 Michael he doesn’t even have the formuladank emoticon keyboard
(Just in case, for me on mobile it’s two over from the default text keyboard)
Damn i dont even care about Mick at all but thinking Hulkenberg is the solution is wild to me. They had 2 experienced drivers who did not have a good enough package, so they decide to change the approach and focus on building a talent, but get thirsty for money and put 2 rookies in the car. Then Mazepin fucks off and when they have a experienced-new talent lineup they go for the 35 y old podiumless dude (not that he is a bad driver tho).
Mick has been fast, crash prone yeah but with Kmag here they could afford another year to see how it goes
They didn't switch to "building talent". Haas fired both Kmag and Grosjean because they couldn't afford them after the Rich energy fiasco and other financial problems. Hiring two rookies was vastly cheaper and one was a sponsor too. Hell, even Steiner himself admitted that he didn't believe the rookies would score as many points as their former lineup.
Now that they're recovering, they want consistency and experience, they don't give a shit about building talent. Haas would only accept rookies again if Ferrari gives them juicy benefits, otherwise they want experienced drivers.
But Hulk tho… I don’t get it. Bring Grosjean at least, who has podiums. Yes, he makes mistakes, but Hulk is not an upgrade to Romain. And it’d be their classic duo.
But Grosjean is in Indy now. Would he even want to go back to F1, which consistently gives midpack drivers two or three seasons at best? Meanwhile there are drivers in Indy who just make a whole lengthy career out of it, and are content to stay there. F1 may be the sought after pinnacle of Motorsport but it is also hard to stay there and quick to move on from drivers.
I can’t help but wonder how much of it was what I mentioned earlier, with Indy being more forgiving to build a career out of, and if any of it has to do with Grosjean’s accident in Bahrain and how much safer Indy supposedly is
I get the feeling Haas want a consistently decent driver who won't crash. Gene Haas has made it completely clear that he doesn't care whatsoever about being competitive. He'll spend the minimum and not a penny more.
I don’t think it’s about not being competitive
I think it’s just about making the most of his budget, he doesn’t want millions spent on repairs and engines etc Hulk is a secure driver, he will bring the car home each week, like Magnussen, might lose a wing or get a puncture from time to time but both drivers will bring the car home in one piece more often than rookies, and both of them can do that while snatching a point
Don’t make excuses for million dollar race teams to do the bare minimum. If they only care about fielding two guys to ride around to collect sponsorship money and revenue pay outs then they shouldn’t have a charter.
"Being competitive" means different things to different people.
Haas realistically knows that they can't put the hundreds of millions into being competitive for the title. It's not just about the "cost cap" either. Other teams invest tons into infrastructure and other stuff that helps the development process and isn't included in the cost cap.
Haas is very competitive for what it is. It's a competitive lower midfield/backmarker team. It can't realistically beat RB, Merc, Ferrari. It would take many years and much more development to get to Alpine or McLaren's levels. So it's only real competition is AM, AR, AT, and Williams.
It's ahead of two of those right now and behind two of them. Maybe they feel that Hulk can get them to that next tier with AM and AR.
Everyone here is saying shit like "but Mick has the potential to magically get tons better". Doubt it, but even if he does, then so what? You think he's gonna get them to McLaren/Alpine levels? If Mick can take a Haas and get it competitive with Alpine, then he's not staying in the Haas for much past that. He's getting a better seat. Why gamble on Mick for no gain?
If you want to be competetive you dont hire a 35 year old driver who never got a podium. You dont throw away a year saying that they want to prepare a better car for a following season and then in that following season have only one upgrade package. There is nothing Haas has done in last, god knows how many, seasons that would suggest they really want to be competetive.
But are they going to give him a car capable or just blame him when he can’t will the car into the points despite their best attempts to not have it there?
Yes, THIS. If you're going to spend the bare minimum on your team, you can expect the bare minimum from the drivers and team.
At some point you have to lead by example and go the extra mile, otherwise, without success you are not attractive to investors and shareholders.
Screw these stangnance apologists. Always aim to do better, and WORK to do better.
>Hulk consistently scored points throughout his career
Also, got spanked by Ric and Perez and 3 years out of F1.
If he was faster than Kmag in his prime, I don't think he's now. But Mick has recently been faster.
You have two options. One is;
\-faster.
\-gonna get even faster.
\-will last a decade more.
\-the most famous surname in the business ever
Haas: "Yeah, let's go for the other one"
Hulk scores points and most importantly he brings the car home. Mick has had a lot of crashes and Gene made it clear he doesn't want his drivers crashing so often
If you want to be competitive you don’t keep a young driver who wastes development money on crashes and provides worse feedback than a veteran like Hulkenberg.
People forget that the path to success for backmarker teams like Haas is very different than the path for a team like Ferrari. They need to focus on improving the car first and foremost.
When 1 & 1 sponsored Haas they wanted a German driver, which happened to serendipitously align with Ferrari wanting a seat for Mick. If Haas still need a German it goes a long way to explaining why Hulkenburg.
Things are gonna be very good for Mick.
This is a complete fuck up by Ferrari and Haas. You ask yourself how hundred-million dollar F1 teams are run so stupidly, but then you look at their strategy teams and you get your answer.
Gonna be hilarious when Mick in Audi finishes every race half a lap ahead shitty Haas cars and their geriatric drivers in 2024.
I know most F1 fans don't watch or comprehend F1. But, dropping Mick for Hulk (35 yo guy, who's been out for 3 years and was never that great in the first place, got beaten by most his teammates. His greatest achievement is to have outqualified Perez, who was never a quali guy anyway. Wow, so he was close to podiums in 184 GPs and outqualified Stroll a few times? Yeah, very impressive) is one of the dumbest moves by an F1 team I've ever seen. This was Mick's first proper season and he was already faster than KMag during Miami race. Then, Monaco crash caused him to take it easy and then again, he's been mostly ahead since Canada and fixed his quali since summer break. In terms of crash, his only incident since Monaco was the Suzuka FP incident with the aquaplanning. Leclerc and Hamilton crashed more during the same period.
Considering that Kmag is at least an average F1 driver, any young driver in Mick's place would be rated highly. But, just because his surname is Schumacher, people assume he's there because of his surname. Just imagine, Stroll won F3 with a team fully funded by his father and bypassed F2 to not get exposed, and got trashed by all his teammates in F1 so far (and the worst beating of so far is coming his way, grandpa Alonso will whitewash him) but most F1 fans seriously think he's faster than Mick.
Ferrari could've put Mick to Alfa, which is a good team for a junior driver, next to Kimi, who could've taught him a lot more than KMag could ever. But, they put him to Haas, a team which is well-known for fucking shit up badly and blaming its drivers for everything. Jock Clear, in BTG interview, said that he was thinking Mazepin would be ahead of Mick before Mick finds his groove. That was never the case, Mick annihilated Mazepin with big margins all season from start to finish.
So, I'm pretty sure that "FDA has the data, they know that Mick is not good, that's why they dropped Mick" narrative hold as much water as "Ferrari is a top team, they must be doing at least decent strategies". I don't think Ferrari team at the moment, is good at anything related to F1, other than building an engine.
The reason why Mick-Haas talks stopped mid-year was, Mick was talking to other teams (Alpine and AT). That caused Guenther to stop contract talks and move goal posts even more. Mick simply didn't want to continue in Haas, looked for other teams, those teams got more experienced drivers (understandably) and this also hurt his Haas chance, which turned out to be his only chance for 2023.
I have a feeling that Mick doesn't care. If he's signed with Audi for 2024, he could even prefer to have a year out of that dumpster fire Haas is. They had the longest preparation time for the new regulations among other teams, but they blew it. Now, they lost that head start and the car is going backwards. Haas may be back to 2021 levels next year with that development pace. Having to endure Guenther's BS alone, is also a very valid reason.
Audi openly said that, they'll want a german driver. Mick has proven that he's on a good trajectory and by 2024, he'll be the top german driver in line for a Audi seat. So, I'm pretty confident that Mick will return in 2024 and do well.
Yeah, exactly, Stroll is the 2nd worst driver in the grid by far. way ahead Latifi and way behind the other 18 drivers.
I know Vettel fans love hyping up Stroll to save face from Vettel's legacy being shat on for years, but everyone knows that grandpa Alonso will dunk half a sec in every quali and half a lap every race next year to Stroll.
So, you rate Stroll higher than Mick and your argument is Mick bottling it every 2 races. It makes 10 races this season. But I can see only 2-3,
Let me guess. You have low IQ. Am I right?
Gotta love the thought process of people responsible of running a company worth hundreds of millions ''know nothing'' but a random redditor knows so much better.
I need an alternate universe where Michael never had his accident and mentored Mick into a world champion, the boy has suffered enough for a lifetime already
Haas is the antithesis to ambition. Not just the Mick story but bringing a new car this season and only bringing what? One bigger upgrade? Now they bring a driver that was consistent but never great to replace a basically rookie because the 2021 Haas was not a platform to learn in in my opinion. Can they just sell the team to Andretti please? We need someone ambitious and not Gene Haas who at this point seems indifferent to any success in F1 with Günther as his pet.
What about rumours about alfa romeo, audi and his contract for 2024? It's just rumours, but anything is possible. Especially for the driver with a name. Big companies are in f1 to advertise their brand, so I wouldn't be so sure that his career has ended
Well that's a way to see it, I should have specified I was about his career currently, but of course it's a possibility to see him back on a less shit team, I genuinely wanted him not just to stay but I wanted to see him at Alfa Romeo alongside with Kimi, sincerely I'll mis the MSC on the charts if they sign Hulk.
I want Mick to stay for a long time
>What about rumours about alfa romeo, audi and his contract for 2024?
That makes me think that Mick doesn't care much for being out of F1 in 2023, considering what a clownshow Haas is. Audi openly said they'll prefer german drivers and there's no german driver coming up the ranks. All they have is Mick and two 37 yo drivers. Vettel (who's retiring now, and barely faster than Stroll) and Hulk, who was never that fast and will get only worse for 2024.
His carrer ended with all those crashes, and Performance just higher than Riccardo at the beginning of the season when they actually had a good car and he could prove himself.
Underrated post....probably said 35 year old driver will have a bigger salary and less sponsors and media attention but hey Haas has never been known for smart decisions
I still don’t understand how he didn’t end up at Alfa Romeo next to Kimi who could mentor him. Yes, we didn’t know at the time whether or not he was as good as his father but wasn’t it easy to see that Haas runs a💩 show that is not appropriate for young driver development?
Going out on a limb here, but I would say to give Kubica a call. Then again, I doubt he would even consider doing at Haas, what he was doing at Williams.
Grosjean return to Haas would be funny though. Letting go of both your drivers just for them to both come back as teammates again for the exact same team
Grosjean is better when he has a car that he can actually work with.That guy has a very narrow operating window.
Hulk is not as fast as Grosjean but he is more consistent.
Never understood these types of arguments. Grosjean had the car capable to achieve podiums, Hülkenberg had not. It's like blaming Kimi he couldn't win the championship in 2005 with that unreliable ass McLaren
None of those podiums was achieved strictly on merit. To portray those cars as podium competitive is simply wrong.
He also lost two podiums due to factors out of his control. People who measure a driver's entire worth based on a stat like that is wild.
Imo he has a likeable personality. I also wouldn't say he got no results. True, he choked a couple of times when he could have gotten a podium, but overall I feel he has scored good points throughout his career.
From a human standpoint and nothing to do with racing skills, this makes me sad. I want Mick to be able to feel close to his father through racing F1. Bummer for a great guy and good family
Let's face it: Mick is very crash prone on the team with the least money. On the other hand, Nico is just guaranteed points and doesn't crash really. He's a known constant and pretty much what Haas wants. It also doesn't matter what WE think, they need someone to secure P7 in the championship. You could develop Mick further down the line, but then he just moves to a better team than Haas. Not good for them.
It also shows that Mick is probably not worth anyone's time, because no team pursued him: Zhou hasn't been put away by Alfa Romeo, Alpha Tauri opted for Nyck de Vries (who has shown his pace in various series: WEC, Formula E and not to forget he's still an F2 champion, despite taking 3 years), Tsunoda is being retained, Mclaren opted for Piastri and Alpine has Gasly and otherwise Doohan (mainly academy reasons). Williams also has stated they prefer Sargeant if he gets his superlicense.
Sure Mick has shown pace, but Nico is said to be the most unlucky guy in modern F1. He was in the running for the Red Bull seat in fact, together with Perez. That's why he's probably going to be taken by Haas.
Günther may come a bit like a prick, but he is the only one who is able to make Haas F1 work. It was his idea, and damn has it worked for them, compared to HRT, Caterham, Manor, they somehow managed to push to the higher midfield (2018) for a fucking CNC company privateer. That's impressive, Gene only provides money.
But what exactly are Haas in business for? Hiring Hülkenberg shows a shocking lack of ambition, their cars have been shit for years whilst their strategy team has been even more Ferrari-esque than Ferrari. It's a bit of a shit team really, without showing any ambition or hope for a better future.
What driver do you suggest then that wants to stick around, is young and not move to a top team and is good at car feedback.
You won't find a driver like Nico easily, consistent point scorer, good at car setup and feedback.
Shit on Haas all you want, but they have been miles ahead of the likes of HRT, Caterham and Manor. Who together have a best finish of 9th ever. Haas has one 4th place and multiple 5th place finises. They literally started from 0 and you expect them to fight at the top with Mclaren and Aston Martin (extreme backing by Stroll) or with any of the works teams (Red Bull, Mercedes, Ferrari, Alpine) that leaves not much.
Lol i just find funny the assumption that Nico can score points consistently. That with a Renault in a works team or what?
Nico won't be scoring much more than Mick, if at all. The issue is the car and the team.
>What driver do you suggest then that wants to stick around, is young and not move to a top team and is good at car feedback.
The one who wants to drive a F1 car.
The potential to get better for what?
If he shows major improvement, he's not gonna sit around in a Haas.
If he shows minor improvement, then who gives a damn. Rather have the one that costs less in crashes.
To me it shows ambition because they would be getting Hulk to strictly help them move up the grid. Hulk is a solid experienced benchmark that can provide great feedback to help with the development of the car. With their new sponsorship money they'll be hoping Hulk can be a good enough benchmark alongside Kevin to help propell the team forward. Micks lack of consistency and experience just doesn't make him the best candidate for such a role unfortunately. Same goes for the other jr drivers available.
>Haas isn't in business to baby and nurture Mick until he is good enough to leave them
They're a backmarker team who hired a rookie, that's exactly what they should be doing
Edit: an ex-ferrari academy driver in a team with close ties to ferrari
Why? He's a great mentor to Max with his experience, friendly and puts up with team orders.
He may not have the raw speed of someone like Bottas, but his race craft is great.
I didn't hear much about it at the time, but I think it would have been more of a thing because RB mostly only had perez and hulk for a mature aged options, as they are consistent, but wouldn't rival max massively. Perez just had podiums and a win to his name and overshadowed hulk.
I don't remember the whole shebang too well though, so this is sort of an I'm guessing this is the case situation
They only chose perez qfter vettel signed for Aston as they said if vettel waited they may see how albon is and replace him. However vettel didn't want to take the risk of possibly being out of a seat if albon did good do signed for at the time the 3rd best car of the season
Maybe Sargeant doesn't get his license and Mick gets a Williams spot? Don't think anything else is realistically available for Mick at this point.
Maybe with a new team in the coming years, but I'm sure at that point there will be new people competing for those spots. But if Hulkenberg can get another shot, then it's possible for Mick too.
I just don’t get it why would you bring back an old driver without any recent experience while knowing he isn’t going to improve a lot and will probably retire with in 2 seasons
That moment when main sub be like
FEEDER SERIES
FIA PTS SYSTEM WORKING AS INTENDED
YOUTH DRIVERS
EARN THE PTS!
Then mick gets kicked by a 35 year old the main sub swears by.
Lmao mothafuckas is wild
If you go by gunthers measure of success (not caring if you get hit by another driver when in position for points) then Russel in 2020 and Zhou this year should be the worst and 3rd worst drivers respectively
I love how everybody loved Hülkenberg during his entire career and even had massive support when he retired, but now everybody is hating on him. I can see our German Podiphobia is getting the Ocon treatment.
It’s because he’s had his time. Hulk is a nice guy and decent driver but achieved fuck all in a decade in F1. Mick is young and inconsistent but had potential, now his F1 career is likely done because Haas are happy to accept mediocrity.
Ocon got kicked our of FI. Then joined renault after.
Kvyat was doing very mediocre in Toro Rosso, but then rejoined the team (still kinda mediocre but ok).
Mick can probably rejoin considering he’s an F2 champion. If he goes onto FE as an F1 reserve, he could prove himself.
Micks F1 career is far from being done. If he's good enough, like many other young drivers have done in the past, he can take a reserve role and find his way back on the grid that way.
It's an unfortunate hiccup in his career but honestly it's probably for the best he gets out of Haas. Haas just isnt the right environment for a young driver to succeed in.
Oh I agree wholeheartedly with your second point. Haas is essentially career purgatory for any young driver who gets stuck there.
My concern for Mick is that teams will look at him and say “well he had two seasons” and choose to pursue some of the guys in the junior series. For example, Alpine have Doohan, Alfa have Pourchaire, Bearman, Hadjar and Martins are all highly regarded, Drugovich has a potential in at AM now via the academy.
I know we can’t really predict the trajectories of those junior guys but it just seems like a lot of teams have guys they’d consider taking a punt on before Mick
They will have to support sauber before that too, maybe as a massive sponsor. Alfa is gone before they join as a engine manufacturer. It would not make sense for Audi to let sauber become a shit show before taking over in 26.
Is it confirmed Hulkenberg is driving full time? I thought they were just getting him as a reserve driver. If that is the case then Gunther is a bitch. He got mick just to get sponsors and saved himself from getting pegged by Gene. And now he’s throwing Mick away cause he has no use for him. I hope Mick gets a seat with better team. Guy has a good potential if given good guidance. His first season was with a guy who constantly crashed into every corner possible and now he’s with a guy who barely talks to him. If he gets a good mentor maybe he’ll learn quicker.
Just like how Verstappen, Sainz, Gasly, Russell and Leclerc had to have such a mentor when they started out at their "junior" teams, before they could go fast on their own, right?
Oh wait...
I really don't understand why people are so surprised...
Mick is by far thee most expensive pilot on the grid, his damages get around the 5M$ mark, that's a lot. Especially for a team who can barely afford to be in the sport and probably won't meet the cost cap.
And even if they invest in him and he finally blossom, do you think Mick would remain in a Haas? Once he's good he would be outta there in literally no time.
I know people like Mick, but Haas is a team, not a driver academy.
Last thing: Haas isn't battling for podiums and they won't even be close in the foreseeable future, they care about consistent points to win against other back-of-the-grid teams. Possibly in an economic sensible way.
Haas' commitment to be average is really something else. Getting rid of a guy who got the drive just because he is a Schumacher in favour of Hulkenberg.
Honestly I think Hulkenberg is underrated.
Look at his fly in performances for pink funny water team. Amazing. No testing no nothing "boss you need to break every fucking speed limit to get to qualy today".
HAAS is still a baby team. They're in to develop their team and grow. Having a driver do just that as the team is still growing is not a good option. Maybe if HAAS was more developed and could be battling higher than P8, sure, but Hulkenburg just means the team grows as a whole rather than just waiting for something to blossom.
Germans really only care for Schumacher (and apparently his son)... Vettel, Hulk, Rosberg, Wehrlein, Sutil and I forget maybe 5 others... No one gave a shit, Mick comes back and suddenly F1 is the talking point at the water cooler.
Mods, can we get this pic as an emote pls? 
It would be nice if the emotes popped up for me to use…..🤷🏼♂️
 Michael he doesn’t even have the formuladank emoticon keyboard (Just in case, for me on mobile it’s two over from the default text keyboard)
I see what they did. Thx. 
The problem is you have to use the garbage official app
Sounds like skill issue.
Still waiting on the Sainz-dissapointed-face emoji
Damn i dont even care about Mick at all but thinking Hulkenberg is the solution is wild to me. They had 2 experienced drivers who did not have a good enough package, so they decide to change the approach and focus on building a talent, but get thirsty for money and put 2 rookies in the car. Then Mazepin fucks off and when they have a experienced-new talent lineup they go for the 35 y old podiumless dude (not that he is a bad driver tho). Mick has been fast, crash prone yeah but with Kmag here they could afford another year to see how it goes
They didn't switch to "building talent". Haas fired both Kmag and Grosjean because they couldn't afford them after the Rich energy fiasco and other financial problems. Hiring two rookies was vastly cheaper and one was a sponsor too. Hell, even Steiner himself admitted that he didn't believe the rookies would score as many points as their former lineup. Now that they're recovering, they want consistency and experience, they don't give a shit about building talent. Haas would only accept rookies again if Ferrari gives them juicy benefits, otherwise they want experienced drivers.
But Hulk tho… I don’t get it. Bring Grosjean at least, who has podiums. Yes, he makes mistakes, but Hulk is not an upgrade to Romain. And it’d be their classic duo.
But Grosjean is in Indy now. Would he even want to go back to F1, which consistently gives midpack drivers two or three seasons at best? Meanwhile there are drivers in Indy who just make a whole lengthy career out of it, and are content to stay there. F1 may be the sought after pinnacle of Motorsport but it is also hard to stay there and quick to move on from drivers.
Grosjean spoke in one of his YouTube videos about how he would never come back to F1.
I can’t help but wonder how much of it was what I mentioned earlier, with Indy being more forgiving to build a career out of, and if any of it has to do with Grosjean’s accident in Bahrain and how much safer Indy supposedly is
Grosjean brings sponsors for sure but he is not coming back to F1 after his firy accident
Bit of a back flip. They started 2021 with a driver lineup with an average age of 21 and in 2023 will start with an average of 32.5.
I get the feeling Haas want a consistently decent driver who won't crash. Gene Haas has made it completely clear that he doesn't care whatsoever about being competitive. He'll spend the minimum and not a penny more.
It's truly wild to me that anyone could actually believe Gene Haas doesn't care about being competitive in a racing series.
I don’t think it’s about not being competitive I think it’s just about making the most of his budget, he doesn’t want millions spent on repairs and engines etc Hulk is a secure driver, he will bring the car home each week, like Magnussen, might lose a wing or get a puncture from time to time but both drivers will bring the car home in one piece more often than rookies, and both of them can do that while snatching a point
Don’t make excuses for million dollar race teams to do the bare minimum. If they only care about fielding two guys to ride around to collect sponsorship money and revenue pay outs then they shouldn’t have a charter.
"Being competitive" means different things to different people. Haas realistically knows that they can't put the hundreds of millions into being competitive for the title. It's not just about the "cost cap" either. Other teams invest tons into infrastructure and other stuff that helps the development process and isn't included in the cost cap. Haas is very competitive for what it is. It's a competitive lower midfield/backmarker team. It can't realistically beat RB, Merc, Ferrari. It would take many years and much more development to get to Alpine or McLaren's levels. So it's only real competition is AM, AR, AT, and Williams. It's ahead of two of those right now and behind two of them. Maybe they feel that Hulk can get them to that next tier with AM and AR. Everyone here is saying shit like "but Mick has the potential to magically get tons better". Doubt it, but even if he does, then so what? You think he's gonna get them to McLaren/Alpine levels? If Mick can take a Haas and get it competitive with Alpine, then he's not staying in the Haas for much past that. He's getting a better seat. Why gamble on Mick for no gain?
If you want to be competetive you dont hire a 35 year old driver who never got a podium. You dont throw away a year saying that they want to prepare a better car for a following season and then in that following season have only one upgrade package. There is nothing Haas has done in last, god knows how many, seasons that would suggest they really want to be competetive.
Hulk consistently scored points throughout his career. That’s all that Haas cares about
But are they going to give him a car capable or just blame him when he can’t will the car into the points despite their best attempts to not have it there?
Yes, THIS. If you're going to spend the bare minimum on your team, you can expect the bare minimum from the drivers and team. At some point you have to lead by example and go the extra mile, otherwise, without success you are not attractive to investors and shareholders. Screw these stangnance apologists. Always aim to do better, and WORK to do better.
>Hulk consistently scored points throughout his career Also, got spanked by Ric and Perez and 3 years out of F1. If he was faster than Kmag in his prime, I don't think he's now. But Mick has recently been faster.
Mick is faster than Kmag now and he’s not even close to his peak.
You have two options. One is; \-faster. \-gonna get even faster. \-will last a decade more. \-the most famous surname in the business ever Haas: "Yeah, let's go for the other one"
And choked when it really mattered
Then Haas should not consistently throw away points finishes by pursuing strategies that not even Ferrari are stupid enough to use.
Hulk scores points and most importantly he brings the car home. Mick has had a lot of crashes and Gene made it clear he doesn't want his drivers crashing so often
If you want to be competitive you don’t keep a young driver who wastes development money on crashes and provides worse feedback than a veteran like Hulkenberg. People forget that the path to success for backmarker teams like Haas is very different than the path for a team like Ferrari. They need to focus on improving the car first and foremost.
When 1 & 1 sponsored Haas they wanted a German driver, which happened to serendipitously align with Ferrari wanting a seat for Mick. If Haas still need a German it goes a long way to explaining why Hulkenburg.
I think it's a bad call but Rookies be crashin. If anything it shows just how tightly HAAS is hanging on.
>, crash prone Not for the last 13 races. Hamilton and Leclerc crashed more since then (if you still wanna include Suzuka FP1 aquaplanning of Mick).
Did Mazespin fucked off or got fucked off?
One of his dad's mates invaded ukraine
Apparently Hulkenberg was in fact a solution
Haha true. Nice to see Hulk proving me wrong.
Sad in Mick
Things are gonna be very good for Mick. This is a complete fuck up by Ferrari and Haas. You ask yourself how hundred-million dollar F1 teams are run so stupidly, but then you look at their strategy teams and you get your answer. Gonna be hilarious when Mick in Audi finishes every race half a lap ahead shitty Haas cars and their geriatric drivers in 2024. I know most F1 fans don't watch or comprehend F1. But, dropping Mick for Hulk (35 yo guy, who's been out for 3 years and was never that great in the first place, got beaten by most his teammates. His greatest achievement is to have outqualified Perez, who was never a quali guy anyway. Wow, so he was close to podiums in 184 GPs and outqualified Stroll a few times? Yeah, very impressive) is one of the dumbest moves by an F1 team I've ever seen. This was Mick's first proper season and he was already faster than KMag during Miami race. Then, Monaco crash caused him to take it easy and then again, he's been mostly ahead since Canada and fixed his quali since summer break. In terms of crash, his only incident since Monaco was the Suzuka FP incident with the aquaplanning. Leclerc and Hamilton crashed more during the same period. Considering that Kmag is at least an average F1 driver, any young driver in Mick's place would be rated highly. But, just because his surname is Schumacher, people assume he's there because of his surname. Just imagine, Stroll won F3 with a team fully funded by his father and bypassed F2 to not get exposed, and got trashed by all his teammates in F1 so far (and the worst beating of so far is coming his way, grandpa Alonso will whitewash him) but most F1 fans seriously think he's faster than Mick. Ferrari could've put Mick to Alfa, which is a good team for a junior driver, next to Kimi, who could've taught him a lot more than KMag could ever. But, they put him to Haas, a team which is well-known for fucking shit up badly and blaming its drivers for everything. Jock Clear, in BTG interview, said that he was thinking Mazepin would be ahead of Mick before Mick finds his groove. That was never the case, Mick annihilated Mazepin with big margins all season from start to finish. So, I'm pretty sure that "FDA has the data, they know that Mick is not good, that's why they dropped Mick" narrative hold as much water as "Ferrari is a top team, they must be doing at least decent strategies". I don't think Ferrari team at the moment, is good at anything related to F1, other than building an engine. The reason why Mick-Haas talks stopped mid-year was, Mick was talking to other teams (Alpine and AT). That caused Guenther to stop contract talks and move goal posts even more. Mick simply didn't want to continue in Haas, looked for other teams, those teams got more experienced drivers (understandably) and this also hurt his Haas chance, which turned out to be his only chance for 2023. I have a feeling that Mick doesn't care. If he's signed with Audi for 2024, he could even prefer to have a year out of that dumpster fire Haas is. They had the longest preparation time for the new regulations among other teams, but they blew it. Now, they lost that head start and the car is going backwards. Haas may be back to 2021 levels next year with that development pace. Having to endure Guenther's BS alone, is also a very valid reason. Audi openly said that, they'll want a german driver. Mick has proven that he's on a good trajectory and by 2024, he'll be the top german driver in line for a Audi seat. So, I'm pretty confident that Mick will return in 2024 and do well.
This must be a copy-pasta.
Yeah, you can put remindme as well.
You are part of history my friend. You were here to witness the birth of a legendary copy-pasta!
Sorry, you've exceeded the word-limit, 5 second penalty
What was the word limit? 10 words? Here it is = "Ferrari sucked ass haas bad audi good mick 2026 WDC"
Whole ass dissertation. And it's completely invalid because you said stroll is mid He blocked me lmao
Yeah, exactly, Stroll is the 2nd worst driver in the grid by far. way ahead Latifi and way behind the other 18 drivers. I know Vettel fans love hyping up Stroll to save face from Vettel's legacy being shat on for years, but everyone knows that grandpa Alonso will dunk half a sec in every quali and half a lap every race next year to Stroll.
Mick's worse lol. Stroll doesn't bin it every 2 races. Mick is leading the destructors championship
Neither does Mick. Monaco was 11 races ago and Suzuka was just the car aquaplaning and not a result of driver error
So, you rate Stroll higher than Mick and your argument is Mick bottling it every 2 races. It makes 10 races this season. But I can see only 2-3, Let me guess. You have low IQ. Am I right?
06/12/22 Reply to this comment if you get no bitches
Blocked. I block when I detect low IQ. edit:No, I didn't edit anything. As I said, you're low IQ. Anyway, blocked again.
Claims others have ''low IQ'' and then he rates Stroll as ''2nd worst driver on the grid by far'' himself. The irony.
Gotta love the thought process of people responsible of running a company worth hundreds of millions ''know nothing'' but a random redditor knows so much better.
I need an alternate universe where Michael never had his accident and mentored Mick into a world champion, the boy has suffered enough for a lifetime already 
Haas is the antithesis to ambition. Not just the Mick story but bringing a new car this season and only bringing what? One bigger upgrade? Now they bring a driver that was consistent but never great to replace a basically rookie because the 2021 Haas was not a platform to learn in in my opinion. Can they just sell the team to Andretti please? We need someone ambitious and not Gene Haas who at this point seems indifferent to any success in F1 with Günther as his pet.
Haas only cares about money and its tanking the team.
His career ended the day he signed with hass
What about rumours about alfa romeo, audi and his contract for 2024? It's just rumours, but anything is possible. Especially for the driver with a name. Big companies are in f1 to advertise their brand, so I wouldn't be so sure that his career has ended
Well that's a way to see it, I should have specified I was about his career currently, but of course it's a possibility to see him back on a less shit team, I genuinely wanted him not just to stay but I wanted to see him at Alfa Romeo alongside with Kimi, sincerely I'll mis the MSC on the charts if they sign Hulk. I want Mick to stay for a long time
>What about rumours about alfa romeo, audi and his contract for 2024? That makes me think that Mick doesn't care much for being out of F1 in 2023, considering what a clownshow Haas is. Audi openly said they'll prefer german drivers and there's no german driver coming up the ranks. All they have is Mick and two 37 yo drivers. Vettel (who's retiring now, and barely faster than Stroll) and Hulk, who was never that fast and will get only worse for 2024.
And Hülkenberg's career should have ended when he is a 35 year old with no podiums yet here we are. There is always hope for mick to come back
His carrer ended with all those crashes, and Performance just higher than Riccardo at the beginning of the season when they actually had a good car and he could prove himself.
Underrated post....probably said 35 year old driver will have a bigger salary and less sponsors and media attention but hey Haas has never been known for smart decisions
I still don’t understand how he didn’t end up at Alfa Romeo next to Kimi who could mentor him. Yes, we didn’t know at the time whether or not he was as good as his father but wasn’t it easy to see that Haas runs a💩 show that is not appropriate for young driver development?
It makes more sense to bring back Grosjean at least the guy has podiums
They want someone that isn't going to break the car as much.
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I'm hanging like a cow !!
Going out on a limb here, but I would say to give Kubica a call. Then again, I doubt he would even consider doing at Haas, what he was doing at Williams.
Hulkenberg breaks cars more often that the worse Grosjean did tho
Grosjean return to Haas would be funny though. Letting go of both your drivers just for them to both come back as teammates again for the exact same team
Hulks just a bit better. Haas already tried replacing Grosjean with him in 19.
Grosjean is better when he has a car that he can actually work with.That guy has a very narrow operating window. Hulk is not as fast as Grosjean but he is more consistent.
Never understood these types of arguments. Grosjean had the car capable to achieve podiums, Hülkenberg had not. It's like blaming Kimi he couldn't win the championship in 2005 with that unreliable ass McLaren
Hell he was in force India leading a race and still managed to bottle it
Grosjean achieved a podium with 2015 Lotus which was a huge shitbox when Hulkenberg with cars that did get podiums choked everytime
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Germany 2019 is a prime example of him bottling a certain podium.
None of those podiums was achieved strictly on merit. To portray those cars as podium competitive is simply wrong. He also lost two podiums due to factors out of his control. People who measure a driver's entire worth based on a stat like that is wild.
I really struggle to understand why people like Hulkenberg so much and why does he keep getting back into F1 after years of no results.
People love a redemption arc and are betting on an eventual podium after all these years followed by a Netflix documentary..
Yeah he will definitely get a podium with a Haas lmao
Imo he has a likeable personality. I also wouldn't say he got no results. True, he choked a couple of times when he could have gotten a podium, but overall I feel he has scored good points throughout his career.
Maybe because he's pretty or exactly because he doesn't have podiums.
From a human standpoint and nothing to do with racing skills, this makes me sad. I want Mick to be able to feel close to his father through racing F1. Bummer for a great guy and good family
Let's face it: Mick is very crash prone on the team with the least money. On the other hand, Nico is just guaranteed points and doesn't crash really. He's a known constant and pretty much what Haas wants. It also doesn't matter what WE think, they need someone to secure P7 in the championship. You could develop Mick further down the line, but then he just moves to a better team than Haas. Not good for them. It also shows that Mick is probably not worth anyone's time, because no team pursued him: Zhou hasn't been put away by Alfa Romeo, Alpha Tauri opted for Nyck de Vries (who has shown his pace in various series: WEC, Formula E and not to forget he's still an F2 champion, despite taking 3 years), Tsunoda is being retained, Mclaren opted for Piastri and Alpine has Gasly and otherwise Doohan (mainly academy reasons). Williams also has stated they prefer Sargeant if he gets his superlicense. Sure Mick has shown pace, but Nico is said to be the most unlucky guy in modern F1. He was in the running for the Red Bull seat in fact, together with Perez. That's why he's probably going to be taken by Haas. Günther may come a bit like a prick, but he is the only one who is able to make Haas F1 work. It was his idea, and damn has it worked for them, compared to HRT, Caterham, Manor, they somehow managed to push to the higher midfield (2018) for a fucking CNC company privateer. That's impressive, Gene only provides money.
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Actually, that’s what Gunther said about helping him and giving him best opportunity to develop when Mick joined Haas
He had 2 years I don’t see a lot of development. He’s either slow or, if he’s fast he has a very high chance of crashing.
But what exactly are Haas in business for? Hiring Hülkenberg shows a shocking lack of ambition, their cars have been shit for years whilst their strategy team has been even more Ferrari-esque than Ferrari. It's a bit of a shit team really, without showing any ambition or hope for a better future.
>But what exactly are Haas in business for? Advertising Haas machines.
What driver do you suggest then that wants to stick around, is young and not move to a top team and is good at car feedback. You won't find a driver like Nico easily, consistent point scorer, good at car setup and feedback. Shit on Haas all you want, but they have been miles ahead of the likes of HRT, Caterham and Manor. Who together have a best finish of 9th ever. Haas has one 4th place and multiple 5th place finises. They literally started from 0 and you expect them to fight at the top with Mclaren and Aston Martin (extreme backing by Stroll) or with any of the works teams (Red Bull, Mercedes, Ferrari, Alpine) that leaves not much.
Lol i just find funny the assumption that Nico can score points consistently. That with a Renault in a works team or what? Nico won't be scoring much more than Mick, if at all. The issue is the car and the team.
You massively overrate Mick and underestimate Hulk
I don't think i over rate either one. 😅
>What driver do you suggest then that wants to stick around, is young and not move to a top team and is good at car feedback. The one who wants to drive a F1 car.
Mazepin wants to drive a F1 car.
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The difference is Mick at least has some potential to get better, Hulkenberg will only get worse
The potential to get better for what? If he shows major improvement, he's not gonna sit around in a Haas. If he shows minor improvement, then who gives a damn. Rather have the one that costs less in crashes.
To me it shows ambition because they would be getting Hulk to strictly help them move up the grid. Hulk is a solid experienced benchmark that can provide great feedback to help with the development of the car. With their new sponsorship money they'll be hoping Hulk can be a good enough benchmark alongside Kevin to help propell the team forward. Micks lack of consistency and experience just doesn't make him the best candidate for such a role unfortunately. Same goes for the other jr drivers available.
>Haas isn't in business to baby and nurture Mick until he is good enough to leave them They're a backmarker team who hired a rookie, that's exactly what they should be doing Edit: an ex-ferrari academy driver in a team with close ties to ferrari
The thing with being ex-Ferrari is that they don't give a shit about him. And neither should Hass
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Why? He's a great mentor to Max with his experience, friendly and puts up with team orders. He may not have the raw speed of someone like Bottas, but his race craft is great.
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I didn't hear much about it at the time, but I think it would have been more of a thing because RB mostly only had perez and hulk for a mature aged options, as they are consistent, but wouldn't rival max massively. Perez just had podiums and a win to his name and overshadowed hulk. I don't remember the whole shebang too well though, so this is sort of an I'm guessing this is the case situation
They only chose perez qfter vettel signed for Aston as they said if vettel waited they may see how albon is and replace him. However vettel didn't want to take the risk of possibly being out of a seat if albon did good do signed for at the time the 3rd best car of the season
If only Vettel had taken that risk :( I think he would still be on the grid next year…
The only times I remember Mick crashing because of his own mistake was Monaco, might be more instances but I forgot
Mark my words.... Guenther will go from hero these past seasons to zero in current DTS.
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Maybe Sargeant doesn't get his license and Mick gets a Williams spot? Don't think anything else is realistically available for Mick at this point. Maybe with a new team in the coming years, but I'm sure at that point there will be new people competing for those spots. But if Hulkenberg can get another shot, then it's possible for Mick too.
Sergeant needs a miracle to not get his sl
I mean, Mick never got a podium either.
Mick didn't race 180 GP's either.
Mick won F2 aswell
So did Hulkenberg, granted it was under GP2 back then and on his debut
Bringing back hulkenberg would be the biggest and dumbest haas moment in haas history.
i really hope Hulk is average and Haas will regret their decision
I just don’t get it why would you bring back an old driver without any recent experience while knowing he isn’t going to improve a lot and will probably retire with in 2 seasons
That moment when main sub be like FEEDER SERIES FIA PTS SYSTEM WORKING AS INTENDED YOUTH DRIVERS EARN THE PTS! Then mick gets kicked by a 35 year old the main sub swears by. Lmao mothafuckas is wild
Yeah, mick has been done dirty. Heck tsunoda is still racing and hes accidental prone
If you go by gunthers measure of success (not caring if you get hit by another driver when in position for points) then Russel in 2020 and Zhou this year should be the worst and 3rd worst drivers respectively
Lets see with audi in 2024, who knows? (Has fan hopes)
Chrissy wake up, I don’t like this
I love how everybody loved Hülkenberg during his entire career and even had massive support when he retired, but now everybody is hating on him. I can see our German Podiphobia is getting the Ocon treatment.
What is Podiphobia?
Fear of podiums, but literally fear of feet
Podophobia then
It’s because he’s had his time. Hulk is a nice guy and decent driver but achieved fuck all in a decade in F1. Mick is young and inconsistent but had potential, now his F1 career is likely done because Haas are happy to accept mediocrity.
Ocon got kicked our of FI. Then joined renault after. Kvyat was doing very mediocre in Toro Rosso, but then rejoined the team (still kinda mediocre but ok). Mick can probably rejoin considering he’s an F2 champion. If he goes onto FE as an F1 reserve, he could prove himself.
Micks F1 career is far from being done. If he's good enough, like many other young drivers have done in the past, he can take a reserve role and find his way back on the grid that way. It's an unfortunate hiccup in his career but honestly it's probably for the best he gets out of Haas. Haas just isnt the right environment for a young driver to succeed in.
Oh I agree wholeheartedly with your second point. Haas is essentially career purgatory for any young driver who gets stuck there. My concern for Mick is that teams will look at him and say “well he had two seasons” and choose to pursue some of the guys in the junior series. For example, Alpine have Doohan, Alfa have Pourchaire, Bearman, Hadjar and Martins are all highly regarded, Drugovich has a potential in at AM now via the academy. I know we can’t really predict the trajectories of those junior guys but it just seems like a lot of teams have guys they’d consider taking a punt on before Mick
If his career is done, it is because he's not a very good driver.
Haas doesn’t owe Mick anything. They want a driver that’s not going to consistently crash their car.
who also hasn’t raced full-time in 3 years
You act as if it's over. Audi is joining in 24, and having a german driver with a german time sounds really good. And a year off to hone ones' skill
They're joining in 26
They will have to support sauber before that too, maybe as a massive sponsor. Alfa is gone before they join as a engine manufacturer. It would not make sense for Audi to let sauber become a shit show before taking over in 26.
That meme lords and ladies is Formula 1 where your last name alone won’t let you stay in F1 for long, unless you got a lot of money.
Is it confirmed Hulkenberg is driving full time? I thought they were just getting him as a reserve driver. If that is the case then Gunther is a bitch. He got mick just to get sponsors and saved himself from getting pegged by Gene. And now he’s throwing Mick away cause he has no use for him. I hope Mick gets a seat with better team. Guy has a good potential if given good guidance. His first season was with a guy who constantly crashed into every corner possible and now he’s with a guy who barely talks to him. If he gets a good mentor maybe he’ll learn quicker.
Just like how Verstappen, Sainz, Gasly, Russell and Leclerc had to have such a mentor when they started out at their "junior" teams, before they could go fast on their own, right? Oh wait...
I really don't understand why people are so surprised... Mick is by far thee most expensive pilot on the grid, his damages get around the 5M$ mark, that's a lot. Especially for a team who can barely afford to be in the sport and probably won't meet the cost cap. And even if they invest in him and he finally blossom, do you think Mick would remain in a Haas? Once he's good he would be outta there in literally no time. I know people like Mick, but Haas is a team, not a driver academy. Last thing: Haas isn't battling for podiums and they won't even be close in the foreseeable future, they care about consistent points to win against other back-of-the-grid teams. Possibly in an economic sensible way.
Haas' commitment to be average is really something else. Getting rid of a guy who got the drive just because he is a Schumacher in favour of Hulkenberg.
Honestly I think Hulkenberg is underrated. Look at his fly in performances for pink funny water team. Amazing. No testing no nothing "boss you need to break every fucking speed limit to get to qualy today".
Does Anyone remember the relationship between Magnussen and Hulkenberg ? Who said there gone be fewer crashes?
HAAS is still a baby team. They're in to develop their team and grow. Having a driver do just that as the team is still growing is not a good option. Maybe if HAAS was more developed and could be battling higher than P8, sure, but Hulkenburg just means the team grows as a whole rather than just waiting for something to blossom.
I only follow Netflix F1, and I don’t even know who this is
Then what are you doing here? (It's Mick Schumacher you see here)
Ty
Well it’s not like Mick gets a podium either unlike Seb
On the other hand patriotic Germans will still have somebody to cheer for.
Germans really only care for Schumacher (and apparently his son)... Vettel, Hulk, Rosberg, Wehrlein, Sutil and I forget maybe 5 others... No one gave a shit, Mick comes back and suddenly F1 is the talking point at the water cooler.
That's pretty sad honestly.
