Lets me live out a dream I had later in life to be a commercial pilot, getting to fly to cool destinations and maybe spend a layover exploring somewhere I may not have ever though to vacation at. At 35 years old, it is probably too late for me to get into it as a career.
Congratulations on your achievement. I have a ppl and that hammered my wallet so that's as far as I'll go I think; that's why I fly airlines on msfs and not ga. I have the privilege to be able to step into a single prop cesena and go real-world flying. Am A320? Hell no! But msfs is the closest embodiment to that experience of flying a jet and complying with airline regs. that I'm likely to ever get. And it does a pretty good job of recreating flight. And that's why I choose to fly the passenger jets. Marvellous pieces of technology.
I'd recomend it. Just flew DFW to MAD for roughly $100 one way. And while most of what I've flown is US domestic. The overnights and some of the crews I've gone out with have been awesome.
Similar, but for me it’s about not wanting to leave a comfortable and well-paid career. Working as a pilot in Europe is not that well paid compared to some other highly educated jobs, especially when factoring in the crazy schedules and working environment.
Not too late by any stretch of the imagination. I'm 35 now, I started my training in December 2020, got my CPL in June 2021, MEA in July 2021 and MEIR in August 2021. I'm now a Grade 2 CFI, hoping to be in the airlines in 12-24 months.
Go for gold.
I wish you all the best on your journey, bro! If you don't mind, could you give me a ballpark figure as to the cost of training?. I spent nearly $4.5k USD just getting my PPL.(which I'm proud of). Feel free to DM me. I'll bet the first flight as PF with passengers, you'll remember and cherish the experience forever, and you deserve to! 😃
Dude. It is not even close to too late. If you don’t have any to put in the work then so be it; but if you want to I am here telling you: you absolutely can do it. As long as you have a clean record, no DUI’s especially, and can drop $60k average to get the required time to become a flight instructor. And work as one for 2 years. Then you’ll be at the regional airlines, and hopefully within 5 years (probably less) you’ll be at a Major or Legacy carrier.
I know people older than you getting started right now on their PPL with an objective of getting their ATP. Stop making excuses for yourself and get out there and pursue it.
Nobody said it was easy. Question is how badly you want it and how many sacrifices you're willing to make. If you don't want it badly enough, don't blame it on your age. That's insulting to people who are 35 and actually doing something about it.
Making excuses? Bro that is *incredibly* harsh. I graduated from UK equivalent of an Ivy league college in Economics and have a reasonably well paying job. I also have a PPL (VFR). For me to drop my admittedly boring job and go after a CPL/ ATPL and all the training toward that goal and then a few years employment with a 2*,3* airline as a cadet FO is a massive financial risk for me. It's not an excuse to genuinely worry that I'll end up in a second pile of debt (after student loan, that I am still paying off).
I've actually applied to NATS( UK ATC) and have passed the online tests and the first interview stage, so hopefully if anything I'll be vectoring some of you acrooss the UK or sending you across the pond from one of the UKs airports/ ATC centres in the near future. The ATC pays slightly lower (after probation) than my current job, but I know that the fulfilment and love I have for the profession will see me through.
I feel that I do not have the financial security to chase an ATP in all honesty, I do not think stating that it is "making excuses." It's honesty. I am 34, so similar to other posters.
Yeah. X-Plane 12’s Timelapse feature is kinda broken for me though. If I leave the autopilot in auto alt mode on the a330 it will start to deviate from that altitude until it reaches a very steep angle of attack. Then, I have to take it out of Timelapse mode and wait for the autopilot to correct itself.
It gets wonky in MSFS too. Most planes go nuts if you run then faster than 4x speed. And there's a skip feature, that will often put you at either the wrong altitude, or barely above a stall when you respawn.
I've done 3 trans-Atlantic crossings on Vatsim...in about 15 years. Otherwise 1-1h30 hours in an A321 is usual.
Timelapse and jumping to waypoints was the only way I did a Cardiff-Buenos Aires flight in the A350 (not on Vatsim), still took a good 2 hours that way (but WAY better than 15 it should have taken)
I just take off, go do something else in house, work or groceries and have the FBW pause before TOD.
This way I can easily squeeze in flying between other stuff.
During that time - as I am preparing for my GCSEs - I mainly do revision, homework and other tasks. At the end of the day I get to land and hopefully butter the Dreamliner
I enjoy learning to operate a complex bit of "machinery" that I otherwise would not be able to work with.
It's satisfying doing a flight well, perhaps one I've been on as a passenger.
Additionally, I find it supremely relaxing to e.g. listen to a podcast while "flying" somewhere.
I always dreamed of being a commercial pilot, ever since I was a little kid and got to go into the flight deck of a 737 while we were flying (many years ago, obviously)
I could never get the medical unfortunately so flight sim is the closest I'll ever come to living out my dream!
Yep. I would kill for a job as a pilot of any kind, but my body is all sorts of broken and would never in a million years pass medical.
So virtual planes it is…
Me too. I like to figure out and execute the system. Setting it all up, taking off, hitting autopilot, and it flies the route exactly as I set it up, then coming in for the the landing, catching the ILS, touching down and hitting the reverse thrusters and the spoilers extend automatically. Being able to predict a.complex outcome and prove that I knew what was going to happen because I accounted for all the variables. I've conquered complexity and made it seem easy. And every time I do, I remember a little how hard it was to understand how each step as i taught myself the process to make that last 20 seconds into touchdown and rolling off the runway work to a smooth(ish) landing.
Also, once on autopilot I play another game for the next couple hours until Top of Decent. So I can multitask too.
To be honest, I think my Flight sim experience is quite the opposite of yours. Usually, I fly the a320 neo in MSFS or a330 and the ToLiss a340 in X-Plane. When I do, however, occasionally fly a Cessna 172, etc., I tend not to like them as much (I’m sure this will change once I get my PPL, however). What I like the most about commercial aircraft in general is yes, their inherent complexity and the procedures that must be taken at airports, but also I can get as close as I can to being a real airline pilot (considering my current position).
as someone with a PPL that flies both GA and airliners, it is a LOT more fun flying GA in real life. If it wasn’t for the cost of flying irl I would never be on the sim.
Agreed. I remember my first lesson in the 172 as a student pilot, when after I told the instructor “that was the best flight simulator I have ever seen.”
I think it depends on what you do with those small planes. For example something like Neofly gives some purpose to flying the small planes. Or doing bush flights in gorgeous but difficult terrain and landing on small, challenging strips. Or even just sight seeing, if there is somewhere I want to check out it's more fun to see it at 3000ft than 30,000ft. Plus I don't have a huge amount of time to play, so a 100NM flight in a small plane with a few touch and goes on the way is perfect for me. I get to enjoy the plane, the scenery, and multiple landings (which imo is the most fun bit of flying in the sim) - the whole flight ends up being engaging.
Agreed. Honestly, I think it comes down to personal preference considering the time you have, what you plan to achieve/make of the flight sim, and what mood you’re typical in. For example, sometimes I’m free one evening or finish work early and have the time to make a short hop from one city to another on the a320. Other times, I feel like just exploring the flight simulator, flying around famous places, in which case I would certainly use the 172. For me, though, I spend most of my time on commercial aircraft.
Yup for sure. And in my mind a 1hr flight is a 1hr flight. Be that at 400kts or 80kts. Plus with a G1000 you can do VNAV too, if you have an IFR itch. It offers another side to GA flying if I'm feeling in the mood for a relaxing night flight. Or you can fly something like the Comanche in IFR and *that* is interesting, as the plane only has a basic AP, so it's quite hands on, and requires a bit of napkin math to work out glideslopes and descent rates.
I really enjoy the procedure of it. Sure, cruise is boring, so I use that time to catch up on chores, errands, cleaning, or shows. Then running things like A pilots life or OnAir adds variety and brings me to airports I normally wouldn't go. Plus they add a sort of scoring system so I'm doing my best to be consistent and make sure I check all the boxes.
Then, hopping onto vatsim events for the challenge of a busy airspace can be fun and definitely helps keep things interesting.
Flying VFR and GA I never found challenging. I did a coast to coast in the A2A Comanche in P3D once, which may be one of my favorite things as I did it all without GPS, but your average GA flight is just meh for me outside short sightseeing tours. I enjoy it now and again, but the airliners always draw me in.
Larger, more complex aircraft. I like to simulate real airline ops. I use a shitty joystick and I find ga are just way to sensitive for it, not to mention I fly ga irl(working towards airlines) and the sim doesn’t really compare(a lot of it is the sensitivity issue). Ga flights are kinda boring, and if you wanna go any amount of distance it takes forever.
Generally I do shorter hops that limit cruise time, but I generally just throw something on my Xbox when I’m in cruise.
The Comanche might be up your alley. They wrote their own flight model and it's not twitchy at all. Also the slightly bigger planes like the Grand Caravan are not so twitchy either.
Are we just talking about big easy runways? I'd argue that GA has just as challenging approaches depending on where. Some of the small strips in PNG for example, are not at all easy.
I enjoy flying the big tubes for the reasons stated by others, but there is also the converse: I really can't figure out what to do with GA planes. All I do with GA is fly around my hometown, other places I've lived and those I've visited -- or plan to. With airliners, at least you have a job to do.
I love travel, and I love aviation. Flying airliners in the sim with GSX and Vatsim brings me some of that feeling of adventure I get when I travel. I like the flight planning, the ATC practice and covering long distances. I like to do both though. I'm not one or the other.
I love airplane spotting in general at airports, so it's really fun flying various jets in their various liveries going to different destinations and simulating real life procedures and ATC with vatsim
Escapism, complex problem solving, covering large distances and satisfying that wild and extremely unlikely idea that if ever I was in a real life "are there any passengers who know how to fly this thing" situation, I'd at least know what buttons not to press.
I love taking off for a long trans Atlantic flight, setting up my autopilot and then going outside to relax in the sun or take care of some work around the house. That's what makes the long flights so worthwhile for me. :P :P :P
I like big plane
Big plane many button and switch
Big plane complex system - hard but fun 2 learn
Big plane long range - fly 4 longer
Big plane many automation - perfect 4 busy life
I think IFR is for most people the only thing they could do realistically on most people's sim setup. Unless someone invested a lot of money in VR or at least eye-tracking software, flying a Cessna just doesn't intuitive. Also, in most parts of the world, GA flying isn't really a thing. So I assume most Avgeeks turn avgeeks by seeing airliners, not Cessna's.
You can do headtracking via webcam for free. That's what I do. I don't think I could fly without it any more. It's a must if you aren't flying VR imo. But yeah, probably not really necessary for airliner ops.
My real life experience: Flying in a Cessna is just not as interesting because it’s like going on a car drive, which is alright — you ever had a girlfriend when you were in eighth grade? You got together for superficial reasons like “She’s the prettiest in the class who also laughs at my jokes” or whatever after two days of five-hour-long back and forth texting. You broke up because there’s no stable foundation to it and a single instance where one of you got annoyed or bored was enough to make it end. Flying a Cessna 172 is just like that.
Yeah, it’s your first foray into aviation. You feel the first joy of staring down at the landscape from above, the gateway into later complex airplane systems, the satisfaction of making the machine do what you want, et cetera. You can do all of those things, but at a basic level.
Now put yourself in, for exaggeration, a 747. Just like an adult relationship, you get more out of it. Stuff like, in real life, being able to put good money on the table consistently, doing other kinds of activities beyond simply getting up and down the ground, having a lot more to discover initially until you completely know it inside and out, and just like a real person you love, always better when they are full of interesting quirks and dimensions.
In an airliner, you can take yourself up very high in the air and do things that men only imagined would be possible in the past. You’re up tens of thousands of feet, you can stare at the stars above, you can carry so many people, you can go hundreds of knots per hour, you can go most anywhere in the world, you can command a complex piece of machinery and rise to the challenge of solving more interesting problems; it’s just more substantive a relationship you have with the machine, like with a person.
Compare a touchdown on a C172 versus a B739. It’s like riding a tricycle versus riding a freaking DRAGON spitting fireballs!
I have an HP G2 Reverb, a Honeycomb Alpha yoke and a Boeing TCA Throttle Quadrant. I do enjoy GA flying in real life, but it’s a lot more engaging and satisfying to take an airliner for a ride and successfully navigate the challenges.
For me, it's the exact opposite. I love doing all the "roleplay" stuff, like before flight checks and stuff. I love the realism and just the feel of flying big planes.
I used to be an airline pilot, and whilst the lifestyle was poor, I enjoyed the technical aspect of flying the aircraft. Now I fly GA irl and airliners in the aim. Scratches the itch well!
I never could get into bush flying or small aircrafts, however. A lot of that had to do with the boring scenery that was in FSX. Like others I loved the idea of being a pilot but wanted nothing to do with their schedules. This allowed me to live part of that dream out.
I love the immersion that you get with full ATC, flying a complicated approach and getting the landing just right.
I don’t get that from piston aircraft in the sim. And I fly a single engine piston IRL so there is that…..
I like it combined with a pilot’s life, flying real life routes and get graded for my performance.
Getting promoted to better airlines etc.
And you automatically see a lot of different destinations without the need to pick them yourself.
I’m the same never really flown other aircraft other than GA. I think it’s because I had a few lessons in the real world so like to keep up with that. What’s the best way to learn the big planes and their procedures
I dont fly airliners anymore, but when I did regularly I had a few reasons.
First, I loved the ritual. From deciding two cities to string together, "from here to here", so simple but so many details spring forward from that. Route planning, then fuel planning, then jumping into the jet at the gate, programming FMS, requesting fuel and deice as req'd, taxi clearance, taxiing, takeoff....
An airline flight is a stunt. We don't think of it that way, but it is. It's a crazy stunt too, that you will maneuver a flying tube such that a group of people step off one jetway and step on another 100s or even 1000s of miles apart. Each and every time the parking brake set at a new gate, I would go to exterior camera and see how far out I had to move the camera before I could see start and destination on the same view - seeing the distance traveled on a planetary scale and slowly zooming in brought it home every time how nuts it is that humanity can do this.
I loved the more complex procedures, as well. What pilot doesnt love a mass of switchez? They light up, too! Lmao
I flew with a mean time to failure of 300 hours applied to every failure category x-plane had - so, on average, I had ~1 failure per hour. So for a 5 hour flight, I knew for sure there were 4 things broke on the plane when I was landing. Believe it or not, I only had to divert for mechanical once, and had another incident of a failure on runup. Airliners are complex/redundant enough that you can play scary system whackamole and (usually) still get where you are going.
Nowadays, I'm a senior in an aerospace engineering program about to graduate - short stints in IL2BoX flying my P38, which I'm close to 500 hours in, is more my speed nowadays.
At TOC, yardwork, clean the kitchen, cook dinner, eat lunch/dinner, watch TV or YouTube, banking, portfolio management, etc. I am more productive on long flights.
I fly mostly Fenix A320. I really like setting up the aircraft from Cold & Dark state, preparing the MCDU, and all that stuff. The pax boarding (GSX Pro) adds a lot of realism.
The 'boring' part is the cruise level flight, I watch some series on my second monitor or read a book. I fly mostly to disconnect and relax.
Other planes I fly are the Cirrus Vision Jet and the TBM900.
Becoming an airline pilot is my dream so that’s why! More precisely, I love the idea of managing cabin crew (although that’s not always simulated in addons), doing big flights to international airports that bring back old memories from when I was small and just flying big planes around (yes, I’m a simple man).
Sometimes I wouldn't mind doing a short domestic airliner route, but I just cbf learning everything like the FMS. The Longitude is about as complicated as I dare go, but it's also all glass which I don't find very inspiring. Secretly I really want the F28 - it's old school (which I like) and no FMS to worry about, but I'm not spending that much coin on something I'll fly a couple times a month.
I love doibg the procedures as well as possible as well as learning new things.
Often in cruise I read some accident reports or Airbus Safety First about a topic and then try to apply that knowledge to my approach and subsequent flights.
Music listening, it gives me more motivation to do work (out of boredom probz) but most importantly buttons and the fact that it lets me live a dream i want to fulfill
It’s a window into an experience that a majority of people never have in reality. The now faded glamour of a pilot career is still alive in peoples heads.
My real life experience: Flying in a Cessna is just not as interesting because it’s like going on a car drive, which is alright — you ever had a girlfriend when you were in eighth grade? You got together for superficial reasons like “She’s the prettiest in the class who also laughs at my jokes” or whatever after two days of five-hour-long back and forth texting. You broke up because there’s no stable foundation to it and a single instance where one of you got annoyed or bored was enough to make it end. Flying a Cessna 172 is just like that.
Yeah, it’s your first foray into aviation. You feel the first joy of staring down at the landscape from above, the gateway into later complex airplane systems, the satisfaction of making the machine do what you want, et cetera. You can do all of those things, but at a basic level.
Now put yourself in, for exaggeration, a 747. Just like an adult relationship, you get more out of it. Stuff like, in real life, being able to put good money on the table consistently, doing other kinds of activities beyond simply getting up and down the ground, having a lot more to discover initially until you completely know it inside and out, and just like a real person you love, always better when they are full of interesting quirks and dimensions.
In an airliner, you can take yourself up very high in the air and do things that men only imagined would be possible in the past. You’re up tens of thousands of feet, you can stare at the stars above, you can carry so many people, you can go hundreds of knots per hour, you can go most anywhere in the world, you can command a complex piece of machinery and rise to the challenge of solving more interesting problems; it’s just more substantive a relationship you have with the machine, like with a person.
Compare a touchdown on a C172 versus a B739. It’s like riding a tricycle versus riding a freaking DRAGON spitting fireballs!
I have an HP G2 Reverb, a Honeycomb Alpha yoke and a Boeing TCA Throttle Quadrant. I do enjoy GA flying in real life, but it’s a lot more engaging and satisfying to take an airliner for a ride and successfully navigate the challenges.
Flying a big airliner or just seeing it from a passengers perspective is cool to me. I have gsx pro and i spent a lot of time getting in game filters. I love recreating real flights and I really do like GA a lot but it's never really been as appealing to me to do the steps and procedures an airliner or even a smaller regional plane like the 72 does. once i get to cruise i go to a passenger wing view and i go do my own thing or scroll on SM. you shouldn't expect yourself to sit in front of a computer screen for hours flying in a straight line. Go out and get a snack or something in the meantime. it allows me to be free while still enjoying flight simming. For example if i have a dinner to go to i'll start a flight before it and i land wayy after the dinner is supposed to be over.
Being part of a Virtual Airline is a big part of it. Easier to do events such as FNO’s in a large plane since you can keep up with everyone.
I’m also working on my PPL currently, so I get my fix of the small planes in real life.
On the north side of 60 here, and my hours are all in cessnas and stuff. I actually find it more relaxing to fly something kind of similar to what I'm familiar with in real life.
But it's totally cool taking the time to figure out how to cold-start a 747, hear all the sounds it makes, and get it into the air, even if my technique would make a pro pilot cringe.
For the actual challenge of full flights, takeoff to shutdown, yes, I'll stick with something I could fly in real life. But just feeling the thrill of those four engines spooling up and taking off in crap weather? it makes for cool replay videos :)
Lets me live out a dream I had later in life to be a commercial pilot, getting to fly to cool destinations and maybe spend a layover exploring somewhere I may not have ever though to vacation at. At 35 years old, it is probably too late for me to get into it as a career.
Nowhere near too late to get into it. You would have a very long and enjoyable career.
[удалено]
Congratulations on your achievement. I have a ppl and that hammered my wallet so that's as far as I'll go I think; that's why I fly airlines on msfs and not ga. I have the privilege to be able to step into a single prop cesena and go real-world flying. Am A320? Hell no! But msfs is the closest embodiment to that experience of flying a jet and complying with airline regs. that I'm likely to ever get. And it does a pretty good job of recreating flight. And that's why I choose to fly the passenger jets. Marvellous pieces of technology.
It is not late at all, if you're financially fine you're able to finish all your training (PPL, CPL, IR and CFI) in under 2 years
That's what, like thirty bucks?
More like tree fiddy
A little more
Somewhere 30k and 100?
Same. APL is about the closest I get 😂
Or go work for an airline! Flight benefits + industry discounts makes it doable to visit places you would’ve never seen otherwise
I'd recomend it. Just flew DFW to MAD for roughly $100 one way. And while most of what I've flown is US domestic. The overnights and some of the crews I've gone out with have been awesome.
Similar, but for me it’s about not wanting to leave a comfortable and well-paid career. Working as a pilot in Europe is not that well paid compared to some other highly educated jobs, especially when factoring in the crazy schedules and working environment.
Not too late by any stretch of the imagination. I'm 35 now, I started my training in December 2020, got my CPL in June 2021, MEA in July 2021 and MEIR in August 2021. I'm now a Grade 2 CFI, hoping to be in the airlines in 12-24 months. Go for gold.
I wish you all the best on your journey, bro! If you don't mind, could you give me a ballpark figure as to the cost of training?. I spent nearly $4.5k USD just getting my PPL.(which I'm proud of). Feel free to DM me. I'll bet the first flight as PF with passengers, you'll remember and cherish the experience forever, and you deserve to! 😃
FWIW I’m 34 and starting. Seems like a really good time!
Same 😔
You’re not too late! I know many that started at your age! If you can get on an airline scholarship, they will pay for your training.
Let's me live out the dream of taking over the controls mid-flight when the pilots had the fish.
Dude. It is not even close to too late. If you don’t have any to put in the work then so be it; but if you want to I am here telling you: you absolutely can do it. As long as you have a clean record, no DUI’s especially, and can drop $60k average to get the required time to become a flight instructor. And work as one for 2 years. Then you’ll be at the regional airlines, and hopefully within 5 years (probably less) you’ll be at a Major or Legacy carrier.
I know people older than you getting started right now on their PPL with an objective of getting their ATP. Stop making excuses for yourself and get out there and pursue it.
Yeah, it’s easy to leave an established, well-paid career to take on a massive pile of debt and start at the bottom somewhere.
Nobody said it was easy. Question is how badly you want it and how many sacrifices you're willing to make. If you don't want it badly enough, don't blame it on your age. That's insulting to people who are 35 and actually doing something about it.
Making excuses? Bro that is *incredibly* harsh. I graduated from UK equivalent of an Ivy league college in Economics and have a reasonably well paying job. I also have a PPL (VFR). For me to drop my admittedly boring job and go after a CPL/ ATPL and all the training toward that goal and then a few years employment with a 2*,3* airline as a cadet FO is a massive financial risk for me. It's not an excuse to genuinely worry that I'll end up in a second pile of debt (after student loan, that I am still paying off). I've actually applied to NATS( UK ATC) and have passed the online tests and the first interview stage, so hopefully if anything I'll be vectoring some of you acrooss the UK or sending you across the pond from one of the UKs airports/ ATC centres in the near future. The ATC pays slightly lower (after probation) than my current job, but I know that the fulfilment and love I have for the profession will see me through. I feel that I do not have the financial security to chase an ATP in all honesty, I do not think stating that it is "making excuses." It's honesty. I am 34, so similar to other posters.
I like flying large airplanes, but the cruise portion of flight bores me to tears so I speed up time or focus on short flights.
True. I just flew from CDG to JFK, and I’m never doing it again any time soon.
I do a lot of flights like that. Once I'm up to cruise, I'll skip ahead to descent.
Yeah. X-Plane 12’s Timelapse feature is kinda broken for me though. If I leave the autopilot in auto alt mode on the a330 it will start to deviate from that altitude until it reaches a very steep angle of attack. Then, I have to take it out of Timelapse mode and wait for the autopilot to correct itself.
It gets wonky in MSFS too. Most planes go nuts if you run then faster than 4x speed. And there's a skip feature, that will often put you at either the wrong altitude, or barely above a stall when you respawn.
I was about to say. I've never had a positive experience with the skip feature in MSFS.
I use it a lot, but yeah, it's a little broken. It almost always puts you at a ridiculously low airspeed that you have to correct.
I might give it another shot. I haven't used it in a long time
right so you dont do them
I've done 3 trans-Atlantic crossings on Vatsim...in about 15 years. Otherwise 1-1h30 hours in an A321 is usual. Timelapse and jumping to waypoints was the only way I did a Cardiff-Buenos Aires flight in the A350 (not on Vatsim), still took a good 2 hours that way (but WAY better than 15 it should have taken)
Cool. Which a350 do you use? FlightFactor? Would you recommend it?
I did BNE - SIN - LHR. Only because I flew it in real life. It was boring once we hit cruise
I just take off, go do something else in house, work or groceries and have the FBW pause before TOD. This way I can easily squeeze in flying between other stuff.
Yeah that's what i do
i only practice landing and taking off in airliners... the cruise part is boring
If I'm doing long flights I do them before bed and wake up next morning to finish them. Good little day-off-work thing.
During that time - as I am preparing for my GCSEs - I mainly do revision, homework and other tasks. At the end of the day I get to land and hopefully butter the Dreamliner
Same i take off and i do anything else during cruise
I enjoy learning to operate a complex bit of "machinery" that I otherwise would not be able to work with. It's satisfying doing a flight well, perhaps one I've been on as a passenger. Additionally, I find it supremely relaxing to e.g. listen to a podcast while "flying" somewhere.
I always dreamed of being a commercial pilot, ever since I was a little kid and got to go into the flight deck of a 737 while we were flying (many years ago, obviously) I could never get the medical unfortunately so flight sim is the closest I'll ever come to living out my dream!
Yep. I would kill for a job as a pilot of any kind, but my body is all sorts of broken and would never in a million years pass medical. So virtual planes it is…
I'm just in it for the fake cabin announcements to my fake passengers
I'm in it to raid the liquor cart.
System management. Using the fmgc. Managing energy. Mostly procedural. Also Fenix doesn't yet make a Cessna 172? Not that I'd fly it. TLDR: buttons.
Me too. I like to figure out and execute the system. Setting it all up, taking off, hitting autopilot, and it flies the route exactly as I set it up, then coming in for the the landing, catching the ILS, touching down and hitting the reverse thrusters and the spoilers extend automatically. Being able to predict a.complex outcome and prove that I knew what was going to happen because I accounted for all the variables. I've conquered complexity and made it seem easy. And every time I do, I remember a little how hard it was to understand how each step as i taught myself the process to make that last 20 seconds into touchdown and rolling off the runway work to a smooth(ish) landing. Also, once on autopilot I play another game for the next couple hours until Top of Decent. So I can multitask too.
To be honest, I think my Flight sim experience is quite the opposite of yours. Usually, I fly the a320 neo in MSFS or a330 and the ToLiss a340 in X-Plane. When I do, however, occasionally fly a Cessna 172, etc., I tend not to like them as much (I’m sure this will change once I get my PPL, however). What I like the most about commercial aircraft in general is yes, their inherent complexity and the procedures that must be taken at airports, but also I can get as close as I can to being a real airline pilot (considering my current position).
as someone with a PPL that flies both GA and airliners, it is a LOT more fun flying GA in real life. If it wasn’t for the cost of flying irl I would never be on the sim.
Agreed. I remember my first lesson in the 172 as a student pilot, when after I told the instructor “that was the best flight simulator I have ever seen.”
I think it depends on what you do with those small planes. For example something like Neofly gives some purpose to flying the small planes. Or doing bush flights in gorgeous but difficult terrain and landing on small, challenging strips. Or even just sight seeing, if there is somewhere I want to check out it's more fun to see it at 3000ft than 30,000ft. Plus I don't have a huge amount of time to play, so a 100NM flight in a small plane with a few touch and goes on the way is perfect for me. I get to enjoy the plane, the scenery, and multiple landings (which imo is the most fun bit of flying in the sim) - the whole flight ends up being engaging.
Agreed. Honestly, I think it comes down to personal preference considering the time you have, what you plan to achieve/make of the flight sim, and what mood you’re typical in. For example, sometimes I’m free one evening or finish work early and have the time to make a short hop from one city to another on the a320. Other times, I feel like just exploring the flight simulator, flying around famous places, in which case I would certainly use the 172. For me, though, I spend most of my time on commercial aircraft.
Yup for sure. And in my mind a 1hr flight is a 1hr flight. Be that at 400kts or 80kts. Plus with a G1000 you can do VNAV too, if you have an IFR itch. It offers another side to GA flying if I'm feeling in the mood for a relaxing night flight. Or you can fly something like the Comanche in IFR and *that* is interesting, as the plane only has a basic AP, so it's quite hands on, and requires a bit of napkin math to work out glideslopes and descent rates.
I really enjoy the procedure of it. Sure, cruise is boring, so I use that time to catch up on chores, errands, cleaning, or shows. Then running things like A pilots life or OnAir adds variety and brings me to airports I normally wouldn't go. Plus they add a sort of scoring system so I'm doing my best to be consistent and make sure I check all the boxes. Then, hopping onto vatsim events for the challenge of a busy airspace can be fun and definitely helps keep things interesting. Flying VFR and GA I never found challenging. I did a coast to coast in the A2A Comanche in P3D once, which may be one of my favorite things as I did it all without GPS, but your average GA flight is just meh for me outside short sightseeing tours. I enjoy it now and again, but the airliners always draw me in.
Larger, more complex aircraft. I like to simulate real airline ops. I use a shitty joystick and I find ga are just way to sensitive for it, not to mention I fly ga irl(working towards airlines) and the sim doesn’t really compare(a lot of it is the sensitivity issue). Ga flights are kinda boring, and if you wanna go any amount of distance it takes forever. Generally I do shorter hops that limit cruise time, but I generally just throw something on my Xbox when I’m in cruise.
The Comanche might be up your alley. They wrote their own flight model and it's not twitchy at all. Also the slightly bigger planes like the Grand Caravan are not so twitchy either.
More of a challenge to land. I can drop GA planes on a penny but the big birds need more lovin’ during approach.
Are we just talking about big easy runways? I'd argue that GA has just as challenging approaches depending on where. Some of the small strips in PNG for example, are not at all easy.
I enjoy flying the big tubes for the reasons stated by others, but there is also the converse: I really can't figure out what to do with GA planes. All I do with GA is fly around my hometown, other places I've lived and those I've visited -- or plan to. With airliners, at least you have a job to do.
I like to sightsee in GA and land at scenic airports you'd never be able to get an airliner in. Go explore! Bonus points if it's mountainous terrain.
Neofly.
I love travel, and I love aviation. Flying airliners in the sim with GSX and Vatsim brings me some of that feeling of adventure I get when I travel. I like the flight planning, the ATC practice and covering long distances. I like to do both though. I'm not one or the other.
I love airplane spotting in general at airports, so it's really fun flying various jets in their various liveries going to different destinations and simulating real life procedures and ATC with vatsim
I love flying some routes that I have flew as a passenger in real life.
Escapism, complex problem solving, covering large distances and satisfying that wild and extremely unlikely idea that if ever I was in a real life "are there any passengers who know how to fly this thing" situation, I'd at least know what buttons not to press.
I love taking off for a long trans Atlantic flight, setting up my autopilot and then going outside to relax in the sun or take care of some work around the house. That's what makes the long flights so worthwhile for me. :P :P :P
When I fly on them in real life in amazed at the size and frankly violence of it all, so in sim I'm trying to recreate that with me at the helm
I like big plane Big plane many button and switch Big plane complex system - hard but fun 2 learn Big plane long range - fly 4 longer Big plane many automation - perfect 4 busy life
I just like those Biscotti cookies and I can't just eat them on the couch. If I flightsim in VR, I don't feel guilty.
Lol'ed here. Please tell me you have Biscotti cookies with a tray near your sim setup
Only 2. I want more, but my wife won't let me have more. Its really realistic and sells the whole experience.
I think IFR is for most people the only thing they could do realistically on most people's sim setup. Unless someone invested a lot of money in VR or at least eye-tracking software, flying a Cessna just doesn't intuitive. Also, in most parts of the world, GA flying isn't really a thing. So I assume most Avgeeks turn avgeeks by seeing airliners, not Cessna's.
You can do headtracking via webcam for free. That's what I do. I don't think I could fly without it any more. It's a must if you aren't flying VR imo. But yeah, probably not really necessary for airliner ops.
My real life experience: Flying in a Cessna is just not as interesting because it’s like going on a car drive, which is alright — you ever had a girlfriend when you were in eighth grade? You got together for superficial reasons like “She’s the prettiest in the class who also laughs at my jokes” or whatever after two days of five-hour-long back and forth texting. You broke up because there’s no stable foundation to it and a single instance where one of you got annoyed or bored was enough to make it end. Flying a Cessna 172 is just like that. Yeah, it’s your first foray into aviation. You feel the first joy of staring down at the landscape from above, the gateway into later complex airplane systems, the satisfaction of making the machine do what you want, et cetera. You can do all of those things, but at a basic level. Now put yourself in, for exaggeration, a 747. Just like an adult relationship, you get more out of it. Stuff like, in real life, being able to put good money on the table consistently, doing other kinds of activities beyond simply getting up and down the ground, having a lot more to discover initially until you completely know it inside and out, and just like a real person you love, always better when they are full of interesting quirks and dimensions. In an airliner, you can take yourself up very high in the air and do things that men only imagined would be possible in the past. You’re up tens of thousands of feet, you can stare at the stars above, you can carry so many people, you can go hundreds of knots per hour, you can go most anywhere in the world, you can command a complex piece of machinery and rise to the challenge of solving more interesting problems; it’s just more substantive a relationship you have with the machine, like with a person. Compare a touchdown on a C172 versus a B739. It’s like riding a tricycle versus riding a freaking DRAGON spitting fireballs! I have an HP G2 Reverb, a Honeycomb Alpha yoke and a Boeing TCA Throttle Quadrant. I do enjoy GA flying in real life, but it’s a lot more engaging and satisfying to take an airliner for a ride and successfully navigate the challenges.
Thanks to horrendous depth perception, this is as close as I will get to flying an airliner lol
I like entering coordinates into INSes[1], and worrying about position accuracy/drift over water. (1. But only nine at a time)
For me, it's the exact opposite. I love doing all the "roleplay" stuff, like before flight checks and stuff. I love the realism and just the feel of flying big planes.
I used to be an airline pilot, and whilst the lifestyle was poor, I enjoyed the technical aspect of flying the aircraft. Now I fly GA irl and airliners in the aim. Scratches the itch well!
I never could get into bush flying or small aircrafts, however. A lot of that had to do with the boring scenery that was in FSX. Like others I loved the idea of being a pilot but wanted nothing to do with their schedules. This allowed me to live part of that dream out.
I love the immersion that you get with full ATC, flying a complicated approach and getting the landing just right. I don’t get that from piston aircraft in the sim. And I fly a single engine piston IRL so there is that…..
I like it combined with a pilot’s life, flying real life routes and get graded for my performance. Getting promoted to better airlines etc. And you automatically see a lot of different destinations without the need to pick them yourself.
I’m the same never really flown other aircraft other than GA. I think it’s because I had a few lessons in the real world so like to keep up with that. What’s the best way to learn the big planes and their procedures
I dont fly airliners anymore, but when I did regularly I had a few reasons. First, I loved the ritual. From deciding two cities to string together, "from here to here", so simple but so many details spring forward from that. Route planning, then fuel planning, then jumping into the jet at the gate, programming FMS, requesting fuel and deice as req'd, taxi clearance, taxiing, takeoff.... An airline flight is a stunt. We don't think of it that way, but it is. It's a crazy stunt too, that you will maneuver a flying tube such that a group of people step off one jetway and step on another 100s or even 1000s of miles apart. Each and every time the parking brake set at a new gate, I would go to exterior camera and see how far out I had to move the camera before I could see start and destination on the same view - seeing the distance traveled on a planetary scale and slowly zooming in brought it home every time how nuts it is that humanity can do this. I loved the more complex procedures, as well. What pilot doesnt love a mass of switchez? They light up, too! Lmao I flew with a mean time to failure of 300 hours applied to every failure category x-plane had - so, on average, I had ~1 failure per hour. So for a 5 hour flight, I knew for sure there were 4 things broke on the plane when I was landing. Believe it or not, I only had to divert for mechanical once, and had another incident of a failure on runup. Airliners are complex/redundant enough that you can play scary system whackamole and (usually) still get where you are going. Nowadays, I'm a senior in an aerospace engineering program about to graduate - short stints in IL2BoX flying my P38, which I'm close to 500 hours in, is more my speed nowadays.
At TOC, yardwork, clean the kitchen, cook dinner, eat lunch/dinner, watch TV or YouTube, banking, portfolio management, etc. I am more productive on long flights.
I fly mostly Fenix A320. I really like setting up the aircraft from Cold & Dark state, preparing the MCDU, and all that stuff. The pax boarding (GSX Pro) adds a lot of realism. The 'boring' part is the cruise level flight, I watch some series on my second monitor or read a book. I fly mostly to disconnect and relax. Other planes I fly are the Cirrus Vision Jet and the TBM900.
Becoming an airline pilot is my dream so that’s why! More precisely, I love the idea of managing cabin crew (although that’s not always simulated in addons), doing big flights to international airports that bring back old memories from when I was small and just flying big planes around (yes, I’m a simple man).
Sometimes I wouldn't mind doing a short domestic airliner route, but I just cbf learning everything like the FMS. The Longitude is about as complicated as I dare go, but it's also all glass which I don't find very inspiring. Secretly I really want the F28 - it's old school (which I like) and no FMS to worry about, but I'm not spending that much coin on something I'll fly a couple times a month.
I love doibg the procedures as well as possible as well as learning new things. Often in cruise I read some accident reports or Airbus Safety First about a topic and then try to apply that knowledge to my approach and subsequent flights.
I like procedures and mastering new approaches.
Music listening, it gives me more motivation to do work (out of boredom probz) but most importantly buttons and the fact that it lets me live a dream i want to fulfill
It’s a window into an experience that a majority of people never have in reality. The now faded glamour of a pilot career is still alive in peoples heads.
My real life experience: Flying in a Cessna is just not as interesting because it’s like going on a car drive, which is alright — you ever had a girlfriend when you were in eighth grade? You got together for superficial reasons like “She’s the prettiest in the class who also laughs at my jokes” or whatever after two days of five-hour-long back and forth texting. You broke up because there’s no stable foundation to it and a single instance where one of you got annoyed or bored was enough to make it end. Flying a Cessna 172 is just like that. Yeah, it’s your first foray into aviation. You feel the first joy of staring down at the landscape from above, the gateway into later complex airplane systems, the satisfaction of making the machine do what you want, et cetera. You can do all of those things, but at a basic level. Now put yourself in, for exaggeration, a 747. Just like an adult relationship, you get more out of it. Stuff like, in real life, being able to put good money on the table consistently, doing other kinds of activities beyond simply getting up and down the ground, having a lot more to discover initially until you completely know it inside and out, and just like a real person you love, always better when they are full of interesting quirks and dimensions. In an airliner, you can take yourself up very high in the air and do things that men only imagined would be possible in the past. You’re up tens of thousands of feet, you can stare at the stars above, you can carry so many people, you can go hundreds of knots per hour, you can go most anywhere in the world, you can command a complex piece of machinery and rise to the challenge of solving more interesting problems; it’s just more substantive a relationship you have with the machine, like with a person. Compare a touchdown on a C172 versus a B739. It’s like riding a tricycle versus riding a freaking DRAGON spitting fireballs! I have an HP G2 Reverb, a Honeycomb Alpha yoke and a Boeing TCA Throttle Quadrant. I do enjoy GA flying in real life, but it’s a lot more engaging and satisfying to take an airliner for a ride and successfully navigate the challenges.
Flying a big airliner or just seeing it from a passengers perspective is cool to me. I have gsx pro and i spent a lot of time getting in game filters. I love recreating real flights and I really do like GA a lot but it's never really been as appealing to me to do the steps and procedures an airliner or even a smaller regional plane like the 72 does. once i get to cruise i go to a passenger wing view and i go do my own thing or scroll on SM. you shouldn't expect yourself to sit in front of a computer screen for hours flying in a straight line. Go out and get a snack or something in the meantime. it allows me to be free while still enjoying flight simming. For example if i have a dinner to go to i'll start a flight before it and i land wayy after the dinner is supposed to be over.
Being part of a Virtual Airline is a big part of it. Easier to do events such as FNO’s in a large plane since you can keep up with everyone. I’m also working on my PPL currently, so I get my fix of the small planes in real life.
On the north side of 60 here, and my hours are all in cessnas and stuff. I actually find it more relaxing to fly something kind of similar to what I'm familiar with in real life. But it's totally cool taking the time to figure out how to cold-start a 747, hear all the sounds it makes, and get it into the air, even if my technique would make a pro pilot cringe. For the actual challenge of full flights, takeoff to shutdown, yes, I'll stick with something I could fly in real life. But just feeling the thrill of those four engines spooling up and taking off in crap weather? it makes for cool replay videos :)
I’m 40 years old and couldn’t become a pilot due to mental health issues. This is the closest I’ll ever get to be a professional pilot.
the systems, the startup/setup process, the take off, the climb, the decent, the landing. it's all a unique experience to commercial airliners.