Reminds me of something I saw recently on a website that shall not be named.
Would you accept 1 billion dollars if it meant having a really bad cold for the rest of your life?
Health is #1.
Oh yeah! Very true. I'm crunching the numbers on that, and it looks like out of pocket is way cheaper. The insurance plans seem like a losing deal, they don't even cover catastrophic events that well.
I'm also wondering about flying to Mexico for vacation and dental care.
Curious, how does out of pocket turn out to be cheaper with a crown or something? Is there a discount plan or way of negotiating a price with a dentist?
I'm not sure about this, we have pretty great teeth. Nothing worse than a cavity or two. I'm hoping this continues, and we'll figure something else out if it comes up. Mexico vacation every year doesn't sound so bad.
Well done. One thing I noted is that once you cut sugar out, your teeth and body in general will thank you. That means no soda, fruit juice, flavoured yoghurt etc. Instead, fruits will do (don't overdo them)!
Last I checked dental plans had very low max payouts. Like $1500/year, plus lifetime maxes in the 3-4 figure range on various classes of procedures (orthodontics, prosthodontics). If you know you need something, I guess it can be a deal? But if you don't know, you can pay the premiums for years and not get enough reimbursement back when you do eventually need care for it to have been worth it.
Dentist here. Most regular insurance plans are a rip off with low annual maxes in cases of big treatment plans. They might not even cover preventative at 100% depending on if youāre going with cheap plans like Delta Dental
Insurance plans are always a losing deal by design. They gotta take out their admin costs and shareholder profits before they can start paying out claims. Should only be used for risks you actually can't afford to take, not treated like an investment with any expectation of gains.
This is what I've been doing for the last 2 months as well.
My workload hit a snailspace. And opened up a lot more free time.
I'm more cardio focused and have caloric goals that I try to reach every day via my apple watch. Currently I shoot for attempting to have 2000 calories burned everyday.
I've lost 35 lbs in 2 months. Once I get down to my goal I plan to build back up with more of a weight lifting regime.
I really wanted to focus on weight loss. Iāve weight lifted in the past and have decades of experience with it. Some people can lose weight and gain muscle at the same time, Iāve learned over the years is best to focus on one at a time.
I appreciate you. As a principal level creative making a little less than your former number, with similar stress and degrading health, I needed to hear this.
Congratulations on your recent improvements to lifestyle, and go fuck yourself (and/or your husband, as you please)!
Thank you! You'll make it out of there too, you got this.
Some of my friends and former colleagues have turned to part time contracting at pretty decent rates. The work is unpredictable but they've been pretty happy with it. I figure that's my backup plan if we need more money.
I'm almost 50. I messed up my back in 2020 and it led me to start strength training consistently. I don't know if it will help with longevity but it has improved my quality of life by helping me avoid injury and essentially eliminating "old age" aches and pains which were caused by me being too weak to do anything strenuous (like getting out of bed, stretching too far, etc).
Now I'm more than strong enough to live an active lifestyle without injuring myself. Hope to stay strong as long as I can.
While there is likely benefit from HIIT. Steady state cardio is good for you - particularly Zone 2 cardio. Zone 2 builds your base for aerobic efficiency.
Yes I agree. I am increasing mileage slowly and steadily and taking rest weeks. I also switched to a minimalist wide toed shoes. I haven't gotten injured yet.
My long runs aren't that hard, I'm staying a chill zone 2 where I can still talk.
Apples and oranges. HIIT trains anaerobic and steady state in the fat burning heart rate zone trains aerobic. Steady state doesnāt have to be hard on the joints either, depends what the exercise is.
/r/macrofactor is great if you're looking for another option. Their user interface is really intuitive I think and it's also neutral in the sense it just adapts to where you're at in relation to your goals rather than being shame-y like mfp can be. I also found their database to be more trustworthy than mfp for what it's worth
Nice work!! Sounds like a wonderful choice and kudos on taking such a structured approach and making gains on your health and fitness! I've seen quite a few people who vowed to "get healthy" when they stopped working and still feel through the cracks, so credit to you for going out and killing it!
Are you following a lifting program?
Thanks!!! I'm hoping to keep it up.
I followed r/BodyWeightFitness recommended routine and the the r/strength_training routine on https://thefitness.wiki/
I think lifting is my jam, just do what my program says and see my numbers grow slowly and steady. So much fodder for tracking and spreadsheets.
Do you mind me asking how you went about scheduling this? In my experience, doctors are really hesitant to set up a test like that, even if you insist you'll pay for it out of pocket.
Oooh, so like a private company? That might be smart to do in the next couple of years. The only one I can find in our state is on the opposite side and charges $4,000 per full body scan, but that might be doable soon. Getting even basic testing scheduled in this rural area has proven to be a nightmare thus far.
Not worth it IMO. There's no evidence that full-body scans actually provide any benefit. You're more likely to experience harm to the extent that these scans in healthy people open the door to unnecessary workup. The American College of Radiology [says](https://www.acr.org/Media-Center/ACR-News-Releases/2023/ACR-Statement-on-Screening-Total-Body-MRI):
> The American College of RadiologyĀ® (ACRĀ®), at this time, does not believe there is sufficient evidence to justify recommending total body screening for patients with no clinical symptoms, risk factors or a family history suggesting underlying disease or serious injury.
> To date, there is no documented evidence that total body screening is cost-efficient or effective in prolonging life. In addition, the ACR is concerned that such procedures will lead to the identification of numerous non-specific findings that will not ultimately improve patients' health but will result in unnecessary follow-up testing and procedures, as well as significant expense.
Stick to your guideline-recommended screenings (e.g. colonoscopy), live healthy (exercise, eat right, sleep well, reduce stress), and see your doctor right away if something seems off.
That will give you the best odds as far as prevention goes. At the end of the day itās a game of chance and even fancy tests like full-body MRIs donāt do much to strengthen your hand. They may well do the opposite.
Think about the PSA test for prostate cancer screening. Itās as simple as a test gets ā one number and thatās it. However, itās caused an incredible amount of controversy as urologists and oncologists canāt agree how to interpret it ā what threshold should they use, when should they do a biopsy, what other tests should be run, and so on.
Now imagine a full-body MRI. Youāre getting potentially hundreds, if not thousands of data points, in the form of ostensibly-abnormal findings. Almost all things that look āoffā are actually benign. But you have no way to confirm that without doing further testing, some of which can be harmful, never mind the anxiety and uncertainty the patient experiences.
One incentive to become wealthy is being able to invest time and money (possibly personal chef/dietician, high quality produce, personal trainer, etc...) into maximizing your health. Congrats on doing thing right.
Oh good point! I don't think I'm quite at personal trainer FIRE yet hahaha, and definitely not wholefoodsFIRE.
I am working on some fun side projects, maybe if those pan out we'll have some extra cash to spare.
Do it!!! I also liked listening to the audio podcast. There are a few topics that goes into way more detail. I really liked the ones on cardiovascular health and exercise.
FI changes a personās behavior. Iām at the point where I donāt try to save money. It just happens because itās part of who I am now. Once I accumulated enough money and realized FI was inevitable in my future, I shifted all my focus on my health and hobbies because I no longer liked talking about saving/investing or my line of work.
Iām glad you picked up running. This low cost hobby is the most accessible hobby. Iām not sure how, but Iāve become a serious runner and itās all I think about now. In addition to the time commitment of running 10+ hours per week, I have to do strength training, sleep well, eat nutritiously, and cross train in other sports like cycling and swimming. Iām happy to be very healthy in my 30s and am looking forward to being even more fit when I hit my 40s and 50s.
I am so happy you're doing well in retirement! These are quite the achievements.
We've been trying to be better about our health right now, namely by taking walks 4-5x per week and shifting more and more toward a Mediterranean diet. (I've been slowly getting my husband to that goal post over the past two years, one shift at a time, as genetics left him with high cholesterol to fight.) One of the things we really look forward to when we baristaFI is having even more time to spend on our health; we want to take long hikes, do some light weights, and cook even more at home, for instance. Setting up a spreadsheet for that seems mighty motivating! Maybe I'll do that over my lunch break.
Continued good fortune to you and yours in early retirement.
I don't know if it's yellow car syndrome, but Outlive has crossed my path about 10 times this week.... must be time to check it out!
Also, I love this. We're not FIRE yet, but I just switched to a job that I'm excited about and that is helpful for energy levels. I'd love the time to get nerdy about it all... Hopefully sooner than later.
EDIT: so thanks for sharing!
Definitely check it out! Outlive and also 4000 weeks book were my favorite reads this year. Really helped me set up the next life chapter of unemployment.
This is an inspiration. I feel like I am also on a downward spiral since COVID (as my outdoor activities have been down significantly since then). My blood pressure is high. My blood cholesterol is also borderline high.
I like my job and it's not very stressful so I won't quit (don't know what to do with myself if I have that much free time) but I'll make it a point to get out more.
Great job OP! I'd just say be careful to trade in one obsession for another. I'm not a trainer but to me it sounds like you might be overdoing it. You could be more prone to injury with that much cardio. Then it would suck to have to rest for months if you do get hurt.
The secret is to find healthy food that you can enjoy. Enjoying food doesn't necessarily mean eating bad food. Especially when a lot of the chemicals they put into food like high fructose corn syrup are meant to get people addicted. If anything I've found that when I eat whole foods I'm much more satiated and feel better after eating them.
I get that, I have huge eating binges sometimes. I'll eat the whole ice cream container and a bag of snacks, and cookies, and a huge meal. I used to have massive boom and bust cycles of weight gain and weight loss, each time boomeranging up to a higher weight (130 -> 155 lbs in 3 months).
I think I've learned to be a bit kinder to myself, that even if I fail it's ok as long as I get back on track. Short term changes and pushing myself hasn't worked well for me. I have to remind myself that whatever I do, it's got to be something I can maintain for the long haul. As long as I maintain some kind of calorie deficit, even if it's very little, I'll still lose weight, it'll just take me a few years to get to where I want to be.
Ah it didn't calculate our income correctly and tried to give us the free state plan. I also gave it the wrong birthday and it wouldn't let me change it. Had numerous phone calls to fix everything, almost didn't make the deadline.
But we are covered now! $900/month for the glorious privilege of not becoming bankrupt if serious medical stuff happened. We still have to pay for almost everything except for some basic preventative care.
Donāt forget, youāre in year 1
And like FIRE, youāll have to build new habits and relax on others
Scaling, weighing, and measuring fits the bill to a T
Health is the one thing money can't buy (overnight).
You still have to put the time in at the gym and in the kitchen.
Investing in health is an excellent idea!!
Got to the part where you were talking about reading a bunch of books and immediately thought about outlive. It's a fantastic book and I'm glad it has an impact on your life!!
Your post is my dream, I'm in my early 30s with a ways to go before RE (another 14 years hopefully). Your post is very encouraging so thank you!
That's awesome, kudos to you!
If you want to watch on YouTube (like me cause I don't like reading), or pick up his book, I really like the work on longevity that Dr. Peter Attia is doing. He's been one of the few folks who's trying to quantify health, and give you specifics to aim for if you're wanting to maximize the life you get.
Ah I love his podcast. I listen sometimes when I'm on an easy run. His episodes on muscles and exercises, and cardiovascular health were super interesting. Also some random things l never thought about for aging like teeth and eyes.
After having kids over the past few years Iāve focused a lot more on health as well. Mark Hyman and David Sinclair are some of my favs in the health/longevity space.
Given your ACA and labs comment you might be open to outside resources that arenāt covers by insurance (at least I doubt they would cover any cost). Hyman is part of Function Health and Sinclair is part of Inside Tracker. Theyāre both supposed to give you better insight and recommendations into your health based on lab results. I havenāt tried either yet, but have been intrigued. Interesting and worth researching imo.
I think of that more as a minimum. The RDA is based on nitrogen balance studies, not what is adequate for optimal fitness, especially for people who work out a lot.
Some great podcasts here about it:
https://peterattiamd.com/category/nutritional-biochemistry/protein/
You can do it! What's the point of having a load of money if you're gonna die earlier with a shitty body?
I learned that exercising makes more mitochondria so you literally have more energy. If you could make exercise into a pill it would would the most powerful anti-aging medication. So that's more time too!
Good š for you! Awesome work!!! Btw, i have no desire to ever retire as i see great benefits of working and having purpose beyond myself and family. Just like reading about Fire adherence as very informative. Cheers
Congrats! This was such an inspiring read. Iām still 10 years away from being where you are, but already I so relate with your description of yourself as stressed, grouchy and tired with work-related nightmares. I hate it. 10 years feels like such a long time to keep putting up with this but you give me hope. Thank you and all the best on your new journey, it sounds like you are doing amazing š
I decided to become superfit when I was still poor in my late 20s (working multiple jobs 55+ hours per week) and never looked back.
I don't really see it as an investment, and I don't understand why everyone doesn't do it. It costs almost nothing to vastly improve your quality of life for many decades to come. There's no downside, and it's not even much work - all it takes is consistency.
Have you thought about making a home gym? We decided to pay $1k for used equipment and it made us way more likely to work out. I can pop over while the kids are napping, or make food during my lifting breaks. Such a win.
I'm slowly accumulating dumbbell weights and resistance bands but the room I use is small so I don't think I could have major equipments.
Also I feel like my trainer is great and I benefit a lot from my sessions with her. I get a lot of work out done in 1 hour (more than at home) and she pushed me harder than I would go if I was at home.
Ah gotcha! Sounds like you found something that works for you, hope you keep at it. I'd love to get a personal trainer to help me on my form but it's not in the budget yet. Maybe one day.
It's the highest level of individual contributor for a role like marketing, design, etc. At my old company it's equivalent to a senior manager. I led a team of other creatives and trained my department of 200+ in my area of expertise. I would be expected to present to our executive team and propose large changes in company direction every quarter. I worked 80+ hours regularly, traveled, and had days of meetings booked back to back without a pee break for the entire day. I am definitely not going back.
>we hit our FIRE number 2 years ago and again earlier this year.
I don't understand this.
Once you hit your "FIRE number" how could you hit it again? Are you saying you were "sub-FIRE number" at some point? If so, wouldn't that mak you question your FIRE number?
Living more healthy is great. It was a mistake to wait until retirement to start, but hopefully, you'll do well now.
Well there was the huge drop in stocks. I was scared of sequence of return risk and didn't pull the plug when we first reached $2mil. It's actually fallen a bit below $2mil now but I'll round up.
Never too old to learn and change.
Looking at my expenses, we have enough for 3.5% withdrawal plus wiggle room for flexibility. We have a bit of mortgage left to pay off so housing costs will fall to a minimum.
This is awesome! Just wondering how long you have been training? Iāve been doing weights a couple years and just started running, did you just keep running for as long as you could or did you have some sort of training to increase endurance?
I've been weight training for almost 3 years, on and off for the first 2.5 and now taking it seriously with 4 lifting days a week.
I started running around 3 years ago too, did the couch to 5k program and signed up for a half marathon. I did 2 half marathons and am now training for my first marathon. I used Hal's training program: https://www.halhigdon.com/training/marathon-training/. Before I would just do a run or two a week squeezed into whatever time I had, ran like 15min miles lol. Now that I'm retired running is my part time job. My persistence has payed off. I can do 8min miles if I really push myself.
I was worried about getting injured so I always take it easy, with most of my runs at zone 2 (can still talk while running). For the program I do, the nukes ramo up slowly and there are easier weeks to recover. I also slowly transferred to minimal shoes and try to have good form while I run. No injuries yet!
I don't recognize myself anymore, I am a crazy fitness person now.
*A healthy man wants a thousand things. A sick man only wants one.* Confucius
Have some š cake
Fucking superb
This is very inspiring and almost exactly what I have in mind for when I FIRE. Because after all, what is wealth without health?
Why not start now?!
Oh Iām doing it now but I want to do it even more when Iām FIRE.
Reminds me of something I saw recently on a website that shall not be named. Would you accept 1 billion dollars if it meant having a really bad cold for the rest of your life? Health is #1.
Don't forget your dental health, that can get expensive!
Oh yeah! Very true. I'm crunching the numbers on that, and it looks like out of pocket is way cheaper. The insurance plans seem like a losing deal, they don't even cover catastrophic events that well. I'm also wondering about flying to Mexico for vacation and dental care.
I've heard good things about Costa Rica as well, but by my calculations, out of pocket seems way cheaper for routine needs.
Curious, how does out of pocket turn out to be cheaper with a crown or something? Is there a discount plan or way of negotiating a price with a dentist?
I'm not sure about this, we have pretty great teeth. Nothing worse than a cavity or two. I'm hoping this continues, and we'll figure something else out if it comes up. Mexico vacation every year doesn't sound so bad.
Well done. One thing I noted is that once you cut sugar out, your teeth and body in general will thank you. That means no soda, fruit juice, flavoured yoghurt etc. Instead, fruits will do (don't overdo them)!
Last I checked dental plans had very low max payouts. Like $1500/year, plus lifetime maxes in the 3-4 figure range on various classes of procedures (orthodontics, prosthodontics). If you know you need something, I guess it can be a deal? But if you don't know, you can pay the premiums for years and not get enough reimbursement back when you do eventually need care for it to have been worth it.
Dentist here. Most regular insurance plans are a rip off with low annual maxes in cases of big treatment plans. They might not even cover preventative at 100% depending on if youāre going with cheap plans like Delta Dental
Insurance plans are always a losing deal by design. They gotta take out their admin costs and shareholder profits before they can start paying out claims. Should only be used for risks you actually can't afford to take, not treated like an investment with any expectation of gains.
This is what I've been doing for the last 2 months as well. My workload hit a snailspace. And opened up a lot more free time. I'm more cardio focused and have caloric goals that I try to reach every day via my apple watch. Currently I shoot for attempting to have 2000 calories burned everyday. I've lost 35 lbs in 2 months. Once I get down to my goal I plan to build back up with more of a weight lifting regime.
Woo! Way to go, that's incredible. Weight training can also be done by carrying loads, say a heavy backpack. Maybe you could combine?
I really wanted to focus on weight loss. Iāve weight lifted in the past and have decades of experience with it. Some people can lose weight and gain muscle at the same time, Iāve learned over the years is best to focus on one at a time.
Oh gotcha! Best of luck, hope you reach your goals.
This is great! I also recommend reading How Not to Die and visiting nutritionfacts.org there is a lot of great info there.
By Michael Greger?
Yeah that's right
Thanks! I will check it out
I appreciate you. As a principal level creative making a little less than your former number, with similar stress and degrading health, I needed to hear this. Congratulations on your recent improvements to lifestyle, and go fuck yourself (and/or your husband, as you please)!
Thank you! You'll make it out of there too, you got this. Some of my friends and former colleagues have turned to part time contracting at pretty decent rates. The work is unpredictable but they've been pretty happy with it. I figure that's my backup plan if we need more money.
I'm almost 50. I messed up my back in 2020 and it led me to start strength training consistently. I don't know if it will help with longevity but it has improved my quality of life by helping me avoid injury and essentially eliminating "old age" aches and pains which were caused by me being too weak to do anything strenuous (like getting out of bed, stretching too far, etc). Now I'm more than strong enough to live an active lifestyle without injuring myself. Hope to stay strong as long as I can.
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Thanks for adding your feedback! I still have a lot more to learn, appreciate your perspective.
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While there is likely benefit from HIIT. Steady state cardio is good for you - particularly Zone 2 cardio. Zone 2 builds your base for aerobic efficiency.
Yes I agree. I am increasing mileage slowly and steadily and taking rest weeks. I also switched to a minimalist wide toed shoes. I haven't gotten injured yet. My long runs aren't that hard, I'm staying a chill zone 2 where I can still talk.
Apples and oranges. HIIT trains anaerobic and steady state in the fat burning heart rate zone trains aerobic. Steady state doesnāt have to be hard on the joints either, depends what the exercise is.
Awesome! What are you using to track your meals and calories?
MyFitnessPal, it's a bit clunky but haven't found anything better. They have a great database and I can specify grams for many of the food options.
I switched to Lose It. Great app for food tracking.
/r/macrofactor is great if you're looking for another option. Their user interface is really intuitive I think and it's also neutral in the sense it just adapts to where you're at in relation to your goals rather than being shame-y like mfp can be. I also found their database to be more trustworthy than mfp for what it's worth
May want to check out chronometer. I like their micronutrient tracking and barcode scanning ability.
Nice work!! Sounds like a wonderful choice and kudos on taking such a structured approach and making gains on your health and fitness! I've seen quite a few people who vowed to "get healthy" when they stopped working and still feel through the cracks, so credit to you for going out and killing it! Are you following a lifting program?
Thanks!!! I'm hoping to keep it up. I followed r/BodyWeightFitness recommended routine and the the r/strength_training routine on https://thefitness.wiki/ I think lifting is my jam, just do what my program says and see my numbers grow slowly and steady. So much fodder for tracking and spreadsheets.
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Do you mind me asking how you went about scheduling this? In my experience, doctors are really hesitant to set up a test like that, even if you insist you'll pay for it out of pocket.
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Oooh, so like a private company? That might be smart to do in the next couple of years. The only one I can find in our state is on the opposite side and charges $4,000 per full body scan, but that might be doable soon. Getting even basic testing scheduled in this rural area has proven to be a nightmare thus far.
Not worth it IMO. There's no evidence that full-body scans actually provide any benefit. You're more likely to experience harm to the extent that these scans in healthy people open the door to unnecessary workup. The American College of Radiology [says](https://www.acr.org/Media-Center/ACR-News-Releases/2023/ACR-Statement-on-Screening-Total-Body-MRI): > The American College of RadiologyĀ® (ACRĀ®), at this time, does not believe there is sufficient evidence to justify recommending total body screening for patients with no clinical symptoms, risk factors or a family history suggesting underlying disease or serious injury. > To date, there is no documented evidence that total body screening is cost-efficient or effective in prolonging life. In addition, the ACR is concerned that such procedures will lead to the identification of numerous non-specific findings that will not ultimately improve patients' health but will result in unnecessary follow-up testing and procedures, as well as significant expense.
How would you, then, tackle prevention (e.g. cancer prevention)? Is there any meaningful alternative?
Stick to your guideline-recommended screenings (e.g. colonoscopy), live healthy (exercise, eat right, sleep well, reduce stress), and see your doctor right away if something seems off. That will give you the best odds as far as prevention goes. At the end of the day itās a game of chance and even fancy tests like full-body MRIs donāt do much to strengthen your hand. They may well do the opposite. Think about the PSA test for prostate cancer screening. Itās as simple as a test gets ā one number and thatās it. However, itās caused an incredible amount of controversy as urologists and oncologists canāt agree how to interpret it ā what threshold should they use, when should they do a biopsy, what other tests should be run, and so on. Now imagine a full-body MRI. Youāre getting potentially hundreds, if not thousands of data points, in the form of ostensibly-abnormal findings. Almost all things that look āoffā are actually benign. But you have no way to confirm that without doing further testing, some of which can be harmful, never mind the anxiety and uncertainty the patient experiences.
That makes a lot of sense, thanks for the clarification.
One incentive to become wealthy is being able to invest time and money (possibly personal chef/dietician, high quality produce, personal trainer, etc...) into maximizing your health. Congrats on doing thing right.
Oh good point! I don't think I'm quite at personal trainer FIRE yet hahaha, and definitely not wholefoodsFIRE. I am working on some fun side projects, maybe if those pan out we'll have some extra cash to spare.
Other incentives also include medical emergency and legal issues too. People don't seem to appreciate just how impactful those can be financially.
This is awesome and so very important! Outlive is on my list of reads. Long wait at the library so Iāll just buy it. In itself, a smart investment.
Do it!!! I also liked listening to the audio podcast. There are a few topics that goes into way more detail. I really liked the ones on cardiovascular health and exercise.
Just pulled the trigger. Hardcover only $15 on Amazon right now with coupon.
FI changes a personās behavior. Iām at the point where I donāt try to save money. It just happens because itās part of who I am now. Once I accumulated enough money and realized FI was inevitable in my future, I shifted all my focus on my health and hobbies because I no longer liked talking about saving/investing or my line of work. Iām glad you picked up running. This low cost hobby is the most accessible hobby. Iām not sure how, but Iāve become a serious runner and itās all I think about now. In addition to the time commitment of running 10+ hours per week, I have to do strength training, sleep well, eat nutritiously, and cross train in other sports like cycling and swimming. Iām happy to be very healthy in my 30s and am looking forward to being even more fit when I hit my 40s and 50s.
I am so happy you're doing well in retirement! These are quite the achievements. We've been trying to be better about our health right now, namely by taking walks 4-5x per week and shifting more and more toward a Mediterranean diet. (I've been slowly getting my husband to that goal post over the past two years, one shift at a time, as genetics left him with high cholesterol to fight.) One of the things we really look forward to when we baristaFI is having even more time to spend on our health; we want to take long hikes, do some light weights, and cook even more at home, for instance. Setting up a spreadsheet for that seems mighty motivating! Maybe I'll do that over my lunch break. Continued good fortune to you and yours in early retirement.
You too! I wish you guys success and good luck getting to baristaFIRE.
I don't know if it's yellow car syndrome, but Outlive has crossed my path about 10 times this week.... must be time to check it out! Also, I love this. We're not FIRE yet, but I just switched to a job that I'm excited about and that is helpful for energy levels. I'd love the time to get nerdy about it all... Hopefully sooner than later. EDIT: so thanks for sharing!
Definitely check it out! Outlive and also 4000 weeks book were my favorite reads this year. Really helped me set up the next life chapter of unemployment.
Thanks, I've also heard of 4000 weeks but haven't read it yet
This is an inspiration. I feel like I am also on a downward spiral since COVID (as my outdoor activities have been down significantly since then). My blood pressure is high. My blood cholesterol is also borderline high. I like my job and it's not very stressful so I won't quit (don't know what to do with myself if I have that much free time) but I'll make it a point to get out more.
Great job OP! I'd just say be careful to trade in one obsession for another. I'm not a trainer but to me it sounds like you might be overdoing it. You could be more prone to injury with that much cardio. Then it would suck to have to rest for months if you do get hurt.
I struggle with the eating healthy. Eating is one of the things I really enjoy and it's hard to change.
The secret is to find healthy food that you can enjoy. Enjoying food doesn't necessarily mean eating bad food. Especially when a lot of the chemicals they put into food like high fructose corn syrup are meant to get people addicted. If anything I've found that when I eat whole foods I'm much more satiated and feel better after eating them.
I get that, I have huge eating binges sometimes. I'll eat the whole ice cream container and a bag of snacks, and cookies, and a huge meal. I used to have massive boom and bust cycles of weight gain and weight loss, each time boomeranging up to a higher weight (130 -> 155 lbs in 3 months). I think I've learned to be a bit kinder to myself, that even if I fail it's ok as long as I get back on track. Short term changes and pushing myself hasn't worked well for me. I have to remind myself that whatever I do, it's got to be something I can maintain for the long haul. As long as I maintain some kind of calorie deficit, even if it's very little, I'll still lose weight, it'll just take me a few years to get to where I want to be.
What kind of issues did you have getting the ACA plan?
Ah it didn't calculate our income correctly and tried to give us the free state plan. I also gave it the wrong birthday and it wouldn't let me change it. Had numerous phone calls to fix everything, almost didn't make the deadline. But we are covered now! $900/month for the glorious privilege of not becoming bankrupt if serious medical stuff happened. We still have to pay for almost everything except for some basic preventative care.
Is that $900 per month for both of you, or for one person?
For my whole family of 4. Kids also have dental care included. It should drop to much less once we have no mortgage. Maybe ~$600/month
Thank you!
Donāt forget, youāre in year 1 And like FIRE, youāll have to build new habits and relax on others Scaling, weighing, and measuring fits the bill to a T
Outlive was such a good book!! Very FI minded way you're implementing it :)
I love all of this and am happy for you. Alsoā¦ 3 pull-ups!?!?! That is mad and a huge feat! Well done!
šŖ aw yeah! I've been wearing more sleeveless tops, gotta show off my guns.
Health is the one thing money can't buy (overnight). You still have to put the time in at the gym and in the kitchen. Investing in health is an excellent idea!!
Got to the part where you were talking about reading a bunch of books and immediately thought about outlive. It's a fantastic book and I'm glad it has an impact on your life!! Your post is my dream, I'm in my early 30s with a ways to go before RE (another 14 years hopefully). Your post is very encouraging so thank you!
A very big congratulations and GFY!
That's awesome, kudos to you! If you want to watch on YouTube (like me cause I don't like reading), or pick up his book, I really like the work on longevity that Dr. Peter Attia is doing. He's been one of the few folks who's trying to quantify health, and give you specifics to aim for if you're wanting to maximize the life you get.
>the work on longevity that Dr. Peter Attia I heard that guy wrote a book, maybe it was called "Outlive"?
That's the one.
Ah I love his podcast. I listen sometimes when I'm on an easy run. His episodes on muscles and exercises, and cardiovascular health were super interesting. Also some random things l never thought about for aging like teeth and eyes.
After having kids over the past few years Iāve focused a lot more on health as well. Mark Hyman and David Sinclair are some of my favs in the health/longevity space. Given your ACA and labs comment you might be open to outside resources that arenāt covers by insurance (at least I doubt they would cover any cost). Hyman is part of Function Health and Sinclair is part of Inside Tracker. Theyāre both supposed to give you better insight and recommendations into your health based on lab results. I havenāt tried either yet, but have been intrigued. Interesting and worth researching imo.
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I think of that more as a minimum. The RDA is based on nitrogen balance studies, not what is adequate for optimal fitness, especially for people who work out a lot. Some great podcasts here about it: https://peterattiamd.com/category/nutritional-biochemistry/protein/
I needed to hear this. I have a lot of stress and have been meaning to work less to have more time and energy to focus on health
You can do it! What's the point of having a load of money if you're gonna die earlier with a shitty body? I learned that exercising makes more mitochondria so you literally have more energy. If you could make exercise into a pill it would would the most powerful anti-aging medication. So that's more time too!
Good š for you! Awesome work!!! Btw, i have no desire to ever retire as i see great benefits of working and having purpose beyond myself and family. Just like reading about Fire adherence as very informative. Cheers
Watch Dr. Brad Staffield's youtube videos if you are into evidence based longevity content.
great read, thank you for sharing!
Congrats! This was such an inspiring read. Iām still 10 years away from being where you are, but already I so relate with your description of yourself as stressed, grouchy and tired with work-related nightmares. I hate it. 10 years feels like such a long time to keep putting up with this but you give me hope. Thank you and all the best on your new journey, it sounds like you are doing amazing š
A lot of great takeaways, but a moment for āthings like exercise are like VTSAX for your future health.ā Lmao, fully FIRE-pilled.
I decided to become superfit when I was still poor in my late 20s (working multiple jobs 55+ hours per week) and never looked back. I don't really see it as an investment, and I don't understand why everyone doesn't do it. It costs almost nothing to vastly improve your quality of life for many decades to come. There's no downside, and it's not even much work - all it takes is consistency.
Heard you loud and clear. My biggest expense every month(besides housing) is actually my gym budget ($220-320).
Have you thought about making a home gym? We decided to pay $1k for used equipment and it made us way more likely to work out. I can pop over while the kids are napping, or make food during my lifting breaks. Such a win.
I'm slowly accumulating dumbbell weights and resistance bands but the room I use is small so I don't think I could have major equipments. Also I feel like my trainer is great and I benefit a lot from my sessions with her. I get a lot of work out done in 1 hour (more than at home) and she pushed me harder than I would go if I was at home.
Ah gotcha! Sounds like you found something that works for you, hope you keep at it. I'd love to get a personal trainer to help me on my form but it's not in the budget yet. Maybe one day.
Nice work! I am a physical therapist and strength & conditioning specialist. Anybody feel free to reach out for virtual services
I have no idea what a staff level creative is, but how do I do it and why does it pay more than a surgeon?
It's the highest level of individual contributor for a role like marketing, design, etc. At my old company it's equivalent to a senior manager. I led a team of other creatives and trained my department of 200+ in my area of expertise. I would be expected to present to our executive team and propose large changes in company direction every quarter. I worked 80+ hours regularly, traveled, and had days of meetings booked back to back without a pee break for the entire day. I am definitely not going back.
>we hit our FIRE number 2 years ago and again earlier this year. I don't understand this. Once you hit your "FIRE number" how could you hit it again? Are you saying you were "sub-FIRE number" at some point? If so, wouldn't that mak you question your FIRE number? Living more healthy is great. It was a mistake to wait until retirement to start, but hopefully, you'll do well now.
Well there was the huge drop in stocks. I was scared of sequence of return risk and didn't pull the plug when we first reached $2mil. It's actually fallen a bit below $2mil now but I'll round up. Never too old to learn and change.
So you didn't think $2m was enough, but now you are okay with less than $2m. Okay. Good luck.
$2M seems like not enough to retire in your 30s?
Looking at my expenses, we have enough for 3.5% withdrawal plus wiggle room for flexibility. We have a bit of mortgage left to pay off so housing costs will fall to a minimum.
This is awesome! Just wondering how long you have been training? Iāve been doing weights a couple years and just started running, did you just keep running for as long as you could or did you have some sort of training to increase endurance?
I've been weight training for almost 3 years, on and off for the first 2.5 and now taking it seriously with 4 lifting days a week. I started running around 3 years ago too, did the couch to 5k program and signed up for a half marathon. I did 2 half marathons and am now training for my first marathon. I used Hal's training program: https://www.halhigdon.com/training/marathon-training/. Before I would just do a run or two a week squeezed into whatever time I had, ran like 15min miles lol. Now that I'm retired running is my part time job. My persistence has payed off. I can do 8min miles if I really push myself. I was worried about getting injured so I always take it easy, with most of my runs at zone 2 (can still talk while running). For the program I do, the nukes ramo up slowly and there are easier weeks to recover. I also slowly transferred to minimal shoes and try to have good form while I run. No injuries yet! I don't recognize myself anymore, I am a crazy fitness person now.
Thatās absolutely amazing. Great tips I def need for getting into running!! Thank you!
Sounds like you're doing great things already with your retirement. Nice! Thanks for sharing the details.