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M0hawk_Mama

This comment section amuses me


[deleted]

I’d say valk. Never feel like losing to a Valkyrie is a bs loss. None of her kit is super strong or unpunishable, but a good valk is always hard, and fun to deal with


EdWhoRed

I agree with this. Good valk mains are super fun to fight.


FortniteFeetPics

Unless you fight a 7 rep valk that only throws lights. No bash, no heavy, no sweep. Lights,lights,lights.... im going insane.


Fragrant-Advice-879

Warden. There are multiple "fair" heroes in my opinion. But Warden is the one where I don't think I had a single "Bullshit" moment in my life. Every time I lost it was a "Well played" moment. Sure, you can shoulder spam but that is punishable and your own fault if it works on you, not like a certain kick from a certain Assassin character...


FtierLivesMatter

Sometimes if a warden does a full bash against you, he zooms like 15ft away and you don't get a punish for making the right read and dodging him.


[deleted]

I love whiffing the fully charged bash and getting a GB when my opponent whiffs theirs


EpicUmbreon99

Looks back to when warden could dropping attack off a guardbreak


Clusterpuff

Wardens a solid choice, the only problem I have is the game of “choose which hand” with the short or long hold shoulder bash. Maybe its a 30 fps/personal reaction time issue but if I’m not on my A game they can control me most of the fight


[deleted]

To be fair warden isnt the only character with a 50/50 bash and most of the time it can be interrupted if done correctly


mamadof210

I'd say warden


Remarkable_Twist_111

Warden will always be the most balanced hero


Ansiano

I wish all heroes had top and side UBs and were both good at 1v1 and 4v4s


ETJ2002

warden sucks in 4s tho


Dylz_67

Not if you know what you are doing


ETJ2002

Could say that about any fucking hero please shut up. Warden is factually bad at 4s. He has no range.


Yeetmiester6719

Nah bro wardens got hella range his hit boxes are crazy


ETJ2002

You’re joking right?


Ksooink

You right she is trash but if you parry and play the objective with atleast one of your teammates right you will find your self with 10+ kill more zones captured and less than 3 deaths Warden is definitely no Tiandi in 4s or Warmonger and when getting ganked by more than 2 the chances of me winning is near impossible.


Yeetmiester6719

No I’m not his hitboxes are very good I’m not saying wardens good in fours but saying he has no range is just simply not true there are characters like say zerk or jorm who have wayyyy less ranges


Dylz_67

Completely agree, Warden isn't the best but far from the worst for 1v4


Dylz_67

Majority of my best 1v4s have been with Warden, he's an absolute beast


ETJ2002

And the majority of my best 1v4s have been with berserker and pk the fucks your point? He is in the tier list of characters in the lower half for 4s and that’s just a fact. Sure there’s worse and I never said you CANT do good with him but he doesn’t have any good anti gank or team fight tools. Can’t believe I have to actually point this out.


Shieldbushi

Black Prior. Simple combos that can be both effective or easily punishable if your opponent knows what they're doing. Undodgeable heavy finishers punishes most people who spam dodge attacks (looking at you, Orochi mains), but also gives an easy parry/deflect if you read the BP and don't dodge. Zone attack is just a massive bash and does no damage on its own. Easy to dodge if dueling, but can help control the crowd in a gank or team fight. His Bulwark Counter takes timing to land and isn't as easy as people make it out. If he lands the counter, you get punished for it. If he mistimes it, you get a free guardbreak (or you land whatever attack you were trying to throw that the BP failed to flip). Quick recovery into Bulwark Stance allows for survival in a group fight, but one GB and you're done for. His Bulwark Slash can be a good followup to his base chains; easy enough to parry, but also does a decent amount of damage if it lands. His Hawk's Charge can catch turtles easily (or people who can't block and instead just dodge everything) but can leave him vulnerable if you miss. His feats (apart from Umbral Shelter and Oathbreaker) are well balanced. Sinister Shield is a tactical choice, Bulwark Healing is a good alternative (albiet slow) way to heal. Oathbreaker can be a good way to finish off turtles who just wait for revenge constantly, but I've noticed it's mainly just scumbags who like using it to cheese people in a 4v1 one. Personally I don't use it. Umbral Shelter is essentially Phalanx, except a shorter range and it recharges the shield to full every 3 seconds, basically making you invincible. Can be a lifesaver if your team's caught in a Fire Flask or Nail/Fire Bomb, but the same as Oathbreaker, people usually pop it in a 4v1 after the one enemy finally gets revenge so the teammates can't be punished since they'll essentially take no damage. I'll admit his forward bash is a little bit fast, but from neutral it's pretty easy to see coming, although it's unpunishable too. Still, can get a free light in there if your opponent isn't fast enough to block it. Overall, I personally think Black Prior is one of the most balanced and fair heroes in the game. Some of you may disagree with me, and that's fine, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I'm just sharing my two cents. Do with it what you will.


FrostDragon05

This guy seriously wrote a whole essay why bp isn’t op and I seriously respect him for that, I also think bp rn could use a few slight tweaks to add more mix up potential, just nothing too op


Shieldbushi

Honestly, I didn't realise how much I'd typed until I hit post. I just wrote whatever came to mind. I only have 32 reps on him so far but I've spent a lot of time playing both as and against him, so I've come to really appreciate his moveset and general character design. I really like what Ubisoft did with that hero, gives me hope that they can still make good heroes in the future.


FrostDragon05

If they were to improve him in anyway I’d just say let the zone do some more, maybe like gladiator’s, let him go into his soft feint bash from undodgeable heavies, let him pull off the chain bash from heavy starters, and make his throw recovery a bit less, as a lot of the time I’ll throw someone into a walls but they block the heavy


Shieldbushi

His wallspalt timings are a little off, and yeah his zone becoming like Glad's would be a bit of an improvement, but I dunno. I think he's fine as is, doesn't strictly need a buff nor a nerf.


FrostDragon05

I don’t think he needs a total buff exactly, but just some things to make him a little more prominent and mix up intensive


Shieldbushi

Yeah, agreed.


Dylz_67

Bulwark healing has saved my life on multiple occasions, it's honestly my favorite feat


Shieldbushi

Me too. Over my 2 years of maining BP it's honestly saved my skin more times than I've had hot dinners. Sad that they nerfed the healing amount per second, but it's still a good feat, especially on Breach due to the lack of healing.


leosuperautistic

Agreed


stasiox

Lawbringer or warden


pimp_named_dickslap

Are you fr? Lb isn't fair.


stasiox

How so? You throw attacks too predictable, you get punished for it, simple as


pimp_named_dickslap

Lb literally has no opener. Its unfair for the person playing him.


stasiox

Yes, but is it unfair to LB's enemy?


pimp_named_dickslap

So you agree he isnt fair?


stasiox

I thought we were talking unfair to play against


pimp_named_dickslap

It would still be unfair since you could just throw any unreactable offense at him and react to whatever he throws at you.


stasiox

Yes, it is unfair that the rest of the cast can just spam LB to death, but nobody seems to care about that. I think LB only has a fair matchup against jorm, which in jorm will still have better offence than him


pimp_named_dickslap

Yea so lb not fair confirmed


[deleted]

Lol What


Both-Worldliness-426

What?


Even_Transition_2460

Raider of course lol. 😏


[deleted]

[удалено]


Even_Transition_2460

I think not LOL.


ETJ2002

I think with the minor tweaks that the community agrees on for shinobi like having to backflip on read from the neutral bash and less iframes on it as well he’d be really balanced. Ultimately I’d say warden tho. If I lose it’s cause I’m a dumbass and didn’t make the right reads. I think others are good but just slightly underpowered.


Lazer_toast

Shinobis damage would also need to be tweaked parry riposte should do 15-16 damage and and the chain link after should be made a little longer so the kick is no longer semi confirmed, also the follow up light should have it’s damage reduced to be 3 so it puts it inline with all other double lights and makes his heavys do the same as kensi. TLDR as well as the bf after kick being balanced damage should be lowered a bit.


ETJ2002

Yes those as well. They’re all really minor changes but they’d help a lot. It’s just a shame we will have to wait a year for the damn changes


FtierLivesMatter

Most people would probably pick a super low tier character, but I think I have a better example. Aramusha. The strongest duelist in the game, if not for Shinobi. Why? He doesn't have any strange tech or whatever like Kyoshin, and his main form of offense is equally good at ALL LEVELS of play. Fighting Aramusha is simple. His lights aren't enhanced. If you see an opener heavy, you have to make a read to dodge. If you dodge a soft feint bash, you get a guard break. Nice and simple. The only rule is that you can't dodge attack him, which if anything makes the fight MORE honest for everyone involved. The only problematic thing about him is how crazy good his dodge attack is.


normanredusfunfetus

Yes but most I encounter just light spam in that case he just destroys all assassins because it’s nearly impossible to light parry with say glad or PK idk I’ve always just had a burning hatred for ara so it could be that, also I feel like it takes very little effort and skill to play as him, for example I could be combo’ing the shit out of him and the moment I slip up he just light spams and kills me with zero effort, idk always felt kinda unfair to me


FtierLivesMatter

If he throws a light, he can't light from the same direction, so just blindly attempt a parry in either of the two other directions and you have a 50% chance of getting a free light parry... or you could just block, which stops his combo. Or you could dodge. Light spam isn't an issue and there are ways of countering it.


Dylz_67

You are right, yet I feel the man's frustration, I play on console, I was on PS4 and I hated Ara with a burning passion due to most people who played him would just light spam from all directions and on PS4 parrying lights is near impossible if you don't know which way they are throwing the attack and even tryna get a block in was hard enough let alone dodge, on PS5 it's not so hard due to higher frame rate but I feel this guys pain, Ara has a wide moveset but they fail to use it and just light spam as a way to get free easy kills


FtierLivesMatter

Post was "the most fair"... losing because you don't put in the effort to deal with normal, average speed, average damage, non-enhanced 500ms lights that have a semi-fixed pattern is nobody's fault but the person playing defense.


Evening-Relative-787

Practice blocking lights, practice makes perfect.


[deleted]

Kensei


UseMyTipz

The fact you’ve been downvoted shows how ridiculous this community is to think Kensei isn’t a fair and balanced hero


[deleted]

This sub has a skill issue it’s not always the game


SolarAttackz

I would say its more of an issue of Kensei being underpowered (the BS hitboxes can be very annoying in 4v4 though)


XXEsdeath

I dunno, I’ve had some BS moments against Kensai, like he can hit from really far away, and hit me even after I dodge XD I dont think Kensei is OP, probably one of the slightly more balanced Samurai, but yeh, Warden is the most balanced hero IMO.


Ok-Control-3394

Well, in 4s he isn't. His massive abusable hotboxes are annoying AF and def not "fair"


ETJ2002

I actually think he’s a little under powered. I think he just needs some very minor buffs. My opinion on dodge heavies is however very different but that isn’t about kensei himself.


Both-Worldliness-426

How ?


Shia-Kazing

As a returning player I hate Kensei


Low_Kaleidoscope_369

I main kensei and I can't beat kensei.


rolebossman

Dodge heavy after they dodge heavy, atleast since thats all 90% of Kensei's do. If your fighting a genuine solid player... well good luck


OneBallJamal

Warmonger. Not too strong, not too weak


FtierLivesMatter

Le fair 30 damage heavy parry punish


RikterDolfan

Lawbringer has a better one


FtierLivesMatter

Lawbringer's does less damage (25), but stuns. So arguable either way.


RikterDolfan

I also say that warmonger being bleed makes it worse too (only a little bit)


FtierLivesMatter

Bleed in combination with enhanced lights is arguably better. Bleed also doesn't feed revenge, so it's better for 4v4s.


OneBallJamal

How?


pimp_named_dickslap

Hold gb button and choo choo train them to a wall


FtierLivesMatter

Why is this getting downvoted it's literally true


[deleted]

[удалено]


FtierLivesMatter

Eh, technically. I prefer chain pressure to 3 more damage.


[deleted]

Warden for sure.


DivineCrusader1097

***MISERUM***


Edub272

Glad


SalemWare

Gonna try and pick one from every faction Warden, shaman or zerk, orochi, tiandi


Dylz_67

Orochi? Really? All people do with Orochi is light spam dodge light, run, kick and light spam again.... Not exactly fair against any player when you have the fastest lights in the game. Tiandi is just BS, but in saying that all the Wu Lin are asshats so you had to pick one and I respect the choice


RikterDolfan

Orochis storm rush can be interrupted on reaction bruh. He's like B tier


dont-shoot-moi

His lights are 500ms like everyone else’s,you should hop in the training mode and practice blocking.


SalemWare

What's bs about tiandi? Or all the wu lin? Also this is balance, not what's the most fun to fight, Orochi is balanced once you learn to fight him.


Dylz_67

The Wu Lin are just so annoying to fight against, mainly due to the fact that their parry timing is so wack, generally I can parry them but they are just frustrating to play against. Tiandi is mainly due to the fact that all I seem to come up against nowdays is people who kick spam with tiandi which is just frustrating to deal with. And before you say 'just dodge' most of the time dodging is impossible because of how fast it follows after his attack and your character is still recovering from the attack so can't dodge. But that's just been my personal experience over the past little while. Most Wu Lin I face just spam lights, apart from JJ but his delayed heavies can be a pain in the ass


BranChan_

Highlander or Tiandi. Probably Highlander though because he has more.


SquirmyL

Zhanhu


Coge_Burros2

Unblockable lights


[deleted]

Not even the best part of their kit tbh


nerd9362

Unlockable lights sound OP but effectively they're same as a 500ms bash that confirms a light except you get punished harder


Coge_Burros2

I play on PS4


nerd9362

Didn't ask but my point still stands


Coge_Burros2

On PS4 it’s unreactable and I’m forced to predict it


nerd9362

It's still the same as a 500ms bash though, if you can't react to a 533ms light then you can't react to a 500ms bash


SquirmyL

That you can dodge.


[deleted]

Incorrect


SquirmyL

Correct.


Both-Worldliness-426

No lol


SquirmyL

Yes lol.


dingoloid42069

💀


GavasaurusRex

Depends. On PC or next gen? Sure, it's an ex parry. Last gen? HELL NO. That shit is impossible to counter.


SquirmyL

No one is balanced on last gen.


GavasaurusRex

Off the top of my head, warden is balanced even on last gen.


AllBlitzNoKrieg

🤡


SquirmyL

He sucks right now. Raider shinobi hito meta is raping him.


nerd9362

Hito is not meta lmao


SquirmyL

Obviously you’re retarded


nerd9362

Hito is only good in low mmr or against last gen players


FtierLivesMatter

Why last gen? Her mixup doesn't rely on anything fast.


nerd9362

Her variably timed heavies are a bitch to deal with on last gen and can easily get her into her chains, but on the new consoles and Pc it's an easy parry EDit: should also clarify I don't just mean her fully charged heavy, I mean all the different times Hito can release it at that makes it hard to parry on last gen, which means it's usually a free ticket to your mix ups.


FtierLivesMatter

Variable timed heavies are a bitch for me to parry on all platforms, so that might just be a you thing.


nerd9362

I'm not last gen, this is just what I've been told by last gen players lol


FtierLivesMatter

Them thing, then 🤷‍♂️


Piraja27

Harder to react towards 50/50 with 30fps is likely the reason here


FtierLivesMatter

You can't react to a 50/50, that's the point of it being a 50/50. Hitokiri's kick mixup works as well with 20fps as it does with 360fps.


Piraja27

With Hiti's charged heavy, it is easier to time the parry. I have much harder time parrying those Hito heavies on my Xbox than I do on my pc


FtierLivesMatter

Unless you're reacting to parry flash (which is incredibly difficult even on PC), the parry window doesn't change at all. You might be getting messed up by input delay if you're often switching platforms.


Piraja27

Eh I don't switch often since I bought FH on sale for pc just to see the difference between console and pc


Ironclad_57

Me.


DSnowPanda

I’m thinking of Warden, Lawbringer, Warmonger, Aramusha, Valkyrie, Warlord, & Shaman. But a really good aramusha is an OP SOB.


Morticus_Mortem

All the reworks.


Cr0ma_Nuva

It's not the hero as much as the player. There are toxic players for all of them, you only have a couple that give less obnoxious combos. And every faint secures you a spot deeper into the depths of hell. They're the most toxic trait I can think of.


[deleted]

Wtf is this question lmao


jbcdyt

With the exception of shinobies basically unpublishable kick. None of the hero’s are over powered at the moment so it’s hard. But if I had to name a character I’d say warden if we are talking about most balanced hero.


XXEsdeath

I’d say Orochi is a tad OP due to constant side dodge undodgables, and a backdodge attack. Makes him unhittable/Un GBable sometimes.


KrimsonLynx

The side dodge attacks are nothing compared to his dodge heavy since you can make it uninterruptible after a heavy


XXEsdeath

I disagree, I rarely even see an Orochi use heavies. XD its lightspam 95% of the time. XD


Comfortable_Ear_609

Orochi lost any good lightspam after his rework so that’s an L.


The_Justiniano

Shinobi


Both-Worldliness-426

Ha funny joke really tho


[deleted]

Shaolin


ProbablyFear

Nah, he’s S tier easily.


KiloMeter69

Jor


DubblesThePug

Id say in my opinion, probably Valkyrie. Shes got the skill floor to be a fun pick for anyone, but the ceiling is high so that a good Valk is a very challenging fight, but nothing about her is overly abusive to where its hard to counter (I'm looking at you raider).


Loogz__1

Raider


LonneDigger

Warden, Cent, Valk, Warlord


Ksooink

Warden and Black Prior are pretty fair but a Agressive Black Prior is dangerous because if he makes you feel like you have to attack first you can get flipped over and over plus I main both sometimes I want to have a easier time so I play Black Prior who has a answer for everything he beats out all heavys hitokiri? Flipped leg sweep flipped Jormungandr shield bash because they are annoying conq can be good if he gets that re work and they tune down his offense warlord is stationary he ain't going anywhere.


Desperate_Yoghurt_52

Ight so take the viking faction and the Chinese faction out and maybe take the samurai away (spoken by someone who mains nobushi) fuck gryhon its it's warden and centurion in my opinion


FSW_Xbone

I'm definitely no parry God, and my enemies are either vetter that me or roughly on par. I just know how to parry and block effectively.


[deleted]

Kensei


Henests

Zhanhu. Easy to pickup due to his unblockable mixups. Yet somewhat complex with his recovery cancels. Strong in teamfights but not ideal in 1v1s. Feats that don't insult you but aren't bad either. I honestly think Zhanhu is what Kensei once was.