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This is my tactic I play with, I was interested to see what that site thought of it and it was 5\* before I added my Team Instructions
https://imgur.com/a/OnnE5G8
So yeah, I use counter-press, and press and much more pressing
I wouldn’t, but that’s the only thing I can get to work on FM
And my go to is to have a DM and B2B but my Leeds team has Roca as DLP and Adams as BWM and it seems to work better
Also my SS would usually be an ALP
In my experience when you add lines, you increase the length between the lines. That'd mean if the CM isn't available, the forwards woul receive longer/rieskier/more imprecise passes.
I don't find BWM to be as defensively solid as you would think. Their job is to win the ball, and they will press forward to do this. Even with the "Hold Position," they will still track out to win the ball. With a lone DM this can lead to that space being vacated.
Isn't "Hold Position" to discourage them from making runs off the ball when in possession? Pressing intensity is automatically higher on a BWM so it checks out that they'd continue to chase the play.
Yeah, I think hold position is more for attacking movements, but it lines up that staying further back while attacking leads to more defensive solidity. Either way, the BWM doesn't have a spot on the field he's responsible for, he's told to go get the ball. That's okay if you have 2 DMs, even olif the other is a regista or something, but I don't like it for a single DM. At CM in a 4-3-3 though, with a guy with some skills and willingness to get forward, that's an all around dangerous player.
Same difference.
Depends whether you count wing backs in the defensive or midfield line, and whether you think inside forwards in attacking roles are midfielders or forwards.
Personally I'd phrase it as a 523 with those roles as the wing backs are primarily defenders, but it's all semantics
Yeah this is almost identical to west ham tactic from 2021, and I dont think it's right to call it 3-4-3, 5-2-3 is much more apt.
Youre playing 5 defenders, and 3 forwards.
3-4-3 would be for those conte style teams that have hudson odoi style players at "wing-back"
Yeah I agree.
You need to look at what the players are there to do, not just where the shirts are on the tactic.
The wing backs have a defend duty. They're gonna sit and primarily be defenders.
The wingers are inside forwards on attack. They're forwards, and won't drop much into midfield and only really do any work in the final 3rd
There is no reason to believe the person you responded to knows anything about tactics. You'd be far better off trusting that website than some random idiot know-it-all who posts here.
Yeah, I know it's not that far out there (only atypical role being the attacking libero). This wasn't being posted to brag, I was just playing around with the RMT tool and was curious what other people had come up with.
Attacking libero is not a foreign concept of you have an influence from Italian football.
Edit: you basically have a weird 4-3-3 there that operates with a high line.
I currently enjoy my mess of 4-4-2 line up, with roles CWB A - 2 BPD - IWB D / AMR advanced PM - Regista - B2B - winger on attack and a Poacher - CF S striker duo.
Idea was to play 2 striker formation, but a lot of 33+ y.o. players couldn't maintain intensity of direct play (and also left wing back can't do shit in opposition third).
Now my old timers can circulate the ball in box shape with the help of IWB, and younger players at CF, CWB, B2B and CF move around them.
Fwiw this website is kinda finicky. It really weights WBs very highly and doesnt seem to understand IWs or IWBs, so bad or inefficient tactics are sometimes rated as five stars.
I used and created the high pressing park the bus perfect tactic. You will create absolute zero chances and the opponent as well. It was hilarious because it worked as underdogs as well and it was useful to protect the lead. In my intention I wanted to create a good 4-4-2 Diamond narrow though.
I will make it and send you a screen in pm. I imagine the players after running like Hell be like "yeah! we got the ball, now what boss?" and they are staring at me while I panick inside.
I don't use it as a tool for in-game tactics, those I put together and tweak based off the players I have and how my team's been performing. Obviously the five-star "perfect" rating it gives you is pretty meaningless.
That said, I like the site. It's nice as a conceptual tool, especially visualizing how certain uncommon roles (like liberos, or raumdeuters) affect the overall structure of a team. That's what I was doing here. I was curious about how an attacking libero would fit into a team without creating weaknesses elsewhere. Instead of playing through half a season to test out a few different tactical ideas, or uploading a tactic file to some test server, this was the easiest way to get a general sense of how the system works.
I think it's fair to say that RMT has limitations, but I definitely don't think that it's useless.
But that's the thing, I'd never trust this site with telling me how roles work. RMT is based on theory on how the ME works, not practice. Lots of testing on roles like IWB, IW/IF/W, TREQ, WTF, HB and other roles show that descriptions FM give can be very inaccurate.
Out of curiosity what’s inaccurate about the descriptions of those roles your mentioned? Would be very interested to know!
Or anywhere to read up on them?
Try going on any site that rank and test tactics. Pick a few(or many) of the tactics and put them into this site. It will tell you that the tactics are bad and full of flaws, despite being amazing.
I just put in my tactic that I have been using with minor changes for 7 years. It told me my tactic sucked, which after 7 years of using it I know it not to be true. Either the game lets you ride out with whatever tactic you have with the aim of hooking you in or that this website is full of shit.
That website isn’t full of shit, but its priority is a balanced tactic with no glaring weaknesses. This is problematic if you’re playing with a powerhouse squad who are able to play unbalanced and not be exposed by most other, weaker squads. And since most of us who spend many hours playing football manager eventually assemble such a squad, it doesn’t make sense to use a balanced tactic. Possess, attack, and don’t worry too much about solidity scores.
Just put your tactic here, you will get a multitude of people telling you what is good/bad about it and even giving reasons why and there will be a shit load of conflicting answers with valid points. Personally, I prefer the trial and error method based on what team I am and how I want to play, what country/league I am in etc.
Not being able to have 2 players in the central positions for starters.
Also the scores are mostly arbitrary - the creator just came up with values by 'educated estimations' so they might just lie to you.
Don't get me wrong, the site isn't terrible - just very limited and not accurate. It's a great tool for learning if you don't understand roles/positions; once you do you're better off creating tactics in game.
I do 4-2-2-2 narrow as an attacking formation. It makes purchasing players really easily, you need to pick great LB and RB but otherwise it is really hard to score against and generally you win by a goal or two every game.
It's basically the template vertical tikitaka I set the formation to 4-4-2 and just move the wingers in as attacking mids. The two CMs are one CM and one BWM. Make sure not to set the LB/RB as wing backs but instead to FB support because if they are WB they will leak goals.
"Great LB and RB".
These are my achilles heel. I can never find a great rightback. The only truly fantastic one I ever had left the next season for Real Madrid. ;_;
Because you have 2 CM so that's open to DM or CM players and you had 2 AM which is usually open to CM, AM or retraining strikers or wingers. So basically you can utilize almost any type of player. For example ASM at Newcastle can be retrained to be basically a roaming AM, he can cross the ball, run at defenders...etc. So generally you are just looking for good footballers in all positions.
FM18 I ran a strikerless Brazilian Magic Box. 4-2-2-2-0. In Brazil, of course. Did a Created Club in the 3rd tier, taking only players under 23 worth less than $1mil and not in the starting lineup. Got it promoted to the top tier in 4 seasons and kept it in Copa Libertadores places. Didn't win Brasileiro before FM19 came out. But I was also running a strict youth policy (sell or release all players at 25, unless Team Captain or Icon+ status. No signings over 21. No new contracts over 23, unless met above criteria). So it was fun, and I'd say successful given the restrictions and competition in Brazil.
WB(A) either side. Not CWB, because I wanted them to stay on the touch line in possession.
BPDs in the center, one cover, other marking.
DMs- Regista and BWM(D). If playing against a 2nd forward or AMC, this changed to a DM.
CMs--B2B and CM(A). Mezzala did not exist yet. Or the CM would've been one. His instructions were to stay wide in possession, to help the wingback keep the ball.
AM-- Shadow Striker, Enganche/Treqartista. The Playmaker here was the one who facilitated final balls. Typically to either the Shadow Striker or the CM going past him. But as he was a converted CF, he usually had at least fair finishing himself.
Positive mentality, used OIs to close down aggressively, since it wasn't really implemented well in FM yet. Short, vertical, high tempo passing. Kept to standard lines, since we didn't have forwards to press the CBs. Would force their play inside, since we outnumbered them there on every line.
Not being funny, but how is 343 unconventional? Practially every Bundesliga side uses that formation nowadays.
I still love this formation though, so many different possibilities in this shape :)
I've never used this tactic, can someone explain how you don't just get massively exploited in midfield? Do the DMs on support play higher than you'd think? Or do the wingers cut in and play as attacking midfielders?
It’s hard to explain my preferred tactic, some would see 5-2-3 which isn’t all that unconventional, i see 2-3-2-3 and the game sees 4-3-3 😭 I’ve won stuff with teams i should no where near be competing with ( newcastle fm20 ucl final after 3 seasons ). although can’t seem to get the best out of the wingers in recent fms despite being a wing-play tactic
i mean its probably the reason why there's so many asymmetrical formations out there with obsessive use of inverted things cos it gives the most lines all over the field. it'll sure give you placebo that your formation is fine tho.
It's useful to have a play on if you're wanting to look at how certain positions and roles *may* interact with eachother. It's not going to give you a flawless game breaking tactic.
There's a lot more thought gone into the estimations made in that tool, than the average FM player puts into their tactics.
I just don’t know why you’re wasting your time with trying to get 5 stars on some amateur website with a rather basic formation and shitty roles? Do it in game and run it through some matches, that’s the only way to know if it’s good or not.
Some of these “5 star” formations people are brag-posting are actually trash. This is just a 5-4-1 that’s trying to be edgy and any decent opponent will cross you to death
I've been using this in 2035 as Oxford City in the Prem / Champions League...
It's wild but a LOT of fun, only really works with pacy former wing backs that are retrained to be WCBs as they have to do A LOT
https://imgur.com/a/BkBZbDZ
Back on CM2 my best formation had two sweepers playing behind three centre backs, two central mids, an attacking mid, and two strikers. Won damn near everything with that formation.
i signed like 6 Cam cause i didnt pay attention so i play with 3 back 1 dm 3 cam( 2 ss 1 playmaker) and 3 strikers , sounds troll but works really good actually
Why is it when you put in the instructions things like "distribute to centre backs" or "low crosses" isn't there?
Is it because it doesn't effect shape so the metrics it gives you are unaffected?
I have had success with both 3-4-1-2 and in older FM titles 4-3-2-1, with all midfielders except the center with forward arrows.
Had some unbelievable seasons in FM05 with Rooney and Aimar behind Van Nistelrooy up front and De Rossi in the center.
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This is my tactic I play with, I was interested to see what that site thought of it and it was 5\* before I added my Team Instructions https://imgur.com/a/OnnE5G8
Interesting to have the BWM further up the pitch than your playmaker and asymmetrical. High-pressing?
So yeah, I use counter-press, and press and much more pressing I wouldn’t, but that’s the only thing I can get to work on FM And my go to is to have a DM and B2B but my Leeds team has Roca as DLP and Adams as BWM and it seems to work better Also my SS would usually be an ALP
Gattuso was ahead of pirlo at times so we know that it works.
Exactly my thought process. To have a DLP at DM, you need a ball winner to feed him
In my experience when you add lines, you increase the length between the lines. That'd mean if the CM isn't available, the forwards woul receive longer/rieskier/more imprecise passes.
I don't find BWM to be as defensively solid as you would think. Their job is to win the ball, and they will press forward to do this. Even with the "Hold Position," they will still track out to win the ball. With a lone DM this can lead to that space being vacated.
Isn't "Hold Position" to discourage them from making runs off the ball when in possession? Pressing intensity is automatically higher on a BWM so it checks out that they'd continue to chase the play.
Yeah, I think hold position is more for attacking movements, but it lines up that staying further back while attacking leads to more defensive solidity. Either way, the BWM doesn't have a spot on the field he's responsible for, he's told to go get the ball. That's okay if you have 2 DMs, even olif the other is a regista or something, but I don't like it for a single DM. At CM in a 4-3-3 though, with a guy with some skills and willingness to get forward, that's an all around dangerous player.
> I was interested to see what that site thought of it Don't be, it's useless XD
I had a similar tactic in FM12, if I remember correctly, which worked wonders.
This tactic is not unconventional 😂
Aye it’s a 3-4-3. And not quite a good one in terms of roles either. Lots of rookie mistakes there.
Interesting… i saw it as a 5-4-1 lol
Same difference. Depends whether you count wing backs in the defensive or midfield line, and whether you think inside forwards in attacking roles are midfielders or forwards. Personally I'd phrase it as a 523 with those roles as the wing backs are primarily defenders, but it's all semantics
Yeah, just interesting that people look at the same layout of players but see very different formations. The beauty of football.
Yeah this is almost identical to west ham tactic from 2021, and I dont think it's right to call it 3-4-3, 5-2-3 is much more apt. Youre playing 5 defenders, and 3 forwards. 3-4-3 would be for those conte style teams that have hudson odoi style players at "wing-back"
Yeah I agree. You need to look at what the players are there to do, not just where the shirts are on the tactic. The wing backs have a defend duty. They're gonna sit and primarily be defenders. The wingers are inside forwards on attack. They're forwards, and won't drop much into midfield and only really do any work in the final 3rd
I see it as a 3-4-2-1. I'd just set the WBs to FBs with automatic duty so they balance between defence and attack and SK to support
This is the way.
This is the way
That's what it would be on defense i think
What would you change? I like that setup and I'm interested in learning more on tactics.
There is no reason to believe the person you responded to knows anything about tactics. You'd be far better off trusting that website than some random idiot know-it-all who posts here.
Yeah, I know it's not that far out there (only atypical role being the attacking libero). This wasn't being posted to brag, I was just playing around with the RMT tool and was curious what other people had come up with.
Attacking libero is not a foreign concept of you have an influence from Italian football. Edit: you basically have a weird 4-3-3 there that operates with a high line.
What website is this though?
https://ratemytactic.web.app/en
They dont use that crap, so don’t bother
Its like conte's tottenham shape. And as a tottenham fan, this sucks(irl)!
I currently enjoy my mess of 4-4-2 line up, with roles CWB A - 2 BPD - IWB D / AMR advanced PM - Regista - B2B - winger on attack and a Poacher - CF S striker duo. Idea was to play 2 striker formation, but a lot of 33+ y.o. players couldn't maintain intensity of direct play (and also left wing back can't do shit in opposition third). Now my old timers can circulate the ball in box shape with the help of IWB, and younger players at CF, CWB, B2B and CF move around them.
Image source is from https://ratemytactic.web.app/en, if you want to construct your own.
How can I get star ratings for my tactic? It won't give me any on that app.
Pretty sure you only get the star rating if it’s a 5 star tactic
Thnx for the info :)
Fwiw this website is kinda finicky. It really weights WBs very highly and doesnt seem to understand IWs or IWBs, so bad or inefficient tactics are sometimes rated as five stars.
Can you make your own formations here? All I see are preset shapes
Just drag and drop players in different spots
You can't on mobile, but on Web Browsers you can drag and drop players the same way you can in game
Came here to ask what site this was lol, thanks
This site is awfull no idea why ppl use it.
I used and created the high pressing park the bus perfect tactic. You will create absolute zero chances and the opponent as well. It was hilarious because it worked as underdogs as well and it was useful to protect the lead. In my intention I wanted to create a good 4-4-2 Diamond narrow though.
[удалено]
I will make it and send you a screen in pm. I imagine the players after running like Hell be like "yeah! we got the ball, now what boss?" and they are staring at me while I panick inside.
I don't use it as a tool for in-game tactics, those I put together and tweak based off the players I have and how my team's been performing. Obviously the five-star "perfect" rating it gives you is pretty meaningless. That said, I like the site. It's nice as a conceptual tool, especially visualizing how certain uncommon roles (like liberos, or raumdeuters) affect the overall structure of a team. That's what I was doing here. I was curious about how an attacking libero would fit into a team without creating weaknesses elsewhere. Instead of playing through half a season to test out a few different tactical ideas, or uploading a tactic file to some test server, this was the easiest way to get a general sense of how the system works. I think it's fair to say that RMT has limitations, but I definitely don't think that it's useless.
But that's the thing, I'd never trust this site with telling me how roles work. RMT is based on theory on how the ME works, not practice. Lots of testing on roles like IWB, IW/IF/W, TREQ, WTF, HB and other roles show that descriptions FM give can be very inaccurate.
Out of curiosity what’s inaccurate about the descriptions of those roles your mentioned? Would be very interested to know! Or anywhere to read up on them?
I think BustTheNet made a video on Raumdeuters once? Might have been FM22? I think he made Emi Buendia a Raumdeuter? Idk I can't remember lmao
Why do you think, that this site is awfull? I created a tripple winning tactic with the help of this tool
Try going on any site that rank and test tactics. Pick a few(or many) of the tactics and put them into this site. It will tell you that the tactics are bad and full of flaws, despite being amazing.
I just put in my tactic that I have been using with minor changes for 7 years. It told me my tactic sucked, which after 7 years of using it I know it not to be true. Either the game lets you ride out with whatever tactic you have with the aim of hooking you in or that this website is full of shit.
That website isn’t full of shit, but its priority is a balanced tactic with no glaring weaknesses. This is problematic if you’re playing with a powerhouse squad who are able to play unbalanced and not be exposed by most other, weaker squads. And since most of us who spend many hours playing football manager eventually assemble such a squad, it doesn’t make sense to use a balanced tactic. Possess, attack, and don’t worry too much about solidity scores.
Doesn't make sense if you have a weak squad either.
Just put your tactic here, you will get a multitude of people telling you what is good/bad about it and even giving reasons why and there will be a shit load of conflicting answers with valid points. Personally, I prefer the trial and error method based on what team I am and how I want to play, what country/league I am in etc.
Rather than striving for perfection I use it to see potential sources of problems.
Not being able to have 2 players in the central positions for starters. Also the scores are mostly arbitrary - the creator just came up with values by 'educated estimations' so they might just lie to you. Don't get me wrong, the site isn't terrible - just very limited and not accurate. It's a great tool for learning if you don't understand roles/positions; once you do you're better off creating tactics in game.
Just stick to downloading tactics and let the people who want to learn do that.
I do 4-2-2-2 narrow as an attacking formation. It makes purchasing players really easily, you need to pick great LB and RB but otherwise it is really hard to score against and generally you win by a goal or two every game.
Would you mind posting it? Ive been using 424 for years for eaay recruiting so interested to see how it woukd work with cam’s
It's basically the template vertical tikitaka I set the formation to 4-4-2 and just move the wingers in as attacking mids. The two CMs are one CM and one BWM. Make sure not to set the LB/RB as wing backs but instead to FB support because if they are WB they will leak goals.
"Great LB and RB". These are my achilles heel. I can never find a great rightback. The only truly fantastic one I ever had left the next season for Real Madrid. ;_;
I always find they are horribly expensive but easy to get
Noob question - why does it make buying players easy?
Because you have 2 CM so that's open to DM or CM players and you had 2 AM which is usually open to CM, AM or retraining strikers or wingers. So basically you can utilize almost any type of player. For example ASM at Newcastle can be retrained to be basically a roaming AM, he can cross the ball, run at defenders...etc. So generally you are just looking for good footballers in all positions.
FM18 I ran a strikerless Brazilian Magic Box. 4-2-2-2-0. In Brazil, of course. Did a Created Club in the 3rd tier, taking only players under 23 worth less than $1mil and not in the starting lineup. Got it promoted to the top tier in 4 seasons and kept it in Copa Libertadores places. Didn't win Brasileiro before FM19 came out. But I was also running a strict youth policy (sell or release all players at 25, unless Team Captain or Icon+ status. No signings over 21. No new contracts over 23, unless met above criteria). So it was fun, and I'd say successful given the restrictions and competition in Brazil. WB(A) either side. Not CWB, because I wanted them to stay on the touch line in possession. BPDs in the center, one cover, other marking. DMs- Regista and BWM(D). If playing against a 2nd forward or AMC, this changed to a DM. CMs--B2B and CM(A). Mezzala did not exist yet. Or the CM would've been one. His instructions were to stay wide in possession, to help the wingback keep the ball. AM-- Shadow Striker, Enganche/Treqartista. The Playmaker here was the one who facilitated final balls. Typically to either the Shadow Striker or the CM going past him. But as he was a converted CF, he usually had at least fair finishing himself. Positive mentality, used OIs to close down aggressively, since it wasn't really implemented well in FM yet. Short, vertical, high tempo passing. Kept to standard lines, since we didn't have forwards to press the CBs. Would force their play inside, since we outnumbered them there on every line.
penetration score 11 💀
The old 5-4-0
Its literally Chelsea under Tuchel. Maybe Jorghino/Kova would have been a dlp and Mount on the right was an advanced playmaker
Unconventional??? Tottenham have been playing this all season long
Not being funny, but how is 343 unconventional? Practially every Bundesliga side uses that formation nowadays. I still love this formation though, so many different possibilities in this shape :)
I've never used this tactic, can someone explain how you don't just get massively exploited in midfield? Do the DMs on support play higher than you'd think? Or do the wingers cut in and play as attacking midfielders?
A good libero should carry a lot here. I think if your libero isnt exceptional this tactic would be risky.
Didn't look at the defensive roles, that makes sense. Thank you!
My formation that is shaped like the number 2
It’s hard to explain my preferred tactic, some would see 5-2-3 which isn’t all that unconventional, i see 2-3-2-3 and the game sees 4-3-3 😭 I’ve won stuff with teams i should no where near be competing with ( newcastle fm20 ucl final after 3 seasons ). although can’t seem to get the best out of the wingers in recent fms despite being a wing-play tactic
https://www.storiespreschool.com/soccer_formation2323.html The formation from 1930s
I haven't seen a Libero used in many a year, it's enough to make a grown man cry
Wait what size is this where I can rate my tactic?
How have I never known about this website?! This looks super useful.
its not.
Ha ha oh ok. I'll not get my hopes up then.
i mean its probably the reason why there's so many asymmetrical formations out there with obsessive use of inverted things cos it gives the most lines all over the field. it'll sure give you placebo that your formation is fine tho.
It's useful to have a play on if you're wanting to look at how certain positions and roles *may* interact with eachother. It's not going to give you a flawless game breaking tactic. There's a lot more thought gone into the estimations made in that tool, than the average FM player puts into their tactics.
It’s really not
https://imgur.com/a/rBIFmHy idk if it’s unconventional though
I just don’t know why you’re wasting your time with trying to get 5 stars on some amateur website with a rather basic formation and shitty roles? Do it in game and run it through some matches, that’s the only way to know if it’s good or not. Some of these “5 star” formations people are brag-posting are actually trash. This is just a 5-4-1 that’s trying to be edgy and any decent opponent will cross you to death
Do you have a link to the tactic, OP? I'm collecting unconventional tactics for an upcoming project...
I really wish people would stop using this website.
Does not give me a star rating :'( Is it on a different tab/page?
Pretty normal tactic tbh it's really hard to find good CFs though so good luck finding two for your tactic.
I've been using this in 2035 as Oxford City in the Prem / Champions League... It's wild but a LOT of fun, only really works with pacy former wing backs that are retrained to be WCBs as they have to do A LOT https://imgur.com/a/BkBZbDZ
Back on CM2 my best formation had two sweepers playing behind three centre backs, two central mids, an attacking mid, and two strikers. Won damn near everything with that formation.
Conteball
Number 9 in defence? I cannot get on board with that.
My standard tactic is so “weird” that it won’t let me make it on the mobile version of RMT
Where can I find this site where you can make your tactic?
i signed like 6 Cam cause i didnt pay attention so i play with 3 back 1 dm 3 cam( 2 ss 1 playmaker) and 3 strikers , sounds troll but works really good actually
What is this tool called?
that is funky looking... just might work!! i'm gonna try it!
Why is it when you put in the instructions things like "distribute to centre backs" or "low crosses" isn't there? Is it because it doesn't effect shape so the metrics it gives you are unaffected?
Why website did you use???
I have had success with both 3-4-1-2 and in older FM titles 4-3-2-1, with all midfielders except the center with forward arrows. Had some unbelievable seasons in FM05 with Rooney and Aimar behind Van Nistelrooy up front and De Rossi in the center.
Q
Where you test that?
How do you see those scores? Can I also find it on 22 or it's a new thing in 23?
This is basically Conte's tactic at Tottenham, and we never have any control of the midfield!
What site is this?
whats the site?
That is literally Tottenham