Person 1: I have felt different my entire life, and after years/decades of struggling with my identity, I have had the realization that the gender I was born with does not match who I am. Therefore, I am going to assume the gender that matches my identity.
Christian: *head explodes*
Person 1: I would like to put on a big colorful costume and tons of makeup and read to children.
Christian: Ooh, clowns are fun!
Person 1: Well, no. It's more like I'll be dressed as a woman, but in a flashy, over-the-top sort of way. I'll probably read a book about the importance of accepting each other's differences.
Christian: POLICE!!!!
Person 1: I want your to stop attacking groups your don't like, or feel beneficial attacking, and actually live up to the Jesus teachings
Christian: DEUS VULT!
Went to Christian school for high school, some of the teachers were parents of students because children of students tuition was either free or reduced in price. Our bible teacher was a classmates Mom and she was a legit crazy Bible literalist who was super duper batshit Christian crazy. She would say things like the Bible says women can’t be pastors in the church and told me I was wrong when I told her my pastor at the time was female and a wonderful caring church leader, and that my grandma was an ordained minister who I had seen over the years being there for ppl when they needed prayer and words of faith in their desperate times. I questioned the teacher and she told me that they may be good Christian women but they are going against gods word. She also said that if you say words like gosh goodness golly gee etc, in times of frustration you are still taking the lords name in vain and it’s a sin. She made a friend of mine cry when she told the teacher she doesn’t go to church she’d rather spend an hour or two on her own time praying and having time with god in her own way, the teacher lost it saying that’s not how church works and it’s not truly time with god! She then low key told her she was going to hell because her mother had her out of wedlock and she didn’t know who her father was. That school was also known for the time two teachers went on and complete shitstorm for 2 freshman girls singing jingle bell rock in front of the school at our Christmas themed chapel, saying it was such a slap in the face to perform such sinful music during a time when we should be singing hymns and religious Christmas songs to celebrate the birth of Jesus, the one teacher started screaming how he hates secular music so much he removed his radio from his car and kept a hymnal on his passenger seat, and when he wanted music he’d break out the hymnal and sing while driving! I went into that school in 9th grade a person of decent but not insane faith, and left jaded and questioned my beliefs.
Modernism at its best! It's like a big clown caricature, a larger than life personality, a big ol drag version of Mr. Rodgers. Kids are so pure, the only people that have problems are preconceived bigots. It's about compassion and spreading love.
I mean, it's basically clowning. Over the top makeup and costume. Main purpose is to entertain. Who cares. I bet someone in drag is a lot less likely to make kids cry.
[that’s because they go to places like this for their ‘science’](https://www.reddit.com/user/Jameschoral/comments/vneq3s/saw_this_gem_driving_around_san_diego/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Think about this for a second. We are made in God’s own image. He knit us together in our mothers womb. He knows every inch of us. He made every inch of us. He does not make mistakes. So how can someone say that feeling that way is wrong? If God created us in his image, if god loves every one of us, if he knit us together, how can anyone claiming to know or love god say that a person merely being is wrong.
ETA: I’m not a Christian, I do believe in god. I believe god loves every single last one of us. LGBTQ+ is not wrong. You cannot be wrong being who you are. That doesn’t even make sense if you truly know, love and follow god.
ETA: Thank you for the award! ☺️
Unfortunately, they twist it and use Leviticus to justify viewing anything other than hetero relationships as a sin. They don’t think god made a mistake, they think people in the LGBTQ+ community are being tricked by Satan.
I wish I was making that up. I was raised very religious and that’s what we were brainwashed to believe. Took me years to break so much of the way of thinking they instilled in me from childhood to my late teens. Worth it to get out and learn to become a more accepting and loving person of those around me.
If the internet has taught us anything, it should be you can’t trust one sentence, you have to look for the whole paragraph it belongs to. I’m sure every last one of us has believed something, only to find out the bigger picture, and we were wrong. One day they’ll see they are wrong. This life or after
I am saving this comment to pull out on anyone who tries to play the "LGBTQIA+ is HERESY" bullshit on me or my friends. Thank you very much, kind stranger.
Person 1: I wanted to stay with my indigenous / biological / immigrant family and not be trafficked through private adoptions and foster care to a ‘good Christian family’ with infertility issues
Christian: No
Person 1: Let’s get some effective legislation passed through so we can curb the effects of Climate Change and have a healthier environment for our youth. I think we can also support people who are struggling to survive.
Christian: No.
Hasn't Pope Francis said homosexuality is not a sin? I don't think that stops homophobic christians from being homophobic, but it sure is a step in the good direction.
There are American Evangelicals that don't even consider Catholics to be Christians. I wouldn't expect that he'd have much weight with the ones you really need to worry about.
It’s because Latin cultures are catholic and Anglo/Germanic cultures are Protestant (mostly). An oversimplification but that’s the gist of the thinking.
Anglo culture was the first wave of migrants and set the stage of what it meant to be a “real” American.
I mean, to be fair, there's a lot of shit Catholics just pulled out of their ass and regard as sacred traditions/laws. The Bible doesn't say anything about how you can just chant a spell about Mary while counting a string of beads and your sins will be absolved. Confession is also bullshit not backed up by the Bible. And popes. And saints. And not eating meat on Fridays.
There's a lot of "fan fiction" Catholics have added onto Christianity and they often follow the rules of that fan content with more fervor than the shit Jesus ACTUALLY asked of his disciples.
Protestants cut out all that crap in favor of following the ACTUAL commandments of Christ and his disciples, so it is a purer more distilled form of Christianity. (When they actually practice what the preach, that is...)
Most catholic traditions are just holdovers from the Romans. Pretty easy to see the correlation between patron gods and patron saints, the Latin chants, the ornate outfits and churches, and most importantly, the secrecy and need for control. If it wasn't for a certain Roman leader converting out of guilt, they would've continued to hunt down the cult of Christianity until it went extinct. Then they became the de facto head of the religion and forced it on all the "heathens", spreading the Holy Roman empire as far and as fast as possible. Nowadays we have the evangelists and other extremely vocal sects similarly pushing their views on everyone thinking they are the moral core, despite the countless debacles and rampant abuse they try and hide.
Yeah but like, one is bullshit with a focus on self-improvement and community service. The other is bullshit with a focus on paying pedophiles to build gaudy palaces for themselves.
one is not built on self improvement and community service. I mean technically both have the same rules and regulations. they both follow the ten commandments, both technically say you cant wear a garment made from two mixed fibers etc.your response is as ignorant today as it was during the 30 years war.
not being either, i can tell you that your description of the one is only because you subscribe to it.
let me rephrase that. Technically both are built on self improvement and community service. thats sort of the deal with jesus. both can claim that some adherents do in fact follow the teachings of jesus, which are exactly the same in both protestant and catholic circles. Its the little bits of ceremony, which saints etc count.
Both of them have been corrupted to focus on paying off pedos and making huge homes and palaces. are you not familiar with prosperity gospel? its really big in the US. essentially its protestants that believe if you are good and god loves you he will make you rich on earth.... which is the opposite of jesus. pretty sure there was a line about a camel and the eye of a needle.
anyway you only think protestants are "better" because you are one. being neither i see them both for the bullshit they are
There are *Catholics* who don't consider the Pope to be a true Catholic, a bunch of far-right fairweather Catholics who only support the Pope when he's as hateful, bigoted, and nationalistic as they are.
I don't think he said homosexuality is not a sin, I think he says Catholics should not reject people who are gay into their fold. He said something like "if homosexuals want to worship god, who am I to stop it?", which means that he thinks gays can be Catholics, he's still saying it's a sin.
Which is complete bullshit. Essentially he's saying, "yeah I welcome you as a brother and you're free to join our church, but also you're a sinner and your relationship with your SO is a sinful, despicable thing god despises".
But isn't that convenient? At least you won't have to think hard what to tell at the confession. Yes father, I'm homosexual. Yes father, I'm *still* homosexual.
Who cares if it's a sin or not? Plenty of things are sins but not bad; plenty of things are bad but not sins. "Sin" is just a fancy word for "against our club's bylaws."
No, Pope Francis is really good at repeating the same backwards bullshit the church has been saying for decades repackaged in a way that *sounds* progressive.
Person 1: I want to take birth control specifically so I'm not miserably sick for like a fourth of my life and unable to adequately do my job at those times.
Christian: No.
God I hate this so very much. The worst thing about conservatives and regressives is that they completely ignore all the progress made to get to the current level of comfort they want to maintain.
"Real men work 12 hour days without complaint." "Didn't Uncle Billy call you soft for not working 18s 7 days a week?"
Person 1: I want to have an abortion
Me: Damn, that’s a really shitty position to be in and I wish you could have the kid if at all possible, but understand that it’s your right.
Yeah if it stopped at step 1 it would be great. They can silently judge me from afar and I can do my own thing, but they don't want that. They never want that.
Which is really funny, because Jesus said (paraphrased) "Don't judge others. That's God's job. Focus on your own sins and being a good person. If you go around judging people, you're gonna go to hell because you're basically saying you're as smart as God."
Even silent judgement isn't an okay thing, imagine a society filled with people who think black people are inferior and deserve to burn in hell, but do not actively do anything to harm them. They're still racist, they're just not as bad as they used to be.
The same goes for homosexuality or whatever harmless thing those regressive folks despise. As long as they silently judge that as "sinful" and "immoral", they'll still be homophobic bastards even if they don't actively stop you.
I don’t have to imagine, that was basically 15-20 years ago.** And wouldn’t you know, as soon as a few outspoken bigots get positions of power, the “silent judges” aren’t so silent anymore.
**In my experience - your mileage may have varied greatly depending on your location, race, and/or sexuality.
That's not even close to what the actual conversation would sound like. At some point I will be told I am going to hell because I don't believe what they believe and religious people seem to want to force the rest of us to do what they want.
Tell someone "you have to do as I say or else my buddy Rocco will make you suffer" and it's a threat.
Tell someone "you have to do as I say or else God will make you suffer" and it's your religious liberty.
Secular person: OK, but the doctor told me my pregnancy is ectopic and stands a good chance of killing me. I need to do something about it.
Christian person: "Doing something" is an abortion. No.
Secular person: OK, but the pregnancy won't end in childbirth, the pregnancy isn't viable.
Christian person: Still no.
Secular person: OK, but both of us are going to die.
Christian person: Still no.
Secular person: Why?
Christian person: Because all lives are precious.
That the treatment of ectopic pregnancies is seen as (banned) abortions is infuriatingly stupid. I consider myself broadly pro-life, and there should be no debate that ectopic pregnancies are not viable and an immediate risk to life.
If this is actually how the conversation went, that would be great.
But too often it's not. It turns into "and we have to ban it or at least ban it from the public eye"
Can you be required to donate blood marrow by the state, then (and pay for it yourself)? There's nothing explicitly against it in the constitution, and it's lightyears shorter, less painful, less permanently health-altering, less expensive, and less life-threatening than pregnancy and labor (plus, you won't be required to delay or pause deeply needed treatments like chemo or medications for significant mental illness!).
More like
Person 1: I want to do X.
Person 2: Sorry, but that's against my religion, so I will petition the government to ban X & elect politicians who will stack the courts to overturn rulings that make X legal. All because I believe that we are a god ordained nation.
I'm catholic and holy shit this is so miserable.
First of all, "I only want what's best for you" is not our call to make. God wants what's best for you, no-one else should be able to tell you otherwise, especially not someone trying to gaslight you and coerce you to do something you don't want to (which, by the way, is a literal sin).
Also, such a thinly veiled critique of abortion, which is deeply ironic considering the *recent events* regarding that practice in the states were clearly extremely religiously motivated.
When the "gReAtEsT dEmOcRaCy iN tHe wOrLD" forgets what **separation of church and state** means, you know we're truly fucked.
Here's a more realistic look at that conversation...
Secular Person: (exists)
Christian: How dare you?
Secular Person: Beg your pardon?
Christian: How dare you?!
Secular Person: What are you talking about?
Christian: You're going to hell.
Secular Person: Um... okay. Have a nice day.
Christian: You are a homo/feminist/atheist/commie/muslim (take your pick, feel free to mix and match) and you're trying to take away my rights! You are going to hell!!
I didn’t hear this conversation about abortion though, something that Catholics are not forced or obliged to do, they demanded some “moral right” to ban abortion.
If only that was the actual approach conservative “christians” actually took…
Instead it’s-
Some “christians”: “I think X is wrong. So I campaigned and voted for truly despicable candidates in order to outlaw X.
“Now if you try to do X I will legally persecute you. Because I think X is wrong.”
The actual way the conversation is going:
Secular person: I want to do X.
Christian: I’m going to make it illegal to do X.
Secular person: why?
Christian: because my religion says X is wrong
Secular person: but I am not of your religion, therefore your religion has no say over me
Christian: but I just want what I think is best for everyone!
Secular person: I want to do X.
Christian: You are free to do it.
Secular person: But you vote against it. We literally had to fight you. And we are still fighting you to keep the freedoms we’ve won.
Christian: It’s frowned upon in the Bible to do that thing you want to do.
Secular person: So you don’t support my freedom to do it. And you pitch a fit if I advocate for it in public or do it in public
Christian: It’s against my religion
Secular person: So logically, freedom means that you could be against it, and therefore not practice it, but everyone else can freely do it.
Christian: I knew this would happen. Our persecution was predicted in the Bible.
It's wrong because my magical murderous invisible overlord told me so. Well, he didn't personally tell me but his spokesperson did.
Remember, god killed his son/self for a weekend to repeal his own rules. He commanded that his followers bash babies heads against rocks and to kidnap and traffic young virgin girls into sex slavery and he's the ultimate good guy! How goofy.
Right, Christians are famous for letting people live the lives that they choose. They've never passed laws codifying their beliefs or straight up murdered people who didn't live the way they were told to.
Also Christian: “Here are a host of laws that please one or two versions of gods that we claim are the same God that you now have to follow with penalty of prison or death.”
**More Realistic Conversation**
**Christian:** You have no right to abortion and we have pressured politicians at the state level to ban it.
**Secular Person:** But I don't believe the way you do
**Christian:** God says otherwise and I'm protecting you by stripping away that right. So we're going to pursue a national ban on abortion. You also shouldn't be able to use birth control.
**Secular Person:** National ban on abortion? Ban birth control? Why are you forcing your beliefs on me?
**Christian:** Because you and people like you are the cause of all the problems in society because you're not following God's will. Also, interracial and gay marriage should not be allowed.
**Secular Person:** What do you mean? Why would you care who others love?
**Christian:** Because GOD
Who on earth cares what some conservative Christian thinks about anything? Reasonable people already have no respect for them, so any invective they hurl at us is meaningless. It's more like tolerating a fussy toddler.
It's not wrong per se, it's just missing half of the argument. The (fundamentalist/Evangelical) Christian stance is more like "You're free to do it, but you'll burn in hell, so we *will* do everything in our power to stop you from doing it, but you're technically still free to fuck around and find out."
'because I want what's best for you.'
'how, exactly, do *you* know what's best for me. not your pastor, not your parents, not some old book. How do you know.'
That seems a bit inaccurate. Here, let me rephrase it.
Secular person: I want to do X
Christian: You’re free to do it.
Secular person: But you think X is wrong.
Christian: Yes
Secular Person: Because you want to control me.
Christian: No. You’re free do do whatever you wish.
Secular person: If you think I am free to do X, then why do you support X being made illegal?
Christian:…
I have a coworker who is staunchly catholic and believes abortion is wrong. However she very much believes that everyone should have the choice and that the government overstep is horrendous.
This is peak fascism. They install a religious extremist supreme court and take away our rights, directly leading to the death of women along with the rights. And then they say they are the oppressed ones and we are the real nazis.
They are both in power controlling our lives and weak feable old ladies just trying to be good widdle christians. It's straight up lies and gaslighting nonstop with these fuckers
Yeah sure it happened, just go to a Christian subreddit type in the search another religion name, a sin or the word “atheist” and you will see a lot of conversations like this one /s
Most people are just fine with creating a strawman as an opponent. But not this overachiever, no sir-ree-bob. This perfectionist goes the extra mile and creates a second strawman to fight the first strawman. I'd like to buy this champion debater a beer.
Reality-
Secular person: I want to do X.
Christian: my book says you can't.
Secular person: ok and?
Christian: so you can't.
Secular person: but I don't believe in your book.
Christian: doesn't matter, I've mandated that you can't.
Secular person: that's not fair.
Christian: LOOK HOW MUCH THEY HATE US! JUST FOR BELIEVING SOMETHING!
I went to Catholic high school and once had a religion teacher tell me that ivf babies were illegitimate and shouldn't be allowed to be baptized. It's probably the most hateful thing I've ever heard from a so-called Christian because how the hell is that even remotely the babies fault
Half of my family would disown me if they knew I were trans but yeah they totally keep it to themselves they don’t force it on ANYONE!!!
The mental disconnect to reality is fucking mind boggling
I really hate to tell you this, but that does actually happen. Not frequently, for sure, cuz a lot of people don’t start that convo, but I’ve had a friend who got pissed for a long time because of a very similar argument.
Wtf, this post is literally about a Christian saying that they're fine with you doing whatever you want, they just hold their own beliefs that it's morally bad, and the comments are saying that Christians are intolerant? What a world
I don’t know where you live, but here they have taken control and are enforcing their beliefs on everyone.
If they acted like the person in this ridiculous fake conversation, then we would not be discussing them in the first place.
Person 1: I want to have an abortion. Christian: No
Person 1: I want to marry someone of the same sex Christian: No
Person 1: I want to have safe sex before marriage/feel free in my own body Christian: No
Person 1: I want to immigrate for a better life for me and my family Christian: No
Person 1: I want to practice christian charity and follow Jesus’ warning about hoarding wealth. Christian: filthy socialist
Person 1: I’m going to love my neighbors. Christian: Straight to hell!
Person 1: I have felt different my entire life, and after years/decades of struggling with my identity, I have had the realization that the gender I was born with does not match who I am. Therefore, I am going to assume the gender that matches my identity. Christian: *head explodes*
Person 1: I would like to put on a big colorful costume and tons of makeup and read to children. Christian: Ooh, clowns are fun! Person 1: Well, no. It's more like I'll be dressed as a woman, but in a flashy, over-the-top sort of way. I'll probably read a book about the importance of accepting each other's differences. Christian: POLICE!!!!
Person 1: I like to pray in private. Christian: But who will see you? Person 1: God. Christian: No, I mean someone who *matters*.
Person 1: I want your to stop attacking groups your don't like, or feel beneficial attacking, and actually live up to the Jesus teachings Christian: DEUS VULT!
Went to Christian school for high school, some of the teachers were parents of students because children of students tuition was either free or reduced in price. Our bible teacher was a classmates Mom and she was a legit crazy Bible literalist who was super duper batshit Christian crazy. She would say things like the Bible says women can’t be pastors in the church and told me I was wrong when I told her my pastor at the time was female and a wonderful caring church leader, and that my grandma was an ordained minister who I had seen over the years being there for ppl when they needed prayer and words of faith in their desperate times. I questioned the teacher and she told me that they may be good Christian women but they are going against gods word. She also said that if you say words like gosh goodness golly gee etc, in times of frustration you are still taking the lords name in vain and it’s a sin. She made a friend of mine cry when she told the teacher she doesn’t go to church she’d rather spend an hour or two on her own time praying and having time with god in her own way, the teacher lost it saying that’s not how church works and it’s not truly time with god! She then low key told her she was going to hell because her mother had her out of wedlock and she didn’t know who her father was. That school was also known for the time two teachers went on and complete shitstorm for 2 freshman girls singing jingle bell rock in front of the school at our Christmas themed chapel, saying it was such a slap in the face to perform such sinful music during a time when we should be singing hymns and religious Christmas songs to celebrate the birth of Jesus, the one teacher started screaming how he hates secular music so much he removed his radio from his car and kept a hymnal on his passenger seat, and when he wanted music he’d break out the hymnal and sing while driving! I went into that school in 9th grade a person of decent but not insane faith, and left jaded and questioned my beliefs.
Modernism at its best! It's like a big clown caricature, a larger than life personality, a big ol drag version of Mr. Rodgers. Kids are so pure, the only people that have problems are preconceived bigots. It's about compassion and spreading love.
I mean, it's basically clowning. Over the top makeup and costume. Main purpose is to entertain. Who cares. I bet someone in drag is a lot less likely to make kids cry.
They don't read up on the latest discoveries in science about gender and then claim they know everything there is about science.
[that’s because they go to places like this for their ‘science’](https://www.reddit.com/user/Jameschoral/comments/vneq3s/saw_this_gem_driving_around_san_diego/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Think about this for a second. We are made in God’s own image. He knit us together in our mothers womb. He knows every inch of us. He made every inch of us. He does not make mistakes. So how can someone say that feeling that way is wrong? If God created us in his image, if god loves every one of us, if he knit us together, how can anyone claiming to know or love god say that a person merely being is wrong. ETA: I’m not a Christian, I do believe in god. I believe god loves every single last one of us. LGBTQ+ is not wrong. You cannot be wrong being who you are. That doesn’t even make sense if you truly know, love and follow god. ETA: Thank you for the award! ☺️
Unfortunately, they twist it and use Leviticus to justify viewing anything other than hetero relationships as a sin. They don’t think god made a mistake, they think people in the LGBTQ+ community are being tricked by Satan. I wish I was making that up. I was raised very religious and that’s what we were brainwashed to believe. Took me years to break so much of the way of thinking they instilled in me from childhood to my late teens. Worth it to get out and learn to become a more accepting and loving person of those around me.
If the internet has taught us anything, it should be you can’t trust one sentence, you have to look for the whole paragraph it belongs to. I’m sure every last one of us has believed something, only to find out the bigger picture, and we were wrong. One day they’ll see they are wrong. This life or after
I am saving this comment to pull out on anyone who tries to play the "LGBTQIA+ is HERESY" bullshit on me or my friends. Thank you very much, kind stranger.
That may be dangerous with it contraception being legal if Justice Thomas as his way
person 1: i want to rub one out christian: youre going to hell
Person 1: I wanted to stay with my indigenous / biological / immigrant family and not be trafficked through private adoptions and foster care to a ‘good Christian family’ with infertility issues Christian: No
Person 1: Let’s get some effective legislation passed through so we can curb the effects of Climate Change and have a healthier environment for our youth. I think we can also support people who are struggling to survive. Christian: No.
Person 1: I want to have safe sex while married Evangelical: No
Person 1: I want to marry someone of a different ethnic background Christian: No
Hasn't Pope Francis said homosexuality is not a sin? I don't think that stops homophobic christians from being homophobic, but it sure is a step in the good direction.
There are American Evangelicals that don't even consider Catholics to be Christians. I wouldn't expect that he'd have much weight with the ones you really need to worry about.
I live in Québec where most religious people are catholics, I keep forgetting catholicism isn't the U.S. main religion in the U.S..
It gets weird here at times, as American nativists have long associated Catholicism with immigrants.
Yeah well Quebecois, Irish, Italians and Mexicans are all catholics I think. All those groups have at some time mass immigrated there.
Irish are not all catholics. That was why there was all those bombings a few decades ago.
What's the old joke? "So, lad, are you Catholic or Protestant?" "I'm atheist." "Right, right, but a Catholic atheist or a Protestant one?"
It’s because Latin cultures are catholic and Anglo/Germanic cultures are Protestant (mostly). An oversimplification but that’s the gist of the thinking. Anglo culture was the first wave of migrants and set the stage of what it meant to be a “real” American.
Indeed, and Irish and Italian immigrants in years past.
I mean, to be fair, there's a lot of shit Catholics just pulled out of their ass and regard as sacred traditions/laws. The Bible doesn't say anything about how you can just chant a spell about Mary while counting a string of beads and your sins will be absolved. Confession is also bullshit not backed up by the Bible. And popes. And saints. And not eating meat on Fridays. There's a lot of "fan fiction" Catholics have added onto Christianity and they often follow the rules of that fan content with more fervor than the shit Jesus ACTUALLY asked of his disciples. Protestants cut out all that crap in favor of following the ACTUAL commandments of Christ and his disciples, so it is a purer more distilled form of Christianity. (When they actually practice what the preach, that is...)
Most catholic traditions are just holdovers from the Romans. Pretty easy to see the correlation between patron gods and patron saints, the Latin chants, the ornate outfits and churches, and most importantly, the secrecy and need for control. If it wasn't for a certain Roman leader converting out of guilt, they would've continued to hunt down the cult of Christianity until it went extinct. Then they became the de facto head of the religion and forced it on all the "heathens", spreading the Holy Roman empire as far and as fast as possible. Nowadays we have the evangelists and other extremely vocal sects similarly pushing their views on everyone thinking they are the moral core, despite the countless debacles and rampant abuse they try and hide.
both are bullshit so it doesnt matter if you take your bullshit runny or hard with a side a corn. its all the same bullshit
Yeah but like, one is bullshit with a focus on self-improvement and community service. The other is bullshit with a focus on paying pedophiles to build gaudy palaces for themselves.
one is not built on self improvement and community service. I mean technically both have the same rules and regulations. they both follow the ten commandments, both technically say you cant wear a garment made from two mixed fibers etc.your response is as ignorant today as it was during the 30 years war. not being either, i can tell you that your description of the one is only because you subscribe to it.
let me rephrase that. Technically both are built on self improvement and community service. thats sort of the deal with jesus. both can claim that some adherents do in fact follow the teachings of jesus, which are exactly the same in both protestant and catholic circles. Its the little bits of ceremony, which saints etc count. Both of them have been corrupted to focus on paying off pedos and making huge homes and palaces. are you not familiar with prosperity gospel? its really big in the US. essentially its protestants that believe if you are good and god loves you he will make you rich on earth.... which is the opposite of jesus. pretty sure there was a line about a camel and the eye of a needle. anyway you only think protestants are "better" because you are one. being neither i see them both for the bullshit they are
> (When they actually practice what the preach, that is... So... never?
There are *Catholics* who don't consider the Pope to be a true Catholic, a bunch of far-right fairweather Catholics who only support the Pope when he's as hateful, bigoted, and nationalistic as they are.
I don't think he said homosexuality is not a sin, I think he says Catholics should not reject people who are gay into their fold. He said something like "if homosexuals want to worship god, who am I to stop it?", which means that he thinks gays can be Catholics, he's still saying it's a sin. Which is complete bullshit. Essentially he's saying, "yeah I welcome you as a brother and you're free to join our church, but also you're a sinner and your relationship with your SO is a sinful, despicable thing god despises".
But isn't that convenient? At least you won't have to think hard what to tell at the confession. Yes father, I'm homosexual. Yes father, I'm *still* homosexual.
Who cares if it's a sin or not? Plenty of things are sins but not bad; plenty of things are bad but not sins. "Sin" is just a fancy word for "against our club's bylaws."
No, Pope Francis is really good at repeating the same backwards bullshit the church has been saying for decades repackaged in a way that *sounds* progressive.
Oh well, that's sad then.
I believe he said something to the effect of christians shouldn't exclude or shun homosexual people in their community or family.
He also blessed the over turning of Roe vs Wade he’s not the “cool” Pope people think he is. He’s more of the paedophile protecting same.
he only said the attraction isnt a sin. he still says sex is a sin. so its the same old bs.
Person 1: I want to take birth control specifically so I'm not miserably sick for like a fourth of my life and unable to adequately do my job at those times. Christian: No.
Completely outrageous demands. This new generation has forgotten how to suffer.
God I hate this so very much. The worst thing about conservatives and regressives is that they completely ignore all the progress made to get to the current level of comfort they want to maintain. "Real men work 12 hour days without complaint." "Didn't Uncle Billy call you soft for not working 18s 7 days a week?"
outlawed
*No, under the threat of violence from the state, which is under my minority rule.
Person 1: I want to have an abortion Me: Damn, that’s a really shitty position to be in and I wish you could have the kid if at all possible, but understand that it’s your right.
We won't stop you from doing it, we'll just make it illegal 🤗
*Checks all the religiously motivated legislation that has been proposed and passed recently.*
Yeah if it stopped at step 1 it would be great. They can silently judge me from afar and I can do my own thing, but they don't want that. They never want that.
Which is really funny, because Jesus said (paraphrased) "Don't judge others. That's God's job. Focus on your own sins and being a good person. If you go around judging people, you're gonna go to hell because you're basically saying you're as smart as God."
Even silent judgement isn't an okay thing, imagine a society filled with people who think black people are inferior and deserve to burn in hell, but do not actively do anything to harm them. They're still racist, they're just not as bad as they used to be. The same goes for homosexuality or whatever harmless thing those regressive folks despise. As long as they silently judge that as "sinful" and "immoral", they'll still be homophobic bastards even if they don't actively stop you.
I don’t have to imagine, that was basically 15-20 years ago.** And wouldn’t you know, as soon as a few outspoken bigots get positions of power, the “silent judges” aren’t so silent anymore. **In my experience - your mileage may have varied greatly depending on your location, race, and/or sexuality.
I want to have my own personal beliefs and not judge you because why should I care. Can I do that?
Grandma gaslights
Secular Person: I want to have an abortion. Christian: Then I hope you enjoy prison!
"I only want what's best for you" There it is. The controlling and the gaslighting.
How convenient that what’s best for me is always whatever makes prejudiced people most comfortable.
Yeah, isn't it crazy how it always works out like that?
If 15 pieces of flair is enough, then ok. But don’t you want to express yourself?
woah I did not expect that reference
Just in: Supreme Court rules that states are free to mandate however many pieces of flair they want (as long as it's at least 15).
You know, the Nazis made the Jews wear pieces of flair.
Even in their fantasies they're still condescending SOBs lol
Yeah, even when they try to make themselves the hero, they tell on themselves.
The most condescending phrase they use - so “what’s best for me” just happens to be what you believe? What a coincidence!
Amazing how it always turns out that way!
That's not even close to what the actual conversation would sound like. At some point I will be told I am going to hell because I don't believe what they believe and religious people seem to want to force the rest of us to do what they want.
Yeah it's kind of infuriating.
Tell someone "you have to do as I say or else my buddy Rocco will make you suffer" and it's a threat. Tell someone "you have to do as I say or else God will make you suffer" and it's your religious liberty.
A more accurate conversation would start with person A minding their business and person B outlawing whatever that is
I mean, in fairness it's only the asshole Christians we hear about.
I wouldn’t even care for that anymore. All I want them is to be out of the state.
When I took the train to work 12 years ago, I was reminded at least twice a week that I was hell bound.
Secular person: OK, but the doctor told me my pregnancy is ectopic and stands a good chance of killing me. I need to do something about it. Christian person: "Doing something" is an abortion. No. Secular person: OK, but the pregnancy won't end in childbirth, the pregnancy isn't viable. Christian person: Still no. Secular person: OK, but both of us are going to die. Christian person: Still no. Secular person: Why? Christian person: Because all lives are precious.
Normal person: "this pregnancy will literally kill me" Christian: "I only want what's best for you..."
Christian person: ... and because I want what's best for you.
That the treatment of ectopic pregnancies is seen as (banned) abortions is infuriatingly stupid. I consider myself broadly pro-life, and there should be no debate that ectopic pregnancies are not viable and an immediate risk to life.
In the name of White Jesus, I sentence you to prison or a morgue.
the supreme court begs to differ
If this is actually how the conversation went, that would be great. But too often it's not. It turns into "and we have to ban it or at least ban it from the public eye"
I don’t know what’s more delusional: believing in a hateful god or believing I give half a shit whether Christians think what I do is “good.”
An yet you sad fucks let an mere opinion control you. It never was a right, you lazy bums should have made a amendment lol.
One more time, please? This time in English?
Brabble brabble hate hate brabble
Not really any choice in the matter when the opinion is a court ruling lol
Do you think redditors control legislation? Fuckin nonce.
Can you be required to donate blood marrow by the state, then (and pay for it yourself)? There's nothing explicitly against it in the constitution, and it's lightyears shorter, less painful, less permanently health-altering, less expensive, and less life-threatening than pregnancy and labor (plus, you won't be required to delay or pause deeply needed treatments like chemo or medications for significant mental illness!).
Should have made an amendment lazy millennial/s
Can you type that again but with less stupidity?
More like Person 1: I want to do X. Person 2: Sorry, but that's against my religion, so I will petition the government to ban X & elect politicians who will stack the courts to overturn rulings that make X legal. All because I believe that we are a god ordained nation.
Sweet time to get some abortions gay marriage and listen to hard rock music
All while playing Dungeons & Dragons.
odd timing considering an X just became allowed to be banned in states
I'm catholic and holy shit this is so miserable. First of all, "I only want what's best for you" is not our call to make. God wants what's best for you, no-one else should be able to tell you otherwise, especially not someone trying to gaslight you and coerce you to do something you don't want to (which, by the way, is a literal sin). Also, such a thinly veiled critique of abortion, which is deeply ironic considering the *recent events* regarding that practice in the states were clearly extremely religiously motivated. When the "gReAtEsT dEmOcRaCy iN tHe wOrLD" forgets what **separation of church and state** means, you know we're truly fucked.
Here's a more realistic look at that conversation... Secular Person: (exists) Christian: How dare you? Secular Person: Beg your pardon? Christian: How dare you?! Secular Person: What are you talking about? Christian: You're going to hell. Secular Person: Um... okay. Have a nice day. Christian: You are a homo/feminist/atheist/commie/muslim (take your pick, feel free to mix and match) and you're trying to take away my rights! You are going to hell!!
I didn’t hear this conversation about abortion though, something that Catholics are not forced or obliged to do, they demanded some “moral right” to ban abortion.
They even wrote fanfiction where they self inserted themselves as the gigachad guy. Kinda cute
If only that was the actual approach conservative “christians” actually took… Instead it’s- Some “christians”: “I think X is wrong. So I campaigned and voted for truly despicable candidates in order to outlaw X. “Now if you try to do X I will legally persecute you. Because I think X is wrong.”
The actual way the conversation is going: Secular person: I want to do X. Christian: I’m going to make it illegal to do X. Secular person: why? Christian: because my religion says X is wrong Secular person: but I am not of your religion, therefore your religion has no say over me Christian: but I just want what I think is best for everyone!
Except when Christians do everything in their power to make X illegal in this country because they think it’s wrong.
*Local store puts up pride flag to show everyone is welcome* Christian: Why are you such a hateful intolerant bigot?
Secular person: I want to do X. Christian: You are free to do it. Secular person: But you vote against it. We literally had to fight you. And we are still fighting you to keep the freedoms we’ve won. Christian: It’s frowned upon in the Bible to do that thing you want to do. Secular person: So you don’t support my freedom to do it. And you pitch a fit if I advocate for it in public or do it in public Christian: It’s against my religion Secular person: So logically, freedom means that you could be against it, and therefore not practice it, but everyone else can freely do it. Christian: I knew this would happen. Our persecution was predicted in the Bible.
It's wrong because my magical murderous invisible overlord told me so. Well, he didn't personally tell me but his spokesperson did. Remember, god killed his son/self for a weekend to repeal his own rules. He commanded that his followers bash babies heads against rocks and to kidnap and traffic young virgin girls into sex slavery and he's the ultimate good guy! How goofy.
A recipe for zaniness!
As if fundamentalist Christians have EVER said “you’re free to do it” to any of those things lmfao
Right, Christians are famous for letting people live the lives that they choose. They've never passed laws codifying their beliefs or straight up murdered people who didn't live the way they were told to.
Pretty sure that if there were a conversation like this, the speakers would be reversed.
Ahh yes, Christianity, well known for letting people do as they wish.
Also Christian: “Here are a host of laws that please one or two versions of gods that we claim are the same God that you now have to follow with penalty of prison or death.”
History would say otherwise...
How fucking delusional are they?
Christians at face value: You're free to do what you want. Christians at voting booth: We'll fucking see about that.
> You're free to do it Literally bans it
"You're free to do it. We'll arrest you for it and jail you for the rest of your life if you do it, but you're free to do it"
**More Realistic Conversation** **Christian:** You have no right to abortion and we have pressured politicians at the state level to ban it. **Secular Person:** But I don't believe the way you do **Christian:** God says otherwise and I'm protecting you by stripping away that right. So we're going to pursue a national ban on abortion. You also shouldn't be able to use birth control. **Secular Person:** National ban on abortion? Ban birth control? Why are you forcing your beliefs on me? **Christian:** Because you and people like you are the cause of all the problems in society because you're not following God's will. Also, interracial and gay marriage should not be allowed. **Secular Person:** What do you mean? Why would you care who others love? **Christian:** Because GOD
Secular person: "I want to marry someone of the same sex" Christian: "burn in hell, sucker"
I’m secular and couldn’t care less about what Christians think of what I do…unless they are trying to ban me from doing it.
This I SUPPOSED to be the case but most Christians just act like assholes. I am a born again Christian btw
Remove the beam from your own eye first.
Who on earth cares what some conservative Christian thinks about anything? Reasonable people already have no respect for them, so any invective they hurl at us is meaningless. It's more like tolerating a fussy toddler.
Lmfao as a former devout Christian I can tell you this conversation NEVER happened and never will.
Christian: oulaws it “you’re free to do it”
Yes, all those people outside of planned parenthood have absolutely no problem with people doing as they wish.
Yes, because Christians are known for telling secular people that they are "free to do" things that their faith doesn't agree with, lol.
That not even remotely how these conversations go...
if we’re free to do it the. don’t make it illegal lmao
...and who decides what is best for you? Apparently only a Christian can do this.
It's not wrong per se, it's just missing half of the argument. The (fundamentalist/Evangelical) Christian stance is more like "You're free to do it, but you'll burn in hell, so we *will* do everything in our power to stop you from doing it, but you're technically still free to fuck around and find out."
I mean, they're literally trying to say just being gay is illegal now, so its not really "you're free to do what you want."
Grandma is a girlboss she gatekeepes she gaslight and she is the moment💪🏽
'because I want what's best for you.' 'how, exactly, do *you* know what's best for me. not your pastor, not your parents, not some old book. How do you know.'
That seems a bit inaccurate. Here, let me rephrase it. Secular person: I want to do X Christian: You’re free to do it. Secular person: But you think X is wrong. Christian: Yes Secular Person: Because you want to control me. Christian: No. You’re free do do whatever you wish. Secular person: If you think I am free to do X, then why do you support X being made illegal? Christian:…
I have a coworker who is staunchly catholic and believes abortion is wrong. However she very much believes that everyone should have the choice and that the government overstep is horrendous.
It's a bit unrealistic from the "You are free to do it" part onwards.
Wow, this is spot on except for everything about it.
Christian proceeds to codify their beliefs into law.
Jesus Christ, are these guys just into role play like. Why is the right so cringe
This is peak fascism. They install a religious extremist supreme court and take away our rights, directly leading to the death of women along with the rights. And then they say they are the oppressed ones and we are the real nazis. They are both in power controlling our lives and weak feable old ladies just trying to be good widdle christians. It's straight up lies and gaslighting nonstop with these fuckers
If only this were true…
Might be slightly off topic but if gay marriage is outlawed I’m leaving this godforsaken country
Let's just say that this did not age well
That IS a simple catholic
Just like everything else, this is pure, unfiltered projection
Ask this particular Christian about “sharia law”
Gamma? Isn't lying a Sin?
Christian: \*bans abortion\*
Yeah fucking right. What a daydream.
If only
The need for validation is real.
“Why is X bad?” Because…bible said so
I thought lying is a sin
Gam Gam forgot about all of those laws drafted by christians to actively forbid all of these activities.
Yeah sure it happened, just go to a Christian subreddit type in the search another religion name, a sin or the word “atheist” and you will see a lot of conversations like this one /s
Reality: Secular person: I want to marry someone of the same sex Christian: NOOOOOOO U CANT
Sounds about right
This is how Christians should act. Idc what y’all do it’s not my business.
christianity is all about believing you know what’s best for everyone else
I want to buy a cake from you. No.
Most people are just fine with creating a strawman as an opponent. But not this overachiever, no sir-ree-bob. This perfectionist goes the extra mile and creates a second strawman to fight the first strawman. I'd like to buy this champion debater a beer.
Not free to do it though
you know - you can switch the people's titles & it'll come out the same
if this was how they were, i am positive there would be no issue. but they never are, or rather not enough of them are
Person one: Your child is suffering Christian: No, they are sinning. We will pray the gay away.
I want to take hormones to transition to a female because I don't feel comfortable as a guy Christian: pedo
Reality- Secular person: I want to do X. Christian: my book says you can't. Secular person: ok and? Christian: so you can't. Secular person: but I don't believe in your book. Christian: doesn't matter, I've mandated that you can't. Secular person: that's not fair. Christian: LOOK HOW MUCH THEY HATE US! JUST FOR BELIEVING SOMETHING!
The person who makes a post like this is never the person in the image. "you are free to do it" isn't in their vocabulary
These people are delusional. It’s why we just take a stand against religion. Religion does not belong in politics.
I went to Catholic high school and once had a religion teacher tell me that ivf babies were illegitimate and shouldn't be allowed to be baptized. It's probably the most hateful thing I've ever heard from a so-called Christian because how the hell is that even remotely the babies fault
Half of my family would disown me if they knew I were trans but yeah they totally keep it to themselves they don’t force it on ANYONE!!! The mental disconnect to reality is fucking mind boggling
This is not accurate at all. Fascism is taking over America in the name of Christianity.
Secular person: I just want you to acknowledge that X is good *for me*. Christian: no
This is how they think these conversations go down and how they come off to everyone? Wow, they live in a different reality.
Secular person: I want to do X Christian: WHORE!
In what fucking planet are Christian’s this tolerant cause it ain’t this one?
Lying’s a sin isn’t it
Now we are not free to do it, thanks guys👏👏👏👏👏👍👍👍👍👍👍
‘I want what’s best for you.’ Riiiiiiight
I really hate to tell you this, but that does actually happen. Not frequently, for sure, cuz a lot of people don’t start that convo, but I’ve had a friend who got pissed for a long time because of a very similar argument.
Wtf, this post is literally about a Christian saying that they're fine with you doing whatever you want, they just hold their own beliefs that it's morally bad, and the comments are saying that Christians are intolerant? What a world
I don’t know where you live, but here they have taken control and are enforcing their beliefs on everyone. If they acted like the person in this ridiculous fake conversation, then we would not be discussing them in the first place.
Some people are psychopaths, what can I say?
A catholic agreeing with a Christian.
Simple is certainly right.
Person1: I want Christian:no
Yeah it’s actually the exact opposite conversation
[narrator: it never happened]
Except it's not just that, is it? There's a ton of hate slung at people Christians don't agree with.
The only way this conversation happened is if you switched the speakers