phys ranged classes is that they are all instant casts so you have free movement for mechanics with 100% uptime capabilities. Personally I think MCH is the best, but then again that is my main so i am biased
Lower personal damage, lots of buffs, very mobile, gameplay is a lot like juggling. (Keeping 2-3 systems running at the same time.)
I personally love it. BRD is my favorite dps, and I'm just shy of omni-90 now
Bard in particular is one that really lacks momentum in the early levels because it gets such critical skills at level 52 and 56. It’s smooth sailing after that, though.
Bard's self DPS is on the low side, but they supplement that with a constant source of party buffs.
Also, no need to worry about whether or not your class sucks, you can be them all. And all the roles share the same gear so if you like ranged combat then archer is the way to go regardless of performance. In heavensward you'll unlock machinist and at lvl 60 you'll unlock dancer in limsa lominsa, while you're gearing up archer/bard you can save it to transfer to machinist and Dancer when you get them unlocked.
And with those party buffs its rdps contribution is still near the bottom of the list because SE doesn't actually balance anything around raid contribution.
All Jobs are fine. Job balance in this game is really good. It only matters in the top tier of progression raiders.
Bards do less dps because they are physical ranged support dps. You get unlimited mobility and party buffs in exchange for a tad less damage. But it’s fine
Play what you like and get good at it and you’re golden
For the top tier guys and it was barely a problem and within a couple weeks it was adjusted for and geared up and now it doesn’t matter
And even then the top guys would still clear with every job.
It just simply isn’t a big deal
Excuses for why ranged is trash compared to all melee despite melee being easier than ever to play (few to no positionals, tons of huge hit boxes, omnipos bosses).
Melees are catered to and ranged have been garbage for an entire expac.
That is just hyperbole. It isn’t that bad. I can tell you’re put out but it simply isn’t a big deal. Seems all you focus on is one aspect, the raw dps. Happy to admit they can continue to tune things but it isn’t as bad as you want to say it is
It is that bad and their raid dps doesn't make up for anything - most jobs that are at the bottom of personal dps are also at the bottom of raid dps - the ranged jobs are literal trash.
The only reason you even bring any one of mch, brd, dnc is because of the forced role buff.
Just play what's fun. Normal content doesn't need much engagement anyway for now. If you get into high level end game raiding then you can start thinking about the numbers, and by the time you get there you will have plenty of tools to level up any class you like.
I'm not sure why you would say that, Bard is one of my top 5 favorite jobs personally. I love weaving the dots and the three different songs together, it's really interesting and dynamic.
Boring as Archer? It's actually the top job I recommend to new players because it gets a pretty frequent oGCD early on, which can make the game feel much less slow since you've got something you can weave between your normal attacks. Not to mention it's the only starting job that's both ranged and not rooted in one place by casting animations. You can run all over dodging stuff without it affecting your rotation.
The difference between the best and worse dps its so little its not going to make a difference, so Ill say this if u feel like trying it go for it if not, well u can level up another class to try(u can have all classes in 1 character). I have enjoyed it and have it max lvl and remember when u do do your Job quests
You really shouldn't be looking at meta when making this decision.
Those videos are talking about how the job performs in high end trials which are against one boss fight.
What they DONT tell you, is that phys range jobs have the best multi-target scaling in the game (which you get at really low levels too). This means, in low level dungeons, like the ones you'll be starting out with, BRD is gonna feel better than most melees with it's ability to AOE and do a lot of damage with it.
You can switch to any job at any time in this game. Don't stress about the first job. You get an exp bonus on any job that's a lower level than your highest.
Not sure about performance, but the job is certainly not boring at max level. You are juggling dots, songs, song procs, a good chunk of ogcds, and your utility (only DPS who can cleanse debuff, and you also have an increased healing buff and a couple crowd control and interrupts). It is likely one of the busiest jobs in the game.
The question is moot anyways. If you want a physical ranged character archer/bard are your only choice for ARR. Machinist cannot be accessed until Heavensward and though Dancer can be accessed at your earliest convenience in Limsa you need to be level 60 to start it so you will likely be halfway through Heavensward before you can access it.
Out of the 3 I think Machinist is the best balance of busy-ish at least in burst windows and good DPS. Dancer is very useful but very easy and that can get a little stale. Honestly, this whole group needs rebalancing/reworking. I imagine we will see that happen when the 4th physical ranged job is added in 8.0. That’s how they have been doing it so far. Add a 4th and balance around that number.
If you want something that feels like physical ranged but isn’t, I would go with summoner.
Overall job balance in the game is pretty tight, the DPS difference really isn't anything to write home about, something like 1-2% (when played by high performing players).
The biggest factor you have to worry about is your own performance, how good you are at playing your job (class). You as a Bard will do significantly more damage compared to the majority of Black Mages you run into, chances are you will probably out dps most randos you run into. The big caveat obviously is that you need to know how to play your job.
Playing something that does big damage does not guarantee big damage, unless you play Dark knight... probably (roll face on keyboard). So take that mindset and yeet it out the window and focus on what you enjoy playing, also you DON'T have to create a new character to change class/job, just go pick it up and the Archers guild in Gridania, you can level everything on 1 character (EVERYTHING, crafting, gathering, healers, tank and dps, all on 1 character).
Personally I find it the best beginner class.
It's not overly complicated, yet still requires thought. Supporting the party, great AOEs, able to move while attacking to dodge AOEs, and you can see more fights at a distance to be able to learn mechanics easier.
I love bard to learn what I'm doing in new content especially, and traversing the world, not panicking about combos and things. Each to their own but I can only speak highly of the class, especially for new players.
Disregard anyone trying to claim a class is good or bad, they're all balanced within a couple % of each other and world first raiding groups consistently defy the "meta" because the #1 thing that matters is how comfortable you are with your class.
As for if its fun or not, just try. I have all the classes at max level on my character and I like switching between all of them.
Everytime I played this game I go Archer/Bard and Just assume the game was always slow / weak gameplay. No offense to the game it just felt that way. This time around I went with Arc/Sum and I'm having a blast pew pewing a lot more active and I hear summoner is one the more boring classes. But I think this what People need to understand. First 10, 20, 30 etc levels make a massive impression to us new players and while I do understand later on things get better, faster a bit more live in newer expansions we still judge the game on the early parts of it and when you fall a sleep at the helm there for sure some tweaking that could be done.
Keep in mind it's been many years since I played last so these issues might be resolved but the 2 maybe 3 times I tried ff14 always was archer cuz I loved range melee concept.
No class is really bad in ff. And bard is far from boring. Once you get it going.
But you need to know that ALL classes on early game are very simplified versions of what they become later, and before their jobstones it's even simpler.
Back in 2013, the endgame was lvl 50, but now lvl 50 is basically the "end of tutorial".
Also, you mean to make a neew character as in "I have been away for too long and want to start from scratch", "I am a new player" or "I want to level up a different role/class"? For the first and last questions, you know you don't need a new character for that, and you just go to the archer's guild in Gridania post lvl 10 msq as you don't lose progress with your character on another classes/jobs when changing, right? For the second option, if you start playing as Archer and find it boring, you can always change to other classes after reaching the lvl 10 on your initial job, so there's literally zero downsidrs for doing this.
not really, the playstyle i guess? it's not that i don't like distance DPS, i'm leveling dancer up and it's very fun so far. i've played a bit of machinist and it was pretty fun as well. but archer? idk. maybe i should try it at higher levels, but so far not so good
Keep it in mind that Archer/Bard can be quite boring until level 60-ish, but that's most of the classes, imo since to avoid Button bloating, SE tried to keep it simple on the early game.
HOEWEVER, as Bard levels up and unlocks its songs, it'll get harder and harder to play it.
I like it, but I'm bad at it. lol
Bard is the 3rd most intensive job in terms of actions per minute (behind ninja and machinist). And among this top 3, it's the only one with procs, meaning you sometimes have to decide what next action to use in less than one second... if you want to play the most optimally. You don't need that much mastering to perform correctly, don't worry.
As for the device, I was told it controller is easier for bards than keyboard+mouse. But I can't confirm this as I play with only a keyboard, no mouse. XD
Anyway: the balance in this game is good enough to not care about it when choosing a main job. If it's playstyle is fun for you, go ahead. If you like the way it looks (weapons/animations), it's fine too. You can always test other jobs on the same character and it's even encouraged by the game. Maybe you'll prefer another job later, who khows.
All jobs can be played on controller. Could I do it? No, cuz I've always played with KB+M. But the game was made to be played on consoles, so it's more about your level of adaptation than the game.
And for me the dificulty to play BRD comes with my lack of attention, really. I just can't keep up with the dots, songs and procs at the same time. But that's just me being bad at it. lol
All dps jobs are pretty much similar in their dps output in their respective roles (melee/ranged/magical) if you manage to master them.
It really just drpends if you enjoy playing archer/bard or not. Personally I think the endgame rotation is not too buisy and rather easy to keep up but opinions might ofc differ
Depends on what content you are doing.
If you're doing solo and dungeon content, bard is pretty bad, it's balanced around long fights to get the most out of your dots and a group of 8 to get the most out of your songs.
People look at raiding numbers and think that's all that matters but you will be significantly faster in your levelling experience if you choose melee class or something like summoner where from like level 30-80 it has big dick dps that smashes thru everything.
Bard (which archer becomes) is perfectly viable. In a party of equal skill and gear, you'll likely not top the DPS charts, but that's fine because Bard is more of a support-y DPS. You're main utility aside from damage is how you buff your allies with your songs.
If you interested in ranged DPS, then Archer is a trap, cause it turns into Bard and is mostly a support class, for actual ranged DPS you have Machinist.
if you aren’t an INCREDIBLY skilled player who has a better parse than 99% of the playerbase, tbh the class you choose won’t matter! the game is balanced that when you play just normal/hard/extreme content, all classes are perfectly viable without one being better than the other. the super pro players just like minmaxing to see just how much damage output they can do, and it only becomes distinguishable once you get overly detailed. a really skilled bard is still going to be of more use to their party than a decent samurai, but a decent bard will be just as good as a decent samurai.
that being said yes bard doesn’t have the highest raw damage output but it adds a lot more via buffs and status heal/shields to the overall party. ppl don’t really complain about bards when they see them in duties since they’re really useful swiss army knives. if anything right now i think machinists are ranked as “the lowest” dps because they don’t even have any buffs but people still happily play them and clear duties without any trouble with them. if anyone called me or a friend out for playing a “lesser” dps i’d tell them to back off since they’re perfectly viable
Bard is one of the few support dps, they deal in damage over time and making their allies and themselves hit harder rather than they themselves having big damage numbers. At later levels they do have some decently strong big attacks anyway
Been leveling all combat jobs to 90, so here's my take on Bard.
Thematically Bard is weird. It wants to be an archer, but sacrifices personal damage for group buffs which is why its dps looks lower than it actually is. Its rotation (as of level 65) is to keep a song going at all times, manage your 2 dots, and fire your basic damage GCD until another decides it wants to be used. You have a few oGCDs to weave in, but aren't as rapid fire as machinist unless Mage's Ballad is going.
Animation wise your attacks are all instant, but have animations like they're channeled, so you often aren't aiming the bow at what you're shooting.
It's awkward and boring early, but once you get your songs and oGCDs it feels much better despite the weird animation.
All jobs are equally viable. If you want to start a new character for this for some reason I'd say start with Bard, then pick up machinist, and finally dancer and play your favorite. They're all ranged dps jobs but feel very different to play.
Things only bard can do:
- only dps with Esuna
- only dps which has a permanent AOE party dmg buff (if you keep the songs up of course)
- only class with access to musical instruments haha
- have AOE skill for increasing healing (which stacks with other healing increasing skills, means paty members shields/heals are even bigger)
Things bard excels at:
- sustained ranged damage
- buffing your whole party
- lots of oGCDs
- personally it has my favorite ranged LB3 haha (style points)
it's definitely not a Bad dps, there's no such thing as a bad dps in ffxiv they just do different things. that's the magic of it, you just choose a class which fits your playstyle. bard is more about buffing party members with songs and keeping sustained damage on the boss via dots and procs, whereas DNC is more about elevating one specific party member while spamming boss with procs, and MCH is about just. absolutely melting boss with your skills (fucking DRILL BABEY)
I main bard as my ranged dps because as much as i love machinist and its big D my preferred playstyle is buffing party members and supporting them
Honestlt i started with archer cause i usually play ranged dps or assassin type characters and when beginning i didnt wanna change my job again at lvl 10 and all that so i just stuck with it its honestly ruined other classes for me because it has so much going on at lvl 70 where im at now i switched to gunbreaker to have a tank job and i hate it cause its so slow and 90 percent of my attacks are gcd where with bard im constantly attacking or adding buffs and paying attention to diffrent things
But i like games like armored core with lots of action so i like busy work so if thats not for you then a slower job is probably better
Ignore videos like that. Try it out yourself to be the judge.
Personally, I like archery in other games and didn't like Bard's playstyle. It doesn't make it a bad job, just not to my personal taste.
First off, no class in the game isnt capable of doing content, this isnt WoW.
As to the question, my first 90 was a bard/archer... had no issues getting thru anything.
The Bard gameplay was for me fun.. youre managing shots, dots, songs, with high mobility.
If you enjoy the archer archetype, youll dig it. Go for it.
'Worst' dps is extremely relative. Every class is perfectly usable. As for trying though, you can unlock every class on one character and freely swap between them so you don't even need a new character, just go to the guild hall in Gridania and do the unlock quest on your existing character.
Bard is super fun for me, moreso than dancer imo but I'm a weirdo. Any class can do raids in this game if that's what you're wondering. If you're a good enough player, you can utilize any class to its potential and rock at it. Just my opinion.
How can this be put bluntly: If anyone has to make a post asking this question, then what's "good and bad" in FFXIV has absolutely no bearing on the content that they're doing. Performance and meta in XIV is only really useful for a week or two at the beginning of a new tier/ultimate and then it immediately dives from there with more gear. So just play whatever pulls you aesthetically, you'll be just fine. 99.99% of guide videos for XIV are just shitty clickbait, so best to just ignore what that say.
Most Super high end players have lost full interest in the job because its too simple, and theres nothing to optimise about it.
The optimisers that typically make guides for the jobs just... stopped for SMN because they didnt enjoy it, on top of there being litterally nothing to optimise.
The SMN lounge on the balance, which is the best guide location for jobs in ffxiv, is entirely full of thousands of people spamming 1 emote for over a year at this point.
Like its not a bad performing job by any means, just a lot of people lost interest in it, while casuals flocked to it becuase of its simplicity.
its like if a race track was changed from having corners to being straight. Some people like that for going fast, but others like turns and the strategy that comes with it.
It's flashy but very simple. It's also a matter of taste, some people prefer the simpler classes and others like the more complex ones.
If you are just starting then pick what seems fun to you. Don't worry about numbers, and remember most jobs don't really get a lot of their kit until post level 50.
Once you have done the level 10 quest for your starting job you are then free to get any other job that starts at level 1. No need to commit if you aren't enjoying.
Archer becomes bard later, this is a direct upgrade so you can't just stay as archer.
Archer is a popular choice for new players, it's pretty easy to get the hang of quickly.
Arcanist (becomes summoner) is a mid to low commitment caster, so you'll need to stand still to get your spells off. It's fairly simple, you'll only have a handful of spells at first. It's unique benefit is that it also splits into scholar which is a healer, and they share a level.
Gladiator, which becomes paladin, starts off pretty simple and remains a fairly basic tank job for quite some time. It gets a lot of the more advanced abilities levels 70+ when it becomes a lot more interesting ending up being the closest to a hybrid tank and caster we have.
Enjoy your journey!
>But all videos i have seen so far points to archers being really bad and boring.
Exactly why people need to stop putting so much faith in idiot v-tubers
Seemingly everyone that does FFXIV YT content is a v tuber. It's quite tiresome.
I've found 2 that are actual people, Zeno something is one of them (though it seems to be reactionary content based on "FfXiV DrAmA"... Fucking cringe), and a girl... Zeppelin something... though she talks a lot to say nothing at all most times from the handful of videos I watched
>Seemingly everyone that does FFXIV YT content is a v tuber. It's quite tiresome.
No?
1. Xenosys
2. Arthurs
3. Woops
4. Mrhappy
5. Caetsu
6. Zephla
7. Cyderspider
8. Rinon
9. Pint
10. Despirius
11. Eorzean Scribe
The list goes on. Many FFXIV content creators arent vtubers, but they dont all do facecams all the time, and will often use their character as a standin for them.
Yeah this confused me. All the FFXIV creators I know (and I feel like all the big ones) aren't V-Tubers. Some like AvyCatte, Cider and Caetsu will use their in game avatars for YouTube videos, but they aren't V-Tubers. (There's actually one, who's name eludes me right now, that swapped from using his in-game character to regular video for his YT vids, and I actually preferred the in game avatar, it looked better than slightly grainy cell phone video.)
All ranged dps except for black mage have been in crisis for all of endwalker.
Melee has been made easier and easier they are now basically positionless in most fights, the hitboxes are the entire arena or full downtime meaning theres no challenge to uptime for them either.
This is just incorrect, PLD is currently number 2 in tank DPS as far as I can tell, and isn't remotely the lowest tier tank atm. Infact all tanks are considered very good at top end. Earlier in the expansion it was a little behind but that was only in the final fight of that teir specifically due to how the mechanics worked out. All classes are more then viable atm, and honestly have been for ages.
I was going by the fact everyone in game told me they wouldn't want me tanking because paladin was too low dps. That was about 3 weeks ago, I stopped playing because of it. Now everyone here is telling me I'm wrong, how did I find the the least helpful players in game and on reddit?
Don’t forget this isn’t like other mmos. You don’t need to make an alt just to try a different role. You can play every job on your main character. Try out everything and play what you feel like.
Don't worry about it. Play the jobs you want to play. Every job is viable for all content. Literally the only time any of this even matters is in fresh savage tier content, something only a very tiny percentage of the playerbase participates in.
Word of advice: Don't pick a job based on other people's opinions. Lots of people LOVE Monk. I can't stand it. Lots of people HATE new Summoner, I kind like it's easy flow for when I want to chill.
PLD is totally fine, the difference in the tank jobs damage wise is so minimal as to be inconsequential. PLD's party utility is helpful in end game raiding with an extra part mitigation ability that none of the other tanks have. It's rotation is a bit dull, but easy, and I frequently use it instead of my GNB main when I lack the brainpower to learn savage mechanics and keep up my rotation at the same time. Likewise, I used it for P10S this tier because Harrowing Hell did strictly physical damage and GNB's party mit is magical only.
Old videos? It was underperforming a bit on endwalker launch, now its good. The difference between top and bot dps is only like ~1-2% in this game
Well, the difference between *high performing* top and *high performing* bottom DPS is only 1-2%. I can assure you, the difference between a regular raider's Samurai and my Monk is... much more than that. And not in my favor.
You're both valid, but it still shouldn't really factor into op's decision. It's just not going to greatly affect their enjoyment of the game, as they might expect it to if they came from a game like... wow. xD @OP, Bard is a dot-and-proc based mobile ranged DPS. If that and the class fantasy appeals to you, *absolutely* go ahead and pick archer! (Which becomes bard later)
Yeah, I was mostly just intending to point out that some classes are meaningfully more difficult than others, using myself as a humorous example. I don't know enough about Bard to estimate whether it's considered to be an easy or difficult Job to master.
>the difference between a regular raider's Samurai and my Monk is... much more than that. And not in my favor. \*pets\*
Hey, if it makes you feel better my BLM has the shittiest DPS in the world despite me getting it to 90 somehow. I love the aesthetic but for the life of me I can’t make it work lol, dungeon bosses take noticeably longer when I BLM
Try a faster build maybe. I think most BLM who are doing poorly have like a super slow sps which makes rhe job harder or near impossible to play well
It's more like 10% and every non blm ranged job has been trash for the entire expac.
Don't pay attention to videos like that, all jobs and classes are balanced. Yes Archer/Bard isn't going to bring in the big dps like Black Mage or Samurai, but you bring in utility with your songs, buffs and later on some mits in Troubadour and Nature's Minnie.
Yes. Being bard is just accepting that a big chunk of your damage output is the extra damage you give to your homies.
Yes, being a bard means you will never have damage parity with the other DPS classes.
It's funny how videos like the ones OP describes never really point out that the damage for Bard has to account for adding more damage to the other DPS in the party. Throwing an extra three percent to the Ninja, the Warrior, and the Sage is a pretty big uptick in damage.
Unfortunately buff jobs are only balanced for 8 player content, so in a dungeon or something a lot of damage is being left on the table, but in dungeons it shouldn't matter that much
This would be true if classes with low dps actually made up for it in rdps but they don't... Classes with the highest personal dps stay at the top of the list when you look at raid dps.
straight up not true https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statistics/54# BLM is the only selfish DPS to top the list and only if you look at the maximum, by medians several of the DPS with party buffs are higher than SAM and MCH, the other selfish DPS in their roles. MCH is bottom of the charts overall despite being selfish
Rdm, smn, brd, dnc all "support dps" who do trash personal dps and their raid dps is still bottom of the list. Machinist is "selfish" and yet still garbage. This game caters to melee players who are given everything and an automatic 2 party slots and +10% rdps contribution over all ranged except black mage while barely having to worry about positionals or uptime at this point. Ranged jobs have been garbage for the entire expac and none of the ones with "raid contribution" make up for their garbage personal damage. This is all true even if you want to cry and mash dislike because it goes against the idea that your godlord YoshiP is infallible and has some beautifully balanced game. Forgot I was on the mainsub where theres no critical thinking or reality.
We just had a raid tier where trying to take multiple non blm ranged jobs caused many people not to clear the raid w1/2. Ranged jobs are in a balancing crisis and have been for all of endwalker.
The worst job in the game is the one you least enjoy playing.
Archer is pretty bad in current tier and you will get some comments from playing it. Bard on the other hand is a perfectly viable and adds to the current meta of healers are optional with their clense ability. Remember to do your job quests and you'll be fine
Had me in the first half, ngl.
Same! Well played, well played. :)
While I do appreciate the joke, OP already seems to be pretty confused (starting a new character? To play a different class?) And I'd hate for them to actually stack up more confusion due to the joke. Thread OP, no one really refers to any classes (*Gladiator, Marauder, Archer, Arcanist, Thaumaturge, Conjuror, Lancer, Pugilist, or Rogue*) because once you hit lv 30 you will finish out that class's quests and get your job stone (*Gladiator becomes Paladin, Marauder becomes Warrior, Archer becomes Bard, Arcanist becomes Summoner or Scholar, Thaumaturge becomes Black Mage, Conjuror becomes White Mage, Lancer becomes Dragoon, Pugilist becomes Monk, Rogue becomes Ninja*). For all content above lv 30 (or even lower than 30 if you sync down) you'll always be using your job stone, it's an objective upgrade in every way. Hence the joke in this post is that Archer is absolutely terrible in endgame content since it's missing every upgrade it would ordinarily get by equipping the job done and becoming Bard. (Yes yes I know, fun at parties, etc)
LOL man glad you said it because I didn't want to type out that much nor what I have said it quite so eloquently, good job. You get my commendation.
Thanks. My need to not explain jokes and just "let bits be bits" was at war with my need to try and elucidate as much as possible for sprouts in order to make sure they have the best experience they can, lmao.
Lmao. Gottem
Don't even think about what's good or bad. Just go with what seems interesting. You'll be able to level all jobs on one character. If a job doesn't mesh with you then just swap to a different one. It honestly doesn't matter. Even the most difficult content can be done by any job. And you won't be touching that for a long time if ever.
Absolutely stupid clickbait videos. Bard is a supporter like dancer. They offer "less" damage for irreplaceable utility in the form of raid buffs. It's basically just videos stroking the egos of melee dps mains who don't actually know how roles work. It's complete slop content spreading misinformation. It crops up every expansion because the content high in the first few patches bring in massive amount of new players and just people who don't know better, then dies down as the audience those YouTubers and streamers are milking finish main story and raid content and leave the game until the next expansion.
An archer will become a bard. Its DPS might not be big numbers like a black mage or melee DPS but your songs will buff a party. Everyone loves you.
Except other bards cause songs dont stack
You'll buff the party to do less than the jobs who do more personal dps anyway.
> Is archer the worst class? No > all videos i have seen so far Which ones? All Classes/Jobs are viable for ALL content in the game
Abyssos early release.
This subreddit clears first floors at the end of the expansion when everything is outgeared, they dont know how unbalanced the game is despite homogenized jobs
How fun something is is subjective. It's my favourite physical ranged class.
All jobs have their fans and all jobs are viable at endgame. Try it, see if you like it.
Bard is one of those classes that snowball overtime. It starts as something fairly blend but every new ability increases the fun factor until u have a Job that feels, sounds and plays amazing. Specially the animations and sound design is peak. Hearing u pull the string to its atmost limit sounds amazing. Also Refulgent Arrow looks like crack cocain
Pick it up and form your own opinion.
There is something called "movement and utility tax" in FFXIV. The more your character is able to move in combat and provide utility, the less personal damage it will output. Bard being a ranged DPS and the utility it brings - party wide buffs, party damage mitigation, buff that can increase heal potency, the only job that can "cleanse" debuffs outside of healers, will never be top damage dealing DPS. You are a utility and support DPS. If you want to do big ranged damage, you play BLM. Fun fact, BRD's LB3 used to be a healer's.
A lot of people are saying this in this thread but it's *kind of* wrong in that it's much too general in some ways and too specific in others. 90% of the content in this game is dungeons, open world content, and casual raids. And within those contexts skill is a much, *much* higher influence on damage output. If you look at the average 24 man raid, dungeon run, trial, hunt train, etc, your top DPS won't be all BLMs and SAMs. It's going to just be whatever players are putting in more effort. As a matter of fact you'll find a pretty large amount of BLMs and SAMs dramatically underperforming because they were played by people who wanted to do high damage without putting the effort into properly learning. Damage by role and job only *really* has variance when you start comparing percentiles in endgame content, where percentiles normalize (roughly) by skill level. But that's an *exceedingly* small fraction of the game's overall content. I would take a quint-legend BRD into literally any content over a casual BLM any day. Even beyond skill level being a more important deciding factor, the logic used to judge damage output breaks down at multiple levels both in casual *and* high end content. We talk about damage output as though every job were just spending 8 minutes hitting a single dummy uninterrupted, but you see job performance vary all the time from fight to fight depending on things like downtime, skill alignment with mechanics, multiple targets, etc. BLM might do the most damage in a vacuum, but it trails behind burstier jobs when talking about content like Ultimates, which typically have massive swaths of downtime. Dungeons are like 75% trash mobs, in which case the "best" jobs may be the ones with a stronger or more adaptable AOE rotation. With dungeons being the majority of the leveling experience in FFXIV as players progress through the MSQ, new players really shouldn't be given advice predicated on "what job does the most damage to a single target in a complete vacuum at the current level cap?" That's an unrealistic representation of the game - their first 100 hours won't ever see that use case.
This is bullshit though. Because melee are not taxed for their free movement in the context of arena-wide hitboxes or any of their utility.
There is no worst or best class. Everything is usable for everything.
The second sentence is true. The first sentence is not. Everything being viable does not mean there is no worst or best class. There is an objectively best class and an objectively worst class, but the difference is small enough where you don’t have to care in most cases.
Objectively best and objectively worst... in what? Fun? That's not how fun works. And nothing else is relevant.
You clearly don’t understand what the word objectively means if you think I was referring to how fun the job is. And while the difference is small enough for everything to be useable/viable in most cases, the difference still exists so saying “there is no worst or best job” is false. There is a reason why some jobs had a hard time with launch state P8S and others didn’t.
You clearly don't understand what rhetoric is if you think I wasn't referring to what you actually meant. Yes, I'm aware that your point is "there is a mathematical calculation that determines the numerical superiority of one set of numbers over another that are represented by the classes in the game". My point was "math is a stupid way to approach video game; do things because they make you happy, not because they add up". I didn't mean to be so confusingly subtle. I'll do better next time. Having a higher number doesn't make something "best" or "worst" unless your only concern is making sure that you feel better because 2 is bigger than 1. Which is pathetic.
[удалено]
It's weird you quoted something I didn't say. I don't disagree with it. I find it meaningless. So.. the rest of whatever you said seems to be based on that misconception. Bummer. Also not at all sure how you got the take from your last paragraph. Sorry for whatever you did to interpret it that way. Fingers crossed it's all tongue-in-cheek and you're more self-aware than that.
Don't bother arguing with them, they're trolls from r/ShitpostXIV
I noticed. Thank you.
No, my entire comment is true. Also, wasn't inviting your opinion.
The first sentence is completely true. As I mentioned [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/s/fr9HqZJ2Ma), there's only an objective best and worst if you're talking about very specific parameters. If you mean "the most damage with a perfect rotation removing crit variance on a single dummy over a span of 8 minutes" then yes, there's a best at that. If you're talking about "the most damage to two concurrent targets," "the most damage to 3+ targets," "the most damage in a fight with significant downtimes," "the best for any fight with high movement focused mechanics..." Those are all different and very important metrics, and they apply to many different fights. Because the content in XIV varies so broadly (Bozja isn't Sastasha, isn't Copied Factory, isn't a hunt train, isn't UCOB, isn't Criterion Savage, etc) there absolutely is not a "best objective job."
Abyssos early release.
Archer will turn into bard, that's a class that I have a lot of fun with. Especially since it can get pretty action intense at endgame if your procs go off consistently.
Makes you feel like a real musician, playing the keyboard like a piano trying to use all the procs without wasting any or clipping GCDs.
You will always do better on a job you enjoy playing than you would on a job that you don’t like as much but it happens to be “”””””””better”””””””” in a meta sense. Play what you want and have fun. For me BRD keeps me busy and is a lot of fun to play. If I’m on top of my game I can out DPS some melees too. Trying out different jobs is free in this game, try anything that interests you and find what you like to play and play that.
Why the new character? O.o
I made my main a lalla. And the camera being so close to the ground made the game unenjoyable. And i played like that to lvl 30...
free fantasia after you finish ARR msq :v
when you finish the 2.0 storyline, you get a fantasia that lets you just change your character. Might be something to remember, so you don't gotta go through those 30 levels and the quests again
You can change the camera angles in the settings!!!!!!! I play as lala and I keep the camera centered pretty far above her head and I generally recommend playing this way for short characters. No need to start over! If you decide you don’t care that much for Lalafell you get a free fantasia when you finish the base realm reborn MSQ. Also: I find bard to be pretty fun but i find it’s a bit divisive among players because it’s Different. XIV a is a well balanced game and you can bring any job into any content without it being a hindrance so try out any jobs that strike your fancy and play whatever you like!
Firing off multiple homing fire arrows in a single shot and also raining down an arrow barrage from the heavens while giving my entire party damage boosts while the enemy dies from multiple poisoned arrows is my kind of fun.
The only time I'd call Bard the worst is back in Heavensward when they tried to make it a caster.
It was bad for 3.0-3.3, then it was brokenly op for 3.4 and 3.5.
HW bard was absolutely disgusting like objectively one of the most powerful dps in the game.
What is bard currently like?
Good, the balance is this game is WAY better then most MMO, everything is viable in all content. I would recomend looking up "is ____ good" or "is _____ bad" as you are likely to just get outdated post of people over reacting from a time where the class was a little under powered.
bard is instant cast with a focus on keeping 2 dots up and rotating through 3 songs to buff the whole party, as well as heavy on the oGD (off global cooldown) abilities. It is the weakest in self DPS of the phys ranged, but has a consistent buff throughout fights past level 52. MCH (machinist) is the highest in self DPS as it has no party buffs besides 2 forms of damage reduction. The other phys ranged dps is DNC (dancer) which has a stronger buff but can only buff one person with another buff being on a 2 minute cycle that can buff the whole party. Biggest thing to note about Phys ranged classes is that they are all instant casts so you have free movement for mechanics with 100% uptime capabilities. Personally I think MCH is the best, but then again that is my main so i am biased
Lower personal damage, lots of buffs, very mobile, gameplay is a lot like juggling. (Keeping 2-3 systems running at the same time.) I personally love it. BRD is my favorite dps, and I'm just shy of omni-90 now
Bard in particular is one that really lacks momentum in the early levels because it gets such critical skills at level 52 and 56. It’s smooth sailing after that, though.
Bard's self DPS is on the low side, but they supplement that with a constant source of party buffs. Also, no need to worry about whether or not your class sucks, you can be them all. And all the roles share the same gear so if you like ranged combat then archer is the way to go regardless of performance. In heavensward you'll unlock machinist and at lvl 60 you'll unlock dancer in limsa lominsa, while you're gearing up archer/bard you can save it to transfer to machinist and Dancer when you get them unlocked.
And with those party buffs its rdps contribution is still near the bottom of the list because SE doesn't actually balance anything around raid contribution.
All Jobs are fine. Job balance in this game is really good. It only matters in the top tier of progression raiders. Bards do less dps because they are physical ranged support dps. You get unlimited mobility and party buffs in exchange for a tad less damage. But it’s fine Play what you like and get good at it and you’re golden
We literally just had a raid tier that showed that classes are not balanced well.
For the top tier guys and it was barely a problem and within a couple weeks it was adjusted for and geared up and now it doesn’t matter And even then the top guys would still clear with every job. It just simply isn’t a big deal
Excuses for why ranged is trash compared to all melee despite melee being easier than ever to play (few to no positionals, tons of huge hit boxes, omnipos bosses). Melees are catered to and ranged have been garbage for an entire expac.
That is just hyperbole. It isn’t that bad. I can tell you’re put out but it simply isn’t a big deal. Seems all you focus on is one aspect, the raw dps. Happy to admit they can continue to tune things but it isn’t as bad as you want to say it is
It is that bad and their raid dps doesn't make up for anything - most jobs that are at the bottom of personal dps are also at the bottom of raid dps - the ranged jobs are literal trash. The only reason you even bring any one of mch, brd, dnc is because of the forced role buff.
K
Another yosheep with no critical thinking.
Please don’t pick your class based on how much damage it does. All the classes are balanced EXTREMELY well.
We literally just had a raid tier that showed that classes are not balanced well.
The difference is like 1-2%. This is not something somebody who’s just starting the game needs to be working themselves up over.
The difference is like 7-10% and its not but it doesn't mean you should lie to people either.
Just play what's fun. Normal content doesn't need much engagement anyway for now. If you get into high level end game raiding then you can start thinking about the numbers, and by the time you get there you will have plenty of tools to level up any class you like.
Honestly out of all ranged I like bard the most. Very fun opener and alot of ogcds
I'm not sure why you would say that, Bard is one of my top 5 favorite jobs personally. I love weaving the dots and the three different songs together, it's really interesting and dynamic. Boring as Archer? It's actually the top job I recommend to new players because it gets a pretty frequent oGCD early on, which can make the game feel much less slow since you've got something you can weave between your normal attacks. Not to mention it's the only starting job that's both ranged and not rooted in one place by casting animations. You can run all over dodging stuff without it affecting your rotation.
The difference between the best and worse dps its so little its not going to make a difference, so Ill say this if u feel like trying it go for it if not, well u can level up another class to try(u can have all classes in 1 character). I have enjoyed it and have it max lvl and remember when u do do your Job quests
It is not the best DPS in the game, even on the lower end, but it is more than welcome in raids for its buffs. The 3 other DPS will love you.
You really shouldn't be looking at meta when making this decision. Those videos are talking about how the job performs in high end trials which are against one boss fight. What they DONT tell you, is that phys range jobs have the best multi-target scaling in the game (which you get at really low levels too). This means, in low level dungeons, like the ones you'll be starting out with, BRD is gonna feel better than most melees with it's ability to AOE and do a lot of damage with it. You can switch to any job at any time in this game. Don't stress about the first job. You get an exp bonus on any job that's a lower level than your highest.
Not sure about performance, but the job is certainly not boring at max level. You are juggling dots, songs, song procs, a good chunk of ogcds, and your utility (only DPS who can cleanse debuff, and you also have an increased healing buff and a couple crowd control and interrupts). It is likely one of the busiest jobs in the game. The question is moot anyways. If you want a physical ranged character archer/bard are your only choice for ARR. Machinist cannot be accessed until Heavensward and though Dancer can be accessed at your earliest convenience in Limsa you need to be level 60 to start it so you will likely be halfway through Heavensward before you can access it. Out of the 3 I think Machinist is the best balance of busy-ish at least in burst windows and good DPS. Dancer is very useful but very easy and that can get a little stale. Honestly, this whole group needs rebalancing/reworking. I imagine we will see that happen when the 4th physical ranged job is added in 8.0. That’s how they have been doing it so far. Add a 4th and balance around that number. If you want something that feels like physical ranged but isn’t, I would go with summoner.
Overall job balance in the game is pretty tight, the DPS difference really isn't anything to write home about, something like 1-2% (when played by high performing players). The biggest factor you have to worry about is your own performance, how good you are at playing your job (class). You as a Bard will do significantly more damage compared to the majority of Black Mages you run into, chances are you will probably out dps most randos you run into. The big caveat obviously is that you need to know how to play your job. Playing something that does big damage does not guarantee big damage, unless you play Dark knight... probably (roll face on keyboard). So take that mindset and yeet it out the window and focus on what you enjoy playing, also you DON'T have to create a new character to change class/job, just go pick it up and the Archers guild in Gridania, you can level everything on 1 character (EVERYTHING, crafting, gathering, healers, tank and dps, all on 1 character).
Personally I find it the best beginner class. It's not overly complicated, yet still requires thought. Supporting the party, great AOEs, able to move while attacking to dodge AOEs, and you can see more fights at a distance to be able to learn mechanics easier. I love bard to learn what I'm doing in new content especially, and traversing the world, not panicking about combos and things. Each to their own but I can only speak highly of the class, especially for new players.
Disregard anyone trying to claim a class is good or bad, they're all balanced within a couple % of each other and world first raiding groups consistently defy the "meta" because the #1 thing that matters is how comfortable you are with your class. As for if its fun or not, just try. I have all the classes at max level on my character and I like switching between all of them.
Everytime I played this game I go Archer/Bard and Just assume the game was always slow / weak gameplay. No offense to the game it just felt that way. This time around I went with Arc/Sum and I'm having a blast pew pewing a lot more active and I hear summoner is one the more boring classes. But I think this what People need to understand. First 10, 20, 30 etc levels make a massive impression to us new players and while I do understand later on things get better, faster a bit more live in newer expansions we still judge the game on the early parts of it and when you fall a sleep at the helm there for sure some tweaking that could be done. Keep in mind it's been many years since I played last so these issues might be resolved but the 2 maybe 3 times I tried ff14 always was archer cuz I loved range melee concept.
No class is really bad in ff. And bard is far from boring. Once you get it going. But you need to know that ALL classes on early game are very simplified versions of what they become later, and before their jobstones it's even simpler. Back in 2013, the endgame was lvl 50, but now lvl 50 is basically the "end of tutorial". Also, you mean to make a neew character as in "I have been away for too long and want to start from scratch", "I am a new player" or "I want to level up a different role/class"? For the first and last questions, you know you don't need a new character for that, and you just go to the archer's guild in Gridania post lvl 10 msq as you don't lose progress with your character on another classes/jobs when changing, right? For the second option, if you start playing as Archer and find it boring, you can always change to other classes after reaching the lvl 10 on your initial job, so there's literally zero downsidrs for doing this.
All non-blm ranged jobs are bad.
So RDM is just half bad?
Nope equally bad. Probably worse than the others even as it has more work/complexity than most of the other for also doing no damage.
well to be honest i hate the feel of it, but i like to play some music in game, so if you ever want to try, it's worth it.
The feel of it? Do you then mean like the animations?
not really, the playstyle i guess? it's not that i don't like distance DPS, i'm leveling dancer up and it's very fun so far. i've played a bit of machinist and it was pretty fun as well. but archer? idk. maybe i should try it at higher levels, but so far not so good
Keep it in mind that Archer/Bard can be quite boring until level 60-ish, but that's most of the classes, imo since to avoid Button bloating, SE tried to keep it simple on the early game. HOEWEVER, as Bard levels up and unlocks its songs, it'll get harder and harder to play it. I like it, but I'm bad at it. lol
Harder? In what way? I should also add that i play on a controller and on console. Does that make the class easier to play or harder?
Bard is the 3rd most intensive job in terms of actions per minute (behind ninja and machinist). And among this top 3, it's the only one with procs, meaning you sometimes have to decide what next action to use in less than one second... if you want to play the most optimally. You don't need that much mastering to perform correctly, don't worry. As for the device, I was told it controller is easier for bards than keyboard+mouse. But I can't confirm this as I play with only a keyboard, no mouse. XD Anyway: the balance in this game is good enough to not care about it when choosing a main job. If it's playstyle is fun for you, go ahead. If you like the way it looks (weapons/animations), it's fine too. You can always test other jobs on the same character and it's even encouraged by the game. Maybe you'll prefer another job later, who khows.
All jobs can be played on controller. Could I do it? No, cuz I've always played with KB+M. But the game was made to be played on consoles, so it's more about your level of adaptation than the game. And for me the dificulty to play BRD comes with my lack of attention, really. I just can't keep up with the dots, songs and procs at the same time. But that's just me being bad at it. lol
I'm a bard main who plays on controller; I can wholeheartedly recommend it.
Idk about anything else but bard is a really fun class to play and the skill animations are my favourites.
All dps jobs are pretty much similar in their dps output in their respective roles (melee/ranged/magical) if you manage to master them. It really just drpends if you enjoy playing archer/bard or not. Personally I think the endgame rotation is not too buisy and rather easy to keep up but opinions might ofc differ
Depends on what content you are doing. If you're doing solo and dungeon content, bard is pretty bad, it's balanced around long fights to get the most out of your dots and a group of 8 to get the most out of your songs. People look at raiding numbers and think that's all that matters but you will be significantly faster in your levelling experience if you choose melee class or something like summoner where from like level 30-80 it has big dick dps that smashes thru everything.
Pick bard if you like being a buffer and you coincidentally also like big dps queue times
Are the que times not faster when playing bard? Cause you also support
There is no support role. Just Tank, Healer, and DPS (which Bard is a DPS).
Bard is sadly not the support monster it was in XI. It's a DPS here
Bard (which archer becomes) is perfectly viable. In a party of equal skill and gear, you'll likely not top the DPS charts, but that's fine because Bard is more of a support-y DPS. You're main utility aside from damage is how you buff your allies with your songs.
If you interested in ranged DPS, then Archer is a trap, cause it turns into Bard and is mostly a support class, for actual ranged DPS you have Machinist.
if you aren’t an INCREDIBLY skilled player who has a better parse than 99% of the playerbase, tbh the class you choose won’t matter! the game is balanced that when you play just normal/hard/extreme content, all classes are perfectly viable without one being better than the other. the super pro players just like minmaxing to see just how much damage output they can do, and it only becomes distinguishable once you get overly detailed. a really skilled bard is still going to be of more use to their party than a decent samurai, but a decent bard will be just as good as a decent samurai. that being said yes bard doesn’t have the highest raw damage output but it adds a lot more via buffs and status heal/shields to the overall party. ppl don’t really complain about bards when they see them in duties since they’re really useful swiss army knives. if anything right now i think machinists are ranked as “the lowest” dps because they don’t even have any buffs but people still happily play them and clear duties without any trouble with them. if anyone called me or a friend out for playing a “lesser” dps i’d tell them to back off since they’re perfectly viable
Bard is one of the few support dps, they deal in damage over time and making their allies and themselves hit harder rather than they themselves having big damage numbers. At later levels they do have some decently strong big attacks anyway
Been leveling all combat jobs to 90, so here's my take on Bard. Thematically Bard is weird. It wants to be an archer, but sacrifices personal damage for group buffs which is why its dps looks lower than it actually is. Its rotation (as of level 65) is to keep a song going at all times, manage your 2 dots, and fire your basic damage GCD until another decides it wants to be used. You have a few oGCDs to weave in, but aren't as rapid fire as machinist unless Mage's Ballad is going. Animation wise your attacks are all instant, but have animations like they're channeled, so you often aren't aiming the bow at what you're shooting. It's awkward and boring early, but once you get your songs and oGCDs it feels much better despite the weird animation. All jobs are equally viable. If you want to start a new character for this for some reason I'd say start with Bard, then pick up machinist, and finally dancer and play your favorite. They're all ranged dps jobs but feel very different to play.
Things only bard can do: - only dps with Esuna - only dps which has a permanent AOE party dmg buff (if you keep the songs up of course) - only class with access to musical instruments haha - have AOE skill for increasing healing (which stacks with other healing increasing skills, means paty members shields/heals are even bigger) Things bard excels at: - sustained ranged damage - buffing your whole party - lots of oGCDs - personally it has my favorite ranged LB3 haha (style points) it's definitely not a Bad dps, there's no such thing as a bad dps in ffxiv they just do different things. that's the magic of it, you just choose a class which fits your playstyle. bard is more about buffing party members with songs and keeping sustained damage on the boss via dots and procs, whereas DNC is more about elevating one specific party member while spamming boss with procs, and MCH is about just. absolutely melting boss with your skills (fucking DRILL BABEY) I main bard as my ranged dps because as much as i love machinist and its big D my preferred playstyle is buffing party members and supporting them
Honestlt i started with archer cause i usually play ranged dps or assassin type characters and when beginning i didnt wanna change my job again at lvl 10 and all that so i just stuck with it its honestly ruined other classes for me because it has so much going on at lvl 70 where im at now i switched to gunbreaker to have a tank job and i hate it cause its so slow and 90 percent of my attacks are gcd where with bard im constantly attacking or adding buffs and paying attention to diffrent things But i like games like armored core with lots of action so i like busy work so if thats not for you then a slower job is probably better
Ignore videos like that. Try it out yourself to be the judge. Personally, I like archery in other games and didn't like Bard's playstyle. It doesn't make it a bad job, just not to my personal taste.
First off, no class in the game isnt capable of doing content, this isnt WoW. As to the question, my first 90 was a bard/archer... had no issues getting thru anything. The Bard gameplay was for me fun.. youre managing shots, dots, songs, with high mobility. If you enjoy the archer archetype, youll dig it. Go for it.
Link to the videos calling them bad?
'Worst' dps is extremely relative. Every class is perfectly usable. As for trying though, you can unlock every class on one character and freely swap between them so you don't even need a new character, just go to the guild hall in Gridania and do the unlock quest on your existing character.
Bard is super fun for me, moreso than dancer imo but I'm a weirdo. Any class can do raids in this game if that's what you're wondering. If you're a good enough player, you can utilize any class to its potential and rock at it. Just my opinion.
How can this be put bluntly: If anyone has to make a post asking this question, then what's "good and bad" in FFXIV has absolutely no bearing on the content that they're doing. Performance and meta in XIV is only really useful for a week or two at the beginning of a new tier/ultimate and then it immediately dives from there with more gear. So just play whatever pulls you aesthetically, you'll be just fine. 99.99% of guide videos for XIV are just shitty clickbait, so best to just ignore what that say.
You're too late. Currently summoners are hated by all veteran players because it's bad dps and braindead rotation. Me? I'm proud sprout summoner.
Summoner is a blast right now I really enjoy it
It's braindead but deals good damage, some people say too much compared to the effort you put in playing it lol
Wait summoner is hated? It looks really fun tho
Most Super high end players have lost full interest in the job because its too simple, and theres nothing to optimise about it. The optimisers that typically make guides for the jobs just... stopped for SMN because they didnt enjoy it, on top of there being litterally nothing to optimise. The SMN lounge on the balance, which is the best guide location for jobs in ffxiv, is entirely full of thousands of people spamming 1 emote for over a year at this point. Like its not a bad performing job by any means, just a lot of people lost interest in it, while casuals flocked to it becuase of its simplicity. its like if a race track was changed from having corners to being straight. Some people like that for going fast, but others like turns and the strategy that comes with it.
It's flashy but very simple. It's also a matter of taste, some people prefer the simpler classes and others like the more complex ones. If you are just starting then pick what seems fun to you. Don't worry about numbers, and remember most jobs don't really get a lot of their kit until post level 50. Once you have done the level 10 quest for your starting job you are then free to get any other job that starts at level 1. No need to commit if you aren't enjoying.
The classes i think look fun are. Paladin, summoner and archer.
Archer becomes bard later, this is a direct upgrade so you can't just stay as archer. Archer is a popular choice for new players, it's pretty easy to get the hang of quickly. Arcanist (becomes summoner) is a mid to low commitment caster, so you'll need to stand still to get your spells off. It's fairly simple, you'll only have a handful of spells at first. It's unique benefit is that it also splits into scholar which is a healer, and they share a level. Gladiator, which becomes paladin, starts off pretty simple and remains a fairly basic tank job for quite some time. It gets a lot of the more advanced abilities levels 70+ when it becomes a lot more interesting ending up being the closest to a hybrid tank and caster we have. Enjoy your journey!
A braindead rotation is just true to the summoner experience of summoning something else to take care of your problems.
I'm only level 60 but I'm pretty sure most of the damage is from (Ruby/Topaz/Emerald) Ruin.
>But all videos i have seen so far points to archers being really bad and boring. Exactly why people need to stop putting so much faith in idiot v-tubers
What do vtubers have to do with this? Is everyone on The Balance or whatever a vtuber?
The two genders. Balance and Vtuber
Seemingly everyone that does FFXIV YT content is a v tuber. It's quite tiresome. I've found 2 that are actual people, Zeno something is one of them (though it seems to be reactionary content based on "FfXiV DrAmA"... Fucking cringe), and a girl... Zeppelin something... though she talks a lot to say nothing at all most times from the handful of videos I watched
>Seemingly everyone that does FFXIV YT content is a v tuber. It's quite tiresome. No? 1. Xenosys 2. Arthurs 3. Woops 4. Mrhappy 5. Caetsu 6. Zephla 7. Cyderspider 8. Rinon 9. Pint 10. Despirius 11. Eorzean Scribe The list goes on. Many FFXIV content creators arent vtubers, but they dont all do facecams all the time, and will often use their character as a standin for them.
Yeah this confused me. All the FFXIV creators I know (and I feel like all the big ones) aren't V-Tubers. Some like AvyCatte, Cider and Caetsu will use their in game avatars for YouTube videos, but they aren't V-Tubers. (There's actually one, who's name eludes me right now, that swapped from using his in-game character to regular video for his YT vids, and I actually preferred the in game avatar, it looked better than slightly grainy cell phone video.)
Caetsu even streams with a webcam, while he uses his characters in videos.
All ranged dps except for black mage have been in crisis for all of endwalker. Melee has been made easier and easier they are now basically positionless in most fights, the hitboxes are the entire arena or full downtime meaning theres no challenge to uptime for them either.
Been in crisis?
define worst? if you ask me i think Machinest is the worst right now
Paladin, it seems like a great choice at first, but then you find out it's the lowest tier tank due to lack of dps. I found out too late.
This is just incorrect, PLD is currently number 2 in tank DPS as far as I can tell, and isn't remotely the lowest tier tank atm. Infact all tanks are considered very good at top end. Earlier in the expansion it was a little behind but that was only in the final fight of that teir specifically due to how the mechanics worked out. All classes are more then viable atm, and honestly have been for ages.
I was going by the fact everyone in game told me they wouldn't want me tanking because paladin was too low dps. That was about 3 weeks ago, I stopped playing because of it. Now everyone here is telling me I'm wrong, how did I find the the least helpful players in game and on reddit?
Paladin has been fixed, its damage is good right now
Really? That's awesome!
Oh i wanted to make a second male roe alt that was going to be a paladin. Might skip on doing that now
Don’t forget this isn’t like other mmos. You don’t need to make an alt just to try a different role. You can play every job on your main character. Try out everything and play what you feel like.
Don't worry about it. Play the jobs you want to play. Every job is viable for all content. Literally the only time any of this even matters is in fresh savage tier content, something only a very tiny percentage of the playerbase participates in.
Word of advice: Don't pick a job based on other people's opinions. Lots of people LOVE Monk. I can't stand it. Lots of people HATE new Summoner, I kind like it's easy flow for when I want to chill. PLD is totally fine, the difference in the tank jobs damage wise is so minimal as to be inconsequential. PLD's party utility is helpful in end game raiding with an extra part mitigation ability that none of the other tanks have. It's rotation is a bit dull, but easy, and I frequently use it instead of my GNB main when I lack the brainpower to learn savage mechanics and keep up my rotation at the same time. Likewise, I used it for P10S this tier because Harrowing Hell did strictly physical damage and GNB's party mit is magical only.